devilish innocent Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 The thing I keep picking up from your posts, Leigh, is that you don't believe couples whose relationship takes a while to develop can truly have a passionate relationship. My husband and I were friends for a while before we became a couple. I still believed it was important to have that giddy, passionate, chemistry at the start of the relationship. I wouldn't pursue a relationship until after I knew those feelings were developing. Fifteen years later, there are still times when I have difficulty sleeping or concentrating on work because of something romantic that's happened between us. We've had friends and family tell us that we're one of the most loving couples they know. I don't view our relationship as lacking in passion just because the friendship part developed first. I think it's actually really rare to find anybody from the western world who doesn't believe in the importance of chemistry for a relationship. The point I would make is that there's more to a good marriage than just the passion. The passion will ebb and flow during different times of the relationship. You need something more to keep the relationship going when the passion has died down. That part can develop before or after the initial attraction, but it needs to be there. Many people make the mistake of assuming that just because they're infatuated with somebody, the person can always make them happy. Then the infatuation dies down, they find they are bored in each other's company, and start constantly arguing. Of course, if the infatuation develops first, and the friendship comes later, then things can still work out. In fact, I would guess most long-term relationships developed that way. Another area that can confuse people is the difference between having intense passion right away and rushing a relationship. You can have intense chemistry and passion, but still hold off on seeing each other every night, planning a future together, etc. I think that's usually a wise choice. Many people think that because the feelings are so strong, they should give up their whole life for somebody right away. Sometimes that works out, but many times that leads to trouble.
clia Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 Evan Marc Katz would say " well you felt attracted and he was a nice guy, the type you always wanted, passion SMASHON... LOL.. Chemistry schemistry...... He would poo pooo true chemistry and lust and actually WANTING to make out with a partner, in favour of " compatibility first, build passion second" I don't think I've ever seen Evan Marc Katz advise anyone to be with a person for whom they feel no attraction. His view is merely that you should not let lust override compatibility because lust fades over time while compatibility is what will make your relationship last for 20 30, 40 years. He relies on studies (like the one Mr. lonely one posted above) for his views. Anyway, I thought you did feel chemistry with that guy? His way of doing things just doesn't resonate with everyone and I wish he had a more realistic approach to dealing with people who do hold out for chemistry and emotional connections... If you don't like his advice, there are many other dating experts out there who you can follow who might have views more in line with your own. Katz just doesn't think it's realistic to chase lust if you are looking for a lasting relationship.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 I don't think I've ever seen Evan Marc Katz advise anyone to be with a person for whom they feel no attraction. His view is merely that you should not let lust override compatibility because lust fades over time while compatibility is what will make your relationship last for 20 30, 40 years. He relies on studies (like the one Mr. lonely one posted above) for his views. Anyway, I thought you did feel chemistry with that guy? I know he doesn't advocate having no passion or chemistry. He does advocate to skip the infatuation and " really into you" sort of passion, though. He claims that we should aspire to feel " in love". Even though we have felt that way before with the wrong people - he shuns people who opt to wait for the same " in love" feeling but with the right partner. I personally know a couple of couples off the top of my head who DID have that intense " in love" feeling and they lasted. Because they were compatible. It is NOT akin to a lotto win; although it is more rare, it is not like those who go searching for it have a SLIM chance of finding it; most people, in fact, WILL likely find it, providing they are desirable enough to garner that sort of infatuation from a man, and also providing that they are NOT only into players, guys out of their league or etc..... If you don't like his advice, there are many other dating experts out there who you can follow who might have views more in line with your own. Katz just doesn't think it's realistic to chase lust if you are looking for a lasting relationship. Why isn't it realistic though, to hold out for lust AND compatibility, it is not some white unicorn or lotto win sort of statistics that an attractive woman in her 30's and 40's can find it..... I have personally felt that in love, infatuation, feeling for non attractive guys who I simply felt mutual intense chemistry with! They weren't all bad guys either, just unavailable for whatever reason. One of them was a player. So yeah, I believe women with realistic standards in terms of looks, income bracket and other traits they so desire in a man, have EVERY hope of finding intense chemistry and passion, with the right man one day. I am 28 and I expect by the time I am 40, it is VERY realistic to think that I would have found a guy I felt passion and strong chemistry for, that also happens to be single and a good, compatible fit for me. Definitely by the time I am 50. Especially after my nose job and graduating, I believe I will be too friendly, affable and physically desirable and sociable to NOT happen to run into a man who I feel that intense attraction for, that also happens to feel it mutually towards me AND who happens to be a great match! Evan basically says " well, good luck, you have a ling and lonely road ahead" It is EXTREMELY rude and condescending! NOT all women or men for that matter, would be HAPPY in a non sparks, mediocre passion based relationship - MANY people can actually enjoy the single life and have a full and rich life single. You would think a well versed relationship expert would be more supportive for those who OPT to live alone for a good chunk of their lives without trying to urge them to "settle" for less than what their heart years for in a partner. Plenty of single women are fabulous, successful and while it would have been nice to have found a passionate relationship with the right man earlier in life, they haven't, and yet they are very happy and fulfilled. It floors me that a "guru" has such a negative view of women who CHOOSE to remain single. He says it will be a "long and lonely" path:lmao: My parents left for overseas when I was young and I was looked after by family friends for a period and while I enjoy being in love and cannot wait to find a passionate and compatible relationship, ONE day, I am also very happy alone. I don't yearn for human contact often. Once every couple of months I see my closest friends, usually less; although we chat daily. Evan fails to pinpoint the women who, based on their up bringing and backgrounds, do not need a partner and rather, are happy single and holding out for the FEELING, that will lead to a long lasting relationship IF compatible, as opposed to searching for a "partner"
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 The thing I keep picking up from your posts, Leigh, is that you don't believe couples whose relationship takes a while to develop can truly have a passionate relationship. My husband and I were friends for a while before we became a couple. I still believed it was important to have that giddy, passionate, chemistry at the start of the relationship. I wouldn't pursue a relationship until after I knew those feelings were developing. Fifteen years later, there are still times when I have difficulty sleeping or concentrating on work because of something romantic that's happened between us. We've had friends and family tell us that we're one of the most loving couples they know. I don't view our relationship as lacking in passion just because the friendship part developed first. I think it's actually really rare to find anybody from the western world who doesn't believe in the importance of chemistry for a relationship. The point I would make is that there's more to a good marriage than just the passion. The passion will ebb and flow during different times of the relationship. You need something more to keep the relationship going when the passion has died down. That part can develop before or after the initial attraction, but it needs to be there. Many people make the mistake of assuming that just because they're infatuated with somebody, the person can always make them happy. Then the infatuation dies down, they find they are bored in each other's company, and start constantly arguing. Of course, if the infatuation develops first, and the friendship comes later, then things can still work out. In fact, I would guess most long-term relationships developed that way. Most long term relationships never have the infatuation stage. That is Evan Marc Katz whole premise! He claims to never having felt infatuated with his wife; yet the women before her, he felt enamoured with. He also admits that, while the sex life with his wife is great, it doesn't have the same sizzle as with his prior partners....... This isn't acceptable to me so I am a 28 year old who is CHOOSING to remain single until her late 30's in order to find the sizzle AND a compatible mate. Evan is wrong for insisting that " oh, well only a tiiiiiiny portion of couples have that, you are more likely to never find it" I find this ridiculous, since I know, anecdotally, enough people who happened to end up with a person they were really passionate about to begin with. He makes it out that it is more rare than it really is - especially for women who do not want kids, like myself, and who are HAPPY to wait ten years to find the passion and comfort. Another area that can confuse people is the difference between having intense passion right away and rushing a relationship. You can have intense chemistry and passion, but still hold off on seeing each other every night, planning a future together, etc. I think that's usually a wise choice. Many people think that because the feelings are so strong, they should give up their whole life for somebody right away. Sometimes that works out, but many times that leads to trouble. I would never rush into a relationship right away. I have learnt from my mistakes. I do however, need the intense passion where both of you are so into each other, cannot keep your hands to yourselves and where you are both infatuated. I would not see them more than once or twice a week though and I would make a very concerted effort to keep things under wraps due to the passion - you have to actively keep a level head. Where as in mediocre chemistry and passion based relationships, it is just easy to not want to see or hear from one another since you're not super into each other to begin with. So yes when I find a guy I feel great chemistry with and who is compatible, I will insist it starts out slower than usual because getting carried away usually leads to things crashing and burning......
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 I dated two guys I felt mediocre passion for. One lasted 2.5 years and one 10 months... I didn't ever get really into making out with them. I didn't yearn to make out. At any stage of the relationship. I was attracted to them enough to have good ish sex but it was never great. I convinced myself this is as good as it gets. Yay. Since I am not a very attractive woman (I am getting a nose job and losing weight though), so I assumed I could never do any better. At the time one of the exes did please me well in the bedroom to compensate for lack of intense passion from my end. I never felt the desire to go down on him. Not once in ten months. With the passion guys, I actually FELT like pleasing them. I still felt some degree of chemistry with him, the lower passion man, a 6 or 7/10 passion wise. But it wasn't enough and never will be for me. Some women have been "there" and have concluded that hey, surely one of those men we were REALLY Into will be compatible one day, providing we have realistic standards, and we are willing to wait a lot longer to find "them". I think it is wrong for a relationship guru to say " sorry but it is better if you just settle for one of those guys you felt mediocre about because it has a better chance of lasting and frankly, NONE of the men you are most into will ever want to date you, in all likeliness. I mean, fair enough if you're a girl like me and you want a hot guy who other girls want. I am not that. I am not hot, so I don't go for hot guys! I have felt hot passion for men who WEREN'T good looking! And had hot guys who I DID NOT feel passionate about at all! I feel great chemistry for nerds, fat guys, bald guy, overly scrawny guys, guys with bad teeth, guys who work in retail and have no grand plans to better their employment prospects.....If only Evan Marc Katz knew that some women set on finding the passion and compatibility, work on themselves with therapy and have identified that yes, they can learn to feel it with non alpha, obvious types. He purports that " the men who make you breathless are never the ones who will stick around". Well, one of my good friends met the guy who made her "breathless" and he was a decent, nice alpha guy who fell so hard for her and realised she was " The One". I have also felt breathless over a lot of men, so it makes sense to me that at least ONE of these said men, will eventually feel it mutually for me and be a good long term match! The trouble is, a lot of us are innately the most intense towards men who we instinctively know are bad for us. I have been there. Luckily for me, through therapy, I have actually been made breathless by men who are relationship orientated but who simple weren't compatible - men who weren't players and were just holding out for the right girl, which they decided wasn't me (and it was mutual, we were no where near compatible) I could never accept a long term relationship.. with another man that I didn't feel high degrees or excitement and passion over....It was too stale, boring and I would only daydream about the men who I HAD felt excited about prior..... I could sense right away in my latest guy that it was never high degrees of sexual passion per say, but it was more that I REALLY, really like who he is as a person that drove me to him - and the fact HE was absolutely head over heels for ME, made me think hey, finally a guy who takes me out and loves spoiling me with dinners rather than wanting me to go halves, for a change.... I even gave it a shot and told myself " hey, if I want to have regular sex and the benefits of having a partner NOW rather than waiting ten years, this is it, he is my only shot at it....... In the end I couldn't do it irrespective of HOW much I realllly really enjoyed being treated like gold.....I would always think " gee, I wish I was a better catch myself so that I could get the guys I was truly passionate about... but you know, because no one else wants me, I will select one of the only decent men who does want me" I always thought about my friend and how they were BOTH head over heels, not just the GUY, and also very excited and falling hard - they were just euphoric the way I had felt about prior guys, they were just giddy with excitement and I thought well, if she found it so can I, since it is what my heart truly wants. They didn't feel love at first site or anything unreasonable or ridiculous - but they immediately felt very strong LUST at first site, and in then, this resulted in a very passionate relationship with plenty of compatibility years later! I find this passionate couple who are also very compatible long term, are much happier than the other couples I know who had mediocre or low passion. They still have explosive sex ^ I talk to this girl for hours every day we are good friends so she has always told me everything about her life... And he adores her so much and treats her like a princess - she still gets giddy with excitement over their weekly " dates", where he takes her out and treats her to a lovely meal and desert once a week.... They absolutely LOVE just talking - they laugh so much together, really crack each other up - and they also then go home and have crazy, passionate sex. She also gained 20 lbs and he STILL adored the heck out of her and felt just as passionate and crazy attracted to her as he did on day one. Sure they have had their disagreements but no more so than a regular, non passionate couple. She also has the face of an angel and is significantly better looking than me - she is a 9 and I am a 6, facially speaking. Sometimes a 7 on a very, very good day with high make up. So obviously she can easily find manly men who have a lot of options yet who pick HER. The types of men who have some options tend to be the kinds who I feel intensely about - but never hot men, just men who are normal. Where as I don't have options in men unless the guy has something " wrong" with him; my ex who fell head over heels for me had a brain injury. The other guy has a bad stutter. I really do feel that a nose job and bettering myself, will definitely make it realistic for me to expect to find what my friend has in the next ten years. I plan on getting hotter with age in my 30's as I am a big believer in botox to erase lines in your 30's although not getting it too overdone. I don't see why it is unrealistic for me to expect that, in a ten year time span, that it is likely for me to find one of those men I have been really into as a long term partner. Just as my friend was lucky enough to find at age 21.
losangelena Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 Hang on a second Leigh, I'm confused. Maybe you've mentioned this in another post, I'm not sure, so excuse me if I've overlooked it. From what I'm hearing you say, you want the passion and infatuation stage, you do not expect it to happen right away, but within a certain amount of time, right? I am not speaking about love at first site drivel.... that is lust... I speak of the falling hard, feeling infatuated and after 2 - 3 months saying I love you. As opposed to spending a lot of time around a person you have a mediocre attraction towards and not falling hard, and waiting 6 months to a year before saying you love them due to lack of intensity in your feelings. I don't understand this slavish adherence to a made up timeline. By their very definition, lust and infatuation play out in the very early stages of a relationship if they are to exist at all. There IS nothing wrong with being sexually attracted to your partner, to falling in love, and being all goo-goo, ga-ga. My parents were that way til my dad's dying day, in that lovey-dovey, cutesy-gross kinda way. The things you want are not mutually exclusive, but yes they actually CAN take more time to develop. My BF and I, for whatever issues we have, are MORE attracted and MORE in love than ever. We laugh all the time, we're more comfortable, and yes we even have more passionate, day-interrupting sex than ever before. Did we get there in a month or two? No. We're both skittish and wary of letting other people in, so it's really only been in the last month or two that these new facets have developed. Who the flying f*ck cares if we didn't say "I love you" at two months versus six? That's not "mediocre chemistry," that's simply chemistry that's taken longer to grow. Also, if you don't agree with Katz, then don't read him! I've read his website, and some of his stuff I agree with, and some I don't. There are as many dating strategies as there are couples in this world, so I wouldn't worry about it if I were you. Find something that work FOR YOU. I personally think you keep coming back to this notion of fireworks and infatuation because somewhere deep down you have an inkling that maybe it's not working, and you're scared of what that means, that you'll have to "settle." Well, I don't think you're going to have to settle. But I do think that somewhere along the line, you're going to change your outlook on all this, and when you'll do you'll find someone with whom you're happy and content.
Mrlonelyone Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 Again I ask you to consider couples like my parents. Nearly 50 years together, early mid 70's couple very little sex for years. Your telling me no passion?
Buddhist Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 Finding a good man is like finding a good house to buy. Dream houses don't exist, or if they do you can't afford them or they're taken. All you'll ever find on the market are slightly shabby homes with potential. Every single one has a set of unique problems and set of unique opportunities. You know you've found the right mix when you walk away from it thinking.....I could live with that. Then you set about cultivating a relationship with that one and focus intensely on all the things you liked about it while glossing over the things you don't and learning to live with them. After a period of time you realise you've developed an irrational kind of fondness for it and could not think about leaving.
Mrlonelyone Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 Reading your post about how you weren't attractive before maybe as others have said you just want to sow oats like you didn't get to do? That's ok to want even well into your mid 30's. Maybe change your outlook from wanting red hot passion in and long term compatibility,to just looking for passion and not expecting forever. Put another way just spend 5-10 years renting rather than trying to buy.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 I will never settle for less than fireworks and passion. I am happy to wait ten years to find it with a compatible partner. I know who I am well enough to know that I will never say " oh, I really need a partner, I am therefore going to give a guy a chance when I am not that into them to begin with" It just isn't my style. Taking ten extra years longer than my peers to find a partner is fine by me since I enjoy being alone and a, very introverted albeit I am a social introvert and I enjoy weekends out once every 4 months. I agree with most of Evans advice hence why I would go to his website. What I don't agree with, is making out like it is near impossible to get the sort of relationships that my friend has! I mean, I have felt "it" before with many men who simply weren't compatible and one was a player. I don't believe it is all that rare for one of the guys I am into, to become the right man for me. I have only dated since age 24. Been single for 12 months tops in that time frame.... between then and age 28.....I have already been really into a diverse bunch of men! In such a short time I have felt intense chemistry with a lot of men so clearly a woman like myself feels "It" easily enough, to expect one of those guys to be "it" for me. It is, after all, a numbers game. Evan fails to address that! For example: my gorgeous Russian friend who is a model and a podiatrist - she SELDOM EVER feels intense chemistry. In fact she NEVER has right off the bat! It takes her 2 weeks MINUMUM to ONE MONTH for her to even feel really' into' a man! Where as I seem to generate intense mutual chemistry wayyyy more often than my friend - sadly, it hasn't been with the men that I share compatibility with! But the mere fact that I feel/generate the intense type of chemistry with ENOUGH men, sounds to me like there is a reasonable shot that I will find it, mutually reciprocated and with a like minded and compatible man! I am sparky, random and generate fireworks more than my better looking friend and I have lower standards than her - I don't need a guy who is cute or hot, or who has a good job, for me to be infatuates with them and to have that magic chemistry.... My friend on the other hand has decided to settle down with a man who she isn't attracted to because he adores her and is absolutely head over heels for her. She never feels chemistry and when she does, it is for men that never want her so.... she knows the chances of her finding a man she is actually into, are slim based on her ' make up'. I have never once urged her not to settle down with this man. Where as Evan gladly tells woman like me, without even know us or consider how realistic our standards are, that " hey, men we really feel it for will never want us" I find this misleading and wrong. Realistic standards, the ability to feel fireworks with men in YOUR own league and fully expecting it to take 4 0 10 years, IS realistic when it comes for holding out for passion and compatibility!
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 Finding a good man is like finding a good house to buy. Dream houses don't exist, or if they do you can't afford them or they're taken. All you'll ever find on the market are slightly shabby homes with potential. Every single one has a set of unique problems and set of unique opportunities. You know you've found the right mix when you walk away from it thinking.....I could live with that. Then you set about cultivating a relationship with that one and focus intensely on all the things you liked about it while glossing over the things you don't and learning to live with them. After a period of time you realise you've developed an irrational kind of fondness for it and could not think about leaving. In all honestly I have found at least.. at least two really stand up, wonderful men who were saints of people, I WAS attracted to them, I did have some kind of a spark. They adored me and were also very, very good men. I could have had a happy life with both I am very certain of this... we laughed, we clicked, they were head over heels for me from date one. I turned both down because I enjoy being single and would rather have more intense passion or nothing at all. It is a real joy to watch my good friend in her passion filled relationship - it is so lovely and beautiful - they felt fireworks, intense passion and years later they are still absolutely crazy for one another:love: And to be honest..... living alone and having a full life outside a partner serves me very well, when I think about all the .. dating woes and unhappy partnerships out there! I feel like.. MAN it is better to be single:lmao: .... If I ever find what my friend has, intense passion AND the right man who adores the heck out of her and who SHE feels the same way about.... THEN I will "settle down":lmao: I dunno, it seems like passionate flings that are short lived but with the men I truly yearn for is more my thing than settling for a mediocre love life simply because " hey, he is one of the FEW men who is really into me, YAY" Least with the passionate flings with the men I truly want, there will be no strings or heartache! Straight to the point, adult fun and laughs after. The men I have been passionate for have also really seemed to click with me in terms of our sense of humour. There is one guy I see very occasionally who has major depression and he has been unable to feel "feelings" his entire life - besides the day from when his kids were born, he felt "happy". ^^^ he can feel to a lowered extent though. We had sparks on steroids! And it was so lovely having sex and having a ret hot passionate session of sex, followed by a glass of wine laying naked on his bed laughing about how stupid we think people are:lmao: There was no commitment, no crap, no heartache and I honestly enjoy my time with him than I EVER have in ANY of my long term but " lacking in passion" relationships.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 Reading your post about how you weren't attractive before maybe as others have said you just want to sow oats like you didn't get to do? That's ok to want even well into your mid 30's. Maybe change your outlook from wanting red hot passion in and long term compatibility,to just looking for passion and not expecting forever. Put another way just spend 5-10 years renting rather than trying to buy. Yeah that sums me up. I tried to have "relationships" at age 24. The fact the guy never wanted me is all that made me stay to be honest LOL... and he was also fun and adventurous and in spite of the COMPLETE lack of passion from HIS end, he is one of the guys who made me laugh! I just laughed all the time around him! After him I tried things with a nice guy who was truly into me but yeah, mediocrity isn't really in my vocabulary..... I prefer being single because I find the dating exciting! You never know when you will meet someone who will excite you ! It is thrilling! I doubt I will ever settle down until I find the one relationship I venerate: my friends relationship, that is very passionate AND with her best friend....They laugh all the time, they just make each other laugh too. Evan Marc Katz would say there is something "wrong" with me due to my lack of desire for a partner - and instead, my yearning for the "feeling" as opposed to the act of HAVING a partner, which I am totally indifferent about. It has only been with I FOUND that "chemistry" that I thought " wow a switch has flipped and I want to see where it goes with these men" They also were men who made me laugh. I just cant bring myself to want to "date" the men I feel less into......
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 somewhere deep down you have an inkling that maybe it's not working, and you're scared of what that means, that you'll have to "settle." Well, I don't think you're going to have to settle. But I do think that somewhere along the line, you're going to change your outlook on all this, and when you'll do you'll find someone with whom you're happy and content. I honestly don't think that what I am doing is not working "for me". It would be not working if I wanted kids and a family one day. I never really have wanted this. If I wanted children and a family I would absolutely have had an "inkling" that my method wasn't working, because a woman who is 28 would need to soon forget the fireworks if having children with a lasting partner was a priority. Fireworks take much longer to find when they are coupled with compatibility. However, luckily for me I enjoy dating. I LOVE the thrill of being single and not knowing what is around the corner! After some misteps I have also learnt to detach from the outcome and to enjoy the ride with high passion affairs as opposed mediocre chemistry. I don't see how being 28 and loving the single dating scene and learning to enjoy being single is classed as " not working":lmao: when for me it is what I want. If I didn't want it, I would be in a relationship with one of the really really nice guys who I WAS attracted to and who adored me. But I opted not to because I am happier alone than without sparks and fireworks. Call it what you want, to me personally, I find that slow growing chemistry never evolves for me - I have tried a few times and after many months it never "grew" to anything close to what I felt for the men I just "FELT" passionate about from day dot. Where as some people have had the red hot passion result from a slow burning chemistry. I never have but of course, others have realised this! I don't think the 12 months of my adult life that I have been single and ready to date - without me stumbling upon fireworks with a compatible guy yet - is a signal that my method "isn't working" I have GIVEN medium to low passion men a chance and it never felt right for me I ALWAYS yearned for the same passion I shared with OTHER men. Clearly we are simply different people with differing modes of transport to our "love" destinations that work the best for us. You catch the train to it and I opt to catch buses. There is no right or wrong way of finding love. It only should be classified as " well it really aint working for ya" if YOU are unhappy. I am not unhappy waiting out for what I want. I am in fact, enjoying being single for the first proper time in soooooo long! If one day I get sick of being single and want a partner I will definitely consider one of those nice guys who adored me but I lacked passion for.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 I sort of believe that about 5% of couples had red hot passion, made each other laugh a lot AND also have great compatibility..... I want to remain single for a few years but in 10 years time, by that time frame, I would like to be among the 5% of people. Who get red hot passion, compatibility and a partner who cracks them up and makes them laugh. Also happy to wait 15 years. I believe I will still be fit and just as attractive as I am now - as I am a big believer in botox. And I never work out as it is, so I can imagine if I started to work out daily I would basically be the way I am NOW, without working out, but in ,my 40's WITH daily work outs. I guess I hate how Evan doesn't consider and encourage woman who are actually wanting to wait for their passionate, intense and compatible relationship. He only focuses on the majority who all WANT a family, marriage and a life together as soon as possible by their 30's or mid 30s....... Isn't it better practice to think outside your own viewpoint and assess whether a woman like me has realistic expectations; to find the rare passionate, compatible relationships in 10 - 15 years from now? Instead he tells us to change; to think more along the lines that "other" people do. I am just not like other people. I want one of the guys I was passionate about as a long term partner one day in the semi distance future. I guess it is lucky that I enjoy my new found single - life and am in no rush to need to meet my life partner.
SawtoothMars Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 Fireworks take much longer to find when they are coupled with compatibility. However, luckily for me I enjoy dating. I LOVE the thrill of being single and not knowing what is around the corner! After some misteps I have also learnt to detach from the outcome and to enjoy the ride with high passion affairs as opposed mediocre chemistry. If one day I get sick of being single and want a partner I will definitely consider one of those nice guys who adored me but I lacked passion for. Just keep in mind that what you practice becomes habitual. That makes changing very hard down the road. "Fireworks" and "spark" mean different things to different people... and if you create a habit of chasing unavailable men for the emotional rush of it... you will have a very hard time changing. You also won't have any quality relationship experience. Some women only feel "fireworks" when a guy is punching her in the face every evening. So make sure you are going for something that is good for you before you commit to a certain path.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 Just keep in mind that what you practice becomes habitual. That makes changing very hard down the road. "Fireworks" and "spark" mean different things to different people... and if you create a habit of chasing unavailable men for the emotional rush of it... you will have a very hard time changing. You also won't have any quality relationship experience. Some women only feel "fireworks" when a guy is punching her in the face every evening. So make sure you are going for something that is good for you before you commit to a certain path. You're absolutely right. I don't believe I only feel fireworks for unavailable men, I have definitely felt it with men who were available but who I simply wasn't compatible with. In one year of being single I have felt fireworks for 3 men. One was unavailable but otherwise a top guy who never played games. One was a bit of a player and one was available but I was the wrong match for him. Prior to that I felt fireworks with 2 men in a few months long span. Both were available and not players or bad seeming guys but were simply not interested in anything long term with me, but were open to meeting the right girl otherwise. Based on the amount of men I have felt firework like intensity for, I don't think it'll take me over ten years to find one of those guys who also happens to feel the same way about me and wants something long term. If I only felt chemistry and fireworks for very few men and the only men I wanted were ALL Players - sure, I would need to settle for a guy I was less into, and yet who was nice to me.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 With the men I felt passionate about a few key things I felt, which I don't think are unrealistic, are: - when they first texted me in the early days after first meeting my heart sort of raced - I fully enjoyed and embraced making out with them - I would be super excited about them and the prospect of dating them! - I would want to have sex with them whenever I could - I ENJOYED giving them head jobs - I had intense "feelings" for them Men I feel mediocre passion for, so I am really attracted to them and feel chemistry still... - I never really enjoyed making out with them nor did I ever yearn to - I could take or leave sex. I could wake up in the morning on a lazy weekend and just want to role over and chill - I didn't get excited about our time together - I NEVER felt intense degrees of emotions for them it was more like a cute puppy who I couldn't wait to kiss and cuddle; the guys were crazy about me and they were so keen to please me sexually so they did - but I NEVER once felt inclinations to give them head jobs. Not once in ten or more months...... So I guess I am simply after, one day, a guy who sort of gets my heart racing at first through just being and not through silly games, and also a guy who I reallllly love making out with and who I have the major hots for! Someone I am super excited about! I am not expecting love at first site. Or an instant relationship.
ascendotum Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 Leigh, reading a couple of your threads/posts recently it seems you have gone back to where you were, just wanting to have fun while holding out for that hot fireworks guy whose also a gentleman that knows how to treat a lady but also doesn't make you a priority in his life type (well not for a while anyway). While you don't want to be another spinning plate for a player, I'm sure many/most of the amazzzing chemistry & fireworks guys you will be hooking up will be playerish guys.
SawtoothMars Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 If I only felt chemistry and fireworks for very few men and the only men I wanted were ALL Players - sure, I would need to settle for a guy I was less into, and yet who was nice to me. Hmm... It doesn't really work like that. Sometimes that feeling comes early, and sometimes it comes late in a relationship. Once you get an idea of what causes it... then you can begin to predict it. I strongly suspect that you are a Push/Pull girl. Used to be the hardest for me to deal with in the dating arena. However, In college I learned how to tell when a girl is Push/Pull and from that point it was easy. They don't tend to be great in relationships, but are awesome at casual sex and hookups.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 Leigh, reading a couple of your threads/posts recently it seems you have gone back to where you were, just wanting to have fun while holding out for that hot fireworks guy whose also a gentleman that knows how to treat a lady but also doesn't make you a priority in his life type (well not for a while anyway). While you don't want to be another spinning plate for a player, I'm sure many/most of the amazzzing chemistry & fireworks guys you will be hooking up will be playerish guys. I don't think I am only feeling it for players. I am mindful to avoid players now but I haven't strictly felt the passion for players at all. Two were players all up. The rest just weren't that into me because we weren't compatible on any level beyond the effortless bedroom chemistry. Plus I know to avoid players when at all possible and I will only ever have casual fun with players (albeit, safe casual fun!). If I catch feelings I cannot manage I will leave.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 Hmm... It doesn't really work like that. Sometimes that feeling comes early, and sometimes it comes late in a relationship. Once you get an idea of what causes it... then you can begin to predict it. I strongly suspect that you are a Push/Pull girl. Used to be the hardest for me to deal with in the dating arena. However, In college I learned how to tell when a girl is Push/Pull and from that point it was easy. They don't tend to be great in relationships, but are awesome at casual sex and hookups. I am great in relationships. I am loyal, loving and I never get bored. I have great longevity when I feel I am with the right person. I only end relationships when I know they aren't "it" for me. I am relationship material because I have more to offer than my vagina. And I am super loyal and will stick by a man thick or thin. I supported my ex of 2.5 years when he was jobless and going through a hard time. So yeah. I simply prefer those guys who I am hot for, I want to make out with and I crave sex with. I don't feel any inclination to date a man I am not into, not excited about dating nor who I have urges to make out with. My wants and needs and very simple and not some outlandish rare thing that seldom ever happens for normal couples.
LookAtThisPOst Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 Good points, as I typically pass by dating profiles that say, "Must have chemistry" and it's stated by a woman that's over 40...usually its lust-based and people aren't keeping their heads about themselves when they are basing their total faith on the so-called "passion/chemistry." How important is falling " in love" when it comes to a relationship? A lot of dating guru's like Evan Marc Katz, base their whole career around " the delusion of passion". He advocates not holding out for a person you fall " in love" with and who ignites that " in love" feeling, and instead, to pick a partner purely based on the type of person you want to build a life with and to GROW " in love". He says attraction has to be there but a 5 - 7/10 is going to, more than likely, work long term. As opposed to the 9 or 10/10 intense chemistry where you fall "hard", or you are "head over heels", or " taken" or "enamoured" Personally, while I believe his approach works for some people who NEED specific personality traits, it isn't the way I operate. I know infatuation invariably fades but I need to go through the infatuation and " in love" stage at the start of a new relationship. For example; some women are highly intelligent and need a partner to be very academically stimulating, among other key traits that could be required for these women to consider him relationship material.. Where as for me, I am lax on many elements of compatibility, I am not an astro physicist and therefore I don't need hyper intelligent men.... Don't need a man with a degree.... don't care about his income but would prefer a man with SOME ambition to continually better their situation in life. In fact, I would be happy with a 6 - 7/10 compatibility! All I need is: - a kind hearted man - a man who makes me laugh.. not with jokes, but who.. can just laugh with me at weird and/or random things:love: -a man who prefers to pay for dates out rather than splitting (but who I pay back in other ways of course, I just prefer that traditional gender role) - a manwho is of average intelligence. More is a bonus. Not needed, I have friends to assume that role. - a man who isn't travel averse. OR will at least let me travel if he isn't into it. I don't mind if he's fat, bald, has bad teeth or didn't finish high school. As long as he has a full time job, isn't below average in intelligence and I feel great chemistry with and that " in love" feeling with. I don't see why a leading relationship guru tries to instil fear in women like me, by telling us that " oh... only a tiiiiiiny portion of long term couples started out with the **in love** feeling" I mean, really! I don't think it is that rare, is it? To start out with a spark, and to be reaallly into your partner initially?.... Providing you're not the type of person who needs someone " hot" or "arrogant" or "super alpha and elusive" in order to feel the passion? I have felt passion and great chemistry with some nice guys who weren't hot. In fact, I have never felt that spark with hot guys for some reason. I tend to be more crazy about men who have flaws that I can see, it is sexier to me..... I realise lust fades and only a freakish small 5 of people who are wired a certain way, remain infatuated and giddy with excitement about dating a long term partner. But is it too much to ask to expect to go through the " in love" stage at all in the real beginning of a relationship? How did your relationships start out and did many of you happily bypass the falling " in love" stage? It is so common that people prefer to partner up based on shared values and all that jazz and only THEN give a second thought to chemistry. I go for chemistry first, and THEN see if they are dating material!
LookAtThisPOst Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 The guy I had the greatest natural chemistry with was my shortest relationship. Lightening bolts and butterflies only get you so far and once you've had sex a few times it pretty much disappears. It's no longer exciting because it's now familiar. Once familiarity set in, the wheels were turning but the hamster was dead because we were fundamentally different people with very little in common. I indulged his love of social outings and shopping by tagging along and making the best of it. But I got bored pretty quickly and he couldn't follow any conversation I wanted to have. Hm....even red hot sex twice a day, couldn't fill in 16hrs of wakefulness or even the 3hrs we typically spent together each day because we lived under the same roof. Dead on here, you'd be surprised how I contacted women online that had the same interests as me, same values, same political thoughts, etc...even interests in the most obscure...all that in common, only to never get response or thought there was no "chemistry." They don't think, "Wow, we have a lot in common, we should at least meetup for lunch!" Nope, that thought never crosses their minds. Some people use the lame cop-out, "Oh, I won't date someone that I have too much in common with". To me that's ALL the more reason to make the attempt.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 Good points, as I typically pass by dating profiles that say, "Must have chemistry" and it's stated by a woman that's over 40...usually its lust-based and people aren't keeping their heads about themselves when they are basing their total faith on the so-called "passion/chemistry." Well what is wrong with wanting to hold out for the chemistry? They aren't saying that they also don't want to base a relationship on compatibility too. It isn't some fairy tale. Plenty of couples started out with passion and also happened to be compatible. If it wasn't that common I wouldn't also hold out for it. For me anyway, I tend to feel passion and chemistry for ample men, a few per year, and therefore why wouldn't I expect that since I feel "it" with a wide array of men, that I wont feel it with the "right" man who is compatible? You probably assume those over 40's woman are holding out for prince charming who is tall dark and handsome and out of their league, right? Wrong. Most women I know who want passion and chemistry simply want to feel excited about the men they date rather than pleasant indifference.
Author Leigh 87 Posted March 30, 2015 Author Posted March 30, 2015 Dead on here, you'd be surprised how I contacted women online that had the same interests as me, same values, same political thoughts, etc...even interests in the most obscure...all that in common, only to never get response or thought there was no "chemistry." They don't think, "Wow, we have a lot in common, we should at least meetup for lunch!" Nope, that thought never crosses their minds. Some people use the lame cop-out, "Oh, I won't date someone that I have too much in common with". To me that's ALL the more reason to make the attempt. What's wrong with wanting to feel attracted to a partner? They aren't asking for super hot guys necessarily. Just because you are happy to date a woman who you have low chemistry with yet who is perfectly compatible, doesn't mean others are also content with a friendship based, low passion relationship. And they are not wrong for wanting what they want. You're not wrong for seeking a companionate based relationship that has less than fireworks. I am honest about my intentions at least and don't string people along. I end things as SOON as I feel it isn't "right" and that it just isn't "it" for me and I would RATHER be single and wait out for the whole package.
Recommended Posts