I don't initiate.

[Els]

I've mostly only dated guys whom others consider to be shy - and I've found that it's a false assumption that shy guys will not make a move when they like you. Every single one of those guys did initiate in my Rs with them. Sure, it took some time and getting to know me first, but I'm personally not attracted to men who ask you out the first day they meet you anyway, so that works fine for me.

 

The 'shy guys need women to initiate' thing is a common misconception from what I've seen - heck in my Rs many of our mutual friends thought that I had asked the guy out, until they were informed otherwise. Don't be similarly misled. IMO no matter how shy a guy is, if he likes you enough and you are patient, he will eventually try to ask you out. If he doesn't, he probably wasn't as interested as he could be, so you'd learn that sooner rather than later anyway.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Elswyth

[Ninjainpajamas]

Well it probably has a lot to do with the type of guys you're interested in also, which is relative to your experience IMO.

 

Shy-nerdy-geeky guys, aren't the most aggressive guys in the world...to the contrary, they tend to know the least about women, and they're pretty damn timid and emasculated in just about every way IMO.

 

So what do you really expect from these guys?

 

I worked with hundreds of these guys at a large software company, not to mention other jobs. I've seen every type of nerd, geek, shy guy there is. I can still see their faces and glasses, and remember their style if that's what you want to call it, which is all relatively the same, if not mostly black.

 

Some look like they don't shower or wash their clothes, others tend to be OCD and germaphobes. Their pterodactyl shaped bodies, with more wing span than muscular tone...you either seem to get skinny/lanky or pudgy with a belly. Not an athletic bone or muscle on 95 percent of these guys, it's almost seems sacrilegious to do anything that involves physical strength and not entirely with the mind...yet they play video games with buffed out guys wearing heavy armor that would probably collapse their own shoulder blades in on themselves like a beach umbrella, if they tried to wear it. I don't even get it, how can nerdy guys who know nothing about muscle, lifting weights, being athletic and actually swinging a sword made out of metal instead foam have such a deep desire to play buff out meat heads, the ones they tend to put down in real life for being stupid and simple-minded unlike their great Vulcan self-proclaimed intellect...but I tell you, they should can rage and talk a big game behind a computer screen, just don't actually take it to the street...you'd see more wrist contact and slapping than anything else. It also seems like most of these guys made some kind of deal or special pact that they'd all be around 5'6 or 5'7...5'9 max.

 

And yet you want THESE guys, these ladies men of the night...to approach YOU, and ask you out on dates? you've got to practically lay out the red carpet, covered in sugary-treats and soda for them to them engage you. They only know how to get friendzoned, they don't "score" with the ladies...and if they do they get married or keep the same GF for at least 3 to 4 years. And if they are single, they're single for a reason because of some oddity or wear behavioral problem which they probably take medication for like anxiety or some ***** like that.

 

Why do women even like shy guys? you like when a guy sits around and takes 3 weeks to do something or never does? you like guys who couldn't rock your world in bed if you were dressed up like their favorite Anime character? they'd probably jizz their pants and start masturbating instead.

 

And your husband...wtf? the guy was a better dog than a partner, he just seemed to follow you around and do whatever you told him or asked him to do...what's the appeal here?

 

If these are the guys you're going to want to date....then you're going to have to be REALLY patient and drop every clue in the world, or just about literally ask them out. Because honestly they'd rather probably just be alone even if they were interested in you because it's easier. Personally I think it's a testosterone problem or lack hence...I mean, these guys hush up whenever a mildly attractive walks by from human resources/marketing or from the art department...these guys need a few light years to make a move, light speed isn't in their repertoire...plus you're like human and have flesh, that already makes you "weird".

[Keenly]

Well it probably has a lot to do with the type of guys you're interested in also, which is relative to your experience IMO.

 

Shy-nerdy-geeky guys, aren't the most aggressive guys in the world...to the contrary, they tend to know the least about women, and they're pretty damn timid and emasculated in just about every way IMO.

 

So what do you really expect from these guys?

 

I worked with hundreds of these guys at a large software company, not to mention other jobs. I've seen every type of nerd, geek, shy guy there is. I can still see their faces and glasses, and remember their style if that's what you want to call it, which is all relatively the same, if not mostly black.

 

Some look like they don't shower or wash their clothes, others tend to be OCD and germaphobes. Their pterodactyl shaped bodies, with more wing span than muscular tone...you either seem to get skinny/lanky or pudgy with a belly. Not an athletic bone or muscle on 95 percent of these guys, it's almost seems sacrilegious to do anything that involves physical strength and not entirely with the mind...yet they play video games with buffed out guys wearing heavy armor that would probably collapse their own shoulder blades in on themselves like a beach umbrella, if they tried to wear it. I don't even get it, how can nerdy guys who know nothing about muscle, lifting weights, being athletic and actually swinging a sword made out of metal instead foam have such a deep desire to play buff out meat heads, the ones they tend to put down in real life for being stupid and simple-minded unlike their great Vulcan self-proclaimed intellect...but I tell you, they should can rage and talk a big game behind a computer screen, just don't actually take it to the street...you'd see more wrist contact and slapping than anything else. It also seems like most of these guys made some kind of deal or special pact that they'd all be around 5'6 or 5'7...5'9 max.

 

And yet you want THESE guys, these ladies men of the night...to approach YOU, and ask you out on dates? you've got to practically lay out the red carpet, covered in sugary-treats and soda for them to them engage you. They only know how to get friendzoned, they don't "score" with the ladies...and if they do they get married or keep the same GF for at least 3 to 4 years. And if they are single, they're single for a reason because of some oddity or wear behavioral problem which they probably take medication for like anxiety or some ***** like that.

 

Why do women even like shy guys? you like when a guy sits around and takes 3 weeks to do something or never does? you like guys who couldn't rock your world in bed if you were dressed up like their favorite Anime character? they'd probably jizz their pants and start masturbating instead.

 

And your husband...wtf? the guy was a better dog than a partner, he just seemed to follow you around and do whatever you told him or asked him to do...what's the appeal here?

 

If these are the guys you're going to want to date....then you're going to have to be REALLY patient and drop every clue in the world, or just about literally ask them out. Because honestly they'd rather probably just be alone even if they were interested in you because it's easier. Personally I think it's a testosterone problem or lack hence...I mean, these guys hush up whenever a mildly attractive walks by from human resources/marketing or from the art department...these guys need a few light years to make a move, light speed isn't in their repertoire...plus you're like human and have flesh, that already makes you "weird".

 

Some one sure is trying hard to make shy guys sound less attractive. You should.spend less time worrying about what other people like.

[Els]

Lots of words.

 

Why do women even like shy guys?

 

You know this post says a lot more about you than it does about anyone else, right?

 

But, I will bite.

 

1) A man who is largely monogamous is attractive to many of us women. You and several others (mostly men) seem to believe that the pinnacle of male attractiveness/achievement is someone who has a different woman on his arm every night, but I assure you that many of us perceive such men differently.

 

2) Personally I find it attractive when a man really gets to know a woman before asking her out, rather than asking every woman he meets on a date after a 5-minute conversation. It says a lot about what he values, and also that he is selective about his partners.

 

3) Some introverts just enjoy being around other introverts. Different strokes for different folks.

 

4) Men who take the time to actually learn about the female anatomy and orgasm can be absolutely amazing in bed, especially compared to someone who thinks he has nothing left to learn because he has been with (insert X number) of women.

 

5) Vulcan-like intellect is hot. That is all.

 

Now, obviously all the above points aren't necessarily true for all shy guys, and some of them might indeed fall within the negative brush you so generously paint all of them with. But your perceptions on what is or isn't attractive are so narrow, no one would be able to fit a hair in them.

[MoreAmore]

Shy-nerdy-geeky guys, aren't the most aggressive guys in the world...to the contrary, they tend to know the least about women, and they're pretty damn timid and emasculated in just about every way IMO.

 

I'm not sure there is anyone I tend to disagree with quite as often in this place, but I have to say something here.

 

Emasculated? Hardly.

 

I love nerdy guys and geeky guys, both shy and not. Who wouldn't love that level of intellect and passion?

[Ninjainpajamas]

 

1) A man who is largely monogamous is attractive to many of us women. You and several others (mostly men) seem to believe that the pinnacle of male attractiveness/achievement is someone who has a different woman on his arm every night, but I assure you that many of us perceive such men differently.

 

Monogamous because they lack options and fear the female species...I guess that can be viewed as a good thing.

 

I wouldn't say being with a different woman every night is the pinnacle of attractiveness and achievement...but being comfortable enough in yourself and your own skin, to know when to approach and ask out a woman who is interested in you and dropping all the hints in the world, is more in line of what a man should be comfortable with.

 

2) Personally I find it attractive when a man really gets to know a woman before asking her out, rather than asking every woman he meets on a date after a 5-minute conversation. It says a lot about what he values, and also that he is selective about his partners.

 

I wouldn't say these men are getting to know women at all, on the contrary I believe they lack the social skill in getting to know said woman, who she's about, where she's from, what her beliefs are.

 

Let's be honest here, chances are you can only talk about certain topics over and over, and it's more of a relationship developed out of proximity and slow comfort rather than truly getting to know the other person at first, just like most people do.

 

A guy asking out a woman in 5 minutes doesn't know you and probably wants to just get in your pants anyway if he's being overly aggressive and obvious in his interest, but it doesn't make a shy guy anymore selective when the women that will talk to him or the only options he has to choose from

 

That's not selective, that's waiting for opportunities to come to you...which is something attractive men do as well too.

 

3) Some introverts just enjoy being around other introverts. Different strokes for different folks.

 

I don't think being introverted has much to do with it...I think it has more to do with self-confidence and being comfortable in your own skin. This "introverted" attitude is sold as being someone who cannot interact with people socially and come off as awkward, but contrary to popular belief, you can still be introverted and quite social, even the center of the spotlight when needed.

 

4) Men who take the time to actually learn about the female anatomy and orgasm can be absolutely amazing in bed, especially compared to someone who thinks he has nothing left to learn because he has been with (insert X number) of women.

 

I really really doubt this...this sounds like a manufactured way of building up an idea rather than a reality.

 

A person who is good in bed always listens to their partner and tests things out, sees what works and what doesn't...it doesn't take a certain guy to be horrible in bed, I'm sure there are equals on both sides of the fence.

 

That argument is total BS...but good try.

 

5) Vulcan-like intellect is hot. That is all.

 

Not when it's the only talent you got. Being intelligent doesn't mean you know how to be around a woman, and it doesn't mean you know how to express yourself and your emotions either stone-cold Spock.

 

But hey, if like the chill of an emotionless man because he doesn't have the courage to express how he feels...go ahead.

 

Now, obviously all the above points aren't necessarily true for all shy guys, and some of them might indeed fall within the negative brush you so generously paint all of them with. But your perceptions on what is or isn't attractive are so narrow, no one would be able to fit a hair in them.

 

Honestly, a lot of it was made in jest...but I know a lot of it stands to be true because I worked with a lot of these guys and you'd be a blind man not to observe it.

 

I do think a lot of their qualities are exaggerated however because at the end of the day they still are just like any other man but with certain common traits, and really I question and wonder from a man's point of view if women select these kind of men because they are insecure and not very confident in themselves, therefore being with one of these men who are generally much less desirable men in the dating world gives them a sense of security and confidence, because a lot of these women know what it's like not to feel or be sexy, and are used to being the nerdy and undesirable girl which gravitates them to these guys, but I know these guys can be just as much of a jerk as the other guys in spite of their more reserved and contained appearance...but at least think they won't have to live up to any high expectations or be challenged or threatened with their own insecurities and fears.

 

I think a lot of that attraction is projected, because they feel they can relate...but just because these men look like their a bird of the same feather, in reality they really aren't...a lot of these guys are douchebags just like any other guy, they just didn't develop into that kind of guy due to other more realistic reasons...not all the cool points or reasons they're given just for being a certain way.

[autumnnight]

Well it probably has a lot to do with the type of guys you're interested in also, which is relative to your experience IMO.

 

Shy-nerdy-geeky guys, aren't the most aggressive guys in the world...to the contrary, they tend to know the least about women, and they're pretty damn timid and emasculated in just about every way IMO.

 

So what do you really expect from these guys?

 

I worked with hundreds of these guys at a large software company, not to mention other jobs. I've seen every type of nerd, geek, shy guy there is. I can still see their faces and glasses, and remember their style if that's what you want to call it, which is all relatively the same, if not mostly black.

 

Some look like they don't shower or wash their clothes, others tend to be OCD and germaphobes. Their pterodactyl shaped bodies, with more wing span than muscular tone...you either seem to get skinny/lanky or pudgy with a belly. Not an athletic bone or muscle on 95 percent of these guys, it's almost seems sacrilegious to do anything that involves physical strength and not entirely with the mind...yet they play video games with buffed out guys wearing heavy armor that would probably collapse their own shoulder blades in on themselves like a beach umbrella, if they tried to wear it. I don't even get it, how can nerdy guys who know nothing about muscle, lifting weights, being athletic and actually swinging a sword made out of metal instead foam have such a deep desire to play buff out meat heads, the ones they tend to put down in real life for being stupid and simple-minded unlike their great Vulcan self-proclaimed intellect...but I tell you, they should can rage and talk a big game behind a computer screen, just don't actually take it to the street...you'd see more wrist contact and slapping than anything else. It also seems like most of these guys made some kind of deal or special pact that they'd all be around 5'6 or 5'7...5'9 max.

 

And yet you want THESE guys, these ladies men of the night...to approach YOU, and ask you out on dates? you've got to practically lay out the red carpet, covered in sugary-treats and soda for them to them engage you. They only know how to get friendzoned, they don't "score" with the ladies...and if they do they get married or keep the same GF for at least 3 to 4 years. And if they are single, they're single for a reason because of some oddity or wear behavioral problem which they probably take medication for like anxiety or some ***** like that.

 

Why do women even like shy guys? you like when a guy sits around and takes 3 weeks to do something or never does? you like guys who couldn't rock your world in bed if you were dressed up like their favorite Anime character? they'd probably jizz their pants and start masturbating instead.

 

And your husband...wtf? the guy was a better dog than a partner, he just seemed to follow you around and do whatever you told him or asked him to do...what's the appeal here?

 

If these are the guys you're going to want to date....then you're going to have to be REALLY patient and drop every clue in the world, or just about literally ask them out. Because honestly they'd rather probably just be alone even if they were interested in you because it's easier. Personally I think it's a testosterone problem or lack hence...I mean, these guys hush up whenever a mildly attractive walks by from human resources/marketing or from the art department...these guys need a few light years to make a move, light speed isn't in their repertoire...plus you're like human and have flesh, that already makes you "weird".

 

Are you Penny's old boyfriend from The Big Bang Theory???

 

Also, you should watch the space walk scene from Revenge of the Nerds

[PrettyEmily77]

I'm not against women initiating either. Sometimes I initiated conversations with men I didn't know. But I appreciate men's balls enough to know that they go after things they want. It's disturbing to know that the man you pursue and who appears passive would chase some other more attractive woman with admirable persistence.

 

 

Men can have balls and enjoy being sweet-talked into pretty much anything you have in mind all at the same time, IME . There's also nothing less appealing than a 'ballsy' guy going after the woman he wants even when the woman is showing no interest.

 

 

To me, an guy who is secure enough in his manhood that he appreciates a little bit of a role-reversal in the early stages is a very big turn-on

[Ninjainpajamas]

Are you Penny's old boyfriend from The Big Bang Theory???

 

Also, you should watch the space walk scene from Revenge of the Nerds

 

Actually I prefer the girlfriend of the Jewish guy with the bowl cut. I have a thing for high pitched voices and she's actually quite good looking.

[regine_phalange]

Men can have balls and enjoy being sweet-talked into pretty much anything you have in mind all at the same time, IME . There's also nothing less appealing than a 'ballsy' guy going after the woman he wants even when the woman is showing no interest.

 

 

To me, an guy who is secure enough in his manhood that he appreciates a little bit of a role-reversal in the early stages is a very big turn-on

 

I get what you're saying. And I get that you like the idea of seducing someone. I'm sure they appreciate it too. But wouldn't it bother you if the same man was extra ballsy with some other woman he thought was really attractive? It has happened to me and it's not a very sexy feeling So never again.

[jen1447]

To me, an guy who is secure enough in his manhood that he appreciates a little bit of a role-reversal in the early stages is a very big turn-on

 

For me, guys having balls (small as they may be) is actually part and parcel with the ability to submit to a woman. It takes a real man to let go out the outward trappings of being a real man.

[Ninjainpajamas]

I get what you're saying. And I get that you like the idea of seducing someone. I'm sure they appreciate it too. But wouldn't it bother you if the same man was extra ballsy with some other woman he thought was really attractive? It has happened to me and it's not a very sexy feeling So never again.

 

These guys are anything but "secure in their manhood"...it's wishful thinking and a belief that if a guy is quiet and doesn't exude a certain negative behavior that he must be this great guy underneath *insert BS and assumed values here*...it's almost like the best qualities about these guys is that fact that they don't show their true selves and who they really are and how they really just think like any other guy to women...it's that "secrecy" that leads them to believe that somehow these guys are different and an exception to the rule than just the other guy trying to get in their pants.

 

I can assure you they are the same men mentally, they are just merely more reserved/less talkative/vocal and generally less expressive with women out of fear and insecurity...but somehow some women have twisted this into believing that because they say nothing, they must be men of whatever qualities they like to assume they have.

 

It's just a projection of what women classify and attach to these men...it's almost like attaching purity and high value to a woman who doesn't have sex but the reality is she suffers from a fear of intimacy due to being raped...it's this whole contraption that people have in their minds that they just feel in the blanks with whatever they want to believe...and because these guys are much less vocal and have much less options generally (I definitely didn't see women lining up to date them) it is perceived that somehow, these guys are doing everything for the right and valued reasons that women desire...ignoring the fact that the way these men are have more to do with everything else than ever having to do with those values they assume they have...that's completely a woman's perspective, I'm glad I can speak from experience in this respect.

 

They think the same way as any other man, they're just simply "can't do's"...it's like this unimaginable conquest that they don't even dare to try or attempt with women...and "extra ballsy" is him just simply being a man who is intrigued, it's like a dog going after a ball, he's just got the reaction to do it. There's nothing special about these guys, they're earning points for no reason at all.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Ninjainpajamas

[Keenly]

It seems we have some one that knows not only everything about shy guys, but has also met every single one of them on the face of the earth.

 

that's fine if you don't like that type of guy, but the lengths of which you are going out of your way to make it seem like they are some how less than really says a lot more about you then it does about them.

[candie13]

well... the real question is if shy guy equals socially awkward guys. Socially awkward = not cool.

 

I like men who aren't immediately all over you. I like men that are more guarded, that seize a situation and a person before talking. I think it all depends on the level of shyness. I am shy in the sense that I would not just go to a random stranger's table and start a conversation with him and his three mates, out of the blue.

 

I might however go to the counter and smile and very softly start a conversation with a random cute stranger, if he's placing his order.

 

Basically, if shyness is debilitating and preventing one from making contact with his peers - having normal relationships - maintaining normal relationships, than that is a turn off for me.

[PrettyEmily77]

I get what you're saying. And I get that you like the idea of seducing someone. I'm sure they appreciate it too. But wouldn't it bother you if the same man was extra ballsy with some other woman he thought was really attractive? It has happened to me and it's not a very sexy feeling So never again.

 

 

Fair enough.

 

 

I've been approached enough by 'ballsy' guys to know that it's not actually a sign of any inherent positive character trait; often the opposite in fact, in my own personal experience, so I don't factor that in at all in terms of level of attraction. And if that extra ballsy guy has the distaste to go see somewhere else, that's his loss .

[PrettyEmily77]

These guys are anything but "secure in their manhood"...it's wishful thinking and a belief that if a guy is quiet and doesn't exude a certain negative behavior that he must be this great guy underneath *insert BS and assumed values here*...it's almost like the best qualities about these guys is that fact that they don't show their true selves and who they really are and how they really just think like any other guy to women...it's that "secrecy" that leads them to believe that somehow these guys are different and an exception to the rule than just the other guy trying to get in their pants.

 

I can assure you they are the same men mentally, they are just merely more reserved/less talkative/vocal and generally less expressive with women out of fear and insecurity...but somehow some women have twisted this into believing that because they say nothing, they must be men of whatever qualities they like to assume they have.

 

It's just a projection of what women classify and attach to these men...it's almost like attaching purity and high value to a woman who doesn't have sex but the reality is she suffers from a fear of intimacy due to being raped...it's this whole contraption that people have in their minds that they just feel in the blanks with whatever they want to believe...and because these guys are much less vocal and have much less options generally (I definitely didn't see women lining up to date them) it is perceived that somehow, these guys are doing everything for the right and valued reasons that women desire...ignoring the fact that the way these men are have more to do with everything else than ever having to do with those values they assume they have...that's completely a woman's perspective, I'm glad I can speak from experience in this respect.

 

They think the same way as any other man, they're just simply "can't do's"...it's like this unimaginable conquest that they don't even dare to try or attempt with women...and "extra ballsy" is him just simply being a man who is intrigued, it's like a dog going after a ball, he's just got the reaction to do it. There's nothing special about these guys, they're earning points for no reason at all.

 

It all makes sense now ...

[PrettyEmily77]

For me, guys having balls (small as they may be) is actually part and parcel with the ability to submit to a woman. It takes a real man to let go out the outward trappings of being a real man.

 

 

Yep. Also has absolutely no bearings on how shy / reserved the guy actually is.

[autumnnight]

Actually I prefer the girlfriend of the Jewish guy with the bowl cut. I have a thing for high pitched voices and she's actually quite good looking.

 

You misunderstood my question. I wasn't asking if you liked Penny. I was remarking that based on your opinion of shy nerdy men, you must be a guy like Penny's old boyfriend....

 

[toscaroscura]

:laugh:

 

I like shy, nerdy guys. But there's a huge difference between a shy nerdy guy, and a neckbeard, or a hardcore otaku, or a cheeto-covered otherkin!

 

My best friend is a brilliant, fiery, articulate, sexy engineer! Too bad he's completely devoted to his girlfriend. (I kid, our relationship is platonic and I'm happy for him.)

 

But he is certainly no mouth-breather.

 

I won't deny these guys can have serious problems with intimacy and that I have gotten my heart broken.

 

PS, I date non-nerds too! Being nerdy is not a requirement for me, but they need to be tolerant of me if I launch into a nerd rant!

[jen1447]

^ I thought you promised me there'd be no nerdisms! Or was that just star wars?

 

I like shy, nerdy guys. But there's a huge difference between a shy nerdy guy, and a neckbeard, or a hardcore otaku, or a cheeto-covered otherkin!

LMAO - what the f*ck are those things??

[toscaroscura]

^ I thought you promised me there'd be no nerdisms! Or was that just star wars?

 

 

LMAO - what the f*ck are those things??

 

I promised nothing!

 

You don't want to know what they are, believe me!

[jen1447]

I'll take your word for it.

 

Ha, I read my own post back as "nerdgasms" ....head in the gutter I know. I'll give you all of those you want tho. I do have a catwoman outfit, meow.

[autumnnight]

I promised nothing!

 

You don't want to know what they are, believe me!

 

You speak the truth "milady" lolololololol

[Got it]

It seems we have some one that knows not only everything about shy guys, but has also met every single one of them on the face of the earth.

 

that's fine if you don't like that type of guy, but the lengths of which you are going out of your way to make it seem like they are some how less than really says a lot more about you then it does about them.

 

Kudos!!!

 

I agree, I love how some feel they are experts on large sects of the human race. Man, to be that knowledgable. How do they handle us mere mortals?

 

To the OP - I do caution to not lose sight of the forest for the trees. There is pursuing but there is still reading the tea leaves. I will definitely pursue a man, if interested, but I expect a certain give and take. It's like a tennis match, if you are constantly volleying balls over to their side of the court then just take your racket and go home.

 

So I see where men love to have a woman approach them but then you toss them the ball and see if they hit it back. If they don't I cut my ties and go home. I was never interested and clearing the way for someone to pursue me. If I have to put that much effort into it, it isn't worth the effort.

[toscaroscura]

 

So I see where men love to have a woman approach them but then you toss them the ball and see if they hit it back. If they don't I cut my ties and go home. I was never interested and clearing the way for someone to pursue me. If I have to put that much effort into it, it isn't worth the effort.

 

This is very true and wise to remember!