A mans pov on booby staring?

[Guest]

Perhaps find something better to do with your time, than sitting here on the computer typing away about what you need/should/could/want to do with your marraige. I know this is a site to help people and give advice etc, but thousands of views later and 200 and some posts later its still going around and around in a vicous cycle. I understand you are hurt/angry but reading some of these repplies probably would make you feel more anger, why do that? Its one thing to vent and get advice but its another to continuley rehash something over and over again. You made it clear what you are and are not gonna do, go do it.

[RecordProducer]

whoa.......... you suggested that I manipulate my husband in this thread earlier. Treat him like a child and such didn't you?

 

People in glass houses..................

What I meant was, the husband can tell compliemnts just to earn coins in the lovebank and the woman can stop herself from nagging (discussing an important issue that needs to be discussed) just to not lose a coin. It's accidently manipulating. It may work on the outside, but it's kinda artificial for my taste. But maybe they didn't use the jar like that. Maybe they found this method beneficial.

 

Manipulation is usually used in the negative sense, but it can be used in the positive as well. Isn't it manipulating when I tell my kids that we will leave only after they clean the mess they made? What's manipulative in telling your husband "I would like you to act like this..."

 

It's manipulative when you threaten with divorce. But hey, I understand you. You're at your wits end with this guy and don't know what to do anymore.

[JackJack]

much less emotional than probably many woman.

 

 

Maybe this is the problem, or part of the problem? Do you feel your husband wishes you were more of an emotional person? NO, I'm not meaning an emotional basket case either. Not trying to sound like a smart ass just asking if you think maybe he would like it if you were a little more emotional on some things.

[Walk]

and yes I am much more logical and much less emotional than probably many woman.

 

You'd think most people would appreciate that instead of talk as if it's a bad thing.

 

I'd say I have the worst relationship out of all of you in this thread.. and my bf is ADAMANT about "know your role" etc... I do know my role. I am Walk. I get what I need or there are consequences. I give readily and often. But I can NOT tolerate getting used. I don't care who's role it is.. I am either appreicated or I take me and my wonderful personality else where.

 

Just as a4a is saying she will do if she is not appreicated. But this isn't about "roles" at all. This is about being taken for granted, and in not showing appreciation in ways that would mean something to her.

 

Also.. I absolutely LOVE the chart idea. Its brilliant. Too bad most men aren't open minded enought to try it. You could really learn an incredibly amount about what makes your partner tick, and have instant feedback on what happened. (Like when you dumped the marbles on the floor). I would love to do something like that. Have a quantifiable way to know where you stand based upon each action.. I have a tendency to give more weight to something I do for my bf, then he actually gives it. Like.. I spent all day finding him a video game he had said he wanted. I thought it deserved major appreciation.. but found out later that he didn't give it much weight at all. But to have it drawn out like that.. God, that would really help me, even if it didn't help him a lick.

 

I like the idea!! That was brilliant.

[a4a]

Huh? How are you less emotional?

 

You think this whole thing pisses you off, but you're actually very hurt; hence the anger that you blow from your nostrils.

 

I was joking about the gender thing obviously. You sound liek a typical woman to me . You resent him for his lack of ambition, laziness, and financial support he gets from you. If your genders were reverse, you wouldn't have a problem.

 

Why doesn't he just get a job? Don't tell me you're unhappy in your marriage because you can't sell your truck. Give him orders about what needs to be done around the house/animals until he learns to do things without you telling him and make him get a job. Is that what you want or is there anything more?

Solve problems one by one. You don't have to do everything in one day.

 

 

no offense RP but you apparently did not read what I have posted... he has a job.....if you missed that much you must be missing more.

 

If I could support my business and this household fully I certainly would think it would be great if he could stay home and play. If I could hire someone to clean the house and mow the lawn on both pieces of property .... he does not have to be the MAN and earn the bucks. Why should he? Because he has a penis? I sincerly hope within 5-10 years I can offer him this option. But if he neglects my needs like effort into making me feel loved like I want him to then no..... he can kiss my butt as it walks out the door.

 

I do not desire a man to keep me or provide for me, if he could and I did not want to work...that would be nice. But that is not my stipulation to find him to be a good partner.

 

Again a fine example that not all women are alike or desire the same things in a partner. I did not marry him for him to provide food and shelter... I already have that on my own.

 

 

and it is obvious by the bold marked post above you have certainly no clue as to what this thread is about at all.

[Walk]

I was joking about the gender thing obviously. You sound liek a typical woman to me . You resent him for his lack of ambition, laziness, and financial support he gets from you. If your genders were reverse, you wouldn't have a problem.

 

Just want to say... Roles are reversed in my relationship, although I don't lack ambition, but all the rest fit. And yes, it does piss my bf off and cause serious resentment issues.

 

I don't think it's a specifically female gender problem. Although some women tend to judge a man's worth by the amount he earns, not all women do that...

[a4a]

much less emotional than probably many woman.

 

 

Maybe this is the problem, or part of the problem? Do you feel your husband wishes you were more of an emotional person? NO, I'm not meaning an emotional basket case either. Not trying to sound like a smart ass just asking if you think maybe he would like it if you were a little more emotional on some things.

 

oh god no... he cannot stand fru fru wimpy women.

he would kick a "OOOH OHHHH dirty horse poo poo" woman to the curb in 2 seconds.

 

I am not a zombie but I don't get all whacked out of shape from little things either.

 

We actually joke about that at length. He will make comments about his friends wives and how he would kill himself if he had to live with them.

 

One boo hooing over a Prada purse..... the nails, the whining, the this the that...... then he says....... I am lucky to have you to me..... so no not that.

 

I don't think he is really appreciating the fact that I am not doing anything around here tho

[JackJack]

I don't think he is really appreciating the fact that I am not doing anything around here tho

 

 

Well maybe after his underwear starts to reek then he will get motivated, not just the laundry but with everything to help save your marriage. Not sure if stinky underwear will motivate him but might be a start.

[a4a]

I don't think he is really appreciating the fact that I am not doing anything around here tho

 

 

Well maybe after his underwear starts to reek then he will get motivated, not just the laundry but with everything to help save your marriage. Not sure if stinky underwear will motivate him but might be a start.

 

well see again I failed..... I did the majority of the dishes and some laundry today again... I cannot live like a slob.

 

the vac is off limits tho. :lmao:

 

See this man would scream from a mountain that he loves me......but won't show me how I need him to no matter how much I communicate it to him.

 

If he would do this he would have me wrapped around his finger again.

 

Quite honestly there are only 3 causes I can think of right now for his behavior.

 

1. he is mentally in a clusterfruck

2. he actually does not love me at all (could really be true and this is what I am starting to really believe)

3. he loves me but is incapable of believing the speed limit is 45 no matter what I say or do.

 

massive frustration...... where is my fork..... I may use it on myself!

 

If it is 2 why is he still holding on tho? no more money is coming from me at all........ none...... I am not doing a thing to help him unless he shows signs of helping himself.

[Mz. Pixie]

Heck, I'm in a wonderful relationship Walk, NOW! :lmao:

[Walk]

From my perspective, the man still loves you... otherwise he wouldn't have bothered talking about relationship issues. He wouldn't admit he was ever wrong. He would reverse everything to be your fault. And instead of going along with ideas you pose, or attempting to still make you happy, he'd be blowing whatever money you two did have with a quickness... (This has been my experience.)

 

Try to reverse it.. how would you act if you really didn't love him? I highly doubt you would even bother to discuss anything, LET ALONE admit you were wrong in anything.. Yet he's admitting he's screwed up a lot. You could chalk that up to trying to make you think he's trying in order to get you to stay.. but do you really think he would do that? Honestly, in his dealings with other people, is he willing to do anything in order to get his way? or does he maybe try to slide, and then bucks up and does whatever he had to do? Take the job thing.. 2 months without a job.. but then he bucks up and does what he has to do. Just not seeing the greedy, no feelings, only using you for the money that he would have to be to meet the requirements for your Alternative number 2.

 

Lazy, maybe. Would rather not have to work, probably. Got to comfortable in your generosity, definitely. But not seeing the doesn't love you part.

[Becoming]

JJ's right about the laundry! I quit doing H's laundry long ago. When he doesn't clean up his clothes and crap to an acceptable level (I'm not talking spotless here, by any means), so that the bedroom looks like something you see on Clean Sweep or Mission Organization or one of those other TV shows, I move into the guest room where it's clean (I'm blessed to be able to have this space). When our room is clean, I move back in. I lived in the guest room for months (it's nice, I sleep better, and there are still conjugal visits--just no cuddling, which he likes). That's how stubborn/dense/hopeless/powerless my H was.

 

Basically, I use myself as live bait. You do this, you get good things from me. You do that, me go bye-bye. And I had to put it to him that simply because he simply never thought relationships were things you had to work at; they just were. Once he got the basic attraction-repulsion thing that orders the entire universe, he started to SEE FOR HIMSELF that what I was saying did indeed prove to be true.

 

The tough part about all of this is staying away from him because I want him. And I let him see all that, saying, "I;m sorry you've chosen to keep the room such a mess because I really miss cuddling with you. But I can't degrade myself to the point where I will accept sleeping in a pig stye with anyone. Sorry. You can come visit me in my room, until you find the time to clean up all your stuff piled knee high (I'm not exaggerating here!), but you'll have to leave afterwards, which is really sad because I like spooning with you all night. But I can't make you do anything you don't want to. I can only do what feels good for me."

 

The chart/love bank thing worked because it helped both of us see we were working hard for things that didn't count to the other--like Walk's video. Ya learn what works and spend your time and energy there. But it can't be manipulative or it won't work--that's true.

 

And **** the gender role crap. I can vacuum naked in high heels and pearls with the best of them. But I will NOT let anyone treat me and my perceptions as less than them and theirs because they happen to have a penis. I can go get a strap-on, if that's what it takes!

Which would make the vacuum cleaning a little more interesting. . .

 

So go:bunny: :bunny: the stud H and take heart. All is not lost. You're beginning the real work of marriage, which is trying to take two strong individuals and negotiate an us instead of a me and you--without losing your individuality. And that's really hard work because we are more different and alien to each other than Moose presumes people are. They simply will not conform presto magico to our perceptions of them and presumptions about what they should and should not be/do.

[a4a]

ok you guys are being awesome and it is very appreciated.

 

I am beyond thinking.

 

I have spent the day on LS and on debt/ credit sites..... looking at new BK laws..... ( I actually handled all my X's finances too..... now perfect credit after a BK) so my mind is fried.

 

1. I assume he will be home in an hour or so (no cell so I don't know )

what the hell do I do now ignore him because it is possible that I will fly off the handle.

 

2. hurry and clean up this house (severe urge to do this)

 

3. comb my hair and get fixed up and ignore him?

 

4. I would consider going out but I am too whipped...... should I just go into the other rooms?

 

5. act nice nice and do my very very best not to fork him in the head?

[Walk]

I just want to warn you right now, a4a.. I tried the "going on strike" thing.. and he was far more equipped at adapting to filth then I gave him credit for. All I accomplished was creating an environment not fit for people.

 

My brother tried that on his wife too.. since she wouldn't lift a finger to help with chores or finances.. Didn't work for him either.

 

I'd suggest.. not sure if this would work for you or not, but try a barter system? Make up things he has to do to re-pay you for your doing the dishes, etc.. My relationship, I do household chores to offset him paying the bills. So what would you want your hubby to do to offset you doing the household chores? Maybe you could be creative in this.. like for every 10 dishes you do, he has to stand on his head for 20 minutes. I was thinking if you made his re-payment kind of embarrassing, then you'd have better results. Otherwise there's no motivation to do the chore. He'd get punished by doing the chore, or punished for not doing the chore.. But embarresment works really well.. As long as it's not hurtful.

 

But I think the plan might not succeed if you hope to outlast him in a filthy house. Don't want to be negative about it.. but I'm serious, I was SOoooo pissed after trying that and then STILL having to clean up after letting it go so long. 3x's harder than it had to be.

[a4a]

I just want to warn you right now, a4a.. I tried the "going on strike" thing.. and he was far more equipped at adapting to filth then I gave him credit for. All I accomplished was creating an environment not fit for people.

 

My brother tried that on his wife too.. since she wouldn't lift a finger to help with chores or finances.. Didn't work for him either.

 

I'd suggest.. not sure if this would work for you or not, but try a barter system? Make up things he has to do to re-pay you for your doing the dishes, etc.. My relationship, I do household chores to offset him paying the bills. So what would you want your hubby to do to offset you doing the household chores? Maybe you could be creative in this.. like for every 10 dishes you do, he has to stand on his head for 20 minutes. I was thinking if you made his re-payment kind of embarrassing, then you'd have better results. Otherwise there's no motivation to do the chore. He'd get punished by doing the chore, or punished for not doing the chore.. But embarresment works really well.. As long as it's not hurtful.

 

But I think the plan might not succeed if you hope to outlast him in a filthy house. Don't want to be negative about it.. but I'm serious, I was SOoooo pissed after trying that and then STILL having to clean up after letting it go so long. 3x's harder than it had to be.

 

 

well it is not that bad..... guests were over and commented your house is way cleaner than mine..... toothpaste in the sink is a real big one for me... not just underwear on the floor.

 

I cannot live like this either:sick: messy.... I think there are 4 dishes left in the sink and the hamper is half full...... I do laundry everyday...home put the wash in...

 

ok so I am a neat freak.....

 

the sofa pillows are messed up from the dog being up there....not in the corner of the sofa. bugs me... hate those messy pillows. :mad:

[Walk]

FORK HIM !!!

 

Take the evening and do something relaxing FOR YOU!!!!!!!!!!

 

Be civil.. be available if he needs you.. But it better be a need. not a want.

 

Don't shut him out.. but just let him know you need YOU time and you're taking it. Then do those things you enjoy doing. I dont' knwo what those are.. read, watch tv, take a long hot bath.. go for a ride.. go for a walk..

 

Do what you need to in order to feel better and more mentally balanced. He can take care of himself. It'll also give him a brief insight into YOU not being there FOR him. Might give him the added boost to really change his ways.

[a4a]

FORK HIM !!!

 

Take the evening and do something relaxing FOR YOU!!!!!!!!!!

 

Be civil.. be available if he needs you.. But it better be a need. not a want.

 

Don't shut him out.. but just let him know you need YOU time and you're taking it. Then do those things you enjoy doing. I dont' knwo what those are.. read, watch tv, take a long hot bath.. go for a ride.. go for a walk..

 

Do what you need to in order to feel better and more mentally balanced. He can take care of himself. It'll also give him a brief insight into YOU not being there FOR him. Might give him the added boost to really change his ways.

 

 

popcorn and a movie is it then..... and my comfy clothes...

if the dish tv was not turned off

 

then it is popcorn and shadow puppets

[a4a]

see I will be pissed too if the dish tv is turned off........

 

oh well...... he knows the bill is due it comes to his email acct.

[hotgurl]

well see again I failed..... I did the majority of the dishes and some laundry today again... I cannot live like a slob.

 

 

a4a this is my problem too. I can't stand living like a slob and he knows he can always out wait me.

 

b@st@rd!

[a4a]

a4a this is my problem too. I can't stand living like a slob and he knows he can always out wait me.

 

b@st@rd!

 

well I just did clean the house except the vac and glass doors...

 

Some progress though..... H usually calls me when he is heading home. Well no cell for him so he actually used one of the employees to call. Seemed very different and some concern and actually chatted a bit (almost nervous like small talk)....chatted about his debt briefly. He is working tomorrow too.... $$$.

 

so I will make his dinner tonight.

 

Now I am smack in the middle of having to choose which house to build on my property.... it is a little stressful too.

[Touche]

"See this man would scream from a mountain that he loves me......but won't show me how I need him to no matter how much I communicate it to him."

 

Actions speak louder than words.

 

I did tell myself I'd stay off this thread because I only want to be supportive, A.

 

But your statement above is so telling.

 

It really doesn't matter how much you're alike or how much you have the same ideas about gender roles, etc. in a marriage if you're not getting your own needs met. It's all meaningless.

 

He will either step up to the plate or he won't.

 

I'm a LOT more like you than you think. I won't go into that now but trust me, I am. Don't let my "stay-at-home-mom" role that I'm living now fool you. That only represents THREE years out of TWELVE that I've been with my H now. I'm extremely independent and I don't represent the typical female in many ways.

 

The thing is is that I expect a FULL EQUAL partner in every way. And so should you. You're not getting that.

 

H and I are FULL partners. We share everything.

 

The real point here is that NONE of it matter if your emotional needs aren't being met. Then it all means nothing. NOTHING at all.

 

With that said though, you might want to consider that in a good marriage there will be times where YOU will be supporting him in many areas and at other times HE will be supporting YOU.

 

Do you see that? Because that's the way it's been in my experience. It can work that way. It's not ALWAYS equal ALL THE TIME.

 

I ask you to consider that concept.

 

I am not saying he's wrong for you at all. Only you can know that. I only ask you to consider the fact that in all good marriages there's sometimes one who is giving more to the other at a particular tme.

 

Perhaps this is just YOUR time to give to him. Pull back. Don't enable..just like you're doing. Let him fail a little but still be there to support him emotionally when he falls and when he, hopefully, pulls himself back up again.

 

I have a feeling that down the line you will reap the benefits of being patient and understanding with him.

 

I just have that feeling.

 

Please consider what I'm saying before you dismiss it.

[Roo]

ok so I've gone back and read this all from the start. From reading your posts, and responses I noticed a few things...

 

You obviously love this man, flaws and all, because all the while you are telling us how shi**y of a husband he is being, you tell us what a great man he is and clearly become agitated when it is suggested that he's not so great.

 

I believe from what I've read here that he DOES truly love you.

I believe that you two have gotten into a pattern of behavior that has become incredibly difficult to break, as I suggested in my earlier post I really do think you would benefit greatly from the "Dance of______" Books by Harriet Lerner. Here's the basic premis...

 

YOU CANNOT AND WILL NOT EVER CHANGE ANYONE BUT YOURSELF, but... here's the upside, relationships are like dances when you change your part in the dance eventually your partner will have to as well. Initially when you make changes the seemingly bad behavior will likely get worse... why?? Because people get comfortable with things they way they are, even if they really do desire change, initially it makes them uneasy and they push you to "change back" You have to stick it out, and you have to honor the SELF, your SELF. You have to make choices that honor your needs, do not waste your time or energy trying to fix him.

 

Does this mean I think you will have to leave him... I don't know. I know you need a change, duh you know you need a change. HOW to change that's the question. Stop looking for the things you aren't getting from him, get them somewhere else. I'm not suggesting you cheat, I'm suggesting you find that companionship somewhere else, go out find someone a group etc with some similar interests etc. Find ways to fill your own cup and stop waiting for him to do so. When you find a way to make yourself happier (without having to decide the fate of your marriage based on either he makes you happy or you walk) you will need these things from him less, thereby reducing your own reactivity to NOT getting them from him, and generally reducing the stress around these issues. This should make them a bit easier to work on.

 

Will it work, will he ever give you what you want?? I dont know. How could I? But I do know that at one time I felt like you do now, I wondered how someone could seemingly love me so much, and so little all at the same time. 8-9 years from the place we started we are happily married with two children and better than average communication. I have read three or four (actually I'm now reading the fourth) of the series of "Dance" books and I am re reading one again too because they help me to remain focused, and how to use my anger and other emotions to help me navigate thru my relationships and be authentic about what I feel and need within them.

 

Here's a snippet for you...

 

"Anger is a signal, and one worth listening to. Our anger may be a message that we are being hurt, that our rights are being violated, that our needs or wants are not being adequately met, or simply that something is not right. Our anger may tell us that we are not addressing important emotional issues in our lives, or that too much of ourself - our beliefs, values, desires, or ambitions - is being compromised in a relationship"

 

"Just as phsyical pain tells us to take our hand off the hot stove, the pain of our anger preserves the very integrity of our self."

 

"Communicating clearly and effectively is difficult even in the best of circumstances. When we are angry, it is more difficult still. It is hardly possible to be self-observant or flexible in the midst of a tornado. When emotions are high, we can learn to calm down and stand back a bit in order to sort out the part we play in the interactions that we complain about."

 

HTH I really do feel for you it sounds as if this pains you greatly, and I can empathize with this pain. I really hope for you that you can find a way to make this marriage work and for you and H to be happy together again.

[RecordProducer]

no offense RP but you apparently did not read what I have posted... he has a job.....if you missed that much you must be missing more.

 

and it is obvious by the bold marked post above you have certainly no clue as to what this thread is about at all.

a4a, frankly, nobody here has a clue as to what this whole thread is about, just like nobody understands what you want.

 

Sorry if I skipped something in the 20 pages of posts, but what is the case. Can you answer 3 simple questions in one post?

 

1. Why are you unhappy with the marriage? (You said if you could fix the money problem everything would be OK, but the name of this thread was boobs whatever, then you talked about dogs, then about gifts, then about affection, then about you working too much then about money problems. I see that all of those are issues, but is it the money thing or general dissatisfaction?

 

2. What do you want from your marriage? You keep rejecting all advice and ideas as totally stupid, accusing people of projecting their own problems on your case, and claiming all the time how unique you and your husband are. Yet we don't see anything so unique about a woman who is frustrated because she gets no presents, her husband doesn't protect her from aggressive dogs and rude people, he is lazy and non-ambitious and she pays his bills... Sorry, but ALL women would be upset about these things. But hey, if you want to think of yourself as special and believe that no one can understand you then go ahead. Take a bottle of vodka and pity yourself.

 

3. What IS the deal with his job and the bills and the money if I got it so wrong after reading 100 posts about it?

 

a4a, take charge of your emotions, calm down your anger, and decide what you're going to do. The few days of rage are over. If you decided to work on your marriage then you have to open your heart and be optimistic and supportive. Even when you argue with him, you have to stay supportive.

 

I've had days when I was really mad at my husband, but after a while it goes away, things get solved and everything is nice afterwards. Sometimes the problems re-occur, sometimes not. You've had your anger-break for a couple weeks, now go cuddle with your husband and be happy for all the things you have in life (that so many people don't).

 

BTW, you said he didn't buy you a present in 3 years. So when you married him, you knew he was like this when it comes to presents.

[AManWithTroubles]

Honestly, I sometimes think that a4a has the problems here. You kinda come off, to me, as an "attention whore".

[Touche]

Honestly, I sometimes think that a4a has the problems here. You kinda come off, to me, as an "attention whore".

 

Of course A has the problems here. She has a problem with her husband right now. But what I don't get is how you think the latter part of your statement is helpful at all.

 

Can't ANYONE who posts about their own problem(s) and is looking for support be considered an "attention whore?"

 

Do you think that everyone who starts a thread looking for support is an "attention whore?"

 

I submit that your post SCREAMS of the very behavior you accuse the OP of.

 

Go think about that, ok?