Is it wrong or 'jerk-ish' of me to ask my girlfriend for a pre-nup if we got married?

[ironpony]

Okay thanks for the advice. Well my gf is not okay with going to a relationship counselor now, cause she says it will take too long.

 

I am kind of feeling like I am losing patients with and just feeling telling her, that if she didn't want to push me away from a marriage then she shouldn't have made those comments towards me. I am not sure if telling her this is the best option, but I am losing my patients with her on trying to work things out.

[BettyDraper]

Okay thanks for the advice. Well my gf is not okay with going to a relationship counselor now, cause she says it will take too long.

 

I am kind of feeling like I am losing patients with and just feeling telling her, that if she didn't want to push me away from a marriage then she shouldn't have made those comments towards me. I am not sure if telling her this is the best option, but I am losing my patients with her on trying to work things out.

 

Well, here is yet another sign that you should think twice about marrying this woman. How many more indications do you need?

 

She is showing how selfish, immature and manipulative she is and yet you keep holding on to some false hope that she will make a good wife despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

 

Save yourself and walk away.

[d0nnivain]

Well my gf is not okay with going to a relationship counselor now, cause she says it will take too long..

 

 

Take too long? Why is she rushing down an aisle? You two are thinking about a Lifetime commitment -- 'til death do you part. Yea, yea I know anyone can get divorced but isn't it better to go into a marriage doing everything possible to assure success not failure?

 

 

You have cold feet on a number of issues and you haven't even asked the Q but all she does is push for a quickie wedding. What does that tell you? If it were me & my SO had concerns, I'd move heaven & earth to assure him that we were meant to be, assuming I was confident that he'd do the same.

 

 

Love alone is meaningless. You need commitment. You need a willingness to work together. You need communication. All you two seem to have is . . . I don't even know at that this point but it's certainly not a foundation for a happy union.

 

 

At this point she only wants to marry you on her terms: all your money is hers & she never has to talk about any of the problems in your relationship, most of which she blames only on you.

[ironpony]

She is rushing down cause she wants to have kids, but is getting too old to have them she says.

 

I discussed some of the problems with her, and I told her how I felt that she has not been the best with money as she only has a couple hundred in the bank off and on, as she pays bills.

 

She says that I grew up wealthy with no responsibility, and that I live in a bubble world, and it takes one to know one when it comes to understanding poor people.

 

She says that when I brought up before, how I wanted to keep the money I had now, in a prenup, that I was being selfish.

 

And she says that why she said those demeaning remarks to me before, was it was the only way to get through to me, cause I have been demeaning to her with this prenup issue. She says that out of all the boyfriends she has, she has never had so abusive, and she said that her friends have even told her that I am abusive. She said that seeing a lawyer behind her back was abusive as well. I asked her what friends said that, but she said she was not going to say.

 

I do have to put my foot down with her sometimes so she will get the point as to where I stand, but is putting my foot down abusive, from what I have described before?

 

I also told her again that I wanted to go to couples therapy and work on our issues before getting married. Even though she seem okay with going a week ago, now she is not. She says she thought I was just saying that out of haste, and that I would have gotten over it, and she says that I am being unfair to her, if I keep on delaying the marriage, since I promised we would get married.

 

She also said that she has had friend that have told her I was not going to actually marry her, and she cannot believe her friends right. She wouldn't say which friends those were either. But maybe that's fair, since she doesn't want me to think differently of her friends?

[elaine567]

If she thinks you are abusive to her then that is no basis for a marriage. Why is she in so much of a hurry to marry an abusive man?

[ironpony]

But that's just it. If her remarks towards me was because I was abusive, I don't want to be abusive! Maybe I have something to work on if that's the case.

 

I am thinking I might tell her that if I am the most abusive bf she has had, than I want to go to therapy and work on that with her, before we get married.

Edited June 3, 2016 by ironpony

[blackcat777]

You're not being abusive... she's being manipulative.

[GunslingerRoland]

 

She says that she is not being manipulating though, and that she honestly felt like getting her tubes tied after I wanted her to sign a prenup. She said that she is not manipulating me, she is just telling me how she feels, which is different.

 

She also said a lot of this is my fault since I lead her on too long, and I should have brought up a lot of these problems before in the relationship.

 

There is a lot of BS here from her. She has a right to tell you how she feels, that is true, but when she starts trying to strong arm you, that has nothing to do with feelings, that is manipulation.

 

And you aren't bringing up problems. You're suggesting something that you should have in place before going into this marriage. I think you both need to stop looking at this prenup as a fix for a problem you have and start looking it as a logical step before entering into a marriage where the two people have very different financial situations.

[GunslingerRoland]

You're not being abusive... she's being manipulative.

 

Exactly this is just more of that manipulation that she claims not to be using.

 

This is abusive to me, unless you marry me without a prenup. Sure seems convenient how her getting what she wants fixes everything. This is manipulation.

[rester]

You need a third party/marriage counselor to help the two of you get on the same page. It's the only thing that is going to help. I don't think she wants to do that because the counselor will recognize how manipulative she is being.

 

In any case, even if you are being abusive, and it doesn't look that way from what you are telling us, but if you are being abusive, one would think she would be the one suggesting counseling. She's turning everything around on you.

 

You could try telling her that since she feels you are being abusive, that the two of you need to go to counseling so she can give her side of things and help you to not be abusive towards her.

 

On the other hand, if I were in your situation, with everything you've written here, I would have a hard time continuing this relationship at all.

[BettyDraper]

Why are you so willing to kow tow to your girlfriend's every wish?

 

It's as if you believe that only her needs are important.

 

This is one reason I am totally against you marrying this woman; a marriage is about compromise and taking responsibility for one's actions. She is too manipulative and immature to consider your needs at all.

 

People who are that selfish need to be alone.

Edited June 3, 2016 by BettyDraper

[jakrbbt]

Sounds to me like she's wanting to ensure having a baby and not thinking beyond that, except that in the back of her mind (or maybe the front) she wants to basically be able to say when the relationship fails, "Thanks for the baby, I'll be taking the baby and your money and assets to raise it with." Which is no good for anyone, not even her and definitely not you or future child or anyone you currently share some of your life and time with.

 

The best way to bring up prenup is to say, "I love you and I want to spend my life with you. I would never suggest a prenup that was not completely fair for you. A prenup is there to protect us from future conflict/protect us from having much to fight about if we do split" or similar. But it might be too late for that conversation.

[BettyDraper]

Do not take what your girlfriend says as gospel. It doesn't matter what she says because all that comes out of her mouth are tactics to bend you to her will. It is obvious that your girlfriend is after your money as well as the status of being married. She wants a sperm donor and a wallet to fund her dream lifestyle.

 

As for you being abusive, I'm not sure why you're even considering such a preposterous statement. You are an intelligent person. Why would your girlfriend want to marry someone who was so "abusive" unless there was something in it for her? If anything, she is the one who is emotionally and verbally abusive!

 

The choice is yours. You can marry this woman and watch your hard earned money be taken from you by her terrible habits and the courts when she leaves or you can save yourself from this awful relationship. Why not see a therapist by yourself about this issue? It seems like you need help with being assertive as well as codependency.

[bathtub-row]

Seeing a lawyer behind her back is abusive?? Now I've heard it all. Lol.

[MargoJones]

I wouldn't sign a prenup. Also, when I married my husband I had significantly more assets than he did and I didn't ask him to sign one. Our marriage didn't work, but he's a good person and didn't try to get anything that wasn't fair to ask for. I don't think you should marry someone you think is capable of taking you to the cleaners if it doesn't work out. If you think you NEED a prenup, you probably shouldn't get married in the first place. Frankly, I'd be deeply offended if someone even asked.

 

The only exception is if you or she has children from another relationship. You have to protect your kid's financial future in case of death or divorce or whatever else.

 

That said, you GFs reaction is a little disturbing. She sounds a little unstable, and I'm not talking about finances. Maybe it's just the way you explained it, but...vomiting? Really? And, the not having kids threat is a bit manipulative. I don't know the details, so maybe it's not as bad as you made it sound, but if that's the way she handles problems, she might not have the maturity for marriage.

 

There is something called pre-marital counseling, where you sit down with a counselor who talks about your values and they bring up every possible thing that could come down the road and you settle the "big questions" and negotiations about family, children, money, and all of that so you don't have unpleasant surprises down the road. I'd recommend premarital counseling to see if your values are in line enough to form a solid marriage. If you DO feel she is the right partner, I'd dump the prenup. If not, dump her.

[MargoJones]

Oh my goodness. I just read your follow up posts. I really hope you break up with this woman. When she doesn't get her way she calls you "abusive" geez!! Trust me, living with this woman will make your life miserable, and if you have children with her they will have a lousy self centered mother and most likely, a broken family because anyone she marries will eventually come to their senses and divorce her. There are plenty of nice, normal women out there. Please go find one!

[bathtub-row]

I wouldn't sign a prenup. Also, when I married my husband I had significantly more assets than he did and I didn't ask him to sign one. Our marriage didn't work, but he's a good person and didn't try to get anything that wasn't fair to ask for. I don't think you should marry someone you think is capable of taking you to the cleaners if it doesn't work out. If you think you NEED a prenup, you probably shouldn't get married in the first place. Frankly, I'd be deeply offended if someone even asked.

 

I understand you're reasoning on this but I have to disagree with some of it. Where people are concerned, you never know who you're dealing with. That "nice" person can become someone else entirely in a blink.

 

I have a saying: You don't know someone until you marry them, but you don't REALLY know them until you divorce them.

 

Do not ever make the mistake of thinking you know someone, or that you can predict their behavior. However, I totally agree that no one should marry a person who they think will screw them over. But this isn't the reasoning behind a pre-nup. The reasoning is, you trust that person but want to make sure you didn't misjudge them.

[BettyDraper]

I wouldn't sign a prenup. Also, when I married my husband I had significantly more assets than he did and I didn't ask him to sign one. Our marriage didn't work, but he's a good person and didn't try to get anything that wasn't fair to ask for. I don't think you should marry someone you think is capable of taking you to the cleaners if it doesn't work out. If you think you NEED a prenup, you probably shouldn't get married in the first place. Frankly, I'd be deeply offended if someone even asked.

 

The only exception is if you or she has children from another relationship. You have to protect your kid's financial future in case of death or divorce or whatever else.

 

That said, you GFs reaction is a little disturbing. She sounds a little unstable, and I'm not talking about finances. Maybe it's just the way you explained it, but...vomiting? Really? And, the not having kids threat is a bit manipulative. I don't know the details, so maybe it's not as bad as you made it sound, but if that's the way she handles problems, she might not have the maturity for marriage.

 

There is something called pre-marital counseling, where you sit down with a counselor who talks about your values and they bring up every possible thing that could come down the road and you settle the "big questions" and negotiations about family, children, money, and all of that so you don't have unpleasant surprises down the road. I'd recommend premarital counseling to see if your values are in line enough to form a solid marriage. If you DO feel she is the right partner, I'd dump the prenup. If not, dump her.

 

She refuses to go to counseling because it will "take too long". The OP's girlfriend is also calling him "abusive" just because he has certain needs and standards.

 

Marriage is not purely a romantic endeavor. Marriage is a huge decision that can have detrimental financial consequences if it doesn't work out. Rather than live in a fantasy world where divorces and greedy exes are never a problem, it makes sense to plan for difficult situations since anyone can turn on a dime. A person can say all the right things in counseling and before marriage yet be out for blood and money if a divorce occurs.

[66Charger]

It is abusive, if you know you dont want to marry her and string her along. If she goes to MC and works out the financials, would you still marry her? Think about that.

 

I have no suggestions other than to make a decision, and soon.

[whichwayisup]

She is rushing down cause she wants to have kids, but is getting too old to have them she says.

 

I discussed some of the problems with her, and I told her how I felt that she has not been the best with money as she only has a couple hundred in the bank off and on, as she pays bills.

 

She says that I grew up wealthy with no responsibility, and that I live in a bubble world, and it takes one to know one when it comes to understanding poor people.

 

She says that when I brought up before, how I wanted to keep the money I had now, in a prenup, that I was being selfish.

 

And she says that why she said those demeaning remarks to me before, was it was the only way to get through to me, cause I have been demeaning to her with this prenup issue. She says that out of all the boyfriends she has, she has never had so abusive, and she said that her friends have even told her that I am abusive. She said that seeing a lawyer behind her back was abusive as well. I asked her what friends said that, but she said she was not going to say.

 

I do have to put my foot down with her sometimes so she will get the point as to where I stand, but is putting my foot down abusive, from what I have described before?

 

I also told her again that I wanted to go to couples therapy and work on our issues before getting married. Even though she seem okay with going a week ago, now she is not. She says she thought I was just saying that out of haste, and that I would have gotten over it, and she says that I am being unfair to her, if I keep on delaying the marriage, since I promised we would get married.

 

She also said that she has had friend that have told her I was not going to actually marry her, and she cannot believe her friends right. She wouldn't say which friends those were either. But maybe that's fair, since she doesn't want me to think differently of her friends?

 

End this relationship and walk away. This woman is drama filled and is rewriting your relationship history. She's manipulative, immature and has no idea about compromise. She's so not ready for marriage and all the responsibility that goes with being a wife, let alone a mother.

[Heracles]

Since you are so hell-bent on being f.u.c.k.ed over, maybe you should impregnate her and marry her ASAP.

 

But before you do, you should withdraw all your money in cash, put it in a nice duffel bag and give it to her with the keys to your car in case she wants to take off right away. Isn't that a wonderful idea?

[ironpony]

Okay thanks.

 

I hope I gave a accurate depiction of the situation. I feel l have maybe only described 5% of her, when the rest of the relationship and her are very good. In fact, she can very giving most of the time. Just little things, like when we go to a restaurant, she will not order say the biggest and most expensive thing on the menu like some women may, for example.

 

Or how she helps me out with some chores and surprises me when I get home, which I don't ask her to do. Things like that.

 

So I hope I painted a fair picture of the situation, and not created an unfair bias towards her, since no one here knows her personally and all of course.

[BettyDraper]

Okay thanks.

 

I hope I gave a accurate depiction of the situation. I feel l have maybe only described 5% of her, when the rest of the relationship and her are very good. In fact, she can very giving most of the time. Just little things, like when we go to a restaurant, she will not order say the biggest and most expensive thing on the menu like some women may, for example.

 

Or how she helps me out with some chores and surprises me when I get home, which I don't ask her to do. Things like that.

 

So I hope I painted a fair picture of the situation, and not created an unfair bias towards her, since no one here knows her personally and all of course.

 

The 5% of your girlfriend is bad enough that strangers are screaming at you to walk away. Remember that we are impartial.

 

Not ordering the most expensive menu item does not make up for wanting access of every dime of your money after marriage because she has none. Now you're just grasping at straws.

 

You know what? Go ahead and marry this woman. I hope that when she starts manipulating you and spending all of your money, you will accept that consequence as not listening to people who were trying to warn you.

 

Good luck!

[jakrbbt]

A prenup (even if you did get one) will not cover child support, custody, visitation if you have a child and divorce.

 

 

I don't like this woman's attitude that she came from poverty and you came from riches and therefore you "don't understand" and it's basically "not fair" et cetera. That is called counting other people's money. She sees others' fortune as her misfortune.

 

It tells me she will consider what is yours, to be hers. You will owe her (in her mind). Simply because you have a relationship with her and you have been (in her mind) more fortunate than she. She is not a person who will go out and match your fortune in terms of gaining her own success and her own stable income. Nor will she reasonably share with you simply as part of sharing a married life.

 

 

Don't marry someone who is less than completely mature and responsible with their life, even if they have other good qualities and even if you love each other.

 

The reason she can be so deceptive is that she likely does not even consider any of her attitudes to be calculating, wrong, manipulative or greedy. She won't see it. She has an immature and twisted worldview.

 

Don't trick yourself by saying, "No, she really loves me, she's really trying, so she can't be trying to exploit me." She probably does love you and she probably is trying. And she absolutely, no doubt, will still manipulate and exploit you and in ways that a prenup can't protect you from. Again, that's because she doesn't understand that she's wrong in her attitudes and she lacks the life skills and other tools to rely herself, or to rely on anything besides exploiting you.

 

The five percent will become one hundred percent if and when you divorce.

 

It will be very painful for you, when -- I say when-- she goes for full custody (because that is the road to receiving more child support), unreasonable amounts of child support, and otherwise does manipulative things involving your future child, in order to basically blackmail you even though she probably won't see it as calculating and blackmailing.

 

And you can't solve the problem by saying to yourself, "Well then we'll never divorce." You can NOT stay in a marriage out of fear of divorcing.

[Toodaloo]

I have always felt that if you need a pre-nup to marry someone then actually you should not be marrying them...

 

If someone threw their teddies out of the pram at the suggestion of one then that too would be a deal breaker for me. Probably a bigger deal breaker than the first.

 

Relationships should be about communication and finding ways that suit both not just one. After all its team work. Some may bring in more of one thing than someone else. Be it money, domestic skills, planning skills etc...

 

I am sorry but I really do not think this girl is the one for you OP. I think there are just too many issues that actually have nothing to do with money.