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In Search Of... Having a hard time forming friendships or finding companions, lovers, or associates? Is someone pursuing an unwelcome relationship with you? Talk about your experiences here.

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Old 24th October 2017, 4:04 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by normal person View Post
I think any form of passive escapism (videogames, tv, movies) where you just sit and consume things, don't learn anything, and aren't a better person as a result, are kryptonite to getting what you want out of life. Yeah, it's fine to use escapism to blow off steam for an hour here or there, but when they siphon the time and energy that could be otherwise used to get what you want, then it's a problem, as it seems to be for OP. He wants to meet girls, but he admits he's happier staying at home and playing video games -- which, in my mind, is a comfortable, convenient, escape from what he ought to do to get the things he actually wants. I would say the same thing about anyone who's overly reliant on comforts and unwilling to face discomfort for something greater.



He said he'd rather sit on the couch and play video games than go out and meet women, and the purpose of his thread is to lament how hard it is to meet women. Therefore, he's putting videogames ahead of meeting women.



If the girl wants to watch ballet to the point that it negatively affects her life and she complains how she can't do other things, then yes, in my opinion, it's a perfectly valid reason to remove her from dating contention. The same goes for videogames, watching football, or anything else. The issue is not the form of escapism (though I think videogames are particularly bad), it's the way and degree to which the person uses it and the negative consequences thereof.



And yet, OP seems like he would enjoy meeting more women, but can't make it work because he's afraid of how he'll be judged or rejected. If he really just wanted to do what he wanted regardless of judgment, he'd simply just do it and there would be no thread. So clearly meeting women is the thing he wants to do but doesn't for fear of judgment. The videogames are just the placeholding, warm blanket activity that he ends up doing instead.

Yeah, potential partners are judgmental. And we all still want them. Some people will face that judgment, discomfort, and uncertainty head on to try and get what they want. Others will be afraid of that judgment and let it hinder or stop them from trying. So in a way, OP is the opposite of the person you give kudos to.



Guys under 35 have careers to build, relationships to develop, families to raise, money to make, mouths to feed, college educations to save for, etc. Any notable amount of time to staring at a screen pretending to be someone else siphons valuable time and energy away from those real life pursuits. I'm yet to hear a convincing argument about how video games are somehow a better use of time than any of those necessary, pragmatic, life-changing endeavors. The more time you spend staring at a screen with no dividend, the more separated you become from your real world responsibilities and goals in life. That's why I'm always in shock when I hear things like this, or when girls say "I prefer a guy who plays video games." Wouldn't you prefer a guy who, say, spends his time learning how to fix cars, or studies for law school, or plows driveways in the winter for extra money? To each their own, but it just doesn't make sense to me.
I don't think there is a problem with escapism per se BUT if you really want something badly enough then yes, you need to actually try get it, if you try and trying makes you unhappy then yes use escapism, well that's my view at least.


I'd agree with the bold to an extent but its about balance, I don't see the harm in some recreational gaming but its about balance. Probably because I too hate clubs I can understand why the OP laments his lack of dating when he hates the tools equally much.


Which is why I say find things which make you happy because life is far better experience when you have those things versus being unhappy about being dateless. Been there have many T shirts to show for it.


One thing I would advise the OP to do is like you say acquire some form of knowledge even if its general knowledge. You need to TRY impress people to lesser or great degrees, pretend life is a shop and try find your own value and believe in that value. Mostly I encourage the OP to be happy in his own skin, look to improve what you can but do it for you nor for others.


Lets be honest when you make a decision not to go out you need to live with the consequences of that, I made that decision and have made peace with it preferring to do focus on other goals. In life you need some focus and you cannot make everything about dating. OP can complain about being dateless but that's only valid if you try to begin with or you cannot actually complain at the circumstance you find yourself in.


Its very hard to be in the OP position, mentally because everything seems utterly hopeless but its only that if you make it so, add value to yourself and you can enjoy chasing those goals.


Against what people say I do believe some people are just not capable of attracting what they want and then you need to either settle for something you don't want or chase other objectives. Or you make friends, the value of this cannot be understated.
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Old 24th October 2017, 4:41 PM   #47
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Those are big words and extremely judgemental. Nowhere has the OP put gaming ahead of everything else so that's a huge assumption.


Lazy person? Judgemental much based on what exactly?


A hobby should NEVER be a reason to throw someone away, someone who doesn't look after themselves is a far greater negative in my opinion. Do you then throw the girl away who goes to watch ballet or classical music because well nobody really does those things?


For me kudos to anyone who does what they enjoy irrespective of the judgemental nature of society.
Just going by what he said about himself in his original post. It sounds like more than a hobby to me. Others on here have called it his lifestyle. I'm just saying this lifestyle isn't conducive to having others in your life because it's solitary. And everything else, he feels is too much effort, as he elaborated on.
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Old 24th October 2017, 4:52 PM   #48
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I don't think there is a problem with escapism per se BUT if you really want something badly enough then yes, you need to actually try get it, if you try and trying makes you unhappy then yes use escapism, well that's my view at least.
I think escapism is totally fine if you're otherwise happy, healthy, fulfilled, prepared for the unexpected, and financially solvent. But if that doesn't apply to you, and there are things that you need, want, or should do, and you still then choose escapism, then you have a problem. OP wants a girl, but only bad enough to complain about how hard it is and not not enough to ditch the comfort of escapism and actually do the work to get one.

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Probably because I too hate clubs I can understand why the OP laments his lack of dating when he hates the tools equally much.
We all have things we don't want to do. We all have to make compromises. We all have to play the hands we're dealt. Complaining won't change much. That's the harsh reality. The hard, uncomfortable things are usually the ones most worth doing.

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Which is why I say find things which make you happy because life is far better experience when you have those things versus being unhappy about being dateless. Been there have many T shirts to show for it.
But the point of the post is that he does those things which supposedly ("should") provide him joy, but he's still unhappy because of his lack of success with women. We have a biological urge to reproduce that can't be undermined with Mario Kart.

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In life you need some focus and you cannot make everything about dating. OP can complain about being dateless but that's only valid if you try to begin with or you cannot actually complain at the circumstance you find yourself in.
Yes, you need a higher purpose in life, or a higher goal to chase, absolutely. But if the primary purpose is to be content sitting around, not contributing anything of value to others, scared to take to chances or be uncomfortable, stuck in front of a TV screen consuming or controlling virtual lives of consequence rather than your own real one, then the whole premise implodes. Your focus or presence in this life needs to be somehow impactful for you to move the meter of respectability to feel fulfilled, and then you can enjoy relationships concurrently or as a result.

The videogames do nothing for anyone but you. There are people who invest lots of time in doing actual things, and there are people who invest a lot of time in watching others do them or pretending to do them. I can't fathom a woman being more attracted to a grown man whose primary focus in life is to sit in front of a TV and pretend to shoot people, as opposed to a man in an actual war zone, literally being shot at while trying to advance his cause and create change in the world.

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Its very hard to be in the OP position, mentally because everything seems utterly hopeless but its only that if you make it so, add value to yourself and you can enjoy chasing those goals.
Life is difficult. Challenging yourself, fighting and overcoming fear/discomfort to do what you or someone else previously thought was impossible is amongst the greatest joys you can ever experience.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I think if OP wants those girls, he should put the videogames down, find more meaningful pursuits, and challenge himself until he's satisfied. But that's just me.
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Old 24th October 2017, 4:56 PM   #49
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Life is difficult.
boy that's the truth np
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Old 25th October 2017, 1:30 AM   #50
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I think escapism is totally fine if you're otherwise happy, healthy, fulfilled, prepared for the unexpected, and financially solvent. But if that doesn't apply to you, and there are things that you need, want, or should do, and you still then choose escapism, then you have a problem. OP wants a girl, but only bad enough to complain about how hard it is and not not enough to ditch the comfort of escapism and actually do the work to get one.



We all have things we don't want to do. We all have to make compromises. We all have to play the hands we're dealt. Complaining won't change much. That's the harsh reality. The hard, uncomfortable things are usually the ones most worth doing.



But the point of the post is that he does those things which supposedly ("should") provide him joy, but he's still unhappy because of his lack of success with women. We have a biological urge to reproduce that can't be undermined with Mario Kart.



Yes, you need a higher purpose in life, or a higher goal to chase, absolutely. But if the primary purpose is to be content sitting around, not contributing anything of value to others, scared to take to chances or be uncomfortable, stuck in front of a TV screen consuming or controlling virtual lives of consequence rather than your own real one, then the whole premise implodes. Your focus or presence in this life needs to be somehow impactful for you to move the meter of respectability to feel fulfilled, and then you can enjoy relationships concurrently or as a result.

The videogames do nothing for anyone but you. There are people who invest lots of time in doing actual things, and there are people who invest a lot of time in watching others do them or pretending to do them. I can't fathom a woman being more attracted to a grown man whose primary focus in life is to sit in front of a TV and pretend to shoot people, as opposed to a man in an actual war zone, literally being shot at while trying to advance his cause and create change in the world.



Life is difficult. Challenging yourself, fighting and overcoming fear/discomfort to do what you or someone else previously thought was impossible is amongst the greatest joys you can ever experience.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I think if OP wants those girls, he should put the videogames down, find more meaningful pursuits, and challenge himself until he's satisfied. But that's just me.
I agree with all of this but maybe OP would be better served to look at his objectives and then determine if they are in fact realistic given his circumstance. If not then the circumstance needs to change to try and achieve those goals.


However if you cannot present a happy persona you can do whatever you like to your circumstance you will never attract anyone at all. In my opinion given the OP age and lack of experience he is far behind the curve and again not universally popular it will be VERY hard to change that circumstance to something that people will actually want.


Which is why I am advocating rather find something that makes him happy, we know that dating makes him unhappy so why continue on this path? Focus on something, anything to improve.


If you take out the physical aspect what is dating really, its just a friendship, nothing more so the solution is to find friends. People need to feel self worth and they need to feel other value them as people. Get those two things remotely right and to an extent you don't need dating at all unless you absolutely want kids and you absolutely want to get married.


Putting himself out there is a good idea but where exactly? You say uncomfortable decisions, again this is opportunity cost, sitting in a club versus sitting at home bettering ones education or working towards something, if you are bad at the former then why expend time doing something you don't enjoy?


Ultimately the steps you take define how much you want something, if you want it enough you will find a way to accomplish it BUT if you are 30 and have no experience the chances are you will accomplish it are slim to next to none in my opinion purely because you are out of step with society and as much as people here will say it doesn't matter, it does because people don't want to teach. The easiest way to get what you are looking for is to lower your standards and then yes I am sure it becomes easy, I lowered mine and I had a flock of interest but none of it interested me.


Again if gaming makes you happy then continue with it if you want to date, think really hard if its ACTUALLY what you want.
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Old 25th October 2017, 1:32 AM   #51
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boy that's the truth np
I don't really think so, things can be as difficult as one chooses to make them. Difficult is when you swim against the tide in any one aspect of life or don't walk to the same beat as everyone else.
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Old 25th October 2017, 1:10 PM   #52
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Well said, Normal Person.
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Old 25th October 2017, 1:48 PM   #53
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I agree with all of this but maybe OP would be better served to look at his objectives and then determine if they are in fact realistic given his circumstance. If not then the circumstance needs to change to try and achieve those goals.
He just wants to meet a woman, it's not rocket science.

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In my opinion given the OP age and lack of experience he is far behind the curve and again not universally popular it will be VERY hard to change that circumstance to something that people will actually want.
Again, it's not like what he's after is particularly difficult. Plus, he's 22, he's got plenty of time to figure it out. Most people are committing dating faux pas up to their mid 20s. The thing OP needs to do is rely less on escapism, start challenging himself to get the things he wants, commit said faux pas, and learn from his mistakes.

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Which is why I am advocating rather find something that makes him happy, we know that dating makes him unhappy so why continue on this path? Focus on something, anything to improve.
No. Having a girlfriend would make him happy. But the process of getting one makes him uncomfortable. I say, "well, that's what you'll have to deal with to get something you want." You're advising him to just not bother. It's like you're saying "I know OP wants to be a lawyer, but law school is really hard and might stress him out, so why take that path?"

If you want the result, you have to do the work.

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Putting himself out there is a good idea but where exactly? You say uncomfortable decisions, again this is opportunity cost, sitting in a club versus sitting at home bettering ones education or working towards something, if you are bad at the former then why expend time doing something you don't enjoy?
We've had this conversation a dozen times. All I'm saying is that if he dedicates less time to staying home and playing videogames, and more time working towards getting something he ultimately wants more than that, he will have better luck. Videogames do nothing for him. If he wants girls, he should go to where the girls are and figure it out. You're overcomplicating it.
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Old 25th October 2017, 1:52 PM   #54
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If he wants girls, he should go to where the girls are and figure it out.
wine tastings are a great place to start
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Old 25th October 2017, 1:53 PM   #55
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If you take out the physical aspect what is dating really, its just a friendship, nothing more so the solution is to find friends. People need to feel self worth and they need to feel other value them as people. Get those two things remotely right and to an extent you don't need dating at all unless you absolutely want kids and you absolutely want to get married.
Dating is about Mating and sexual selection. There are 3 evolutionary drivers. Good genetics (health), ability to provide resources (social status), and willingness to raise the child (attention).

Friendship doesn't tick all those boxes very well. I don't think it can help you learn how to be a more successful mate by itself.
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Old 25th October 2017, 3:59 PM   #56
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So... You're an introvert who prefers gaming over getting out and meeting women and only one-in-five of those women are your "absolute type"? You are your own worst enemy in this situation. You can't really complain about not being able to get dates when you're at home, playing XBox and pondering about 20% of women that fit your "standard".
You basically succinctly summed the root problem of every guy who complains about dating on ever internet forum on the web.

And none of them will believe it.

It would be funny if it weren't so annoyingly sad.
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Old 25th October 2017, 4:07 PM   #57
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For some unexplained reason, the topic of video games does not sit well with preraph.
Here is why, and this is on topic because not only is the OP the stereotypical shy gamer who wants a girlfriend (and so is my son), IT WILL GIVE EVERY GUY LIKE THAT AN INSIGHT INTO ABOUT 95% OF WOMEN ON THIS TOPIC.

I'm sorry about the caps. I got a new wireless keyboard and my fingers keep remembering the size of my old one. I'm not yelling.

The average early 20-something who spends lots of time on gaming and who has done so for years:

Is very shy and introverted
Has not had much socialization outside of the gaming world
Has done most of their interaction with other humans via computer and therefore:
- does not do well with social cues
- does not do well with body language
- does not understand the nuance of tactful communication
- has only interacted with faceless people who may or may not be female and are only communicating within the style of the game
- have grown up in the PUA era of being entitled to women and women more as objects than people
- feels more as though the world should adapt to them than learning how to fit in the world


None of the above are a slam. They are all thoughts that have been borne out in actual studies, actually. So they do not really know HOW to date, they do not want to take the risk outside their comfort zone, they expect if they finish a quest/equation, they should receive the reward, and that is how they approach dating. If I X, then a woman "should" want me.

They are also innately resistant to them being part of the problem.

So yes....when most women hear "I spend most of my time gaming in mom's basement/my dorm room" we automatically assume the above....and data supports our assumption.

OP, the hardest but best thing would be for you to take risks, be open, learn to let rejection roll off, and know that the only guarantees in dating are no guarantees. Oh, and learn that women are people, and that they are good people most of the time.
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Old 25th October 2017, 4:13 PM   #58
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I don't really think so, things can be as difficult as one chooses to make them. Difficult is when you swim against the tide in any one aspect of life or don't walk to the same beat as everyone else.
Actually, I would posit that CHOOSING to swim against the stream on principle and to prove a point is the very definition of making life difficult.

We all have challenges and we all have crap. I do not think the shy struggling guy who wants a hot babe has it any worse than anyone else on earth. The fact that he THINKS he does is part of what makes him unattractive to women.

He just refuses to believe it.
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Old 25th October 2017, 4:18 PM   #59
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Dating is about Mating and sexual selection. There are 3 evolutionary drivers. Good genetics (health), ability to provide resources (social status), and willingness to raise the child (attention).

Friendship doesn't tick all those boxes very well. I don't think it can help you learn how to be a more successful mate by itself.
How does this fit for people who don't want kids?
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Old 25th October 2017, 4:20 PM   #60
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How does this fit for people who don't want kids?
Well most people who don't want kids still value care and attention. But....people are not robots, car engines, or math equations. So again....no guarantees.
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