He finally sent the email breaking NC after 13 weeks

[curiousnycgirl]

This puppy is throwing his heart at her feet, completely at her mercy. Man I'm absolutely shocked and impressed that he's capable of doing this!!

 

Come on TBF you knew there had to be SOME redeeming features to him -otherwise why would I have stayed so long?

[curiousnycgirl]

I'm jealous, actually.

 

I'm sorry if I feel ungrateful I'm just so scared to act at all.

[threebyfate]

If that were the case I would be in turbo suck up mode, but that is not the case, and I would not be so emotionally tied to that client.

 

However I would develop a plan, step by step - on how to move forward - then probably put my very best person on it, and work with him/her behind the scenes. But that is not the case here.

 

I do not believe that the words he slung at me in November were not true, I believe he does feel I have emasculated him. But he is now saying that's not really an issue and he wants me to lead the way. I am so paralyzed by that one thing (above most of the others) that I am afraid to act.

Turbo suck up mode. Love it!!

 

Okay, I'm downgrading it to a client who generates $50K/per annum, but also can be difficult.

 

Maybe go into mini hand vacuum suck up mode?

[threebyfate]

How about something like this?

 

"I love you and miss you so much.

 

But there's something that is of major concern, something you need to clarify for me. In what way can I treat you, that won't make you feel emasculated?"

[curiousnycgirl]

OK I'm going to call him, I am going to start off by explaining that this statements full of hyperbole are not helpful - such as "It seems you are healthier, sleep better, and are happier now, so why would you want to explore any next steps?" What I said was that I was so stressed by his treatment of me at the end that I had not been sleeping. The rest he basically made up.

 

The next thing is that I can no longer be the one holding it all together, I need help and a lot of it.

 

Then I am going to say is that I am unwilling to sign on if this is not going to go anywhere. I have spent 5.5 years going down that path - and I cannot do that again. That we need to work toward living together within the next X amoutn of time (I need help with X - please help me). That does not mean I am going to insist he sell his house - that means we will be together, either his house or mine, but TOGETHER.

 

Only then will I say that I am more than willing to work on these constructive criticism he keeps referring to. But they MUST include this issue he has with emasculation - because that was never my intent, but I don't know how to deal with that, so he needs to tell me.

 

Ok so 1. how's that sound, 2. please help me with X and 3. When should I call? I'm leaning toward tonight, but want input please!!!!!

[curiousnycgirl]

How about something like this?

 

"I love you and miss you so much.

 

But there's something that is of major concern, something you need to clarify for me. In what way can I treat you, that won't make you feel emasculated?"

 

Ok that would be way simpler, but not sure that covers it.

[threebyfate]

OK I'm going to call him, I am going to start off by explaining that this statements full of hyperbole are not helpful - such as "It seems you are healthier, sleep better, and are happier now, so why would you want to explore any next steps?" What I said was that I was so stressed by his treatment of me at the end that I had not been sleeping. The rest he basically made up.

No, stay away from responding to the criticism. Just let it drop.

 

The next thing is that I can no longer be the one holding it all together, I need help and a lot of it.

Good but make this more of an appeal, rather than an accusation. If he buys in, then he's fully responsible for it.

 

Then I am going to say is that I am unwilling to sign on if this is not going to go anywhere. I have spent 5.5 years going down that path - and I cannot do that again. That we need to work toward living together within the next X amoutn of time (I need help with X - please help me). That does not mean I am going to insist he sell his house - that means we will be together, either his house or mine, but TOGETHER.

Good. This is important.

 

Only then will I say that I am more than willing to work on these constructive criticism he keeps referring to.

Don't mention the criticisms. You're already doing something about it by not responding in a negative way to the criticisms. Only discuss them, if he brings them up. And if he brings them up, point to how you're addressing things now.

 

But they MUST include this issue he has with emasculation - because that was never my intent, but I don't know how to deal with that, so he needs to tell me.

Agreed. Refer to my last post!

 

When should I call? I'm leaning toward tonight, but want input please!!!!!

Call tonight and get this resolved, ONE WAY or ANOTHER.

[GrayClouds]

Put your right foot, put you right foot out, take your right foot and shake it shake it shake it, then turn yourself around, . Now your doing the hokie pokie and thats what its all about.

 

3 months, 9 pages, 130 post and your still wondering what to do next. You got TBF trying to convince you he is some romantic pinning his heart on his sleeve bearing his soul for you. Buit what he is saying is "If you change to the person I want you to be I will want to be with you."

 

 

Come on. Stop the dance, stop the madness.

Edited March 23, 2010 by GrayClouds

[curiousnycgirl]

Put your right foot, put you right foot out, take your right foot and shake it shake it shake it, then turn yourself around, . Now your doing the hokie pokie and thats what its all about.

 

3 months, 9 pages, 130 post and your still wondering what to do next. You got TBF trying to convince you he is some romantic pinning his heart on his sleeve bearing his soul for you. Come on. Stop the dance, stop the madness.

 

Ah the voice of reason. Yes GC I think I must be out of my mind, but I also love this guy. Why I don't know. So you feel I should keep on walking.

 

Well that's one vote for that answer.

[Tamia78]

I'm sorry, girl, but I'm with GC on this one. He wants something (YOU!), so he's going to do and say anything to get it. Yes, it's probably the only way he knows how, and I don't doubt that he's being honest. But.........read that again. Is he taking responsibility at all? Remember, that's what you wanted. Great that he's willing to forgive and forget, but does he know what he even did to hurt you? Personally, if you two want to start over, BOTH of you have to be willing to start with an ultraclean slate........can you do that? Can you just forget all the hurt he caused you, whether intentional or not? Can you stop reminding each other of the past? If you can do those things, then I say "Do eet!!! "

 

I'm not trying to be a spoil sport, Curious, but something just doesn't feel right to me. How long is he really gonna behave? It's been 5.5 years, and he hasn't learned. You are going to have to literally leave for him to change, and even if he does, you will have moved on to someone who truly deserves you.

 

But I understand the enormous need in you to work it out.........good luck, Lady. I hope he changes, I really do. You need some happiness finally.

 

--T

[GrayClouds]

Ah the voice of reason. Yes GC I think I must be out of my mind, but I also love this guy. Why I don't know. So you feel I should keep on walking.

 

Well that's one vote for that answer.

 

Has he given you one thing he needs to do to make the relationship better? No he saying you need to do this, you need to do that, and when do he is going to say your to controlling.

 

Do not walk run from the Eunuch, he constantly shown you he has no balls. He gives them to you and then crying you cut them off.

[curiousnycgirl]

Has he given you one thing he needs to do to make the relationship better? No he saying you need to do this, you need to do that, and when do he is going to say your to controlling.

 

Indeed I have thought of this. I still do not believe he's taken responsibility and I truly do not believe he understands the negative impact he had on me at the end. If he doesn't understand it, can he truly be committed to fixing it?

 

Oh yes I have all these questions and more.

[threebyfate]

Point blank, I agree with your ex that you're over-reacting to things, as they stand right now. But what he's not taking into account, are the years of frustration. It's like each lack of initiative is another straw on the camel's back.

 

So I leave this thread with the following. IF you continue holding onto resentment for his past deeds, this will never work. Same goes for him.

 

Address each of your needs to him but stay away from reacting to his criticisms. You're also criticizing him and yet, he's still back for more, heart on his sleeve.

 

Edit - refer to emasculation. If you push him to fall on his sword about all his past misdeeds, he's not going to do it.

[GrayClouds]

Point blank, I agree with your ex that you're over-reacting to things, as they stand right now.

Yes but as thing are right now it can not be disassociated from past behavior, in context to previous actions, actions that are the best indicator of future behavior.

 

He ran way, rather then working on the realtionship, he needed 13 weeks to contact, he need 3 weeks to give some pat response of "I love you but..."

 

This is not a man who know what he wants, and people who do not know what then want hurt other people. Is she over-reacting? NO, CNYCG a proper reaction was all the effort you were doing to move on to a better place.

[Rearden Metal]

Take a few days to think things through. There's no law that says you have to reply RIGHT AWAY RIGHT AWAY everytime he contacts you.

 

Get a clear head and then do what's right.

[threebyfate]

Yes but as thing are right now it can not be disassociated from past behavior, in context to previous actions, actions that are the best indicator of future behavior.

 

He ran way, rather then working on the realtionship, he needed 13 weeks to contact, he need 3 weeks to give some pat response of "I love you but..."

 

This is not a man who know what he wants, and people who do not know what then want hurt other people. Is she over-reacting? NO, CNYCG a proper reaction was all the effort you were doing to move on to a better place.

Refer to what I stated after the above excerpt. Don't take it out of context so you can criticize it. Not very cool, GC.

 

The guy already feels he's been emasculated. So now, you're suggesting that she emasculate him further? Bad advice.

 

If you don't want her to reconcile in any way, then I understand where you're coming from by ramping up her resentment.

[curiousnycgirl]

I appreciate everyone's input. Truth is I AM going to call tonight. Further truth is I am not going to jump all over his stuff because frankly I don't do that.

 

Yes I am overreacting, and yes that is within context, however let's be clear here - his approach is not at all the one I would have taken to attempt a reconciliation. I would have tried to reach out on common ground first. I would have tried to understand the issues of the other person, and only then would I have introduced my issues. He jumped right into his issues - and I am so dense I did not realize all this until the email he sent today.

 

I am not 100% confident that this will work, but at this poitn I am willing to try. When I try I give it my all - so we shall see if this time he will indeed meet me half way.

 

Wish me luck. TBF please don't leave. GC please don't hate me for caving - I need to see this through.

 

All of you - I appreciate your support more than you can ever know.

[curiousnycgirl]

OK so here I sit laughing my butt off - I got voicemail. Wow how anticlimatic is that?

[threebyfate]

Sheesh, some people's kids. Did you leave a VM?

[curiousnycgirl]

Sheesh, some people's kids. Did you leave a VM?

 

Of course I did. Told him I was calling in response to his email, would like to talk and that I am home.

[threebyfate]

Of course I did. Told him I was calling in response to his email, would like to talk and that I am home.

Now the ball's back in his court. Good. Let's see how he reacts. It's now almost 9 pm (est) so he might not reply tonight.

[Rearden Metal]

Hey, BTW, don't forget that you're contacting him because you LIKE him. It's OK to try to have a positive vibe. As much as 3byfate likes to make the analogy, this is NOT a business transaction.

 

Even a simple one line, "I love you baby, but what do you think has to happen for us to work out?" should get HIM talking through the issues. If he takes ZERO culpability, call him out. "I'm hearing you and want to work through this, but I get the impression you feel these are my issues. What are yours?"

 

Direct, open, honest. Loving, caring, empathetic. Resolute, strong, self respecting. These all can exist together.

[curiousnycgirl]

Yup I agree RM - while I sound very negative here, I can assure you I am very postiive when communicating to him. I swear I have not written one snarky thing to him since December.

 

He's taken some of what I've written as snarky but that is not how I meant them - and I'm sure that is a also true of him, although he HAS written snarky stuff.

[GrayClouds]

Refer to what I stated after the above excerpt. Don't take it out of context so you can criticize it. Not very cool, GC.

The statement itself deserve criticism. The banal statement "as they stand now" disassociates everything from any context. The fact that you follow the statement, with what you refer after the my excerpt, illustrates that even in your own mind that context is needed. The need for contest needed to be expounded upon to reinforce CNYCG does not needed to being chastises for being wisely self protective. She has already spent to much energy talking all the blame for the problems in the realtionship.

 

The guy already feels he's been emasculated. So now, you're suggesting that she emasculate him further? Bad advice.

 

By no means have I suggest she behave poorly toward him. Quite the contrary I suggest she focus on herself, moving beyond a person who blames her for his own inability to be assertive enough in own life to be confident of his own masculinity.

 

He feels like he's been emasculated because he choose to be passive in the relationship. It was his choice and now he blames her for it. And now there is simple a continuation of the same passive behavior. He still had not showing any assertiveness towards the situation, in the attempt at reconciliation, and at best he offer latent responses.

 

He has shown no growth as a person which mean any success in a realtionship with him will be determined by the other partner doing all the needed change to make the realtionship work. Having expectations of him, communicate he has an ability have affect in his own life, it is only his insecurity that would see it as less.

 

If you don't want her to reconcile in any way, then I understand where you're coming from by ramping up her resentment.

 

If anything I am challenged to understand you desire to project the breadcrumbs he is offering as a four course meal. Your lack of apprehension, considering the consistency of his behavior, seems less like constructive advice, and more like cheerleading. And it is only through shared commitment to compromise and grow will the realtionship have any chance to succeed.

 

My interest here is in CNYCG, and if she is to reconcile it is in with eye wide open, not blinded by feelings. By pointing out the consistency of his behavior is not to ramp up her resentment, it is to help her see beyond the emotions of the situation.

[spriggig]

This is a drive-by response.

 

Yes but as thing are right now it can not be disassociated from past behavior, in context to previous actions, actions that are the best indicator of future behavior.

 

This can apply to a group but not necessarily to an individual.

 

What you are saying here is the old "people never change" BS. Do/can individuals learn, grow and better themselves? Yes. Just look in the mirror, I suspect you believe you are capable of learning and changing, why can't he?