Health Issues and Wayward Spouses

[Nyla]

While responding to a post by NewSouth an observation came to the light that I have never associated cheating with health problems. In my response I noted the fact that four of the women that have been key in my life have cheated on me and all four had health problems. So my question to all is "do cheaters have more health problems than those that honor their fidelity?" Do cheaters punish themselves in some way through their subconscious? I hope this is the right thread to post this question in?

 

I have myriad health problems and I have NEVER cheated on my husband. The thought of being intimate with another man turns my stomach.

 

My health problems make me feel grateful that I have met such a wonderful man.

 

My husband does not judge me for having poor health. How could he?

[xorro]

I think that the brain's reaction to starting a new relationship is probably similar to it's reaction to doing opiates.. a surge in dopamine, a feeling of euphoria, and probably some reduction in pain. Maybe that could explain people with chronic illnesses seeking out new, exciting, extra-marital relationships.

Studies have shown that heroin addicts can be weaned off drugs easier if they're given something else to replace the addiction with- often running or other strenuous exercise. Without the replacement, the withdrawal pain would be worse. People with low dopamine or other chemical brain imbalances tend to self-medicate with drugs, or other 'rewarding' habits.. Sex is probably one of those.

[Act Two]

BetrayedH,

 

I am always trying to better myself, I am always looking for rhythm's in nature that may influence a future decision. That would include "would I date another alcoholic?", would I risk another serious relationship with someone that has BPD? Would I have a serious relationship with someone that cheated on a former significant other? This is just me speaking out about things that happened to me and are my observations and are not intended to hurt anyone. I just look for red flags, I don't want another bad relationship. Just recently I have noticed that all of the wayward women in my life had one or more of addiction issues(alcohol and cocaine), health issues(back problems)or bipolar disorder, mostly back issues and alcohol. I am not saying that everyone with back problems cheats but that has been my experience.

 

I've never heard or read of a correlation between substance abuse and infidelity, although I'm sure it exists and alcohol sure can play a part in getting people together who shouldn't be together!

 

I just don't know about regular substance abuse. At least for me, I've never done drugs and drink socially.

[aliveagain]

Nyla,

 

You are not a cheater, and I mean no harm, this is simply an observation that is based on my own experiences. I am sorry if I offended you in anyway. I have been doing some reading about our Biological Clocks and Circadian Rhythms(master clock in our brain coordinates all the body clocks so that they are in synch). The Circadian Rhythms influence so many of our bodily functions including hormone release. Abnormal Circadian Rhythms have also been associated with Obesity, Diabetes, Depression, Bipolar Disorder, and Seasonal affective Disorder. All it takes is one of our clocks to be out of synch and our path in life is drastically changed.

[krazikat]

While I agree that pain can begin to rewire the brain, it is still no excuse for having adulterous relationships.

 

Right and wrong, do not become rewired in our brain. In extreme cases, perhaps:

 

-repeated violent acts

-rape

-brain washing

-severe and prolonger physical and emotional abuse

 

But seriously, Nerve damage, back pain, things like that. I call bull****. Straight up and down.

 

While I have sympathy for people that live in constant pain, or suffer from ailments, I hold them to the exact same level of morality as myself. Do right, no matter what, no excuses.

 

There is a FF1 down at Engine 5 that has terminal brain cancer. You know what he does?

 

Toughs it the **** out. Shows up to work everyday (modified duties of course), and works his 24hr shift. Goes home and helps take care of his wife and kids like a god damn Boss.

 

He doesn't use his illness as an excuse to make stupid decisions, he owns his illness, and stands up to it. This man is going to die, that is clear as day, but he doesn't let that warp his sense of reality, duties and morals.

 

Ya, I have to agree. I have suffered with loooong term chronic pain from an injury and there is no way to fix it, and have to take narcotic meds, nerve meds, sleeping meds...have various procedures...and I have never cheated period.

 

But I will say cp is DEPRESSING, taking all the meds sux, tired all the time and always in pain is life altering. Cp and depression go hand in hand, and this thread makes me wonder if depression is the underlying cause for some to cheat? Not that all depressed people would cheat, but does anyone think depression may have an impact?

[aliveagain]

krazikat, the woman that destroyed me the most suffered with depression. She was bipolar, the problem with her was not the being bipolar but she stopped taking her med's because she liked the high she got when she was manic and using alcohol. Her sex drive was through the stratosphere. She attempted suicide once before we broke up and twice after I left her.

[dreamingoftigers]

While I agree that pain can begin to rewire the brain, it is still no excuse for having adulterous relationships.

 

Right and wrong, do not become rewired in our brain. In extreme cases, perhaps:

 

-repeated violent acts

-rape

-brain washing

-severe and prolonger physical and emotional abuse

 

But seriously, Nerve damage, back pain, things like that. I call bull****. Straight up and down.

 

While I have sympathy for people that live in constant pain, or suffer from ailments, I hold them to the exact same level of morality as myself. Do right, no matter what, no excuses.

 

There is a FF1 down at Engine 5 that has terminal brain cancer. You know what he does?

 

Toughs it the **** out. Shows up to work everyday (modified duties of course), and works his 24hr shift. Goes home and helps take care of his wife and kids like a god damn Boss.

 

He doesn't use his illness as an excuse to make stupid decisions, he owns his illness, and stands up to it. This man is going to die, that is clear as day, but he doesn't let that warp his sense of reality, duties and morals.

 

Ok, I think that you may be seeing something that people aren't saying.

 

Give me a second here:

 

Everyone (that is living) is born with a CNS (central nervous system) and PNS (peripheral nervous system). They are NOT created equal (proven!)

 

CNS (brain and spinal cord) integrates stimuli from PNS (everything excluding brain and spinal cord) and fires PNS to act accordingly.

 

Essentially, "we" our encased in this big pile of bone, fat, and jello, "the world" is on the outside. Our CNS and our PNS are both shaped by initial functionality, our interactions with the world and our physical state. (I.e. are we oxygen deprived, are blood vessels constricted etc.)

 

Essentially our "hardware" and "software."

 

We are influenced by thousands, many even millions or billions or even trillions of things each day that impact CNS and PNS. And no, I am not just ripping off a Biology text for fun.

 

All of those individual factors can lead to stimuli that can and does lead us to perceive the world and our place in it vastly differently from the next person. Things that OFTEN we aren't even remotely aware of.

 

For instance, with addicts. Many are in denial BUT when they come out of that denial and realize that there's an issue, they can put a label to, some will admit: "I am an alcoholic."

 

That comes with a whole different set of reactions by so many people:

 

1. Some see it as a life sentence

2. An "excuse"

3. An entitlement

4. A Golden Ticket to get away with whatever you want

5. A tragedy

6. A character flaw

7. A choice

 

Really, all that happens when someone gets that label is:

 

their issue is defined.

 

That's it.

What should happen is that they understand what their deal is and what they have to do to fix and and take responsibility for it.

 

And not everyone that has alcohol pass their lips becomes an alcoholic. Some refuse it because: they are as susceptible to it, physically or psychologically. Some because they choose whatever value they place above it before the emotional and physiological reaction they have to it. And some because they see the effects of chronic overconsumption and don't want to risk it.

 

Just like everyone having the opportunity to have an affair doesn't. Some do, but only in certain instances. And yet others take every chance they have.

 

Some don't understand the risks or see the fallout, some think it is harmless, some don't care, some feel the risk is worth the tradeoff, more sociopathic ones don't see either their spouse or AP and people with feelings but more objects to take advantage of.

 

Having a health issue does NOT give one the Golden Ticket, nor was that stated. This thread wasn't "Let's give all of our WS a pass because they hurt their back in 2002." It was, "is this a contributing factor?"

 

The same as a genetic susceptibility or lack of consequence to someone who is an alcoholic. At the end of the day, "poor childhood" "genetic coincidence" or "crappy spouse" makes and alcoholic an alcoholic. And just because Jim up the street isn't an alcoholic and he had a way crappier childhood than Joe doesn't mean Joe isn't "really" an alcoholic.

 

Joe can be a sh*t-faced as anyone. It just depends on how neurally and emotionally susceptible he is.

 

I would guess that someone having a health issue could be more susceptible to an affair, because chronic, even low-level pain DOES impair judgment and even impairs EMPATHY.

 

You don't need to be raped to have an effect on judgment and empathy. FOr instance, a Mom yells at her kid in frustration after a long night of no sleep. Or she's sick etc. Nobody's going to say "oh well, she's the worst parent ever. There's just NO excuse for that ever ever." (Well, actually a lot would, and then they'd go home and yell at their kid, hypocrites). Some people would say it's "perfectly okay behaviour." But probably most would be able to look at it and go, "ah well. It was not okay. But you can see where she would've been at a disadvantage that particular time. She's exhausted."

 

The same reason they tell alcoholics not to get Too hungry, angry, lonely or tired. These factors all weigh in. Yes, something can be wrong. For sure. And the vast majority of us temporarily lose it. Most of us also only have our equilibrium off for a brief period OR we aren't as neurally susceptible to overreact OR we hold the value on keeping an even temper at ALL times much higher than yelling in exhaustion. Generally such a person is very self-aware and has a very high degree of empathy, also due to a combination of neural and historic factors.

 

IMO saying that our WS have health issues, could help label the issue, not excuse or give the Golden Ticket.

 

All it does is underline a weakness where our spouses could have taken more responsibility. An area where they themselves didn't see themselves as particularly susceptible because "it was life" for them. Just the same as an alcoholic might not realize he has an issue until he loses that third job, or gets arrested or loses a marriage over it.

 

It's just a point of understanding, not a moral judgment one way or the other.

 

Personally, I find it very insightful and fascinating.

 

 

 

One point I would like to add is that a spouse with a serious health issue may suffer a lowered self-esteem because of it.

 

They may view themselves as less attractive, more of a burden etc. Then, when an AP comes along and flatters them, they feel attractive and they aren't a burden to this person. Hence, confidence. They get to "shine" because they don't feel very shiny in general. I could see it.

[BetrayedH]

BetrayedH,

 

I am always trying to better myself, I am always looking for rhythm's in nature that may influence a future decision. That would include "would I date another alcoholic?", would I risk another serious relationship with someone that has BPD? Would I have a serious relationship with someone that cheated on a former significant other? This is just me speaking out about things that happened to me and are my observations and are not intended to hurt anyone. I just look for red flags, I don't want another bad relationship. Just recently I have noticed that all of the wayward women in my life had one or more of addiction issues(alcohol and cocaine), health issues(back problems)or bipolar disorder, mostly back issues and alcohol. I am not saying that everyone with back problems cheats but that has been my experience.

 

I can understand all of that. I think every BS certainly wrestles with how to trust the next SO (or anyone for that matter). Personally, I don't have a list of exclusions like the things you mentioned (not even previous infidelity). Maybe I should have. I think the big requirement for me was an ability to openly and honestly communicate. My ex was emotionally challenged and conflict-avoidant (among other things). Never again. My current SO hasn't lived a perfect life and has been thru a divorce herself. But she learned from it. We are mutually determined not to quietly let resentments build. We're both introspective and willing to be open about it. We REALLY don't want to screw this up. That's pretty critically important to me. It's far more important (to me) than previous mistakes.

 

So far so good. But, who knows? People are whacked and there's no guarantees. Your method may pay off much better than my own.

[dreamingoftigers]

While I agree that pain can begin to rewire the brain, it is still no excuse for having adulterous relationships.

Right and wrong, do not become rewired in our brain. In extreme cases, perhaps:

 

-repeated violent acts

-rape

-brain washing

-severe and prolonger physical and emotional abuse

 

he doesn't let that warp his sense of reality, duties and morals.

 

Now, I find this interesting.

One thing that appears to be universal is that Human societies develop a "right and wrong" code. Many of them are very similar dealing with sexuality, territory and violence. Some of them are VERY divergent or have exceptions to when an otherwise unacceptable behaviour is acceptable.

 

One thing to note is that affairs are perpetuated globally, they cut across all age groups, genders, orientations, religions, and races. They are not a standalone thing in which certain groups are afflicted and not others. For such a universally reviled thing that can carry VERY high consequences in some regions (esp for women) it STILL HAPPENS.

 

This leads me to think that although there are codes of conduct, social mores and the like, for some reason we are STILL vulnerable. Why? I don't know. I don't think it is just "we are supposed to be in the jungle screwing" or what have you. Nor do I think that given such a broad spectrum of people that all of the motives are the same. I don't want to get into moral relativism because almost universally (until very very recently) humanity has been pretty certain on a marital tie and at the very least female monogamy. It shows that there is a psychological value for monogamy. BUT regardless of the right and wrong codes that have been in place for thousands of years, globally there are still affairs.

 

And all of us in our day to day life do not, as a rule, follow even our own moral codes to the letter. We have Christians who outright flout themselves as sinners, Muslims who cheat or what have you, I am a swearing Mormon who doesn't speak as flatteringly about my husband as the church's "no gossip" standard dictates, Buddhist who are greedy, Athiests who pray even. I'm not kidding. Our bad behaviour extends way past affairs. And statistically we ALL LIE. The vast vast vast majority of us lie. And we've been told it was bad since we were LITTLE KIDS.

 

I think we all TO SOME DEGREE have been role-modelled, "say this, do that" and those limits are shiftable depending on what kind of parents you had. Was the gap there HUGE or rather small? To what degree have you witnessed your peers, parents, entire reference group step away from who they claimed to be? You're likely going to fall along similar lines.

 

Dan Ariely wrote a fascinating book about cheating. (Like at games, not the screwing around kind). One small study (of course multiple trials) they did showed the students in a room, they had one student (who was the manipulated variable) wearing the opposing university's jersey do a REALLY obvious cheat. The students in the room all cheated slightly more on their results than the group where there was no obvious cheating. Afterward, they changed the Cheating Student's Jersey to the University they all attended and repeated the experiment with the one student doing an obvious cheat. THEY ALL CHEATED and they cheated much more that the second group.

 

We are a susceptible bunch. I would guess that with the infusion of mass media and pornography, this global village is going to see those rates rise even more. Look at divorce, and cohabitation, it almost had a multiplier effect since in became legal, and the more people see other's doing it, the less repugnant, more acceptable and even LAUDED it became.

 

Betrayed H's (sorry buddy, go with me here) wife even wrote the lamest blog about hers.

 

Somewhere in there, there's some WS thinking, insecurely: "this person thinks I'm cool enough to cheat with." And that could very well be another glaring factor.

[NewSouth]

Affairs are frequently caused by self-image problems and the related seeking of validation of self-worth. If the health problems manifest into self-image problems, then yes, they could very much be related.

 

So by extension, if you seek to prevent cheating, validate a partner's worth to you, even in the face of health problems.

 

I'm sorry I missed this thread when it went up, especially since my post triggered it. I'm not through reading it yet, but self-worth is a key ingredient. My W had chronic illnesses dating to childhood, and also had a mother that placed a high value on external appearances and validation. I was not particularly good, actually sucked, at validation, so that fed the insecurities.

[aliveagain]

dreamingoftigers, excellent points. Some of the male cheaters that I have known were cheaters that were ruthless in business(very successful), hit their wives yet professed to being good Christians. To be a cheater you have to be a liar, if you cheat on your partner why wouldn't you cheat on people less important to you? Consciously or subconsciously this has to effect some part of their life that relates to health, your Suprachiasmatic Nucleus(SCN), your master clock that controls all the Circadian Rhythms that I referred to before, your 24 hour cycles, light and dark, in essence your sleep cycle. Health gets effected one way or another me thinks( sorry, that was me quoting Popeye).

[NewSouth]

I have myriad health problems and I have NEVER cheated on my husband. The thought of being intimate with another man turns my stomach.

 

My health problems make me feel grateful that I have met such a wonderful man.

 

My husband does not judge me for having poor health. How could he?

 

Kudo's to you. My W's self-esteem was pretty much s**t from day one. She went through a major attitude adjustment when my career took off, which was only a year or two post affair. As I have stated elsewhere, she may have still dilly-dallied, but I wasn't looking for it. As my income increased and her health declined there was a shift in attitude, but certainly no genuine affection.

 

Again, be proud of your character!

[NewSouth]

My ex was emotionally challenged and conflict-avoidant (among other things).

 

Conflict avoidant is a big factor. It is also a huge impediment to reconciliation. In my case the conflict avoidant WW could never enter into the discussion and come clean.

[dreamingoftigers]

dreamingoftigers, excellent points. Some of the male cheaters that I have known were cheaters that were ruthless in business(very successful), hit their wives yet professed to being good Christians. To be a cheater you have to be a liar, if you cheat on your partner why wouldn't you cheat on people less important to you? Consciously or subconsciously this has to effect some part of their life that relates to health, your Suprachiasmatic Nucleus(SCN), your master clock that controls all the Circadian Rhythms that I referred to before, your 24 hour cycles, light and dark, in essence your sleep cycle. Health gets effected one way or another me thinks( sorry, that was me quoting Popeye).

 

My father was the "catholic" alcoholic abuser who became a millionaire with his business. He also did a number on his taxes too and nearly lost the house, twice. Horrid with financials and very unstable and show offy with people. Truly, hates everyone. Except my daughter, she's still too small and adores him.

 

I'm not kidding. Hatred. Frequently. Expressed. Hatred.

 

I can't think of anyone who loathed himself more and can't overcomoensare for it. He didn't physically abuse my mother though. That's her one line I think.

 

My husband was raised by a mother like you describe.

He definitely cares about "appearances." BUT it's weird because when I met him he was homeless living under a bridge and had for the previous decade. BUT he was a drinker then too. As soon as he sobered up, he became really really rigid about some things. Quite the fault-finder (he really shredded me today actually ) I think maybe the alcohol, sexual issues and rigidity are all ways to try to control the shame he has.

 

Like he has to be extra-careful not to "appear" screwed-up. Horrible time taking responsibility. Like admitting to a poor behaviour condemns him, forever. Like admitting to a screw-up means that he IS something instead of he "acted in a certain way."

 

It's very exhausting. It may even be a dealbreaker yet. Honestly, I'm at the point where I am sick of paying for other people's mother's mistakes.

 

My father was raised in poverty with eight brothers and sisters to two alcoholic abusers. Both husband and father were stripped of any decision-making about their life, repeatedly shamed and grew up in chaotic abuse.

 

As did I. My husband and I had similar childhoods. So when we fight I see the old conflicts with my Dad where nothing I have to say holds any weight because the judgment has been made and all the talk is about is delivering that pound of shame to me, randomly, over random things. He sees in me his mother where he figures if I feel bad about something, (even if I burnt toast) it MUST BE his fault and I'm blaming him. (I.e. There's something rattling on the car. "oh, so you're saying I drove it this way or that? /What am I supposed to do about it?/ not my problem/ I told you that car wasn't worth XYZ! (lol to the last one because he insisted we buy it)).

 

It's like this at least once a day and often 2-3 times a day, very very hypervigilant. I do end up losing my temper. It happens 2-3 times a month. Then that gets put in the "fault jar" I try to tune it out though because I KNOW that his issues are way more exhausting than the average spouse. And honestly, my Dad was worse. We're chipping away at it in counseling. It's a long process though. I've even been very reluctant to admit it on LS. peoplewere very critical of me reconciling with him.

[dreamingoftigers]

Conflict avoidant is a big factor. It is also a huge impediment to reconciliation. In my case the conflict avoidant WW could never enter into the discussion and come clean.

 

Whats interesting in my situation, even though both father and husband are rather *ahem* Ill-tempered and quick to jump to the defensive: I describe both as conflict -avoidant because the fights they do get into are seriously to avoid the actual issue. 99% of the time.

 

Not my husband's very argumentative nature didn't come out in spades until after the affair. I keep getting this feeling that he thinks I've "got one over on him" and that automatically backs him into a corner he's got to come out fighting from.

 

Neither man will discuss the TOPIC or ISSUE until you are willing to concede a character-fault or at least an "error" of some sort, like their has to be an exchange for hearing, "oh I didn't know we were out of eggs."

[dreamingoftigers]

I wonder if "mental health issues" fall under the topic header, or if that's too broad.

[SmokeRat]

One has to believe that people who have affairs, already have mental health issues.

 

Serious, deep seated issues.

[krazikat]

krazikat, the woman that destroyed me the most suffered with depression. She was bipolar, the problem with her was not the being bipolar but she stopped taking her med's because she liked the high she got when she was manic and using alcohol. Her sex drive was through the stratosphere. She attempted suicide once before we broke up and twice after I left her.

 

Bp is no joke, my mom was diagnosed years ago...and there are definitly foo issues from that. For me, the foo has kept me from drugs and other risky behaviors...because I do not want to live that way. My mom refused to acknowledge the diagnosis...and I only found out about it a few years ago. I had her committed when I was 18 (I have lived on my own since 16) because she called me threatening suicide...I was hundreds of miles away. I had custody of 2 of my young teen siblings when I was in my early 20s with 2 of my own kids...so ya, as far from that as possible after a temporary backslide...I was a hs drop out teen mom...my foo caused me to put on my big girl panties, buck up, and do better. Went back to school, college, basically did not let my childhood experience pull me down.

 

I often feel sadness for my mom...and the self destructive behaviors. But more sadness for my younger siblings. Especially the ones who didnt deal well and still live with the foo issues defeating them.

 

I think that depression alone can cause people to slide, but add in other issues, such as bp, and that is a cocktail for disaster and pain to not only yourself but those around you. Especially when treatment is refused.

 

So sorry you had that experience.

[aliveagain]

krazikat,

 

She and I were common-law, we lived together for about 4 years. I raised her two young boys, both under 5, as my own. I paid for the private French School they attended, bought everything they needed. She blessed me with a son who we named after my deceased father. I got to raise him until his first birthday, that's when my world fell apart. One of her girlfriends came to me and told me everything. It appears that my SO had been having an affair with her ex-husband's best friend for two years behind my back. She wanted to have something to remember him by so she purposely got pregnant by him and told me it was mine. She never intended to be with him, he couldn't pay for the lifestyle she wanted and he was in a long term committed relationship and would never leave his SO. She thought I would be OK with raising another man's child, even though she was living with me when baby was conceived. She could not understand why I was so upset. She insisted that he was my son even after a DNA test was done at the Children's Hospital, the test concluded that there was a 99.999999 % chance that I was not the father. Even after all the drama was done, after three suicide attempts, her loosing custody of all three of her children(because of suicide attempts, social services placed her two boys with her ex, her youngest son was placed in foster care for a year).

 

She has attempted to contact me through some of her old friends, her former nanny and most recently through Facebook. She still claims that I am at fault for not choosing to have him as my son. I am still unlisted because of her. Yes, bipolar is one hell of a disorder to have to deal with. I am told that infidelity is one of the symptoms. I have major respect for anyone that has been able to deal with it and have a marriage that has survived it.

Edited May 24, 2013 by aliveagain
spelling

[aliveagain]

You just can't make s**t like this up, if it wasn't my life I would have a hard time believing it. How do people do this kind of s**t to someone they claim to love, I can not make sense of it, I just hate her so much. I have been trying to forgive her and myself for all she has done and I keep telling myself that none of this was my fault, but I was foolish enough to be in a relationship with her.

[dreamingoftigers]

You just can't make s**t like this up, if it wasn't my life I would have a hard time believing it. How do people do this kind of s**t to someone they claim to love, I can not make sense of it, I just hate her so much. I have been trying to forgive her and myself for all she has done and I keep telling myself that none of this was my fault, but I was foolish enough to be in a relationship with her.

 

I hear you.

 

I really really do.

 

I trusted my husband so much. I really really did. I thought his lifestyle was circumstantial, and he did so well in the first few years we were together. So amazing.

 

Now I believe that people pretty much are who you meet on Day One. Not fully and completely, but mostly. The circumstance they're in. Their personality.

 

If she's living with Mom and Dad at 25, she's mommy and daddy's girl.

 

If he's at a dead-end job, most likely he's staying there.

 

The Love Chemicals spur people on to impress one another, be their best shiniest selves and see the other person as a great shiny wonderful person too.

 

It makes us go, "oh he's working on that and he wants to be a Rocket Scientist. Oh she'll move out soon, she's just waiting for the right guy to come along, I AM that guy. Then she'll be more independent."

 

Obviously neither of those is a character flaw or what have you.

 

But in my case, I married a homeless guy who had been an alcoholic. Sure he stopped drinking the week I met him. He later started living indoors.

 

But still, I met him as a homeless alcoholic. Like, what was my first clue that he might have some underlying issues?

[karnak]

I hear you.

 

I really really do.

 

I trusted my husband so much. I really really did. I thought his lifestyle was circumstantial, and he did so well in the first few years we were together. So amazing.

 

Now I believe that people pretty much are who you meet on Day One. Not fully and completely, but mostly. The circumstance they're in. Their personality.

 

If she's living with Mom and Dad at 25, she's mommy and daddy's girl.

 

If he's at a dead-end job, most likely he's staying there.

 

The Love Chemicals spur people on to impress one another, be their best shiniest selves and see the other person as a great shiny wonderful person too.

 

It makes us go, "oh he's working on that and he wants to be a Rocket Scientist. Oh she'll move out soon, she's just waiting for the right guy to come along, I AM that guy. Then she'll be more independent."

 

Obviously neither of those is a character flaw or what have you.

 

But in my case, I married a homeless guy who had been an alcoholic. Sure he stopped drinking the week I met him. He later started living indoors.

 

But still, I met him as a homeless alcoholic. Like, what was my first clue that he might have some underlying issues?

 

Not always like that.

When I and my ex met I was an alcoholic, with severe emotional issues and a very sick view of life and people.

 

She helped me get rid of those demons and vices.

 

Our relationship collapsed. But I never returned to alcohol. And I acquired a healthy lifestyle.

[dreamingoftigers]

Not always like that.

When I and my ex met I was an alcoholic, with severe emotional issues and a very sick view of life and people.

 

She helped me get rid of those demons and vices.

 

Our relationship collapsed. But I never returned to alcohol. And I acquired a healthy lifestyle.

 

Dammit. My husband is sober too.

 

And I helped him get and stay back on track after we separated and he relapsed. Otherwise sober for eight years.

 

However, he STILL has heavy issues.

 

They just tend to shift around because he neve dealt with "why" he became that way in the first place or even just how to healthily cope with whatever emotional stimuli is behind that.

 

And no, I don't try to pull it all out of him.

 

So it went from alcohol, shifted more into sexual addiction and overindulgence. And A LOT of rigidity and anxiety.

[NewSouth]

Dammit. My husband is sober too.

 

And I helped him get and stay back on track after we separated and he relapsed. Otherwise sober for eight years.

 

However, he STILL has heavy issues.

 

They just tend to shift around because he neve dealt with "why" he became that way in the first place or even just how to healthily cope with whatever emotional stimuli is behind that.

 

And no, I don't try to pull it all out of him.

 

So it went from alcohol, shifted more into sexual addiction and overindulgence. And A LOT of rigidity and anxiety.

 

Very common situations. As you may know alcohol is simply a coping mechanism to cover emotions which usually include fear, anger, shame etc. When someone becomes sober they MUST substitute a healthy coping mechanism for the alcohol. If they don't they will become what AA calls a "dry drunk" who are among the most miserable people in the world. The principle holds for all addictions; new life skills must be learned. A woman or man who covers self-esteem and shame issues with sex would have to learn new skills. So a serial cheater can change, but only if healthy behaviors and beliefs are substituted. People drink and screw because it makes the pain go away for awhile, but then adds to the shame usually.

Edited May 24, 2013 by NewSouth
incomplete thought

[worldgonewrong]

Honestly, I'm at the point where I am sick of paying for other people's mother's mistakes.

 

Add in "father's mistakes" too.

But PHEW, this really rung a huge bell with me, as I'm sure it will for others.

 

To add to the list of afflictions (though it's not categorical across the board, of course): (early) menopause. Hormones surge crazily; certain women doubt their whole way of existence before that point, and ka-boom.