Star Gazer Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Show me where I said that. Your attitude says it all. 50/50, tit-for-tat. A relationship is supposed to be 50/50. What you're promoting is manipulation. Are you in a RELATIONSHIP within the first 3 dates? No. It's called DATING. When you're DATING, you have your role, she has hers. Once you're in a RELATIONSHIP, it's 50/50.
Star Gazer Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Hey everyone! Lots of strong opinions here. I texted him "Thanks, had fun" etc and within an hour, I had not one but TWO date invitations for next week. I like this guy! Ta-da!! SEE, that's how it's done! Look like you found yourself a real man, so far!!
AverageJoe Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Word, Star ! Well between Joe's philosophy and Max's, looks like they'll be single for a while ! This is a good thing. I am unmarried and I love every minute of it. I have no desire to be in a relationship. I get all of the benefits of a relationship without having to answer to anyone. Btw, Max does make an interesting point now that I think about it. Women have gotten a free ride for years now. Seems some want the allure of traditional courting, with the benefits of a women in 2010.
Cobra_X Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 C'mon. Don't act like you don't know what I'm referring to. After a few dates, th woman can begin initiating the invitations and paying for the dates. But the first few are on him. Haha... this illustrates my point perfectly. Don't just expect me to know what your thinking when you say things that are vague. 99% of the men I date are real men and know how to treat a lady. So I've never had to remind them of dating etiquette. Well... it seems your still looking so that can't be working perfectly for you. Don't make the assumption that the only "real men" are the ones that conform to your list of expectations.
Star Gazer Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Btw, Max does make an interesting point now that I think about it. Women have gotten a free ride for years now. Seems some want the allure of traditional courting, with the benefits of a women in 2010. And you men have the benefit of never having to have to carry and birth a child since the inception of mankind! Wanna trade now? Or do you only want to trade inherent, biological roles when it suits you? OP is dating a real man. Good on her!
Mad Max Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Your attitude says it all. 50/50, tit-for-tat. 50/50 and tit-for-tat are not the same. I believe in equality and the woman making an effort for something she wants. If you think it's okay to put in less effort because you're a woman, any decent guy is going to run. Are you in a RELATIONSHIP within the first 3 dates? No. It's called DATING. When you're DATING, you have your role, she has hers. Once you're in a RELATIONSHIP, it's 50/50. What do you think dating leads to? If you want to go back to gender roles, a woman's role was to stay home while the husband works. Of course, you're not going to like that. If you don't like that, then no man is going to like being told he's required to initiate each date prior to a relationship because he's a man.
Star Gazer Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Well... it seems your still looking so that can't be working perfectly for you. I'm dating just plenty. Just because I'm not in a relationship doesn't mean I'm having trouble meeting quality men. I just nexted one who didn't live up to my expectations, and whaddyaknow, 2 stepped up to take his place. They asked, they paid, they get another date!
homersheineken Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 WRONG. Second date should still be his. He knows she's interested with the f/u text. Yeah, be the man and pursue her.
Author The Non-Student Posted August 27, 2010 Author Posted August 27, 2010 This is a good thing. I am unmarried and I love every minute of it. I have no desire to be in a relationship. I get all of the benefits of a relationship without having to answer to anyone. Btw, Max does make an interesting point now that I think about it. Women have gotten a free ride for years now. Seems some want the allure of traditional courting, with the benefits of a women in 2010. I think it's good to know what you won't and don't want right now. I think a lot of women (at least the ones I know) feel similarly--really enjoy being unattached. And, I actually paid for our drinks last night. He got dinner. I don't feel comfortable assuming a guy will pay for a date. I always offer.
AverageJoe Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 So seriously, if YOU had a great date with a wman you found extremely interesting and attractive, and she texted you, you would NOT text her back ASAP ? Why not ????? Yeah, seriously. Why is that hard to believe? If a date went good then fine, great, grand we'll take it from there. If you notice closely there is a phone number attatched to that txt. I will use that instead. I have to be honest here. If a gal decided she didnt want to see me again because I didnt return her txt ASAP. I would be done. Interest is gone. That is the first chapter in a book I have no desire to read anymore.
Author The Non-Student Posted August 27, 2010 Author Posted August 27, 2010 Ta-da!! SEE, that's how it's done! Look like you found yourself a real man, so far!! Definitely looking forward to a second date!
Cobra_X Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 I'm dating just plenty. Just because I'm not in a relationship doesn't mean I'm having trouble meeting quality men. I just nexted one who didn't live up to my expectations, and whaddyaknow, 2 stepped up to take his place. They asked, they paid, they get another date! You make it sound like these are patrons at a strip club. Just because you have a line around the door doesn't mean your doing well.
meerkat stew Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Sorry, but that's not how I was raised. If I initiate a first date and the girl doesn't initiate a second one, I'm going to assume she's not interested enough to see me again. It's not my responsibility to keep initiating dates. Sorry, but I'm not wrong. Agree with Max, there are no rules here, especially in 2010. Of course you aren't wrong, there is no right and wrong in these things, do as you feel. Partially agree with you as have had good success in getting women to ask me out for the second or third date. If you are a good date who projects social value, you can easily pull this off. You can set it up in several ways, when they offer to pay part of the first date, just say, "I asked you out, if you had fun and want to ask me out sometime, you can pay!" then wink or smile. The good ones love this, as many of them have gotten tired of sitting around waiting for slowpoke men to take action. They will usually ask you out within a few days if the date was good enough, and if they don't, you can always decide whether to ask them out again. Give them permission to ask you out and let them know you are secure and don't need to play traditional gender roles and they often respond very well. The bad ones, princesses and privileged attitudes, get screened out. This also tends to screen out the ones who are just looking to hook a man so they can quit work. Another way is when they talk about things they like to do, and things are going well, throw in "I haven't done that in so long (or ever), let me know if you ever want company," If they like you, they will plan something just to ask you out soon after that. Isn't it interesting though, how some of them feel entitled to question your manhood or to imply you will never have a GF if you don't do things "their way" i.e. the old double standard way that benefits them? Not letting them bully you is the first step to ending up on top (or having them on top if that's how you like it)
Mad Max Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Btw, Max does make an interesting point now that I think about it. Women have gotten a free ride for years now. Seems some want the allure of traditional courting, with the benefits of a women in 2010. This. Not all women are like that and I wouldn't even say most are like that, but it's completely hypocritical to accept equal rights in other areas, yet remain traditional in another area because it already benefits them. These types of women get no respect from men. And you men have the benefit of never having to have to carry and birth a child since the inception of mankind! Wanna trade now? Or do you only want to trade inherent, biological roles when it suits you? OP is dating a real man. Good on her! You're comparing apples and oranges. Women do pursue men. That's not biological, child birth is. Because I expect an equal effort on her part doesn't make me any less of a man. If you want to start a debate there, I can argue that any time a woman has sex outside of a relationship isn't a real woman. I can play the gender role too. Yeah, be the man and pursue her. Initiating the first date is pursuing. The woman needs to put in an equal effort.
Author The Non-Student Posted August 27, 2010 Author Posted August 27, 2010 Yeah, seriously. Why is that hard to believe? If a date went good then fine, great, grand we'll take it from there. If you notice closely there is a phone number attatched to that txt. I will use that instead. I have to be honest here. If a gal decided she didnt want to see me again because I didnt return her txt ASAP. I would be done. Interest is gone. That is the first chapter in a book I have no desire to read anymore. Yeah, in my case, I was just doing it to say "had a good time." I didn't expect a reply right away...or even possibly ever. I just wanted him to know I'd had fun--honestly! I actually don't really like texting. Maybe I'll email next time.
meerkat stew Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 whaddyaknow, 2 stepped up to take his place. They asked, they paid, they get another date! Works just the same for quality guys who cultivate options, welcome to 2010.
Star Gazer Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 You're comparing apples and oranges. Women do pursue men. Sure they do, when they aren't being pursued by the man they're interested. The problem? It sets them up to feel as though he's not as interested in her as she is in him, because a REAL man would ask her out on that second date if he was interested. He wouldn't go quiet and still and refuse to return a text message. Allowing her to chase you puts her in a defensive position, feeling insecure. A woman may do this a few times, with a few different guys, but eventually she'll learn her lesson and will stop doing it. But this is all neither here nor there, because you three have already proven to me to be dudes I'd never date anyway... AND OP already got her second date invite.
Author The Non-Student Posted August 27, 2010 Author Posted August 27, 2010 This. Not all women are like that and I wouldn't even say most are like that, but it's completely hypocritical to accept equal rights in other areas, yet remain traditional in another area because it already benefits them. These types of women get no respect from men. You're comparing apples and oranges. Women do pursue men. That's not biological, child birth is. Because I expect an equal effort on her part doesn't make me any less of a man. If you want to start a debate there, I can argue that any time a woman has sex outside of a relationship isn't a real woman. I can play the gender role too. Initiating the first date is pursuing. The woman needs to put in an equal effort. It's hard to be clear about expectations when you've just gone out on a date or two with someone. Some men like to initiate more than just the first date. Some men, like you, appreciate and even expect the woman to reciprocate. I picked the place we went last night. He offered two suggestions for next time. It feels fair to me, if not totally "equal."
Star Gazer Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 I picked the place we went last night. He offered two suggestions for next time. It feels fair to me, if not totally "equal." Picking the location of a date has nothing to do with being equal in who initiates dates.
Cobra_X Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Yeah, in my case, I was just doing it to say "had a good time." I didn't expect a reply right away...or even possibly ever. I just wanted him to know I'd had fun--honestly! I actually don't really like texting. Maybe I'll email next time. ... Just a thought.... maybe ask him his preferred method of communication? Txting and Emailing is the same to me because my phone handles them the same... but longer emails are annoying to read when I'm busy at work. I usually won't respond quickly.
AverageJoe Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Yeah, in my case, I was just doing it to say "had a good time." I didn't expect a reply right away...or even possibly ever. I just wanted him to know I'd had fun--honestly! I actually don't really like texting. Maybe I'll email next time. Thats all I am saying. If you send a txt dont expect a reply. If you fear not receiving a txt in return, just dont send one to begin with. Thats your problem, not mine. I read your other post as well, see you seem to be a cool gal. Someone with a reasonable head on her shoulders.
Mad Max Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Sure they do, when they aren't being pursued by the man they're interested. And by doing such, they stand a much better chance of getting what they want. They don't sit on the sidelines waiting for the man to make a move. That type of woman will always win over the passive one. The problem? It sets them up to feel as though he's not as interested in her as she is in him, because a REAL man would ask her out on that second date if he was interested. Initiating the second date has absolutely nothing to do with what a real man. A REAL man will not be a sucker and put in all that effort without getting an equal effort in return. Allowing her to chase you puts her in a defensive position, feeling insecure. A woman may do this a few times, with a few different guys, but eventually she'll learn her lesson and will stop doing it. And why should a man be required to be in a defensive position? By pursuing men, the only lesson a woman will learn is she stands a much better chance of getting what she wants. Keep sitting on the sidelines and waiting. See how far that gets you. But this is all neither here nor there, because you three have already proven to me to be dudes I'd never date anyway... AND OP already got her second date invite. And you're a woman I would never date because you have a sense of entitlement because you happen to be a woman.
Star Gazer Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 Thats your problem, not mine. This attitude permeates your posts, and I'm sure your dates sense it too.
Star Gazer Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 And you're a woman I would never date because you have a sense of entitlement because you happen to be a woman. Yeah. I have a sense of entitlement alright. That's the funniest thing I've heard all week...
Mad Max Posted August 27, 2010 Posted August 27, 2010 It's hard to be clear about expectations when you've just gone out on a date or two with someone. Some men like to initiate more than just the first date. Some men, like you, appreciate and even expect the woman to reciprocate. I picked the place we went last night. He offered two suggestions for next time. It feels fair to me, if not totally "equal." Of course. I'm not saying I shouldn't initiate the first date, but I will not pursue a woman to that extent with so little in return.
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