Is my mother narcissistic or is it just me?

[Radu]

I need to remember this as a test to do later on, for the ppl in my life, should get some interesting results.

[dreamingoftigers]

Omg, my Dad fits ALL the traits, exceptionally well.

 

Maybe I should complement him on being the best example of a narcissist I have ever met?

 

Oh that would be difficult for him to sort out.

It's hard buying father's day card for him. It's like "greatest Dad" nope. "you were always there for me, Dad."nope. "I'm glad you're my Dad, I'm glad we're so close." nope.

 

I usually end up finding something like "dad you deserve the same amount of love you give out."

 

One time I gave him a card like that and he called me to tell me that he was glad I was finally "getting it" and that he wanted to see more examples of that it the future. OH LOL did I laugh after that one! (not to his face, that would've been pretty rude).

 

It's too bad they don't make cards saying something like "thanks to you I've had a whole bunch of personal growth. ;)"

 

 

I read up a little bit on NPD and my mother does have a few of these traits:

 

 

Reacting to criticism with anger, shame, or humiliation She will get angry every time tells her that she needs to quit smoking. We have been trying to make her quit smoking for some time to improve her health, but every time we tell her not to, she goes hysterical and gets pissed off BIG time.

 

 

Exaggerating their own importance, achievements, and talents During the wedding, my mom believed that she could do anything better than anyone, such as cook and make a wedding cake. This is why she didn't ask for help because she believed that she was Paula Deen on something. Her cooking is great, but I just got mad at her wanting to do all of that stuff, yet whining her arse off when she realized how swamped she was going to be. This is why I think she fits this symptom.

 

Imagining unrealistic fantasies of success, beauty, power, intelligence, or romance I don't know if this fits in here, but my parents always imagine themselves in a bigger and better house than the one they currently have. They also imagine running a business where my mom cooks and caters events. I am not sure if that is a NPD trait or just a normal thing.

 

Requiring constant attention and positive reinforcement from others Oh does she fit this one. She calls me 3 times a day sometimes to just to bitch and complain about something. And when she does talk to me in a normal convo, she bitches and complains ABOUT everything. I am not sure if it's for attention or if the woman is truly unhappy about EVERYTHING. Also, she gets mad when the DOG (yes the DOG) doesn't pay her any attention. She wants a dog that fully gives her it's undivided attention. Also, the taking the credit for my husband's idea for the wedding decor shows that she wanted it all to be a show about her and how she did all this work and how she made the wedding so wonderful. Just that martydm attitude. Then she whines about how tired she was afterwards, when I NEVER asked her to take on that many responsibilities.

 

 

Becoming jealous easily She is clearly jealous of the relationship with my in-laws and she always says that they make her look like an inadequate mother. I just think that it makes her feel good that I rely on her for everything. It makes her feel like Superwoman and allows her to polish her image even more. It's the same way with my husband. She is jealous that he is present in my life and being there for me better than she was. She always ignores him and doesn't include him in anything. She never invites him to do anything with the family all because she hates him and is jealous of him.

 

Lacking empathy and disregarding the feelings of others She's always been this way. I was never allowed to express my own feelings about anything. If I did, she would get so angry and take it as if I was sassing her. For example, when I was living at home, I was talking to my husband, who was my boyfriend at the time via the internet because the phone bills would get outrageous if we called each other. They had gone out of town that weekend and I really couldn't get in touch with my boyfriend that weekend, so that night was the first night I got in touch with him. We still had stupid dial up internet then and I was going to the kitchen to get something to drink and my mother starts yelling at me because she wanted to talk on the phone that night and I wouldn't let her because I was on the internet. She told me that I needed to get a damn job so I could pay for my own internet. I try telling her that she should have asked me to get off the internet if she really needed it. And she tells me me to shut up and she didn't ask me to say anything. She thought that I just had to assume that she needed it and that I was the one who was being the bitch. She apologized later in an email (too bad she couldn't really tell me all of this crap). It really shaped me too. I always assume that people aren't telling me what they are really feeling and they expect me to just figure it out on my own. It sucks.

 

 

 

Wanting "the best" of everything She always wants the best kitchen equipment and the best of everything, and she also expects that out of me too. When we were still living at home with his parents, we went shopping one day and I bought me a nice dress at Goodwill. She asked me where I got it from and I told her and she goes "I am going to have to give you money to go out and buy some real clothes". I was insulted because it wasn't like money was coming out of our asses at the time. That really made me mad.

 

 

So this is how I think she fits in with NPD. Sorry about the constant stories and making it mostly about ME. I probably have some of that crap embedded in me.

[capricorndreamgurl3]

I know right. Speaking of gifts and stuff, my mom made my dad a cake for his birthday one time and he got really drunk and started making snarky comments about it, which to be fair, pissed me off too. She starts crying though and whines about how no one ever makes her a cake and does anything for her birthday, which is BS. I have asked her many times what kind of cake she wants for her birthday, she always has told me that she doesn't want one or needs one. She thinks she's "too fat" to have a cake. We go on trips for her birthday. Yet she had the audacity to sit there and complain about what we don't do.

 

Then both of my parents had a fight one time and I didn't think I said or did anything wrong. I thought it was only a fight between one of them. My dad blames the whole thing on me, all because I said something I thought wouldn't make him mad. I was only agreeing with him and he yells at me and says it's all my fault, when he was the one who started it with his snarky comments. Then I told my mother I was tired of the drama that he causes, then she gets all mad at me saying that I think she starts all of the drama. They can say all they want that they always know when they are wrong, but they don't. They don't take responsibility for anything and that sucks. It's always my fault for everything. My husband wonders why I am insecure all of the time and everything.

 

I was never allowed to express anger in my household either. My mom was being a bitch one time all because I asked a question and she made me feel like an idiot for asking it. I got very mad and started slamming the doors and stuff and she got mad at me for being mad about something. She always does this when she pisses me off. Every time she pisses me off and I show it, she goes "DON'T GET MAD AT ME", as if I have no right to get mad at her EVEN though she was being a bitch and disrespecting me. I am afraid to express any kind of emotion. My husband is trying his damnest to get me out of that crap. It makes him mad to see all the crappy things they have done and continue to do to me. I just think that ppl with NPD are afraid of being in the wrong and want to be the bully all of the time and when you call them out, it's on.

[capricorndreamgurl3]

Sorry for going on tangents and sharing random stories. I want to thank you guys for being a great help to me on here. I am grateful to know that I am able to connect to people going through the same thing as I am. It makes me feel better.

[capricorndreamgurl3]

Omg, my Dad fits ALL the traits, exceptionally well.

 

Maybe I should complement him on being the best example of a narcissist I have ever met?

 

Oh that would be difficult for him to sort out.

It's hard buying father's day card for him. It's like "greatest Dad" nope. "you were always there for me, Dad."nope. "I'm glad you're my Dad, I'm glad we're so close." nope.

 

I usually end up finding something like "dad you deserve the same amount of love you give out."

 

One time I gave him a card like that and he called me to tell me that he was glad I was finally "getting it" and that he wanted to see more examples of that it the future. OH LOL did I laugh after that one! (not to his face, that been pretty rude).

 

It's too bad they don't make cards saying something like "thanks to you I've had a whole bunch of personal growth. ;)"

 

I understand that too. I happen to get the ones that say that you are the most selfless mother I know. I wish that was true lol. I wish there were ones that said "I worked hard to seek your approval, yet I never got it. I know I am not good enough for you ,but I am still your daughter. I hate myself because of this. I make myself sick worrying whether you will get mad at what I say. I worry about you hating me. I wish you loved me for who I am and not what I look like." I wish you could just say that. But no. I don't really have the courage to do that at this point in my life. I would rather honestly just keep the peace. I guess if I do that though, I will suffer. I guess that I am this way because of my parents. My parents also fought a lot growing up and within the last few years. When my mom yelled, it was like nails on a chalkboard and scared the hell out of me. I vowed to never be that way. Yikes I know lol.

Edited August 3, 2012 by capricorndreamgurl3

[dreamingoftigers]

I found "Boundaries" by Cloud and Towshend to be a great book for helping realize when I can step and not overstep into their garbage.

 

They can rile me almost at all anymore.

 

I've noticed they have almost a mystical sense for when they've pushed too much and I'm about to end a conversation. It's almost like my mother races to the finish line to end it first now. It doesn't feel like a rejection, in fact it doesn't bother ne in the least because it means I've stopped being pushed by her and that through trying to be "more powerful" in the conversation, she's inadvertently respected me instead. LOL.

 

Embrace the happy, you won't always get burned anymore. It's a hard weird lesson, especially after marriage. Narcissists have this weird issue where think they that we are not allowed to be happy unless they (unconsciously) give us permission to be.

 

Here, I'll play your narcissist for a minute: CDG3, I give you permission to be happy whenever you want. and I can't take it back ever because I said so.

 

Just pretend it was your mother that said it.

[capricorndreamgurl3]

Another tangent, and I will stop for now:

 

My parents always had the nerve to criticize other parents' parenting methods, although sometimes they were right. Unlike myself, my cousins had a mother who cheated on their father when they were younger and she left. She wasn't that much of a mother to them and my grandma ultimately raised them. One of them is kind of an douche. He never speaks to you when you say hi, nor does he try to go out and get a job for his wife and kids. But that's not for me to judge. The other one turned out wonderful. But when they were little, my parents always bragged that they wouldn't have anything to do with them because they are the authoritative parents who wouldn't put up with any of their crap and would spank them when they were out of line. They acted like they were God's gift to parenting and that they awesome parents, when in turn, they treated me like crap and crippled me. I just think that's funny. They believe they have done nothing wrong. Sadly, I have realized that I cannot change their behavior because they don't get it. However, I can change how I deal with them. I am an adult and I need to deal with them in an adult fashion.

 

I am sure that many of you can relate to this, but the things that they did, I felt were totally normal. If I was out of line and got them angry, whatever the reason, I felt like it was my fault and I was asking to be punished. Because I had no friends growing up because I was so insecure, I had no one to talk to. I had two wonderful grandparents who I told more than my own parents. But I knew if I talked to them about anything that my parents did to me, it would come back to them and I would get treated worse than I had already been treated. If I cried about ANYTHING, they would yell at me and threaten to spank me. One time, they started fighting and I got upset about and my mom turns around and goes "YOU BETTER DRY IT UP OR I WILL GIVE YOU SOMETHING TO CRY ABOUT!!!!" I was 18 at the time. Then she tells me later that I should have not upset about it because it was their right to fight like that and get me all upset. It really sucked. I met a friend, who became my best friend and I told him everything and he goes "Here's my theory, you were ABUSED as a kid. Your parents were HORRIBLE to you". Sadly, he knows firsthand how they can be. They were even rude to him a couple of times. So I am just in the first stages of dealing this and let me tell you, I am angry about everything. I just see them differently now. I don't want to say that I hate them, but I don't like them and they make me miserable. I get nervous when I see them and sick to my stomach. The whole time I visit, I am on edge and I break out in hives. It sucks feeling this way. I am not sure why I feel this way. I just hope it gets better soon because I don't know how much more I can take.

[capricorndreamgurl3]

I found "Boundaries" by Cloud and Towshend to be a great book for helping realize when I can step and not overstep into their garbage.

 

They can rile me almost at all anymore.

 

I've noticed they have almost a mystical sense for when they've pushed too much and I'm about to end a conversation. It's almost like my mother races to the finish line to end it first now. It doesn't feel like a rejection, in fact it doesn't bother ne in the least because it means I've stopped being pushed by her and that through trying to be "more powerful" in the conversation, she's inadvertently respected me instead. LOL.

 

Embrace the happy, you won't always get burned anymore. It's a hard weird lesson, especially after marriage. Narcissists have this weird issue where think they that we are not allowed to be happy unless they (unconsciously) give us permission to be.

 

Here, I'll play your narcissist for a minute: CDG3, I give you permission to be happy whenever you want. and I can't take it back ever because I said so.

 

Just pretend it was your mother that said it.

 

It's so true. My mother believes if she's not happy, no one else should be happy. I am working hard every day to be happy for me. It's hard, but I am trying and my husband is pushing me to be this way too. I don't know where I would be without my husband He is my chief motivator for everything. I have seen this book as well and it's been recommended to be before too. I have considered reading it. I may give it a try.

[dreamingoftigers]

You sound terribly on edge a great deal of the time.

 

Have you gone for some IC?

 

I also found EMDR indispensable for removing the triggering effects my parents have had. It's hard to live with so much anxiety.

 

Once you realize just how anxious they have caused you to be over the years you are bound to be lividly pissed right off at them. More then you can even think or realize now.

 

I realized that I was still upset at my father when I was 25. Before that I didn't even realize that I was angry. How it came out was pretty funny.

 

I knew another woman in her 50s that had similar weight issues to mine so we went to a support group together. She one night talked to me about her demanding, pushy mother. Her mother had come to live with her in her old age and nothing was ever good enough. I heard her reflect my father essentially. (autocorrect just made "father" into "dagger", hilarious)

 

Anyway.... I said how I understood and I shared that I just imagine what it will be like with my father when he grows old and is helpless, maybe in a wheelchair.

 

She said to me, "I know. You'll just want to help them and feel so guilty that you should take care of them."

 

And I thought about it for a split-second and this image came to me. I just looked at her and said. "heck no! I'd kick him in his wheelchair down a flight of stairs."

 

It caught me so off -guard that I started laughing like a crazy woman and that I said. "hey, guess what? I guess I am angry with my father. I had no idea until now."

 

Then we both just cracked right up. I guess you had to be there but I just remember it as one of the most weirdly funny moments of my life. I wouldn't do that to my father but I'm surprised that my mind randomly went there after years of cutting the cord. I was finally relaxed enough to realize I was pissed off about the whole thing beyond belief. I should've been, really.

[freestyle]

 

It's too bad they don't make cards saying something like "thanks to you I've had a whole bunch of personal growth. ;)"

 

 

*wipes coffee from computer screen*---

 

OMG, DOT, can I borrow that??

 

I know exactly what you mean about picking out cards---I just CAN'T bring myself to send a card that would be the epitome of hypocrisy.So, I spend half my shopping time, searching for something bland enough............uggggh.

[Radu]

So what did you do at EMDR therapy ?

[dreamingoftigers]

*wipes coffee from computer screen*---

 

OMG, DOT, can I borrow that??

 

I know exactly what you mean about picking out cards---I just CAN'T bring myself to send a card that would be the epitome of hypocrisy.So, I spend half my shopping time, searching for something bland enough............uggggh.

 

Ha ha ha.

 

I knew someone would appreciate that one!

LOL.

 

I had a heck of a time when my husband and I were working on things just after he got back for treatment. He was still treating me crappy, sone improvements. BUT our 5th wedding anniversary was happening two weeks after he got back.

 

THAT was a challenge. I ended up find a card that had a beautiful design on it with a boat at sea. It said "thanks for the journey." I thanked him for being part of "our" marital journey and it said "hopefully we can make the next 5 even better." he was pretty touched by it and it wasn't full of BS.

 

But father's day and mother's day cards.....ugh.

 

Maybe I should come out with a bunch of dysfunctional family cards.

 

"dear sister, you have nice plants, happy birthday."

 

Ha ha.

[Radu]

I'm sure there must be a website in the US where you can custom-order greeting cards, at least custom messages.

 

It's not a bad business ideea, you might even end up with some unknown greeting design you can link to your company's name.

[bluegreen]

How is anyone doing on just ignoring them or not talking to them at all ?

I really stopped just about totally few months ago and you should see her it goes from wounded puppy looks and sighs to screaming insults and threats to quiet and buying me my favorite snacks.

But am still keeping my mouth shut and talk what I only am forced to say

It hurts me to but comparing to before this feels like BREAK for my brain and heart to ...

[MuscleCarFan]

I read up a little bit on NPD and my mother does have a few of these traits:

 

 

Reacting to criticism with anger, shame, or humiliation She will get angry every time tells her that she needs to quit smoking. We have been trying to make her quit smoking for some time to improve her health, but every time we tell her not to, she goes hysterical and gets pissed off BIG time.

 

 

Exaggerating their own importance, achievements, and talents During the wedding, my mom believed that she could do anything better than anyone, such as cook and make a wedding cake. This is why she didn't ask for help because she believed that she was Paula Deen on something. Her cooking is great, but I just got mad at her wanting to do all of that stuff, yet whining her arse off when she realized how swamped she was going to be. This is why I think she fits this symptom.

 

Imagining unrealistic fantasies of success, beauty, power, intelligence, or romance I don't know if this fits in here, but my parents always imagine themselves in a bigger and better house than the one they currently have. They also imagine running a business where my mom cooks and caters events. I am not sure if that is a NPD trait or just a normal thing.

 

Requiring constant attention and positive reinforcement from others Oh does she fit this one. She calls me 3 times a day sometimes to just to bitch and complain about something. And when she does talk to me in a normal convo, she bitches and complains ABOUT everything. I am not sure if it's for attention or if the woman is truly unhappy about EVERYTHING. Also, she gets mad when the DOG (yes the DOG) doesn't pay her any attention. She wants a dog that fully gives her it's undivided attention. Also, the taking the credit for my husband's idea for the wedding decor shows that she wanted it all to be a show about her and how she did all this work and how she made the wedding so wonderful. Just that martydm attitude. Then she whines about how tired she was afterwards, when I NEVER asked her to take on that many responsibilities.

 

 

Becoming jealous easily She is clearly jealous of the relationship with my in-laws and she always says that they make her look like an inadequate mother. I just think that it makes her feel good that I rely on her for everything. It makes her feel like Superwoman and allows her to polish her image even more. It's the same way with my husband. She is jealous that he is present in my life and being there for me better than she was. She always ignores him and doesn't include him in anything. She never invites him to do anything with the family all because she hates him and is jealous of him.

 

Lacking empathy and disregarding the feelings of others She's always been this way. I was never allowed to express my own feelings about anything. If I did, she would get so angry and take it as if I was sassing her. For example, when I was living at home, I was talking to my husband, who was my boyfriend at the time via the internet because the phone bills would get outrageous if we called each other. They had gone out of town that weekend and I really couldn't get in touch with my boyfriend that weekend, so that night was the first night I got in touch with him. We still had stupid dial up internet then and I was going to the kitchen to get something to drink and my mother starts yelling at me because she wanted to talk on the phone that night and I wouldn't let her because I was on the internet. She told me that I needed to get a damn job so I could pay for my own internet. I try telling her that she should have asked me to get off the internet if she really needed it. And she tells me me to shut up and she didn't ask me to say anything. She thought that I just had to assume that she needed it and that I was the one who was being the bitch. She apologized later in an email (too bad she couldn't really tell me all of this crap). It really shaped me too. I always assume that people aren't telling me what they are really feeling and they expect me to just figure it out on my own. It sucks.

 

 

 

Wanting "the best" of everything She always wants the best kitchen equipment and the best of everything, and she also expects that out of me too. When we were still living at home with his parents, we went shopping one day and I bought me a nice dress at Goodwill. She asked me where I got it from and I told her and she goes "I am going to have to give you money to go out and buy some real clothes". I was insulted because it wasn't like money was coming out of our asses at the time. That really made me mad.

 

 

So this is how I think she fits in with NPD. Sorry about the constant stories and making it mostly about ME. I probably have some of that crap embedded in me.

 

My father-in-law, pink_sugar's father, is almost all of those. No wonder I dislike the guy...

[RiverRunning]

Oh Lord. I hear you oh birthdays, cg. It's like it's a National Holiday or something! You can share all of your stories here - well, obviously I have . It is nice (well, not really nice...I don't wish this on others...) to see others coping with many of the same things, especially people my age. It sounds like most of you also haven't met anyone your own age who has really dealt with this?

 

bluegreen, I went limited contact with my family. I run errands with my mom, essentially. I don't go over her house and just linger there. If I DO, it's because I'm playing with my cousin, who is 6 (she baby-sits him).

 

I don't think that no contact will ever be possible. I'm just not willing to risk the rest of my family. I got a lot of heat because I DID go no-contact with my paternal grandma (who was also verbally abusive to me) about two years ago. The only thing she ever did when I was growing up was insult me about how 'fat' I was (and I think this was before I even really got fat - I was like 5'0", 115, 120 lbs). Then I'd lose weight and it was, "Oh, maybe boys will actually LIKE you now." Thanks, grandma.

 

I remember slamming out of my house because one of my maternal great aunts started laying into me about how I need to go see my grandma, I need to be 'good' to her, etc. I think I said, "Yeah, that's not going to happen," and slammed the door. Seriously, bitch. I'm a grown woman. I will decide for myself who I do and don't see. You don't know what the relationship is like, so how dare you start telling me what I should or shouldn't do.

[capricorndreamgurl3]

I don't think that no contact will ever be possible. I'm just not willing to risk the rest of my family. I got a lot of heat because I DID go no-contact with my paternal grandma (who was also verbally abusive to me) about two years ago. The only thing she ever did when I was growing up was insult me about how 'fat' I was (and I think this was before I even really got fat - I was like 5'0", 115, 120 lbs). Then I'd lose weight and it was, "Oh, maybe boys will actually LIKE you now." Thanks, grandma.

 

Do we have the same paternal grandmother? My paternal grandmother is also very verbally abusive herself, especially to my father. She came over to dinner at my house one time and she told me that it looked like I gained weight. It was right after my maternal grandfather (who I was extremely close to) passed away and it really hurt me. I ran outside and my husband went with me and just started crying. She also insulted me about living with my boyfriend unmarried telling me that I am going to get pregnant and all the crap that wasn't any of her damn business. She even told my father that he was an alcoholic one time just because he enjoyed to drink a few beers. It really upset our family and they didn't really speak to her for awhile either.

 

 

Needless to say, I never call her or visit her. She makes my skin crawl so much. She never had that much to do with me anyway and at this point in my life, that is fine with me. She is too mean beyond words. But I am always expected to be there for her to some extent because I guess that's how our family works. All the abuse and meanness is supposed to be swept under the rug I guess.

[freestyle]

I know I brought it up a few pages back,but the topic came up again, so I'm going to share some great writing I came across, regarding third-parties trying to tell us what to do, and how to feel about abusive parents.

 

I personally regard it as a form of secondary abuse---although I do believe that some of the third parties who chastise us, sincerely think they're helping.

 

What they don't realize, unfortunately, is that they're heaping shame upon someone who's already in a lot of pain. I'd venture to guess that many of those bystanders are NOT in possession of all of the facts, that they've been spoon-fed a strategically edited version of events from our disordered parents.

 

(who believe themselves to be the hapless, helpless victims of how *unreasonable* we are )

 

 

Here 's the article written by a brave woman who got tired of being admonished to "get over it, already"......

 

Standing up to Damaging Advice and Overcoming Trauma Directives :: Emerging From Broken

 

 

 

Hope it can be helpful, I found a lot of validation in it.

[capricorndreamgurl3]

I know I brought it up a few pages back,but the topic came up again, so I'm going to share some great writing I came across, regarding third-parties trying to tell us what to do, and how to feel about abusive parents.

 

I personally regard it as a form of secondary abuse---although I do believe that some of the third parties who chastise us, sincerely think they're helping.

 

What they don't realize, unfortunately, is that they're heaping shame upon someone who's already in a lot of pain. I'd venture to guess that many of those bystanders are NOT in possession of all of the facts, that they've been spoon-fed a strategically edited version of events from our disordered parents.

 

(who believe themselves to be the hapless, helpless victims of how *unreasonable* we are )

 

 

Here 's the article written by a brave woman who got tired of being admonished to "get over it, already"......

 

Standing up to Damaging Advice and Overcoming Trauma Directives :: Emerging From Broken

 

 

 

Hope it can be helpful, I found a lot of validation in it.

 

This is a great article and it's one of the things that makes me angry.....people that tell ya "Well why don't you just get over it already" or "What they did to you wasn't that bad". It makes me soooo mad because they don't know what they hell I have been through in my life and they never will because they are lucky that they had parents who didn't do these things to them. It is a lot harder than they think to overcome something like this. It is truly a secondary form of abuse for sure.

[freestyle]

This is a great article and it's one of the things that makes me angry.....people that tell ya "Well why don't you just get over it already" or "What they did to you wasn't that bad". It makes me soooo mad because they don't know what they hell I have been through in my life and they never will because they are lucky that they had parents who didn't do these things to them. It is a lot harder than they think to overcome something like this. It is truly a secondary form of abuse for sure.

 

 

Yep, it sucks when you have to deal with the knee-jerk invalidations that people spout off. I'm still learning how to deal with that myself, so, I'm not sure how much advice I can give you........

 

One thing I'll say for sure, though--

 

The only person who's TRULY qualified to define you, is.....YOU.

 

 

Here's another of Darlene's articles (the same author from the other one I linked):

 

Avoiding Feelings ~ The Root Cause :: Emerging From Broken

 

 

She's got a lot of profound writing on her blog, you might find some other helpful stuff, if you check the archives on the right hand margin of her page.

[dreamingoftigers]

How is anyone doing on just ignoring them or not talking to them at all ?

I really stopped just about totally few months ago and you should see her it goes from wounded puppy looks and sighs to screaming insults and threats to quiet and buying me my favorite snacks.

But am still keeping my mouth shut and talk what I only am forced to say

It hurts me to but comparing to before this feels like BREAK for my brain and heart to ...

 

I would ignore them for literally years sometimes. You are right, it is a great break. It's harder to separate grandparents though.

 

Now I just try to manage the insanity and shield my daughter from the stupider stuff.

 

They know if they cut us down to her, even as a "joke" that they will be completely restricted from seeing her. As it stands, I am allowing them visits where my husband and I supervise.

 

My father has tried to go behind my back and arrange a "secret visit" with my dayhome provider and I made it very clear to him that that was completely inappropriate and that if anything like that was ever tried again their visits would be terminated.

 

I also I instructed my dayhome provider to simply instruct them to call me instead. That really pissed him off because he's been offering her loads of money to control the situation. She won't budge. I'm glad for it because he's tried to manipulate her before. He figures everyone can be bought.

[Radu]

I would ignore them for literally years sometimes. You are right, it is a great break. It's harder to separate grandparents though.

 

Now I just try to manage the insanity and shield my daughter from the stupider stuff.

 

They know if they cut us down to her, even as a "joke" that they will be completely restricted from seeing her. As it stands, I am allowing them visits where my husband and I supervise.

 

My father has tried to go behind my back and arrange a "secret visit" with my dayhome provider and I made it very clear to him that that was completely inappropriate and that if anything like that was ever tried again their visits would be terminated.

 

I also I instructed my dayhome provider to simply instruct them to call me instead. That really pissed him off because he's been offering her loads of money to control the situation. She won't budge. I'm glad for it because he's tried to manipulate her before. He figures everyone can be bought.

 

What he tried ... that could constitute enough for a restraining order, or other legal problems for him.

[freestyle]

I would ignore them for literally years sometimes. You are right, it is a great break. It's harder to separate grandparents though.

 

Now I just try to manage the insanity and shield my daughter from the stupider stuff.

 

They know if they cut us down to her, even as a "joke" that they will be completely restricted from seeing her. As it stands, I am allowing them visits where my husband and I supervise.

 

My father has tried to go behind my back and arrange a "secret visit" with my dayhome provider and I made it very clear to him that that was completely inappropriate and that if anything like that was ever tried again their visits would be terminated.

 

I also I instructed my dayhome provider to simply instruct them to call me instead. That really pissed him off because he's been offering her loads of money to control the situation. She won't budge. I'm glad for it because he's tried to manipulate her before. He figures everyone can be bought.

 

 

yep--I read elsewhere that , "if your parents are too toxic for you, they're definitely too toxic for your children.."

 

It's very common that disordered parents will attempt to triangulate with their grandchildren, and turn the grandkids against their parents. It can do a lot of damage to a young, developing mind, to see their own parent(s) undermined by a toxic grandparent.

 

And the toxic grandparent is more concerned with getting some jabs in, than being worried about how the mixed messages will affect the grandkids.

 

 

You're very wise to not allow any unsupervised visits, DOT.

 

My paternal grandmother started trash-talking my mother to me, when my parents finally split up. (I know I complained about my mother in this thread, but my father was actually the worse of the two. Bad enough, that it overshadowed my mom's abusive behaviors....)

 

I was 14, and old enough to see how messed up that was. It made me not want to see my grandmother for over a decade. Good thing I wasn't younger, and more impressionable.

[Radu]

I never knew this freestyle, but it makes sense.

 

A few pages back i wrote that my grandfather and grandmother came to my parents [paternal ones], and without being asked offered to take me and my sister to the countryside as both my parents were working and there were no daycare services offered.

We ended up staying there for 2yrs, i wonder if this was their attempt to 'control' my parents by turning us against them or by holding us 'morally' hostage.

[dreamingoftigers]

yep--I read elsewhere that , "if your parents are too toxic for you, they're definitely too toxic for your children.."

 

It's very common that disordered parents will attempt to triangulate with their grandchildren, and turn the grandkids against their parents. It can do a lot of damage to a young, developing mind, to see their own parent(s) undermined by a toxic grandparent.

 

And the toxic grandparent is more concerned with getting some jabs in, than being worried about how the mixed messages will affect the grandkids.

 

 

You're very wise to not allow any unsupervised visits, DOT.

 

My paternal grandmother started trash-talking my mother to me, when my parents finally split up. (I know I complained about my mother in this thread, but my father was actually the worse of the two. Bad enough, that it overshadowed my mom's abusive behaviors....)

 

I was 14, and old enough to see how messed up that was. It made me not want to see my grandmother for over a decade. Good thing I wasn't younger, and more impressionable.

 

My Dad tried making some of his "jokes" to her when she was an infant.

 

He's always thrown me under the bus to others unless he can brag about me in a way that he can take credit for.

 

I nipped it right away.

 

It's a big reason for supervised visits, but there are more reasons as well.

 

He's already been pushing for her to be babysat at their house. No way.

When she was in foster care they did put in for custody of her. I allowed that in preference to having her potentially remain in foster care if SS was going to rule against us. (I'll get into reasons why but only if anyone truly believes it's

relevant and/or hasn't read some of my other posts).

 

After social services cleared my husband and I (as well as putting ongoing terms for him) my patents still kept their application for custody in. I made it very clear that I would come up with the capital to continue with the trial even if I had to involve my other family. (I also would have quit school and panhandled, I would've done anything for my kid )

 

They dropped it after that, it would have cost at least $30,000 and they had no grounds to challenge our guardianship.

 

I refuse to have them run over my parenting efforts whatsoever.

As far as I am concerned they can play a very restricted role in her life. They can give her presents and tell her that she's pretty and boost her self-esteem etc. If I ever hear the words "spoiled brat" "lazy" "fat" or "shut-up" they will become my child's first example of how not to tolerate abuse. They will vanish like they vanished me for years. I have no guilt or problem with that. I have had years of experience knowing that if they get the smallest increment of an inch, soon we will have travelled six time zones.