Ladyjane14 Posted January 13, 2005 Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog 200 posts on this thread. I'm thinking that isn't something to be proud of is it? That just means you're a hard worker. I just have no idea how to stop the escalating anger on her part. Any suggestions? Call her on it. Call it what it is. "Your anger is inappropiate, and not at all conducive to a good parenting relationship. This was ultimately your decision. And I will NOT allow you to make your problems into my problems." The more serene you are, the better this will fly. Remind her that you were the one willing to get counseling, and having done so, you are now reaping the benefits of it by finding yourself feeling much better about the whole situation. It'll p*ss her off to no end when you suggest that she does the same, possibly to get her anger under control. Ahhhh....irony, ain't it grand? My daughter is doing much better now. Got a mega dose of antibiotics at the hospital and that kicked it pretty quick. I have her this weekend, so she will get her Daddy quality time. The question I have been biting my tongue on is this, How did she get pneumonia? What happened that she developed it? Glad to hear she's getting better. Pneumonia can be viral or bacterial. By definition it is an inflammation of the lungs due to infection. She could have gotten it anywhere.
Author Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Author Posted January 14, 2005 If only she was the type of person to take any kind of criticism Ladyjane. I have tried calling her on the anger. She just denies that she is angrier now then before. I am still the root of all her anger even though I am not there in her life to cause any such anger. It's really kind of pathetic.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 It's not criticism at that point. It's quiet observation of her obvious emotional outbursts, designed to make her feel stupid and out-of-control. The idea is to deflate her with your non-response to her stimulus. She can no longer affect you. That's gonna boil her beans! The side-benefit of course is that you will UTTERLY ENJOY watching her work herself up into a lather. But next time she'll remember how stupid she felt afterwards and hopefully exercise more self-control. It may take a few times, but eventually she'll learn that she's not going to get a rise out of you. It's all about serenity and confidence. (muahahahahahaha! )
Author Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Author Posted January 14, 2005 Why Ladyjane, is that an evil streak I am detecting in you? She hasn't gotten a rise out of me lately, and she won't get one again unless she tries to play games with our daughter. Then she will see the true definition of hell on earth. I talked with her this morning for a few minutes to check how my daughter is doing, she seemed a bit less bitter and confrontational. Maybe she is getting the hint.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog Why Ladyjane, is that an evil streak I am detecting in you? Who....me? Never. :lmao: She hasn't gotten a rise out of me lately, and she won't get one again unless she tries to play games with our daughter. Then she will see the true definition of hell on earth. I hope that means she'll finally get to meet your lawyer. Don't ever let her see you mad. She's not your friend, and she'll use any outburst that she witnesses to keep your child from you. I talked with her this morning for a few minutes to check how my daughter is doing, she seemed a bit less bitter and confrontational. Maybe she is getting the hint. I wouldn't count on it. She's going to see-saw back and forth. She's made a mistake and she's still evading responsibility for it. Until she accepts the situation and her part in it, she's loose cannon. p.s. I read the 'ugly girl' drama. WWIU is right about confidence. It's self-confidence that stands out and helps the "jerks" score. It's self-confidence that makes the 'table-top drunk girl with puke in her hair' stand out. But all things considered......Ewwwwwww! Be confident in yourself..... And go to the places that women with similar interests frequent. If you like books, drink your coffee every morning in the bookstore cafe. If you want an athletic girl, join a co-ed gym, and go every day. If you want a snow-bunny, take as many ski trips as you can afford. Some of that is about exposure in the same locations with great frequency. Eat in the same restaurants, drink in the same bars. You become familiar with people, and they become familiar with you. But always carry yourself confidently, and talk...talk...talk wherever you go. How'd you meet STBX, btw?
Author Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Author Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Ladyjane14 p.s. I read the 'ugly girl' drama. WWIU is right about confidence. It's self-confidence that stands out and helps the "jerks" score. It's self-confidence that makes the 'table-top drunk girl with puke in her hair' stand out. But all things considered......Ewwwwwww! Be confident in yourself..... And go to the places that women with similar interests frequent. If you like books, drink your coffee every morning in the bookstore cafe. If you want an athletic girl, join a co-ed gym, and go every day. If you want a snow-bunny, take as many ski trips as you can afford. Some of that is about exposure in the same locations with great frequency. Eat in the same restaurants, drink in the same bars. You become familiar with people, and they become familiar with you. But always carry yourself confidently, and talk...talk...talk wherever you go. How'd you meet STBX, btw? Hey, I am having some fun with that drama as you call it. I haven't even begun to play games if moimeme hasn't had enough yet. But yeah, I know the self confidence is a big thing. I have been rebuilding it after my wife did everything to crush my "arrogance" as she called it. STBX and I met because her sister married a friend of mine from High School. She had broken up with her last boyfriend a few weeks ago and her sister felt it would do her some good to get out. So she tagged along with them and me and some other friends of mine. And she asked me out. Funny huh? She wanted me in the begining and in the end she tossed me aside.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog Hey, I am having some fun with that drama as you call it. I haven't even begun to play games if moimeme hasn't had enough yet. You need a kick in your seat! My money's on Moi, btw. :lmao: Funny huh? She wanted me in the begining and in the end she tossed me aside. And still doesn't know what she wants. True to form, I suppose.
Author Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Author Posted January 14, 2005 Betting on Moi? Is this some kind of woman solidarity thing or something? I might take that bet. One of my favortie sayings "The tongue is the only edged weapon that gets sharper with use" Yeah, story of her life I guess. Not knowing what she wants and never realizing what she had.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Yup. And go to the places that women with similar interests frequent. If you like books, drink your coffee every morning in the bookstore cafe. If you want an athletic girl, join a co-ed gym, and go every day. If you want a snow-bunny, take as many ski trips as you can afford. Some of that is about exposure in the same locations with great frequency. Eat in the same restaurants, drink in the same bars. You become familiar with people, and they become familiar with you. But always carry yourself confidently, and talk...talk...talk wherever you go. And I'm still waiting to hear what you think of these ideas for meeting women. (????) What's your plan? It's' not imperative that you jump right into the dating scene, btw. But I think it could be beneficial to lay the groundwork for it, by getting out and meeting new people. You know, get that arrogance built back up.
Author Devildog Posted January 15, 2005 Author Posted January 15, 2005 Those are good ideas, but not so feasible around where I live. Small town area, no coffee houses, bookstores, plenty of bars though. Unfortunately, I don't really drink much. And drunk people tend to annoy me when they get stupid drunk. I'm still getting back into doing some of the things I want to do. Things will go from there I guess.
Author Devildog Posted January 19, 2005 Author Posted January 19, 2005 I had a surprise visitor this afternoon. My oldest friend stopped by. I haven't talked to him in 9 months probably. This is a guy I have known literally my entire life. We are distant relatives, but our parents have been good friends for a very long time, and we are 6 months apart in age, so I have known him since the day I was born. This is a guy who had always been there for me, was always the guy who met me at the airport when I came home on leave. We learned how to hunt together and spent summers out in the woods my family owns growing up. When my wife and I started getting serious we drifted apart, eventually getting to the point where we only talked once or twice a year. And he lives a mile away from me. My wife and I got into an arguement a few months ago and she told me that my friend and another close friend didn't want anything to do with me anymore and it was NOT because of her. I started to believe that since I hadn't talked to him since before the separation and I live right next door to his parents now. He told me it was never me, that he and this other friend couldn't stand my STBXW. They felt she was a bossy, controlling, b!tchy and was always looking for sympathy for any reason. We sat and talked for about 1 1/2 hours catching up. It was good for me. My social circle had diminished to nothing during my marriage, and having someone outside my family to talk and hang out with opens up more avenues for me to meet other people and move on with my life.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 19, 2005 Posted January 19, 2005 That's fabulous!!! I've learned over the years to value old friends. My husband had a friend from many years ago that he 'drifted apart' from. I do hope that it's because of me, 'cause that guy was an A$$!!! (j/k) His other old friend of many years, I treat like a member of the family. Not because I always agree with him, but because he's a truly good friend to my sweetie. Hopefully, you'll start getting out a little bit. It'll make you feel like a million bucks to have a social network again. You sound better already.
Author Devildog Posted January 19, 2005 Author Posted January 19, 2005 Originally posted by Ladyjane14 Hopefully, you'll start getting out a little bit. It'll make you feel like a million bucks to have a social network again. You sound better already. I am getting better and stronger every day now Ladyjane. Each day is brighter for me now. I have always considered myself fortunate to have him as a friend. Well, mostly fortunate anyway. He is a very likable guy and I don't know of anyone that has ever had anything bad to say about him. He knows alot of people and everyone likes him. The drawback is the guy can have any woman he wants. He doesn't realize it, but women would get into catfights if he were available. He is actually very shy when it comes to women though and doesn't have the confidence with women he has in every other aspect of his life. Now, I'm not hard on the eyes, but it is hard to get noticed when your friends leave women drooling. Maybe that is what I need, uglier friends. The group we used to hang out with more when I came home on leave and first got out of the Marine Corps, there was about 6 of us, and I was number 5 on the list of physical attractiveness.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 26, 2005 Posted January 26, 2005 How is everything going? Haven't heard an update from you in a while.
Author Devildog Posted January 26, 2005 Author Posted January 26, 2005 Things are..... complicated I guess is a good word. Monday would have been my daughter's first birthday. Emotional time for sure. She called me to see how I was doing, then accussed me of not thinking of her or seeing how she was doing. I explained that I didn't want to do anything while she was at work like that. And that if she believed that I hadn't thought of her then not to bother stopping by her grandparent's house who I had left a rose with for her. ( Didn't want to leave it out in the wind and cold). A couple of seconds of silence, and then "You should have left the rose for our daughter at the cemetary." I told her I left a rose out there as well. A few more seconds of silence, followed by "Why couldn't you have done those kind of things last year. I bit my tongue and didn't point out the countless little things I did on a daily basis to show her I loved her that she ignored or took for granted. I just didn't say anything. I think she is at the point she wants to try and reconcile, but her stubborness and her pride won't let her ask me back. And if I asked to try to work things out, I lose. I have less to bargain with and the changes I need from her become non-negotiable. So I have to wait for her to swallow her pride if there is any chance of salvaging anything. And I still don't know if things can be salvaged at this point. If it was just me and her, yeah, probably could. But her parents would not be able to step back out of our daily lives and controlling everything. And I have lost pretty much ever last ounce of respect for her parents after the way they treated me throughout this situation. The horrible things they said to me and about me. Bottom line is she has to make the first move now. She has to be willing to make some sacrifices and make some changes for me to consider it. Time will tell what happens. I don't have much hope though.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 26, 2005 Posted January 26, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog Things are..... complicated I guess is a good word. Monday would have been my daughter's first birthday. Emotional time for sure. She called me to see how I was doing, then accussed me of not thinking of her or seeing how she was doing. I explained that I didn't want to do anything while she was at work like that. And that if she believed that I hadn't thought of her then not to bother stopping by her grandparent's house who I had left a rose with for her. ( Didn't want to leave it out in the wind and cold). A couple of seconds of silence, and then "You should have left the rose for our daughter at the cemetary." I told her I left a rose out there as well. A few more seconds of silence, followed by "Why couldn't you have done those kind of things last year. I bit my tongue and didn't point out the countless little things I did on a daily basis to show her I loved her that she ignored or took for granted. I just didn't say anything. That was a difficult situation. And once again, I'm sorry for your loss. But you really handled the interaction with your wife sooooooo well. Pat yourself on the back! It leaves her wondering and curious when you don't rise to the occasion as far as arguements are concerned. Maybe she'll start wondering if there's something positive to be had in getting counceling afterall. I think she's definately showing that she's still emotionally connected to you. This is demanding behavior that you wouldn't expect from someone who had severed her ties. I think she is at the point she wants to try and reconcile, but her stubborness and her pride won't let her ask me back. And if I asked to try to work things out, I lose. I have less to bargain with and the changes I need from her become non-negotiable. So I have to wait for her to swallow her pride if there is any chance of salvaging anything. I think you are absolutely correct about this. You would need concessions from her in a reconciliation, and she's unlikely to comply if she's in the driver's seat. And I still don't know if things can be salvaged at this point. If it was just me and her, yeah, probably could. But her parents would not be able to step back out of our daily lives and controlling everything. And I have lost pretty much ever last ounce of respect for her parents after the way they treated me throughout this situation. The horrible things they said to me and about me. I'm really less concerned over time about her wanting to reconcile than I am about your ability to still want to. I've always thought it was just a matter of time as far as she's concerned, but you've been taking on damage in the interim. As far as the parents go, they are non-entities in this decision. That's not something you want to expend energy on at this time. Hang in there.
debilou Posted January 26, 2005 Posted January 26, 2005 Devildog, I'm so happy hearing your good news. Sounds like things are really turning around for you. It gives me hope with my situation. Ofcourse I agree with everything Ladyjane says!! If your wife didn't feel connected to you she would have never called to complain. I know where you're at~I'm about two steps behind you. I've pretty much given up on my H. I can't keep trying to have a marriage by myself. He's extremely angry with me~and I have no idea why. Keep us posted. I know things can change in a flash. Debilou
Author Devildog Posted January 27, 2005 Author Posted January 27, 2005 Originally posted by Ladyjane14 As far as the parents go, they are non-entities in this decision. That's not something you want to expend energy on at this time. Hang in there. Unfortunately my wife seems to have a steel belted umbilical cord still attached to her parents. And they will whine and complain and make things miserable for her if they get pushed back to where they should be in our relationship. I don't think my wife will be able to handle that from them.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 27, 2005 Posted January 27, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog Unfortunately my wife seems to have a steel belted umbilical cord still attached to her parents. "Steel belted umbilical cord." Too funny. I remember that you had a fairly close relationship with the in-law's. Have they said things to you directly, or are you getting this second-hand? Any chance of misinterpretations or miscommunications? At any rate, should your wife change her tune, it would follow that they will change theirs. At that time, you will be in a position to instruct them all on "how it's gonna be". You don't need to worry about this yet. That is, unless they interfere in your parenting relationship with your child. Should that situation arise, you would be doing right by your daughter to hash it out now. Are you getting a social life established?
Author Devildog Posted January 27, 2005 Author Posted January 27, 2005 Originally posted by Ladyjane14 I remember that you had a fairly close relationship with the in-law's. Have they said things to you directly, or are you getting this second-hand? Any chance of misinterpretations or miscommunications? Yes, her father called me on the phone because his siblings decided to talk to my wife. He called and threatened to have me arrested for stalking, called me every name in the book. Told me by not walking away from my marriage and letting my wife run off with another man I was not a man. Her mother sent a letter to all of his siblings saying I was a horrible husband and father and criticizing how I handled my grief over the loss of our daughter, even though I had no one to lean on because they made my family feel very unwelcome at the hospital and they were so far up my wife's butt I couldn't get anywhere near her. I was at fault because I didn't decide when to turn off life support, that I "made my wife do it." Yeah, like I didn't struggle with that decision for several days. I would have done anything to take that pain away from her, but if I had said to turn the machines off even 10 seconds before she was ready she never would have forgiven me. The letter was basically "poor us, feel sorry for us, don't think badly of our daughter cheating on her husband and running around with another man. And if you ever want to have a relationship with your brother you will forget it ever happened." They even tried to paint him as some sort of heroic saint, that their relationship was an "innocent, beautiful thing that everyone was twisting into something ugly." Starting to get a social life back as much as I can. I work nights so it isn't so easy.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 27, 2005 Posted January 27, 2005 I'll be honest...(like you EVER have to worry I might hold back on my opinion! )....I do see at least some room for misunderstanding. Keep in mind, that really the largest source of information that they have is your wife....who has/had an axe to grind. Your in-law's WILL follow her lead later on, you can bet on it. They're following it now. Are they aware that you know about these letters, btw? I don't see the value in hashing it all out right now, but if the in-law's make any further attempts to interfere, then I think I'd go ahead and lay all my cards out for them. People act weird in times of grief, like they did at the hospital. But you made the right call there, because the reasoning that you stated is the most valid. What you had to go through was hard enough without people reconstructing the history of it to suit themselves. If they want to go there let them, just don't allow them to drag you along. In the meantime, I hope that despite your weird schedule, you'll not get bogged down in daily routine. Call some friends and make plans for getting out of the house.
Author Devildog Posted January 27, 2005 Author Posted January 27, 2005 I agree that they are getting a biased interpretation of things from my wife. And up until we actually seperated they did side with me in the feeling that what she was doing was inappropriate and wrong. But the turn they took, they didn't just stab me in the back, they took an axe to me. [sarcasm]But they will tell you they are wonderful parents and human beings. They are soooo wise and have all the answers. And they have never had to apologize for anything. [/sarcasm].
Author Devildog Posted January 28, 2005 Author Posted January 28, 2005 Funny story. Setting wasn't pleasant though. My friend that I mentioned a few posts back, his Grandmother died a few days ago. I went to the funeral home and talked with him for a bit tonight. He told me he ran into my wife at a major discount retail store everyone knows. She asked if she was still going to get an invitation to his wedding in June. His reply was he didn't know, he would have to aske me and see what I thought about it. She just turned around and walked away. It's funny, she doesn't get it. She can't comprehend why my family, my friends, and friends of my family don't appreciate, support and side with her over this situation. What is so hard to understand about it? How does she convince herself that people who have been my friends for years before I ever met her, only tolerated me for her sake? So they could hang out with her? Totally warped sense of reality.
Ladyjane14 Posted January 28, 2005 Posted January 28, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog She can't comprehend why my family, my friends, and friends of my family don't appreciate, support and side with her over this situation. Totally warped sense of reality. That's kind of sad really. She just doesn't get it, because she still thinks she was right to do what she did. She's lying to herself in an effort to try to make everything all better, still avoiding the root cause of her problems. You two had a good marriage before, right? If the marriage was a good one, then this has to stem from her inability to deal with her grief. The sad part is that all the external things that she tries to fix aren't going to improve her quality of happiness. Because the unhappiness was coming from within to begin with. As she heals from her loss, I wonder how she's going to cope when the reality of the situation finally hits her. She has cast aside the one person that could really understand her pain. I think you'd be looking at a different situation right now if she hadn't stubbornly refused grief counseling.
Author Devildog Posted January 28, 2005 Author Posted January 28, 2005 It is sad. I really feel sorry for her. Seeing all the people coming out against her. Seeing her delusions shattered one by one. And watching her try to tape them back together again so she can continue lying to herself to avoid the reality. She is drowning, but she doesn't want to be saved either. Each day the hurt builds and my desire or belief that anything could ever be salvaged diminishes. I know she will eventually realize what the truth of the matter is. And I will feel guilt because most likely I will have had to move on with my life well before that happens. And she will have to live with regret on top of the grief she finally recognizes. Yeah, if she could have gotten some help for the grief, starting with her brother's death, things would have been different. But that is what could have been, not what is.
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