Now what..

[DSP]

I have just stumbled upon an old email from the father of my Ex's child. I am now reading about the parent alienation she did to him when she was around 3 years old. She is 21 now and has reached out to him and they now have a limited relationship.

 

God this is heart breaking to read.

 

He had tried for years to contact his daughter. One day he actually did get a hold of her and while on the phone and his little girl had to tell him that he was not her daddy anymore and that the guy my Ex was married to was. Mommy said so.

 

Jesus she was 18 years old moved across country and got married to a guy she didn't even know. Telling her little girl that her father isn't her daddy anymore.

 

We have a 1 and 4 year old. Her daughter had to step in and tell her mom and this POS guy that he is not the father of these children and they have a very good father that loves them very much. My mind is just blown on so many levels now.

 

I cannot believe I was so blind to what was done. I was always told he was manipulative, controlling and abusive.

 

I really do not know how I made it through this ordeal in such good shape if not only by humility and listening to those who knew more than I.

 

She is the enemy obtain legal consultation now.

Be there for your children they are going to need you now more than ever.

Start doing projects to keep your mind occupied.

Walk away now and keep no contact with her.

 

Best advice ever.

 

Putting in the order for the children not to leave this state has to be one of the best decision I have ever made or was made for me.

 

I have reached out to him as he and I have had our issues in the past. I think now is a great time to apologize for my actions.

 

He accepted my apology and we exchanged texts and will be meeting for Lunch. Funny we have the same career too.

 

Two side jobs came through today. This will be going into next years Christmas account. I told you as the sun would rise I will overcome. I meant that.

 

I am repairing this bridge between the father of a child I raised and myself. This will help him heal as well. I am thankful I've been given the opportunity to do so.

 

I texted with my Ex today about visitation without getting overwhelmed with anxiety. Still didn't accept her call. This is a big step for me honestly.

 

Amazing how one insignificant measurement of time can change all the time you have left in this world.

 

What a damn good feeling this is. Interesting indeed...

[EgoJoe]

The FOG is lifting.

[road]

I have just stumbled upon an old email from the father of my Ex's child. I am now reading about the parent alienation she did to him when she was around 3 years old. She is 21 now and has reached out to him and they now have a limited relationship.

 

God this is heart breaking to read.

 

He had tried for years to contact his daughter. One day he actually did get a hold of her and while on the phone and his little girl had to tell him that he was not her daddy anymore and that the guy my Ex was married to was. Mommy said so.

 

Jesus she was 18 years old moved across country and got married to a guy she didn't even know. Telling her little girl that her father isn't her daddy anymore.

 

We have a 1 and 4 year old. Her daughter had to step in and tell her mom and this POS guy that he is not the father of these children and they have a very good father that loves them very much. My mind is just blown on so many levels now.

 

I cannot believe I was so blind to what was done. I was always told he was manipulative, controlling and abusive.

 

I really do not know how I made it through this ordeal in such good shape if not only by humility and listening to those who knew more than I.

 

She is the enemy obtain legal consultation now.

Be there for your children they are going to need you now more than ever.

Start doing projects to keep your mind occupied.

Walk away now and keep no contact with her.

 

Best advice ever.

 

Putting in the order for the children not to leave this state has to be one of the best decision I have ever made or was made for me.

 

I have reached out to him as he and I have had our issues in the past. I think now is a great time to apologize for my actions.

 

He accepted my apology and we exchanged texts and will be meeting for Lunch. Funny we have the same career too.

 

Two side jobs came through today. This will be going into next years Christmas account. I told you as the sun would rise I will overcome. I meant that.

 

I am repairing this bridge between the father of a child I raised and myself. This will help him heal as well. I am thankful I've been given the opportunity to do so.

 

I texted with my Ex today about visitation without getting overwhelmed with anxiety. Still didn't accept her call. This is a big step for me honestly.

 

Amazing how one insignificant measurement of time can change all the time you have left in this world.

 

What a damn good feeling this is. Interesting indeed...

 

 

 

So you were the OM to this BH?

 

 

You can support them reconnecting. Though as with planting a seed there is no guarantee on how the relationship will grow.

 

 

Sad though that no matter what you do now you will never be able to give back those years to him and daughter.

[DSP]

So you were the OM to this BH?

 

You can support them reconnecting. Though as with planting a seed there is no guarantee on how the relationship will grow.

 

Sad though that no matter what you do now you will never be able to give back those years to him and daughter.

 

All of this is such a mess. I cannot believe how destructive this all is. Like a pebble in a pond the ripple effects can be seen and felt.

 

She had a child at 14 with the guy I texted last night.

 

She left at 17 and married a guy who was home on leave and moved across country. While across country she didn't allow for any communication between her daughter and this guy.

 

At 19 she came back here and met me and we started a relationship. She was pregnant 5 months later. I was under the impression she was divorced, but after the birth of my eldest I found that not to be true due to the fact by law I had to put her husband on the birth certificate.

 

I raised her daughter since she was 5. She is 21 now.

 

I always facilitated communication between those two and always told her daughter that anytime she wants to talk to her father let us know and I will make it happen. When she was 9 he tried to get visitation rights, but never came back to the place of visitation for some reason. I hope to have this cleared up on Monday.

 

I was always told he was obsessed with my Ex, controlling, abusive, and manipulative. After reading the email again he specifically said I don't care about you in any way. I have moved on and I just want to see my daughter.

 

It was an event that had happen about 6 years ago that forced us to reach out to him. He in turn wrote an email back detailing things that happened when the little girl was 2 or 3 and she was taken from him. This is what I found.

 

It was right there in front of my face in black and white and I could not see it. She alienated him immediately and lied to anyone that would listen that he was a horrible human being. I fell for it hook line and sinker.

 

Her daughter actually reached out to him after she went to university. They have limited contact due to distance.

 

He did tell me that he appreciated all I did to raise his daughter to be a great person today. He knew it was my Ex feeding me the poison. He also said his daughter told him that I always would allow her to contact him she just never did because she didn't want to deal with the drama of it all.

 

I feel so horrible and used. No apology will be enough for this. Her daughter doesn't contact me or want to talk to me even though she is nice to me when I see her in person. I'm not sure if I should let her know that I spoke to her father or not. If so I wouldn't really know what to say.

 

I want to tell my Ex she is a horrible human being. The things she did were horrible and so destructive. Her patterns are so predictable now that I've been educated on these things.

 

I was told yesterday her mother said the best thing she ever did was leave me so now I wonder how much venom she spit about me to her family and what she really has said. It doesn't really matter in the end though just a piece of mind for myself which it seems I'm never going to get.

 

Other than meeting him on Monday and making amends I really don't know what to do about it all. Not sure if I should let his daughter know or not. We have a court date in 8 days as well I don't want to do anything to mess that up either so I can't say anything to the Ex, but her daughter will let her know.

 

Any suggestions from the community?

[EgoJoe]

Ask the Ex to be a character witness, print out the email, get an affidavit from the stepdaughter if she can't come either.

 

 

Go full force no holds bar and bring in a psychiatric expert.

 

 

Find a Men's rights type attorney and nail her to the wall. Let her indulge so much victim thinking in the face of overwhelming facts that nobody in their right mind will be able to take her side and have their sanity.

[Tocook]

DSP, I just wanted to tell you what a good, strong man you are and I have a lot of respect for you as both a father and a man. I'm sorry that you're going through such madness with your Ex but bad things happen to such good people. You wrote several times that you don't have it that bad or that others have it so much worse. That in itself shows your integrity but don't discount your own problems and it's ok to feel sorry for yourself when you're going through this type of life altering situation.

[DSP]

I spoke with the father of my Exes child.

 

I was just appreciative of the fact he even spoke with me based on the acidity of our past.

 

He filled in some gaps about my Exes life and I filled him in on many gaps of his childs life. He said he was happy to hear I got legal counsel as soon as I knew something was wrong. He also told me of how many times the cops were called on him for just looking at her wrong. He told me to be very careful around her. Very very careful.

 

Her child is very angry at me and has told her father many things that even he stated were hard to believe. He said he was just going to be neutral and wait to hear my side of the story.

 

I sat there in disbelieve as we talked. He was told how I was abusive, controlling, and manipulative her entire life. That his child thinks I try to manipulate her in various ways to this day.

 

He said I really want to know about the abuse in her childhood. I couldn't believe it. I talked to him straight about everything. From the day I met his child to today.

 

Told him there was no abuse. I instilled values and hard work in her. I held her responsible for her actions and made her earn trust. I told him how I parented her basically alone and was responsible for all the discipline in her life. Not only was I her father figure, but I was her parent as well and in the last year and a half I was the only parent to the three children, because their mother was in school and working.

 

He said that he was told I would just come home slap my Ex around scream at the children and drink all day. He did tell me that he had asked that if I was so bad what they did to fix the issue or to get away from me. Why had no one in the family ever helped them. He never got a good answer. I told him, because none of it was true. I busted my back to get us a better life and had to drag an anchor on my neck to get where I am today. I never abused anyone. I'm not an alcoholic. I am a hard worker and value education and hard work which he said he can see today in his child.

 

By the end he said he felt that I was just like him and just was being a father. He believes what he is hearing from his daughter is what she is being told to her by my Ex. He said one day she will understand when she has her own children or has to be a step parent.

 

I asked him why he never showed up again to supervised visitations. He said he did religiously like clock work. The last visit was unsupervised at a public location and she never showed up. He waited for hours and she never came. I thought it was only on the second visitation he never showed up, but it was on the third she never brought his child to him. I never knew that.

 

He said that was when he had to leave it all behind. He loaded up his car and drove away. Had no idea where he was going he just left. He said at that time he mentally could not take anymore. He had to walk away. He made it to a city and rebuilt his life. He is in a better place now and holds no ill will toward anyone. He got help for his issues and is doing much better now married and with children of his own.

 

He said that on the last supervised visitation as she was leaving she ran back to him and hugged him. He felt for sure he had made a breakthorugh with his daughter and he said he could see it in my Exs face that it triggered something in her. I told him I never knew any of this and that I had always told his child to reach out to him to build a bond with him as it is her only father.

 

He told me his child is an angry girl now and the first time they met she just unloaded the anger at him. He sat there patiently and listened. Then after she friended him on Facebook her mother had a melt down and she had to defriend him and she told him she couldn't talk anymore. Now she texts him every once in a while. She told him that she would take her mothers side no matter what so he said he has come to terms with that and just takes what she will give him when it comes to contact. He asked for some pictures of her as she grew up I told him I would give him anything I can find though I don't have much since I gave everything back to her.

 

We talked for a good hour and a half. I have very mixed emotions. We shook hands and he said thank you for talking to him. I said thank you for accepting my apology.

 

I am hurt that the child raised has turned on me like this, but I am also happy I was able to give this guy a chance to heal. I'm hurt that I am being made out to be a monster, but I am happy I bridged a gap and learned some truth to a chaotic mess. I am thankful he forgave me for the foolishness of my actions towards him in the past.

 

I wish we never had to go through any of this. I just want us to be happy. I'm feeling pretty sad now.

[DSP]

After a couple of hours of thinking about it all and replaying what was said I've come to the conclusion that what she says and what she does will have no barring on who or what I am. What is being said about me is the exact same thing that was said about her childs father and her Ex husband. No matter what I will be painted black and everything will be my fault.

 

I am a good person. Always have been. Always will be. I came from a good family with a mother and father that worked hard and instilled those values in me. I don't have any addictions. I'm driven to a fault and that's about it. God forbid I want to have more than what I started with. I'm a good father and have sacrificed my sanity to protect my children and I do not have to do that anymore.

 

How amazing is it that I got to rebuild a bridge with another human being? I wonder if I helped him heal just a little bit. How great is that? I made him smile and laugh. I told him things about his little girl and he just looked at me in amazement. Can you believe that? He was happy just by talking to him about his child.

 

This whole experience has opened me up to new ideas and new ways of thinking.

 

My children are so beautiful it hurts. I've heard "I love you daddy" at least 25 times in the last 3 hours. I gotta be doing something right.

 

Who cares what she says about me. I am going to live well. I am just going to keep being the person I've always been and be happy. I have to let the past go I have to let the sickness go. I just have to. I'm almost there it won't be long I can feel it.

[Downtown]

DSP, you are exhibiting a healthy attitude -- refusing to let your self worth be defined by another person -- and are on the path to healing. Your experience with the biological father is a delightful development, giving you an opportunity to make a real difference in his life. Please keep in mind, however, that the healing process is not linear. There will be ups and downs even though you are steadily improving. The result will be that, on some days, you may wake up feeling like you're back at square one. That is just a feeling. Don't believe it when it happens occasionally.

[DSP]

Thank you Downtown.

 

You are correct this will not be linear.

 

I had to drop off the babies at my Ex mothers for child care and after handing over my 1 year old she started crying. I took her back and she stopped.

 

The exes mother said "Oh I know this is all just so confusing to you."

 

I just wanted to say to her...

 

The baby is 1 years old she has on idea what is going on. Maybe if you kept all those strange men away from your daughter and paid attention to her she wouldn't have been pregnant at 13 and had a shot at a normal life instead of being the destroyed mess she is today. Maybe my children wouldn't be paying the penance for your transgressions.

 

I didn't though. I just kept my mouth shut. Held my baby again to quiet her then had to pass her back and listen to her scream. I kissed my middle child and she told me I was her best friend and I walked out the door. Angry, sad and hurting.

 

So yes this isn't linear by a long shot. I feel like I did a couple months ago. It's going to be a long day at work.

[DSP]

Today after the horrific morning. I read up on some things in order to set my mind back to straight. I thought a lot about what DT said and how this isn't linear, but don't think you've been set back.

 

I realized that I have some options about my life. I can make my own decisions in life or let my fear control me. I thought a lot about many things.

 

My children come first and foremost. They are coming along fine and I think everyone is understanding that I am the responsible adult in this tragic story. My relationship with my children is better than it was before so that got me thinking about the what ifs.

 

What if she wanted to come back. How would my life be if I said OK lets try one more time.

 

I thought about my house now. It is a pocket of calmness now. I have my scented candles burning. It isn't a clustered mess and stays clean. My kids are much calmer and better behaved now. It looks the way I like it to be. My eldest told me it feels like a home now a while back. Her returning would probably send the house back into chaos and disorder and leave me stressed out every day I came home.

 

I thought about the woman I am talking to. She has her stuff together. I mean really together. She is educated and professional and has an unbelievable beautiful life she wants to share with me. If I accepted my Ex back and all her craziness I would have to say good bye to what most people is telling me is a gift from above. I would have to drag my Ex up to that point in life when it is already in front of me. This woman has no issue with me or my children though she hasn't met them. I can share the life I always wanted with my kids even if it would be a temporary thing. With my Ex I'd still be fighting for that life day after day dragging her along.

 

I thought about what the Exes baby daddy told me the other day. He said she has always been this way, but used to be worse. That got me thinking that she is never ever going to change. Even he said she would never admit to fault and go to counselling. So if she came back I'd just have to be a door mat or take blame for everything. Forget that noise.

 

I thought about the guy she is seeing now. He stayed with her for the last week or so, but she didn't want me to meet him. Why? this isn't a game. So I thought it was time to man up and face this fear. I'll meet him shake his hand, shoot the breeze and he'll go back to the arctic circle for a couple months.

 

I picked up my girls today and told her I could have met him this week. I really didn't care anymore I'd just like to see the guy that is going to be around my children. I could visibly see that hurt her. She actually flinched or twinged or something, but I could see it. She then said "Oh yeah he wants to meet you too and he'll be in town for a couple more days.." Which according to my eldest he doesn't want to meet me at all so I know it was BS, but the biggest thing is this gave me the power back.

 

When I left she was kissing my middle child saying "Now you be good at your dads." I said "She always a good girl and we never have any issues with that stuff." Immediately got the venom spit at me and she hissed: "That's not what I meant." with those squinty eyes. My lord calm yourself.

 

I took a good long look at her tonight. She looked so angry, so sad. Just beat up. Honestly nothing different than when she lived here. I just never seen it like I do now. I just loved her too much.

 

No more games. I will still have to meet this clown, but I can do it. The last nail in the coffin has been placed. She knows it too. It's no longer some childish game of "Lets see how much I can hurt DSP" it is real now. Once I meet him the nail will be driven. I will take one more step in moving on. She will be one step closer to her new reality.

 

So tonight I got texts of all kinds:

 

"When are you picking them up tomorrow?" Already agreed upon the day after Christmas. Actually I was online here when that was finalized and I was avoiding her calls. Sent a picture of the text message confirming this from that day. (Always snap shooting texts from her) Edit: This may actually be her trying to set up a time for me to meet this guy. This will be interesting if so and will be good to finally get out of my way.

 

"Make sure you bring them back in the morning" This was told to me today when I picked them up. I reiterated that to her as well.

 

"Your eldest can't come with you on blah, blah, blah..." All BS, but I said: OK sounds good I'll talk to her later this weekend. Kind of alienating me, but there may be a legit reason behind it so I didn't question it.

 

"Your children need stuff from the house and the courts said they can bring that stuff" I said: I'll drop it in the morning.

 

Then I thought about what my life can be without her. I'm going to have my house and it will be clean and calm. It will be a place for my children even if their mother doesn't want to be here. I can always rent it out too later in life. This place is big enough that I'm going to rent out a room next year. My name is on the title and it will be mine forever.

 

The woman I am talking to as I said before has an amazing life. I have an opportunity to do that. I can bring value as well as I am a good person and have a great career. She truly likes me for me and is impressed with what I do. She is wicked smart and travels the world. I can give that to my children. Give them something better even if it is for a small moment in time. That matters more than anything to me.

 

I've learned a lot over the past couple of months and this has helped me be a better person. I'm a different person now. More open to things. Not depressed or isolated. Not filled with constant anxiety. I have a ways to go, but this is getting better. I'm getting the power back. I still have court next week and that is going to be horrible, but I'll survive. I survived Thanksgiving and Christmas so whatever. I'm still on this roller coaster and I'm sure I'll be all kinds of sad soon enough.

 

I'm going to keep posting as well, because I'm long winded and this place is great company. Cheap therapy too. Hope I feel this way tomorrow.

Edited December 31, 2014 by DSP
Added some thoughts...

[DSP]

It's been a couple weeks since the court date.

 

The day before court she stopped to pick up the children and wanted to talk to me.

 

I got some lame beginning of an apology and I cut it short and said the only talking we can do is in therapy. Told me I never needed to file with the courts.Told her she needs some medication to help her sleep. We talked a little and she cried a bit and left.

 

We went to court and it went as good as it could. She tried giving me the sad face and pouty look as if she was so sorry about everything and I just ignored her.

 

She laughed and joked with her lawyer and tears ran down my face through the entire proceeding. My lawyer did his lawyering and I left when it was finished. I think everyone in the court house felt my pain. I just wanted to run away as fast as possible.

 

So that is what I did. I came home and sobbed on my floor. This was it. My family was over.

 

My children always said that mom acts different when you are around. Now I understand what they meant. I've never seen someone have so many different personalities. She goes from utterly exhausted around me to tyrannical around the eldest to jubilant and bouncy in the matter of minutes.

 

I hear second hand from my eldest everything that goes on over there. It's not going well for anyone. The vitriol and venom is old to eveyone so they've stopped coming around. Facebook is her only friend and her and OM had a fall out for a couple days. Not even six months and they had a two day NC type argument.

 

Good luck buddy... Your problem now.

 

This was a tough week and I was feeling down since mid week. Some feelings of guilt came back to me and hit me like a sledge hammer. I sought out a new therapist that specialized in personality disorders, relationships, and those that have suffered through them.

 

I was feeling very responsible for the break up of my family. I felt that I did not give a validating environment to my Ex ever and that it contributed to her resentment towards me eventually destroying everything. The therapist was able to correct that train of thought and showed me that it wasn't always like this. There was a time when I did give a validating environment. I could not have sustained this forever. The actions that I had done after the validation failed were invalidating, but it received the desired results. This was increased each time to obtain the same results and eventually failed to work. This is when I withdrew and became isolated. This was the beginning of the end.

 

This therapist opened me up raw with the first visit and it impacted me for a couple days. It hurt a lot and gave me new insight and perspective. It was powerful.

 

I felt that I can pay penance for what I failed to understand in the past. Not in terms of gaining support for her to come back. Just to make myself heal. I can be nice, but still set boundaries. I can send nice updates about the children, but still make the point we are not friends.

 

This is the first weekend she's been truly all alone. I knew she was going to be going insane being alone. So I sent some pictures of the children having a blast. Told her that I know she worries about the children and they are safe and having fun. She appreciated it and told me so. I didn't respond back, but felt good for taking the high road. I don't hate her. I have many other feelings from sorrow to contempt, but not hate. I don't entirely forgive her either.

 

I won't be sharing pictures and such when they are with me much though moving forward. I want her to understand what it means to be a single mother on her own. She still acts like this is one big movie and every move she makes is going to get her a thumbs up on Facebook so she will be the coolest. Reality is her life is **** and my life isn't. I'm making a conscious effort for it not to be.

 

My children are doing as well as they can for such madness. I see them more now than when they lived here. They are with me more than what the court ordered visitations were agreed upon and that is perfectly fine with me. My baby has taken first steps and will be walking soon. My eldest fights bitterly with her mother and is tired of being the responsible one in their relationship. My middle child is finding her way and I am guiding her as best as I can. Critical time for childhood development on both ends of the spectrum.

 

I've been on some dates with other women, but haven't felt anything for them. Very odd to me actually. I had very deep love and admiration for my Ex. I don't even have a flutter of feeling for the women I've dated. I hope I will feel something soon. I want that connection again. I want to feel the rope of love between my soul and another woman. To feel her presence when she is in my home. To feel her laughter and strength.

 

There are times in the day that I have what I call moments of clarity. I feel normal and like none of this every happened. I hope this feeling comes to stay soon.

 

Thank you for reading.

[Downtown]

DSP, thanks so much for returning to give us another update. I'm so glad to hear that you've made it out of the dark tunnel and into the sunlight. If you are like me, you must feel very relieved to have the divorce behind you now. When I emerged from it, I felt like the clouds had parted to reveal the sun.

 

At the divorce, the attorneys decided to proceed with the case under my exW's petition for divorce (actually, we both had filed for D). Hence, even thought the D case was proceeding under her petition for D, she tried to portray herself as "The Victim" right up till the last moment. Specifically, when the judge asked whether she wanted the divorce, my exW said "No, your honor, I really don't want a divorce." The judge simply rolled her eyes and proceeded to grant the D. The judge knew, of course, that this woman had kept me out of my own home for 18 months on a R/O and had shown no desire to salvage the marriage.

[Movingforward2]

DSP,

 

Been a minute, but I find your story inspiring. My counselor recommends journaling, but I find this site much more helpful. Your story is much like mine.....utter confusion, your family over, etc. It's hard to believe. But like you, I'm being the best father I can be and focusing on improving myself. I'm interested in women, but not to the point I want to be in a relationship at all. I respect you for your posts and find a lot of common ground in them.

 

Going NC is something I'm working towards. Hopefully in 2015 I can keep making progress.

[DSP]

DT I was going to actually send you a PM or something and talk to you. I was actually wondering if my Ex was coming around and was going to ask you for some advice. I was wrong.

 

MF2 yeah no contact works if you can do it. We have children so every couple days I have to deal with the drama.

 

Last couple of days were going smooth. I thought maybe the Ex was coming around. It looked like she was coming down and starting to get depressed. The downside of Bi Polar mania. Being that she has never been diagnosed I do not know what the heck is wrong with her, but after talking with other women, educating myself and therapy I know she has some mood disorder.

 

She stopped dressing my children in raggedy clothes and started to actually talk to me and be cordial. I was thinking maybe she would be in a state to actually approach me and talk. I was hoping she would be open to therapy or anything. Maybe the therapist could talk her into some medication. Stupid stupid me. I'm so angry at myself for getting my hopes up. I just don't want this to be. I don't want it for my children. We were happy at one time.

 

Tonight everything was burned down to the ground again.

 

I can't even cry. My heart hurts, but I just sit her and shake my head. No tears are coming. I tried just to get the hurt away. I can't tell if my heart hurts or if it is so scarred that it's the pain of the scar ripping open.

 

I receive a mis text from her that was meant for the OM. It wasn't sexual, but involved my middle child. I responded "why would you send me that?" Of course she blamed our 4 year old for sending it. Unreal.

 

By the end of it I had her daughter hate texting me, the ex coming over after I told her not to so my eldest could get something and involving all of our children in the mess.

 

I looked at her and asked what are you going to do when OM ditches you and you have nothing? You threw away your family and all of this for what?

 

She said "I didn't throw away my family. I threw you away."

 

That ****ing hurt. That hurt just like it was supposed to. That hurt more than you can imagine. It hurt so much I just felt numb.

 

I walked away. My little children in the car, my eldest getting into the car all of it a nightmare. I turned around and blew kisses and smiled to my babies and told them I loved them.

 

I don't know why I keep thinking maybe; just maybe she will get better. She isn't. She has been like this for as long as I can remember. I simply will never understand why this woman hates me so much. Why she has such an undying resentment towards me. Even from everything I've read it just does not make sense.

 

I just have to walk away.

[Downtown]

I don't know why I keep thinking maybe; just maybe she will get better. She isn't.

Like smokers who are "always quitting," BPDers and other unstable people may be seen to dramatically improve their behavior every several weeks. Because we love them so much, we badly want to believe that it may be a real and lasting improvement. It is very difficult to see the real truth: that we are simply seeing the momentary upswing of an unending roller coaster ride. That's the way emotionally unstable people behave unless they've worked very hard in therapy.

[DSP]

I just want to share this, because I'm alone and I have nobody to talk to.

 

15 years ago I was so poor. I lived in a house with no heat. I got fired from my job at the factory and I was just surviving. I met my ex and she got pregnant. I didn't even have a checking or savings account.

 

I worked hard from the day I found out she was pregnant to this very day for a better life.

 

I got another job at a factory and worked it for as much as I could for a couple years. I bought a trailer for us all to live in and got us all out of that house. I took care of all of us as best as I could. I had no idea what I was doing. I had no guidance.

 

I lost the job at the factory and had another in a day or two. I worked that for years as well. It was hell. I worked sometimes in over 100 degree heat and over 100 percent humidity. I remember one year I worked 72 hours a week for 90 days and took 1 day off and worked another 72 hours a week for another 90 days. I woke up went to work came home ate slept and did it again for months. We needed a new TV, our cars fixed, and I wanted our children to have the best Christmas ever.

 

One day I said I could spend this many hours in college and get a doctorates degree. So I found another job in a warehouse and enrolled in night classes.

 

I created a budget on a spread sheet when I was learning how to use Excel. I found out that I had exactly 1 dollar each month to spend. That was it. I was never turning back.

 

I worked 50 hours a week at the warehouse job and spent another 20 hours a week in class. I graduated with honors.

 

I got a job in a computer shop and rolled that into an even better job. I continued to study for certifications and then started my own company. I worked so hard at that. All for my family. All for us. You went to school and I supported us as best as I could.

 

Remember when I worked 16 hours that one day and slept in the car to work another 16 hours the next day? I did that for us.

 

Remember when I started crying because I couldn't figure out that problem? I looked at you and said "My head is breaking honey.... Why can't I figure this out. I don't know why. You just held me. I cried with my head in your arms.

 

You held me and said "It's OK you'll figure it out. You're the smartest man I know. You always do."

 

I can hear your voice saying that in my head right now. I can feel your warmth on my ears.

 

We moved from the run down trailer to a beautiful home. You would look at our home and say "I love our house. It is so pretty to look at. I love coming around the corner and seeing it." You loved me at one time. You were my everything. I did all of this for us. I wanted to grow old and die with you.

 

All those days of being poor and having nothing. No money. No time. Nothing. Just you and me playing Play Station at night and laughing with each other. Checking on the baby to make sure she was OK.

 

Remember when I called you on the phone and told you I bought that Playstation? You said "Why you can't afford that right now?" I said "I know, but I bought another controller so you can play with me. Can you come over?" I didn't have food or heat but I had a damn Playstation. I just wanted you next to me.

 

I got the offer to work for a large corporation. To be part of something big. I went for it. I had no idea what I was doing I just knew it was going to help our family. No more being poor. This was the big time.

 

Yesterday I had a meeting with some of the smartest people I've ever worked with. They are part of the largest corporations in the world. I read their books. I look up to them. I admire them. We were all talking about a problem and I offered a solution that I had thought about. They agreed my solution would work. I was so happy. I worked so hard to get here. If they only knew what I've done to get here.

 

I'm not special there are many others in this world who have done the same or more.

 

I just wanted to call you. I had nobody to share it with. All the hard work. All those hours staring into a book or screen.

 

I was all alone again.

 

I would have called you on the way home. I would have told you in my excited way about what had happened. I would have been so happy. Come home hug my babies, kiss you and smile. Instead I came home to nothing.

 

Nobody will ever understand what we went through to get here. Only you and me. It took everything just to get this far. It literally took away everything from me to get this far.

[DSP]

Like smokers who are "always quitting," BPDers and other unstable people may be seen to dramatically improve their behavior every several weeks. Because we love them so much, we badly want to believe that it may be a real and lasting improvement. It is very difficult to see the real truth: that we are simply seeing the momentary upswing of an unending roller coaster ride. That's the way emotionally unstable people behave unless they've worked very hard in therapy.

 

I read this many times DT.

 

Thank you. Seriously thanks.

 

I think this was the last straw. It is never going to get better and I have to stop thinking we will all play nice.

 

"we are simply seeing the momentary upswing of an unending roller coaster ride."

 

It's been this way for as long as I can remember... Every single time something happens I learn something new. I never knew people could be this way.

[DSP]

I said to her...

 

"I thought maybe you were coming around. That maybe we could talk about some things."

 

She said.. "We can talk anytime."

 

This is a trap.

 

She will not communicate with me via email. Doesn't like to talk to me via text. She will talk to me though face to face forever. She will talk in circles until I lose my cool, shut down and walk away. She doesn't hear what you say. She is only thinking of things to say.

 

I like to communicate via email. I can edit my thoughts and speak properly. I listen to what someone says and respond appropriately to what I hear.

 

I cannot think as fast as her. I don't manipulate.

 

Son of a gun...

 

I see it now.

[DSP]

• 1. Black-white thinking, wherein she categorizes everyone as "all good" or "all bad" and will recategorize someone -- in just a few seconds -- from one polar extreme to the other based on a minor comment or infraction; - Watching the flip flop now. Thought I was painted black then white. I know I'm back to black now.
  

 

 

• 2. Frequent use of all-or-nothing expressions like "you always" and "you never;" - I do this more than she
  

 

 

 

• 3. Irrational jealousy and controlling behavior that tries to isolate you away from close friends or family members; - Irrational jealousy yes. I seen this visibly on her face twice when I played with our children. Last time was purely accidental and I watched her change from a hatred look to a look of happiness when she seen me looking at her.
  

 

 

 

• 4. A strong sense of entitlement that prevents her from appreciating your sacrifices, resulting in a "what have you done for me lately?" attitude (e.g., not appreciating all the 3-hour trips you made to see her for two years) and a double standard ; - Lately yes, but not always.
  

 

 

 

• 5. Flipping, on a dime, between adoring you and devaluing you -- making you feel like you're always walking on eggshells; - I think she's always hated me.
  

 

 

 

• 6. Frequently creating drama over issues so minor that neither of you can recall what the fight was about two days later; - No
  

 

 

 

• 7. Low self esteem; - Lower than the bottom of my shoe.
  

 

 

 

• 8. Verbal abuse and anger that is easily triggered, in seconds, by a minor thing you say or do (real or imagined), resulting in temper tantrums or cold sulking that typically start in seconds and last several hours; - No just always sulking or tired.
  

 

 

 

• 9. Fear of abandonment or being alone -- evident in her expecting you to “be there” for her on demand, making unrealistic demands for the amount of time spent together, or responding with intense anger to even brief separations or slight changes in plans; - Not always, but their was always someone around. Now that she is alone when I have the children. Yes
  

 

 

 

• 10. Always being "The Victim," a false self image she validates by blaming you for every misfortune; - Yes. I've even said years ago I am not to blame for everything bad that has ever happened in your life.
  

 

 

 

 

 

• 11. Lack of impulse control, wherein she does reckless things without considering the consequences (e.g., binge eating or spending); - No
  

 

 

 

• 12. Complaining that all her previous BFs were abusive and claiming (during your courtship) that you are the only one who has treated her well; - Yes and I hear reports that she is telling people the same about me.
  

 

 

 

• 13. Mirroring your personality and preferences so perfectly during the courtship period (e.g., enjoying everything and everyone you like) that you were convinced you had met your "soul mate;" - Watching her do it now with the OM. This is what lead me to BPD.
  

 

 

 

• 14. Relying on you to center and ground her, giving her a sense of direction because her goals otherwise keep changing every few months; - I was the direction. I made any long term plans or planned any type of trip. (Except the last one)
  

 

 

 

• 15. Relying on you to sooth her and calm her down, when she is stressed, because she has so little ability to do self soothing; - In the beginning, but eventually refused since it was too exhausting.
  

 

 

 

• 16. Having many casual friends but not any close long-term friends - Only long term friends she has are her cousins and they don't visit.
  

 

 

 

• 17. Taking on the personality of whatever person she is talking to, thereby acting quite differently around different types of people; - Yes seen this many times. Paid close attention and watched the change happen as I predicted.
  

 

 

 

• 18. Always convinced that her intense feelings accurately reflect reality -- to the point that she regards her own feelings as self-evident facts, despite her inability to support them with any hard evidence. - Yes. Many arguments that only Google could solve.
  

[DSP]

So roughly a week after mis text melt down 2015 here I am.

 

I feel kind of sad as I miss my little ones. My eldest is angry because she was dragged into the middle of our argument by her mother. Her daughter jumped into the fray and I kindly stonewalled her. Little did I know that her father then caught all of her anger that was supposed to be for me.

 

I woke up the next morning and made it very clear. The ex will blocked from texting. Email communication and VM only. Her daughters father contacted me and we talked for a couple hours. He was ready to write off his daughter and I helped him understand her volatility and what I've gone through the last 15 years with the both of them. He had a new found respect for me and told me so. He never knew it was as bad as it was and he never really knew the real reason I stayed with her for so long.

 

That gave me some confidence back and I stayed home alone all weekend by myself. Just to see how it would feel. I had a couple people want me to come out, but I really didn't want to. It felt kind of good. Not as lonely as before. House wasn't as empty as it used to feel.

 

Three days later the ex tried to text me through our eldests phone and I had to direct her to email again. There she tried to bait me into an argument about our eldest. Looked over the court order and directed her to the paragraph and lines that had to be followed. If it is not I will file charges that day. Period.

 

She did not like the new boundaries that is for sure. Later that night I sent an email that went something like this...

 

I didn't apreciate the drama that unfolded last week or the fact you drew the children into our arguments. Your lack of empathy is disturbing. I am over this and it's time we move on. Either we can be adults and learn the new boundaries of our relationship or we can stew in this toxic mess like we did before you left.

 

I am moving on. I just want to be happy and I don't need any excess drama. The emailing will continue until I feel we are civil to each other again. We have apps on our phones that alert us just as fast as texts, but will eliminate any mis texts or problems that may come from it. You can leave a voice mail any time.

 

After picking up the little ones it is clear that now I am painted black as night with her. It is over. No more lingering what ifs. No more kind of sort ofs. Nothing. Strickly business now. Give me my kids and I'm out of here. She seems to have laid down the line too. Brick wall right back at me and at this moment I couldn't be happier.

 

I also learned that my eldest is not reliable when it comes to all things school so I cut out the middle men and go right to the teachers now via email. It's just another avenue I can shut down.

 

I should have done this long ago and stop feeling so damn sorry for her. The guilt I was feeling two Fridays ago tripped me up something bad. I'm over that now. I'm starting to see she was more of a problem or another child than my better half. Like she never grew up to have adult feelings or thoughts and if she did she never shared them with me. The future always seemed like a distant thought to her like it was never going to come around. I'm starting to talk to other women that are her age or older and none of them act like that. They all have plans or goals or something. They don't just float around with no ambition. When I tell them some things they are as confused as I am with her decisions in life.

 

Three times now today I felt the awakening. I knew it too. I kept hoping it was going to stay. Saying in my head "be here to stay.. be here now" I need more of this. I am so ready to move on from this.

 

Do I feel like great? No. Am I happy that I'm feeling better? Kind of. Am I still sad my family is destroyed? Yes. I still feel sad, but I'm doing the best I can.

 

Therapy in two days and I get my children for Super Bowl Sunday. We will be cooking food for sure.

[Downtown]

It is over. No more lingering what ifs. No more kind of sort ofs. Nothing. Strickly business now. Give me my kids and I'm out of here.

DSP, I'm glad to hear that things are crystallizing for you and you now see the way forward.

I get my children for Super Bowl Sunday. We will be cooking food for sure.

Have a great Sunday with your children! Lord knows that you and the kids deserve it.

[toolforgrowth]

So roughly a week after mis text melt down 2015 here I am.

 

I feel kind of sad as I miss my little ones. My eldest is angry because she was dragged into the middle of our argument by her mother. Her daughter jumped into the fray and I kindly stonewalled her. Little did I know that her father then caught all of her anger that was supposed to be for me.

 

I woke up the next morning and made it very clear. The ex will blocked from texting. Email communication and VM only. Her daughters father contacted me and we talked for a couple hours. He was ready to write off his daughter and I helped him understand her volatility and what I've gone through the last 15 years with the both of them. He had a new found respect for me and told me so. He never knew it was as bad as it was and he never really knew the real reason I stayed with her for so long.

 

That gave me some confidence back and I stayed home alone all weekend by myself. Just to see how it would feel. I had a couple people want me to come out, but I really didn't want to. It felt kind of good. Not as lonely as before. House wasn't as empty as it used to feel.

 

Three days later the ex tried to text me through our eldests phone and I had to direct her to email again. There she tried to bait me into an argument about our eldest. Looked over the court order and directed her to the paragraph and lines that had to be followed. If it is not I will file charges that day. Period.

 

She did not like the new boundaries that is for sure. Later that night I sent an email that went something like this...

 

I didn't apreciate the drama that unfolded last week or the fact you drew the children into our arguments. Your lack of empathy is disturbing. I am over this and it's time we move on. Either we can be adults and learn the new boundaries of our relationship or we can stew in this toxic mess like we did before you left.

 

I am moving on. I just want to be happy and I don't need any excess drama. The emailing will continue until I feel we are civil to each other again. We have apps on our phones that alert us just as fast as texts, but will eliminate any mis texts or problems that may come from it. You can leave a voice mail any time.

 

After picking up the little ones it is clear that now I am painted black as night with her. It is over. No more lingering what ifs. No more kind of sort ofs. Nothing. Strickly business now. Give me my kids and I'm out of here. She seems to have laid down the line too. Brick wall right back at me and at this moment I couldn't be happier.

 

I also learned that my eldest is not reliable when it comes to all things school so I cut out the middle men and go right to the teachers now via email. It's just another avenue I can shut down.

 

I should have done this long ago and stop feeling so damn sorry for her. The guilt I was feeling two Fridays ago tripped me up something bad. I'm over that now. I'm starting to see she was more of a problem or another child than my better half. Like she never grew up to have adult feelings or thoughts and if she did she never shared them with me. The future always seemed like a distant thought to her like it was never going to come around. I'm starting to talk to other women that are her age or older and none of them act like that. They all have plans or goals or something. They don't just float around with no ambition. When I tell them some things they are as confused as I am with her decisions in life.

 

Three times now today I felt the awakening. I knew it too. I kept hoping it was going to stay. Saying in my head "be here to stay.. be here now" I need more of this. I am so ready to move on from this.

 

Do I feel like great? No. Am I happy that I'm feeling better? Kind of. Am I still sad my family is destroyed? Yes. I still feel sad, but I'm doing the best I can.

 

Therapy in two days and I get my children for Super Bowl Sunday. We will be cooking food for sure.

 

This was pretty epic. You've had your "a-ha" moment; it's that wonderful moment when you finally see how the pattern of your behavior, her behavior, and the cards life dealt you all led to where you are now. And how you can finally see the dysfunction and mental illness in it's full glory; her manipulative and entitled personality, and your co-dependency and low self-esteem. It was a powder keg just waiting to go off.

 

Coming to that realization doesn't suddenly make you happy, or make the loss of your family any less painful. But for me, it did provide a sense of peace...knowing that this is what was best for me, for my ex-wife, and for my child. Short term pain, long term gain. It's so easy to wallow in the now, and much harder to look down the road, when you're going through something like this. But having the a-ha moment really helps shift your focus.

 

This is just the beginning. Eventually, the awakening will always stay with you...it'll just become a part of your life. Part of the way you think. You've begun the process of detaching by letting yourself go, which is the hardest thing co-dependents have to do. I've been there, and it was haaaaard. lol But it's so liberating once you finally do that. The world becomes your oyster. Which I can have, now that I'm no longer with a woman who hates seafood.

 

Keep that brick wall up. I guarantee you she's watching you, just waiting for you to crack. Mine did. But I didn't, I stuck to my guns and divorced her and moved on and kicked her as far out of my life as I literally possibly can. And I knew she hated it, she'd put pictures of our wedding in our daughter's backpack for me to see, she'd act all sad whenever she had to come to my door, hell she had a minor tantrum when I had my own conference with our daughter's teacher. In other words, she's still as mentally ill as ever...hasn't made any changes at all. It's honestly sounding like yours is going to do the same thing. Keeping that wall up and getting her as far out of your life as you can is the best thing you can do for yourself.

 

Keep it up, and have a (insert alcoholic beverage of your choice) on me.

Edited January 29, 2015 by toolforgrowth
fixed typos

[DSP]

Thank you DT and TFG

 

Downtown I remember one time you stated that these type of relationships with a disordered person are either very short or very long generally around the 15 year mark. You had no solid evidence, but just through observation. I too have noticed this pattern from what I have researched. Countless stories of My wife/husband of 15 years just left what do I do? You start to read through the stories and see a pattern. They never end well either. You never read a story about someone staying with a partner who has bipolar, BPD, or NPD and it turning out for the better. It is always a struggle. There is always one person taking care of another. I've seen stories where professional care givers get taken under and had been caring for the person for decades.

 

My head is getting clearer and I'm starting to see things from our past in a different light. I'm beginning to realize I've been fighting madness for a long time. Speaking with her daughters father and seeing him look at me with amazement because I stuck around for so long really made me think. Was I really that messed up or was our relationship. The only change I could see throughout the years was either me accepting it and moving onto something else or avoiding the conflict by staying away and preoccupying myself with other things. I always wondered if this was how life was. The relationship with your spouse as always a struggle until one day they decide they want to be on your team.

 

The words she spoke to me last week and the drama that ensued afterwards was the last straw for me. I clearly understood that day that any validating environment I may offer isn't going to fix anything at all. I will just get walked all over even more.

 

I'm not perfect by any means. I dealt with our arguments incorrectly more times than not. It just helps me see I'm not crazy and not a bad person when other people are seeing what I've not for a long time and telling me so. My lifting partner even commented on it by saying "It's like you're arguing with a teenager all the time. You guys are divorced... Here's your things and here are mine. Lets move along.."

 

Honestly if it wasn't for the manic episode I watched unfold I don't think I would have gotten this far in evaluating what went wrong or myself. I would have just carried anger for being cheated on and been miserable for a long time. I could have just as easily came to the conclusion that we are simply different people who cannot get along. As painful as this is... This way was the best way.

 

The process has matured me in a way I don't think would have otherwise happened. I had to take a hard long look at myself and my patterns of behavior and my interactions with others. Truly focus on being a better man and father. That in turn will hopefully make me a better partner.

 

I still have a way to go, but I'm making progress.

[DSP]

You've had your "a-ha" moment; it's that wonderful moment when you finally see how the pattern of your behavior, her behavior, and the cards life dealt you all led to where you are now. And how you can finally see the dysfunction and mental illness in it's full glory; her manipulative and entitled personality, and your co-dependency and low self-esteem.

 

I think I have honestly. As painful as all of this has been I think it was going to the new a new therapist that opened up this road. What she said to me in the first 10 minutes of our session tore me open and bothered me for days.

 

What she said combined with me trying to create a validating environment only to get slammed twice as hard and cut twice as deep changed me. Combine this with some anger and ability to gather a birds eye view of the situation allowed me to begin to see this dysfunction and the overall destruction it is creating.

 

 

 

But having the a-ha moment really helps shift your focus.

 

This did shift my focus in a couple ways.

 

Either by luck or design when I cut it down to emails and seen I was being baited everything started to become clear. I'm working with someone who is emotionally stunted. Everything I've read is true. Everything I've seen is true. I cannot fix this. I can read on this disorder until I become the foremost expert in the field or I can accept that she will never change until she sees it for herself and puts forth the effort. Protect the children. Protect myself.

 

Keep that brick wall up. I guarantee you she's watching you, just waiting for you to crack.

 

She'd act all sad whenever she had to come to my door...

 

I feel it as well. I know she is watching and waiting. The first test was the baiting in the email. The second one will be coming soon as we have a school function to attend this weekend. I don't even feel anxious anymore. I feel empowered with knowledge. Can't wait until she tries to sit next to me like she did at Christmas. I won't leave this time I'll ask her to sit elsewhere.

 

As far as the act. Yup I got that too. She dropped off the little ones two days ago and it was a sad dramatic scene all the way around. Drop the little ones off and leave... Sheesh.

 

I can't wait until the baby can start walking so I don't have to accidentally touch her when she is handed over. That's an angry statement, but that is how I feel. I know I'll be one step closer to removing myself from anything that she may be needed for even if its something as little as that.

 

Think I'm going to buy a co dependency book this weekend for self study. Any suggestions for anyone reading this saga would be appreciated.