Should I have continued to go out with her in this situation?

[marcheem]

After 6 months of knowing each other and two dates, she told me this in person “I enjoy spending time with you, but I have commitment issues due to my parents going through a rough divorce when I was young, so I am not looking anything serious right now. I think it is better to go with the flow and see where things go between us, I can tell you are a great guy, but you do not really know me yet and I do not want to hurt you, because I believe that you are too good for me, and you deserve better. If I can give you some advice, if someone tells you they are afraid to hurt you, it is because they probably will. I think we should keep going out as friends to continue getting to know each other better, because I think it is too early for more.”

This was my response: "I really appreciate you being honest with me, and I respect that. I also enjoy spending time with you, but I believe that we accept the love we think we deserve. If I can give you some advice too, do not let your past shape your future”.

Then she invited me to go with her at a park the following weekend. I initially accepted but got legitimately busy with a family emergency, so had to cancel that same day over text. However, I did not feel the need to give her a reason in my text, just told her I was busy so was probably not going to be able to make it that day. She left me on read, did not even ask me what happened, which made me assume that she got offended.

As a matter of fact, a couple of hours later she posted this on social media “No one is ever too busy. People make time for those they really want to see. It is just a matter of priorities. Remember that if he wanted to, he would”.

When we saw each other time in person a couple of days later, she acted dismissively toward me to make me realize how much it hurt her, so I apologized and explained her what happened. She understood, empathized with me and my situation, but she just thought that I did not want to go out with her anymore, so then said we could always do another time. However, we never rescheduled, and things pretty much ended there.

Now, here are the questions I have been asking myself: would you still have continued to go out with her as friends? Was the ball on my court to reschedule or was there no obligation to do so at that point? Was she just letting me down easy and got disappointed because she thought that I did not want to be her friend? We are still friendly with each other, and I prefer things to be that way honestly after all, but was my behavior not emotionally mature enough? I wonder what she may think of me now for shooting my shot, but I always acted respectfully, so is it safe to think that it is for the best that things turned out the way they did, and it did not escalate to avoid making things worse? Am I wrong for thinking that we can stay friends without necessarily having to spend time alone?

Edited November 1, 2023 by marcheem

[BaileyB]

You’ve asked a lot of questions, but I’m just going to let you know what I think.

She is your coworker. This is going to get really messy if you continue to “date” your coworker for reasons to follow… No, I don’t think you can hangout alone and “date” your friend who is also your coworker… see what I’m saying - messy.

The other thing I will say, this woman has got a lot of maturing and work to do on herself before she is going to be a healthy relationship partner for anyone. She basically laid the groundwork that she was going to keep you at a distance and make you prove yourself to her because of her parents divorce and if you stay, you do so with the full knowledge that you should not expect any more from her… IDK, when somebody tells you that you should date them because you deserve better - I say, you should believe then. Consider yourself warned. Her tantrum when you cancelled the planned date is a sign of what will come if you continue to pursue this relationship. She has high expectations of you, while you need to manage your expectations for her/this relationship. I would say - thanks, but no thanks. 

I say, you work together - be friendly, if you are going to socialize, do it with a group of other people, but otherwise keep things professional. 

Edited November 2, 2023 by BaileyB

[Wiseman2]

23 minutes ago, marcheem said:

, if someone tells you they are afraid to hurt you, it is because they probably will

How come it's only 2 dates in 6 months? How old is she? She seems too complicated and messed up. However her comment about hurting people is true and perhaps a warning. 

Edited November 2, 2023 by Wiseman2

[Gaeta]

1 hour ago, marcheem said:

Am I wrong for thinking that we can stay friends without necessarily having to spend time alone?

But why? What's the point? 

You think that it will give you an opportunity to become more eventually? It won't

She told you she is emotionnally unavailable.

It's a bad idea from beginning to end. When women are ready to date again they don't pick their 'friend'. 

Let her go.

[glows]

If anything she was incredibly immature for airing out personal grievances like that especially about some guy she’s not even dating.

That aside yes you should have been more upfront about the family emergency and let her know you’re wanting to still see her. I don’t think she should have posted such a comment publicly and overreacted like you’re the last man on earth as it somewhat exposes how unstable and desperate she is. You both had ONE minor misunderstanding and she flips out on social media with negative comments. Can you imagine if you forgot something else while dating? How ridiculous.

You can stay “friendly” but she wouldn’t be a dating option. This person would be so remotely on the outskirts of friendzone it would border on rare acquaintance to me, maybe chat in 30 years if I see you on the side of the road. It would then be unfair of me if I were in your shoes to keep up the contact because she might think it will lead somewhere. 

What is she thinking? You say you wonder what she’s thinking. She is likely nervous and overreactive to things and I wouldn’t spend much time on what she thinks as how she reacted or behaved shows she’s just not doing well with life right now. I do feel bad for her and would wish her well regardless.

[Alpacalia]

What's up with 2 dates over 6 months? It seems like there wasn't much of a romantic spark there for her, and she was trying to let you down gently. You did the right thing by respecting her boundaries and not pushing for a relationship. And there's no obligation for either of you to reschedule after a cancelled plan. It's just a matter of mutual interest and availability. In this case, it seems like she may have lost interest or just didn't prioritize it. Overall, it sounds like you handled the situation maturely and respectfully. Don't beat yourself up over it. Sometimes things just don't work out, and that's okay.

[d0nnivain]

She's too damaged.  She told you as much.  Then she immediately jumped to the worst conclusion about the cancelled date.  She handled it passive aggressively too by posting (whining ) on social media where she knew you would see it then being cold in person.  

You don't owe people explanations but some of this could have been avoided if you had given her the reason when you cancelled the date initially.  At this point though, you dodged a bullet.  

If you want to reschedule you can try but after all this time she resents you for not chasing earlier.  In fact when you didn't initially chase hard & crawl around trying to make it up to her, you validated her warped world view that relationships are bad.   

You can stay friendly because there is no point in being mean but what do you get out of this? 

[Acacia98]

No. Forget about going out with her.

The reason why I say this is because I can't wrap my mind around the idea of "going out as friends" with someone whom you want to date romantically.

Also, next time someone tells you you're too good for them, take them seriously.

Edited November 2, 2023 by Acacia98

[Acacia98]

4 hours ago, d0nnivain said:

She immediately jumped to the worst conclusion about the cancelled date.  She handled it passive aggressively too by posting (whining ) on social media where she knew you would see it then being cold in person.  

You don't owe people explanations but some of this could have been avoided if you had given her the reason when you cancelled the date initially.  At this point though, you dodged a bullet.  

I agree. If this is how complicated "friendship" with her is going to be, I hate to imagine what a relationship with her would be like. 

[marcheem]

Thank you all for the responses. I guess the reason why I am overthinking it is because I am afraid that made me look as a man that could not keep his word and immature for being rejected? Am I wrong to think it was already over when she said those things to me? Then why did she keep reaching out via text, inviting me to do stuff together, after rejecting me and putting me in the friendzone? She said that she had no problem being friends with other men she went on dates with but just did not work out, so am I less or more mature than them for putting a boundary without necessarily cutting off contact since we have to see each other often? Giving attention one day and then removing it, did it made me look as a love bomber/manipulator, despite my intentions were genuine?

As mentioned, I was respectful during the dates by opening doors, picking her up from her place, buying her a box of cookies I know she likes, paying the bill at restaurants, making her laugh, reciprocating physical contact (holding hand, hugging, kiss at the end of first date), following sidewalk rule, asking personal questions. She also said "no other guy has treated me so well before. I told my mom about you, and she said the same thing, which is not easy to accomplish".

I am not opposed to socialize with a group of other people, but like pretty much all of you said, I do not think it would have been beneficial if the two of us would have continued to go out alone since I already had expressed my intentions, while she wanted someone to spend time with and nothing more. It also would have implied that I am still looking for something in return, which I am not, since I simply do not push boundaries or force people into anything, especially a relationship. However, she probably thought that I was not willing to be patient with her and not really interested in getting to know her after being vulnerable with me, validating her warped view about relationships, which I was trying to avoid. I also wonder if it was too soon to bring up the relationship conversation to her after only two dates, but I did not want to keep investing time and pursuing someone that was not on the same page.

In my mind, the fact she did not even answered my text about the canceled date can be considered a response as proof that interest was already lost, if it was ever there. It also was probably just a sign that walking away was for the best, I guess.

 

[BaileyB]

23 minutes ago, marcheem said:

She said that she had no problem being friends with other men she went on dates with but just did not work out, so am I less or more mature than them for putting a boundary

No, I would say that it’s the opposite - she is being a little naive, immature, and selfish to expect that you would want to be her friend after she essentially told you that she has no interest in dating. 

Some women like to collect male “friends.”  To me, this is a very immature thing for a woman to do. I say this because, when she meets a man who she wants to get serious about - he is inevitably going to have a problem with all her male “friends.” And when she is serious about her relationship with that man, she will dump her male friends pretty quickly…

She’s attempting to use you for her own purpose - companionship. You want to find a romantic relationship. This isn’t going to work, this is not your girl. 

Edited November 5, 2023 by BaileyB

[glows]

If I have to be very honest here and also trying to be objective about you, less about her, I’d say your attentive behaviours you describe above in your most recent post do not align with the part in your first post “I did not feel the need to give her a reason in that text” for cancelling the same day. You said you were “busy” actually and this is a very blithe and callous kind of text to send someone you have been lavishing a lot of romantic attention on for 6 months.

Someone brought up the fact that you only dated 2 times in 6 months which does stand out. This means you only treated her well on 2 dates and she told her mother about you after just 2 dates? She is more disappointed than anything and maybe slightly turned off that you cancelled the same day using wording that can easily be understood as pushing someone off and disinterest. She did appear to understand you afterwards and you both made up but she’s lost interest. 

I wouldn’t read into this being any deeper than that. It was only 2 dates. Yes, you could have been more communicative on why you just cancelled like that last minute and not brushed it off as being just “busy” but she’s just not interested. 

If you say that you did follow up later on a third date after all this confusion and she never replied it’s very clear she’s ok being acquaintances but she’s not interested in dating you anymore. You may not know the whys or what she thinks of you but it’s best to respect that.

For your sake maybe consider not being friends or chatting as often and give yourself a chance to move on and date other women.

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by glows

[Wiseman2]

On 11/1/2023 at 7:51 PM, marcheem said:

After 6 months of knowing each other and two dates, she told me this in person “I enjoy spending time with you, but I am not looking anything serious right now. 

After 2 dates in 6 months and this remark, it's best to let this go. There's nothing you could have done if she doesn't want to have a relationship. 

[Gaeta]

On 11/1/2023 at 7:51 PM, marcheem said:

“I enjoy spending time with you, but I have commitment issues

Yes it was over even before it started. I don't know why you put your hope in a woman telling you she cannot be in a relationship. When women tell you something beleive them.

There is zero advantage for you to be friends with her. You cannot befriend every woman you had a failed dating experience with. This will look bad when you meet a woman deserving of your attention. Don't be that guy with multiple women he briefly dated on his social media.

Addressing a relationship after 2 dates was quick yes! The woman told you she is a commitmentphobe and you bring up a relationship on second date! Next time don't bring up *relationship* but bring up *exclusuvity*.....My bf spoke about exclusivity on our 2nd date and it did not chase me away. He did not ask me to be exclusive, he informed me that he did not want to date anyone else. On our 3rd date l confirmed to him l was not going to date anyone else either. When people connect they're not afraid of words like exclusivity.

I agree with others, if you cancel a date don't act like you're cancelling a dentist appointment. Be sensitive. 

I don't think the outcome would have been different if you had acted differently. Like l pointed It was over before it started.

[marcheem]

I agree with all of you, it is just that for some reason I am still concerned about she perceived me as a man, because I am someone that likes the words and actions to align, and I always try my best to make sure I do that. It might have to do with the fact that I do not like to make people feel like they are not enough either, and I do not like to be remember as the man who was afraid to continue trying. However, I have learned that is not healthy, and if someone pretends to constantly prove yourself to them, just because she suffered in the past because of her dad, which should never be held against them since no one of this world chooses their family, and expects you to be there for them regardless, just to show how much you want them, seems utterly delusional and contradictory to me in a way too, because it gives them a reason to treat you however they want. Like I said before, no one should be chasing anyone and beg for something they cannot give, or maybe they just do not want to try it with you.

A simple explanation for the two dates in 6 months is that I did not really make a move until the last month, after we attended some social events and happy hours together first, since I wanted to make sure there was enough reciprocal interest before inviting her on a date due to working in the same building and having some mutual friends.

Therefore, when the situation started to become a little ambiguous for lack of better word, I decided to take the "safer" route and abort mission before it could have become potentially messy and avoid making a fool of myself. At the same time, when I think about it, I think she showed interest in me mostly because I started showing interest in her, so she kind of liked the attention and wanted to give it a chance too at the start I guess. Therefore, when I lost interest in her after she told me all of that, which I do not see how anyone would not after hearing that, and ended up canceling the date, even though I agree on the fact that I could have been more explicit that it was a family emergency, that is when she lost all interest to, but only because I stopped pursuing. However, I do not think that makes me a bad person or insensitive man. In fact, I would have appreciated a simple text back saying "okay, hope all is well" or something like that, instead of just leaving me on read, which seemed to me a little rude. I started noticing low interest anyway the week before that third "date", which did not happen, since she started to take even longer to reply, at least 4 hours and in one instance, she replied 24 hours later.

I did not say I wanted a relationship with her, I simply expressed that I was intentional in dating, which is when she hit me with the monologue. Sometimes I blame myself for bringing it up, but like many of you said, she probably had made her mind up already before saying all of that, and had those words ready in case things started to escalate, so it was bound to happen regardless probably. I know women would often test a man, but it comes a point where it is important to realize when they are doing it for validation.

I am not looking to get her back and focused on moving on to find a more fulfilling relationship, because despite everything, it was still an amicable "separation", and we still wish the best for each other.

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by marcheem

[Gaeta]

9 minutes ago, marcheem said:

I agree with all of you, it is just that for some reason I am still concerned about she perceived me as a man.

Well, search winthin why you care at all how she perceived you.  She is not someone of importance in your life, you should not care of her opinion. I went on 75 dates  with difderent men before meeting my boyfriend, imagine if l cared about how these men perceived me. 

She perceived you like any other commitmentphobic women would have perceived you, you stood no chance no matter what.

[BaileyB]

52 minutes ago, marcheem said:

Sometimes I blame myself for bringing it up

I wouldn’t feel too badly, as you said it would have happened anyway at some point. And how long would she have strung you along before you knew her intention? If this is how she feels, it’s best that she tell you now. 

You sound like a very nice man, so all I will say is if you are looking for a romantic relationship with a woman, don’t waste too much time and energy in a relationship with a woman who does not want the same thing. She will take advantage of your kindness if you allow her to do so -

If you want a romantic relationship, someone who is excited to date and be in a relationship with you, you will need to find the courage and have the conviction to go out and find it… lots of women out there who are looking to date a nice guy. Don’t waste your time on someone who isn’t interested. 

Good luck! 

Edited November 5, 2023 by BaileyB

[glows]

You probably knew right away this would be an uphill battle but tried not to judge her for her past. In the end it didn’t work out and since you work together you were cautious. I think that’s a smart choice. I’d steer clear of dating colleagues. Just skip the hassle and choose to date outside of work.

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, marcheem said:

Should I have continued to go out with her in this situation?

Unfortunately it doesn't seem like this was an option. Please reevaluate the situation. This one troubled woman was crystal clear about not being ready willing or able to date. Let it go. It really wasn't in your control no matter how well the dates went. 

Why not refocus on talking to and meeting other women? Hopefully you have a good profile and pics on quality dating apps. However if it's 2 dates over a 6 month period, don't expect things to work out. 

[MsJayne]

Assuming all romance will lead to disaster because of her parent's toxic marriage is a small-minded outlook, and posting stuff on social media as a dig at you is childish, (and jerk-ish). Acting like potential partners must 'prove themselves' is also toxic behaviour, very tiresome, and then there's the guilt-tripping which is the hallmark of someone who's going to drain the Happy right out of you. Just be grateful she showed her hand before you got too involved. 

[Bassthumper]

Brotha..you started to get to serious with her and she is looking for away out.

[marcheem1]

Thank you all for the responses again. Fast forward to almost a month later, I have started seeing another girl, who genuinely makes me smile and reciprocates the same feelings.

However, the girl I have been talking about previously on this thread, found out. It was probably a friend of her who asked me if I was interested in meeting her cousin but told her that I was already happily seeing someone.

Here is how the conversation went when we met at a work conference after two months of not seeing each other:

"Long time no see! How are things going? I can see that smile in your face, have you been seeing someone?"

"Hey yes, things are going well! Hope you are doing okay. Well, it was great seeing you, see you around!"

"Well, I am happy for you, but wait. I need to tell you that I really should have communicated things better, because I have felt so safe whenever I have been with you. My mom and friends keep talking about you, and I really should have communicated things better. I really do want a relationship after working on myself, but I was just so scared to have a conversation with you, and the guys I have been dating are not intentional like you. I just want you to know that you have nothing to feel sorry about, because you really are exceptional, and as your friend, I hope it works out."

"Thanks a lot, I hope you understand that I am very intentional in everything I do, as you can tell. I just respected your boundary when you said that you did not want anything serious and all the rest, but there are no hard feelings."

"Okay, yeah, because I have been seeing a guy lately, but he does not act right. He always walks ahead of me, his actions do not align with his words, he is inconsistent, he always asks me why I act a certain way around him. I think he is gaslighting me, and I already told him that I did not want anything to do with him, but he keeps reaching out to me. We went to a concert last weekend, and he always kept walking ahead of me, and did not introduce me to any of his friends. He did not even open doors for me or offered to pick me up!"

"Sorry to hear that, but as a friend, like you said, I need to ask you: why are you entertaining this with someone who does not seem sure about wanting to be with you? I do not see this guy respecting your boundaries, based on what you are telling me, but it is your decision at this point."

"I just do not know where I stand with him, but I am going to handle this now, I am tired of it. See? This is what I am saying, you are so different and mature, not like the other guys. It was great talking to you like usual."

"Thanks again, I have to go now, have a good one!"

One day later, she texted me, saying "It was really great seeing you again!  " I just replied with a thumbs up.

On social media she also posted: "There are still good men in this world, you just have to be willing to see it when they come to your life."

What is your interpretation? Is she really regretful?

Let me be clear: I am not looking to get her back, simply because things are going well with the girl I am seeing now, because I do not have need to doubt her intentions, and she feels the same way, which makes us happy.

Just let me know your thoughts.

Thank you!

Edited November 26, 2023 by marcheem1

[Wiseman2]

On 11/1/2023 at 7:51 PM, marcheem said:

 “I enjoy spending time with you, but I have commitment issues due to my parents going through a rough divorce when I was young, so I am not looking anything serious right now.

She doesn't seem regretful, she seems to be just as confused and confusing as before. It seems like a variation of the same theme as last time. 

Sort of talking to you like a male-girlfriend about her dating adventures.

Perhaps it's time to be polite but avoid her and focus on your new relationship?  She seems like a timewaster. 

[basil67]

“No one is ever too busy. People make time for those they really want to see. It is just a matter of priorities. Remember that if he wanted to, he would”.  and "There are still good men in this world, you just have to be willing to see it when they come to your life."   

What she's doing is called "vaguebooking".  It's a well known technique of the attention seeker.  And it's working because you're here talking about her and wondering what's going on.  Meanwhile her friends are all reaching out wanting to support and she's lapping it all up   

Block her and move on.  Focus on your future, not your past.  

To help you get over it, here's some classic vaguebook posts https://failblog.cheezburger.com/failbook/tag/vaguebooking

 

 

Edited November 27, 2023 by basil67

[marcheem1]

55 minutes ago, basil67 said:

“No one is ever too busy. People make time for those they really want to see. It is just a matter of priorities. Remember that if he wanted to, he would”.  and "There are still good men in this world, you just have to be willing to see it when they come to your life."   

What she's doing is called "vaguebooking".  It's a well known technique of the attention seeker.  And it's working because you're here talking about her and wondering what's going on.  Meanwhile her friends are all reaching out wanting to support and she's lapping it all up   

Block her and move on.  Focus on your future, not your past.  

To help you get over it, here's some classic vaguebook posts https://failblog.cheezburger.com/failbook/tag/vaguebooking

Thank you for sharing, I have heard the term "vaguebooking" before but never really paid attention to what it truly meant. I guess it is because I never felt the need to fully understand it anyway. It seems a way for people to dump their feelings on social media, so they could feel heard by friends/followers, like you said, without having to address the issue directly. It does seem pretty attention seeking behavior, and maybe a little narcissistic/manipulative too, because it is done with the intent of getting sympathy from others, while it actually does the opposite and make you look cringe/childish in my opinion too.

However, I am not judging anyone, since everyone is facing some kind of struggles in their lives, but I guess it does make sense. It is usually people who feel alone and do not feel safe opening up to others who tend to do this, considering the fact we are just starting the holiday season, which makes people feel that way even more. I really hope she realized that she is the only that can fix it and put an end to that, because most men (both good and bad) would end up desisting to be with someone who just goes to social media for advice after any sort of eventual discussion or situation, instead of talking about it and finding a solution together. Unfortunately, these types of people tend to realize it when it is too late in the majority of cases. Most people want a relationship but do not really know how to be in one, which is why I am truly grateful that I did not settle.

I am not against social media, but there is a huge difference in the use of it between the girl I am dating now, who mostly uses it to keep up with friends/family and post about major life events, instead of using it as basically a dating app, portray a flamboyant traveling lifestyle, and look for sympathy from others.

I do not want to block her since we may still have to meet at other work conferences, but I just put a restriction to any of her related content, so it can stop showing on my feed.

Lastly, there are no hard feelings like I said before, just glad I dodged a bullet, because that was a bomb that was going to tick sooner or later, and it does not seem I could have done anything about it. Focusing on my current relationship, which I do see it being long-term, is definitely what I am doing, but I do believe in empathizing with others too, as long as there was no harm or disrespect, to move on with even more confidence knowing that you acted respectfully, did not lead anyone, and there was no harm done. That is also a good feeling.

Thank you so much again for all the advice.

Edited November 27, 2023 by marcheem1