This guy is really nice but is he just slow?

[Versacehottie]

1 hour ago, Shortskirtslonglashes said:

I get what you’re saying Versace, but to me there’s a big difference between “sure, any relationship might not work out” and “i’m going to ignore all the red flags waving” such as: 

—“Since we started chatting it has been non stop”

—“... he hasn’t made any move. He hasn’t asked for my number to get out of the dating App, didn’t mention for us to meet, ... didn’t ask to talk on the phone, nothing”

—“ ... we were talking about a coffee shop we both know and like, and I told him how much I want to go there when lockdown is over and it opens again, and he said he feels the same, and nothing else! “

—“He asked me NOTHING about my previous relationships. How long I have been single, what am I looking for, etc,etc. Nothing. I just realised I also do not know anything about him in that regard. If he is single, how long, etc. “

— “So instead of asking me for my number to send the photo, he just uploaded the photo into his dating profile photos for me to see, and then deleted it after I see it...”

—“yes he might be texting me all day because he is bored and wants someone to talk to and nothing else.”

—“He has a job but is not working at the moment.”

—“If we lived near each other then yes we could go on a walk together and see how we feel, and then after the lockdown go on a proper date. We cannot do that now because we live like a 20 min car drive. “

——————————

And sure, ideally you don’t get serious until you are, but I don’t get the feeling that OP is the type of person that is just taking it casually, just chatting when bored and not developing any feelings for a person she’s never met. Hopefully I’m wrong about it though. 

 

She  said:

“So I am still talking to other guys too. It’s very tempting to stop talking to other guys and just focus on him ...

Although at the moment the way other guys are just makes me want to talk to him more.”

Of another textlationship she was in: 

“ ... the first lockdown I also met a guy online and we texted all day everyday. As soon as lockdown was over and he went back to work he was gone. Disappeared. Ghosted. So that showed my intuition was right.

... I don’t feel that way with this guy now”

 

Yeah, except  this thread has several contradictions to that. Maybe she doesn’t notice how much she’s ignored her intuition and made excuses for this guy 

Even in this short post  she makes an excuse for him right after she points out exactly what seems off to her: 

“So we cannot meet now and so I cannot judge him based on not asking me for a date. But...nothing stops him from saying he would like to meet once lockdown is over, something he didn’t mention so far. And no talking on the phone either.”

 

When he did that pic upload thing, it sent her alarm bells off, and she said : 

 

“Let’s just say that was a big turn off for me and I’ll be talking to other guys instead.”

 

 

Yeah, but look where we are. And really, everything else she’s said in the thread is “yes, this is all very weird to me...but....” 

hmmmm, well I agree with some, definitely not all.  I just don't believe in taking someone who has misfiring alarm bells, which they ring at every turn, as purely factual and accurate representation of what is going on.  It's her interpretation based on the fact that she has previous baggage, is hyper-sensitive, overly worried, guarded and cautious.  Also fails to take into account that how she wants (or anyone posting) wants this guy read her mind and present himself is limited view and there are many ways to be without meaning the guy is a bad seed or a narcissist whatever she called the last one.  Lol, it's a walk in the park and a first date.  It's a minor investment, which is how she should have been treating it all along.  Her mistake is investing like it's going to pay off big and must be the love of her life.  We've been taken on the ride of her ruminating & over investing mind, is how I see it. Best to bring her down off that so she can be in reality.

bolded I agree with you.  I do think that OP is calibrated a certain way and even if she might calm down a little, maybe they just won't be suited for each other because of what she needs for how she is calibrated.  It doesn't mean she is doing herself justice to be calibrated like that and that her mind is "right".  Too much to go into (because lol i can't even believe i'm spending this much time dissecting her dilemma), but a person who is calibrated to ruminate and worry and in "protect" herself mode will see things happening as if her reality, is reality. I'm taking a lot of what she's said with that grain of salt.  I don't know if she will be able to relax even if she ends up dating this guy which may sabotage things.  So it doesn't mean her "intuition" is right in describing the situation. It can mean though, that if she can't get a hold of this so-called intuition, most people won't be the right guy for her and her faux intuition will "always" be right (self-sabotage after self-sabotage).  Ugh, can't explain it well but it's a psychology thing.

[Miss Spider]

9 minutes ago, Versacehottie said:

just don't believe in taking someone who has misfiring alarm bells, which they ring at every turn, as purely factual and accurate representation of what is going on.  

I agree, and she certainly has a bias as evidenced in the thread, but even based on what she told us, cutting the excess out and just looking at his actions ‘objectively’, it isn’t the behavior of a well-adjusted, interested guy. Just not. 

Edited March 2, 2021 by Shortskirtslonglashes

[lurker74]

19 hours ago, Gaeta said:

Who wants to date a man that's afraid of rejection? You are making way too many excuses for this guy. 

We (guys) are all afraid of rejection. I imagine all women are, too. The thing is - you have to move forward anyway, even with the fears. @Emilyinroses, I don't think you're making this too big of a deal at all. With online dating, it is far better to move from messaging to phones to meeting (Covid notwithstanding) too early than too late. Often times, the weakest potential mates delay is so much that their fear is no longer rationale...it's limiting. And based on your messages, I am guessing that you are attracted to a man that makes your feel slightly uncomfortable, at least at times. Most women are...I don't buy the "nice guys finish last" theme, but there is some truth to the idea that a large swath of women are attracted to a level of confidence that is mildly intimidating, at least at first. It's most often biological, with female primates seeking mates that exude the ability to obtain resources and protect. 

There's nothing wrong with that feeling as long as you understand it and don't let it rule you. And it means that as nice as he is, he so far has not exhibited any of that behavior. Him being worried that you will run away now is just another signal that he's not confident, in the long run, to keep you. 

But the others are also right. It is a signal but it is ONLY a signal. He could adapt or be different in real life. So it's perfectly appropriate for you to note that he's passive and you don't love that and it's also perfectly appropriate for you to be lightly concerned that it might not work out because of his passivity. The only way to find out is to try it out. 

[Alvi]

2 hours ago, Emilyinroses said:

He told me the reason he didn't make a move yet was because he feels a connection with me but wasn't sure if I was feeling it too or was just talking to him to pass the time!

Wait...What? He is talking about a connection and expects you to feel it too? He expects you to feel attached to him before meeting him in person? Way too soon. You haven't even met and he is throwing that your way already. Sorry, a Red Flag in my opinion. Sort of like trying to guilt trip or to manipulate you into feeling whatever the heck he is feeling. And "punishing" you by not taking things further for presumably you not behaving the way he wants you to behave and feeling whatever he wants you to feel. Why does he care about what a person whom he never met in real life feels about him? That is why people arrange dates and meet.

Meet him if you must but please keep your eyes and ears very wide open. Run if you see any more red flags.

[Versacehottie]

25 minutes ago, Shortskirtslonglashes said:

I agree, and she certainly has a bias as evidenced in the thread, but even based on what she told us, cutting the excess out and just looking at his actions ‘objectively’, it isn’t the behavior of a well-adjusted, interested guy. Just not. 

yeah i don't agree with this, as you can imagine.  I would say time will tell but i think as we will only get one side of the story (if that) as it evolves and there are so many factors in play, it will be hard to determine what the character of this guy is.  I see it as normal and well-adjusted based on what she has said (potentially a little slow to move).  If it fails, perhaps you & op will think that means you were correct which could be but also could fail (if she's not well-adjusted for example, a real possibility or many other reasons).  

No one has a crystal ball or the absoluteness of anything in this situation.  sorry SSLL

[Miss Spider]

Np Versace , don’t need to agree on everything

[SaraSays]

2 hours ago, Emilyinroses said:

I am happy he took that step and I am taking the opportunity to meet him and see how he is for real.

I think there are 2 aspects you're both considering at each baby step - what do I think of the other as a fellow human, and what do I think of us together as a potential match.

Try to avoid any black-and-white thinking that might creep in. Everything could be lovely when you meet, regardless of whether you're a good relationship match, or not. Enjoy the fresh air. Enjoy the exercise. Put your best foot forward. There are a multitude of ways it could unfold.

• Person 1's horrid, it has no legs
• Person 2's horrid, it has no legs
• Both people are horrid - match made in heaven (kidding)
• Both people are decent people, person 1 would like to pursue a relationship, person 2 would not like to pursue a relationship, it has no legs
• Both people are decent people, person 2 would like to pursue a relationship, person 1 would not like to pursue a relationship, it has no legs
• Both people are decent people, neither would like to pursue a relationship, it has no legs
• Both people are decent people, both would like to pursue a relationship, it has a chance of going somewhere

If you're both good souls, and it's just not a match, try to resist the urge to reflect negatively on it.

[Emilyinroses]

1 hour ago, Versacehottie said:

hmmmm, well I agree with some, definitely not all.  I just don't believe in taking someone who has misfiring alarm bells, which they ring at every turn, as purely factual and accurate representation of what is going on.  It's her interpretation based on the fact that she has previous baggage, is hyper-sensitive, overly worried, guarded and cautious.  Also fails to take into account that how she wants (or anyone posting) wants this guy read her mind and present himself is limited view and there are many ways to be without meaning the guy is a bad seed or a narcissist whatever she called the last one.  Lol, it's a walk in the park and a first date.  It's a minor investment, which is how she should have been treating it all along.  Her mistake is investing like it's going to pay off big and must be the love of her life.  We've been taken on the ride of her ruminating & over investing mind, is how I see it. Best to bring her down off that so she can be in reality.

bolded I agree with you.  I do think that OP is calibrated a certain way and even if she might calm down a little, maybe they just won't be suited for each other because of what she needs for how she is calibrated.  It doesn't mean she is doing herself justice to be calibrated like that and that her mind is "right".  Too much to go into (because lol i can't even believe i'm spending this much time dissecting her dilemma), but a person who is calibrated to ruminate and worry and in "protect" herself mode will see things happening as if her reality, is reality. I'm taking a lot of what she's said with that grain of salt.  I don't know if she will be able to relax even if she ends up dating this guy which may sabotage things.  So it doesn't mean her "intuition" is right in describing the situation. It can mean though, that if she can't get a hold of this so-called intuition, most people won't be the right guy for her and her faux intuition will "always" be right (self-sabotage after self-sabotage).  Ugh, can't explain it well but it's a psychology thing.

I'm sorry but I am not invested in him thinking he is the love of my life! lol 

I am also not sabotaging anything! I am cautious like a normal person would be in this situation. I'm glad for my previous baggage because it prevents me from falling for the same BS I once did. I don't fantasize about men anymore or hide behind a screen. I want to meet in real life, eye to eye. What's sabotaging in that? Normal to me.

Yes I have anxiety I agree with that, but that doesn't mean I am rude to people or treat them bad. I just like to be honest like I was with this guy and I'm glad I was.

To be honest, yes I do feel a connection to him and am not gonna deny it. But I am well aware that might not mean anything. Actually, I told him that when talking online we create an idea of the other person that then might be or not true, so it's important to meet in person asap as to not waste time.

I am going to this date for what it is: a first date. And see how I feel, and if that connection is real or not. And then I can decide what to do next. Simple.

Also, I don't have "faux intuition". My intuition is on point. In the past I ignored it and led me to many bad situations. The last guy I got involved with my intuition told me to run and I didn't. So now I listen to my intuition and how I feel.

Edited March 2, 2021 by Emilyinroses

[SaraSays]

8 minutes ago, Emilyinroses said:

so it's important to meet in person asap as to not waste time.

I am hoping you conveyed this a bit more hopefully (... meet in person to see if we're a good match for each other). It can seem minor, but intial sparks are delicate, and this way of expressing things from your post is pretty negative, and an example of black-and-white thinking. Assuming you're both decent people, and it's just not a potential match, you won't have wasted your time. You'll simply have discovered you're not a good match for each other. That's to your benefit, and to his benefit, because it's lovely to spend time with good souls, even if it's just momentary.

[Emilyinroses]

1 minute ago, SaraSays said:

I am hoping you conveyed this a bit more hopefully (... meet in person to see if we're a good match for each other). It can seem minor, but intial sparks are delicate, and this way of expressing things from your post is pretty negative, and an example of black-and-white thinking. Assuming you're both decent people, and it's just not a potential match, you won't have wasted your time. You'll simply have discovered you're not a good match for each other. That's to your benefit, and to his benefit, because it's lovely to spend time with good souls, even if it's just momentary.

I don't think I was very clear in what I said. What I meant by "not wasting time" is by spending more days and weeks texting and talking without meeting, just to one day finally meet and see that we are not a match. So basically we both wasted time and energy talking to someone for so long who is not a Match. So better to find that out sooner than later, so we can both move on if that's the case.

In regards to the date, no it's not a waste of time. And yes it is to see if we are a match for each other.

I have a feeling this guy can even become a good friend, even if there's no chemistry for more.

[Gaeta]

49 minutes ago, Emilyinroses said:

Also, I don't have "faux intuition". My intuition is on point. In the past I ignored it and led me to many bad situations. 

But in your original story you said: 

I find that really weird. Usually guys are pretty fast in asking for the phone number ... but I don’t want to be myself doing that because not only I find it weird ...I don’t want just a penpal! And I find it weird he not asking for my number

That's a lot of *weird* your intuition is sending you that you're not listening to. 

[Emilyinroses]

29 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

But in your original story you said: 

I find that really weird. Usually guys are pretty fast in asking for the phone number ... but I don’t want to be myself doing that because not only I find it weird ...I don’t want just a penpal! And I find it weird he not asking for my number

That's a lot of *weird* your intuition is sending you that you're not listening to. 

On the contrary. I listened to it and questioned and decided to ask him that and if he wants to meet. In the past I would ignore it and just continue talking to him.

My intuition was telling me something but I still like to know the other person and understand them instead of making assumptions. 

[cleverusername]

Not reading through all 8 pages of this, but what are you doing to reciprocate? How are you escalating and making your feelings toward him known? Being a man is a lot of pressure, we are just as anxious and vulnerable as women. Some play it off better than others, but it is always there. 

We also aren't mind readers, and it can be hard to know where you stand. There is a HUGE difference between pursuing and chasing. Pursuing is going after something with the intent of capturing it, chasing is going after something with the HOPE of capturing it. One leads to you claiming your prize, one leads only to a possibility of claiming it. It seems to me this guy isn't sure whether he is pursuing you or chasing you, because he isn't quite sure how far (how into him) you are. 

[Gaeta]

8 minutes ago, Emilyinroses said:

My intuition was telling me something but I still like to know the other person and understand them instead of making assumptions. 

In theory it's a good tactic to ask  but my experience has thought me to never believe a person until his words match his actions. 

[Emilyinroses]

13 minutes ago, cleverusername said:

Not reading through all 8 pages of this, but what are you doing to reciprocate? How are you escalating and making your feelings toward him known? Being a man is a lot of pressure, we are just as anxious and vulnerable as women. Some play it off better than others, but it is always there. 

We also aren't mind readers, and it can be hard to know where you stand. There is a HUGE difference between pursuing and chasing. Pursuing is going after something with the intent of capturing it, chasing is going after something with the HOPE of capturing it. One leads to you claiming your prize, one leads only to a possibility of claiming it. It seems to me this guy isn't sure whether he is pursuing you or chasing you, because he isn't quite sure how far (how into him) you are. 

Well I did tell him I like talking to him and that I would like to meet him. We only started talking 2 weeks ago and haven't met in person yet, so I guess is a bit too soon to talk about feelings!?

Edited March 2, 2021 by Emilyinroses

[lurker74]

15 minutes ago, cleverusername said:

Pursuing is going after something with the intent of capturing it, chasing is going after something with the HOPE of capturing it. 

I have said for years that people should pursue but not chase, but I have never come across this definition. I love it. I hope you don't mind me stealing it. I would guess some people wouldn't like your use of "intent" and "capturing" but I take what you mean. 

[cleverusername]

On 3/2/2021 at 12:23 PM, Emilyinroses said:

Well I did tell him I like talking to him and that I would like to meet him. We only started talking 2 weeks ago and haven't met in person yet, so I guess is a bit too soon to talk about feelings!?

So you qualified his actions without communicating your dislikes. You said you enjoyed talking to him, talking to him consisted of as you said, "no banter, no sex" talk or whatever. He has deduced that he doesn't need to escalate further because what he is doing is sufficient enough. See the problem? People can't fix what they don't know is wrong, he thinks all is well because there has been no resistance. So you need to either escalate it yourself (send a funny picture, or video, or a picture of your butt, literally anything), cut communication until the date, or just move on. 

On 3/2/2021 at 12:26 PM, lurker74 said:

 

 

Edited March 9, 2021 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Off topic

[Emilyinroses]

4 minutes ago, cleverusername said:

So you qualified his actions without communicating your dislikes. You said you enjoyed talking to him, talking to him consisted of as you said, "no banter, no sex" talk or whatever. He has deduced that he doesn't need to escalate further because what he is doing is sufficient enough. See the problem? People can't fix what they don't know is wrong, he thinks all is well because there has been no resistance. So you need to either escalate it yourself (send a funny picture, or video, or a picture of your butt, literally anything), cut communication until the date, or just move on. 

Go for it. Actually, you seem like quite the word smith, I bestow upon you the honor of refining it with something more eloquent than "intent" or "capture". 

No, he didn’t escalate further because he didn’t know if I was truly enjoying talking to him or I just talking to pass time. 

Many men would understand that if a woman is talking to them consistently is because she is interested, so they ask her on a date to escalate. They don’t need to receive a picture of their butt to escalate things.

[lurker74]

1 minute ago, Emilyinroses said:

They don’t need to receive a picture of their butt to escalate things.

You are 100% correct. But I have to tell you, it doesn't hurt! 

[Gaeta]

7 minutes ago, cleverusername said:

 So you need to either escalate it yourself

She doesn't want to fill that role, she wants a man with a bit of leadership but he's not a leader. They have not met and she already would like him to be different. 

Emilyinroses he won't become a confident man all of a sudden. You will have to lead that first kiss and anything else following. 

 

 

[cleverusername]

6 minutes ago, Emilyinroses said:

No, he didn’t escalate further because he didn’t know if I was truly enjoying talking to him or I just talking to pass time. 

Many men would understand that if a woman is talking to them consistently is because she is interested, so they ask her on a date to escalate. They don’t need to receive a picture of their butt to escalate things.

Oh ok, I was just going off what I remember from page 1. I thought he had worked his way up to asking you out already but I guess not. This dude isn't going to change, you need to either coax him out of his shell with hints, take the initiative and be blunt about escalating, or move on. Two of those 3 require more work on your part. Normally I just go for it if I have even the slightest inclination they are interested, so this I cant really speak too much on. 

 

[Emilyinroses]

37 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

She doesn't want to fill that role, she wants a man with a bit of leadership but he's not a leader. They have not met and she already would like him to be different. 

Emilyinroses he won't become a confident man all of a sudden. You will have to lead that first kiss and anything else following. 

 

 

Lead a first kiss!? Or it happens naturally at the same time for both or I am not escalating anything.

I want to meet him and see how he is. If he does feel very passive in person as he is online, I’m out.

My only doubt is he is truly passive or is just being cautious for some reason.

[Versacehottie]

3 hours ago, Emilyinroses said:

I'm sorry but I am not invested in him thinking he is the love of my life! lol 

I am also not sabotaging anything! I am cautious like a normal person would be in this situation. I'm glad for my previous baggage because it prevents me from falling for the same BS I once did. I don't fantasize about men anymore or hide behind a screen. I want to meet in real life, eye to eye. What's sabotaging in that? Normal to me.

Yes I have anxiety I agree with that, but that doesn't mean I am rude to people or treat them bad. I just like to be honest like I was with this guy and I'm glad I was.

To be honest, yes I do feel a connection to him and am not gonna deny it. But I am well aware that might not mean anything. Actually, I told him that when talking online we create an idea of the other person that then might be or not true, so it's important to meet in person asap as to not waste time.

I am going to this date for what it is: a first date. And see how I feel, and if that connection is real or not. And then I can decide what to do next. Simple.

Also, I don't have "faux intuition". My intuition is on point. In the past I ignored it and led me to many bad situations. The last guy I got involved with my intuition told me to run and I didn't. So now I listen to my intuition and how I feel.

Agree to disagree.

Like Gaeta is saying (though we have different positions about your situation), you aren't listening to your "intuition" at all then.  You have on this thread been 90% negative about what his intentions are and your intuition was mostly telling you NO and all that yet you are going ahead. 

There's a whole mindset meaning for it which I'm not getting into at the moment but part of the reason why you would do stuff against what your "intuition" is telling you is that on some level your rational mind knows it's being irrational.

bolded? who said that? not me.

Edited March 2, 2021 by Versacehottie

[Emilyinroses]

1 hour ago, Versacehottie said:

Agree to disagree.

Like Gaeta is saying (though we have different positions about your situation), you aren't listening to your "intuition" at all then.  You have on this thread been 90% negative about what his intentions are and your intuition was mostly telling you NO and all that yet you are going ahead. 

There's a whole mindset meaning for it which I'm not getting into at the moment but part of the reason why you would do stuff against what your "intuition" is telling you is that on some level your rational mind knows it's being irrational.

bolded? who said that? not me.

True. There are things about him that are confusing to me, but in some way I feel like I want to get to know him and at least see him in person and check how I feel, so I am doing that.

[sushiandtacos]

2 hours ago, Versacehottie said:

Like Gaeta is saying (though we have different positions about your situation), you aren't listening to your "intuition" at all then.  You have on this thread been 90% negative about what his intentions are and your intuition was mostly telling you NO and all that yet you are going ahead. 

Sometimes (a lot) of the cases in dating, even if there are bad intuitions or red/yellow flags, the girl wants to follow through until the very end with the guy especially when there's high interest involved which seems to be the case with OP. Later along the road when the guy is officially diagnosed a dud, it'll confirm those doubts she had in the first place but will feel upset for "wasting time". Now emily hopefully this isn't the case with this guy and he actually turns out to be great, so don't be so hard on yourself for wanting to try and see how things go. A lot of the times we have to decide on our own when someone is not a good use of our time despite hearing others' opinions albeit they be super helpful!