25 Years Together - Is it time to end it?

[NickFeek]

Jesus..Nick can you just hurry the hell up, throw your wife and her clothing out on the curb and sue her for every dime she's got so vou and 2sunny can go out and rent a room? lol

 

I don't think anything on this forum has made me laugh as hard as this!

[2sunny]

Gotta love the sandbox theory!

 

I am absolutely going to explain that to her next time we talk. It never seemed like the right time after my infidelity, because it would have sounded to her like an excuse. But once we unseal this deal, there's no reason I can't say it. I don't have any reason to be especially vindictive, but I hope it may help her someday to know the truth.

 

come on... talk, talk, talk... DO SOMETHING!!!!

 

no more talk - she's NOT listening, she doesn't care... stop wasting your time talking - DO SOMETHING.

 

when the horse is dead - you acknowledge that it's a dead horse... YOU are standing there with the dead horse beating it (you wanting to TALK more) - thinking it will get up - it's a dead horse... get off the dead horse! get moving...

[NickFeek]

come on... talk, talk, talk... DO SOMETHING!!!!

 

no more talk - she's NOT listening, she doesn't care... stop wasting your time talking - DO SOMETHING.

 

when the horse is dead - you acknowledge that it's a dead horse... YOU are standing there with the dead horse beating it (you wanting to TALK more) - thinking it will get up - it's a dead horse... get off the dead horse! get moving...

 

Well in order to explain something to her, which is what you suggested, I have to utter the words. So think of this as part of the extended breakup. I'm patient & far-sighted enough to have confidence that I'll do the right thing & the best thing will happen from that, without having to jump on it right away. But I appreciate your fire as always.

[2sunny]

Well in order to explain something to her, which is what you suggested, I have to utter the words. So think of this as part of the extended breakup. I'm patient & far-sighted enough to have confidence that I'll do the right thing & the best thing will happen from that, without having to jump on it right away. But I appreciate your fire as always.

 

i never said you need to explain it to her - she's already experienced it by LIVING through it.

 

i was explaining it to you. see you don't seem to be able to think for yourself - you run to her with every little thing. women don't respect men that can't wipe their own a$$ without asking permission... she sees that.

 

stop being her doormat.

 

start being a man on your own - a man that doesn't need to run to her to ask her permission to do every little thing.

 

she's pushed the man you were intended to be down so far - you're not even sure if you are half a man anymore.

 

use those balls God gave you... i'll loan you mine. TELL her what action YOU are planning to take asap... without HER permission. you've allowed her to play the role of mommy for you - it's time to get back to BEING a man. a man that doesn't ask permission but just starts doing.

[soserious1]

I don't think anything on this forum has made me laugh as hard as this!

 

good, lol,making you laugh was my intention

[NickFeek]

i never said you need to explain it to her - she's already experienced it by LIVING through it.

 

i was explaining it to you. see you don't seem to be able to think for yourself - you run to her with every little thing. women don't respect men that can't wipe their own a$$ without asking permission... she sees that.

 

stop being her doormat.

 

start being a man on your own - a man that doesn't need to run to her to ask her permission to do every little thing.

 

she's pushed the man you were intended to be down so far - you're not even sure if you are half a man anymore.

 

use those balls God gave you... i'll loan you mine. TELL her what action YOU are planning to take asap... without HER permission. you've allowed her to play the role of mommy for you - it's time to get back to BEING a man. a man that doesn't ask permission but just starts doing.

 

Just to set the record straight, here's a quote from your posting: "explain to her that since she chose not to play in your sandbox (hers is work, work, work only!) and you aren't allowed to play in hers..."

 

Other than that, you have me pegged wrong. I will NEVER believe that flashing your balls at someone you respect is a good thing to do. I am WAY more patient & reasonable than that. AND IN THE END, the outcome will be the same, but with LESS HURT spread during the process.

 

Besides our interpersonal issues, I am very very much the man I want to be and was meant to be. My issues reside ALL within the her & me dynamic. And within that, yes, you do have a point about me letting her run the show. In the end, action will be the only thing that changes anything. Before then, we'll have to disagree a bit on the process. I want to come out the other side of this knowing I didn't miss a thing, I did it all right and with respect for everyone.

[NickFeek]

good, lol,making you laugh was my intention

 

Thanks! I need as much of that as I can get.

[2sunny]

Just to set the record straight, here's a quote from your posting: "explain to her that since she chose not to play in your sandbox (hers is work, work, work only!) and you aren't allowed to play in hers..."

 

Other than that, you have me pegged wrong. I will NEVER believe that flashing your balls at someone you respect is a good thing to do. I am WAY more patient & reasonable than that. AND IN THE END, the outcome will be the same, but with LESS HURT spread during the process.

 

Besides our interpersonal issues, I am very very much the man I want to be and was meant to be. My issues reside ALL within the her & me dynamic. And within that, yes, you do have a point about me letting her run the show. In the end, action will be the only thing that changes anything. Before then, we'll have to disagree a bit on the process. I want to come out the other side of this knowing I didn't miss a thing, I did it all right and with respect for everyone.

 

you have not been the man you were intended to be - since you have handed her all the power in your R - thus becoming her doormat. i highly doubt you intended to be a doormat.

 

yes, i said explain it to her. call and leave her your decision, based on your evidence, on her voicemail.

 

no need to beat the dead horse any further - just explain to her that you realized she has made her decision with her lack of change, lack of action, lack of participating. she can move. she won't until you tell her to stop coming home.

 

THAT would be realistic considering she doesn't participate much in the household anyway.

 

that would be YOU standing firm on acknowledging that the horse is dead and things need to change.

 

change is good - brings about new possibilities = and brings tons of hope. but you can't get it standing still - there has to be some forward movement in order to get to a better place.

[2sunny]

i'd bet money if you did what i suggest - she'd start participating differently after you tell her not to come home.

 

she might just change if you kick her out. she might get scared that it's over. she might stop working so late.

 

she might actually think you are serious when you take action.

[NickFeek]

i'd bet money if you did what i suggest - she'd start participating differently after you tell her not to come home.

 

she might just change if you kick her out. she might get scared that it's over. she might stop working so late.

 

she might actually think you are serious when you take action.

 

I was just discussing this with someone. No question a drastic change on my part is the only thing that MIGHT compel her to change her approach. What's amazed me is that I've done everything differently this time, and I can see how that's making her more afraid; but every step of the way she digs in deeper. I keep thinking my next step will break her, but no. The fact that I told her on Monday that there's no way we can continue like this, and that I DO NOT want things to be the way they were ever again, should have shaken her more in my opinion. But she is damn tough. So the only thing that's left is for ME to tell HER it's over, and then leave.

[2sunny]

I was just discussing this with someone. No question a drastic change on my part is the only thing that MIGHT compel her to change her approach. What's amazed me is that I've done everything differently this time, and I can see how that's making her more afraid; but every step of the way she digs in deeper. I keep thinking my next step will break her, but no. The fact that I told her on Monday that there's no way we can continue like this, and that I DO NOT want things to be the way they were ever again, should have shaken her more in my opinion. But she is damn tough. So the only thing that's left is for ME to tell HER it's over, and then leave.

 

ok, then DO that... knowing that SHE left no option.

[NickFeek]

Absolutely, and thanks for the prodding.

[2sunny]

Absolutely, and thanks for the prodding.

 

prodding.... :lmao::lmao:

[NickFeek]

Ha! Hey I admit I need it!

[2sunny]

does your wife find time to get her hair done, nails done, groceries bought and shop for clothes every now and then?

[NickFeek]

does your wife find time to get her hair done, nails done, groceries bought and shop for clothes every now and then?

 

I do all the grocery shopping, which is no big deal. Nails aren't a thing for her. As for hair & clothes shopping, hardly ever. She gets to those things maybe 2-3 times a year. She never even takes a lunch break at work. Why do you ask?

[2sunny]

I do all the grocery shopping, which is no big deal. Nails aren't a thing for her. As for hair & clothes shopping, hardly ever. She gets to those things maybe 2-3 times a year. She never even takes a lunch break at work. Why do you ask?

 

ok. so you now know that when you do things = she doesn't - or doesn't need to.

 

so stop doing the grocery shopping. let her participate. force it. go without food in the house if necessary. see if she even attempts to make an effort.

 

since YOU do everything = she needs to do nothing.

 

i experienced this when i was married. my exH did it all. it was quite a shock as a 45 year old woman to learn to DO for myself again. good balance would have been ME participating in the daily errands... he was such a control freak though, that he wanted to DO it all... and i simply kept up with the house. he shopped for food, clothes, furniture etc. all of it.

 

but that's not healthy or good balance. i should have known how to do those things... she should know how to do it too! more than that - she should be DOING it at least half the time! so stop doing it! you are making it easy for her NOT to participate by doing these things.

 

step back. look. see what you DO each day... and stop doing those things. let it go... when she notices that things are needed - let her go get them. this is why it's called a partnership. tell her you're no longer handling those things and you trust she can handle them now. smile when you say it. and step back.

 

she won't DO more as long as you take care of it all.

[NickFeek]

ok. so you now know that when you do things = she doesn't - or doesn't need to.

 

so stop doing the grocery shopping. let her participate. force it. go without food in the house if necessary. see if she even attempts to make an effort.

 

since YOU do everything = she needs to do nothing.

 

i experienced this when i was married. my exH did it all. it was quite a shock as a 45 year old woman to learn to DO for myself again. good balance would have been ME participating in the daily errands... he was such a control freak though, that he wanted to DO it all... and i simply kept up with the house. he shopped for food, clothes, furniture etc. all of it.

 

but that's not healthy or good balance. i should have known how to do those things... she should know how to do it too! more than that - she should be DOING it at least half the time! so stop doing it! you are making it easy for her NOT to participate by doing these things.

 

step back. look. see what you DO each day... and stop doing those things. let it go... when she notices that things are needed - let her go get them. this is why it's called a partnership. tell her you're no longer handling those things and you trust she can handle them now. smile when you say it. and step back.

 

she won't DO more as long as you take care of it all.

 

Coincidentally (or not), I was just having this discussion with someone else yesterday. I was saying how I have no problem taking care of these things, and would continue to do whatever as long as I could have my freedom. He said that arrangement doesn't give her a chance to A. realize what she'd be missing without my support; and B. learn how to do these things for herself.

 

At this point, I do exactly half the household chores, all the bills, almost all of the errands & shopping, all of the doctors appointments, all of the taking to school, much of the pickup (when the babysitter is sick or something), a good deal of taking days off from work for the kids. I get all our cash (she does not have her own ATM card), and do almost all of the driving. And the list goes on from there.

 

I'd say one prime reason she'd consider moving back to our hometown is to have family support to help do all the things I do for her now. But I think it would be an important growth step for her to do these things herself, and to see how much of her time & functionality are eaten up by her job.

[2sunny]

Coincidentally (or not), I was just having this discussion with someone else yesterday. I was saying how I have no problem taking care of these things, and would continue to do whatever as long as I could have my freedom. He said that arrangement doesn't give her a chance to A. realize what she'd be missing without my support; and B. learn how to do these things for herself.

 

At this point, I do exactly half the household chores, all the bills, almost all of the errands & shopping, all of the doctors appointments, all of the taking to school, much of the pickup (when the babysitter is sick or something), a good deal of taking days off from work for the kids. I get all our cash (she does not have her own ATM card), and do almost all of the driving. And the list goes on from there.

 

I'd say one prime reason she'd consider moving back to our hometown is to have family support to help do all the things I do for her now. But I think it would be an important growth step for her to do these things herself, and to see how much of her time & functionality are eaten up by her job.

 

stop it. just stop.

 

you are a doormat. plain and simple. why does she need to do anything?

 

when you STOP doing all those things - she will HAVE to FIND the time to start participating. have her do the marketing. drive the kids to school and get her own money if she needs it! you are making yourself her errand boy. women don't respect a man that bows down at every turn meanwhile giving her free reign to live as if she has no family at all. so stop. make her see that she needs to step up to the table and DO some participating in the household. let her make dinner, do dishes, do homework etc.

 

can you stop?

[NickFeek]

stop it. just stop.

 

you are a doormat. plain and simple. why does she need to do anything?

 

when you STOP doing all those things - she will HAVE to FIND the time to start participating. have her do the marketing. drive the kids to school and get her own money if she needs it! you are making yourself her errand boy. women don't respect a man that bows down at every turn meanwhile giving her free reign to live as if she has no family at all. so stop. make her see that she needs to step up to the table and DO some participating in the household. let her make dinner, do dishes, do homework etc.

 

can you stop?

 

She does do a bunch of things for the house & the kids, but I'm sure I do the bulk. I hear you, and this arrangement would be mostly fine for me if our personal life was healthy. I wouldn't mind picking up the slack in those areas.

 

But from this perspective, I can see how me doing all that has made it much easier for her to get lost in work without the need to step out of that & do practical life things. I CAN and will stop doing things for her, but I really don't want to stop doing things for the kids.

[2sunny]

She does do a bunch of things for the house & the kids, but I'm sure I do the bulk. I hear you, and this arrangement would be mostly fine for me if our personal life was healthy. I wouldn't mind picking up the slack in those areas.

 

But from this perspective, I can see how me doing all that has made it much easier for her to get lost in work without the need to step out of that & do practical life things. I CAN and will stop doing things for her, but I really don't want to stop doing things for the kids.

 

it doesn't matter what you would NORMALLY want to do - this is designed to see IF she'll even TRY to DO something rather than not much - or nothing.

 

IF you don't DO it - we need to see if she will.

 

IF you divorce - she's going to be forced to do some of these things anyway... so it's essentially getting her into practice for what may be coming.

 

she doesn't participate in the family because YOU do most of it. when you look at HOW YOU PARTICIPATE - you need to understand that it affects others... and for her = she is off the hook... simply because she KNOWS you are going to do all the $hit stuff.

 

when YOU stop playing the familiar role - she's going to HAVE to adjust. then see what she does or doesn't do.

 

 

 

on a side note - this isn't a marriage, partnership - or anything that looks close to loving behavior. you aren't married. if you are - you're married to a ghost! that ghost can easily be replaced by someone who participates.

 

why stay? there's no reason to stay when she isn't even participating.

[NickFeek]

it doesn't matter what you would NORMALLY want to do - this is designed to see IF she'll even TRY to DO something rather than not much - or nothing.

 

when YOU stop playing the familiar role - she's going to HAVE to adjust. then see what she does or doesn't do.

 

on a side note - this isn't a marriage, partnership - or anything that looks close to loving behavior. you aren't married. if you are - you're married to a ghost! that ghost can easily be replaced by someone who participates.

 

why stay? there's no reason to stay when she isn't even participating.

 

Ah okay, now I see what you're saying. I think I may be just as scared as she is to give up the familiar role. Old habits die hard, better the devil you know, etc. etc. I WILL do it, but it won't be easy. I think I've been latching onto the daily routine as a comfort against the loneliness.

 

Wow, that's a hard-hitting side note! But sad to say I agree with you. And if there's ANY future for us at all, there's NO WAY it's going to happen if we just adjust or keep going. There has to be a clean break, after which we'll see which way both of us drift, and how both of us change. At this point, I'm only looking forward to the separation, even with how hard it will be. I still feel terrible for her. She's a good person who got horribly lost inside. I wish her only the best, but I can't suffer next to her anymore.

[2sunny]

Ah okay, now I see what you're saying. I think I may be just as scared as she is to give up the familiar role. Old habits die hard, better the devil you know, etc. etc. I WILL do it, but it won't be easy. I think I've been latching onto the daily routine as a comfort against the loneliness.

 

Wow, that's a hard-hitting side note! But sad to say I agree with you. And if there's ANY future for us at all, there's NO WAY it's going to happen if we just adjust or keep going. There has to be a clean break, after which we'll see which way both of us drift, and how both of us change. At this point, I'm only looking forward to the separation, even with how hard it will be. I still feel terrible for her. She's a good person who got horribly lost inside. I wish her only the best, but I can't suffer next to her anymore.

 

well you doing it all is only ENABLING her to continue her suffering.

 

yes, you are her enabler. so stop being that to her. go out and eat with your kids. when she comes home and sees no groceries - she will understand you are on strike - she can fend for herself.

 

she needs to do nothing because you will do it. that's not balance.

 

when you don't take the kids in the morning - allow her to understand it's because she didn't drive them. tell the kids "mom is driving now - tell her what time you need her to take you"

 

have her make appointments, and et them there. have her take a day off when they are sick... this is what a parent does - this is what i did... this is what my exH did when we divorced. he is a super busy man - but a parent DOES things for their children, even IF they ARE busy!

 

IF she doesn't intend to drive them, shop and make it to appointments - then you, my dear, are with the world's most selfish and self centered woman.

 

 

she has come to know you as her errand boy, cook, bill payer, and childcare person... she does not see you as an equal or a partner. she doesn't even see you as her lover.

 

you have assumed the perfect role for her = the doormat.

 

YOU should be damn angry. change things!

[NickFeek]

well you doing it all is only ENABLING her to continue her suffering.

 

yes, you are her enabler. so stop being that to her. go out and eat with your kids. when she comes home and sees no groceries - she will understand you are on strike - she can fend for herself.

 

she needs to do nothing because you will do it. that's not balance.

 

when you don't take the kids in the morning - allow her to understand it's because she didn't drive them. tell the kids "mom is driving now - tell her what time you need her to take you"

 

have her make appointments, and et them there. have her take a day off when they are sick... this is what a parent does - this is what i did... this is what my exH did when we divorced. he is a super busy man - but a parent DOES things for their children, even IF they ARE busy!

 

IF she doesn't intend to drive them, shop and make it to appointments - then you, my dear, are with the world's most selfish and self centered woman.

 

 

she has come to know you as her errand boy, cook, bill payer, and childcare person... she does not see you as an equal or a partner. she doesn't even see you as her lover.

 

you have assumed the perfect role for her = the doormat.

 

YOU should be damn angry. change things!

 

Again, this person I talked to yesterday also used the word "ENABLER". And I'm really seeing that's true. I think a big break is in order for us, so she can get herself back together. It's odd. I'd never have thought of her as a selfish person, and in fact she claims I'm way more selfish than she is (in some ways I might be). There's a definite high level of resentment in her that she is the primary breadwinner & has all that burden on her shoulders, so I think she justifies her not doing all this other stuff because of that. I swallowed that line of thinking whole until recently. But no more. I AM damn angry. And wow, to see it put in words that she doesn't see me as an equal partner or her lover really drives it home.

[2sunny]

for what it's worth - i still smell a rat... i think her emotional and intimacy must be placed somewhere else besides home.

 

i don't want to get off track - but i can usually see it from this far away.

 

if it were me - i'd walk right into her office today - pay close attention to what's happening while you are there... and how she reacts... and how "others" react to you visiting your wife at work.

 

sit down and give her your new rules... calmly, cleanly and straight up. just the facts. speak your truth.

 

no room for any argument - just state what you are no longer willing to DO for her.

 

see how she acts... it's only right that you let her know... and do it at work - since she's always there and won't answer email or her phone.

 

give her what options she's left you with - which is nothing... except to walk in there and tell her what you aren't gonna do any longer.

 

this is what taking "action" on a new, healthy boundary looks like...