Suggestions for handling this problem?

[riobikini]

Cali, All,

 

Since the Mom's email was tagged (unknowingly, at the bottom) with info regarding Cali's ex and her new boyfriend, confirming to Cali that his ex was, indeed, still with her new beau, it dashed to hell, for the umpteenth time, Cali's remaining hope, and confirmed to him again, that his ex had moved on.

 

It was a blow to Cali's hopes, which we all realize, despite everything, are still burning.

 

This could send anyone still harboring hope into a tailspin.

 

Now -get this straight- the Mom's email was sent as a mass-mailing from her computer to many, many people, -all tagged with the same old message still tagged at the bottom from another email from another family member.

 

The Mom didn't realize she'd sent the old message to everyone.

 

Cali is the one who was affected by it most.

 

Secondly, I have to take a stand on 'NC', here, with my personal view, forthcoming, below.

 

But first, Cali, I do not apologize for what I am about to say, -it's time to turn the corner on all this and face the true facts, -if I didn't care, I wouldn't have even looked at this thread.

 

Now, the hard facts, brass tacks -whatever you want to call it:

 

'NC' does most absolutely (if the full dose is to be taken undiluted) mean that nosing around purposely for info from relatives regarding an ex is defying the help offered by 'NC'.

 

Keeping in contact with the brother because he's such a nice guy, or the parents because they are such wonderful people, or his/her friends because you still like them, is just a way of rationalizing your behavior to fool others so you can hang around just in case there's info about the ex.

 

You're breaking 'NC'.

 

You can argue, -but if you want the truth, -that's it.

 

We are very creative human beings, in that even though we know what's good for us, we don't always accept it -or do it- right away.

 

We can know the facts, the truth, the bottom line, and the consequences to anything, -like the back of our own hand- and where love emotions are clinging and very much present, -still do just the opposite.

 

Finding a way to fudge the truth, or veil ourselves from reality is a creative, self-deceiving stunt that has the very real ability to keep us mired in a miserable and psychologically disillusioned state of mind that slowly deteriorates the quality of our lives.

 

'Fessing up to that is difficult, but it will mark the place where you finally made a significant stride in your recovery, -a milestone- a place where you truly began to heal.

 

Cali, I am stating all the above in total kindness and concern for you.

 

You have been in denial for much too long and need to break free from this girl and the emotional and psychological effects of clinging to this very dead relationship.

 

I know you must have loved her with everything in you...*but she is truly gone* and you must relinquish her from your life, as well.

 

You do not have the power to make her come back, -so there's no reason whatsoever to keep any hope alive.

 

Someone said something on the board recently, regarding hope, that I interpreted to mean this: *** hope is something that should serve you, -not hurt you.***

 

And I see a great deal of wisdom in that statement.

 

I urge you to also block all email addresses from her family.

 

You must move on, Cali.

 

Your entire future mental (and physical) well-being depends on it.

 

Again, -all said in complete and sincere kindness.

 

-Rio

[bendit]

Rio, great post!

 

regards

[CaliGuy]

Cali, All,

 

Since the Mom's email was tagged (unknowingly, at the bottom) with info regarding Cali's ex and her new boyfriend, confirming to Cali that his ex was, indeed, still with her new beau, it dashed to hell, for the umpteenth time, Cali's remaining hope, and confirmed to him again, that his ex had moved on.

 

It was a blow to Cali's hopes, which we all realize, despite everything, are still burning.

 

This could send anyone still harboring hope into a tailspin.

 

Now -get this straight- the Mom's email was sent as a mass-mailing from her computer to many, many people, -all tagged with the same old message still tagged at the bottom from another email from another family member.

 

The Mom didn't realize she'd sent the old message to everyone.

 

Cali is the one who was affected by it most.

 

Secondly, I have to take a stand on 'NC', here, with my personal view, forthcoming, below.

 

But first, Cali, I do not apologize for what I am about to say, -it's time to turn the corner on all this and face the true facts, -if I didn't care, I wouldn't have even looked at this thread.

 

Now, the hard facts, brass tacks -whatever you want to call it:

 

'NC' does most absolutely (if the full dose is to be taken undiluted) mean that nosing around purposely for info from relatives regarding an ex is defying the help offered by 'NC'.

 

Keeping in contact with the brother because he's such a nice guy, or the parents because they are such wonderful people, or his/her friends because you still like them, is just a way of rationalizing your behavior to fool others so you can hang around just in case there's info about the ex.

 

You're breaking 'NC'.

 

You can argue, -but if you want the truth, -that's it.

 

We are very creative human beings, in that even though we know what's good for us, we don't always accept it -or do it- right away.

 

We can know the facts, the truth, the bottom line, and the consequences to anything, -like the back of our own hand- and where love emotions are clinging and very much present, -still do just the opposite.

 

Finding a way to fudge the truth, or veil ourselves from reality is a creative, self-deceiving stunt that has the very real ability to keep us mired in a miserable and psychologically disillusioned state of mind that slowly deteriorates the quality of our lives.

 

'Fessing up to that is difficult, but it will mark the place where you finally made a significant stride in your recovery, -a milestone- a place where you truly began to heal.

 

Cali, I am stating all the above in total kindness and concern for you.

 

You have been in denial for much too long and need to break free from this girl and the emotional and psychological effects of clinging to this very dead relationship.

 

I know you must have loved her with everything in you...*but she is truly gone* and you must relinquish her from your life, as well.

 

You do not have the power to make her come back, -so there's no reason whatsoever to keep any hope alive.

 

Someone said something on the board recently, regarding hope, that I interpreted to mean this: *** hope is something that should serve you, -not hurt you.***

 

And I see a great deal of wisdom in that statement.

 

I urge you to also block all email addresses from her family.

 

You must move on, Cali.

 

Your entire future mental (and physical) well-being depends on it.

 

Again, -all said in complete and sincere kindness.

 

-Rio

 

Rio, I agree with your sentiments. I guess what's bothering me most is I had dropped off contact with her Mom for the most part. I wasn't initiating contact and most of her emails are just little stories.

 

The one she sent that made me angry was an email I didn't even need to see and I told her it upset me for her to do that.

 

She got the message. I'm not going to initiate contact with her.

 

As for the ex, do I miss her? Yes.

Do I still love her? Sure.

Do I know why? No. And that's what's bugging the hell out of me.

 

Why do I love and miss someone who never met any of my needs whatsoever?

 

You know I am doing everything I can to get over her (including everything in my guide). I have projects and fun things to do. It's not like my life is boring or I can't keep myself entertained.

 

I really WANT to go out on dates, have fun and enjoy life. I just can't seem to get myself interested enough in someone else to do it.

 

Maybe I am obsessed. Not with the ex, but trying to figure out how I got myself this way.

 

I know what I should be doing. Some of us have the willpower to do it easily, others do not. We all know how easy it is to say "do this or do that" but actually doing it, finding the strength is quite difficult.

 

If it was easy, we certainly wouldn't need LS.

[Lishy]

Cali you are so right! It is easy to say "go date someone" I meet loads of guys and dont even like em enough to give them my number, let alone go on a date with em!

[2sunny]

Nobody can tell you CG what time frame you need to be under to move forward and not think about her.

 

I have a strong feeling that when you truly become interested in someone new and healthy and fun for you and your lifestyle, then you will no longer think of her as often.

 

You don't have to rush things, but don't think you have to be ultra picky either! You may be ruling out good prospects as you meet them just for one reason or another.

 

Maybe the current objective is to find a few gals to spend some time with having fun and see which one might interest you for the future....

 

Or - you could always just take a vacation and see how that goes too.

[bendit]

Nobody said it was easy. For those who are serious about recovery, it is simple, however. You are in Contact. No matter what YOUR guide says, you are in contact. You can point to your Guide till doomsday and say you are NC. You aren't. And no, you Are Not doing "everything you can" to get over it. The one thing you Haven't tried is NC.

 

After four months, you should really try No Contact. That is if you really truly want to move on. If you don't, then keep referring to your Guide when someone suggests disengaging, keep pretending you are in NC, and keep doing "everything you can" to get over her. This is guaranteed to keep you stuck.

 

regards

[CaliGuy]

Nobody can tell you CG what time frame you need to be under to move forward and not think about her.

 

It's unbelievable but for a while there I wasn't thinking about her much at all. Then a couple of things happened that reminded me of her and poof, I started thinking about her again. I've stuggled at times and I freely admit that. But I do know time will heal the wounds and I just have to maintain a positive atttiude. CBT so to speak

 

I have a strong feeling that when you truly become interested in someone new and healthy and fun for you and your lifestyle, then you will no longer think of her as often.

 

I agree with you 100%.

 

You don't have to rush things, but don't think you have to be ultra picky either! You may be ruling out good prospects as you meet them just for one reason or another.

 

Agreed. I do know that my libido is still OK I mean, I still notice attractive women (though most I wanted to approach had wedding rings on) so in that respect I wouldn't be opposed to going out on dates. I just need some kind of spark to get it going.

 

Maybe the current objective is to find a few gals to spend some time with having fun and see which one might interest you for the future....

 

As soon as I find one that sparks me I'm good to go

 

Or - you could always just take a vacation and see how that goes too.

 

Got any ideas?

[shelters]

Why do I love and miss someone who never met any of my needs whatsoever?

 

 

Maybe because relationships are opportunities to heal wounds from long ago and you saw/still see the potential of a different outcome to 'your story' (whatever your story is).

 

 

Dunno. I'm thinking out loud here and writing this more for myself than you...

[2sunny]

CG-

 

Yep,

 

Ideas for a quick vacation.... those party cruises for three days to mexico have all kind of pretty gals looking to enjoy a few days of fun. Bound to be someone who lives here in Cali on the boat.

 

Not only that but you would have a few days to relax and have some fun.

 

Go to Papa's and Beer in Ensenada, dang, scary - but damn fun and funny.

 

Shoot, isn't cinco de mayo coming up on a Friday? Just a curious thought for you....

[Pyro]

CG-

 

Yep,

 

Ideas for a quick vacation.... those party cruises for three days to mexico have all kind of pretty gals looking to enjoy a few days of fun. Bound to be someone who lives here in Cali on the boat.

 

Not only that but you would have a few days to relax and have some fun.

 

Go to Papa's and Beer in Ensenada, dang, scary - but damn fun and funny.

 

Shoot, isn't cinco de mayo coming up on a Friday? Just a curious thought for you....

 

I know that there is not as much scenery as a cruise, but Pittsburgh is amazing. Its the perfect spot for a single to go and cut loose.

 

Two weeks away is Cinco De Mayo. I am all ready to go. I go downtown every year and it is fantastic.

[chocolate_boy]

Rio, I agree with your sentiments. I guess what's bothering me most is I had dropped off contact with her Mom for the most part. I wasn't initiating contact and most of her emails are just little stories.

 

The one she sent that made me angry was an email I didn't even need to see and I told her it upset me for her to do that.

 

She got the message. I'm not going to initiate contact with her.

 

As for the ex, do I miss her? Yes.

Do I still love her? Sure.

Do I know why? No. And that's what's bugging the hell out of me.

 

Why do I love and miss someone who never met any of my needs whatsoever?

 

You know I am doing everything I can to get over her (including everything in my guide). I have projects and fun things to do. It's not like my life is boring or I can't keep myself entertained.

 

I really WANT to go out on dates, have fun and enjoy life. I just can't seem to get myself interested enough in someone else to do it.

 

Maybe I am obsessed. Not with the ex, but trying to figure out how I got myself this way.

 

I know what I should be doing. Some of us have the willpower to do it easily, others do not. We all know how easy it is to say "do this or do that" but actually doing it, finding the strength is quite difficult.

 

If it was easy, we certainly wouldn't need LS.

 

Dude I've been in your shoes, and I got over it by being pissed off. I too did not initiate contact with my ex, but took it a level further by flat-out ignoring her feeble attempts at contacting me (sms and email), just sack them off like they're not worth your time of day, it makes you feel a lot stronger.

 

If a woman I invested my energies and love into, and believe has done the same to me, turns around and turns into a bitch (like yours did), my ex had a new guy lined up 2 weeks before we split and got with him the next day after we broke up, then wanted to meet me "as friends" and tell me all about him, coldhearted c*nt, so she can get f*cked. I'm not really angry anymore, but seriously just don't ever want to see or hear from her again, and will not give her enough respect to ever reply to her, every few months she sends little messages, and they will all be ignored.

 

I have too much respect for myself to allow someone who is like that to be in my life.

 

It disillusioned me in a way, I have had several failed relationships, but thought the last girl would never leave me (got all the usual "i love you more than i've ever loved anyone" etc.) then one day it changed. I've been single for 7 months now, and not got laid, not even kissed a girl in that time, while it does make me feel bit pissed that my ex is still the last girl I slept with (she's had about 4 guys i know of before xmas!), I just have no interest like you.

 

But enjoy it, enjoy the peaceful life, I go out drinking with my buddies whenever I feel like it, I work like a dog (15 hour days sometimes) and can do what ever I want, keep all my money, and last thing I want is a girlfriend right now. Don't worry about new women etc. just learn to be on your own and be happy.

 

The ex screwed you over in the worst possible way, while it isn't a crime falling out of love with someone, I have read your posts and she was rather nasty to you, so treat her with the contempt she deserves and tell yourself she was a mistake and you have lost nothing, she wasn't the person you thought she was, you f***ed up your judegement. But you're human, don't blame yourself, put it down to experience and look forward not back...

 

Time to be a MAN, be strong and forget that waste of time.

 

Worked for me!

[pippen_2k]

Dude I've been in your shoes, and I got over it by being pissed off. I too did not initiate contact with my ex, but took it a level further by flat-out ignoring her feeble attempts at contacting me (sms and email), just sack them off like they're not worth your time of day, it makes you feel a lot stronger.

 

If a woman I invested my energies and love into, and believe has done the same to me, turns around and turns into a bitch (like yours did), my ex had a new guy lined up 2 weeks before we split and got with him the next day after we broke up, then wanted to meet me "as friends" and tell me all about him, coldhearted c*nt, so she can get f*cked. I'm not really angry anymore, but seriously just don't ever want to see or hear from her again, and will not give her enough respect to ever reply to her, every few months she sends little messages, and they will all be ignored.

 

I have too much respect for myself to allow someone who is like that to be in my life.

 

It disillusioned me in a way, I have had several failed relationships, but thought the last girl would never leave me (got all the usual "i love you more than i've ever loved anyone" etc.) then one day it changed. I've been single for 7 months now, and not got laid, not even kissed a girl in that time, while it does make me feel bit pissed that my ex is still the last girl I slept with (she's had about 4 guys i know of before xmas!), I just have no interest like you.

 

But enjoy it, enjoy the peaceful life, I go out drinking with my buddies whenever I feel like it, I work like a dog (15 hour days sometimes) and can do what ever I want, keep all my money, and last thing I want is a girlfriend right now. Don't worry about new women etc. just learn to be on your own and be happy.

 

The ex screwed you over in the worst possible way, while it isn't a crime falling out of love with someone, I have read your posts and she was rather nasty to you, so treat her with the contempt she deserves and tell yourself she was a mistake and you have lost nothing, she wasn't the person you thought she was, you f***ed up your judegement. But you're human, don't blame yourself, put it down to experience and look forward not back...

 

Time to be a MAN, be strong and forget that waste of time.

 

Worked for me!

 

Money post Choclate Boy - Props to you.

 

I was here when you were going through a bad stage and you have moved on well.

 

Congrats.

[riobikini]

re:

 

CaliGuy: " Rio, I agree with your sentiments. I guess what's bothering me most is I had dropped off contact with her Mom for the most part. I wasn't initiating contact and most of her emails are just little stories.

 

The one she sent that made me angry was an email I didn't even need to see and I told her it upset me for her to do that.

 

She got the message. I'm not going to initiate contact with her.

 

As for the ex, do I miss her? Yes.

Do I still love her? Sure.

Do I know why? No. And that's what's bugging the hell out of me.

 

Why do I love and miss someone who never met any of my needs whatsoever?

 

You know I am doing everything I can to get over her (including everything in my guide). I have projects and fun things to do. It's not like my life is boring or I can't keep myself entertained.

 

I really WANT to go out on dates, have fun and enjoy life. I just can't seem to get myself interested enough in someone else to do it.

 

Maybe I am obsessed. Not with the ex, but trying to figure out how I got myself this way.

 

I know what I should be doing. Some of us have the willpower to do it easily, others do not. We all know how easy it is to say "do this or do that" but actually doing it, finding the strength is quite difficult.

 

If it was easy, we certainly wouldn't need LS."

 

 

Cali,

 

You have been one of the foremost inspirations here on the boards since I have been present, submitting very sound wisdom and offering helpful advice to some of the worst-case scenarios of breakup, but as with most of us (me included) -because we are still very human, and admittedly vulnerable to all the things everyone else is vulnerable to- we do tend to fail to be able to take our own advice, sometimes.

 

We are, at the core, dealing with the same issues, and meeting with the same obstacles in most cases.

 

No one is perfect, not you, not I, not the next fellow, -no matter how bright he/she is.

 

We all hurt.

 

We all struggle with the confusion and wonder "Why this?" or "Why that?" -and it, normally turns out that the answer was one that we knew, -and didn't act upon.

 

Myself? I know what it's like to analyze something until you're sick of it. I've had my head up the proverbial cow's rear-end so far on some things that I could have sent a dental bill.

 

Par for the course of many 'advice-givers'.

 

Yes, -me too.

 

I am certainly not above ignoring my own good advice, nor failing at my own strategies and 'how-to's that I give so sincerely to others.

 

Even with that said -knowing my own imperfections- I am very thankful to be human and have those flaws, because it puts me in a position where I am forced to seek the advice of others, and there, I know I can find my perspective reflected through theirs -unbiased by my own convoluted ideas, knowledge, and experience.

 

***A good advice-giver is not too proud to accept failure, nor admit when he/she is wrong.***

 

Being wrong is an opportunity to learn something new....and, for me, (smile) it is often the way I learn much.

 

My failures have served me rather well ('nother smile).

 

Now, I have come a long way through this post to begin making my point(s).

 

The first point is that it is not too late to change the way you are going about getting over your ex, nor rerouting your strategy to remove (once and for all) the stigma of being noted the guy who will always be her (your ex's) 'fallback guy', if she chooses to crook her little finger.

 

That is one of the things I think you are waiting on: for her to 'give up' or realize that she made this huge mistake in breaking up with you, and is ready to crawl on broken glass to beg you to be with her again.

 

Cali, close the door on that notion.

 

You are in no position, in regards to how much you have learned throughout your ordeal, to become the kind of fellow she is seeking.

 

You have learned over the last few months more about yourself than you have probably ever learned in the same amount of time at any other period in your life.

 

And you have grown stronger, -and are simply not the same guy you were a few months ago, -whether you realize it or not.

 

And for that reason, alone, -even if she did return, -it would more likely be you who would not be satisfied with the realtionship in a few short months, rather than her.

 

You believe that you want to feel the comfort and security again, of the love you felt for her when things were good, but it wouldn't be enough.

 

And, too boot, she is still in 'seeking' mode, -you already know what you want, -and she doesn't possess it to give and shows no signs of cultivating it at any time in the near future.

 

She wanted what she viewed as masculine traits which, by description, borderline on nothing more than male aggressive behavior.

 

She thinks these are strong traits indicative of what it takes to be 'a man' and is looking at not much else.

 

She is sooooo wrong, because those traits alone are insufficient to meet most female needs in the long run. But she will find this out soon enough, though, I doubt, she will choose to do much about it.

 

On the other hand, you are (and have obviously always been) a very attentive gentleman, -something she has, at times, viewed with much disdain. She, in a very strong sense, has viewed your traits as being weak...thus, challenging you to be more 'masculine'....and when that didn't satisfy her, or she felt you didn't display it well enough, you actually began the clinging behavior, because you started feeling her move away from you emotionally/physically.....bringing into the picture your 'clinging' behavior, and, perhaps, magnifying it more....and then the demise of the relationship.

 

It can devastate a man to have his masculinity challenged by a woman, -and that's exactly what she did to you when she helped to bring forward the clinging behavior in you and then pointed it out as something she considered 'weak' and 'unmanly'. It was a great part of why the relationship began the downhill slide, and frankly, I can see where she had great opportunity to actually engineer this behavior, purposely, to generate a 'reason' to leave the relationship. She wanted out. She wanted out to play. Again. Because the pattern was already there before you ever met her.

 

But it's also the reason you are stuck, I believe.

 

You see, the thinking with all that, is "If I can just win her back, I will have proven myself to her".

 

Truth is, Cali, ***any man need only to prove himself to himself.***

 

She did like your attention, though, because you catered to alot of her rather immature behavior...but she grew tired of it and looked for the opposite, -which is something you do not have in you, and which is something she felt she was missing out on, or being 'short-changed' by not having.

 

So she found herself a hulked-out 'manly' man and is now dealing with his rather insensitive behavior frequently.

 

She feels like maybe she made a mistake every now and then. She thinks about CaliGuy, and wonders if he's found a new girl, so she checks out his blog page or whatever.

 

***It doesn't mean she's woken up to her immature behavior pattern.***

 

Truth is, this girl is only learning what -no, who- she can use to meet her own selfish little-girl needs.

 

She's not fully grown up, yet, Cali -throw her back in the pond. But don't wait for her to mature, she may be ninety before she grows up. Or never.

 

She desperately needs the dose of reality she'll soon be getting. -it may be her only chance to learn something that will act as the turning point she needs to change.

 

She'll never be satisfied with either one of the other of the extreme types of romantic personalities she has chosen recently (you and Mr. Beefed-out Guy).

 

Furthermore, I do agree (from viewing her lovely picture) that she is a gorgeous girl, -but her looks are going to do more to contribute to her bad choices and selfish behavior than anything.

 

That's something that she will come to grasps with and choose to make some positive changes regarding, -or continue to pile up with mistake after mistake.

 

She was a prize for you, I realize that, -and she's certainly aware of the affect of her looks on the male gender, -but looks, alone, are not building blocks for a lasting, loving relationship.

 

In the meantime, -don't expect that awakening in her, -she doesn't show any signs of changing.

 

As far as her past 'hurts' in romantic relationships where she 'almost' married one or two other guys, -don't think for a minute that you could be the hero to have healed those hurts.

 

Remind yourself that those relationships were just mini-versions of what's happening in her life now, and that, as much as you want to believe that she was the victim in those breakups, there's too much repetition of an obvious pattern, here, for it to be accepted as 'none of her fault', at all.

 

What I see, is that she's a very cute Barbie doll, who's too used to getting her way, -and too used to pulling the strings and seeing you (guys) jump at the other end than being any kind of victim.

 

In my opinion, it's been the guys who have been the victims, here.

 

She's spoiled rotten, and will continue to have what she wants at anyone's expense and play sweet coquette to get her way, whenever she wants it.

 

Cali, there's no doubt you fell prey to all her charms and went spiralling head over heels in love with her, -but it's time to call all the facts to the carpet.

 

She's a user....and you have come too far to turn back.

 

Yours,

-Rio

[BBetsy]

I've only been here a few days and I just wanted to say to CaliGuy and RioBikini, you two are amazing to me. That last post, Rio, was right on the money. You give the greatest advice, I wish I knew you personally and could hang out with both of you.

 

The fact that CaliGuy still is dealing with issues is actually a source of support to people like me who are just starting this process. So I appreciate so much you sharing your weaknesses as well as your strengths.

 

Anyhoo, just wanted to say THANKS for what you're doing for unknown numbers of people like me all over the place who are trying to get a grip on this pain and deal with it in a healthy way. You -- and others on here -- are doing big, big things whether you ever hear about it from most of the people you're helping. Thank you.

[No Foolin]

This is an easy fix. You love your ex but you do no contact. So, same applies to the fam. Ex-girlfriends family is all part of that break up gig. No longer with the girl, you are no longer with the fam.

 

Hey I’ve been there, you love something but it jams you up. So you get your nuts out of your purse, cut it off at the knees and walk.

 

If something is hurting you why devote effort? Remember kids most of the sh*t that goes wrong in your life you do to yourself. 1+1=2. That’s what this smells like.

 

No Foolin