Getting into the dating scene...

[GooseChaser]

Hello! Well, things are getting exciting for me lately, and I wanted to ask for advice, following a short description of how things have been going.

 

For the last month or two I have been dating a good friend of mine. It started out as "FWB", but I feel that we have moved on to a point where I can call it dating, because he feels comfortable now with asking me out and taking things a bit more seriously. He still doesn't seem to be totally into me, though, and I don't think he will want commitment any time soon, though we have agreed on sexual exclusivity for now. That arrangement leaves us single and free to date others.

 

Which leads me to my next point! A guy I became acquainted with a month ago gave me a call tonight! He wants to meet me tomorrow for a date! I'm excited! He has expressed enthusiasm about meeting me, and I have a really good feeling about it! I know it's going to go great!

 

The way I see it, Guy #1 isn't taking things seriously with me and is a bit of a commitment-phobe at the moment (he's still getting over another girl), so dating others too seems like a good choice. It gives me a chance to meet someone who might take me seriously, unlike Guy #1, and if Guy #1 finds out he has competition and doesn't like that, he has two choices: he can use it to find motivation to take me off of the market by officially entering a relationship with me, or he can back off and let Guy #2 take his place if he isn't interested enough to do that.

 

So dating multiple people is a good start for me, I think. Also, if Guy #1 doesn't show that he is really into me, I am considering withholding sex until the point that he would be willing to be in a relationship, if that ever happened. That way, I can be free to make further choices about that with other guys I date. I'll find love yet, and ultimately, I'm not going to settle for less.

 

Any thoughts? Do I have the right idea here?

[tigressA]

You've lost your way with the idea that Guy #1 will want to have a relationship with you if you withhold sex, or do whatever else. If he wanted to date you, he would be dating you now. So just forget about him, period, and explore things with other guys. And not necessarily Guy #2. From what you've said, it honestly sounds like you're just using Guy #2 to make #1 jealous. It doesn't sound like you're really into him for his own sake.

[GooseChaser]

You've lost your way with the idea that Guy #1 will want to have a relationship with you if you withhold sex, or do whatever else. If he wanted to date you, he would be dating you now. So just forget about him, period, and explore things with the other guy. From what you've said, it honestly sounds like you're just using Guy #2 to make #1 jealous. It doesn't sound like you're really into him for his own sake.

No, I am interested in Guy #2! I just do not know Guy #2 very well, as I have only met him once, so of course I have not formed much of an opinion of him yet, though I think he's cute, and he seems sweet too. I could get attached to him, for sure! I would say that Guy #2 actually has an advantage over Guy #1 if he would consider commitment in time, because that totally trumps what Guy #1 can offer at this point. Guy #1 can't compete.

 

I really like Guy #1-- I've known him for years as a friend-- but he is just not ready for a relationship right now. I don't regret getting involved with him, because we've been able to help each other through getting over our respective rejections a bit. We both got rejected by people we really cared about, and well, Guy #1 is having a hard time with it. He put so much emotion into her and she just didn't feel the same way. Sometimes it's just not meant to be.

 

If Guy #1 really doesn't care, he will just shrug it off and find someone else. It doesn't seem like things are going anywhere with him; it's just a way to pass the time. I do enjoy spending time with him, but I want more. I want to be with someone who would be proud to call me his girlfriend.

[GooseChaser]

Also, I've learned so much from my time with Guy #1. He does care, and I appreciate that. He just isn't THAT into me. He was my first kiss, the first to ask me on dates, and the one to take my virginity too, and all of that is meaningful to me. I won't forget him.

[Mike B.]

Withholding sex from men to get them to commit does not work. It will backfire every time. Men, unlike women, cannot take step backwards when it comes to sex. They will depart the relationship altogether or continue to see you and start screwing someone else on the side while seeing much less of you.

 

If you want this guy#1 in a relationship, your best bet is that he just come to the point where he wants it. Dating others, just as you said, may help to nudge him. Withholding sex will give him the nudge to stop seeing you.

 

 

As a side, I recall someone responding to one of my post and saying that they just couldn't help someone who dates multiple women. I wonder if that same poster will post here and say that she can't help a woman who dates multiple men. I can do it.

[Mike B.]

Also, I've learned so much from my time with Guy #1. He does care, and I appreciate that. He just isn't THAT into me. He was my first kiss, the first to ask me on dates, and the one to take my virginity too, and all of that is meaningful to me. I won't forget him.

 

Why not add some humanity to Guy#1 and just call him "Craig" here.

[GooseChaser]

A recent text from Guy #1 that makes the situation with him crystal clear:

 

"I love you as a friend but our lives have made us wiser in such different areas that the relationship/fwb feels uncomfortable. The sex is great, but you're not my type to be honest. I wanted to help you out sexually as a friend and you seemed okay with that."

 

Conclusions:

• He always emphasizes "friend"-- not promising
  
• I like that he says the sex is good, ahaha
  
• I think it's sweet that he said "I love you", even if just as a friend. Maybe later I'll say it back.
  
• I wish that he would give it more of a chance. He thinks just because we have different backgrounds that we couldn't find enough in common. I don't think so. If anything, we could learn so much from each other, having expertise in different areas of life! It's just a shame.
  
• This isn't going anywhere.
  

[GooseChaser]

Withholding sex from men to get them to commit does not work. It will backfire every time. Men, unlike women, cannot take step backwards when it comes to sex. They will depart the relationship altogether or continue to see you and start screwing someone else on the side while seeing much less of you.

 

If you want this guy#1 in a relationship, your best bet is that he just come to the point where he wants it. Dating others, just as you said, may help to nudge him. Withholding sex will give him the nudge to stop seeing you.

 

As a side, I recall someone responding to one of my post and saying that they just couldn't help someone who dates multiple women. I wonder if that same poster will post here and say that she can't help a woman who dates multiple men. I can do it.

Thank you for your perspective, it helps. That's a good idea to just let things move on naturally. I can continue with the sexual relationship with "Craig" if I want, until I find I would prefer to end it and start one with someone else, like Guy #2 ("Arnold"), who I saw more of a future with.

 

I think what I'm going to do is work on improving my skills in the bedroom so the guy enjoys himself more with me , date a few guys, and see where things go from there. I'm sure everything will work out just fine in the end!

[Mike B.]

A recent text from Guy #1 that makes the situation with him crystal clear:

 

"I love you as a friend but our lives have made us wiser in such different areas that the relationship/fwb feels uncomfortable. The sex is great, but you're not my type to be honest. I wanted to help you out sexually as a friend and you seemed okay with that."

 

Conclusions:

• He always emphasizes "friend"-- not promising
  
• I like that he says the sex is good, ahaha
  
• I think it's sweet that he said "I love you", even if just as a friend. Maybe later I'll say it back.
  
• I wish that he would give it more of a chance. He thinks just because we have different backgrounds that we couldn't find enough in common. I don't think so. If anything, we could learn so much from each other, having expertise in different areas of life! It's just a shame.
  
• This isn't going anywhere.
  

 

Lay off him a bit, get into guy#2 and he will be running back to you. You can legitimately withhold sex in this situation without the negative side to it because the relationship would have changed and he technically no longer has rights to the benefits. Now this situation could work for you but you have to be dating guy#2 and by then you may not care how Craig feels.

[GooseChaser]

Lay off him a bit, get into guy#2 and he will be running back to you. You can legitimately withhold sex in this situation without the negative side to it because the relationship would have changed and he technically no longer has rights to the benefits. Now this situation could work for you but you have to be dating guy#2 and by then you may not care how Craig feels.

Is the situation different because he tries to call me "just a friend" and doesn't want commitment at this time? I think part of it is that he doesn't NEED to get into a relationship because he's already getting what he wants-- sex and companionship. "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?" Maybe if I withheld sex he would see more value in commitment?

[Mike B.]

I think what I'm going to do is work on improving my skills in the bedroom so the guy enjoys himself more with me , date a few guys, and see where things go from there. I'm sure everything will work out just fine in the end!

 

 

I appreciate your enthusiasm but your BJ and HJ skills will probably most important in setting you apart from others. Other than that, most guys will be happy with you just being present during the deed. Anything extra would, of course, be very welcomed. You will be fine in the end.

[GooseChaser]

I appreciate your enthusiasm but your BJ and HJ skills will probably most important in setting you apart from others. Other than that, most guys will be happy with you just being present during the deed. Anything extra would, of course, be very welcomed. You will be fine in the end.

Hehe, yeah, I'm not the best at BJs and HJs yet to be honest. That's just my inexperience though. I'll learn, you can be sure of that... Thanks for the tip! I didn't know that was so important! I guess it's the major method of turning them on quickly? The big thing I really want to do is turn up the intensity.

[tigressA]

I wouldn't want to date a guy who came running back just because I started dating someone else. JMHO.

 

Goose--he's already said the sex has been great. If you get comments from one guy like that, chances are that other guys you get involved with sexually would agree. So I personally don't see any reason to continue with him.

 

Also, I don't agree with the idea of you continuing a sexual relationship with one guy, hoping to get him to commit, and then going on dates with others. It just seems like taking advantage. If you weren't sleeping with him I wouldn't be saying that.

[GooseChaser]

Is the situation different because he tries to call me "just a friend" and doesn't want commitment at this time? I think part of it is that he doesn't NEED to get into a relationship because he's already getting what he wants-- sex and companionship. "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?" Maybe if I withheld sex he would see more value in commitment?

Or does he lose the rights to the benefits because I'm seeing other people?

[GooseChaser]

I wouldn't want to date a guy who came running back just because I started dating someone else. JMHO.

 

Goose--he's already said the sex has been great. If you get comments from one guy like that, chances are that other guys you get involved with sexually would agree. So I personally don't see any reason to continue with him.

 

Also, I don't agree with the idea of you continuing a sexual relationship with one guy, hoping to get him to commit, and then going on dates with others. It just seems like taking advantage. If you weren't sleeping with him I wouldn't be saying that.

Maybe it would be a good idea to just get to know both guys outside of a sexual relationship for a while then, if they were okay with it. (And if one of them wasn't, I could say goodbye! ) We could get to know each other better that way as people, and I could see who enjoyed just spending time with me without the sexual element added and was really into me. Sex has a way of complicating things.

[tigressA]

Or does he lose the rights to the benefits because I'm seeing other people?

 

He doesn't want a relationship with YOU. Period. I realize that comes off harsh, but that's really what you need at this point. I don't think he will ever want a relationship with you, not even if you're dating someone else. And if he does come running back, will you honestly never, ever wonder if it's because he really truly likes you for you, or if it was just because he didn't want someone else to have the "benefits"?

 

If he were sufficiently interested, you wouldn't even be posting here about this. You two would be in a relationship. But he isn't sufficiently interested. And I very much doubt that you going off and dating other guys would change that for him. He said point-blank that you are not his type. You should accept it and move on.

[GooseChaser]

He doesn't want a relationship with YOU. Period. I realize that comes off harsh, but that's really what you need at this point. I don't think he will ever want a relationship with you, not even if you're dating someone else. And if he does come running back, will you honestly never, ever wonder if it's because he really truly likes you for you, or if it was just because he didn't want someone else to have the "benefits"?

 

If he were sufficiently interested, you wouldn't even be posting here about this. You two would be in a relationship. But he isn't sufficiently interested. And I very much doubt that you going off and dating other guys would change that for him. He said point-blank that you are not his type. You should accept it and move on.

Good points, TigressA! Thanks! I agree that it is very telling that Craig said that I am "not his type". It makes me curious what "his type" is, but.... (For one, he says he usually doesn't date white women; he likes most other ethnicities, but not mine, I guess. Funny coincidence, because I'm often not attracted to hispanic men. I do like him though.) I understand the point that he is not looking for a relationship WITH ME, and I think that's true and an important point to notice. Well, I'll see how things go with Arnold, and if things work out with him, I can end things with Craig and feel good about having found someone who likes me enough to take that step to have a relationship!

[Mike B.]

Is the situation different because he tries to call me "just a friend" and doesn't want commitment at this time? I think part of it is that he doesn't NEED to get into a relationship because he's already getting what he wants-- sex and companionship. "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?" Maybe if I withheld sex he would see more value in commitment?

 

 

Well when you withhold sex from a man after giving him the blessing of commitment-free sex, he tends to think:

 

"WTF!? How is she just going to stop putting out!? Well **** her!"

 

Then he will go and cry on someone else's shoulder in hopes that that woman will replace the sex that he lost from the withholder.

 

 

Men tend not to think this way when sex is withheld from us: "Wow, she is cutting out the sex now after I was getting it commitment-free. I better hurry up and ask her to be my girlfriend or I will lose the sex!" This just doesn't happen.

 

 

So the best way for this to work out in your favor is to simply start getting into Arnold and treat Craig strictly as a friend and that means no flirting or anything. Craig cannot possibly be offended by him not getting the sex anymore because it is rightfully gone because the relationship has changed and you are dating someone else. He could start missing laying up with you while having relationship-free worry and then approach you about a relationship but this is a relatively small chance. He will very most likely say: "well, it was great while it lasted."

Edited October 4, 2010 by Mike B.

[GooseChaser]

So the best way for this to work out in your favor is to simply start getting into Arnold and treat Craig strictly as a friend and that means no flirting or anything. Craig cannot possibly be offended by him not getting the sex anymore because it is rightfully gone because the relationship has changed and you are dating someone else. He could start missing laying up with you while having relationship-free worry and then approach you about a relationship but this is a relatively small chance. He will most likely say: "well, it was great while it lasted."

Yeah, there was actually one time before that I did make a move to try to cut off the sexual relationship with him (but I changed my mind). This was his reaction through texts, which is probably really useful information:

 

"Thanks for being honest"

"It was fun while it lasted"

"What did the book say that made you change your mind?"

- (I'm not sure what book he's talking about here; I think it was some casual reading I was looking at at the time)

"You're not hurt, are you?"

"You need a church boy. Most don't want relationship stress, they wanna have fun"

"Just hit me up when you want attention, don't stress yourself with guys if you don't wanna. You need more friends, Goose, or sex?"

 

 

 

Conclusions:

• He said what you thought he might, Mike! "It was fun while it lasted"
  
• He accepted that I was stopping the sexual relationship and didn't freak out or anything
  
• He wanted to figure out WHY I wanted it to end
  
• When he thinks of relationships, he thinks "stress"... that's a really sad and negative way to look at them. They can be so happy.
  
• This line also says a lot: "Most don't want relationship stress, they wanna have fun." Here, he is saying what he wants-- fun.
  
• He values the sexual relationship and wants it to continue.
  

[Star Gazer]

Conclusions:

• He always emphasizes "friend"-- not promising
  
• I like that he says the sex is good, ahaha
  
• I think it's sweet that he said "I love you", even if just as a friend. Maybe later I'll say it back.
  
• I wish that he would give it more of a chance. He thinks just because we have different backgrounds that we couldn't find enough in common. I don't think so. If anything, we could learn so much from each other, having expertise in different areas of life! It's just a shame.
  
• This isn't going anywhere.
  

 

The bolded conclusion is the only one that matters.

 

Please, save your dignity. Do not tell him you love him.

[GooseChaser]

The bolded conclusion is the only one that matters.

 

Please, save your dignity. Do not tell him you love him.

I meant that I would say it "as a friend", like he did. Should I hold off on even telling him I like him, then? I guess I have to direct my energy toward Arnold, then.... Maybe Craig will notice a change?

 

Whatever happens, if things work out with Arnold, I don't have to worry what goes through Craig's mind.

[GooseChaser]

Hey everyone! I have an update! I met Arnold today, and well, it got sexual. I didn't think it would happen so fast, but seems like he means business! We didn't go all the way, just to "second base," I'd say.

 

I think the right thing for me to do is pursue things with Arnold and tell Craig it's over. If I'm lucky, Arnold will want a relationship, while I know for a fact that Craig doesn't. That makes the decision very easy. Hopefully we can go back to happily being just friends. That plan sounds great to me!

Edited October 5, 2010 by GooseChaser

[Star Gazer]

You had sex with Arnold on your first date?

[GooseChaser]

You had sex with Arnold on your first date?

 

No, just kissed and sorta masturbated together. We didn't go all the way.

[GooseChaser]

There was a lot of good flirting going back and forth. When he was leaving, he also said that he would like to meet up again sometime.