Back and Forth...Still in Love

[optimisticgirl]

Ok, so many times did you go talk to him after the big argument? Who exactly went to offer a gift and an olive branch?

 

Just playing devil's advocate here, if you were so lacking in empathy, stable emotions in all the 3 years you were together, in fact you forced him to go to family events (really unforgivable that)..... erm, what does that say about him then?

 

I am not out of the woods either to be giving any advice, but (I will after all) in a healthy relationship both partners are respected, opinions valued. Basically you don't want a door mat.

 

Bet he wasn't a doormat either, you are just forgetting the negative bits here. About contacting him , I would say don't. You have said enough, let him have space. If he wants you, he will let you know. Keep yourself busy. Be it flat hunting, re-decorating, cleaning, learning new recipes and actually cooking from scratch.

 

okay. you are right chloe. i've done enough. ive done MORE than enough. way more. WAY more. and as much as i am willing to compromise on things with him...i don't want to be a doormat. I've seen women that are doormats. i just won't ever be one of them. It's not in my DNA.

 

The forcing him to go to family events stuff - my brother and him do not get along. Mainly...because they are the same exact person. Loud,opinionated, excitable. However, they have a difference of opinion on everrrrrrrything from ice-cream to politics to the way board games are played. So Ex would sometimes put up a fight to go to family events (i will give him a break here...my family consists of 5 children, all around the same age. we have 16 cousins also around the same age, and we get together a lot.) anyhow. he comes from a small family, other than his parents, no one lives in the same town. We go from my house with 43565 people to his house with just his parents on holidays. He gets overwhelmed. Anyone would. This year his family came over to my families house on thanksgiving.......everything was meshing, extremely well. UGH - WTF!!

 

Anyways.

Gator - you are spot on with this stuff about NC! It hasn't been long at all and he's been texting.

 

Today he called. left a voice mail...."need to know who the dogs vet is - i need to get his nails clipped. and they won't do it at the groomer til they know xy&z - can you PLEASE call me BACK"

 

really dude. the dogs nails clipped? You're going to call me, about the dogs nails?

 

i messaged him back...45 minutes later. all i said was the name and place of the vet. (told myself not to do it...told myself it was "for the dog"...but lets get serious...i caved.)

 

Big surprise - nothing substantial back form him after that other than "already taken care of, thanks a lot for helping me out earlier, you could have just responded." ---what a freakin jerk! i didn't respond to that text.

 

he needed to know info about the dog. gave it to him. whatever...all the dog's info at the vet and the groomer is in my name...I'm the one who took him to the vet (big surprise.) so I'm guessing they wouldn't release anything to him.

 

I have no trouble keeping myself busy! work all day, class all night! Its after class, and before work that I get all upset. Even after class, after all my progress, i almost went over there! Weekends are hard...but I'm going to try to make some solid plans for the weekend.

 

Sigh...bed alone. It's weird. Very weird.

[optimisticgirl]

Mornings are the hardest for me.

 

I just want to talk to him give him a big hug, and work it out, - but he has turned into a different person. He isn't at all loving.

 

He has never acted like this before, totally hating me. I don't understand.

 

Why isn't he calling me more? Telling me to come home? Why is it so hard for me to leave him alone? He seems to be just fine, going about his day like he is unaffected.

 

He said that he "needed to be his own man and he is happy that he can have time to figure himself out now. and that he doesn't want to settle for me."

 

He says these mean things...it makes me feel really upset. I don't know who he turned into.

 

I want to go home...and back to our life...he never said the word "settle" before. Before I was his beautiful girl. The "best". He sent me texts every other day of how I was amazing and how much he loved me...

 

I don't understand how it just changes...

 

And why can't i stop thinking about him...and hoping...im clinging..i don't know how to stop. Or how to stop thinking of HIS feelings too.

 

I want to go over...tell him we need to start NOW to fix things. I know it would be just fine....i know it...

 

why can't he just let it happen?

[optimisticgirl]

Last time I saw him...

 

he said maybe in a few months we can try to work things out.

 

why can't we just do it right the **** now.

[700miles]

Optimistic...

 

I can relate to you on SO many levels, even though I am quite a bit older. You sound like an over-achiever. You work hard, you put everything you have into everything you do, right? It's so hard to feel like you've "failed." Am I on track? You sound like you're beating yourself up because you over-reacted and threw a phone...so, I'm guessing that it was out of character for you. It's not a good way to communicate, but we ALL react to things poorly from time to time...it's human nature and NOT a deal breaker in a healthy relationship.

 

When I was married, I threw a remote control in anger. I felt HORRIBLE, even though my husband at the time did things like that and more on a regular basis. I was embarassed, ashamed. At that moment, I realized that I did not like who I had become in that relationship. It opened my eyes to what the situation REALLY was...not what I wanted it to be.

 

Have you ever heard of Dr. Laura Berman? I listen to her on my XM radio. She is a sex therapist, but talks about every facet of relationships. Anyway...she is a firm believer that a couple should have complete access to each other's phones, emails, etc... Not that they will ever use that access, but it is understood. "Those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing."

 

I'm guessing there is more going on with your guy. I may be TOTALLY wrong though, not knowing him or more details. But, normally, people do not ignore someone they are in a serious committed relationship with, and they do not end things over a phone violation.

 

He sounds emotionally abusive. You have already demonstrated that you have SOOOOOOOOOOOOO much going for you!!!! There is a warm, understanding man out there waiting for a strong, independant, smart, fun girl who can cook!!

 

After a break up, a friend once reminded me, "You didn't think anyone was out there when he came along...there will always be others until you find the match you are looking for." It's been true and has/is helping me get through lonely times.

 

You deserve better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Have you ever made an objective list of what you want in someone? (Not loosely based on the guy you're with btw.) Try that and see if he HONESTY matches your requirements. You can afford to be selective!

 

This message is meant to encourage and support...hope you see it that way.

 

Best wishes!!!!!!!!! Your future looks bright!

[gator12]

Stay strong. If he wants to come back nothing will stop him from doing so. Ignore anything he said during the breakup, that doesn't mean anything. Breakups are filled with emotions, this is why we go into NC so we can get our heads on straight. Your text back to him was okay since it was just information but don't respond to other things, let him know you don't need him. (Even if you do, let him think you don't) Guys love independent women, women we can't have. It's a simple fact, my ex said no to me two times before agreeing to date me and that only made me want to date her even more.

 

It'll get better, but you need to get out and have fun, one month of NC will be here before you know it, and you'll be so proud of yourself. Don't worry about him in any way shape or form, the funny thing is NC is going to put him in the exact position your in right now. And when you finally get that power in your hands everything is going to change.

 

-Gator

[optimisticgirl]

Ran into him yesterday at school. This was planned, by him, he swears otherwise...but he is NEVER in the building that I am in...and just "happened" to be there.

 

This morning he sent me a message asking me to come over tonight so we can talk and try to work things out. That he wants to take baby steps...he loves me..can I please talk to him. Can we please stop playing games, and just have an honest talk.

 

Haven't responded yet. The meeting at school was great - it only lasted about 20 minutes. As I was on my way to class...and acting very aloof..

 

Should I go? AH! Im scared!

[optimisticgirl]

I still haven't said anything! I want to very badly!

 

I'm just scared that he is going to LURE me over there saying he wants to talk and try to work things out and he loves me and then we'll end up getting nowhere.

 

It's only been a few days of me ignoring him.

 

He didn't say "I WANT YOU BACK" he just said he wants to try.

 

I have two rationals here -

 

1.TRYING is okay. Relationships take work. If he can do the work. I can do the work. So I should probably here him out of what his definition of "compromise and trying" are. But every time I've seen him since the break up, with the exception of last night at school, it just ends up getting emotional and we argue!

 

2. If I tell him I have plans tonight and we can talk tomorrow, his reaction will tell me whether or not he is actually serious or if he was just luring me back in for selfish reasons. (But i don't actually have plans, so. thats a lie...and sort of a game.)

 

Please! Help! Or do i just ignore it completely and wait for another message? It's super soon.

[confused31]

Just go. Life is too damn short to be playing games like this. Hear what he has to say, and then decide if you believe it or not. Sorry to say this, but your situation will not be figured out in a week or two. It will take months before you ever have a chance of feeling that normal relationship feeling again. You might as well get all the information you need to make the correct decision for you. At this point its all about you, screw the person who doesnt know if you're good enough for them.

[optimisticgirl]

Just go. Life is too damn short to be playing games like this. Hear what he has to say, and then decide if you believe it or not. Sorry to say this, but your situation will not be figured out in a week or two. It will take months before you ever have a chance of feeling that normal relationship feeling again. You might as well get all the information you need to make the correct decision for you. At this point its all about you, screw the person who doesn't know if you're good enough for them.

 

 

I agree. Life is too short to play games. I think that's what he's saying. Recent events however have led me to believe its all BS and he's just trying to get me to come over without actually wanting to resolve things.

 

I'll just think positive. Go over with a clear head...hear what he has to say. say what i've got to say. And do my best not to react if he starts an argument. Then walk away if he does.

 

I know it won't get fixed in a few weeks. Or overnight. Things that can be fixed over night aren't even worth it!

[chloe56]

Hey, you have a good head on you. You know what you want, that is the most important thing. Just ask yourself, will you regret not meeting with him and hearing him out? Just keep calm whatever happens if you do go. We will be here for you.

[gator12]

I don't know if I would go over personally, because if things don't go the way you planned you've lost any progress that you've already made.

 

If he wants to work things out, fine, don't make it easy for him. Don't take him back the second he says those words, let him know he is going to have to work for it. I don't know if you guys have really learned from the breakup is my point though. Yea you miss him, and yea you love him and you may get back together. But if none of the problems have been fixed they WILL come back up again. And the second chance will fail.

 

All in all it's your call, play it cool should you go. Don't get excited for anything he says to you, indifference is the key to all of this, even reconciliation. Ooo and be prepared for the worst, because chances are this first meeting won't change much. I still don't think you should do it.

 

All that being said, good luck, stay strong, and don't worry. Be calm and collected when you go over.

 

-Gator

[loveforever]

Im worried that he has too much pride to come back.

 

Im worried that since he said "its over" that he wont come back

 

I worry about the same thing with my ex-husband.....

 

Although I've told him several times and he knows that I still love him, I worry that his pride and stubbornness will get in the way....

 

Aaaaahhhhhhh, why does love have to be so complicated....????

[gator12]

True love is stronger than pride guys. No emotion is stronger than real love so your worries are unfounded. There is no reason to be worried so relaz and don't even think about the what if's. If it's real love the guy will come back, nothing can stop us from fighting for something once we realize we want it.

 

-Gator

[jenny_ruthie09]

I really have to commend gator on his support all thru out. Im having same problem as you and the most we need now is a man's point of view to guide us into making rational instead of emotional reactions.

 

Although I cant be perfect ,yesterday I managed not to reply to his txt when he's saying all sweet that lets go of the past and forgive each other. Since I did not reply, he sent another message today completely different from positive response that I might be out dating someone else already which left me frustrated and cant help but replying pls find and know what you really want because u say one thing yesterday and a different thing today. To which he replied more anger that all this is my fault because i had a rebound during the time we broke off. So now i learned my lesson complete NC is the way to go. Some things never change. Its time he realize his mistakes. I may cry and mop for 2 weeks but I'll get through it.

 

And knowing that I am not alone and we can share the low moments here is such a good thing, just keep posting this is part of our recovery period. One day, we'll realize that we've done it.

 

Cheers gator. Thanks for the support. Keep inspiring us and keep reminding us how men think and how not to experience same bad situation.

[gator12]

Thanks jenny, kind words always mean a lot to me. Idk, I figure a man's perspective on things is needed in situations like these, because we really don't think like women do in a lot of ways. NC in my experience is the best way to both move on and to get someone back which is why I usually am in favor of it. Breaking it too early just ends up with someone getting hurt. So stay strong, you never know when he'll be coming back, and if he doesn't you're way better off.

 

-Gator

[optimisticgirl]

Jenny and Gator, 700, Chloe...everyone. You are such wonderful people. Gator a special shout out to you, you are like a rock to all of us! I know you hear that a lot, and I've evn said it before. But you are going to make some woman very, very happy one day. If it's not this particular girl, it will be someone who loves you just as much as you love them.

 

For an update. We're not out of the woods what so ever. AT ALL. But starting with baby steps. I obviously went over...we talked and talked and talked about compromises and what each of us were expecting from the relationship. Literally, a weight lifted off my shoulders the minute I saw him.

 

I'm doing my best to not get my hopes completley up and scream "WERE FINE!" - I know that in the end the relationship is just about the two of us...but we have to figure out what the next step is. I can't hurt my parents, our friends, or his paretns again.

 

The plan is - over the next few weeks...see how things go. Sort of "date" each other.

 

After our big talk, we went to dinner - some mutual friends ran into us and started screaming with joy - "YAY, OMG DO YOU GUYS WANNA GO OUT NEXT WEEKEND? WE MISSED YOU SO MUCH!"

 

I laughed, so did he. It was actually rather funny, but I didn't want to get ahead of myself. It was nice to see that other people are happy too though...we didn't make plans with them though.

 

I just want you to know, especially you gator, that I am being careful. Very careful. I know - that at any moment, this entire thing could blow up again. And I also know - that the next few weeks are going to be BRUTAL.

 

I have no clue what I am going to say to his mother. Our friends will be fine...but our families...will be the tough ones. Either way. Its hopeful. I'm nervous, yes, but...its a step in the right direction.

[optimisticgirl]

Also...

 

NC does work. For all you no contactors. KEEP doing it.

 

I'm still not calling him as much as I used to. Literally...we'd talk pretty much all day before. I'm at work right now...he's messaged me three time already. Haven't answered one of them.

 

This is what I have learned so far. Be yourself. Do your thing. Live your life. and don't let the relationship consume you. It is the most attractive thing you could ask for in a partner.

 

Think about when you first met him/her. You didn't say "oh. i like him because he's obbsessed with me."

 

Now - believe me - I very well have no clue what im talking about.

 

But NC worked for me. and then once the lines were open..and we sat down and talked. Honesty worked.

[optimisticgirl]

wELP! Just read over the last posts that I made. How irritating.

 

 

You guessed it! He's "CONFUSED" again.

 

**** this.

 

It's ****ing Valentines day. You're confused? You don't know how to move forward, your scared....BLAH BLAH BLAH B LAH BLAH. Don't ****ing talk to me unless you actually ****ing WANT TO and not for selfish reasons.

 

I hate you EX. I hate you.

 

Why do you do this to me. Why do you give me false hope with such real words and real actions. Does this make you feel better?

 

Please pray for me that I do not ever speak to him again. Please pray that I don't let him trick me again. Please pray for me that I'll be okay.

 

Im so lost. I should have listened to you gator and not gone over.n And to you 700 and realized that he is emotionally abusive.

[gator12]

First off, thank you so much for your kind words, they really mean a lot to me, I'm so glad to be able to help all of you. Secondly, I am so proud of far you have come Optimistic, you really have learned so much these past few weeks and are well on your way to a wonderful life.

 

As for breaking contact, I know you're hurt and I am so sorry. You did everything in your broken NC right though, took it slow and played it cool. The guy has emotional problems. You just need to go back into NC and do not message him again. Unless he says those magic words just ignore whatever else he has to tell you, even if it is an apology. Unless he wants you back, you have nothing more to do with him.'

 

You've gotten to the point where you live for you, and I am so proud of you. The guy is a loser, he will realize what a great girl he has lost and will come running right back. But by then I have a feeling you will be on to someone much better for you . Who knows, it doesn't matter. You have a wonderful life without him so go back to living it.

 

Oooo and Happy Valentine's Day.

[optimisticgirl]

Thanks Gator. My chin is up a little more today after a brutal holiday. The sun is shining.

 

He's confused. He's been confused the whole time. I've been pushing it I guess. I dunno. Holding onto it. Hearing what I want to hear. It's so hard to let go of. There is so much hair in the situation I forgot why I actually give a **** about him. At this point all I see is the negative.

 

He came unannounced to my parents last night with roses and stuffed shells (traditional VDAY meal for us. Normally I made it.) I was drunk on wine already. I hardly ever drink anymore. Doesn't take much!

 

He said ' babe you know how much i love you, and that you are my valentine, and that i enjoy doing things together, and talking to you. but i just don't think you moving back in is going to fix this. can we just see each other on the weekends for now so we could both focus on school and work, and our time together will be "special" and we can see if there is a way to move forward?"

 

I said no. Then he kept talking. and i said "fine" but that's not very fair. how do we move backwards like that and think of it as moving forward?

 

He said "Stop being so stubborn and have some faith in me. just let me figure this out before we just start resenting each other. Don't take everything so seriously, you have no idea what tomorrow is going to bring, just let it be for now, get your homework and work done, get to the gym, do your thing, i love it when you do your thing - let me do mine, and we'll see..."

 

After this talk, after i said "alright, i'll have faith", we talked about regular life and had a few laughs...but then i started bawling, it all seemed very forced. It was forced...for me anyway.

 

His reply was "this is just how men and women are...we don't think alike. we need to do this if we have any hope to save this. and we love each other."

 

So. That's where we are. I'm not calling him today. Not calling him tomorrow. Not calling him this week. If he thinks he wants to have "special" time with me. Then he can make the effort.

 

Im looking at an apartment on Friday. It's cute. Im scared to live alone. Scared to "have faith". And its hard to look at is as a fresh start if he's still going to be lurking around. Is it bad to be an all or nothing type of person? Is that wrong of me? Life isn't black and white, but is this?

 

he is right on one thing....I need to stop obsessing. And focus on myself.

[ladii]

he wants to take it slow...how it should be...and you seem to want it fast...moving in again ???

 

You can't expect it to work out after a break up if you rush and expect it all to be back to normal...

 

This is not the old relationship anymore..this is like meeting for the first time and getting to know each other all over again...

 

he is right in thinking to take it slow...relax and go with the flow...

 

I don't think you are emotionally ready to reconcile if you are already being so emotional about his view in taking it step by step...

[heartshaped]

he wants to take it slow...how it should be...and you seem to want it fast...moving in again ???

 

You can't expect it to work out after a break up if you rush and expect it all to be back to normal...

 

This is not the old relationship anymore..this is like meeting for the first time and getting to know each other all over again...

 

he is right in thinking to take it slow...relax and go with the flow...

 

I don't think you are emotionally ready to reconcile if you are already being so emotional about his view in taking it step by step...

 

She's right. It sounds to me like you want your old relationship back. A lot of people who want their exs back want their old relationship back, but you have to face the fact that the relationship the two of you had together previously is over.

 

You cannot just pick up after everything has happened and say 'this didn't happen, let's just continue our lives like we were never broken up.' You can start over, but starting over is just like starting a new relationship only harder because now you know all the other person's faults, there has been significant damage to the relationship, and you both have to work on repairing something that is essentially broken.

 

I think he is doing the right thing in wanting to take things slow, that's the only way it will work. Whether or not you want to do start over with him is your decision.

[gator12]

Thanks Gator. My chin is up a little more today after a brutal holiday. The sun is shining.

 

He's confused. He's been confused the whole time. I've been pushing it I guess. I dunno. Holding onto it. Hearing what I want to hear. It's so hard to let go of. There is so much hair in the situation I forgot why I actually give a **** about him. At this point all I see is the negative.

 

He came unannounced to my parents last night with roses and stuffed shells (traditional VDAY meal for us. Normally I made it.) I was drunk on wine already. I hardly ever drink anymore. Doesn't take much!

 

He said ' babe you know how much i love you, and that you are my valentine, and that i enjoy doing things together, and talking to you. but i just don't think you moving back in is going to fix this. can we just see each other on the weekends for now so we could both focus on school and work, and our time together will be "special" and we can see if there is a way to move forward?"

 

I said no. Then he kept talking. and i said "fine" but that's not very fair. how do we move backwards like that and think of it as moving forward?

 

He said "Stop being so stubborn and have some faith in me. just let me figure this out before we just start resenting each other. Don't take everything so seriously, you have no idea what tomorrow is going to bring, just let it be for now, get your homework and work done, get to the gym, do your thing, i love it when you do your thing - let me do mine, and we'll see..."

 

After this talk, after i said "alright, i'll have faith", we talked about regular life and had a few laughs...but then i started bawling, it all seemed very forced. It was forced...for me anyway.

 

His reply was "this is just how men and women are...we don't think alike. we need to do this if we have any hope to save this. and we love each other."

 

So. That's where we are. I'm not calling him today. Not calling him tomorrow. Not calling him this week. If he thinks he wants to have "special" time with me. Then he can make the effort.

 

Im looking at an apartment on Friday. It's cute. Im scared to live alone. Scared to "have faith". And its hard to look at is as a fresh start if he's still going to be lurking around. Is it bad to be an all or nothing type of person? Is that wrong of me? Life isn't black and white, but is this?

 

he is right on one thing....I need to stop obsessing. And focus on myself.

 

It is all or nothing in a lot of respects, but easing back into a second chance should be done slowly. Rushing in to it will ruin any chances of it being successful. At these point keep it casual, and keep your guard up, be ready for him to abruptly change his mind. Make him make the effort, that is just perfect. Be aware this second chance will take a lot of work, and that yesterday may have just been the "holidays talking" Don't rush into the hard work necessarily but eventually that will be what it takes to get it to work if he's serious. Both of you need to have changed and it CANNOT be the same relationship again or it will fail again.

 

-Gator

[optimisticgirl]

1. He suggested I move back in. I just agreed. Which is why i was so mad when he flipped out about it again, making it sound like it was my idea.

 

2. Either way. Im calm. Calm for myself. The holidays aren't talking any more!

 

3. The points all of you make about it having to be a new relationship really hit home. On my way home from class...i was thinking to myself "why can't we just go back to normal!"

 

But "normal" now that I think about it...was what got us here in the first place. If you read from he beginning...the "normal" is what made me react so hard in the first place and what made us get into such an argument. So....if a new relationship can work, then it will work.

 

If not...then...it isn't right. Marriage goes through changes of lifestyle all the time...if we can't get through this type of change, we would've gotten divorced anyhow.

 

Thanks. For the reasonable words. I love you LS.

[gator12]

Congratulations, optimistic. I was always pulling for you, I hope that you guys can really work through all of the things that broke you up the first time. But remember take it slow, there's no rush and no need to pressure. And if you ever feel the need for more advice you can always turn to us here. I'm very happy for you and hope things really work out for you, you deserve it .

 

All the best,

Gator