Are Paternity Tests Insulting?

[JustJoe]

Huh? to whom was I disrespectful? It was not intended.

[donnamaybe]

That's not the point - its what all this means to you and how you'd deal with it all should it ever arise.

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You can't answer the question, because you will prove my point.

[silic0ntoad]

I would only ask if I thought she cheated. I would try my best in the future to know my partner well enough before committing to having children wether she would cheat or not.

 

If it's a casual encounter, I'd ask for a P test.

[donnamaybe]

I would only ask if I thought she cheated. I would try my best in the future to know my partner well enough before committing to having children wether she would cheat or not.

 

If it's a casual encounter, I'd ask for a P test.

 

I keep asking and never get the answer, so since you're a man I will ask you: What could a guy be thinking to feel the need to ask his woman for a paternity test?

[threebyfate]

I don't think there's one single person here, male or female, who if it's a casual encounter, believe a pat test is unnecessary. This is understandable when you don't know or purportedly love the individual. But if you get to the point of getting married or being in a long-term committed happy relationship, why would you be with someone you don't trust, enough to need a pat test?

[silic0ntoad]

I keep asking and never get the answer, so since you're a man I will ask you: What could a guy be thinking to feel the need to ask his woman for a paternity test?

 

 

Well, for me really, if it's a random encounter, it's the obligation to someone for life. I mean, if I go to the bar, hook up with some girl, and hear back a month down the line she is preggo, I want a P test to protect myself and potential child. I wouldn't want no say in that scenario, and I wouldn't just accept it because modern laws can still hobnail you into child support if you find out DOWN the road that you aren't daddy-o (ie, NJ, FL and others)

 

I would ask my wife (If I were married) only if I caught her in an affair and she became pregnant.

[silic0ntoad]

I don't think there's one single person here, male or female, who if it's a casual encounter, believe a pat test is unnecessary. This is understandable when you don't know or purportedly love the individual. But if you get to the point of getting married or being in a long-term committed happy relationship, why would you be with someone you don't trust, enough to need a pat test?

 

If it's long term and I have no reason to think they cheated I wouldn't even think to ask for a P test, TBH.

 

I mean, if I am commited to you, and trust and love you, it would be an insult. People who DO ask are simply insecure douchebags.

 

I think most guys are terrified of having to pay child support and thus would ask.

[donnamaybe]

Well, for me really, if it's a random encounter, it's the obligation to someone for life. I mean, if I go to the bar, hook up with some girl, and hear back a month down the line she is preggo, I want a P test to protect myself and potential child. I wouldn't want no say in that scenario, and I wouldn't just accept it because modern laws can still hobnail you into child support if you find out DOWN the road that you aren't daddy-o (ie, NJ, FL and others)

 

I would ask my wife (If I were married) only if I caught her in an affair and she became pregnant.

 

Of course in scenario one you would wonder.

 

However, this thread was started on the premise that this is a long term, trusting relationship with the woman in question giving no reason for suspicion whatsoever. In that case, why would the guy ask for a paternity test other than he thinks she might be screwing some other guy? I mean, you can only get pregnant by having sex. If you think you're not the father...

[LucreziaBorgia]

I was going to post this in the 'poll' thread but didn't want to threadjack... thought I would bring in some Devil's Advocacy...

 

 

Do men not have a right to be reassured that the child their partner is bearing is biologically theirs? Why should men be expected to just 'have faith' that the child is theirs? What is wrong with wanting to be 100% reassured?

[Mme. Chaucer]

 

Do men not have a right to be reassured that the child their partner is bearing is biologically theirs? Why should men be expected to just 'have faith' that the child is theirs? What is wrong with wanting to be 100% reassured?

 

Well, in a marriage or committed relationship that I am in myself, I have no room for such needs for "reassurance." If the trust level is that low, or the man is that insecure and needy, I wouldn't be there with him anyway. Yuck.

 

Maybe he would like to put a bugging device or a camera on his wife so he can be "100% reassured" that she is not attending an orgy rather than going to her aerobics class?

 

Just the idea that some people would think this could possibly be reasonable makes me get a sick & slimy shiver down my old and achy spine. What's next? Will we be asked to consider donning the burqa?

[A O]

You can't answer the question, because you will prove my point.

There isn't a point to prove other than this is largely about how we see and deal with issues that arise. If this was about me, and you were my partner for instance, I'd be explaining to you that these are my concerns, perhaps my own insecurities maybe, but not necessarily so, and that this has very little to do with you, and certainly has nothing to do with picturing you being hot n heavy with another man. Chances are, I would have read an article, watched a doco, heard from someone that peaked my interest, aroused my concerns, to the point of wanting a test. This is how I see it, and how some men see things also. Not to be confused with the controlling, really insecure types who'll demand a test for the heck of it or just because they think they can or some other dysfunctional reason.

 

 

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Do men not have a right to be reassured that the child their partner is bearing is biologically theirs? Why should men be expected to just 'have faith' that the child is theirs? What is wrong with wanting to be 100% reassured?

Some people feel far too slighted to look past their own nose. Or they can't see or fail to see that this can be little more than a reassurance issue, i.e. something that has to do with the man moreso than the woman involved.

 

 

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Huh? to whom was I disrespectful? It was not intended.

To whom, to any man who'd request a test and some men in general. They're insecure, pathetic and their manhood is under question. None of this is respectful behavior Joe.

 

 

Wow, I was raised by my Aunt and Uncle, and we kids were always taught to respect others, it always amazes me how little respect some men have for their women. These guys , who would need a PT, are about as insecure as anyone I know. Dudes, Man the f**k up! If you can't keep a woman, without subjecting her to "verification", then you probably can't keep her WITH "verification". If your woman has given NO indication that she cheats, then the only reason for testing, is your own pathetic issues.

 

 

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[A O]

Well, in a marriage or committed relationship that I am in myself, I have no room for such needs for "reassurance." If the trust level is that low, or the man is that insecure and needy, I wouldn't be there with him anyway. Yuck.

 

Just the idea that some people would think this could possibly be reasonable makes me get a sick & slimy shiver down my old and achy spine. What's next? Will we be asked to consider donning the burqa?

It sounds like, to a degree, that you're projecting your own fears on this issue. The men are needy but at the same time, you're extremely uncomfortable about it all. You fit a pattern.

 

 

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[donnamaybe]

I would never be with a guy who was so insecure as to think that ANY woman he was involved with just HAD to be boinking some other guy. Thank goodness this would never be an issue for me or my relationship.

[Mr White]

If I'm at the doctor and they tell me there's a 3% chance I have something and a 97% chance that I do not, and therefore insurance will not cover the testing because it is considered an insignificant risk, I generally don't freak out and demand the extra testing immediately because I'm overcome with fear that I'm caught in death's grip. There is a greater than 3% chance that my birth control pills could give me a stroke sometime in the next fifteen years, yet I still take one every day.

 

Personally I have seen a ridiculous range of studies and statistics on this subject, all refuting each other. None of them can be taken seriously at this point.

 

You are correct - 3% is probably close to the most common estimate, and as such, it represents a very, very low probability. A really small one.

 

However, that's only part of the "decision rules" people employ when assessing risks - in evaluating risks, the decisions are based on the "expected value" of the outcome, which means considering not just the probability of the outcome, but [the probability of the outcome] X [the value/cost (broadly defined) of the outcome]. Thus very low probabilities can be associated with significant "expected values" (and high probabilities can be associated with "low expected values). In the latter case/example, the stakes seem to be simply too high to tolerate even a small probability (i.e. wasting your life on a woman who cheated and on a child that isn't yours), and in the former case, for example, who cares that there is 80% chance of rain outside. The worst that could happen is a damage to a nice pair of shoes.

Edited March 8, 2010 by Mr White

[sally4sara]

Legally speaking, he can't do it behind her back. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but in order to do a pat test, he will need to get a sample of his SOs DNA. He can't be in possession of her DNA and submit it, without breaking the law, if he doesn't get her consent.

 

Well, there are these home job mail order DNA tests (you can get them for your dog too ). You swab you and the kid's cheek and mail them off to some lab from what I can tell. But no legal court will accept these tests into evidence. Kinda makes me wonder how accurate or tamper proof they are.

 

And if you live in a state that includes all children born within a marriage as your responsibility - genetically matched or not - what becomes of the relationship you have with that child once you AND THEY know you ain't daddy? If there are other sibling that are your DNA in the mix, it only serves as an act of ostracizing that one blameless kid from the rest of the family. Its great you're all worried about you, not so great for a kid in that situation regardless of the mom's lies.

 

And imagine the trip to the clinic if the kid is of any age to wonder what is going on when you go behind the mom's back, get the kid tested, and find out you just used your own kid as a lab rat because you're a suspicious, insecure person. Father of the Year I guess....

 

If you think your partner is capable of cheating on you. Why are you not asking for std tests? Why wait only until a kid is on the way? THIS is what makes it sooooo insulting. Its like you're HOPING they cheated so you can get out without a blemish on your character.

[bayouboi]

And if you live in a state that includes all children born within a marriage as your responsibility - genetically matched or not - what becomes of the relationship you have with that child once you AND THEY know you ain't daddy? If there are other sibling that are your DNA in the mix, it only serves as an act of ostracizing that one blameless kid from the rest of the family. Its great you're all worried about you, not so great for a kid in that situation regardless of the mom's lies.

 

And imagine the trip to the clinic if the kid is of any age to wonder what is going on when you go behind the mom's back, get the kid tested, and find out you just used your own kid as a lab rat because you're a suspicious, insecure person. Father of the Year I guess....

 

It's fascinating to watch how even in your hypothetical situation where the mother cheated on the husband, the husband is the one accused of being selfish & sarcastically described as "Father of the Year". Seems like nearly all responses on this site are gender-biased.

[Mme. Chaucer]

It sounds like, to a degree, that you're projecting your own fears on this issue. The men are needy but at the same time, you're extremely uncomfortable about it all. You fit a pattern.

 

 

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I fit a pattern of a woman who knows what it is like to be in a trusting relationship with a self confident MAN who knows me and who, like me, has CHOSEN to give himself in trust & faith within that relationship.

 

My "fears" and discomfort only stem from the fact, evident from this thread, that some men and women would find the idea of a guy asking for a paternity test just as a matter of course, without any concrete reasons for suspicion, somehow acceptable and even reasonable.

 

YIKES!

[sally4sara]

It's fascinating to watch how even in your hypothetical situation where the mother cheated on the husband, the husband is the one accused of being selfish & sarcastically described as "Father of the Year". Seems like nearly all responses on this site are gender-biased.

 

No, you just struggle with reading comprehension.

 

I said an act of ostracizing one kid you cannot avoid being responsible for despite no genetic match, from the rest of the family he knows is a cold act. The kid is blameless no matter what act of betrayal the mother made.

 

I said secreting away your kid to use as a lab rat just to find out it is your kid isn't a 'father of the year' kinda thing to do.

 

I also said the mother was a liar and had cheated.

 

The problem is you can only see this situation from a ME ME ME position, the woman a distant second, and the kid? Well its no better than a lab rat and hardly factors in at all.

 

All my responses on this site are anti stupidity-biased. Only YOU can change how they get put across to you.

[threebyfate]

If it's long term and I have no reason to think they cheated I wouldn't even think to ask for a P test, TBH.

 

I mean, if I am commited to you, and trust and love you, it would be an insult. People who DO ask are simply insecure douchebags.

 

I think most guys are terrified of having to pay child support and thus would ask.

In a situation of child support, you do have legal means to fall back on, in that the Court could order a paternity test. If one or the other partner refuses to cooperate, which I believe is their right, I'm guessing that the Courts will take a dim view to this and react accordingly, with their judgments.

 

Keep in mind that I'm no attorney and don't purport to be one.

 

Well, there are these home job mail order DNA tests (you can get them for your dog too ). You swab you and the kid's cheek and mail them off to some lab from what I can tell. But no legal court will accept these tests into evidence. Kinda makes me wonder how accurate or tamper proof they are.

From what I'm given to understand, these tests aren't legally admissible. For that matter, it's only a matter of time before someone challenges these unauthorized tests, due to laws that surround unauthorized possession of "human tissue".

[bayouboi]

No, you just struggle with reading comprehension.

 

I said an act of ostracizing one kid you cannot avoid being responsible for despite no genetic match, from the rest of the family he knows is a cold act. The kid is blameless no matter what act of betrayal the mother made.

 

I said secreting away your kid to use as a lab rat just to find out it is your kid isn't a 'father of the year' kinda thing to do.

 

I also said the mother was a liar and had cheated.

 

The problem is you can only see this situation from a ME ME ME position, the woman a distant second, and the kid? Well its no better than a lab rat and hardly factors in at all.

 

All my responses on this site are anti stupidity-biased. Only YOU can change how they get put across to you.

 

I understand that you're emotionally charged, but there's no reason to insult me. I merely posted my observation on your comments and have not resorted to any name-calling, so I'm not sure why you're getting defensive.

[A O]

I fit a pattern of a woman who knows what it is like to be in a trusting relationship with a self confident MAN who knows me and who, like me, has CHOSEN to give himself in trust & faith within that relationship.

Self-confident people embrace the concerns of others rather than dismiss them or dismiss them out of hand. One reason they do this is because they know that they can't do everything, can't cope with everything, that at some point in time, they'll need to ask for a helping hand, or for reassurance themselves. Now that takes real courage to do. They are also confident enough in themselves to take the knocks, in this case a knock to their trust.

 

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[troggleputty]

Well, in a marriage or committed relationship that I am in myself, I have no room for such needs for "reassurance." If the trust level is that low, or the man is that insecure and needy, I wouldn't be there with him anyway. Yuck.

 

Maybe he would like to put a bugging device or a camera on his wife so he can be "100% reassured" that she is not attending an orgy rather than going to her aerobics class?

 

Just the idea that some people would think this could possibly be reasonable makes me get a sick & slimy shiver down my old and achy spine. What's next? Will we be asked to consider donning the burqa?

 

 

The shiver down your spine is the same shiver that criminals feel when they're about to be arrested.

 

It's not the feeling an innocent person has.

[sally4sara]

I understand that you're emotionally charged, but there's no reason to insult me. I merely posted my observation on your comments and have not resorted to any name-calling, so I'm not sure why you're getting defensive.

 

And your wrong observation was insulting and intended to be insulting. Don't start and it won't start.

 

My ability to see how these action can hurt others who had no hand in it, comes from the same place being able to say no guy I have been with would have ever had a reason to ask me for a pat test. I think about how my actions will effect others around me.

[troggleputty]

I fit a pattern of a woman who knows what it is like to be in a trusting relationship with a self confident MAN who knows me and who, like me, has CHOSEN to give himself in trust & faith within that relationship.

 

My "fears" and discomfort only stem from the fact, evident from this thread, that some men and women would find the idea of a guy asking for a paternity test just as a matter of course, without any concrete reasons for suspicion, somehow acceptable and even reasonable.

 

YIKES!

 

 

Why did you choose a Nazi dominatrix as your avatar?

 

Why did your long time 30 year marriage fail?

[troggleputty]

I understand that you're emotionally charged, but there's no reason to insult me. I merely posted my observation on your comments and have not resorted to any name-calling, so I'm not sure why you're getting defensive.

 

 

Most likely the ladies who are reacting so defensively to the mere idea of other people getting DNA tests have cheated on their spouses or significant others in their current or past relationships, and the high sensitivity is because the topic "hits a nerve."

 

Clearly they virtually all have histories of seriously dysfunctional relationships. They cannot be relied on to accurately characterize the health of their past nor even present relationships.