Is it wrong or 'jerk-ish' of me to ask my girlfriend for a pre-nup if we got married?

[whichwayisup]

Okay thanks a lot for reading and for your opinion. You say that she is blackmailing me into marrying her, yet if I call it off, there will be a s.h.i.t.storm.

 

So I am not sure what the most fair option is now.

 

And yes she is probably my first long term relationship. The others lasted a few months here and there, but this is the first to over a year.

 

Are you scared of her? Scared of calling it off? If so, that's NOT a reason to go through with it just to keep her happy.

 

So let there be a crap storm! What's the worst that can happen? She throws yet another tantrum, says rude and mean things?

[whichwayisup]

Yes I don't intend to be all over the place, I was just not sure what to do about it.

 

And she said it herself that I am all over the place which is why she told me to grow a pair and all that.

 

It's just seems that a lot of this is my fault, where as before, people were saying she was being manipulative and I should do something about it. So what changed, that it may be my fault now for how she reacts towards me?

 

Plus I have been told by her and a couple of others that I am making too big of a deal about the prenup for this reason:

 

After being taken advantage of the last time, before my gf, I made a vow to myself not to put myself in large positions to be taken advantage of again.

 

If I break my vow I made to myself, I feel like I would be losing my self respect, since our promises to ourselves are what make us who we are.

 

My gf says I am making too big a deal out of and we can break promises to ourselves and still have our self-respect. But what do you think?

 

That's like asking someone to change their morals. You hold yourself accountable and responsible for your choices. You chose to love and respect yourself first and have boundaries that you live by. That's great! If she cannot respect that or accept it, then say goodbye to her and find another woman who will accept you and be willing to compromise.

 

This woman doesn't know the meaning of compromise, doesn't comprehend or process things normally.

 

You may love her, a lot but that doesn't mean she is the 'right' one for you and you must marry her. Your lives don't seem to mesh well.

[d0nnivain]

Ironpony

 

 

Getting her to agree to counseling is going to be almost as difficult as getting her to talk about a prenup.

 

 

I'd sit her down & say something like the following:

 

 

I love you & I think I want to marry you but some of what has been going on the past few months scares me. You know I have concerns about our disparate financial situation but you keep screaming at me. When you threaten to withhold sex as punishment, I wonder if you really love me. But since I love you I want to work with you to resolve these issues

so

we really can get married, have it be 'til death do us part and live happily ever after. I think we could both use help getting there.

So

how do you feel about pre-martial / relationship counseling?

 

If she says anything other then a resounding yes, I think you have to take a giant step backwards, away from her because she's going to make your life a living hell if you marry without a good foundation -- financially and emotionally.

[ironpony]

I could do that but maybe I might leave out the sex part. It was just a bluff. She wanted to have sex on her birthday. But I had to not do it, because I didn't keep my distance a little now, if we are going to be drifted apart from this.

 

I think that maybe going to the whole birthday family gathering and after party with her friends, might have been a mistake though, cause that will make the s.h.i.t.storm much more hard now, after all the sweet loving birthday moments.

[Phoenician]

Man , you are so lucky to have this question raised ,

Forget about unconditional love , it doesn't exist !

 

My wife has never been materialistic , yet she ended up taking the whole thing ; and we are still married .

 

My advise to you is to stick to your word , if she doesn't agree , it is her problem .

[bathtub-row]

I could do that but maybe I might leave out the sex part. It was just a bluff. She wanted to have sex on her birthday. But I had to not do it, because I didn't keep my distance a little now, if we are going to be drifted apart from this.

 

I think that maybe going to the whole birthday family gathering and after party with her friends, might have been a mistake though, cause that will make the s.h.i.t.storm much more hard now, after all the sweet loving birthday moments.

 

Leave out the sex part? You're really missing the whole point here. It doesn't matter if that was a bluff on her part or not. She said the words, she made the threat. That's tells you all you need to know about her.

 

You would do yourself a huge favor if you'd stop downplaying how serious her comments are. She has you hopping all over the place and you don't even see it. I'll say this much, if you don't open your eyes now, life will open them for you in a few years and you won't like it very much.

 

I once saw a program that talked about the "alarm bells" in our lives; the warning signs that we encounter. The alarm bells are usually soft at first. If we acknowledge them and get ourselves out of danger, the alarms stop. But if we ignore them, they start to get louder and louder until we simply can't ignore them anymore. From where I'm standing, it sounds like your alarm bells are increasing their volume but you're still mostly ignoring them. I fear that, when it's too late, those alarm bells are going to be so loud that you can no longer deny them. It's up to you as to when you choose to listen. If you choose to never listen, then life will step in and teach you yet another lesson that you're not likely to forget. Your call.

[GunslingerRoland]

Plus I have been told by her and a couple of others that I am making too big of a deal about the prenup for this reason:

 

My gf says I am making too big a deal out of and we can break promises to ourselves and still have our self-respect. But what do you think?

 

 

Yeah we know your GF doesn't believe in prenups. She's also nearly 40 and has less money in her bank account than a 14 year old who has just worked her first shift at McDonalds. Regardless of whether her intentions are bad or not, she's not exactly the person you should be listening to financial advice from. Come on, she even got hosed in one of her own relationships financially and that doesn't bother her.

 

 

And who are these couple of others who don't believe you need a prenup. Do they know your financial situation? Are they older, in other words have they been married and divorced, or have close friends who've divorced. Because in all honesty a lot of people around your age are still very naïve about marriage and are usually still to busy trying to get out of college debt to have enough assets to even start to think about stuff like protecting them.

 

 

Also ask yourself, why are people trying to psychoanalyze your request for a prenup? It's not a strange request, most people don't have them simply because they get married before they have much or because they are in relatively equal standing... but they are hardly a rarity for people getting married at 30 or older.

[d0nnivain]

I could do that but maybe I might leave out the sex part. It was just a bluff. She wanted to have sex on her birthday.

 

 

Reread what you wrote.

 

 

You repeatedly say things like this but what they mean is your GF lies, exaggerates & can't be trusted at her word. Do you understand this?

 

 

If you think she is bluffing (a euphemism for LYING) about withholding sex why do you think she's telling the truth about anything else?

[BettyDraper]

I could do that but maybe I might leave out the sex part. It was just a bluff. She wanted to have sex on her birthday. But I had to not do it, because I didn't keep my distance a little now, if we are going to be drifted apart from this.

 

I think that maybe going to the whole birthday family gathering and after party with her friends, might have been a mistake though, cause that will make the s.h.i.t.storm much more hard now, after all the sweet loving birthday moments.

 

You should have ended this relationship as soon as your girlfriend started using future children as bargaining chips.

 

If you did that, you would not be in this position right now.

[ironpony]

Okay thanks.

 

Well I hope that everyone is right on here and that I am wrong. I only described about 5% of her personality and the relationship, so I feel that maybe I have not given enough of the other 95%. I mean by breaking up with her, I would be following the advice of strangers. Which is what I asked for. As long as it's the right thing to do, it's just hard cause I still feel that I love her for some reason, perhaps illogical.

[bathtub-row]

I think it's been said by more than one person -- you need to decide for yourself what's the right thing to do. We're only seeing a snapshot, however, that snapshot isn't very encouraging. Dealbreakers are dealbreakers. There are just so many issues in this relationship and she is so extremely immature and spiteful. These types of relationships just don't work out very often. But if you can't bring yourself to do it, then you can't. If you can feel ok about breaking your promise to yourself, then do it.

 

I will say just one thing -- real love and mature relationships are not this much work. Just some food for thought.

[CarrieT]

I only described about 5% of her personality and the relationship, so I feel that maybe I have not given enough of the other 95%.

You had almost thirty pages of discussion to tell us anything different about her that might sway us a different way and you never did. In fact, I asked you no less than three times why you wanted to marry her and there was never a really good, heartfelt, honest explanation.

 

I believe there is a reason that you were focusing on all the bad. Because in your gnawing gut you needed strangers to tell you what you really know to be the truth.

 

I will say just one thing -- real love and mature relationships are not this much work. Just some food for thought.

Repeated for truth.

[ironpony]

That's true, since the prenup came up with her, I have been concentrating on all the bad that came out of it. But for the last few days since her birthday, I was brought back to all the good, prior to the prenup. Now I am not sure and feel more positive for the past few days.

[CarrieT]

That's true, since the prenup came up with her, I have been concentrating on all the bad that came out of it. But for the last few days since her birthday, I was brought back to all the good, prior to the prenup. Now I am not sure and feel more positive for the past few days.

 

Than I would recommend you give yourself some time away from this site AND her to clear your mind and center yourself - several weeks, actually. Look for the answers within you and what feels right for you; not what she cajoles you into believing and not what a handful of strangers are speculating.

[ironpony]

Okay then. Well I will have to buy myself some time, since she is going to not take it well if I tell her that I am having second thoughts. Perhaps I should tell her that I am for the reasons given before, and I want to go premarital counseling or something, before we get married, or at least need some time to sort things out.

 

We went for a counseling session before about a year ago, but it didn't go well, because the counselor said I was being selfish, and all about me. But I can suggest it again, and she may go for it, or may not.

Edited May 27, 2016 by ironpony

[d0nnivain]

We went for a counseling session before about a year ago, but it didn't go well, because the counselor said I was being selfish, and all about me. But I can suggest it again, and she may go for it, or may not.

 

 

If that was the counselor's objective opinion, what did you change upon hearing that? Perhaps some of the fault here does lie with you. If you have been harping on this pre-nup and going on and on about how it's your money, & your house, & your future & your need for security without any consideration to the team building that is required to sustain a marriage I can better see why your GF is having such a negative reaction to your insistence. Although I am in favor of pre-nups & DH & I have one, if I sensed that my intended wanted one because he wasn't fully committed I wouldn't be thrilled about getting married either.

[rester]

What happened when you went to see the attorney this week? Did they give you any good advice about your money situation?

 

 

 

5/19/16:

The earliest time the attorney could meet is next week, so I am waiting till then.

 

But the gf said she is not going to sign one no matter what and is not interested in what the lawyer has to say. Hypothetically, if the prenup options come with the options I would like, the big decision is, do I leave my gf if she won't sign, and I want one.

 

But then again, others have said she was being manipulative. I didn't see it as manipulation, I just saw it as a huge upset overreaction, but maybe it is manipulation.

 

5/21/16:

When did I say I wasn't going to see an attorney? I have the appointment made and it was next week? Did I say I wasn't going?

 

Am I making this relationship too much about money? Is it just the prenup or other things?

[ironpony]

It was okay. The attorney basically told me my options and I felt that keeping the 200K was the best one, and whatever money we make after the marriage, she could have half, in case any possible separation were to happen.

[ironpony]

Well I had a talk with her about getting pre-marital counseling and she is a lot more up for the idea than I thought she would be. She seems open to it. I told her about what the problems were when she asked.

 

She says that she is not being manipulating though, and that she honestly felt like getting her tubes tied after I wanted her to sign a prenup. She said that she is not manipulating me, she is just telling me how she feels, which is different.

 

She also said a lot of this is my fault since I lead her on too long, and I should have brought up a lot of these problems before in the relationship.

[d0nnivain]

If she is open to counseling, go. She does have a right to feel whatever she feels. If she feels like you are blindsiding her now with issues that have be going on for a while, you do need to address your communication issues.

 

 

If she has changed her mind about wanting children with you, there is a way to say that to open the discussion. To announce that she will get her tubes tied sorry but that is just drama designed for maximum emotional impact: manipulation.

[CarrieT]

She also said a lot of this is my fault since I lead her on too long, and I should have brought up a lot of these problems before in the relationship.

 

Her finger-pointing is not taking responsibility for her own culpability with the inherent problems in your relationship.

 

The issues are not YOUR fault or HER fault but the fact that you are both concerned with each other's actions is telling in a lack of compromise and empathy for each other's points of view.

 

In short, she is guilting you into believing that all the issues are one's that you caused. Again - as d0nnivain said - you are being manipulated.

[66Charger]

I dont see why you need a prenup or a attorney. It appears all you need is a good financial planner. Why cant you invest some of your premarriage capital (75%) in a retirement that takes effect at 55? IF this is done correctly, dissolution of the marriage will not effect it.. . If you are still married at that time you may have a nice nest egg, along with whatever else you save, for the both of you. You should be willing to RISK and invest some capital in your marriage, so that things are easier. Either you are a team or you are not.

 

I understand her concern about bearing children. Children will cost you, and if you struggle, it may seem unfair that while bills are stacking up, and the children need shoes, you have a seperate nest egg that you are unwilling to use. Think about that.

 

You guys are not even married, and you are already fighting over money, manipulating, and pointing fingers. Not good , bro.

 

Premarital counseling is okay, but a financial counselor is a must. This may eliminate the prenup, but if there are still problems, dont get married.

[ironpony]

Okay thanks. The attorney never mentioned this option when we spoke. I would have to look into it, but is there a way to do without having to pay for an attorney again? I could look for a financial planner if they are better to go to.

[CarrieT]

The attorney never mentioned this option when we spoke.

Because he is not a financial planner.

 

is there a way to do without having to pay for an attorney again?

Probably, if you are willing to sock the money away and not use it to buy any major purchases like a house or start a business.

 

The difference could be that if you do put it in a retirement fund and your marriage fails, the divorce proceedings could still include her going after half of the retirement fund. There is simply no way to know without good financial planner/lawyer to be able to protect the account.

[66Charger]

You have 6 figures to invest. Any investment company will be more than willing to give you free advice and create a secure portfolio. The proceeds may be subject to divorce proceedings. but your initial investment will not. Thats fair. Google. Dont create drama, where none needs to be.

Edited May 29, 2016 by 66Charger