hopesndreams Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 Emotional investment is exactly right. For those who don't give a darn about that....happy trails! Link to post Share on other sites
hopesndreams Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 Not to hijack your thread Lisa, but I've had nineteen ~ going on twenty to reflect back on why my marriage failed. I've read all kinds of books about marriage, seduction, rommance, etc. And it all came down to this! Stress, and her being weak minded, not having the self control, self discipline to stick it out through the hard times, the bad times. At 28 years of age, I would lay in bed having chest pains (I was on the drill field for the second time, which is nothing but STRESS! You just say the wrong word to someone and you've just 'washed' your career down the toliet) Went to the Dr. and he told me it was stress! Woke up one morning with a knot on my forehead about half the size of a golf ball! Stress! After the H left, my blood pressure was through the roof, almost lost my career over it, couldn't pass the medical that would make me my bread and butter...a month without income....SOB! Link to post Share on other sites
Gunny376 Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 Emotional investment is exactly right. For those who don't give a darn about that....happy trails! In looking back ~ the women I've had the greatest sucees with? Were the ones that I showed the greatest restraint with. Self control and self discipline with? Come to think of it? They were also the ones that I had the best sex with! And that I cared about the most and cared about me the most! Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm! Link to post Share on other sites
2.50 a gallon Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 Lisa You are a free bird. He has cut you free, you can do what you want. I can understand why you wouldn't want to pick some random guy, but on the other hand are you allowing yourself the right to get out there and meet new guys. It sounds as if you have been the good girl most of your life. Maybe you should consider letting a little bit of the bad girl out to play. I am not suggesting that you do it, just consider it Another thing to consider, you say you have only been with the one guy. Are you afraid of trying the second guy. How do you really know that the first guy was all that great with nothing else to compare it to? Maybe you should back off on analyzing and just let life flow Link to post Share on other sites
Author LisaUk Posted August 16, 2009 Author Share Posted August 16, 2009 I can see I sparked a bit of a discussion last night then?! Thanks fo rthe replies, I'm feeling back to my normal self now. H&D, I'm like you, sex is more of an emotional thing than physical and the whole bar "lets get laid" scene is so not me. Mad five mins there, which I would have regreted very much had I done it. Gallon, yes I have been the good girl, but that is b/c that is who I am. I had other boy friends before my ex, but I have only ever had sex with my ex. In terms of comparision, well, I think you know when sex is good, as in if it's agreeable (think When Harry Met Sally), then a comparision isn't necessary, I've never really understood that, people have said it to me before, many times over the years. When something is right, it's right and you know. Link to post Share on other sites
giotto Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 Stress, and her being weak minded, not having the self control, self discipline to stick it out through the hard times, the bad times. That's me, in reverse... Link to post Share on other sites
Author LisaUk Posted August 16, 2009 Author Share Posted August 16, 2009 The stages following abandonment really rang true. They are not the same stages of grief that you are mentioning. Shattering (the awful, initial shock and punch in the gut). Withdrawal (the addiction to the person part, like a heroin addiction), internalizing (blaming yourself), rage (haven't read it yet), and the final stage which I also haven't read yet, cause I'm not there!! Thanks Soheartbroken, this rings sooooooooooooooo true! Shattering-yes Withdrawal-yes Internalizing-yes (think that's evident to everyone form my posts!) Rage-OHHHHH GOODY THAT MUST BE NEXT THEN! At least I won't be crying in this stage! Do let me know what the last stage is please, I would like to get there asap, I'm fed up with this c**p, I really hate my ex for making me go through all this, when any problems we had could have been so easily resolved! It's not like I was abusive, cheating, distant, I could go on..... Mind you, the problem was his CP, so theres the answer right there. Sorry rambling! LOL Link to post Share on other sites
delajoonal Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 hi lis... i wanted to add my 2 cents on this one... the 'stages'... well..i have gone thru them all...and back again... the ONLY one i have NOT is rage! and THAT makes me so darn angry... why why oh why can't i get angry and just argih! you know??? get that poor me feeling OUT of my heart and mind.. even my therapists says, i NEED to angry, because apparantley there is something about THAT particular stage that helps us move on at warp speed:) so please please, if any of you get there, please post IT IN DETAIL! let us know is there something you did, felt, H/W did, etc...? my H (left 6 months ago) has been SO incredibly CRUEL and all i do is cry.. HELLO! that is NOT me..i am a fighter, i am stronger than that... so what the H*** is wrong with me now? Link to post Share on other sites
tojaz Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 Dela, You've experienced plenty of anger. You told me all about it, remember? You just need to embrace the part of him your angry at as the new him, so thats what you see whenever you think about him. That was the purpose of the lists I asked you about. TOJAZ Link to post Share on other sites
soheartbroken Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 The fifth stage is Lifting. Also wanted to add that the the author talks about sexual withdrawal during the withdrawal stage. Can make you crave sex. Of course, there is probably overlap of all stages, so I wouldn't expect to progress linearly through them. About rage...apparently, "fighting back" has a biological effect which can make you better off. Link to post Share on other sites
delajoonal Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 tojaz....hmmm? i am trying to think back..i can't recall ever getting angry enough to yell at him, i have only cried all these months..and whined and begged for answers. i have gone thru all the emotions with him, but never anger... even my doc says i need to get really angry and fight back... i have been able to TALK alot of anger on LS and with you, but never with H... so i am confused..LOL...pm'd you:) Link to post Share on other sites
tojaz Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 I think the anger stage is more whats in you vs. what you show the H. It's your emotional state not a reconciliation tactic! I know you've felt anger!:mad: TOJAZ Link to post Share on other sites
Author LisaUk Posted August 16, 2009 Author Share Posted August 16, 2009 The fifth stage is Lifting. Also wanted to add that the the author talks about sexual withdrawal during the withdrawal stage. Can make you crave sex. Of course, there is probably overlap of all stages, so I wouldn't expect to progress linearly through them. About rage...apparently, "fighting back" has a biological effect which can make you better off. How so with the fighting back, what bio effect? Can you elaborate on that please Soheart broken!? Link to post Share on other sites
soheartbroken Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 Intruder rats that are placed in a cage and submit to an alpha rat show weakened immune responses (reduction in antibody levels). On the other hand, the immune system of intruder rats that continued to fight back against the alpha, dominant rat, was not weakened. The more interesting study was with baboons. Stress hormones rise in dominant baboons who are trying to fight off lower ranking ones. But stress hormones do NOT increase in baboons who fight to overtake those of higher social status. I'm not doing a very good job at explaining it, but the author is trying to point out when you are the one who is left, you lose power (status). We are the ones begging and pleading. We might be better off fighting for greater gain than getting caught up in defensive behaviours. The author suggests fighting back against thoughts that you are unworthy (NOT fighting back with your ex). Link to post Share on other sites
silverfish Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 I'm sure there is something in this. I had a standing joke with my 87 year old grandad that I had more illnesses than him in the year that I was separated - pleurisy, shingles, cauliflower ear(?!) eczema, asthma...not to mention the panic attacks and high blood pressure. To be honest, I still don't feel physically 'right'. I wish I'd taken the advice of going to the gym, eating healthily etc but I didn't. I drank to much, didn't eat (big weight loss), and smoked more, as well as being ill, and the sleep patterns were fecked too. It is important to look after yourself but it's easier said than done. I'm sure that going back to college and being around all those clean living students will help a bit . I'm really glad to hear you went for it! Link to post Share on other sites
Author LisaUk Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share Posted August 17, 2009 It is important to look after yourself but it's easier said than done. I'm sure that going back to college and being around all those clean living students will help a bit . I'm really glad to hear you went for it! :laugh: Thanks Silverfish, it felt like the best decision, hope it turns out to be so. I think there is something in that Soheartbroken, fighting the thoughts that you are unworthy, (glad to hear that's a common thing as well, not just me with my low SE then!). I have started to realise that my ex soooooo isn't worth all this pain. Call it a moment of "enlightenment" if you like?! I've come to see that he actually had some serious issues with intimacy, all part of the CP I think. Yet, still he really believes what he has said and he really thinks what he has done is no big deal! How can I keep pining for someone like that. Answer-I can't and I'm not. I woke up so happy this morning............. Link to post Share on other sites
tojaz Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 I have started to realise that my ex soooooo isn't worth all this pain. Call it a moment of "enlightenment" if you like?! I've come to see that he actually had some serious issues with intimacy, all part of the CP I think. Yet, still he really believes what he has said and he really thinks what he has done is no big deal! How can I keep pining for someone like that. Answer-I can't and I'm not. I like the moment of enlightenment Lisa, it seems the more I read on LS that when people come to this realization, it's like a bolt of lightning! It wasn't there and now it is. I do think the walk aways believe what they say at first, but they can only keep the delusion up for so long before it all comes raining down on them what they have done! By then, the spouse has moved on to bigger and better things. TOJAZ Link to post Share on other sites
Author LisaUk Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share Posted August 17, 2009 I like the moment of enlightenment Lisa, it seems the more I read on LS that when people come to this realization, it's like a bolt of lightning! It wasn't there and now it is. I do think the walk aways believe what they say at first, but they can only keep the delusion up for so long before it all comes raining down on them what they have done! By then, the spouse has moved on to bigger and better things. TOJAZ Thanks Tojaz, yes it is very much like that, just one moment, that's all it takes it seems, suddenly things become much clearer and I can see what I could not before! Hope you are right about the walk aways and the partners having moved on, I hope I keep up this feeling.....I think I can, I think maybe I have reached a turning point. Link to post Share on other sites
tojaz Posted August 18, 2009 Share Posted August 18, 2009 Thanks Tojaz, yes it is very much like that, just one moment, that's all it takes it seems, suddenly things become much clearer and I can see what I could not before! Hope you are right about the walk aways and the partners having moved on, I hope I keep up this feeling.....I think I can, I think maybe I have reached a turning point. Lisa, It sounds like youve made some decisions. It shows in your posts. I'm sure that feeling will continue or even get better for as long as you want it to. It's all up to you know. TOJAZ Link to post Share on other sites
Author LisaUk Posted August 19, 2009 Author Share Posted August 19, 2009 Yes you're right Tojaz. That moment made everything so clear to me. Toady, in reading these boards I had some more realisations. Just reading the posts from all the guys on here and seeing, feeling your pain over your wives... I just had the briefest of crys. It shows in all the posts the capacity for love that some men are able to give, how much you all truely love your wife. I got upset, not because my ex has gone, but because it makes me so sad that I haven't known that kind of love, no one has loved me like that. I thought my ex did...I thought... But in reading here and with the realisation I had the other day, I can now see, that although he loved me, he never gave himself over to me completely, like I did to him. He held back. I do think he has CP, but even if he hasn't, he was never truely intimate with me. I'm sad that I have never known that complete type of love and that I spent 18 years with a man who did not truely cherish me. Now, I hope I can put this to rest, certainly I do not long for him anymore, nor would I take him back if he came knocking, I mean, I don't even think I want him to ask, so I can tell him to sling his hook, anymore either. I just don't care. I don't think about what he's doing, I don't think about what he's feeling or if he thinks about me. The only thing I think about him when he occasionally and briefly comes to mind, is a feeling of sadness, not sadness in the sense that I miss him, I don't, just sadness..... Link to post Share on other sites
lastout_82 Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 Yes you're right Tojaz. That moment made everything so clear to me. Toady, in reading these boards I had some more realisations. Just reading the posts from all the guys on here and seeing, feeling your pain over your wives... I just had the briefest of crys. It shows in all the posts the capacity for love that some men are able to give, how much you all truely love your wife. I got upset, not because my ex has gone, but because it makes me so sad that I haven't known that kind of love, no one has loved me like that. I thought my ex did...I thought... But in reading here and with the realisation I had the other day, I can now see, that although he loved me, he never gave himself over to me completely, like I did to him. He held back. I do think he has CP, but even if he hasn't, he was never truely intimate with me. I'm sad that I have never known that complete type of love and that I spent 18 years with a man who did not truely cherish me. Now, I hope I can put this to rest, certainly I do not long for him anymore, nor would I take him back if he came knocking, I mean, I don't even think I want him to ask, so I can tell him to sling his hook, anymore either. I just don't care. I don't think about what he's doing, I don't think about what he's feeling or if he thinks about me. The only thing I think about him when he occasionally and briefly comes to mind, is a feeling of sadness, not sadness in the sense that I miss him, I don't, just sadness..... im at the same point lisa, just sadness, but im finally at a point were i dont dream everynight and think about it everyday. which is very good. Hope the best for you Lisa and thank you for the help you have given me. Link to post Share on other sites
tojaz Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 Yes you're right Tojaz. That moment made everything so clear to me. Toady, in reading these boards I had some more realisations. Just reading the posts from all the guys on here and seeing, feeling your pain over your wives... I just had the briefest of crys. It shows in all the posts the capacity for love that some men are able to give, how much you all truely love your wife. I got upset, not because my ex has gone, but because it makes me so sad that I haven't known that kind of love, no one has loved me like that. I thought my ex did...I thought... But in reading here and with the realisation I had the other day, I can now see, that although he loved me, he never gave himself over to me completely, like I did to him. He held back. I do think he has CP, but even if he hasn't, he was never truely intimate with me. I'm sad that I have never known that complete type of love and that I spent 18 years with a man who did not truely cherish me. Now, I hope I can put this to rest, certainly I do not long for him anymore, nor would I take him back if he came knocking, I mean, I don't even think I want him to ask, so I can tell him to sling his hook, anymore either. I just don't care. I don't think about what he's doing, I don't think about what he's feeling or if he thinks about me. The only thing I think about him when he occasionally and briefly comes to mind, is a feeling of sadness, not sadness in the sense that I miss him, I don't, just sadness..... Lisa, I'm very happy to hear you've turned the corner. It's like what i've been trying to tell you all along, to find someone who loves you the way you deserve to be loved!! It dosen't sound like he was capable of that. My wife wasn't either really. I've always thought love would be like getting caught in a storm. It would just wash over you and saturate every part of you. She always held something back. Shut me out of something and kept it for herself. You will find love like that, even after all this, I'm still a hopeless romantic that believes that true love, once found, can conquer all!! I guess we just haven't found it yet. TOJAZ Link to post Share on other sites
delajoonal Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 You will find love like that, even after all this, I'm still a hopeless romantic that believes that true love, once found, can conquer all!! I guess we just haven't found it yet. TOJAZ that was beautiful tojaz....i hope we ALL find THAT special love....soon;) Link to post Share on other sites
Author LisaUk Posted August 19, 2009 Author Share Posted August 19, 2009 Lisa, I'm very happy to hear you've turned the corner. It's like what i've been trying to tell you all along, to find someone who loves you the way you deserve to be loved!! It dosen't sound like he was capable of that. My wife wasn't either really. I've always thought love would be like getting caught in a storm. It would just wash over you and saturate every part of you. She always held something back. Shut me out of something and kept it for herself. You will find love like that, even after all this, I'm still a hopeless romantic that believes that true love, once found, can conquer all!! I guess we just haven't found it yet. TOJAZ What a lovely way to put it Tojaz, I think that sums up what I'm feeling perfectly. I do so hope I am lucky enough to find love like that, from this forum I can see it's out there. I never knew I was missing anything with him at the time, but now it has been shown to me I realise there is so much better. Amazing how you can miss something you've never had once it becomes clear it exists. Link to post Share on other sites
MrMayI Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 let's just all find a big ranch and settle down together. Link to post Share on other sites
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