Emotional Affair

[SomethingToSay]

In addition to not seeing him until papers are served you also need to cut off and limit text and phine contact. Im not saying necessarily NC but you cant give yourself fully to him via contact. Especially if you TRULY want this to be him leaving on his owm accord and not you breaking up the marriage.

 

Make yourself scarce while all this supposedly goes on. If your guys love truly is so amazing it can certainly withstand that

 

So why did he still wait so long befire contacting you? Why didnt he contact you right after the appt?

 

Did he pay a retainer or sign an representation agreement? If not Id be careful of being too over excited for your future life with this avoidant cheating man.

 

At first I thought you meant you smiled bc you felt strong and didnt give in to gis request to see you. But I think its moreso bc you are happy bc you think he is divorcing?

[Grapesofwrath]

I'm sorry, am I supposed to be upset and sad about this?

 

I am happy he is finally dealing with it. I am happy we might actually be able to move forward without this huge elephant in the room.

 

I refuse to say I broke up his marriage. He could and still can stay in it.

 

Pink: I agree that you did not break up his marriage. He did that. However, I would like to give you a little real-life advise here:

 

Divorce is a long, complicated process. Even if he "comes to you with papers" that doesn't mean anything. He doesn't get a lawyer to draw up a marital separation agreement, hand it to her, and go on his way. It doesn't work that way. What he does is sign a legal separation advisement, which essentially means that he is suing her for divorce, and then she is served with those papers. She can then decide whether to sign that as well, or try to prolong things. Then she most likely gets a lawyer, and the lawyers negotiate a marital separation agreement. Legal separation simply draws a line for when financial and legal matters are considered to be "separate."

 

The marital separation agreement is something else altogether. It outlines custody, the division of assets, spousal support, etc. This usually takes a long time to complete, especially in situations when the divorce is not amicable or when there are a lot of assets to protect. You mentioned that her family has money, so you can bet dollars to donuts that they will lawyer up with a pitbull. This will not be fun, and this is where you can be sued for "alienation of affection" if that applies in your area.

 

I expect that, if Jamie is serious about pursuing divorce, this is going to be a long and rocky battle. Once it's over, if the two of you are still involved, you will find yourself in a relationship with a man who criticizes his partner to others, complains about her behind her back, demonstrates extreme disloyalty to her, and who has a proven track record of cheating and deception. Not to mention having lost at least half of his assets.

[loveisanaction]

I'm sorry, am I supposed to be upset and sad about this?

 

I am happy he is finally dealing with it. I am happy we might actually be able to move forward without this huge elephant in the room.

 

I refuse to say I broke up his marriage. He could and still can stay in it.

 

 

You can refuse to say it all you like hon, doesn't mean it's not the truth.

 

Of course you're not going to be upset, you're getting the guy right? Wife? What wife?

 

...and FYI, Married people have problems, married people go through difficult times, they have ups and downs, when they are mad they say nasty things to each other, and they take each other for granted sometimes. Married people fight but it doesn't always mean that it's the end of the marriage.

 

Married people who have stayed married for a long time have done so because they understand that 'For better or for worse' doesn't mean 'for better or i divorce and find someone else to start over with'.

[noelle303]

How can you smile and be happy knowing his wife is about to get hit with one of the most gut wrenching news of her life?

 

She lost her child and now she's about to lose her husband.

 

Even if you and Jamie end up together, you broke up his marriage. I am sorry but there is nothing to be proud of about that.

 

Married people are and should always be off limits.

 

I actually disagree with this. I don't believe that a third party can break an intimate relationship between two people. If he is filing for divorce (remains to be seen) then he surely did not only do that for the sake of getting into OP's pants.Divorce, especially with children involved, is a huge life-altering process for all involved and if he is going through with it then it means that he is serious about being unhappy in his marriage.

 

And in my opinion, people owe it to themselves, their spouses and especially their children to end a relationship that is no longer working.

 

OP, I would advise you to stay away until the dust settles. His life is going to be a mess for a while and he'll be extremely stressed out. You two haven't even begun an actual relationship yet and I feel that under these circumstances it is going to be extra difficult to do so. Be patient, let him sort his life out and have a fresh start after.

[SomethingToSay]

I asked if he drew up the separation agreement and he said no. That he wants to sit down and discuss it with his wife first without blindsiding her.

I asked how he can blindside her, if he has already told her he wanted out.

Apparently him wanting a divorce is something he says all the time when they argue but never goes through with it and never brings papers or anything. I guess this is the first time he will actually DO something.

 

 

Lets talk about this for a second too. Do you see how this is evidence of how MM never actually gave you an accurate picture of their marriage?

 

 

He told you Monday that he had over the weekend told her he wanted a divorce. He gave you the impression in saying that, that he had taken a big step by telling her he wanted out. That he was "doing what you asked". And that she got mad, threatened, blah blah blah. Now the truth comes out -- he says it all the time when the fight. (which makes sense given his avoidant and abusive natures we have seen)

 

 

Also, keep in mind the meeting with a lawyer is a much easier step then actually telling the wife he's serious and going through with it.

 

 

She will likely fight him on 50/50 custody; she may beg and plead to make the marriage work; you just don't know. But it is very unlikely she is going to say:

 

 

'Oh okay; just send me your new address and where/how you want the custody exchanges to take place. Bye!"

 

 

Like everyone says, you would do very well to busy yourself with things OTHER than occupying MM time and being his emotional crutch during all this, assuming it even occurs. And believe NOTHING out of his mouth unless it is accompanied by actual evidence, ie receipts, paperwork, cancelled checks, filed agreements, etc

[noelle303]

You can refuse to say it all you like hon, doesn't mean it's not the truth.

 

Of course you're not going to be upset, you're getting the guy right? Wife? What wife?

 

...and FYI, Married people have problems, married people go through difficult times, they have ups and downs, when they are mad they say nasty things to each other, and they take each other for granted sometimes. Married people fight but it doesn't always mean that it's the end of the marriage.

 

Married people who have stayed married for a long time have done so because they understand that 'For better or for worse' doesn't mean 'for better or i divorce and find someone else to start over with'.

 

And sometimes marriages break down irreparably and there is no point in forcing it.

 

We don't know these people and can't point fingers on who to blame. My point is - if someone doesn't want to be married to their spouse anymore, then that's a pretty good reason for a divorce.

[SomethingToSay]

Agree marriages break down on their own accord. however if a spouse is willing to just stick it out for 4 years being miserable/content....and then all of a sudden OW comes in the picture and he suddenly has the impetus/drive to divorce

 

 

then its BECAUSE of the OW.

 

 

OW doesn't cause the pre-existing marital problems in effect before MM and OW met. But she was the catalyst for the divorce.

 

 

had there been no OW, most MM will just continue to suffer/be content.

 

 

I mean, this particularly MM Jamie....it is very clear he had no intention or drive to leave his marriage until PinkSunset gave him an ultimatum.

 

 

So assuming he divorces, the actual act of taking that step was due to OW ultimatum.

 

 

She may not have caused the marriage to be a bad one (IF it is even bad); but she is the proximate cause for the divorce.

 

 

In that regard, yes she will have in effect broken up the marriage. (By being the proximate cause to MM filing for divorce.)

[loveisanaction]

And sometimes marriages break down irreparably and there is no point in forcing it.

 

We don't know these people and can't point fingers on who to blame. My point is - if someone doesn't want to be married to their spouse anymore, then that's a pretty good reason for a divorce.

 

The married man here doesn't even want a divorce. Read through this thread from the beginning and you will read what the OP has posted. When it comes to divorce this married man has been dragging his feet on it for years. His wife has been treating him badly yet he has stayed married to her. Any married person who is dragging his (or her) feet concerning getting a divorce means one simple truth.... that they don't want to one. It doesn't matter what their reasons for staying married are they are dragging their feet because they want to stay married....period. We might not agree with the reasons married people choose to stay married but we must respect it.

 

When it comes to married people and their problems, anybody who has a romantic interest in either the wife or the husband should not be listening to or giving advice because their motives are not genuine. Unless you are a family member or a neutral friend to a married person, you should not be encouraging them to get a divorce.

 

If the tables were turned and one of us was this man's wife isn't that what we would want? Whether our marriage is falling apart or not; that any person who does not have our marriage in their best interest should stay away?

 

This is why i will always say that married people should be off limits, leave them alone to deal with the problems in their marriages. There are millions of single and available people on this earth, why go for someone who is already taken?

[noelle303]

Agree marriages break down on their own accord. however if a spouse is willing to just stick it out for 4 years being miserable/content....and then all of a sudden OW comes in the picture and he suddenly has the impetus/drive to divorce

 

 

then its BECAUSE of the OW.

 

 

OW doesn't cause the pre-existing marital problems in effect before MM and OW met. But she was the catalyst for the divorce.

 

 

had there been no OW, most MM will just continue to suffer/be content.

 

 

I mean, this particularly MM Jamie....it is very clear he had no intention or drive to leave his marriage until PinkSunset gave him an ultimatum.

 

 

So assuming he divorces, the actual act of taking that step was due to OW ultimatum.

 

 

She may not have caused the marriage to be a bad one (IF it is even bad); but she is the proximate cause for the divorce.

 

 

In that regard, yes she will have in effect broken up the marriage. (By being the proximate cause to MM filing for divorce.)

 

 

Is the demise of a bad marriage in which both parties suffer a bad thing?

 

Plus, I believe that a marriage can be over without the actual step of a divorce, therefore, she may have been the motivation behind the divorce, but not the reason for the break up.

 

But as I said, I don't know what kind of a marriage MM and his wife had, and how much they suffered/been content. I'm just saying that I personally doubt he would be divorcing her if there was something in it worth saving for him.

 

For example, my xMM was at the time of our affair unhappy in his marriage, they were having classic problems caused by a domestic life, two small children, a rut etc. However, he never wanted to pull the plug on his marriage at the time and he never did.

[SomethingToSay]

And Jamie may not want to divorce either. He may just be in withdrawal from PinkSunset and not thinking clearly. Only time will tell.

 

 

Is the demise of a bad marriage in which both parties suffer a bad thing?

 

 

That's really not for anyone to say other than the people in the marriage and the children of the marriage. Its not ours or OP place to judge whether it was for the best for all involved.

 

 

So no...I don't think OW can pat herself on the back and say she did everyone a favor by putting them out of their misery, if that's whats implied here.

[noelle303]

And Jamie may not want to divorce either. He may just be in withdrawal from PinkSunset and not thinking clearly. Only time will tell.

 

 

 

 

 

That's really not for anyone to say other than the people in the marriage and the children of the marriage. Its not ours or OP place to judge whether it was for the best for all involved.

 

 

So no...I don't think OW can pat herself on the back and say she did everyone a favor by putting them out of their misery, if that's whats implied here.

 

It's not. Point is he had a choice and he is deciding to end his marriage. It's certainly not the easy way and if he is doing it then I can only assume that he is truly unhappy in his marriage. If he is unhappy and it's not working, a divorce will have put them out of their misery.

[LadyIrish]

It's not. Point is he had a choice and he is deciding to end his marriage. It's certainly not the easy way and if he is doing it then I can only assume that he is truly unhappy in his marriage. If he is unhappy and it's not working, a divorce will have put them out of their misery.

 

Is it possible that as another OW, you are simply projecting what you had hoped that your xMM would have done? The fact of the matter is, if you go to the infidelity section, BWs and BHs are criticized if they participate in the "humiliating dance of pick me" but that is essentially what this OW has done. She has told Jamie to pick her over Joe, whilst saying that she never wanted Jamie to leave because of her. That is essentially two-faced and quite frankly her lack of remorse for her role of disparaging Joe and casting her in a constant negative light to Jamie is downright callous.

[PinkSunset]

I do plan on taking a step back while this is going on. He needs to be able to deal with this himself but I will be here for him if he needs me to a certain degree.

 

Grapes - I think she would be the type to sue me for alienation of affection. Another reason for me to stay away during this time.

 

The way he has brought it out to me, whether it be fact or not, is that he has prolonged the divorce because he knows she will fight him on everything. He SAYS that she is comfortable in the life she lives and faking their marriage to everyone but yet at home it's a different story.

 

I can say I was the catalyst for pushing him to finally end his unhappiness. However I think if someone is truly happy in their relationship they wouldn't have room to invite someone else in.

Even in my case with Kevin. I never felt emotionally fulfilled even though I knew he loved me and I loved him.

 

If he is only doing this to appease me? I hope not. Is he missing me and has withdrawal? Probably, but I am waiting to see if he actually talks to his wife tonight. If he doesn't, then I know it isn't real.

[SomethingToSay]

But how will you even know if he talks to her. He can certainly say yeah I did. How will you know what her reaction was, what he said, who cried, who proclaimed love, etc etc?

 

 

You wont. That's why his words don't matter. All you need to look for is actual papers.

 

 

Until then, you are just putting yourself out on limb emotionally and in even far greater ways than that. I know you want to jump back in b/c you miss him. But you cant just keep moving your line in the sand and lessening your expectations so you can get immediate gratification. You need papers (signed retainer agreement, cancelled check, signed lease, filed separation/divorce papers). Until then, "being there to some extent" = you are still the OW.

 

 

And please consider stopping with the digs on the BS. Its like you cannot resist. You don't even know her. SO why would you say "she is the type"....or that she "fakes" her marriage? How would you know?

 

 

Just trying to break you of this mindset. Its almost like you are brainwashed or obsessed with BS.

[PinkSunset]

Agree marriages break down on their own accord. however if a spouse is willing to just stick it out for 4 years being miserable/content....and then all of a sudden OW comes in the picture and he suddenly has the impetus/drive to divorce

 

 

then its BECAUSE of the OW.

 

 

OW doesn't cause the pre-existing marital problems in effect before MM and OW met. But she was the catalyst for the divorce.

 

 

had there been no OW, most MM will just continue to suffer/be content.

 

 

I mean, this particularly MM Jamie....it is very clear he had no intention or drive to leave his marriage until PinkSunset gave him an ultimatum.

 

 

So assuming he divorces, the actual act of taking that step was due to OW ultimatum.

 

 

She may not have caused the marriage to be a bad one (IF it is even bad); but she is the proximate cause for the divorce.

 

 

In that regard, yes she will have in effect broken up the marriage. (By being the proximate cause to MM filing for divorce.)

 

It's hard for me to beleive that his marriage isn't a bad one.

 

If his marriage was a good one, neither Jamie or I would be in this situation. He is not a womanizer who goes from one to the next.

 

He is 38 years old and has been married since he was 26. That is 12 years of marriage to this woman. 12 years of ups and downs. He didn't just wake up and decide one day he wanted to have an affair.

[PinkSunset]

But how will you even know if he talks to her. He can certainly say yeah I did. How will you know what her reaction was, what he said, who cried, who proclaimed love, etc etc?

 

 

You wont. That's why his words don't matter. All you need to look for is actual papers.

 

 

Until then, you are just putting yourself out on limb emotionally and in even far greater ways than that. I know you want to jump back in b/c you miss him. But you cant just keep moving your line in the sand and lessening your expectations so you can get immediate gratification. You need papers (signed retainer agreement, cancelled check, signed lease, filed separation/divorce papers). Until then, "being there to some extent" = you are still the OW.

 

 

And please consider stopping with the digs on the BS. Its like you cannot resist. You don't even know her. SO why would you say "she is the type"....or that she "fakes" her marriage? How would you know?

 

 

Just trying to break you of this mindset. Its almost like you are brainwashed or obsessed with BS.

 

I am going by what he has told me and from what I know of her. I agree with you that I need to get out of that mindset. I just feel like it's a competition even though it's not. I don't want to be in this "choose me" game because it's not even about that.

[noelle303]

Is it possible that as another OW, you are simply projecting what you had hoped that your xMM would have done? The fact of the matter is, if you go to the infidelity section, BWs and BHs are criticized if they participate in the "humiliating dance of pick me" but that is essentially what this OW has done. She has told Jamie to pick her over Joe, whilst saying that she never wanted Jamie to leave because of her. That is essentially two-faced and quite frankly her lack of remorse for her role of disparaging Joe and casting her in a constant negative light to Jamie is downright callous.

 

No, it's not projection on my part. My affair was a physical one more than emotional and therefore I never even expected him to leave his wife.

 

As for the ''pick me'', I honestly did not get that impression? From what I've read the OP wanted to withdraw herself and diminished contact and that is when MM decided that he wants to go through with ending his marriage. Therefore, he had a chance to go back to possibly work things out with his wife and he chose not to.

 

But that is just my perception, it's obviously different from yours.

[PinkSunset]

Is it possible that as another OW, you are simply projecting what you had hoped that your xMM would have done? The fact of the matter is, if you go to the infidelity section, BWs and BHs are criticized if they participate in the "humiliating dance of pick me" but that is essentially what this OW has done. She has told Jamie to pick her over Joe, whilst saying that she never wanted Jamie to leave because of her. That is essentially two-faced and quite frankly her lack of remorse for her role of disparaging Joe and casting her in a constant negative light to Jamie is downright callous.

 

I need to get one thing straight here:

 

Jamie and I don't sit around and talk bad about his wife and about his horrible marriage and laugh like two evil trolls with a big bad plan all the time! You are making it seem like I set out to do all of this and that I am turning Jamie against Joe which I am NOT.

We barely talk about her at all at this point. When we are together we do couple things, we talk about the future or how our day was that day etc. We cook together and swim together, cuddle, watch movies. We talk a lot and about everything under the sun. She isn't a thought in our heads but his marriage is/was the elephant in the room. It needs to be dealt with!

 

I did tell Jamie to get a divorce or I am out of this yes, because continuing what we are doing whilst he is married is a horrid thing IMO. I am surprised I let it go this far. I didn't say choose me or her, I didn't mean it in that context and HE knows it.

[PinkSunset]

No, it's not projection on my part. My affair was a physical one more than emotional and therefore I never even expected him to leave his wife.

 

As for the ''pick me'', I honestly did not get that impression? From what I've read the OP wanted to withdraw herself and diminished contact and that is when MM decided that he wants to go through with ending his marriage. Therefore, he had a chance to go back to possibly work things out with his wife and he chose not to.

 

But that is just my perception, it's obviously different from yours.

 

^^^ This!

 

Thank you for getting it.

[stilltrying16]

Yes you deserve an explanation.....his wife deserves the truth.....there is alot of mistreatment going around

 

As for your truth, I think at some point you must accept that the truth is Jamie loved to fantasize about leaving and how he is trapped and so forth....but tha painful truth is he just doesnt want to face all the struggles that come with that. He probably does love you....in your current role as emotional support/special friend/AP. And Im sure he "wishes" circumstances were different but at the same time is not willing to DO anything to make those circumstances different.

 

Another possibility is his wife had aDDay...looked thru his ohine while he was passed out....and he has going NC to save his marriage.

 

Just out of curiosity had you ever checked his wifes social media pages?

 

Something to say, I had the same thought about his wife having caught him cheating, except I thought it might have happened even before PinkSunset met him. To me her public snippiness to him (while she was friendly to everyone else) was just so easy to imagine if she felt she had been wronged by him in some way. And had chosen to reconcile but still harbored resentment. But then it turned out that the miscarriage was the reason for their tense relationship (so so so sad). But I'm still not ruling out the possibility of earlier cheating episodes. However, PinkSunset will have a better idea about this obviously.

 

PinkSunset I commend you for listening to the advice here and trying to pull back! I think you are questioning a lot more things about Jamie than you were before.

Edited May 11, 2016 by stilltrying16
clarification

[PinkSunset]

Something to say, I had the same thought about his wife having caught him cheating, except I thought it might have happened even before PinkSunset met him. To me her public snippiness to him (while she was friendly to everyone else) was just so easy to imagine if she felt she had been wronged by him in some way. And had chosen to reconcile but still harbored resentment. But then it turned out that the miscarriage was the reason for their tense relationship (so so so sad). But I'm still not ruling out the possibility of earlier cheating episodes. However, PinkSunset will have a better idea about this obviously.

 

PinkSunset I commend you for listening to the advice here and trying to pull back! I think you are questioning a lot more things about Jamie than you were before.

 

From what he has told me, he has never cheated in the past. I am the first woman he has had romantic feelings for since being with his wife. I guess you can take that with a grain of salt?

 

And thank you. It's helped me a lot making decisions thus far. I am definitely questioning more things.

[elaine567]

It's hard for me to beleive that his marriage isn't a bad one.

 

If his marriage was a good one, neither Jamie or I would be in this situation. He is not a womanizer who goes from one to the next.

 

He is 38 years old and has been married since he was 26. That is 12 years of marriage to this woman. 12 years of ups and downs. He didn't just wake up and decide one day he wanted to have an affair.

 

Plenty MM have affairs and have no intention of leaving their wife.

Plenty MM are womanisers.

Plenty MM do wake up one day and make the decision to have an affair.

What makes you so certain Jamie is any different?

His marriage may be reeling and on the rocks from his last affair(s), how would you know?

[onemanband]

omg i have a bridge in brooklyn i want to sell you, what happens when he finds a friend at work?,things change when you are around 24/7 not just on thursday

i think you will feel the wrath of his wife,once she finds out its you ,one more thing most people have that same feeling when they meet someone new im sure you had it with kevin.

[anika99]

It's hard for me to beleive that his marriage isn't a bad one.

 

If his marriage was a good one, neither Jamie or I would be in this situation. He is not a womanizer who goes from one to the next.

 

He is 38 years old and has been married since he was 26. That is 12 years of marriage to this woman. 12 years of ups and downs. He didn't just wake up and decide one day he wanted to have an affair.

 

Well, how was your relationship with Kevin before the MM came into the picture. Was it really miserable? Was it your unhappiness with Kevin that pushed you into the arms of a cheater?

[JulieEverette]

I didn't say choose me or her. I didn't mean it in that context and he knows it

 

In his mind he is most definitely choosing between you two.

 

I believe the options presented by you were either stay married to wife, or be with you.