What is normal communication between dates in early stages of dating?

[Gaeta]

Depends of your definition of relationship. Are you ok with him being on dating sites for the next 3 months, while you feed him dinner and he sleeps in your bed?

When I was dating exclusivity was established betweeen 3-5 dates. It meant we were exclusively dating each others and not sleeping with others. I still took my time to get to know them before introducing them to friends & family, usually at 3-4 months dating. Usually around 2 months we would call each other girlfriend/boyfriend

[BaileyB]

2 hours ago, DatingMom said:

@Gaeta I agree with the relationship part. I guess we haven't established if we are in a relationship yet. I thought that normally happens more around the 3-month mark?

 

I don’t know that there is a particular time frame. It sounds to me like you are there - you are getting more serious about the guy so that seems a good time to have this conversation. 

[BaileyB]

2 hours ago, Gaeta said:

Depends of your definition of relationship. Are you ok with him being on dating sites for the next 3 months, while you feed him dinner and he sleeps in your bed?

That would be an absolute NO for me. 

Sure, continuing to communicate with other in the early stages of a relationship is fine... but, six weeks in and we are having sex - at that point, for me it would be time to start shedding other people to spend more time together if both people want something more than casual sex. 

Edited May 4, 2021 by BaileyB

[DatingMom]

 

3 hours ago, Gaeta said:

Depends of your definition of relationship. Are you ok with him being on dating sites for the next 3 months, while you feed him dinner and he sleeps in your bed?

That is a very good point! Jeez I hadn't even thought of that!! I guess up until now it was ok with me because I honestly wanted to get to know him better to see if I wanted to date more seriously, as I was doing the same with two other guys. Not a situation I wanted to be in. It just happened like basically right after our second date (and the first time we slept together!).  I kind of felt uncomfortable about it, but felt things were too early on to not give the other two some thought at least. So in that sense, I didn't mind things moving slowly, although I was definitely not comfortable with the idea of sleeping with more than one (which was always him). 

As I said, I don't think that he is sleeping with anyone else, but it is not impossible he is still peaking online. I guess honestly thinking about it, it would bother me if he were. Which of course is completely hypocritical since I am still doing that also. Now, the reason that I am doing this is because I don't know if this is progressing into something or not, and I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket. I'd be more than happy to delete my apps if he asked me. 

So, what I'm hearing is that the communications thing is linked to an exclusivity talk, is that correct? I realize that this might seem surprising that a 43 year old woman with two kids has never been in a situation where an exclusivity talk was necessary: how does one go about that? It just seems so... formal. And, pushy? 

[Gaeta]

41 minutes ago, DatingMom said:

So, what I'm hearing is that the communications thing is linked to an exclusivity talk, is that correct? I realize that this might seem surprising that a 43 year old woman with two kids has never been in a situation where an exclusivity talk was necessary: how does one go about that? It just seems so... formal. And, pushy? 

People new to dating are always surprised to hear about 'exclusivity talk' but that's how dating is nowadays. 

There are different ways in addressing this subject.

A) You can take the indirect approach: You state that you are enjoying getting to know him and so much you're only interested in dating him. You then listen to what he has to say. 

B) You can take the direct approach: You say that since you are intimate now you would like to confirm you are only dating each other.

If you feel any resistance on his part, like he's not ready to only date you, then you can say it's ok with you except you will stop being intimate and date others as well. Or you could say you do not wish to continue under these conditions. 

It doesn't have to be formal or pushy. It's your health, your heart. There are tons of new STI out there. When he visits you and kisses you, do you want to wonder where his mouth has been? No. 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Gaeta

[Wiseman2]

11 hours ago, DatingMom said:

, I don't think that he is sleeping with anyone else,   I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket. 

If you want to play the field, now that you are free and single again,go right ahead.

In fact after divorce and adjusting to single life, single parenting etc. It's probably best not to nail yourself down into a relationship.

Things are in flux right now so try everything on, shop around and enjoy.

This isn't 1950. You don't have to be be celibate until you remarry.

Men aren't " using you". You're experimenting with newfound freedom and adjusting to single life.

 

 

Edited May 5, 2021 by Wiseman2

[DatingMom]

@Wiseman2 I wouldn't really considered myself "newly single, or newly divorced". I separated over three years ago, and have been divorced almost 2 years. 

After my separation from my ex-husband, I started dating pretty quickly because my therapist had told me it would be good for me to just go and meet new people, to see what's out there and work on developing a single, dating woman identity again. I met this guy about 8 months later. With him things were easy: we didn't need to have an exclusivity talk or anything like that. It was just very obvious we really liked each other and there were no games or pretending. On date 5 he "accidentally" called me his girlfriend to a waiter at a restaurant, and I laughed, and he asked "is that ok?" and I said yes. And that was that. We were together for a year and half (he was struggling with depression though and at some point I had to walk away for my own well-being). 

@Gaeta Thanks for the advice. I like both options, but option b) seems to align better with my personality. Seems so simple!! I think my problem is that I can get very verbose sometimes, and then over-explain! I like this more simple approach of just stating a fact and seeing what he has to stay in return. 

[Miss Peach]

I will bring up two things I haven't seen anyone mention and that was him saying he was scared to fall in love again. How over his other relationships is he really? Or whatever it is for him trying experimental therapy? There are a lot of men who go hot and when they feel you're hooked pull back. These are usually men who are not emotionally available or over their exes. He could be a guy who just does the push and pull which won't bode well for you long term. Just throwing that possibility out there since I haven't heard it mentioned. I also have run into a few men who hear bad dating advice and think by stopping communication and letting you run in there that they're creating more interest rather than destroying the connection being built.

 

I think 4-8 weeks in is when you need to start figuring out if you're serious so I think if you want to bring up the exclusivity talk it's a good time for it. If a guy doesn't know by then then I would prefer to cut him loose.

[DatingMom]

@Miss Peach yes, those are both valid points, and have I have discussed with him.

1- relationship. He was married for 22 years and has a daughter with his ex wife. Their separation is recent and yet not. His ex wife told him 8 years ago that she is not in love with him anymore, but that she wanted to stay together for their daughter but have separate bedrooms and kind of an open marriage. Then he met someone and was seeing that person for a while. He was open about it with the ex wife since that was their agreement. She was ok with it for a year, but then suddenly decided she wasn't ok with it anymore, and that he needed to break it off and she wanted to be together again. So, he broke it off although he said he was really in love with that woman. They got back into a shared bedroom situation for a few months, then she decided she changed her mind, and that they would do the separate bedrooms again,  but she didn't want the relationship to be open, and also didn't want to be touched by him. He lasted two years that way (he says he agreed to it because of the daughter - he felt like he had to prioritize her), and then started feeling really badly and went to see a therapist who finally made him realize he needed to end the relationship. He seems really relieved about the decision, and says he felt dead for many years. I think he still carries a lot of hurt from that relationship, but not in the sense that he has regrets, or wishes to be back with her. He is definitely over his ex. But the fear of falling in love I think comes from a place of vulnerability: he loved someone for so many years that didn't really love him back, so...

2- Experimental therapy: is unrelated to his past mariage. Or more that the therapy he was doing to figure out his marriage made him realize that he had a lot of unresolved issues from his childhood that were affecting him up to this day. He had a very difficult childhood: violent alcoholic father and bi-polar mother. So, he is doing the psychedelic therapy because those are things so far in his past that it's hard to remember in any other way, but those events still have consequences in his life today.

On another note, there is actually some development.

1- So, we had set up a date for Friday earlier in the week. Last evening I was just checking in on him, and he said he had a rough day. I offered to go over to give him a massage and he said: "I really appreciate it but I'll be fine." I had offered something similar - an unplanned get together mid week - a few weeks back and he was not up for it. So I texted back: "Ok, no problem. I get it that you're not into unplanned meet ups." And added a smiley face. He immediately called me to say that he really wanted to see me and had been thinking about me all week. He just didn't want to impose, and surely I had better things to do than hang out with him. He ended up coming over, and stayed till 2 am (even though we both had work this morning). 

2- This is a bit of a curve ball. I had a long conversation with my best friend last night and one of the topics was this guy. One of the things that she said was: if you're gonna bring up exclusivity, just make sure that you're sure about this, and you're ready to stop talking to every person that you are still talking to.  If you're not sure then wait till he brings it up first. And then she asked me who else I was still talking to online, and made me describe every person that I still had an active dialogue with online. Which was really not many, and mostly not very interesting. Except for this one guy I hadn't even really considered as a possibility because he is not available to meet before the end of May. He's an epidemiologist and since he is partly responsible for the policies currently in place here around Covid (we are in lockdown till end of May), he said he could not break his own policy by meeting women before the lockdown is over. We had been chatting daily since a few weeks, and had a few phone calls, but I didn't really think this would actually drag out for that long. Back in mid-April when we started chatting, end of May seemed really really far away. So anyway, I wasn't really considering him seriously, but then my friend was asking questions, and she asked for his full name and looked him up. And, well, very long story, but one of our common very close friend is also an epidemiologist who works for WHO in Africa now, and this guy had worked for WHO also, so my friend said we should ask our friend if he knows him, and turns out he does, quite well actually!! So, our other friend immediately joined our conversation and he was raving about this guy! He thinks he would be a perfect fit for me! 

Now I'm confused. I really like this guy I'm seeing. And I really hate when people do this thing where they have this constant fear-of-missing-out and are therefore never willing to give someone a chance. I don't want to be that person. 

 

[BaileyB]

4 hours ago, DatingMom said:

One of the things that she said was: if you're gonna bring up exclusivity, just make sure that you're sure about this, and you're ready to stop talking to every person that you are still talking to.  If you're not sure then wait till he brings it up first.

Absolutely correct. You can’t tell a man that you want exclusivity and then continue dating other people.

Too many men to date is a good problem to have, but still a problem none-the-less. Let us know how it goes - we are in lockdown too and I have literally nothing else to do! I’ll be sitting on the edge of my seat, waiting for the next exciting update! 

[DatingMom]

@BaileyB Haha! Ok. Not much update today except that:

1- Was texting with the epidemiologist yesterday, and he suddenly asked me: "I know you're not strict like me about this lockdown - and I'm ok with that - but can I ask if you've been seeing anyone in the past weeks. Because I'll be honest: I really like you, and am not really chatting with anyone else right now. I like to focus on one person at a time, and in that sense I hope we make it to the end of lockdown without anyone else snapping you up first." I didn't know what to say, so I said: "I have gone on a few dates in the past month, and have seen one person several times." I kind of felt a bit like I was lying. Was that a dishonest answer? Anyway, he then suggested that maybe we should do a FaceTime date sometime next week. 

2- The engineer I'm supposed to see tonight. But now he does this thing again that drives me absolutely crazy of not answering my texts! Sometimes he answers right away, and others I don't hear from him for 24 hours+. It's maddening! I texted him last night asking what time he wanted to meet and what he wanted to do. Then suggested a few things. No answer. So I texted this morning to let him know: "by the way, it's supposed to rain, so one of my suggestions can't happen. What do you want to do? And a time would be great." It's been 2 hours, and still no answer. It's just really frustrating. And I don't know if I'm overreacting, but I find it a little rude. Am I crazy? I mean, past 3 dates, he came over to my place, I made dinner, and we hung out. So, it's easy for him to just show up, but I need to get groceries, plan a meal, know when to start cooking depending on when he arrives. I hate being that woman that men see as the "nagging one". I'm really trying to be chill about this. But am I wrong in feeling this is not great behaviour on his part?

[Gaeta]

1 - I like his openness, willingness to show vulnerability and communication seems to come easy for him. If it doesn't work with you send him my way  Yes do a Facetime together. You did not lie. You are not exclusive with anyone. 

2 - I have never had a positive experience with engineers. I don't want to generalize but my experience with 2 of them is they only see things 'their way', they're always right, no room for negociation. You will wonder at times if you are part of this relationship at all. 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, DatingMom said:

I mean, past 3 dates, he came over to my place, I made dinner, and we hung out. So, it's easy for him to just show up, but I need to get groceries, plan a meal, know when to start cooking depending on when he arrives. 

Ok, don't ask him over or cook dinner or buy groceries. Why make all these plans for someone who doesn't have the interest/courtesy to reply? Put him on the back burner and if he replies, simply suggest a simple outing.

 Try not to get in a rut or routine especially playing mom/house. Let him date you.

[Calmandfocused]

Commitment phobe alert! 
 

He’s more or less told you that he fears falling in love again. He’s therefore keeping his distance from you to ensure this doesn’t happen. 
 

Seems now he’s got you, he’s hell bent on keeping you at arms length and so far he’s succeeding. 
 

This is in its very early stages so it’s hard to predict whether he will snap out of it. 
 

At the moment I think he’s more fearful of you than into you in which case you’d be wise to guard your heart and keep your options open for now IMO
 

 

[DatingMom]

Thanks for the replies! 

@Gaeta ok. noted you like this guy. I kind of like him too. He's fun, and very communicative. But he is quite a bit older than me though. I'm 43 and he's 50. He's a good looking man judging from the photos (both those he posted on his profile and the ones I found looking him up.. of which there are many). But he definitely looks his age, while I, not to boast or anything, but I've been told several times that I look much younger than my age. I frequently get asked for ID when buying alcohol for example. People often don't believe me when I tell them my age. In that sense, dating someone like him... it might look like he's 15-20 years older than me. That makes me sound really superficial! It's definitely not my #1 priority when dating someone, but it is something that has been on my mind I guess. 

Engineer: I hear you about the "their way" mentality. I dated an engineer for a year and half after my divorce, and dated another engineer for two months in the fall as well. They were both exactly like you describe. It was maddening! This guy is not like that at all though. He's pretty chill in that sense.

@Wiseman2 That is actually good advice. I do feel like I've been making most of the effort in this relationship so far. I do have more time as I work at lot less hours than him, and also my schedule is more flexible. But you're right: we are getting into a routine, and the routine we are getting into is very comfortable for him. I actually don't know how things would progress if I left things entirely up to him for a few weeks. I'm assuming he would want to see me? He would step up? I guess in some ways I'm afraid to let go, and then see that he's not stepping up. On the other hand, if he's not stepping up, I probably don't want to pursue things seriously with him. Ah, vicious circle dilemma! 

[DatingMom]

@Calmandfocused Oh! Interesting point of view. I hadn't really thought of that. You make a good point. He has told me about his past hurt in relationships at great length. So, if this is the case, is there anything I can do to reassure him? Or is this something he just needs to deal with himself? 

I mean, he doesn't have much to fear with me. I'm extremely monogamous. And I'm someone that has no fear of commitment. I'm willing to take that jump even if I still have certain doubts. I prefer to give things a real try, and risk that it's not gonna work out, then to be in this constant "I'm keeping my options open" mode. I haven't exactly told him that, but nothing I've said has given him indication of the contrary... I think. 

[Calmandfocused]

5 minutes ago, DatingMom said:

@Calmandfocused Oh! Interesting point of view. I hadn't really thought of that. You make a good point. He has told me about his past hurt in relationships at great length. So, if this is the case, is there anything I can do to reassure him? Or is this something he just needs to deal with himself? 

I mean, he doesn't have much to fear with me. I'm extremely monogamous. And I'm someone that has no fear of commitment. I'm willing to take that jump even if I still have certain doubts. I prefer to give things a real try, and risk that it's not gonna work out, then to be in this constant "I'm keeping my options open" mode. I haven't exactly told him that, but nothing I've said has given him indication of the contrary... I think. 

Unfortunately not.

If I am indeed correct then he needs to work through that fear barrier himself. Which also means recovering from the traumatic relationship breakdown with his wife. 
 

Reassurance won’t help. You can’t take that fear away from him for him. And frankly it’s not your job to do so. 
 

[ShyViolet]

1 hour ago, DatingMom said:

2- The engineer I'm supposed to see tonight. But now he does this thing again that drives me absolutely crazy of not answering my texts! Sometimes he answers right away, and others I don't hear from him for 24 hours+. It's maddening! I texted him last night asking what time he wanted to meet and what he wanted to do. Then suggested a few things. No answer. So I texted this morning to let him know: "by the way, it's supposed to rain, so one of my suggestions can't happen. What do you want to do? And a time would be great." It's been 2 hours, and still no answer. It's just really frustrating. And I don't know if I'm overreacting, but I find it a little rude. Am I crazy? I mean, past 3 dates, he came over to my place, I made dinner, and we hung out. So, it's easy for him to just show up, but I need to get groceries, plan a meal, know when to start cooking depending on when he arrives.

Do not put in all this effort cooking for a man who can't even be bothered to respond to your texts.  If he's interested in you then let HIM put in the effort and plan dates, take you out. If he doesn't do that, then you'll have your answer.

[Gaeta]

8 minutes ago, ShyViolet said:

Do not put in all this effort cooking for a man who can't even be bothered to respond to your texts.  If he's interested in you then let HIM put in the effort and plan dates, take you out. If he doesn't do that, then you'll have your answer.

Or next time he calls wanting to visit OP she could tell him to pick up a pizza & chicken wings & onion rings & and beer on his way. 

[Alpacalia]

On 5/3/2021 at 5:57 PM, DatingMom said:

All that being said, I think at this point in the process of getting to know this guy, I think for me going forward (in a way that would not make me constantly feel frustrated), I would need him, within the next few weeks, to either communicate more between dates if he's only available to meet once a week, OR to start seeing each other twice a week. Is that a reasonable thing to ask for? I'm thinking perhaps better to bring it up in person next time I see him?

I'm not certain.

Having these types of requests too early in the process is a fine line to walk and may backfire.

Sometimes, the right answer will be revealed to you. All you have to do is wait and observe. 

Edited May 7, 2021 by Alpaca

[DatingMom]

1 hour ago, Gaeta said:

Or next time he calls wanting to visit OP she could tell him to pick up a pizza & chicken wings & onion rings & and beer on his way. 

Did I mention he's vegetarian and doesn't drink? So, cooking for him has been quite a pain in the ass i.e. me having to look up recipes. He keeps saying he's such a good cook, but I haven't witnessed that first hand yet.

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, DatingMom said:

@Wiseman2 That is actually good advice. I do feel like I've been making most of the effort in this relationship so far. But you're right: we are getting into a routine, and the routine we are getting into is very comfortable for him. He would step up?

Exactly. Lay back and see what he does and if he steps up. 

[Gaeta]

31 minutes ago, DatingMom said:

Did I mention he's vegetarian 

So he just dump that on you to deal with it? Does he arrive at your place for dinner empty handed?

[introverted1]

3 hours ago, DatingMom said:

2- The engineer I'm supposed to see tonight. But now he does this thing again that drives me absolutely crazy of not answering my texts! Sometimes he answers right away, and others I don't hear from him for 24 hours+. It's maddening! I texted him last night asking what time he wanted to meet and what he wanted to do. Then suggested a few things. No answer. So I texted this morning to let him know: "by the way, it's supposed to rain, so one of my suggestions can't happen. What do you want to do? And a time would be great." It's been 2 hours, and still no answer. It's just really frustrating. And I don't know if I'm overreacting, but I find it a little rude. Am I crazy? I mean, past 3 dates, he came over to my place, I made dinner, and we hung out. So, it's easy for him to just show up, but I need to get groceries, plan a meal, know when to start cooking depending on when he arrives. I hate being that woman that men see as the "nagging one". I'm really trying to be chill about this. But am I wrong in feeling this is not great behaviour on his part?

This would annoy the crap out of me. I have no issue cooking for  man but if all our dates consist of him showing up while I cook (and subsequently clean up), that would be a 'no' for me. And combined with sluggish responses to my texts, it would be a 'hell, no.'

 

52 minutes ago, DatingMom said:

He keeps saying he's such a good cook, but I haven't witnessed that first hand yet.

So let him cook or bring dinner.  You can suggest this by telling him you're eager to try some of the home cooking he's been telling you about. 

2 hours ago, DatingMom said:

I kind of like him too. He's fun, and very communicative. But he is quite a bit older than me though. I'm 43 and he's 50. He's a good looking man judging from the photos (both those he posted on his profile and the ones I found looking him up.. of which there are many). But he definitely looks his age, while I, not to boast or anything, but I've been told several times that I look much younger than my age. I frequently get asked for ID when buying alcohol for example. People often don't believe me when I tell them my age. In that sense, dating someone like him... it might look like he's 15-20 years older than me. That makes me sound really superficial! It's definitely not my #1 priority when dating someone, but it is something that has been on my mind I guess.

Meh..  I wouldn't put too much stock into this. Everyone knows that the 2 best ways to flatter a woman are to ask if she's lost weight or to imply her age is younger than she is.  Not saying you don't look good for your age, but 7 years is not a huge gap and as long as you are compatible in terms of life stage, activity levels, etc., is this really a deal-breaker?  If it is, best to tell him up front; he can't get any younger!

 

 

[DatingMom]

1 hour ago, Gaeta said:

So he just dump that on you to deal with it? Does he arrive at your place for dinner empty handed?

He does! He usually brings wine although he doesn't drink, and dessert.