Lost Our Baby and Now I've Lost Her **Updated**

[snowboy91]

Harsh, but true. It still hurts but now I am beginning to see it from the "she did me a favor" point of view.

 

Good - keep going. I'll put it to you this way - do you want to spend your life with someone who isn't 100% invested in your relationship?

 

If someone is interested then they will give their all to make it work. If not, then they often try to find something that doesn't sound brutal (whether or not it is actually true). I've recently been on the other side of that - having to break up with a GF of 6 years because we spent very little time together and started arguing a lot - ultimately it boiled down to a lack of compatibility personality wise, and diverging wishes for our future. I spent so long hanging on because I still cared about her and didn't want to hurt her... but even only 1.5 weeks later I'm so glad I left.

 

Breakups suck no matter which way you look at it, and reasons are often based on twisted truth, if not white lies. But the first thing you can do for yourself is not to take them personally. She didn't leave because you messed up, she left because it wasn't right for her, and fortunately you're realising it wasn't right for you either.

[Happy Lemming]

So whatever reasons she gives, you can pretty much chalk it up as bs.

 

100% AGREE!!

 

Who cares what reasons she has thought up to tell you; they are just meant to be hurtful.

 

Personally, when a woman dumps me, I'm out the door before she can give some BS reasons. After she says... "I not longer want to see you"; my brain goes into "mute" mode. I'm no longer listening, I'm headed for the door and I'm thinking where I can pick up her replacement.

 

NEXT!!

[David2357]

Yeah, you guys are right. I should not dwell on the reasons she gave me. Also, she did experience a huge loss earlier this year (our stillborn son).

 

 

 

I guess what I am stuck on is my own selfish feelings of abandonment. It is seemingly easier for her to cut me out of her life than it is for her to deal with the feelings that she has for me, be they positive or negative. She does not want to be responsible to or for me. I kind of understand that, but the end result is that she is treating me as if I am dead to her. It is a horrible feeling.

 

 

 

What I've realized over the last couple of weeks is that I can't control her, how she feels, or how she behaves. I can control my reaction it, which has not been great, to be honest.

 

 

 

I guess the only reasonable thing to do is move on without her in my life and accept that in all probability, we will never speak again.

[bathtub-row]

It would be so nice if we could just move on and stop thinking, analyzing, rewinding. We just can’t and it’s EXTREMELY uncomfortable.

 

David, I doubt that she has moved on in the way you think she has. Every relationship is highly significant in our lives and even people who walk away don’t walk away without a lot of feelings about that. She is in pain, the same as you. You both have been through hell and you haven’t come back from that. It’s a long road, my friend, but you’re worsening things by your beliefs about her. She has chosen to stop taking to you for some reason. I don’t know what that reason is and I do think it’s exceptionally cruel but maybe someday you’ll understand. Still, I don’t think it’s about how little you mean to her. I think it has more to do with extreme grieving and trying to make sense of things. Kind of like crawling into a dark hole and needing to be left alone.

 

I feel for you in so many ways. I read a lot of things on this site but your story really breaks my heart. It’s raw and deeply sad. I wish someone could take away your pain but this is a process that you just have to go through. I hate these nasty life lessons — they’re so miserable. But the sun will shine for you someday and I hope you’ll hang on to that belief above all others. Hugs.

[Rubix Cubed]

 

 

 

What I've realized over the last couple of weeks is that I can't control her, how she feels, or how she behaves. I can control my reaction it, which has not been great, to be honest.

 

 

 

I guess the only reasonable thing to do is move on without her in my life and accept that in all probability, we will never speak again.

 

What ever happened with the R/O? What was her reason for taking one out?

 

Can you tell when she opened her POF account? a possibility may be that she had that account while you two were together and the accusations of you cheating were transference or projection. It may also explain how quick she turned on you.

[David2357]

Ahh, here we go....

 

 

The ex girlfriend that dumped me about two months ago resurfaced a week ago (give or take) and wants to be "friends."

 

 

I know what I should have done. I should have blocked her. Or simply replied, "No, thank you. Best of luck."

 

 

 

But, we have been talking, and we have had some very long and very detailed conversations. Both about our relationship, and about other things. We've actually talked more in the last week than we did in the last few months of our relationship.

 

 

 

She is adamant that she NEVER wants to date me again. I asked why, and she said that I did not treat her as well as I should have (spending more time with friends than with her), and that if she gave it another try she feels I would settle into the same old habits and she would be disappointed all over again.

 

 

 

The weird thing is that she talks to me like nothing happened. Tells me about her day, about work, about issues with her family. Jokes with me. We've even flirted a bit. But if I bring up the possibility of working things out, she becomes very defensive.

 

 

 

I know this is not healthy for me, and I should just walk away, but I guess I am wondering: what is her end game? Is she looking for me to say or do the "right" thing to make her interested again? Does she just want attention? Does she not want to be with me but does not want to completely let go at the same time?

 

 

 

It's just so weird to have someone be so adamant that they do not want to be in a relationship with you, yet spend a couple hours at a time texting back and forth. I've never had this experience before.

[Lotsgoingon]

Your ex is clueless about how difficult it is to be friends with someone you just dumped. She is acting very self-absorbed.

 

Sure, that happens ... but rarely! ... Basically the problem is the exact one you identify here. The more friendly the former partners are, the more the dumpee is going to think, well maybe I have a chance after all. Maybe they've changed their minds. May I still have a shot of getting back together with her. They almost never change their minds. And you do not have a shot of getting together with her again (99 percent of the time).

 

Most people in your ex's position are aware of this issue and so most dumpers don't try to be friends with the people they dumped ... except as a misguided attempt to soften the pain for the person who was dumped.

 

What's more, this foolish friendship attempt puts YOU in a bad position. Because part of your ego wants to say, I can be friends and be cool. I'm strong. I can handle being friends even though you dumped me. That's the ego talking --and that ego is completely, woefully wrong.

 

As to why she's talking to you as if nothing happened, I think this is an opportunity to reflect back on the relationship and see if she exhibited other signs of this kind of self-absorbed blindness. Usually these strange behaviors are not a one-off.

 

Think back. What other kind of blindness to your interest or to you ... or to the interests of others did she display? This can't be the first time she acted this way.

[Marc878]

Being friends is for her not you. Why stay in this?

 

You are living on hopium.

 

Do you really want to be around her while she's dating other guys?

 

Weak move on your part

[David2357]

I suspect that she is doing this to alleviate her guilt. We did not have a great breakup (who does right?). We had a still born son back in February and she left me a couple of months after that. I was very angry and resentful; I felt like she had no respect for the fact that I, too, was grieving, and also felt that she expected too much from me at the time. She left because "I wasn't there for her" and she "felt all alone."

 

 

 

We have talked about that at length, and she still does not really see it from my perspective. For her, I did not give her what she needed when she needed it, so that's it. Game over. For me, I was so distraught and trying to hold it all together so that I could function and go to work, that I couldn't be there in the way she needed - and I think most people would understand that.

 

 

 

What kills me is that she will tell me things like, "I love you but I can't be with you." I mean, come on....

[Marc878]

You need no contact or you'll just prolong your stay where you are.

 

You beg, plead and chase they always move farther away. Always.

 

If she were to change her mind you'd know it.

 

She's throwing out breadcrumbs and you are lapping them up.

 

You can't make her do a thing or see it your way. She'd have to do that.

 

Better wake up to where you are putting yourself.

[David2357]

Do you actually think that if I ignore her she will end up wanting more? Or are you saying ignore her for my own sanity?

[Lotsgoingon]

Sorry to hear about the stillborn child. Devastating ...

 

I wish I could say that she's going through a phase brought on by the grief. Sounds more like the grief made her intolerant of certain aspects of you ... (I don't mean this in judgmental way towards you) ...

 

I mean this to say ... she has zero patience. Zero. When people are grieving, any b.s. in a relationship--anything that even part-way drains them--they want to drop it. They do not have patience or energy. That fuel tank is gone. The grief and survival is using up all that fuel.

 

If she doesn't think you were there for you, she's likely not coming back.

 

Question to ask yourself: why weren't you there for her? ... In some ways, in times of crushing grief, it can be easier to be there for someone else--especially someone you love--than it is to be there for yourself. And ask that question neutrally. No, the answer isn't that you're bad, selfish, not thoughtful. No ... if those are your answers, go beneath: why are you this way?

 

I'm not quite getting a clear sense of whether YOU think you were at fault. It feels like you are half trying to own up to stuff ... and half trying to duck and dodge and say that she's over-reacting. Which is it?

 

Note: for purposes of long-term learning and growing and becoming a better person and someone who can be a better partner, it's better to take on more responsibility ... own up loudly to your own contributions to the breakup. That way, you have an agenda to work. For the ego, of course, it's better to pin the blame on her.

 

Avoid contact for YOUR sanity ... it's not a strategy for winning her back. It's a strategy for keeping you sane and keeping you from wasting time and energy. Dude, I'm sorry, but she's really not likely coming back. People don't casually break up with us ... and if they do, that means they are disqualified from being worthy of dating in the first place.

 

And btw: if you really think you cannot see your perspective at all ... then why would you want to be with her? That ain't gonna change all of a sudden.

 

You have the right to tell her that talking to her is painful to you right now. And that talking gets your hopes up. That's where I might start.

[Beachead]

Friendship with an ex after not long after a breakup is never genuine.

 

Typically the person requesting it is doing so for some kind of self-serving reason that they are aware or unaware of and the person being dumped still carries feelings and hope for reconciliation. So, the friendship is just a false pretense used by both ends to satisfy ulterior motives.

 

Furthermore, this move serves only her. It is unhealthy to the one who was dumped. She's likely doing this to alleviate guilt for breaking up with you. If this is the case, she'll stick around, treat you nicely, right her wrongs until she is satisfied in her mind that she has paid her debts. Then she's gone. The next reason could be to keep you on the backburner while she tries out other guys or maybe she's not completely over you but is using "Friendship" to ween herself off of you. Could be a mix of all 3.

 

By sticking around in the present moment and allowing her to run this bs on you, you're teaching her that you posess very little value, self-respect, and self-worth, because she can give you 50% of what she used to and still get 100% back from you. She knows you'll respond to her. She knows you'll be down to meet up. She knows she has you wrapped around her finger and that she can be with you whenever she feels like it. She just chooses not to. She holds all the cards and has all the power and you are at her mercy following the leader. Ironically, in your attempt to try and win her over by staying in touch, you will end up turning her off.

 

Ultimately, if she chooses not to be with you, that means she has chosen to be with someone else. No current partner wants an ex lingering around as a threat. She will cut you out of her life or distance to the point where you might as well not speak at all, when that happens. If you stay, you will live to realize this and you will have no one else to blame but yourself. That will be the worst part.

 

Been through this. Learned the hard way.

 

Tell her you are unwilling to do a friendship because it is simply not possible for you, wish her well, and walk away. She wanted to end it? Fair enough. But if she ends it, she doesn't get to choose what pieces of you she wants to keep..she loses it all. Let her face the reality of her decision.

 

- Beach

Edited July 18, 2018 by Beachead

[PegNosePete]

I know this is not healthy for me, and I should just walk away

Yes, you should definitely follow your own advice here.

 

Do you actually think that if I ignore her she will end up wanting more? Or are you saying ignore her for my own sanity?

Ignore her for your own sanity. She has told you loud and clear that she will never date you again. Why would she lie to you about that? You need to wake up and smell the coffee here. It's over, forever.

[fromheart]

Your being played. Tell her that she can give you a call if she wants to work it out, but your not interested in friendship. Then NC.

 

Otherwise, she'll just keeping talking to you and then suddenly go quiet when she meets someone else.

[CantTakeMySmile]

I think it is more important how YOU feel and what YOU are getting out of it. If you are getting what you want out of it, then continue. If you are not, then stop.

 

 

Trying to figure out why she is doing something is a loss cause. Trying to guess someone else's actions is futile.

 

 

Concentrate on your path.

[Lotsgoingon]

BTW: it's not strange for someone to say "I love you but I can't be with you."

 

Nothing strange about that at all.

 

The feeling of love is only loosely, very loosely, connected to the reality of whether or not someone is a good romantic partner for us. I've fallen in love with people who were obviously terrible partners. And people fell hard for me when I was a terrible partner.

 

You guys have experienced a lot together ... and she has an emotional connection with you ... She loves you ... (doesn't mean she's "in love" with you). She thinks you're basically a good person. She wants your life to be OK.

 

But she knows that she can't be happy with you as a partner.

 

As someone once put it, love is required for a good relationship. But love is not enough for a good relationship. Same with attraction. Attraction is required for a good relationship, but it's not enough. You've got to have common values and interests and personalities that work together. And there needs to be deep attraction.

 

Traditionally people call this the head/heart conflict. The head stands for rationality and reason and thinking. The heart stands for feelings.

 

In deciding whether a relationship is good for us, you don't want to simply rely on feelings. Sometimes feelings are slow ... dumb ... clueless ... People fall in love with criminals and abusers every day of the week.

 

Or think of it this way: how many times have I interacted with a woman, concluded she was an amazing "catch" ... then I go hang out with her ... and quickly realize there is no way I want to be with this woman. Feelings are one of many indicators of who we should make friends with and date. They can point us in a direction. They aren't necessarily accurate indicators.

 

Lots of divorced people have some residual positive feelings left over for their partner. Doesn't mean they regret dumping the partner.

Edited July 18, 2018 by Lotsgoingon

[goldenlotus]

I am so sorry to hear about your loss.

 

Your post raises questions for me. I feel bad for you both. I don't understand why some of these posts are demonizing your ex girlfriend. I find your post concerning, maybe because you just didn't give all the details and there are reasonable explanations, but...

 

1. This is your girlfriend, whom you love and whom you were having a baby with. Why are you living apart?

2. What was your plan for caring for this infant if it had lived? Why was she not making plans to be staying with you?

3. Were you there when she was at the hospital? Did you come see her after?

4. Did you really spend the entire month after not seeing her? You could have driven to see her and taken her to dinner. A movie. Anything. Better yet, you could have gone to see her father and apologized for whatever it was you said, instead of holding on to your pride.

 

The way I see it, someone you professed to love went through an excruciating, tragic ordeal and you were not there for her. Texts and calls are poor comfort when you are grieving. I understand you are grieving too, but you guys are not kids, you are adults and you should have been with her as much as you possibly could be. She's saying she feels you prioritize your friends over her, she is concerned that you might be cheating on her...I do not blame her. According to your own post, unless you are really leaving some things out, you are not treating her in a way that should make her feel secure and important in your life.

 

I think you are in the wrong here and you ought to really be thinking about what you want from a relationship from her. I doubt she really wants to be dating other people. She probably wants to be with you, but you aren't taking the steps to be with her so she possibly thinks you don't care enough and she ought to be with someone who will want to be there for her, live with her, marry her, whatever it is that she is looking for.

[bathtub-row]

Isn’t this the same person who put a restraining order on you not long ago? Here’s what I see - a tumultuous relationship that will never change. But, remember what I said before? That she most likely hadn’t moved on as uncaringly as you thought. Now you have your answer. But continuing with her is unhealthy. I don’t know what her end game is but she’s very flippant as to how she treats others. Perhaps you were a lousy bf. If so, she may be just jerking your chain.

 

Most women aren’t going to try to make a guy come see her. Your expectations that the ball was just as much in her court is a dangerous mind set. A woman knows that if a man loves her, he will make time for her. You didn’t and she interpreted that as you not loving her. Then you weren’t there for her when your child passed away. I know you were grieving but I can see her point. A man needs to be there for a woman and she needs to be able to depend on him.

 

Whatever the case, again it’s all speculation but I think it’s obvious that the two of you are bad for each other and need to call it a day. I’d suggest that you should say everything you want to say to her about your child, not being there for her, etc and then walk away from this.

[David2357]

She filed for (and obtained) a temporary restraining order. There was a hearing 3 weeks later. She did not show up and the order was dropped. The "let's be friends" text came about a week after that. She claims that her family was behind the restraining order (get a restraining order or you can't stay here), and that she did not really want it or feel it was necessary. She has since moved from her Father's house into one of her sister's homes.

 

 

 

In a "normal" situation, I would never speak to her again. But after what we went through, that seems cruel. I also, to be completely honest, do not really want to cut ties with her. On the other hand, I do not think that it is healthy for us to continue speaking *right now*. Perhaps another month or two of NC is in order.

 

 

 

To answer some of the other questions that were asked:

 

 

1. Yes, I did stay with her in the hospital. Because of complications after birth (off the charts high blood pressure), she was hospitalized for a week. I stayed with her 24/7 and slept on a cot next to her hospital bed so that I could help her get up to use the restroom during the night.

 

 

 

2. I did see her during the first month that she was at home, but admittedly not as often as I should have. I took her out on Valentine's Day for dinner (which she has now apparently blocked out as she claims I did nothing for her on VDay). I did try to communicate with her Father but he hung up the phone and would not answer my texts or an e-mail that I sent him apologizing and asking if I could come into the house to visit.

 

 

 

3. Why was I not "there" for her after the baby died? I thought that I was. Like I said, even though I was not physically present, I talked to her every day. I repeatedly told her that what happened was not her fault, that I loved her, and that if she needed anything or just wanted to talk, she could call me any time - day or night - and I'd be there. What else was I supposed to do?

 

 

I don't know. I do not want to invalidate her feelings, but I think she is making this overly complicated. Maybe I was not as sensitive as I should have been, but I tried to be there. It just seems to me like she is now making excuses for leaving. And if I deconstruct one excuse, she will move on to the next one. Yet she will spend *hours* talking to me about this stuff, even now. So that brings me back to "what is her end game?" Is she trying to get me to convince her that she should come back? Or just yanking my chain and getting a kick out of the attention?

[Marc878]

Do you actually think that if I ignore her she will end up wanting more? Or are you saying ignore her for my own sanity?

 

You can only control yourself and your life.

 

Fix yourself at this time. You have no other good path.

[CantTakeMySmile]

So that brings me back to "what is her end game?"

 

 

What was her answer to this question?

[bathtub-row]

It does sound like you were definitely there for her. Although I wonder why she didn’t just stay with you once she was out of the hospital. The two of you needed each other. He parents are far too controlling and she caves in to them. I’m glad she moved out.

 

Perhaps the solution is to just talk when she wants to talk and leave it at that. It may be that the pressure from her parents is too much for her and she’s been through so much, as well as you, she’s not making good decisions. I think if I were you and she makes accusations about your behavior, just listen instead of defending yourself. She doesn’t appear to be listening or capable of listening. I get the sense that she’s just venting and trying to make sense of everything. If she asked herself what her end game was, she probably couldn’t give an answer.

[preraph]

Many woman are perfectly happy salvaging ONLY the friend part of a relationship. She's decided you're not her future mate, but she likes you for a friend. You don't want that, so don't go along with it. She's not up to anything. Many women are perfectly happy with this.

[CantTakeMySmile]

What is YOUR end game?