SycamoreCircle Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 So? So so. No desire to beat horses here. I don't even know who or what I'm arguing against or why. This thread has become so hydra-headed. There's so many cross arguments, I have no interest in pursuing. Date who you wanna' date, marry who you want to marry, view providers as dispassionate men, view poets as dispassionate men, ban xBox, change the world, work a 9 to 5 and come home energized. CASTIGAT RIDENDO MORES:laugh::laugh: 1 Link to post Share on other sites
gaius Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 ohhhhhhhh, yeah. the "fat" (i hate that word) women are getting men... like a bunch of men. contrary to the popular opinion, they don't have any troubles finding men. and just like that -- the "broke" dudes don't have any troubles finding ladies either. i don't mind a broke dude. i get that people struggle financially, i get that. but i do mind a dude who is okay being broke, just like 90% of the women do. i might f&ck a broke dude, with no car and no place -- but i won't go anywhere seriously with him unless i'm trying to play a sugar mommy. & i really think most women are like that -- especially if they plan to start a family. you're looking for someone who is able to take care of themselves and you and your future family when things get rough. it isn't about the money, it is about the drive. people who are driven and WANT success -- eventually WILL be successful . and then... success aside, you have a character. you have people who are passionate and love their jobs and you have those who absolutely hate it and look at it as another way to earn money. not every successful man or rich man is passionate and driven. I knew a guy in high school who was fairly skinny and decently popular with the ladies. Like a couple of the more popular girls were interested in him on some level. But for pretty much the entire time I was there he was on and off with this ugly, taller than him, at least 100 pounds overweight girl. That most of the guys there were afraid of. Because she always had a vicious snarl on her face. It was one of the more popular topics of conversation, wtf he was doing with her, but I guess they just had a connection and figured it out before most other people. That public perception shouldn't trump true connection and going for what you want. I get there are some guys who are so broke that it really throws a wrench into the normal dynamics of the relationship. But the impression I'm getting here is that a lot of women won't date a guy who they can't run to their friends and say "oh he's a blah blah blah" and they'll all be impressed. Even if he can support himself and pay for dinner. Which is untrue based on my personal experience and incredibly unfortunate for any woman who would honestly follow that philosophy. Like a gay guy stuck in a closet because he's afraid what other people might think. I'm dating a woman who's older than me right now and I couldn't care less what other people think about that. Link to post Share on other sites
RedRobin Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Thats a plus for you, I suppose... I think in some ways its even ethnic or cultural..Like, IME, Jewish and Italian women are usually very strong willed and opinionated..(think someone like Judge Judy)..They will not usually stand for a guy that's not on some steep trajectory for something significant...They arent the types that get google-eyed over flowers and cards. Show them the money!..... TFY I don't know about the cultural references, but I do believe that a lot of women are very much pressured to do better than themselves by well intentioned friends and family... They bring the guy home, and its the family grilling him for his income potential. Few are working all that hard to sort the guy's character out all that much. As if, $$ comes first, and everything else comes second. That needs to change. By the time I'd met my fiancée, I was well past that point in my life. Had a failed marriage from a guy from a wealthy family, so you could say I'd already BTDT with the so called 'good potential' guy who turned out to be an a-hole. If I didn't have my own money and options, I'd probably still be married to him, and miserable. Probably with a couple of kids too, and feeling stuck. So, for me it wasn't 'flowers and cards' at all... and I kind of resent that notion. Money doesn't buy you love, or real consideration, and it certainly has zero to with character. I always knew that. But this time, I was going to make sure to expand the net. Link to post Share on other sites
WasOtherWoman Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Lol, I disagree. As another high earning couple we obviously do things very differently. I don't think that is the factor but the players involved. And I know MANY low earning couples where the woman defers many of the decisions. Not something I understand but it isn't unique by any means. What you have said is he makes 95% of the decisions. Not that he only cares for 5% and you only care for 5%. So a relationship where one party make the majority of the decisions is not unique and happens quite often. My husband had that in his first marriage easily. He just hated it. Sigh... I actually did not say that my husband MAKES 95% of the decisions. I said that I am not necessarily invested in 95% of the decisions, meaning the outcome of which are mostly irrelevant for me. How the deck looks? Not something I can bother myself with, he loves that kind of crap. What kind of car he buys.. why should I care? Now, when we bought a boat, that was a different story. For me, there was a three bathroom minimum.... no discussion. We each make sure that the person gets their way in the things that they truly care about. This is not about power..... Anyway, carry on... Link to post Share on other sites
candie13 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Or someone took a job that allowed them to stay home to care for their dying mother. Or they spend their time volunteering to help save animals and fight animal cruelty. Is this hard to understand? you're mistaken animal right militants with successful people Link to post Share on other sites
candie13 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 I think that is opinion and not actual fact. factually speaking, successful people actually have the $$$ to show, not just a good heart and good intentions Link to post Share on other sites
Elam Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 I was referring to successful in life not successful in dating. Being successful with women is being successful in life. Casanova dedicated his entire life to bedding women and the guy's will always be forever held in high-esteem by his fellow men. He's still loved, admired and copied, and he'll never be forgotten as long as Mankind endures. That decent guy who had a family and a great business? Sure, that's great, but unless his name is rockefeller no one gives a damn about him. And even if I have a very rich guy talking to me, why do I care? its just money. Link to post Share on other sites
candie13 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Being successful with women is being successful in life. Casanova dedicated his entire life to bedding women and the guy's will always be forever held in high-esteem by his fellow men. He's still loved, admired and copied, and he'll never be forgotten as long as Mankind endures. That decent guy who had a family and a great business? Sure, that's great, but unless his name is rockefeller no one gives a damn about him. And even if I have a very rich guy talking to me, why do I care? its just money. your words mark catastrophe. Womenizers don't chase women because they like them, but as a mean of escapism. It gives them an identity, ego boost, it's how they can make up for their failures in the other aspects of their lives. It's like that saying "when you start having a stomach ache, you're accusing a serious headache". 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Elam Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 your words mark catastrophe. Womenizers don't chase women because they like them, but as a mean of escapism. It gives them an identity, ego boost, it's how they can make up for their failures in the other aspects of their lives. It's like that saying "when you start having a stomach ache, you're accusing a serious headache". You clearly don't know what you're talking about. Lord Byron was one of the greatest womanizers the Western world has ever known and he was a success in every aspect of his life. He was and still is considered one of the best poets the English world has ever produced. He was highly admired by everyone not only for his good-looks, his social background, his success with women and how he was, a hero, a soldier, a conqueror. Casanova was also highly regarded by the intellectuals of his time. He spoke fluent French, he was a great historian, he was responsible for the creation of the lottery if I'm not mistaken. He had a great friendship with many renowned men. Speaking personally. I have an uncle who has been womanizing since he was a teenager and he has a great job and so on. On the other hand, the men who aren't all that successful with women are downright depressed and they stick onto their women like the women tehy are with are the only women left on this planet. Its patethic. i respect far more a womanize than I'll ever respect a guy who'll stick to his girlfriend because he doesn't have options. Link to post Share on other sites
WasOtherWoman Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 You clearly don't know what you're talking about. Lord Byron was one of the greatest womanizers the Western world has ever known and he was a success in every aspect of his life. He was and still is considered one of the best poets the English world has ever produced. He was highly admired by everyone not only for his good-looks, his social background, his success with women and how he was, a hero, a soldier, a conqueror. Casanova was also highly regarded by the intellectuals of his time. He spoke fluent French, he was a great historian, he was responsible for the creation of the lottery if I'm not mistaken. He had a great friendship with many renowned men. Speaking personally. I have an uncle who has been womanizing since he was a teenager and he has a great job and so on. On the other hand, the men who aren't all that successful with women are downright depressed and they stick onto their women like the women tehy are with are the only women left on this planet. Its patethic. i respect far more a womanize than I'll ever respect a guy who'll stick to his girlfriend because he doesn't have options. With all due respect, I am not sure that any women would consider a man who is a "womanizer", as you call them, to be successful. The concept of that is just funny to me. May I ask your age please if that is not too personal? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
candie13 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 You clearly don't know what you're talking about. Lord Byron was one of the greatest womanizers the Western world has ever known and he was a success in every aspect of his life. He was and still is considered one of the best poets the English world has ever produced. He was highly admired by everyone not only for his good-looks, his social background, his success with women and how he was, a hero, a soldier, a conqueror. Casanova was also highly regarded by the intellectuals of his time. He spoke fluent French, he was a great historian, he was responsible for the creation of the lottery if I'm not mistaken. He had a great friendship with many renowned men. Speaking personally. I have an uncle who has been womanizing since he was a teenager and he has a great job and so on. On the other hand, the men who aren't all that successful with women are downright depressed and they stick onto their women like the women tehy are with are the only women left on this planet. Its patethic. i respect far more a womanize than I'll ever respect a guy who'll stick to his girlfriend because he doesn't have options. Byron could write. I have no idea what Cassanova was doing - oh, I think when he was getting bored, he was taking a knack out of marrying his mistresses with other men. And best case scenario, those are 2 men that humanity remembers. How about the rest of the humanizers? The ability to f*ck anything that goes your way is hardly remarkable, it dehumanizes both yourself and your partner. you seem to see the ability to be successful with women as being successful in life. If that's what your value system is telling you, you should, by all means, live in accordance and harmony with it. here's a thought: I doubt you even think at your disposable partners as human beings. They're only purpose of passage through your life is that you can feel you're worthy or valueble because you've shagged them. That's sad, the sense of worth is supposed to come from within, not from outside, otherwise it's external validation. Anyway, I'm not judging you, just an observation. Link to post Share on other sites
SammySammy Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 With all due respect, I am not sure that any women would consider a man who is a "womanizer", as you call them, to be successful. The concept of that is just funny to me. May I ask your age please if that is not too personal? You don't consider them to be successful with women or successful in general? Link to post Share on other sites
WasOtherWoman Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 You don't consider them to be successful with women or successful in general? I think, speaking as a woman, that we rarely even think about whether a man is successful with women. Maybe it is just me, or my age, or something but that is not even on my radar. When I hear the term "successful man" (or "successful woman") for that matter, it is really about what they have accomplished in life, and yes, shallowly speaking, what they "have." I can only speak for myself, but the concept of a man being successful with women is not really something I spend any time considering.... Link to post Share on other sites
SammySammy Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 I think, speaking as a woman, that we rarely even think about whether a man is successful with women. Maybe it is just me, or my age, or something but that is not even on my radar. When I hear the term "successful man" (or "successful woman") for that matter, it is really about what they have accomplished in life, and yes, shallowly speaking, what they "have." I can only speak for myself, but the concept of a man being successful with women is not really something I spend any time considering.... Oh, you don't think of men being successful with women. Male success is defined in terms of material goods. I see. Link to post Share on other sites
WasOtherWoman Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Oh, you don't think of men being successful with women. Male success is defined in terms of material goods. I see. Yes, guilty. To be fair though, I also measure my own success that same way. I am an equal opportunity shallow person Link to post Share on other sites
Elam Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 With all due respect, I am not sure that any women would consider a man who is a "womanizer", as you call them, to be successful. The concept of that is just funny to me. May I ask your age please if that is not too personal? Of course. A successful man to a woman is a man who invests and spends his resources and time and efforts on only one woman. Someone who makes a woman's life as comfortable as possible. Someone like my father. I'm 28. Link to post Share on other sites
WasOtherWoman Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Of course. A successful man to a woman is a man who invests and spends his resources and time and efforts on only one woman. Someone who makes a woman's life as comfortable as possible. Someone like my father. I'm 28. Well, yes, I do certainly HOPE that my husband invests in only me (although I am not interested in him investing ALL of his resources, time and efforts on me, he has a company that he needs to run). He makes it a priority to make my life as comfortable as possible, but I also make it a priority to do the same for him. I had a Dad likes yours.... great man, he was Link to post Share on other sites
alphamale Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 ladies, the dumber you are the more likely you are to have a bf or husband 5 Link to post Share on other sites
SammySammy Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Yes, guilty. To be fair though, I also measure my own success that same way. I am an equal opportunity shallow person Honesty. I like that. I submit there are many types of achievement though. Intellectual, physical, spiritual, financial, social and many others. Many people strive to achieve success in areas that can't be measured by money or goods. If sexual conquests are in the social realm, I can see how some people might view bedding women as success. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
candie13 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 ladies, the dumber you are the more likely you are to have a bf or husband it's not about dumb, it's about standards and settling. Hell, I'm the one to talk, I was this close to settling myself... IMO, as long as you are true to yourself and actively chose your partner, everyday, then you're not settling. Link to post Share on other sites
candie13 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Honesty. I like that. I submit there are many types of achievement though. Intellectual, physical, spiritual, financial, social and many others. Many people strive to achieve success in areas that can't be measured by money or goods. If sexual conquests are in the social realm, I can see how some people might view bedding women as success. success amongst women and bedding as many women as you can lay your hands on are 2 different things. But... I do understand your point about sexual conquests, especially for men, it adds to the pressure of "being successful". Link to post Share on other sites
SammySammy Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 success amongst women and bedding as many women as you can lay your hands on are 2 different things. But... I do understand your point about sexual conquests, especially for men, it adds to the pressure of "being successful". Right. How many men are on this site right now bemoaning their lack of success with women? Considering themselves failures? Many. It's just part of the male psyche. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
WasOtherWoman Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Right. How many men are on this site right now bemoaning their lack of success with women? Considering themselves failures? Many. It's just part of the male psyche. LOL, I am just hopeful that my husband does not consider bedding as many women as possible as one of his success criteria for himself!! :eek: If he does then I hope a body condom is in use!!! 2 Link to post Share on other sites
SammySammy Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 LOL, I am just hopeful that my husband does not consider bedding as many women as possible as one of his success criteria for himself!! :eek: If he does then I hope a body condom is in use!!! Some men. Not all. Some women may even see sexual conquests as success. Gold diggers, for example. Link to post Share on other sites
candie13 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Right. How many men are on this site right now bemoaning their lack of success with women? Considering themselves failures? Many. It's just part of the male psyche. I cannot generalize, because these things can't be generalized. I don't know why some men aren't popular with women. Maybe their idea is sleeping with 3 different ones every week. that doesn't happen - oups, failure. Maybe they go only after very beautiful women. I don't know. Each story is different. Moral of this story is "successful against women" is external validation. I know a lot of guys who jump from one RS to the next with the first girl who'll have them, only to not have to be single and face rejection, if god forbid, they happen to change their standards. I understand pressure. I won't even go into: "you're so pretty, so successful, how come you've got no bf, what's wrong with you ?". see, social pressure will always exist. If I have a bf, I'll hear the "ok, you have a bf, why on Earth isn't he proposing, what's wrong with you?". Then I'll hear "oh, now that you're married, why don't you have a baby? what's wrong with you?". then it's the "just one baby? You're making so much $$$, you can have more babies than that". And let's not forget the last "oh, three children?!? These days? What the hell were you thinking?" "who'll have you, with 3 children, if you husband leaves you". etc etc etc. Everyone's under pressure. Everyone. Male or female. Key is to not give in to it and to not let the social pressure define who you are and how you're living your life. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
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