What is normal communication between dates in early stages of dating?

[elaine567]

4 minutes ago, DatingMom said:

d it's only when we had a deeper connection that he was able to have an orgasm while having sex with me.

But that could be because he is already satisfied elsewhere surely?

[Gaeta]

10 minutes ago, DatingMom said:

You're right. I completely agree with you. Let me rephrase this: I'm 100% sure that he is not sleeping with anyone else, and that he will not have multiple sexual partners. I say this because I don't think he would physically be able to. It was difficult for him to get physically comfortable with me, and it's only when we had a deeper connection that he was able to have an orgasm while having sex with me. So in this sense I doubt that he'd be able to sleep with more than one person at a time, and even less have one-night stands. But you are right that there might be some work colleague that he has an eye on and that he's not telling me about. I doubt it, but it's not impossible. 

Thank you for keeping an open mind. 

Also, when I had less experience with dating, men, and life,  I had a short relationship with a man still having issues with their divorce and whatsnot. He had lost his confidence in the bedroom, I had to be patient with his ED, etc. What happened is I ended up being the loving patient woman that gave him back his self-confidence and he flew away as soon as his mojo was back. 

Edited May 17, 2021 by Gaeta
grammar

[DatingMom]

15 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

I was just going to say the same. 

For a little perspective, two weeks ago you posted - you said that you had known the man for six weeks and you have been on weekly dates. Again, kindly, I think you are in deep here with a man that you hardly know. At this early stage of a relationship - when you see red flags, you get out! 

Haha! I'm terrible with dates and time to be honest. I went to look back, and we started chatting online on February 15th, and we met for the first time on March 5th. Not that this makes any difference with anything else, but you are right that I have not given a very accurate timeline here! 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, DatingMom said:

He's had a very difficult childhood (alcoholic violent father, bi-polar mother), and then was in a relationship for 20 years with a woman that also had mental issues (he realizes now that he was with her because he didn't know any better, that was what was familiar). Anyway, the last two years of his marriage, he started having severe pain, and doctors couldn't figure out what was wrong. Finally, one doctor suggested it might be psychosomatic because of his bad relationship with his ex as well as past trauma that he never dealt with. 

Do you really want someone this neurotic and who blames everyone and everything else?

Keep in mind, with hypochondriacal, neurotic, blame-the-world people like this, you're next on his list of things to blame for his "condition and trauma".

Not to mention, his family history/predispositions? Sorry, he seems very high maintenance. Someone who refuses to take responsibility for himself, including the damage he's doing to you with his slap-in-the-face offer of 'let's have sex but can't have a relationship'.

You may need to examine if you are bored, searching for something or simply can't develop other dates/relationships while getting sucked into this guy's neurotic quicksand.

Continuing with someone like this is a great way to damage yourself, while depriving yourself of a decent man/relationship.

[DatingMom]

14 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

Thank you for keeping an open mind. 

Also, when I had less experience with dating, men, and life,  I had a short relationship with a man still having issues with their divorce and whatsnot. He had lost his confidence in the bedroom, I had to be patient with his ED, etc. What happened is I ended up being the loving patient woman that gave him back his self-confidence and he flew away as soon as his mojo was back. 

Oh wow! I could totally see this happening here to be honest. Thanks for sharing that story with me. I will keep that in mind!

[DatingMom]

24 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Do you really want someone this neurotic and who blames everyone and everything else?

Keep in mind, with hypochondriacal, neurotic, blame-the-world people like this, you're next on his list of things to blame for his "condition and trauma".

Not to mention, his family history/predispositions? Sorry, he seems very high maintenance. Someone who refuses to take responsibility for himself, including the damage he's doing to you with his slap-in-the-face offer of 'let's have sex but can't have a relationship'.

You may need to examine if you are bored, searching for something or simply can't develop other dates/relationships while getting sucked into this guy's neurotic quicksand.

Continuing with someone like this is a great way to damage yourself, while depriving yourself of a decent man/relationship.

I don't get the sense that he's a hypochondriac or blaming others for his problems. But, I do agree with I think what your underlying argument is that this person has issues, and although he's working through them right now, those issues will likely be lifelong issues, and they will probably not go away. More likely, being in a long-term relationship with someone like that will involve him having to periodically taking time "for himself". 

To be honest, I am not really contemplating/hoping for a longterm relationship with this guy at this moment/anymore. If a few months down the road, things change drastically with him, I'll cross that bridge when we get there. But I'm not interested right now, given circumstances, in considering pinning my romantic hopes on him. I'm not a masochist and don't need to force myself into a heartbreak situation!! haha.

I'm basically just wondering right now whether to keep him around for the physical satisfaction (and some friendship too of course) while continuing my search for something more satisfying. I mean, it is Covid and we are in lockdown for another month.

[BaileyB]

I don’t bring up the dates because they are particularly important. Whether you’ve known him two months, or three months, doesn’t really matter. My point being - it’s three months, not three years. When you see red flags and you can count on one hand the number of months you’ve been dating a man - your best course of action is usually to get out before you get more involved. You are already fairly committed to this man - considering that when you first posted two weeks ago you were not even sure if you wanted to stop dating others, you weren’t actually even sure if you wanted to keep him around... You’ve become quite invested in a relatively short period of time. Just, be careful. 

Edited May 17, 2021 by BaileyB

[Gaeta]

You start counting when you meet. 

We know online is a big catalogue and women have a wide variety of men to chose from.

I am sure when you created your profile you had a certain type of man in mind. Back then if we had asked you what that type was l'm pretty sure you wouldn't have answered: broken from divorce, childhood issues, bedroom insecurity, emotionnally unavailable, right? So why now it's your pick? 

You could be back online tonight and next week we're talking about how fun is your brand new guy. 

[Wiseman2]

47 minutes ago, DatingMom said:

I'm not a masochist and don't need to force myself into a heartbreak situation!! haha.

Excellent. Absolutely keep your options open.

This guy's story would be better to watch from afar on something like Netflix. Lots of weirdness, twists, turns, zany stuff, quirkiness, etc., but no one needs a front row seat to all that.

Edited May 17, 2021 by Wiseman2

[DatingMom]

I completely agree with everyone here. I kind of got sucked in with this guy over the past few weeks because we suddenly started spending an insane time together, and it was very intense. But I am seeing all the red flags. Right now I feel I need to disconnect a bit from him by not seeing him or communicating for a while. I already told him that was what was happening. And I went back online, and am chatting with 4 people, and am meeting one person this week. I'm also seeing some friends later in the week. 

I'm also aware that the chances of this going anywhere serious are very close to zero at the moment, not even so much because he might not change his mind in a few months, but more likely because I will have moved on before then.

I can easily let myself go with people, but being an extremely practical and down to earth person, my stupidity attacks are generally short lived! haha 

All that being said, I also like to keep my mind open to surprises and possibilities. Perhaps this is contradictory! 

[poppyfields]

@DatingMom when you say things like "I don't get the sense (fill in the blank)" OR "he's not the type to (fill in the blank)," you are projecting. 

As others have said, you are seeing what you want to see, instead of what's actually there.  

I can tell you from experience when a man begins bringing another (or other) women into your dating experience, even as covertly as he did, mentioning "jealousy" etc, he's got something going on.  Another agenda that he wants you to know about without him telling you directly.

To add, what is your explanation for him encouraging you to keep options open and date other men?

Because HE wants the option to date other women.

Which would be FINE if you weren't so attached and seeking more, which is obvious no matter how you spin this.

You are deeply entrenched in his world and his psyche, it's all very compelling and romantic, but the bottom line is no matter how well you think you know him, or the "sense" you have about him, at 8-9 weeks in, you don't know him at all.

 

Edited May 17, 2021 by poppyfields

[DatingMom]

8 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

@DatingMom when you say things like "I don't get the sense (fill in the blank)" OR "he's not the type to (fill in the blank)," you are projecting. 

As others have said, you are seeing what you want to see, instead of what's actually there.  

I can tell you from experience when a man begins bringing another (or other) women into your dating experience, even as covertly as he did, mentioning "jealousy" etc, he's got something going on.  Another agenda that he wants you to know about without him telling you directly.

To add, what is your explanation for him encouraging you to keep options open and date other men?

Because HE wants the option to date other women.

Which would be FINE if you weren't so attached and seeking more, which is obvious no matter how you spin this.

You are deeply entrenched in his world and his psyche, it's all very compelling and romantic, but the bottom line is no matter how well you think you know him, or the "sense" you have about him, at 8-9 weeks in, you don't know him at all.

 

I agree. He actually told me out right that he wants to keep his options open, so no surprise there! He was honest about that. I doubt he's got something going on right now, but I agree that he's not ready to commit because he wants to see who else is out there. He pretty much said that, so again, no surprise, and I did hear him when he said that, trust me! 

To be honest, I don't think I'm quite that attached actually. (I was still considering my options just a few weeks back!) We spent the past couple weeks spending a lot of time together which gave a sense of intimacy and closeness (and was really great, I won't lie). But I have only known him a short period, you are right,, and that period hasn't been long enough for me to develop deep feelings for him. I'm not in any way devastated about this situation, more likely disappointed. 

[Miss Spider]

4 hours ago, DatingMom said:

This is a therapy thing, yes. He is doing psychedelic therapy sessions in the presence of a certified psychotherapist. It's a new kind of therapy to deal with childhood trauma that might be too far away for memory to access properly. I guess it goes in the category of hypnosis to quit smoking for example. It's just another way to access your psyche and past memories. The things that come up during those psychedelic sessions he then processes in real therapy with another therapist. It's not a tripping thing. He's actually quite the opposite of an addict: he doesn't do any drugs outside of these types of sessions, doesn't even drink alcohol, doesn't smoke. 

Anyway, you guys might disagree with this kind of therapy, but it is something that entirely legal and proven to work. 

A psychotherapist can tell him how many grams of shrooms to take and  be his  trip sitter, but if he’s using psychedelics to “access his psyche”, he is tripping. And there’s not much a psychotherapist(psychonaut) can do to be sure what his trip will do to him, besides guide him/talk/comfort him through it. Psychedelics are being more and more accepted in therapy, but this is still definitely considered ‘fringe’ therapy and not an excessive amount of study on it beyond what the individual therapists has done. 
 

 

 

I think he suggested it to you, or maybe  his therapist suggested he suggest to you, because he may have told them he needs help connecting to you. Psilocybin is thought to unlock and activate parts of the brain that are responsible for “falling in love” (sometimes causing them to cross paths with other parts that normally aren’t related for weird effect) and raise hormones associated with it like oxytocin which is kinda thought to be why hippies who do shrooms regularly want to hug everything/body, including trees 

 

But if you aren’t feeling close to a particular person, it can help you feel closer. You empathize more with the person and can connect with what feels like a deeper level ( they use MDMA for that too, but that comes with more serious side effects and addictive properties) Sometimes with lasting results. I mean... I think it’s a weird suggestion, but he’s probably trying 

 

Just FYI. I don’t think many people who do mushrooms are addicted lol. First of all, psilocybin( active compound on shrooms) is not thought to be addictive. Secondly, tolerance is built up incredibly quickly( you can’t ‘trip’ as effectively for weeks after one use).Thirdly, it’s an exhausting, heavy, often scary experience. It can be fun, but the overall experience often isn’t. So people usually don’t abuse shrooms... Actually, I think I saw a study that they are the least addictive “drug” and the chances a person does it again are the lowest. 
 

I speak from experience because I had one bad trip alone last year and I’d never do it again. 

 

 

————

 

I agree with everyone else though that this is a huge waste of time. He isn’t feeling it that much and he probably hates that he isn’t. This just isn’t an a match. That’s OK. But if you are looking for something long term/marriage or whatever, I think you’re probably wasting your time

 

 

Edited May 17, 2021 by Cookiesandough

[DatingMom]

I just wanted to give an update here since everyone has been so so generous with advice. I realize that you all have other things to do - lives to live! - instead of giving a stranger advice. So I just want to say "thank you" to everyone that has taken the time to reply to my post before.

So update here is that despite everyone's recommendations, I continued seeing this guy for the past 3 weeks. I heard you all when you advised me against it, but there was something there with him that I had never experienced before, and I had to explore it further. We saw each other a lot over the past few weeks, and talked on the phone daily. We connected at a level that in my 43 years of life I had never connected with anyone before... and I fell for him. I won't lie. 

And then this last week something unrelated happened: I had a huge fight with my ex. And that kind of made me realize that I wanted/needed someone in my life that was a "partner" that I could rely on to discuss my problems with. Given the ambiguity of our relationship I didn't feel comfortable doing that. I finally mentioned it to him a week later, and he was a bit hurt I didn't feel comfortable discussing this with him before. I thought about it a lot, and finally told him that I hadn't brought it up with him given the ambigious circumstances of our relationship, and that the situation made me realize that I needed more, that I needed him to be able to commit. He said he needed a few days to think about it, and we finally met tonight to discuss it. I had given it some thought on my end as well, and felt that I was ready to let this go if he was unable to meet my needs. I realize now that I wasn't ready to let go before. 

We had a very long discussion involving a lot of crying and hugging, but one in which we both agreed. I expressed my needs and made it clear that I was not willing to compromise. He said that he loved me, and that he had never before in his life felt this kind of connection with anyone, but that he wasn't ready for what I asked, and that he felt heartbroken about it. He said that he really wanted to be able to say yes, but that he couldn't. Not because he wanted to date other women, he said that he knows that he will never meet anyone like me again and that what we have is special. But that right now he doesn't feel that he's in a place to be the partner that he wishes to be for me. That his separation/past relationship has done a lot of damage and he doesn't feel healthy, that he needs time to heal and focus on himself, that he is taking a leave of absence from work for the summer, and taking time away from his daughter for a few months to focus on himself and his healing. He asked me if we could revisit this conversation in the fall. I told him that we could, but that I didn't want any contact with him until then, and that I couldn't promise that I wouldn't have moved on by the fall, that I wouldn't be waiting for him. He cried when I told him that, but he said that he understood. 

I feel at peace with this although of course I'm heartbroken. But I don't regret having given this some more time because he touched my heart in a special way, and it's not every day that you get to feel something special. So at the worst, it'll be a nice memory. And  I feel that if it's meant to be it'll happen, but in the meantime I'm not going to wait for him. 

Anyway, just felt like you all deserved this update.

 

[Wiseman2]

5 hours ago, DatingMom said:

 I feel at peace with this . 

Excellent. You made the right call even if it was difficult.

It seems like the rosy glasses came off when reality hit.

You are correct that he didn't offer much. He was just doing srooms and bellying up to your table.

You dodged a bullet.

What a long strange trip it's been, right?🍄

[Gaeta]

awwww @DatingMom so sorry for your broken heart. You rode it to the end and you're in peace with your decision. It was the best decision. Take time to lick your wounds. I know it feels like he's the one that got away and you'll never live another love like this but time has a way to shed light on all that. 

[DatingMom]

@Gaeta and @Wiseman2 Thanks for your words. I woke up this morning feeling like I got hit by a truck yesterday. I didn't realize that you could fall for someone so hard so fast. Part of me is entertaining hope that he'll sort his s*** out over the summer and that we'll have a second chance in the fall. The other part is trying to shut down that hope because I know it won't help things in the present.

God I wish we didn't need men!

[hippychick3]

2 hours ago, DatingMom said:

@Gaeta and @Wiseman2 Thanks for your words. I woke up this morning feeling like I got hit by a truck yesterday. I didn't realize that you could fall for someone so hard so fast. Part of me is entertaining hope that he'll sort his s*** out over the summer and that we'll have a second chance in the fall. The other part is trying to shut down that hope because I know it won't help things in the present.

God I wish we didn't need men!

You don’t need a man. You just allowed yourself to get attached to the wrong person. This is why when someone says they don’t want to commit to you, you walk away immediately. You waited a bit too long to do this, but good for you for finally making that decision to leave. Now you’ll know how to guard your heart better in the future. Huge hugs 🤗