Dating outside your paygrade

[Auspecial]

Auspecial...

 

Firstly kudos to you for working so hard in a very difficult economic climate! And holding down your jobs and honouring the bills etc whilst many with their "high flying" careers and posh houses/flash cars and fancy lifestyles live in daily fear of losing it all.. Afterall, whilst it may mean a lot to some people to have such status, we who have lived life and taken the knocks, know that what actually matters at the very bottom of it all, is to have a decent meal on the table and inner soul contentment..to be happy in our own skin..and a little bed to sleep well at night..

 

I am in a similar situation and I did take mild offence at one posters' comment regarding "working at a gas station" As that is precisely what I do right now...

But you know what? I have been recently dating someone who I would say far exceeds my 'current' financial status... They want to see me, spend time with me regardless.. They are not superficial like that..

They see beyond my current circumstance and appreciate my whole being and me as a person..

Sounds to me like you have met guys who are not worth the air you breathe.. Find one who wants to live and breathe every moment of YOU.. Anyone who is even scared of supposed ''gold digging' isn't worth a second look in my book.. It is they who is shallow not you..

You be yourself and all will come right in good time you will see..

 

All the best xx

 

 

Aww, thanks!! All the best to you as well!!!

[clevelander321]

You know it's possible I don't fully grasps the economical situation where you are. Where I live unemployment is 4% and if people lose their job it takes a couple of weeks to a couple of months and they find a new one, maybe the longest 6 months.

 

This doesn't make much sense to me either unless OP is holding out for one specific job. I mean does every girl in this city have 4 jobs?

 

You don't even need to tell guys what you do for work and that you have 4 jobs. Once you start sleeping with a guy and he likes you you can tell him you are a drug dealer and he probably wont care.

[Phoe]

I work a manual labor low wage job, and definitely get some flak for it. From anyone and everyone.

 

I'm totally self sufficient, no assistance, and work very hard and have great work ethic. I am always applying for better opportunities, have a bachelors, and am working towards a masters.

 

Just not my time yet, so I keep chugging along. Just have to accept that my job scenario may make me less appealing to men.

 

One of my female coworkers get some crap for her job. Her boyfriend's friends make insulting remarks and make fun of her on his facebook page.

[Auspecial]

When I looked at the heading/opening post, I expected to read a post by a man. My, how things have changed!

 

Well, the economy is still not great, so having 4 part-time jobs is not surprising.

 

My biggest question would be, how do you have time to date?

 

That aside, do your friends care that you have 4 jobs and are not an executive? - if they don't, neither should your boyfriend. You just have to find the right man. You are only looking for one, who cares what all the rest think.

 

A relationship is a friendship on fire, with romance and affection to turn up the heat! As long as you are not doing anything immoral or illegal, who cares if you are the garbage girl!

 

 

Love it, Gary S., Thanks!

 

 

Yes, I do make time for a social life because I enjoy life and I know how important balance is. Everyone has to make priorities, and this is one of mine because life is very short! My schedule isn't so bizarre that I can't have a life outside of working. And you are right, none of my friends has a problem with my work.

[Echo74]

I disagree with most on this thread. I do not feel your job choice has any bearing on landing a man. Are you a pisces? 4 jobs does make you seem scattered.

 

Matt Damon married a bartender. Guys all over marry poor women, successful women, business owners, day care teachers, waitresses, etc.

 

Often times we have successful women complaining that "men are intimidated by their success". They always feel the need to blame men for their lack of dating success, and chalk it up to something out of their control, instead of changing how they date.

 

I agree. I dated the president of a small biotech company for 3 years, he made 3-4 times what I did as a department supervisor.

[acrosstheuniverse]

I don't think it's the fact you don't make much money or you don't have a corporate job. I think it's the fact you have 4 different jobs and this for the past 7 years. You pretty much handle your working life like a student would do, not the way a woman of a certain age would do. My daughter used to have 3 part time jobs through her University, that's the type of things early 20ish students do.

 

I too would wonder why someone hadn't managed to land a full-time job in eight years... I get that the economy is rough, I know it's difficult, but 7/8 years of sending out resumes daily is a LONG time not to land a full-time position. Heck, when I was qualifying in my field I'd apply to anywhere in the country just to make sure I got the right job and was employed. It's just me, but I'd probably wonder how bad you wanted a full-time professional job if you hadn't gotten one in so many years. I would admire your work ethic and willingness to do what it takes to survive (I was pulling 70 hour weeks for months on end at one point.... often fifteen hour days!) but I would presume if I were dating a man in your situation that he'd probably still be struggling for the forseeable future and I wouldn't want to date a partner who was forecasted to only work a 'McJob' or who had such a mad schedule I'd never know when they were free. I pizza delivered and bank cashiered my way through my MA to qualify as a professional and I'm definitely NOT above low wage jobs, but I don't want a relationship with someone where that's all we'd ever have, because I know what a struggle it is. I earn quite a bit more than my boyfriend and don't care a bit, I'm just glad he's in a professional role he enjoys with opportunities to succeed instead of working as a retail sales assistant or a pizza chef.

 

It's just what it is. Some men won't care, but you're focusing on the ones that do care unfortunately. I'm sure some won't care, but you'll have to be willing to accept and date guys who are in a similar situation and man... that'd be hard work!

 

I'm just being honest... I hope I don't offend.

[Auspecial]

I work a manual labor low wage job, and definitely get some flak for it. From anyone and everyone.

 

I'm totally self sufficient, no assistance, and work very hard and have great work ethic. I am always applying for better opportunities, have a bachelors, and am working towards a masters.

 

Just not my time yet, so I keep chugging along. Just have to accept that my job scenario may make me less appealing to men.

 

One of my female coworkers get some crap for her job. Her boyfriend's friends make insulting remarks and make fun of her on his facebook page.

 

 

 

Yes, this is the type of thing I am talking about. In our society, it seems to be more acceptable to live off "disability" (whether true or not) than to have things tightened down by actually working hard.

 

 

Heck, I am starting to think I should just say I am a SAHM, and not working at all, and these guys would find it more acceptable than "I am working 3-4 jobs." I am a mom, although my daughter is grown. I do stay at home, to sleep at night after work. LOL

[gaius]

You're just in one of those situations where there's a decent amount of unfair perception involved. =/ My mother went to college and got a science degree many years ago, but eventually quit her job to have more kids and today subsists on government benefits and child support. But she still thinks because she went to college that she's better than everyone that didn't, including people who still work an actual job everyday. While she's actually the lowest of the low without realizing it.

 

I know you said you got a degree but I'm just illustrating. And you're probably doing something else that's turning them off and that's their excuse. There's in the closet gay guys out there for sure that prioritize like women but in general if you scratch a guy in the right place he's not gonna care a whole lot about your job title.

[Auspecial]

I too would wonder why someone hadn't managed to land a full-time job in eight years... I get that the economy is rough, I know it's difficult, but 7/8 years of sending out resumes daily is a LONG time not to land a full-time position. Heck, when I was qualifying in my field I'd apply to anywhere in the country just to make sure I got the right job and was employed. It's just me, but I'd probably wonder how bad you wanted a full-time professional job if you hadn't gotten one in so many years. I would admire your work ethic and willingness to do what it takes to survive (I was pulling 70 hour weeks for months on end at one point.... often fifteen hour days!) but I would presume if I were dating a man in your situation that he'd probably still be struggling for the forseeable future and I wouldn't want to date a partner who was forecasted to only work a 'McJob' or who had such a mad schedule I'd never know when they were free. I pizza delivered and bank cashiered my way through my MA to qualify as a professional and I'm definitely NOT above low wage jobs, but I don't want a relationship with someone where that's all we'd ever have, because I know what a struggle it is. I earn quite a bit more than my boyfriend and don't care a bit, I'm just glad he's in a professional role he enjoys with opportunities to succeed instead of working as a retail sales assistant or a pizza chef.

 

It's just what it is. Some men won't care, but you're focusing on the ones that do care unfortunately. I'm sure some won't care, but you'll have to be willing to accept and date guys who are in a similar situation and man... that'd be hard work!

 

I'm just being honest... I hope I don't offend.

 

 

 

 

No, you didn't offend. You are telling your reality, and I am telling mine. The disturbing thing to me is that some people automatically feel dubiousness about my work, if it doesn't match up to their own experiences. There are valid reasons for my struggles with finding full time work. But those aren't really the point of my original post, and I'm not interested in defending my life (which is a VERY nice and rich life, because I choose for it to be.)

 

 

Its ironic about the whole "busy schedule" commentary......I recall two scenarios with two different guys who were concerned about my schedule, yet they had schedule obstacles too, having regular 9-5 jobs. In my opinion, the problem was their jump to conclusion that my schedule must be insurmountable and "hard," but in reality, because I juggle it so well, and because I insist on personal life balance, its no more difficult than their own.

 

 

I'm not in a position to go back to school, as I am still currently chasing bills on paycheck at a time. However, that would immensely help if I can ever arrange that scenario.

 

 

Thanks for your response.

[Auspecial]

You're just in one of those situations where there's a decent amount of unfair perception involved. =/ My mother went to college and got a science degree many years ago, but eventually quit her job to have more kids and today subsists on government benefits and child support. But she still thinks because she went to college that she's better than everyone that didn't, including people who still work an actual job everyday. While she's actually the lowest of the low without realizing it.

 

I know you said you got a degree but I'm just illustrating. And you're probably doing something else that's turning them off and that's their excuse. There's in the closet gay guys out there for sure that prioritize like women but in general if you scratch a guy in the right place he's not gonna care a whole lot about your job title.

 

 

You're probably right that there is some kind of blind spot going on that I don't see. Its possible that I am projecting my thoughts about my professional success, because it bothers me more than they.

 

 

Yet, particularly for the two guys I mentioned who gave weird, off-the-cuff comments about my work choices (which are partially forced choices, since my options are limited), it truly did seem to be a judgement issue for them. I think they were both highly attracted to me but didn't think I was good enough.

[carhill]

Since you have a grown child, you're at an age where, generally, child-rearing and all that stuff is over and adult life dominates the landscape and measuring up partners for family and child-rearing is, or should be, past-tense. I'm perhaps a bit older but can't recall, at least post-mid-30's, considering a dating prospect's profession/occupation/job as pertinent to any initial dating contacts. Perhaps that's more typical of my generation of men, IDK. One option, respecting that potential, is to date older men who don't view a woman's professional credentials and job classification as an entry requirement. It's not a lifetime commitment, rather hopefully beneficial and pleasurable social interaction. Then, if meeting a contemporary who happens to be like-minded, you can move on to that milieu.

 

I guess I can see all sides of this, having been fathered by a white collar professional and educated privately but still choosing a blue-collar job life and being self-employed, so not as easy to classify and pigeon-hole as to image or pay scale. In general, from long experience in business, the confused or uncertain mind says 'no' and perhaps that's what you're experiencing from these men when disclosed of your current job and career aspects. With little to no emotional investment, it's easy to analyze the surfaces and make a cognitive decision. If relevant, the solution may lie in either finding men who don't analyze and make decisions in such a manner or dating 'within your paygrade', whether that alludes to image or actual numbers as you deem relevant.

 

The other option is doing something I've done since getting a divorce and dealing with the financial fallout of that. Don't date. Enjoy life. There's lots out there without a partner. I learned that lesson from the female role model in my life who loved one man for her life and lived alone after he died. Good lessons. Good luck!

[Mr.D.E.B.T.]

Some of these guys are probably only doing what they've been taught. They might have parents that are still upset about a bad relationship and passed these ideas down to them. I just hope for your sake that despite your circumstances you are still pursuing your passion. I'm sure that is tough with four jobs and bills, but don't let it get you down.

[Emilia]

But in reality, I am content with my life

They feel your content and they don't find you ambitious enough. It's not shallow just different values. A lot of men nowdays like a woman with a good career.

[Gaeta]

So what's the problem? You enjoy your life as it is and you are liking the life style the 4 jobs give you. If it bothers men you meet then fk'em. You asked why this might turn some men off and we explained a few reasons why.

 

I have a similar problem but the other way around. I am an executive and men my age are intimidated by me because I am ahead of them, it hurts their ego and I am a daily reminder to them they're not where they want to be in life. I get constant little sneaky comments from them. You know what I do now? I don't date professionals that way they don't compare themselves to me. My last boyfriend was a welder the one before a mechanic. They were hard working men with no post high school education. They did not care what I did for living or how much I made and never made little sneaky comments comparing themselves to me. On top of that they never let me reach for my wallet.

 

So solution? Keep on dating till you find men that don't give a heck about your work situation and this means dating men in same situation as you or on opposite end.

[Auspecial]

 

Just not my time yet, so I keep chugging along. Just have to accept that my job scenario may make me less appealing to men.

 

 

 

 

Therein lies part of my problem. I have trouble accepting that my value isn't evident. In light of the many many people who are not trying to better themselves, or just plain lazy, or living off the government or disability.

 

 

For me, my 3-4 jobs are fun and pay the bills. I have plenty of time for a rich social life. I have flexibility to help my family almost every time something is needed. Why is this less appealing than a user, or even someone who has a regular 9-5, maybe a little nicer car than me, has every weekend off (I work two weekends a month, its not the end of the world.) but can't help their family when needed? Indeed, if I can get a full-time that gives me the flexibility to self-schedule so I can meet my priorities in life, I would love that! I don't think it would change my busy schedule, though. I would still make time for a social life.

 

 

I admire your ability to so easily accept this apparent role. I guess part of confusion is that they initiate contact and pursue me, all along thinking I am not really good enough for something that's real.

[Auspecial]

So what's the problem? You enjoy your life as it is and you are liking the life style the 4 jobs give you. If it bothers men you meet then fk'em. You asked why this might turn some men off and we explained a few reasons why.

 

I have a similar problem but the other way around. I am an executive and men my age are intimidated by me because I am ahead of them, it hurts their ego and I am a daily reminder to them they're not where they want to be in life. I get constant little sneaky comments from them. You know what I do now? I don't date professionals that way they don't compare themselves to me. My last boyfriend was a welder the one before a mechanic. They were hard working men with no post high school education. They did not care what I did for living or how much I made and never made little sneaky comments comparing themselves to me. On top of that they never let me reach for my wallet.

 

So solution? Keep on dating till you find men that don't give a heck about your work situation and this means dating men in same situation as you or on opposite end.

 

All very good points, thanks.

 

 

Maybe I should also develop some kind of filter for those who know what I do for a living, yet pursue me but don't actually respect me. One would think if they pursue knowing your work, that they don't give a heck what you do. But sometimes they actually do.

[Auspecial]

 

I guess I can see all sides of this, having been fathered by a white collar professional and educated privately but still choosing a blue-collar job life and being self-employed, so not as easy to classify and pigeon-hole as to image or pay scale. In general, from long experience in business, the confused or uncertain mind says 'no' and perhaps that's what you're experiencing from these men when disclosed of your current job and career aspects. With little to no emotional investment, it's easy to analyze the surfaces and make a cognitive decision. If relevant, the solution may lie in either finding men who don't analyze and make decisions in such a manner or dating 'within your paygrade', whether that alludes to image or actual numbers as you deem relevant.

 

 

Thanks for your response. I relate to what you are saying about age groups having different focuses and life views. Of the two guys I mentioned in OP, the first had a 25 year marriage where the wife was educated but never worked. He is faced with paying her support and seems ok with that, but not ok with what I do for work. I think the worst of it was him being embarrassed when I talked to his friends about my work. They were all professional people, including several attorneys and higher-end business people. I felt so low. And there should have been no reason to feel low at all. I think perhaps he hasn't made the thought leap that things are different as we are older. Other than his assumptions, etc. he was pretty good to me. The other one I mentioned is ?50, never married. I try not to pigeon-hole people, also, but perhaps this could suggest a possibility of having a few social misconcepts.

 

 

Bottom line: neither of these guys were for me, and I am trying to take this whole thing as a learning experience in this Grande Operation of Life.....

[BluEyeL]

I wouldn't have a problem with anyone's job, as long as they support themselves. I do, however, have a problem with people who are constantly unhappy about their situation, but blame everyone else but themselves for their station in life.

 

Throw their hands in the air and declare that oh well, it's not my fault that: I'm fat, I'm underemployed, I can't get a date etc. Nobody is perfect, and definitely, most of the time it is OUR fault for wherever we are in life.

 

These being said, a lot of men wouldn't date someone who: has children, has an unstable job, has a too high up job, is fat, is short, is too skinny etc etc etc. In the end, you just need ONE and blaming others for your situation is just completely unproductive.

 

In your case, quit blaming men and look at what you can improve about yourself, your dating habits, your presentation. That's the only way to succeed in anything because you only have control over yourself, not others.

[carhill]

Taking out of the equation who approaches who, it appears these interactions are simply misses.

 

The men apparently initially found you sufficiently attractive to approach but further interaction led to one or both sides deciding the interaction wasn't worth pursuing.

 

Your posting caused me to reflect upon the two women I dated after my wife and I separated. It didn't even occur to me to ask 'what do you do?' (for a living) and I never did, though both, at some point, shared aspects of their jobs in passing conversation. I was more interested in social interaction. One lady was rehabbing her house so that was of interest. Another enjoyed travel, as do I, so we shared aspects of those pursuits. I guess that's one dating style. I've always viewed dating as social interaction. When I close the door on the shop, work ends and I don't even think about it since, to me, there is so much more to life than work, even though I love my work. Again, another style.

 

Perhaps these experiences can help solidify a dating style which respects your current circumstances and perspectives and more quickly and easily allows you to continue, or discontinue, associations as you desire without investing substantial time or thought into that process.

 

I recall an old bit of advice from a lady I followed in my childhood, 'Dear Abby', when experiencing interactions or inquiries which I felt not pertinent. She always recommended simply asking 'why do you want to know?' and listening. Answers usually arrive, one way or another.....

[clevelander321]

Thanks for your response. I relate to what you are saying about age groups having different focuses and life views. Of the two guys I mentioned in OP, the first had a 25 year marriage where the wife was educated but never worked. He is faced with paying her support and seems ok with that, but not ok with what I do for work. I think the worst of it was him being embarrassed when I talked to his friends about my work. They were all professional people, including several attorneys and higher-end business people. I felt so low. And there should have been no reason to feel low at all. I think perhaps he hasn't made the thought leap that things are different as we are older. Other than his assumptions, etc. he was pretty good to me. The other one I mentioned is ?50, never married. I try not to pigeon-hole people, also, but perhaps this could suggest a possibility of having a few social misconcepts.

 

 

Bottom line: neither of these guys were for me, and I am trying to take this whole thing as a learning experience in this Grande Operation of Life.....

 

Would you mind dating a guy who told you "Look, I have been applying for a job for 10 years and could not find one. So right now I hold a sign infront of this store for 2 days, busboy for ten hours, shovel snow, and cut my neighbors grass, but i am happy and get by"

 

You might think something was strange.

 

Having said that, there probably are men in certain fields who would judge what you do for work, or be embarassed once you start talking about it to their colleagues.

 

Would you have an issue dating a man with no career and 4 part time jobs? If I was the guy with 4 jobs I would totally understand if a woman who was a doctor or lawyer would not date me..

Edited February 26, 2015 by clevelander321

[Auspecial]

 

Would you have an issue dating a man with no career and 4 part time jobs?

 

 

 

We all have our preferences, but I do feel that life, and people, are more dynamic than simply their life and/or work circumstances.

 

 

I have dated: self-made wealthy men, poor hard-working men, a disabled man, unemployed and looking, inherited-wealthy. Its the person that I am interested in, and how I feel with them and how my life is enhanced in general, not what they do to pay bills.

 

 

It is not my "story" that I have been unsuccessful getting a full-time professional career going for seven years. That is how you read it, but not as it has happened. The reality is, I have other priorities, such as family, that preclude me accepting a miserable 9-5 with no flexibility just so that I can fit into someone else's mainstream ideals.

[Auspecial]

 

Your posting caused me to reflect upon the two women I dated after my wife and I separated. It didn't even occur to me to ask 'what do you do?' (for a living) and I never did, though both, at some point, shared aspects of their jobs in passing conversation. I was more interested in social interaction. One lady was rehabbing her house so that was of interest. Another enjoyed travel, as do I, so we shared aspects of those pursuits. I guess that's one dating style. I've always viewed dating as social interaction. When I close the door on the shop, work ends and I don't even think about it since, to me, there is so much more to life than work, even though I love my work. Again, another style.

.

 

 

 

 

I wholeheartedly agree with this. My favorite dates have been where there is no mention of work, past relationships, politics, etc. But just getting together and talking about whatever comes up and is interesting. Leave all the other stuff behind for an hour at least! lol

 

 

Problem is, everyone always seems to jump immediately to: "what do you do?" Is there a nice way circumvent that and re-direct conversation to more social topics? I'm not sure if the question is someone's weeding out process, or just because they can't think of anything else to ask. But for me its a loaded question, because I know my situation may seem unsolid to others, even though it does work.

[clevelander321]

I have been a very hard working professional woman for many years, but lost my career in 2008. I am healthy and happy in general, but have been struggling financially ever since. I am in the bracket of people who are "forced part-time" because we want full-time work but have not been able to get it. I am still very hard working. I currently have four part-time jobs. But they are not professional jobs. I can't afford to go back to college and get another degree, and I can't use the one I had for many years. I still submit resumes and applications on a daily basis.

 

 

Yes, of course I would love to be making more money. But in reality, I am content with my life and I have actually come a long way from the crash in 2008. I work very hard and I also enjoy my work.

 

 

.

 

I am a little confused.

 

A. You repeatedly state you are happy with your life and situation, and feel men are shallow for judging you and your job choice.

 

On the other hand you also state you fill out applications daily, and would rather be working one full time job. These to sentiments seem to directly oppose each other..

 

if you were happy you would not be filling out applications daily.. If you are not happy then why state you are? And what is really preventing you from having one job?

 

B. The job search time is stressful. if you have been doing this daily for 7 years, as a guy I would probably get sick of hearing about it. It is not the best time to date and find love when your life is in such disarray.

 

C. From some of your statements, you might seem a little entitled? You equate a full time job to being miserable and not flexible, but blame the economy for not being able to find one?

 

Once again, I don't think it is not being a "professional", it is the fact that you have 4 jobs and are on the job hunt daily for 7 years that would probably make a new partner a bit anxious. Not because they need your money, but because it is just not very stable and calm.

[Gaeta]

Problem is, everyone always seems to jump immediately to: "what do you do?"

 

It's just a question to get the conversation going. Do you feel uncomfortable answering? If you expect to be judged and that makes you uncomfortable maybe they are picking on it. Do you feel the need to explain your situation? You should not. Also, do you say "I used to work as...'' ? That demonstrate disappointment in your current situation.

 

If I were you when I am asked what I do I would present it as I am doing exactly what I want to be doing at this moment in my life. No excuses, no explanations. I do this and this and I love the freedom it's giving me.

[carhill]

Problem is, everyone always seems to jump immediately to: "what do you do?"

 

Yes, that's quite common. One option is developing a humorous response if wishing to deflect but not wishing to be 'serious' about the interaction.

 

When women ask me what I do, I tell them 'I fix things'. What kinds of things? 'All kinds of things' No, really. 'Would you like me to fix you?' When out and about with my best friend, we play Mutt and Jeff, or Laurel and Hardy, with this stuff, all in good humor. I remember one time, at a bar, I got a 'come home' invitation to fix something, a toilet IIRC. I don't do casual sex but do fix toilets