Important conversation with MM soon

[Got it]

Dela, some things I have posted prior that may help you a little.

 

A lot of women on this website have spent years hurting themselves so as to not hurt others. It's another way of expressing how little you value yourself. The reason why you feel other people don't consider whether or not they hurt you, is that you don't consider it yourself.

 

Every time, you put someone else's feelings ahead of your own, you are sending a message that says "it's okay if you hurt me in this way."

 

 

There comes a time in your life when you finally get it ... When in the midst of all your fears and insanity you stop dead in your tracks and somewhere the voice inside your head cries out "ENOUGH! Enough fighting and crying or struggling to hold on." And, like a child quieting down after a blind tantrum, your sobs begin to subside, you shudder once or twice, you blink back your tears and through a mantle of wet lashes you begin to look at the world from a new perspective.

 

..........This is your awakening.

 

You realize that it is time to stop hoping and waiting for something or someone to change, or for happiness safety and security to come galloping over the next horizon. You come to terms with the fact that there aren't always fairytale endings (or beginnings for that matter) and that any guarantee of "happily ever after" must begin with you. Then a sense of serenity is born of acceptance.

 

So you begin making your way through the "reality of today" rather than holding out for the "promise of tomorrow." You realize that much of who you are and the way you navigate through life is, in great part, a result of all the social conditioning you've received over the course of a lifetime. And you begin to sift through all the nonsense you were taught about :

 

- how you should look and how much you should weigh,

- what you should wear and where you should shop,

- where you should live or what type of car you should drive,

- who you should sleep with and how you should behave,

- who you should marry and why you should stay,

- the importance of bearing children or what you owe your family,

 

Slowly you begin to open up to new worlds and different points of view. And you begin re-assessing and re-defining who you are and what you really believe in. And you begin to discard the doctrines you have outgrown, or should never have practiced to begin with.

 

You accept the fact that you are not perfect ,and that not everyone will love appreciate or approve of who or what you are... and that's OK... they are entitled to their own views and opinions. And, you come to terms with the fact that you will never be a size 5 or a "perfect 10".... Or a perfect human being for that matter... and you stop trying to compete with the image inside your head or agonizing over how you compare. And, you take a long look at yourself in the mirror and you make a promise to give yourself the same unconditional love and support you give so freely to others. Then a sense of confidence is born of self-approval.

 

And, you stop maneuvering through life merely as a "consumer" hungry for your next fix, a new dress, another pair of shoes or looks of approval and admiration from family, friends or even strangers who pass by. Then you discover that it is truly in "giving" that we receive, and that the joy and abundance you seek grows out of the giving. And you recognize the importance of "creating" and "contributing" rather than "obtaining" and "accumulating."

 

And you give thanks for the simple things you've been blessed with, things that millions of people upon the earth can only dream about - a full refrigerator, clean running water, a soft warm bed, the freedom of choice and the opportunity to pursue your own dreams.

 

And you begin to love and to care for yourself. You stop engaging in self-destructive behaviors, including participating in dysfunctional relationships. You begin eating a balanced diet, drinking more water and exercising. And because you've learned that fatigue drains the spirit and creates doubt and fear, you give yourself permission to rest. And just as food is fuel for the body, laughter is fuel for the spirit and so you make it a point to create time for play.

 

Then you learn about love and relationships - how to love, how much to give in love, when to stop giving, and when to walk away. And you allow only the hands of a lover who truly loves and respects you to glorify you with his touch. You learn that people don't always say what they mean or mean what they say, intentionally or unintentionally, and that not everyone will always come through... and interestingly enough, it's not always about you. So, you stop lashing out and pointing fingers or looking to place blame for the things that were done to you or weren't done for you. And you learn to keep your Ego in check and to acknowledge and redirect the destructive emotions it spawns - anger, jealousy and resentment.

 

You learn how to say "I was wrong" and to forgive people for their own human frailties. You learn to build bridges instead of walls and about the healing power of love as it is expressed through a kind word, a warm smile or a friendly gesture. And, at the same time, you eliminate any relationships that are hurtful or fail to uplift and edify you. You stop working so hard at smoothing things over and setting your needs aside. You learn that feelings of entitlement are perfectly OK and that it is your right to want or expect certain things. And you learn the importance of communicating your needs with confidence and grace. You learn that the only cross to bear is the one you choose to carry and that eventually martyrs are burned at the stake. Then you learn to distinguish between guilt, and responsibility and the importance of setting boundaries and learning to Say NO. You learn that you don't know all the answers, it's not your job to save the world and that sometimes you just need to Let Go.

 

Moreover, you learn to look at people as they really are and not as you would want them to be, and you are careful not to project your neediness or insecurities onto a relationship. You learn that you will not be more beautiful, more intelligent, more lovable or important because of the man on your arm or the child that bears your name. You learn that just as people grow and change, so it is with love and relationships, and that that not everyone can always love you the way you would want them to. So you stop appraising your worth by the measure of love you are given. And suddenly you realize that it's wrong to demand that someone live their life or sacrifice their dreams just to serve your needs, ease your insecurities, or meet "your" standards and expectations. You learn that the only love worth giving and receiving is the love that is given freely without conditions or limitations. And you learn what it means to love. So you stop trying to control people, situations and outcomes. You learn that "alone" does not mean "lonely" and you begin to discover the joy of spending time "with yourself" and "on yourself." Then you discover the greatest and most fulfilling love you will ever know - Self Love. And so it comes to pass that, through understanding, your heart heals; and now all new things are possible.

 

Moving along, you begin to avoid Toxic people and conversations. And you stop wasting time and energy rehashing your situation with family and friends. You learn that talk doesn't change things and that unrequited wishes can only serve to keep you trapped in the past. So you stop lamenting over what could or should have been and you make a decision to leave the past behind. Then you begin to invest your time and energy to affect positive change. You take a personal inventory of all your strengths and weaknesses and the areas you need to improve in order to move ahead, you set your goals and map out a plan of action to see things through.

 

You learn that life isn't always fair and you don't always get what you think you deserve, and you stop personalizing every loss or disappointment. You learn to accept that sometimes bad things happen to good people and that these things are not an act of God... but merely a random act of fate.

 

And you stop looking for guarantees, because you've learned that the only thing you can really count on is the unexpected and that whatever happens, you'll learn to deal with it. And you learn that the only thing you must truly fear is the great robber baron of all time - FEAR itself. So you learn to step right into and through your fears, because to give into fear is to give away the right to live life on your terms. You learn that much of life truly is a self-fulfilling prophesy and you learn to go after what you want and not to squander your life living under a cloud of indecision or feelings of impending doom.

 

Then, YOU LEARN ABOUT MONEY... the personal power and independence it brings and the options it creates. And you recognize the necessity to create your own personal wealth. Slowly, you begin to take responsibility for yourself by yourself and you make yourself a promise to never betray yourself and to never ever settle for less than your heart's desire. And a sense of power is born of self-reliance. And you live with honor and integrity because you know that these principles are not the outdated ideals of a by-gone era but the mortar that holds together the foundation upon which you must build your life. And you make it a point to keep smiling, to keep trusting and to stay open to every wonderful opportunity and exciting possibility. Then you hang a wind chime outside your window to remind yourself what beauty there is in Simplicity.

 

Finally, with courage in your heart and with God by your side you take a stand, you TAKE a deep breath and you begin to design the life you want to live as best as you can."

 

 

 

 

 

CLOWN STORY

 

" A man found himself in the middle of a long hallway. In the middle of this long hallway was a solitary door. He walked up to the door and knocked on it. It was answered by a clown who proceeded to beat the life out of him. The next day, the gentleman was in the hallway once more, and once more found his way to the door and knocked on it. Again, it was answered by the same clown and again, the clown beat him senseless. This occurred for 4 more days - the man would be in the hallway, go to the door, knock on it, and the clown would answer the door only to beat him senseless once more.

 

On the 7th day, the man was once again in the hallway. He walked up to the door and knocked on it - but no one answered. So, he went looking for the clown.

 

My husband and I often say, when we're discussing how we used to allow prior relationships to hurt us AGAIN and AGAIN, that we're NO LONGER looking for the clown.

 

I see women here who continually allow their xMM (or MM) to hurt them again and again and again. The key word here, though, is "allow." When we allow someone to continually hurt us and abuse us emotionally, it becomes the rule rather than the exception.

 

I just want to tell those who are hurting to STOP looking for the clown. "

 

 

 

 

 

So, this is from the Clown's perspective:

 

Wow, she finally found me, she must really want me. I'm going to treat her like ****, disrespect her, lie to her, give her just little bits of my time and make promises I have no intention of keeping. She surely won't stay around after that.

 

Hmmmm....I can't believe she's come back looking for me again. I would have thought that by treating her so bad to begin with she wouldn't want to be treated like that anymore. I'm going to treat her like **** some more, give her some even bigger lies and give her hope when I know there isn't any.

 

WOW, she is back for more? I thought for sure she'd have gone away by now. After all, I have really been an ******* to her. I've given her nothing but pain and heartache, yet she seems to enjoy all these bad things I can give her. I'm thinking she must be enjoying this.

 

OMG - this is great! She has come back again and I now know for sure that I don't ever have to change. That no matter how bad I treat her, no matter what I say or do, no matter how much I lie to her, hurt her, give her hope - she is just going to accept it. I don't have to change my life, ruin my family, put anything of my own in jeopardy because she has proven to me she will continue to keep coming back for me. No matter how bad I treat her.

 

And, I keep getting to have someone on the side who I can have sex with, who I can call when I'm lonely, hurting or just need someone to understand my problems. I can fit her into my life because she is waiting around and always available to me no matter what. She is so happy for the 5 minutes we get together that I don't have to give more than that.

 

Wow, I LOVE being the Clown. I have it made!!

 

I feel sorry for the one who keeps looking for me.

[Dela]

Dela, you are human, you will bobble, that is okay. You don't need to beat yourself up so much. All it was, was an opportunity to show you that the clown is still at the door. Do you know the Clown Story?

 

Basically it goes like this, a man stood in front of a door, when he opened it a clown was on the other side. The clown would hit him. Each time he opened the door the clown would be there and would hit him. He finally realized to stop opening the door.

 

So you opened the door again, it just gave you an immediate lesson in seeing that things are the same. There is some reassurance there, no? You see that there is no forward progress. Maybe you opened the door because you had a little hope? Maybe some of your pain now is realizing that nothing has changed, that the hope needs to die.

 

But this is not a linear process, this takes time, and you will err, you are wonderfully human. Be gentle with yourself, see that you made the right decision and the Universe just gave you reassurance in your decision. And realize that the door is probably best served staying closed.

 

Thank you. Yes i had/have hope. I had hope because i know deep down he s not a bad human being. I had hope because of all times he s been good to me. I had hope because we didn t part fighting, no one disappeared, because he is/was there when i contacted. We all have hope. These news hit me like a train. All his victimization really gets to me. I am very empatic. Trying to fix things. Being there for people. Crying with them, laughing with them. I love him and i wanted him to be ok. I even told him, i hope all that we ve been thru, having to give up a child and this relationship, i hope it is all worth it for u. I hope u learned something. This is a life lesson. But he is in the same damn point he was in feb-march and all these months. No progress. At least i m fighting with my demons. I do something. Sometimes i don t succeed, but i beat those mother****ers.

Seeing him stuck is making me crazy. I know i shouldn t let it affect me, but it does.

[Dela]

Dela, some things I have posted prior that may help you a little.

 

A lot of women on this website have spent years hurting themselves so as to not hurt others. It's another way of expressing how little you value yourself. The reason why you feel other people don't consider whether or not they hurt you, is that you don't consider it yourself.

 

Every time, you put someone else's feelings ahead of your own, you are sending a message that says "it's okay if you hurt me in this way."

 

 

There comes a time in your life when you finally get it ... When in the midst of all your fears and insanity you stop dead in your tracks and somewhere the voice inside your head cries out "ENOUGH! Enough fighting and crying or struggling to hold on." And, like a child quieting down after a blind tantrum, your sobs begin to subside, you shudder once or twice, you blink back your tears and through a mantle of wet lashes you begin to look at the world from a new perspective.

 

..........This is your awakening.

 

You realize that it is time to stop hoping and waiting for something or someone to change, or for happiness safety and security to come galloping over the next horizon. You come to terms with the fact that there aren't always fairytale endings (or beginnings for that matter) and that any guarantee of "happily ever after" must begin with you. Then a sense of serenity is born of acceptance.

 

So you begin making your way through the "reality of today" rather than holding out for the "promise of tomorrow." You realize that much of who you are and the way you navigate through life is, in great part, a result of all the social conditioning you've received over the course of a lifetime. And you begin to sift through all the nonsense you were taught about :

 

- how you should look and how much you should weigh,

- what you should wear and where you should shop,

- where you should live or what type of car you should drive,

- who you should sleep with and how you should behave,

- who you should marry and why you should stay,

- the importance of bearing children or what you owe your family,

 

Slowly you begin to open up to new worlds and different points of view. And you begin re-assessing and re-defining who you are and what you really believe in. And you begin to discard the doctrines you have outgrown, or should never have practiced to begin with.

 

You accept the fact that you are not perfect ,and that not everyone will love appreciate or approve of who or what you are... and that's OK... they are entitled to their own views and opinions. And, you come to terms with the fact that you will never be a size 5 or a "perfect 10".... Or a perfect human being for that matter... and you stop trying to compete with the image inside your head or agonizing over how you compare. And, you take a long look at yourself in the mirror and you make a promise to give yourself the same unconditional love and support you give so freely to others. Then a sense of confidence is born of self-approval.

 

And, you stop maneuvering through life merely as a "consumer" hungry for your next fix, a new dress, another pair of shoes or looks of approval and admiration from family, friends or even strangers who pass by. Then you discover that it is truly in "giving" that we receive, and that the joy and abundance you seek grows out of the giving. And you recognize the importance of "creating" and "contributing" rather than "obtaining" and "accumulating."

 

And you give thanks for the simple things you've been blessed with, things that millions of people upon the earth can only dream about - a full refrigerator, clean running water, a soft warm bed, the freedom of choice and the opportunity to pursue your own dreams.

 

And you begin to love and to care for yourself. You stop engaging in self-destructive behaviors, including participating in dysfunctional relationships. You begin eating a balanced diet, drinking more water and exercising. And because you've learned that fatigue drains the spirit and creates doubt and fear, you give yourself permission to rest. And just as food is fuel for the body, laughter is fuel for the spirit and so you make it a point to create time for play.

 

Then you learn about love and relationships - how to love, how much to give in love, when to stop giving, and when to walk away. And you allow only the hands of a lover who truly loves and respects you to glorify you with his touch. You learn that people don't always say what they mean or mean what they say, intentionally or unintentionally, and that not everyone will always come through... and interestingly enough, it's not always about you. So, you stop lashing out and pointing fingers or looking to place blame for the things that were done to you or weren't done for you. And you learn to keep your Ego in check and to acknowledge and redirect the destructive emotions it spawns - anger, jealousy and resentment.

 

You learn how to say "I was wrong" and to forgive people for their own human frailties. You learn to build bridges instead of walls and about the healing power of love as it is expressed through a kind word, a warm smile or a friendly gesture. And, at the same time, you eliminate any relationships that are hurtful or fail to uplift and edify you. You stop working so hard at smoothing things over and setting your needs aside. You learn that feelings of entitlement are perfectly OK and that it is your right to want or expect certain things. And you learn the importance of communicating your needs with confidence and grace. You learn that the only cross to bear is the one you choose to carry and that eventually martyrs are burned at the stake. Then you learn to distinguish between guilt, and responsibility and the importance of setting boundaries and learning to Say NO. You learn that you don't know all the answers, it's not your job to save the world and that sometimes you just need to Let Go.

 

Moreover, you learn to look at people as they really are and not as you would want them to be, and you are careful not to project your neediness or insecurities onto a relationship. You learn that you will not be more beautiful, more intelligent, more lovable or important because of the man on your arm or the child that bears your name. You learn that just as people grow and change, so it is with love and relationships, and that that not everyone can always love you the way you would want them to. So you stop appraising your worth by the measure of love you are given. And suddenly you realize that it's wrong to demand that someone live their life or sacrifice their dreams just to serve your needs, ease your insecurities, or meet "your" standards and expectations. You learn that the only love worth giving and receiving is the love that is given freely without conditions or limitations. And you learn what it means to love. So you stop trying to control people, situations and outcomes. You learn that "alone" does not mean "lonely" and you begin to discover the joy of spending time "with yourself" and "on yourself." Then you discover the greatest and most fulfilling love you will ever know - Self Love. And so it comes to pass that, through understanding, your heart heals; and now all new things are possible.

 

Moving along, you begin to avoid Toxic people and conversations. And you stop wasting time and energy rehashing your situation with family and friends. You learn that talk doesn't change things and that unrequited wishes can only serve to keep you trapped in the past. So you stop lamenting over what could or should have been and you make a decision to leave the past behind. Then you begin to invest your time and energy to affect positive change. You take a personal inventory of all your strengths and weaknesses and the areas you need to improve in order to move ahead, you set your goals and map out a plan of action to see things through.

 

You learn that life isn't always fair and you don't always get what you think you deserve, and you stop personalizing every loss or disappointment. You learn to accept that sometimes bad things happen to good people and that these things are not an act of God... but merely a random act of fate.

 

And you stop looking for guarantees, because you've learned that the only thing you can really count on is the unexpected and that whatever happens, you'll learn to deal with it. And you learn that the only thing you must truly fear is the great robber baron of all time - FEAR itself. So you learn to step right into and through your fears, because to give into fear is to give away the right to live life on your terms. You learn that much of life truly is a self-fulfilling prophesy and you learn to go after what you want and not to squander your life living under a cloud of indecision or feelings of impending doom.

 

Then, YOU LEARN ABOUT MONEY... the personal power and independence it brings and the options it creates. And you recognize the necessity to create your own personal wealth. Slowly, you begin to take responsibility for yourself by yourself and you make yourself a promise to never betray yourself and to never ever settle for less than your heart's desire. And a sense of power is born of self-reliance. And you live with honor and integrity because you know that these principles are not the outdated ideals of a by-gone era but the mortar that holds together the foundation upon which you must build your life. And you make it a point to keep smiling, to keep trusting and to stay open to every wonderful opportunity and exciting possibility. Then you hang a wind chime outside your window to remind yourself what beauty there is in Simplicity.

 

Finally, with courage in your heart and with God by your side you take a stand, you TAKE a deep breath and you begin to design the life you want to live as best as you can."

 

 

 

 

 

CLOWN STORY

 

" A man found himself in the middle of a long hallway. In the middle of this long hallway was a solitary door. He walked up to the door and knocked on it. It was answered by a clown who proceeded to beat the life out of him. The next day, the gentleman was in the hallway once more, and once more found his way to the door and knocked on it. Again, it was answered by the same clown and again, the clown beat him senseless. This occurred for 4 more days - the man would be in the hallway, go to the door, knock on it, and the clown would answer the door only to beat him senseless once more.

 

On the 7th day, the man was once again in the hallway. He walked up to the door and knocked on it - but no one answered. So, he went looking for the clown.

 

My husband and I often say, when we're discussing how we used to allow prior relationships to hurt us AGAIN and AGAIN, that we're NO LONGER looking for the clown.

 

I see women here who continually allow their xMM (or MM) to hurt them again and again and again. The key word here, though, is "allow." When we allow someone to continually hurt us and abuse us emotionally, it becomes the rule rather than the exception.

 

I just want to tell those who are hurting to STOP looking for the clown. "

 

 

 

 

 

So, this is from the Clown's perspective:

 

Wow, she finally found me, she must really want me. I'm going to treat her like ****, disrespect her, lie to her, give her just little bits of my time and make promises I have no intention of keeping. She surely won't stay around after that.

 

Hmmmm....I can't believe she's come back looking for me again. I would have thought that by treating her so bad to begin with she wouldn't want to be treated like that anymore. I'm going to treat her like **** some more, give her some even bigger lies and give her hope when I know there isn't any.

 

WOW, she is back for more? I thought for sure she'd have gone away by now. After all, I have really been an ******* to her. I've given her nothing but pain and heartache, yet she seems to enjoy all these bad things I can give her. I'm thinking she must be enjoying this.

 

OMG - this is great! She has come back again and I now know for sure that I don't ever have to change. That no matter how bad I treat her, no matter what I say or do, no matter how much I lie to her, hurt her, give her hope - she is just going to accept it. I don't have to change my life, ruin my family, put anything of my own in jeopardy because she has proven to me she will continue to keep coming back for me. No matter how bad I treat her.

 

And, I keep getting to have someone on the side who I can have sex with, who I can call when I'm lonely, hurting or just need someone to understand my problems. I can fit her into my life because she is waiting around and always available to me no matter what. She is so happy for the 5 minutes we get together that I don't have to give more than that.

 

Wow, I LOVE being the Clown. I have it made!!

 

I feel sorry for the one who keeps looking for me.

 

 

Thanks so much for this great post

[whichwayisup]

Talked to my exMM last night(i know, bad)... Thru all the victim act and i miss u and i have made a sculpture for our sone s grave, he told me his wife wants another child. I am shocked. Ru kidding me???

He doesn t want, of course, he feels miserable and a monster to think of having another child when he gave up our child and he feels pushed to put his life in order and see what to do. But also mentioned that it may happen (to have a child).

Again, ru kidding me??? And as history has shown, it s not so hard for him to get someone pregnant.

I am angry. I am sad. I cursed the hell out of him. Why bring another child in a marriage where u stay for the kids???

Please if someone has been thru this, what the heck is on their mind? Do they have a brain? I feel like i wanna die

 

If he is considering this, then his marriage is not half as bad as he's made it out to be to you. I doubt very much he's 'only staying for the kids'. He may not feel such deep passion for his wife like he used to, but he obviously still loves her and is invested enough to stay. The glue that binds them together is still strong.

 

Stay away from him, go NC. No good is coming out of you talking to him.

[Got it]

Thank you. Yes i had/have hope. I had hope because i know deep down he s not a bad human being. I had hope because of all times he s been good to me. I had hope because we didn t part fighting, no one disappeared, because he is/was there when i contacted. We all have hope. These news hit me like a train. All his victimization really gets to me. I am very empatic. Trying to fix things. Being there for people. Crying with them, laughing with them. I love him and i wanted him to be ok. I even told him, i hope all that we ve been thru, having to give up a child and this relationship, i hope it is all worth it for u. I hope u learned something. This is a life lesson. But he is in the same damn point he was in feb-march and all these months. No progress. At least i m fighting with my demons. I do something. Sometimes i don t succeed, but i beat those mother****ers.

Seeing him stuck is making me crazy. I know i shouldn t let it affect me, but it does.

 

 

Dela, I totally get this and why you are such a sweet woman. But you know how on airplanes they tell the parent to put the oxygen mask on themselves first than the child? You need to do the same. You can't save him from himself. You have to focus on being supportive of yourself and your best interests.

 

I know, you wanted to see that maybe something had changed, that maybe he was going to do something since you weren't in his life, to validate your existence in his life. And this was a crushing reality that he has literally stayed straddling the fence, as mopey and as martyred as ever.

 

You aren't fighting demons. You are fighting hope, or more correctly losing hope. At some point you will finally release it, truly mourn the relationship then and what it was and could have been, and move forward.

 

It is your healing and your timeline. The clown will always be there to remind you of how he never changes.

 

Peace to you.

[whichwayisup]

I broke NC, not him... He says he doesn t want to hurt me more, that s why he doesn t contact me. But now he seems to contact me. It s all ****ed up. I don t know why i texted him. I was weak. Going to bed everynight makes me weak.

I an angry and i want this nightmare to end. I feel so stupid.

He keeps saying it s time to put things in order. Life isn t giving him more options bla bla...

I felt so sicklast night that i actually prayed not to wake up...

 

It'll all end when YOU end it and stop contacting him. Any contact HURTS YOU, not him. Remember that!

 

He contacts you because you are allowing him to manipulate you. He doesn't care if contact hurts you, if he did he would ignore you and be in NC, he'd respect you. He doesn't.

[Mount]

That is so correct, there have so many women here or elsewhere, doing or thinking IF they gave so much love or doing the sacrifice to the MM or XMM, the MM or XMM will do the same return, loving back to those women. But the reality is not, and quite opposite actually.

 

The truth of getting love is to increase the value of yourself (make yourself lovable), then options will come.

 

For OWs keep saying why can't MM just leave wife, the reality is or think another way logically, even you/OW being MM, why would you leave wife for a destructive, broken or damaged OW that so unpleasant or pathetic.

 

To summarize, any OW or exOW, need to cheer up, love or cherish yourself first, then you will have many options.

 

 

Dela, some things I have posted prior that may help you a little.

 

A lot of women on this website have spent years hurting themselves so as to not hurt others. It's another way of expressing how little you value yourself. The reason why you feel other people don't consider whether or not they hurt you, is that you don't consider it yourself.

 

Every time, you put someone else's feelings ahead of your own, you are sending a message that says "it's okay if you hurt me in this way."

 

 

There comes a time in your life when you finally get it ... When in the midst of all your fears and insanity you stop dead in your tracks and somewhere the voice inside your head cries out "ENOUGH! Enough fighting and crying or struggling to hold on." And, like a child quieting down after a blind tantrum, your sobs begin to subside, you shudder once or twice, you blink back your tears and through a mantle of wet lashes you begin to look at the world from a new perspective.

 

[Grapesofwrath]

I find it helpful to try to reframe the thoughts this way:

 

Release the part of you that wants to figure out why he does what he does. This is a puzzle with no solution.

 

How does this relationship make you feel?

 

How does this person make you feel?

 

It sounds like he brings you much pain, and very little enjoyment. Why invite more pain into your life? Release him from your thoughts and from your life. He does not nourish your soul. He takes from you and gives nothing in return.

 

If you touch a hot stove and burn your hand, why put your hand back on the stove? To prove that it will still burn you? How many times must you burn your hand before you believe that the stove will burn you?

[Satu]

OP:

 

What is it that you are reaching out for when you contact him?

 

What perceived need are you trying to fill?

[NewLeaf512]

Apart from being a liar and a cheat, this MM is also a weakling.

 

Doesn't want another child, but says, "It may happen."

 

So he's willing to play his part in bringing a child that he doesn't want into this world.

 

His responsibility level is zero.

 

His integrity level is zero.

 

 

I won't scold you about talking to him, because you already know why I could.

 

 

 

Take care.

 

Honey I think Satu and the others are right. I am guessing she is already pregnant. Would you have unprotected sex multiple times with anyone right now risking getting pregnant while you are in love with MM?

 

Of course not because then you wouldn't be in love with MM.

 

I'm so sorry

[NewLeaf512]

Dela, some things I have posted prior that may help you a little.

 

A lot of women on this website have spent years hurting themselves so as to not hurt others. It's another way of expressing how little you value yourself. The reason why you feel other people don't consider whether or not they hurt you, is that you don't consider it yourself.

 

Every time, you put someone else's feelings ahead of your own, you are sending a message that says "it's okay if you hurt me in this way."

 

 

There comes a time in your life when you finally get it ... When in the midst of all your fears and insanity you stop dead in your tracks and somewhere the voice inside your head cries out "ENOUGH! Enough fighting and crying or struggling to hold on." And, like a child quieting down after a blind tantrum, your sobs begin to subside, you shudder once or twice, you blink back your tears and through a mantle of wet lashes you begin to look at the world from a new perspective.

 

..........This is your awakening.

 

You realize that it is time to stop hoping and waiting for something or someone to change, or for happiness safety and security to come galloping over the next horizon. You come to terms with the fact that there aren't always fairytale endings (or beginnings for that matter) and that any guarantee of "happily ever after" must begin with you. Then a sense of serenity is born of acceptance.

 

So you begin making your way through the "reality of today" rather than holding out for the "promise of tomorrow." You realize that much of who you are and the way you navigate through life is, in great part, a result of all the social conditioning you've received over the course of a lifetime. And you begin to sift through all the nonsense you were taught about :

 

- how you should look and how much you should weigh,

- what you should wear and where you should shop,

- where you should live or what type of car you should drive,

- who you should sleep with and how you should behave,

- who you should marry and why you should stay,

- the importance of bearing children or what you owe your family,

 

Slowly you begin to open up to new worlds and different points of view. And you begin re-assessing and re-defining who you are and what you really believe in. And you begin to discard the doctrines you have outgrown, or should never have practiced to begin with.

 

You accept the fact that you are not perfect ,and that not everyone will love appreciate or approve of who or what you are... and that's OK... they are entitled to their own views and opinions. And, you come to terms with the fact that you will never be a size 5 or a "perfect 10".... Or a perfect human being for that matter... and you stop trying to compete with the image inside your head or agonizing over how you compare. And, you take a long look at yourself in the mirror and you make a promise to give yourself the same unconditional love and support you give so freely to others. Then a sense of confidence is born of self-approval.

 

And, you stop maneuvering through life merely as a "consumer" hungry for your next fix, a new dress, another pair of shoes or looks of approval and admiration from family, friends or even strangers who pass by. Then you discover that it is truly in "giving" that we receive, and that the joy and abundance you seek grows out of the giving. And you recognize the importance of "creating" and "contributing" rather than "obtaining" and "accumulating."

 

And you give thanks for the simple things you've been blessed with, things that millions of people upon the earth can only dream about - a full refrigerator, clean running water, a soft warm bed, the freedom of choice and the opportunity to pursue your own dreams.

 

And you begin to love and to care for yourself. You stop engaging in self-destructive behaviors, including participating in dysfunctional relationships. You begin eating a balanced diet, drinking more water and exercising. And because you've learned that fatigue drains the spirit and creates doubt and fear, you give yourself permission to rest. And just as food is fuel for the body, laughter is fuel for the spirit and so you make it a point to create time for play.

 

Then you learn about love and relationships - how to love, how much to give in love, when to stop giving, and when to walk away. And you allow only the hands of a lover who truly loves and respects you to glorify you with his touch. You learn that people don't always say what they mean or mean what they say, intentionally or unintentionally, and that not everyone will always come through... and interestingly enough, it's not always about you. So, you stop lashing out and pointing fingers or looking to place blame for the things that were done to you or weren't done for you. And you learn to keep your Ego in check and to acknowledge and redirect the destructive emotions it spawns - anger, jealousy and resentment.

 

You learn how to say "I was wrong" and to forgive people for their own human frailties. You learn to build bridges instead of walls and about the healing power of love as it is expressed through a kind word, a warm smile or a friendly gesture. And, at the same time, you eliminate any relationships that are hurtful or fail to uplift and edify you. You stop working so hard at smoothing things over and setting your needs aside. You learn that feelings of entitlement are perfectly OK and that it is your right to want or expect certain things. And you learn the importance of communicating your needs with confidence and grace. You learn that the only cross to bear is the one you choose to carry and that eventually martyrs are burned at the stake. Then you learn to distinguish between guilt, and responsibility and the importance of setting boundaries and learning to Say NO. You learn that you don't know all the answers, it's not your job to save the world and that sometimes you just need to Let Go.

 

Moreover, you learn to look at people as they really are and not as you would want them to be, and you are careful not to project your neediness or insecurities onto a relationship. You learn that you will not be more beautiful, more intelligent, more lovable or important because of the man on your arm or the child that bears your name. You learn that just as people grow and change, so it is with love and relationships, and that that not everyone can always love you the way you would want them to. So you stop appraising your worth by the measure of love you are given. And suddenly you realize that it's wrong to demand that someone live their life or sacrifice their dreams just to serve your needs, ease your insecurities, or meet "your" standards and expectations. You learn that the only love worth giving and receiving is the love that is given freely without conditions or limitations. And you learn what it means to love. So you stop trying to control people, situations and outcomes. You learn that "alone" does not mean "lonely" and you begin to discover the joy of spending time "with yourself" and "on yourself." Then you discover the greatest and most fulfilling love you will ever know - Self Love. And so it comes to pass that, through understanding, your heart heals; and now all new things are possible.

 

Moving along, you begin to avoid Toxic people and conversations. And you stop wasting time and energy rehashing your situation with family and friends. You learn that talk doesn't change things and that unrequited wishes can only serve to keep you trapped in the past. So you stop lamenting over what could or should have been and you make a decision to leave the past behind. Then you begin to invest your time and energy to affect positive change. You take a personal inventory of all your strengths and weaknesses and the areas you need to improve in order to move ahead, you set your goals and map out a plan of action to see things through.

 

You learn that life isn't always fair and you don't always get what you think you deserve, and you stop personalizing every loss or disappointment. You learn to accept that sometimes bad things happen to good people and that these things are not an act of God... but merely a random act of fate.

 

And you stop looking for guarantees, because you've learned that the only thing you can really count on is the unexpected and that whatever happens, you'll learn to deal with it. And you learn that the only thing you must truly fear is the great robber baron of all time - FEAR itself. So you learn to step right into and through your fears, because to give into fear is to give away the right to live life on your terms. You learn that much of life truly is a self-fulfilling prophesy and you learn to go after what you want and not to squander your life living under a cloud of indecision or feelings of impending doom.

 

Then, YOU LEARN ABOUT MONEY... the personal power and independence it brings and the options it creates. And you recognize the necessity to create your own personal wealth. Slowly, you begin to take responsibility for yourself by yourself and you make yourself a promise to never betray yourself and to never ever settle for less than your heart's desire. And a sense of power is born of self-reliance. And you live with honor and integrity because you know that these principles are not the outdated ideals of a by-gone era but the mortar that holds together the foundation upon which you must build your life. And you make it a point to keep smiling, to keep trusting and to stay open to every wonderful opportunity and exciting possibility. Then you hang a wind chime outside your window to remind yourself what beauty there is in Simplicity.

 

Finally, with courage in your heart and with God by your side you take a stand, you TAKE a deep breath and you begin to design the life you want to live as best as you can."

 

 

 

 

 

CLOWN STORY

 

" A man found himself in the middle of a long hallway. In the middle of this long hallway was a solitary door. He walked up to the door and knocked on it. It was answered by a clown who proceeded to beat the life out of him. The next day, the gentleman was in the hallway once more, and once more found his way to the door and knocked on it. Again, it was answered by the same clown and again, the clown beat him senseless. This occurred for 4 more days - the man would be in the hallway, go to the door, knock on it, and the clown would answer the door only to beat him senseless once more.

 

On the 7th day, the man was once again in the hallway. He walked up to the door and knocked on it - but no one answered. So, he went looking for the clown.

 

My husband and I often say, when we're discussing how we used to allow prior relationships to hurt us AGAIN and AGAIN, that we're NO LONGER looking for the clown.

 

I see women here who continually allow their xMM (or MM) to hurt them again and again and again. The key word here, though, is "allow." When we allow someone to continually hurt us and abuse us emotionally, it becomes the rule rather than the exception.

 

I just want to tell those who are hurting to STOP looking for the clown. "

 

 

 

 

 

So, this is from the Clown's perspective:

 

Wow, she finally found me, she must really want me. I'm going to treat her like ****, disrespect her, lie to her, give her just little bits of my time and make promises I have no intention of keeping. She surely won't stay around after that.

 

Hmmmm....I can't believe she's come back looking for me again. I would have thought that by treating her so bad to begin with she wouldn't want to be treated like that anymore. I'm going to treat her like **** some more, give her some even bigger lies and give her hope when I know there isn't any.

 

WOW, she is back for more? I thought for sure she'd have gone away by now. After all, I have really been an ******* to her. I've given her nothing but pain and heartache, yet she seems to enjoy all these bad things I can give her. I'm thinking she must be enjoying this.

 

OMG - this is great! She has come back again and I now know for sure that I don't ever have to change. That no matter how bad I treat her, no matter what I say or do, no matter how much I lie to her, hurt her, give her hope - she is just going to accept it. I don't have to change my life, ruin my family, put anything of my own in jeopardy because she has proven to me she will continue to keep coming back for me. No matter how bad I treat her.

 

And, I keep getting to have someone on the side who I can have sex with, who I can call when I'm lonely, hurting or just need someone to understand my problems. I can fit her into my life because she is waiting around and always available to me no matter what. She is so happy for the 5 minutes we get together that I don't have to give more than that.

 

Wow, I LOVE being the Clown. I have it made!!

 

I feel sorry for the one who keeps looking for me.

 

A rival for the best post I ever read. Where did you evolve into all this wisdom?

 

Dela I know there is more in the universe for you than this pain. I am one of the weakest women on the planet and I managed a month. I'm not going to tell you I never feel sad, because that would be a lie. I can't say I never ask myself why? Why? Why?

 

What I can tell you is that I am in control of my life now. No idea what that will look like but.. I know I don't make sure I don't have client calls from 11:30 to 11:45 any more "IN CASE" he calls or texts me during his morning dog walk. (That's right. Me. Of my education, reputation, kindness to others, loyal friend.)?Hoping for a crumb while his dog was taking a **** for 2 YEARS. But only Monday through Friday of course because the weekends were "family time". And that was ONLY IF his BW gave him his phone back before breakfast. I built a life of fantastically ridiculous behaviour for a man who put me on par with his dog's bowel movement schedule.

 

You are young. You have your whole life to find someone who will love you in Public. Just you. Because you are the one they have been waiting for. Please do this for you. You deserve so much more.

[Gloria_Smellons]

Is there any way to save or pin Gotit's post #26?

 

It is truly wonderful.

[Satu]

Is there any way to save or pin Gotit's post #26?

 

It is truly wonderful.

 

I agree. It really is wonderful.

[privategal]

If she isn't already pregnant...hes softening the blow setting you up for the news.

My xeap told me his wife was FOUR MONTHS pregnant...when the affair was at its strongest.

So he was getting me deeper and more emotionally and sexually addicted THEN delivered the news.

I was shattered.

Your MM cant be telling the truth. Couples decide together, its a huge undertaking and one spouse doesn't decide to make that lifetime commitment alone.

He told her "yes".

Id walk NOW. The pregnancy news from someone you love is a HARD blow...but if you walk now...your decision...head held high, dignity in tact...you will be able to handle it better, you have to take control for you.

He wont. Hes gonna ride this bus until the wheels fall off period.

Cake eaters dont part ways with their came easily.

Let them have sex and build their family.

It makes you look like a desperate fool to stay now.

"It still might happen" means its happening.

How low do you want to let him sink you?

Theyre having a baby. Hes never leaving, he will never be single and even if he was your life will be baby mama drama, custody and child support battles.

Get out of the mess.

Cold Turkey no dramatic emails, goodbyes, texts, explaining...its done.

[xxoo]

It's really simple: he and his wife are adding to their family. Their family. Because they are raising a family together, and there is no plan to change that. In fact, their family would be a bit nicer with another of those wonderful, joyful children that are the best part of their family. Another sibling for their children.

 

The fact that he'd like a romance on the side (without consequences to his family, of course) doesn't change the fact that he and his wife are very much raising a family together, and plan to continue. From his perspective, why not have another child? Only because it makes it more difficult for him to convince a woman to date him on the side, so he has to be apologetic about it and claim victimhood. It's his wife's fault. He's powerless.

[privategal]

It's really simple: he and his wife are adding to their family. Their family. Because they are raising a family together, and there is no plan to change that. In fact, their family would be a bit nicer with another of those wonderful, joyful children that are the best part of their family. Another sibling for their children.

 

The fact that he'd like a romance on the side (without consequences to his family, of course) doesn't change the fact that he and his wife are very much raising a family together, and plan to continue. From his perspective, why not have another child? Only because it makes it more difficult for him to convince a woman to date him on the side, so he has to be apologetic about it and claim victimhood. It's his wife's fault. He's powerless.

Exactly EXACTLY! And what a wretched evil wench she must be for wanting another baby and if things were that bad as he tells you...would she even WANT intimacy with him.

He loves his wife and family...he also loves free sex without commitment on the side.

There's no puzzle here...and the victim role IS working with you as your still there. Believing hes staying for the kids.

Hes staying because he is vested and comfy.

[Got it]

A rival for the best post I ever read. Where did you evolve into all this wisdom?

 

Dela I know there is more in the universe for you than this pain. I am one of the weakest women on the planet and I managed a month. I'm not going to tell you I never feel sad, because that would be a lie. I can't say I never ask myself why? Why? Why?

 

What I can tell you is that I am in control of my life now. No idea what that will look like but.. I know I don't make sure I don't have client calls from 11:30 to 11:45 any more "IN CASE" he calls or texts me during his morning dog walk. (That's right. Me. Of my education, reputation, kindness to others, loyal friend.)?Hoping for a crumb while his dog was taking a **** for 2 YEARS. But only Monday through Friday of course because the weekends were "family time". And that was ONLY IF his BW gave him his phone back before breakfast. I built a life of fantastically ridiculous behaviour for a man who put me on par with his dog's bowel movement schedule.

 

You are young. You have your whole life to find someone who will love you in Public. Just you. Because you are the one they have been waiting for. Please do this for you. You deserve so much more.

 

I can't take create for this. This came from a now defunct site with far smarter, wiser, and more compassionate women than I.

 

I will say, no one can support an OW like an (x)OW. They have walked in your steps, felt the same pain and joy and rode the roller coaster. They can deliver the tough love with a gentle smile and soft eye, wipe the tears when needed, and give a leg up when desired.

 

I know for my own journey, there by the grace of of the OWs before me go I.

[sandylee1]

Who stays in an unhappy marriage because of the kids and continues to have more kids? It doesn't make any sense whatsoever and if it makes sense to him, he isn't quite right in the head. I'm sure you want a man with basic common sense.

 

Someone mentioned his wife wanting a baby to fix things....does she know there's a problem? I don't recall a dday , so I can't see that she's doing this to fix the marriage that she doesn't know is broken.

 

I'm sure if she knew about the affair and your pregnancy , she would have a very different plan. How can anyone make an informed decision when they don't have all the facts... She can't.

 

I hope you find a man who never does to you what he's done to his wife.

[Goodbye]

Who stays in an unhappy marriage because of the kids and continues to have more kids? It doesn't make any sense whatsoever and if it makes sense to him, he isn't quite right in the head. I'm sure you want a man with basic common sense.

 

Someone mentioned his wife wanting a baby to fix things....does she know there's a problem? I don't recall a dday , so I can't see that she's doing this to fix the marriage that she doesn't know is broken.

 

I'm sure if she knew about the affair and your pregnancy , she would have a very different plan. How can anyone make an informed decision when they don't have all the facts... She can't.

 

I hope you find a man who never does to you what he's done to his wife.

 

 

I mentioned it as a possibility. I think the OP said the wife knows he HAD an affair, I don't think she knows it continues.

[jaskiegs]

Dela,

 

I am a MM that recently ended a long-term affair. I am replying to you even though I have not read your entire back history because some things have to be said by someone that is not "in your position" so that you can hear the veracity of the words.

 

And, to be clear, I've done a number of bad things that I regret and hurt people that I shouldn't have all while being weaker than I thought I could be.

 

Having said that, if you aborted a child that you had with him and he is considering or even talking about having a baby with his wife, he simply doesn't care about you.

 

The next time you have a weakness to contact him, come here and message someone. He's a jerk.

 

I will tell you point blank that I told my xGF that if she gets pregnant, she keeps the baby (unless she REALLY didn't want to because I wasn't going to force things) and all hell breaks loose in my life, but so be it, because it was my choice. The duplicity that your xMM shows almost makes me feel like a saint and I am a scumbag.

 

Please find the strength you need to move on. Good luck with everything...life ain't easy.

[Dela]

I mentioned it as a possibility. I think the OP said the wife knows he HAD an affair, I don't think she knows it continues.

 

Thanks for ur post. The wife doesn t know anything

[sandylee1]

I mentioned it as a possibility. I think the OP said the wife knows he HAD an affair, I don't think she knows it continues.

 

I didn't realise his wife actually knew that he had an affair. I recall Dela starting a thread to ask if the BW would want to know about ab affair , so along with her post about MM ending it, I assumed the wife doesn't know.

[Dela]

Dela,

 

I am a MM that recently ended a long-term affair. I am replying to you even though I have not read your entire back history because some things have to be said by someone that is not "in your position" so that you can hear the veracity of the words.

 

And, to be clear, I've done a number of bad things that I regret and hurt people that I shouldn't have all while being weaker than I thought I could be.

 

Having said that, if you aborted a child that you had with him and he is considering or even talking about having a baby with his wife, he simply doesn't care about you.

 

The next time you have a weakness to contact him, come here and message someone. He's a jerk.

 

I will tell you point blank that I told my xGF that if she gets pregnant, she keeps the baby (unless she REALLY didn't want to because I wasn't going to force things) and all hell breaks loose in my life, but so be it, because it was my choice. The duplicity that your xMM shows almost makes me feel like a saint and I am a scumbag.

 

Please find the strength you need to move on. Good luck with everything...life ain't easy.

 

 

Hi Jas. thanks for ur post

 

About my pregnancy, he didn t tell me to abort but he didn t tell me not to abort when i decided. He wanted to keep everything a secret anout the baby. At least for a while(he said). In the beggining of the pregnancy he said that if i decide to keep it he will support this decision. But heck, a secret child? He said he would divorce and take care of his 2 kids and our. I didn t trust his words, to be honest. It was a child and i couldn t risk being a single mom at 26 yo with a child that would ask me who his father is or where is he.

I regret my decision but it was the only way i found 6 months ago.

He keeps saying that he won t have a baby with his W. I had some horrific thoughts about it, i even cursed everything. I m sorry i did this(in my mind) but as u said, if he decides to have another child with her he s a jerk. Karma is a bitch.

[Dela]

I didn't realise his wife actually knew that he had an affair. I recall Dela starting a thread to ask if the BW would want to know about ab affair , so along with her post about MM ending it, I assumed the wife doesn't know.

 

 

 

She doesn t know. I ended the affair, not him. We communicate now only but i will end that very soon. I still have unfinished business(as things to say)

Thanks for ur post

[sandylee1]

if he decides to have another child with her he s a jerk. .

 

Indeed. The alternative to that is that it's not a bad marriage and he's just wanted some fun, being selfish.