Dating outside your paygrade

[katiegrl]

You know it's possible I don't fully grasps the economical situation where you are. Where I live unemployment is 4% and if people lose their job it takes a couple of weeks to a couple of months and they find a new one, maybe the longest 6 months.

 

But Gaeta, surely you must be aware of what's happening in other parts of the country, are you not? I mean ...seriously, YOU are an "executive," unless you have been living and working under a rock, all it takes is watching the news and/or picking up a newspaper once a week...it's hard to miss how bad our economy is...and has been for the past god only knows how many years.

 

Come on now....

[Auspecial]

I am a little confused.

....

B. The job search time is stressful. if you have been doing this daily for 7 years, as a guy I would probably get sick of hearing about it. It is not the best time to date and find love when your life is in such disarray.

....

 

Once again, I don't think it is not being a "professional", it is the fact that you have 4 jobs and are on the job hunt daily for 7 years that would probably make a new partner a bit anxious. Not because they need your money, but because it is just not very stable and calm.

 

 

 

 

I agree. People have a perception, true or not, based mostly upon their own experiences. The reality is, my life is not in disarray, although it apparently appears that way to some others. While it is true that I give time to look daily for something full-time, what I am doing to pay bills right now works better unless I can find something that is flexible. I don't discuss my daily search with dates, I don't see how that's relevant, it just came out during this discussion thread. Its something I naturally do, because I am a very proactive type of person. Along side job flexibility, several jobs that I enjoy doing and enable me to be there for family, PLUS have a full social calendar, keeps me content and happy, whilst others are cringing "she must be batty as all heck, because I would be!"

[Auspecial]

If you expect to be judged and that makes you uncomfortable maybe they are picking on it. Do you feel the need to explain your situation? You should not. Also, do you say "I used to work as...'' ? That demonstrate disappointment in your current situation.

 

Yes, I have done all variations of what you suggested. I do believe I am projecting. I wish I could view a video of myself discussing my work, so it would be more clear what I may be doing to not present myself properly.

 

 

And other times I am able to not feel worried and not care what they think.

[Auspecial]

Yes, that's quite common. One option is developing a humorous response if wishing to deflect but not wishing to be 'serious' about the interaction.

 

When women ask me what I do, I tell them 'I fix things'. What kinds of things? 'All kinds of things' No, really. 'Would you like me to fix you?' When out and about with my best friend, we play Mutt and Jeff, or Laurel and Hardy, with this stuff, all in good humor. I remember one time, at a bar, I got a 'come home' invitation to fix something, a toilet IIRC. I don't do casual sex but do fix toilets

 

 

 

Love it! I need to come up with some of those......!

[carhill]

Love it! I need to come up with some of those......!

Example, say if one moonlights as a waitress:

 

'I serve up the most delectable cream pie in the tri-state area'.... with a wink and a smile.

 

'Oh, you're a waitress?'

 

'I'm many things'

 

Think Linda Darnell in the classic noir 'Fallen Angel'. One can tell the truth and still be a bit mysterious and interesting.

 

One aspect I've noted as a man of my generation, rooted more in the classic style of romance, is that women these days seem far more obviously 'businesslike' about romance than in decades in the past, when, even with the necessities of survival (work, etc), they focused more on the art of romance and seduction. Perhaps I merely received an erroneous impression of women through role-modeling, IDK.

 

Anyway, try some different stuff and see what sticks. Personally, I'd view the social milieu as separate from job and career related objectives and goals, as boxes which don't have to touch. Valid and important boxes, sure, but separate.

[clevelander321]

But Gaeta, surely you must be aware of what's happening in other parts of the country, are you not? I mean ...seriously, YOU are an "executive," unless you have been living and working under a rock, all it takes is watching the news and/or picking up a newspaper once a week...it's hard to miss how bad our economy is...and has been for the past god only knows how many years.

 

Come on now....

 

Op repeatedly states she wants something full time that is "flexible".

 

How flexible? If you need a full time job to cater to your schedule you can't blame that on the economy.

 

In a way the economy is blamed. Men are blamed. On a date this is what I would sense immediately. Not if the girl is professional or not. If you need flexibility then I don't feel it is appropriate to blame the economy.

 

I just read an article where in China these people are basically owned and working almost as slaves just to eat. When you look at it that way it seems entitled to complain about our economy and a lack of flexibility.

 

And equating a lack of flexibility to misery.

Edited February 26, 2015 by clevelander321

[Auspecial]

@Carheel: Great advice!

[Ieris]

@Auspecial ~ Doesn't really matter what you do as long as you are doing something, so well done for taking on 4 part time jobs and not sitting around doing nothing. It is great that you staying positive and still sending out CVs trying to move forward. May I suggest you have someone clean up/reword your CV just to change it up a little and see if that can improve your chances of landing a job you want. Maybe apply to some recruitment agencies, change location if you have to and also networking, doesn't even have to be some event, you can meet people anywhere. You never know who might be able to hook you up with a job

 

I grew up with some very condescending people and a lot of my friends look down on other people aswell. I don't know why exactly but maybe they feel the need to put down others to make them feel better about themselves? It is pretty sad but I like to remind them that, it's not about where you start, it's where you finish. As we're not dying anytime soon, one day that guy might be our boss and we'll have to shine his shoes. It really pisses them off lol. So don't be upset about where you are now, lots of people aren't happy with where they are now (not just career wise) so as long as you are doing something to improve your situation that's not bad at all.

 

What people think or say about you doesn't matter, they don't even know you. What those men said only hurt you because it hit a nerve. If you don't want to talk about something you can divert the conversation or give a humorous response like Carhill suggested. Lots of people just talk about the same old stuff, conversation killing small talk so I would even jokingly *yawn* "You're boring me already, tell me something interesting instead...", "I cut my leg at spinning class last week, do you want to see it? Can you kiss it better?" Take the lead in the conversation, you control the pace and where it's going. You don't have to give anyone any details if you don't want to, it's not a job interview and especially if you're not interested in them anyway so why give them the opportunity to dig at you in the first place.

 

I hope you manage to sort out your job situation x

[Auspecial]

Clevelander: It seems to me that you have picked up this "economical" ball and run with it. Its seems to be a personal sticking point for you, as well as the supposed "men blaming." It appears that you live in a world of black/white thinking whereas mine has color and nuance.

 

 

In actuality, I have not mentioned the word economy one time, until this post to you. You may have inferred that, but I did not state it, thus how can I point a finger at something that I have not named to be a villain?

 

 

I mentioned two men who made disparaging comments. I did not say all men do this. I asked why would these men do it. Do you agree with those comments, as they made them? If you felt a woman was "below your station" to date why would you still ask them to social functions?

[Auspecial]

@Auspecial ~ Doesn't really matter what you do as long as you are doing something, so well done for taking on 4 part time jobs and not sitting around doing nothing. It is great that you staying positive and still sending out CVs trying to move forward.

 

 

------

 

So don't be upset about where you are now, lots of people aren't happy with where they are now (not just career wise) so as long as you are doing something to improve your situation that's not bad at all.

 

 

------

 

What people think or say about you doesn't matter, they don't even know you. What those men said only hurt you because it hit a nerve. If you don't want to talk about something you can divert the conversation or give a humorous response like Carhill suggested. Lots of people just talk about the same old stuff, conversation killing small talk so I would even jokingly *yawn* "You're boring me already, tell me something interesting instead...", "I cut my leg at spinning class last week, do you want to see it? Can you kiss it better?" Take the lead in the conversation, you control the pace and where it's going. You don't have to give anyone any details if you don't want to, it's not a job interview and especially if you're not interested in them anyway so why give them the opportunity to dig at you in the first place.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I hope you manage to sort out your job situation x

 

 

 

 

Thank you! I love the positivity! And getting some great ideas to staunch my worry streak. )

[BluEyeL]

Accept that some men would prefer a woman that appears more stable in her employment and move on to more productive endeavors. If it's just two men, it's nothing.

 

You can't avoid judgment by others. Not matter who you are, some people would find some of your characteristics unappealing and other people will judge you in different ways. If you are secure, you shouldn't care.

[smackie9]

But Gaeta, surely you must be aware of what's happening in other parts of the country, are you not? I mean ...seriously, YOU are an "executive," unless you have been living and working under a rock, all it takes is watching the news and/or picking up a newspaper once a week...it's hard to miss how bad our economy is...and has been for the past god only knows how many years.

 

Come on now....

 

The economy isn't that bad anymore...it actually has picked up quite a bit within the last two years.

[Gaeta]

But Gaeta, surely you must be aware of what's happening in other parts of the country, are you not? I mean ...seriously, YOU are an "executive," unless you have been living and working under a rock, all it takes is watching the news and/or picking up a newspaper once a week...it's hard to miss how bad our economy is...and has been for the past god only knows how many years.

 

Come on now....

 

I am not American. Of course I heard of the American economy struggle and how some states have been hit hard, people losing their homes and jobs but I read this a few years ago as an outsider. I have never heard of people not finding a full time job for 7 years when aiming at all fields. I have an American friend in FL, which was one of the States the most affected by the bank crash, he lost his job and he found another within the same year.

[clevelander321]

Clevelander: It seems to me that you have picked up this "economical" ball and run with it. Its seems to be a personal sticking point for you, as well as the supposed "men blaming." It appears that you live in a world of black/white thinking whereas mine has color and nuance.

 

 

In actuality, I have not mentioned the word economy one time, until this post to you. You may have inferred that, but I did not state it, thus how can I point a finger at something that I have not named to be a villain?

 

 

I mentioned two men who made disparaging comments. I did not say all men do this. I asked why would these men do it. Do you agree with those comments, as they made them? If you felt a woman was "below your station" to date why would you still ask them to social functions?

 

 

Everyone is different and this is what I sense from talking to people similar to you. You repeatedly mention things like "the crash", being "forced into part time", difficult since 2008, the reality for lots of people, etc. As if your situation is beyond your control due to the crash of 2008. So fatalistic.

 

Then on the other hand, you repeatedly state how you need a full time job with the ability to self schedule. Flexibility. make your own hours...

 

For people who sacrifice other aspects of life to work full time, they do not want to hear how the crash of 2008 affected your life, when in reality you want some sort of full time job that does not exist for many others.. The type of full time job where you write your own schedule. Sort of like you are above the rules others play by, but then blaming something else for your choice.. The crash, being forced into part time, others not having thr asbility to understand what it is like for others etc.

 

I would be confused and think you are making excuses. The crash is not the problem. You are not forced into working part time. Getting good work is not the problem. The problem is your expectations of how work should fit into your life, as you value other aspects of life more than work.. Which is fine, but just own it and do not say you are being "forced" into some position you are choosing to be in.

 

 

 

 

 

 

'I am in the bracket of people who are "forced part-time" because we want full-time work but have not been able to get it.'

 

Its the same that I expected before financial crash

 

I have actually come a long way from the crash in 2008

 

It is difficult for people who have never been in this position to understand. I know this, because I've never had trouble getting good work until 2008.

 

I really do wish people were better able to understand the dynamic and reality of this that is going on for a LOT of people.

 

I am forced to work part-time because I can't get a full-time.

 

if I can get a full-time that gives me the flexibility to self-schedule

 

The reality is, I have other priorities, such as family, that preclude me accepting a miserable 9-5 with no flexibility just so that I can fit into someone else's mainstream ideals.

 

unless I can find something that is flexible

 

Edited February 26, 2015 by clevelander321

[Auspecial]

Everyone is different and this is what I sense from talking to people similar to you. You repeatedly mention things like "the crash", being "forced into part time", difficult since 2008, the reality for lots of people, etc. As if your situation is beyond your control due to the crash of 2008. So fatalistic.

 

Then on the other hand, you repeatedly state how you need a full time job with the ability to self schedule. Flexibility. make your own hours...

 

For people who sacrifice other aspects of life to work full time, they do not want to hear how the crash of 2008 affected your life, when in reality you want some sort of full time job that does not exist for many others.. The type of full time job where you write your own schedule. Sort of like you are above the rules others play by, but then blaming something else for your choice.. The crash, being forced into part time, others not having thr asbility to understand what it is like for others etc.

 

I would be confused and think you are making excuses. The crash is not the problem. You are not forced into working part time. Getting good work is not the problem. The problem is your expectations of how work should fit into your life, as you value other aspects of life more than work.. Which is fine, but just own it and do not say you are being "forced" into some position you are choosing to be in.

 

 

 

 

 

 

'I am in the bracket of people who are "forced part-time" because we want full-time work but have not been able to get it.'

 

Its the same that I expected before financial crash

 

I have actually come a long way from the crash in 2008

 

It is difficult for people who have never been in this position to understand. I know this, because I've never had trouble getting good work until 2008.

 

I really do wish people were better able to understand the dynamic and reality of this that is going on for a LOT of people.

 

I am forced to work part-time because I can't get a full-time.

 

if I can get a full-time that gives me the flexibility to self-schedule

 

The reality is, I have other priorities, such as family, that preclude me accepting a miserable 9-5 with no flexibility just so that I can fit into someone else's mainstream ideals.

 

unless I can find something that is flexible

 

 

Obviously there is no way people who don't know me other than on an internet forum can really know me. As I don't really know you and what motivates your trying to look for something to criticize. However, these attitudes do serve me by reminding me where these particular men I mentioned are also getting their viewpoints. There are people who understand and "get it," and people who don't understand right now, and then also, people who will never understand.

 

 

I don't understand how a dating question has turned into a character bash on a person who works their a** off. But to each his/her own. I'm sure there are things about your life that I would find odd or otherwise unappealing.

 

 

Re: entitlement, again, you do not know me and you do not know anything about what I have lived. I have done some very menial jobs to stay afloat, with no assistance, and I am now doing non-menial but non-professional part-time work, that is unappealing to some men. I also haven't been presenting myself properly, as I am very self-critical about this issue.

 

 

What is entitled about wanting to be with family to help them and to have a content, decent life? If I can't get that in a full-time job (I did have this flexibility in a full-time job in the past,) then I will get it in a part-time fashion. Why is that being vilified by some?

 

 

You say I am unappealing because I am un-ambitious, and don't want to better my life, then you contradict yourself by saying that I don't deserve the fruits of my hard work in creating a content and decent life for myself. As an add: both these guys I mentioned still wanted to date me. I just picked up that they didn't fully respect what I am doing, and that was too much a drain on me, so I stopped seeing them. Is that un-allowed, too, because I have several part-time jobs??

 

 

I think the reason is for some reason, you are engaged in a cat-and-mouse, and are in the mood for bullying.

[William]

Folks, let's stay focused on the scenario presented in the topic and 'dating outside of one's paygrade'. There are threads available elsewhere on our site, for free, to discuss jobs, employment options and philosophies and general aspects regarding employment and pay. This thread is about dating. Additionally, our guidelines provide that postings shall be relevant to the topic and provided in a civil and respectful manner. If this seems like I'm repeating myself, it's because I am. Thanks!

[GoBlue]

There are all kinds of "shallow" people both male and female. The key is to never settle and not spend too much time worrying about someone who has these kinds of attitudes. You can only do what you can do. Amen!

[blackcat777]

I went on one date with a guy...

 

I've done a lot with my life. I've traveled extensively, published two books, can speak other languages, play the piano, stand on my head. I'm self-sufficient, witty and in good health.

 

I'm going to school now because I never went to a four year college after graduating high school.

 

As soon as I mentioned ^that^ to this guy I went on a date, the conversation came crashing to a halt. I will never forget the look of disgusted revulsion on his face. "....OH," he said.

 

Think I called that guy back? Ha ha ha. His loss.

 

If someone wants to judge you for doing what you have to do to survive, it's a blessing, because that is a bright green light to go ahead and kick them out the door, if you're dating.

 

The only thing that matters is if YOU are happy with what YOU are doing.

 

I decided to finally go to beauty school because, while bartending et al was awesome to allow me to travel and explore the world in my youth, it's not where I want to be when I'm 65. But that's me.

 

And some guys are just judgmental and there's nothing you can do. I always felt like my dad was so ashamed I never went for any professional schooling, and I was so happy and excited the day I told him I enrolled in school. He was so unsupportive. He thought it was so stupid. With some people, you just can't win. You can only know your worth, soldier on, and do what makes you happy.

[clevelander321]

I still submit resumes and applications on a daily basis.

 

 

 

 

The last guy kept making comments like what (I) do for a living "is ok for now......"

 

 

 

Another recent guy, a plumbers assistant, condescendingly told me that I would do better with one full-time job.

 

 

 

Is it really so hard to find quality men who are not shallow? And able to see value in character of a person, not just material things or titles. It seems to be getting worse and worse.

 

 

 

Aren't the above guys just stating how you already feel? You are looking daily for a full time job.. One guy said what you do is ok for now, and the other guy said you would be better off with a full time job..

 

What is the issue? What do you want them to say when it comes to your job situation? you are getting dates and seeing guys regardless of your job situation. many guys would not be so lucky if the situation was reversed.

Edited February 27, 2015 by clevelander321

[Buddhist]

The only time I'll ever give up on dating is when I've completely lost ALL hope in the male species of the human race. Seems like you've reached that point already. How sad.

 

Sounds like you think your preferences should apply to everyone else.

[NJ123]

What I've heard in the past on this site is that as long as you can support yourself it should be no problem. Just as long as you're not in some low paying job & make like 20 grand a year or less. Since it's highly likely for a serious relationship that a woman would want a guy to have a good job. And a successful man wouldn't want a woman to leech off of him if she's not doing anything much herself. There's definitely exceptions though where a man or woman wouldn't care in general just as long as you do have some sort of job.

[Phoe]

I admire your ability to so easily accept this apparent role. I guess part of confusion is that they initiate contact and pursue me, all along thinking I am not really good enough for something that's real.

 

It definitely is not easy to accept, I have had a history on this forum of over analyzing and wondering and worrying over why things are the way they are.

 

I stressed myself over it and made myself feel quite low...

 

Accepting that things are the way they are, and putting a very simple focus on just doing what's good for me, and ending it at that, no further thought about it, is the only way to keep myself from getting back into that cycle of overthinking and then feeling lousy.

 

Gotta value my own happiness and peace of mind first and foremost.

[Auspecial]

I went on one date with a guy...

 

I've done a lot with my life. I've traveled extensively, published two books, can speak other languages, play the piano, stand on my head. I'm self-sufficient, witty and in good health.

 

I'm going to school now because I never went to a four year college after graduating high school.

 

As soon as I mentioned ^that^ to this guy I went on a date, the conversation came crashing to a halt. I will never forget the look of disgusted revulsion on his face. "....OH," he said.

 

Think I called that guy back? Ha ha ha. His loss.

 

If someone wants to judge you for doing what you have to do to survive, it's a blessing, because that is a bright green light to go ahead and kick them out the door, if you're dating.

 

The only thing that matters is if YOU are happy with what YOU are doing.

 

I decided to finally go to beauty school because, while bartending et al was awesome to allow me to travel and explore the world in my youth, it's not where I want to be when I'm 65. But that's me.

 

And some guys are just judgmental and there's nothing you can do. I always felt like my dad was so ashamed I never went for any professional schooling, and I was so happy and excited the day I told him I enrolled in school. He was so unsupportive. He thought it was so stupid. With some people, you just can't win. You can only know your worth, soldier on, and do what makes you happy.

 

 

You are awesome! Thank You!

[Auspecial]

[quote=Phoe;6

 

Gotta value my own happiness and peace of mind first and foremost.

 

Me too! Thank you.

[Auspecial]

I went on one date with a guy...

 

I've done a lot with my life. I've traveled extensively, published two books, can speak other languages, play the piano, stand on my head. I'm self-sufficient, witty and in good health.

 

I'm going to school now because I never went to a four year college after graduating high school.

 

As soon as I mentioned ^that^ to this guy I went on a date, the conversation came crashing to a halt. I will never forget the look of disgusted revulsion on his face. "....OH," he said.

 

Think I called that guy back? Ha ha ha. His loss.

 

If someone wants to judge you for doing what you have to do to survive, it's a blessing, because that is a bright green light to go ahead and kick them out the door, if you're dating.

 

 

 

 

Exactly!! )

 

 

The societal buy-in to having to meet only specific bullet points in order to be validated as a successful person.

 

 

Its great to be educated! Its great to be over-educated! Its also great to be HAPPY, no matter what your circumstances are. There is a huge wave pushing for education right now. That's great.

 

 

But is it EVERYTHING???? No, it is NOT. There are many, many, many other things that contribute to being a successful person.