Does he care about me?

[stillafool]

Also, there's a big difference between blaming... and simply wanting to know you're cared about.

 

I want to know that he cares about my well-being. That's it. Pretty basic human need.

 

Isn't it obvious to you since he let you stay at his place and tried to lead you there? If I were following someone and decided to turn off and back up or whatever I would have blown my horn to let the person know that I was following that I turned off. It's hard to drive forward if you're constantly looking in the rear mirror. I agree that it is your responsibility to look after yourself.

[Iseult]

It's hard to drive forward if you're constantly looking in the rear mirror.

I agree. That's why no one uses them anymore. For safety reasons.

[emzara]

If you're stopped at a red light, you can check your rearview safely.

[emzara]

Isn't it obvious to you since he let you stay at his place and tried to lead you there?

 

No. Look, in a completely different thread, there are people trying to get it through to me that this man is emotionally abusive towards me because of the way he punishes me. I'm trying to determine whether or not ignoring my phone message was a way for him to punish me by sending me back to my apartment.

 

Sort of a, "Call me a dick?! Fine, [] go get sick. I'm not answering your phone message or your text."

 

I was posting this one example here as a way to isolate stories because I'm trying to gain perspective.

 

I know abusive men. I married one and left after he became physically abusive. What I know is that abusers can be incredibly sweet sometimes. So when you call them out on their abusive behaviour, such as punishing, they bring up all the nice things they did.

 

My current boyfriend has been incredibly sweet (letting me stay at his place). He's also given me the silent treatment and "punished" me whenever he's hurt and I'm not so sure about this behaviour.

 

If I were following someone and decided to turn off and back up or whatever I would have blown my horn to let the person know that I was following that I turned off. It's hard to drive forward if you're constantly looking in the rear mirror. I agree that it is your responsibility to look after yourself.

I didn't decide to turn off. I was trying to follow him after he made a whip-around U-turn. Edited January 7, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Language

[d0nnivain]

, there are people trying to get it through to me that this man is emotionally abusive towards me because of the way he punishes me. I'm trying to determine whether or not ignoring my phone message was a way for him to punish me by sending me back to my apartment..

 

Punish you? That's where your brain goes? If you even remotely think some guy is trying to punish you, walk away.

 

All I really saw is kind of what you saw -- a d1ck move in traffic that made it impossible for you to follow him. I concluded he sucks at letting people follow him while driving. You questioned your entire relationship which I saw as an overreaction. I also cautioned you to be more responsible about your own safety through greater familiarization with the area & an investment in technology.

 

For you to now come out with some idea that this man is trying to punish you tells me you are not ready to be in a relationship. You are either solely attracted to horrible people in which case you need to be alone for a while, get into therapy & figure out how to break that self destructive pattern OR you need to be alone for a while, get in therapy & figure out where your paranoia comes from.

[emzara]

Punish you? That's where your brain goes? If you even remotely think some guy is trying to punish you, walk away.

 

All I really saw is kind of what you saw -- a d1ck move in traffic that made it impossible for you to follow him. I concluded he sucks at letting people follow him while driving. You questioned your entire relationship which I saw as an overreaction. I also cautioned you to be more responsible about your own safety through greater familiarization with the area & an investment in technology.

 

For you to now come out with some idea that this man is trying to punish you tells me you are not ready to be in a relationship. You are either solely attracted to horrible people in which case you need to be alone for a while, get into therapy & figure out how to break that self destructive pattern OR you need to be alone for a while, get in therapy & figure out where your paranoia comes from.

 

Be careful about assessing before you know all the details. Also, please read what I wrote more carefully. I wrote that in another forum altogether, other people are telling me that he's abusive because his behaviour is punitive.

 

Which behaviour?

 

Example 1

He texted me during a weeknight because he wanted to come see me. I really wanted to see him, but I had just ordered a bed and the shipment was delayed. I was sleep deprived for a few nights and unable to focus at my brand new, fancy job, so I was desperate for a bed. I texted him:

 

I am on my way to IKEA to get a bed. The one I ordered was supposed to have arrived yesterday but I got an email saying it's not coming for another 9 days!!! Argh. My superintendent only installed the curtain rail yesterday and someone's light has been glaring in all night so I am completely sleep deprived.

 

So, I'm off to get a bed and curtains. Unless you feel like helping me assemble a bed and install curtains tonight isn't a good night for a visit.

 

He replied:

How about I check in with you at 6 see if you still need help? Otherwise I'll let you sleep.

 

So, a bit later, I texted:

 

They don't have the frame in stock so I got just the mattress for now. Ugh!

 

If you want to come say hi for a short visit you're welcome. Otherwise I will see you another time.

 

He decided to "let me get some rest and I'll see you Saturday".

 

When I went to his house that following Saturday, his body language had changed. He didn't hug me hello, he didn't touch me at all. The previous weekend, he had been all over me, kissing me and telling me he was falling in love. So, this new behaviour was drastically different.

 

When I talked to him about it later, he told me that he was really hurt by my texts and that's why he was cold.

 

Example 2

He was away over New Year's to visit friends. His trip was supposed to be 5 days long. As he was leaving for his trip, he kept coming back in the house because he forgot things. We had kissed goodbye a few times, so I had no clue that the last time he came back in the house was because he wanted another kiss goodbye. I was in the kitchen and yelled out "goodbye" again, not realizing he wanted me to come back and connect with him.

 

As a result, he didn't text me or communicate while he was gone. On his last day, I texted him to ask when he would be home, to know if I should have dinner ready at his place. He ended up having to extend his trip and the way he texted it to me was:

Probably Sunday

Staying longer

 

That was it. No phone call, no explanation. When I talked to him about it, he said it was because he felt hurt that I didn't go kiss him goodbye again, so he didn't communicate more.

 

 

Finally, I'm not suggesting that the U-turn was to punish me. I'm suggesting that not returning my call after hearing my message and reading my text was punitive. I'm suggesting that letting me go back to my apartment, which he knew made me sick, was punitive. For clarity, my message said (more or less), "I'm lost. My app is sending me in circles and I don't know how to get back to your place. I can't reach you and I'm not sure what to do." He ignored that message for at least 20 minutes, probably more because he felt slighted by my "dick move" comment.

 

Yes, I think there's a possibility that this was to punish me. He may have just needed to cool off. I see how an expression I used ended up being perceived as calling him a name and I totally get how hurtful that was. I understand him needing time to cool off. But, I'm also concerned that he has a part of him that goes something like, "Nyah! I'm not talking to you because you hurt me!", which is emotionally immature and indicative of a tendency to punish and that is very unhealthy.

 

This might be a pattern of him perceiving me hurting him and then withdrawing and punishing me for it.

[todreaminblue]

Actually, I didn't call him a name. I said it was a "dick move". This is lingo I hear all the time, especially at work. For example, my former colleague said that I should only attend an interview if I wanted the job because otherwise it would be a "dick move".

 

I wasn't lashing out at my boyfriend. I was trying to tell him that what he did was inconsiderate.

 

The thing I'm stuck on is that he was fine to let me go and be sick.

 

definition of dick move is a move made by a dick....thats calling names.......you do need to apologise......and so does he....it really did get blown out of proportion and not worth fighting over ......the whole thing started out with his concern for you...his concern for you is what you can try to remember when you make the first move to make up....good luck...deb

[emzara]

The definition I'm familiar with is:

 

A stupid action by someone. An ill advised decision which later had negative consequences

 

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=a%20dick%20move

 

I don't like the word "stupid". I think of it more as inconsiderate.

 

I definitely chose the wrong words to express that. It was inconsiderate of me to express it that way.

[emzara]

Punish you? That's where your brain goes? If you even remotely think some guy is trying to punish you, walk away.

 

...

 

For you to now come out with some idea that this man is trying to punish you tells me you are not ready to be in a relationship.

 

 

I was once in an abusive marriage. There were signs before we got married, but I didn't recognize them.

 

My ex-husband (boyfriend at the time) and I were moving a piece of furniture together. At one point, I misunderstood him and thought I was supposed to put the piece down. It ended up pinching his finger between the furniture and a root sticking up from the ground. His injury was so bad that it turned black and his fingernail fell off.

 

I felt incredibly awful for hurting him. Despite it being an accident, he was indignant with me. I didn't think much of it other than physical pain can bring out some pretty angry emotions.

 

Later, he and I decided to watch a movie together after dinner.

 

Later, we were hanging out with his best guy friend (let's call him Derrick) in the kitchen while making dinner. Derrick didn't know how bad the injury was and made fun of him the way guys make fun of each other. He laughed. I felt really uncomfortable at his insensitivity and made a sound that was basically a way to express my discomfort towards him.

 

After we ate, my ex turned to the household (there were several people there) and loudly announced, "Derrick and I are going to go watch a movie. Anyone want to come?"

 

He uninvited me to watch a movie and announced it in a way that was meant to hurt me. To get back at me.

 

When I told him how hurtful this was, he said he did it because I laughed at him. It was his friend that had laughed at him and yet he punished me for it. No matter how much I explained that I definitely didn't laugh at him, that I in fact felt uncomfortable about his friend laughing, he insisted that I laughed at him and justified getting back at me.

 

This incident was pretty minor and I chalked it up, again, to him being in physical pain, a misunderstanding and hurt feelings.

 

And then we got married... and he became abusive. He "punished" me throughout our marriage in several ways for things that weren't even true or reasonable. It got so extreme that he began to punish me physically if I didn't just agree with everything he did.

 

So, yes, my spidey senses are more finely tuned to watch for this kind of behaviour. It often starts small and might seem like an overreaction initially. But after you've been in an abusive relationship, you get wiser.

Edited January 7, 2018 by emzara

[JuneL]

OP: Do you care about your boyfriend? I saw a lot of ME ME ME in your posts.

[emzara]

OP: Do you care about your boyfriend? I saw a lot of ME ME ME in your posts.

 

Where do you see ME ME ME?

[emzara]

You know, it really depends on which details are shared.

 

On another forum, I shared different details in a different order and another poster was extremely frustrated with me for not seeing this this man is emotionally abusive.

 

You think it's all about me.

 

Just goes to show that limited information can really, really skew things.

 

I do know this much: I am trying to get perspective to properly evaluate whether or not this man actually means me well. How can that possibly be selfish?

[emzara]

JuneL, you're the same poster that wrote:

 

So what are you going to do if your apartment has an emergency and your boyfriend is on one of his spiritual trips? Blaming him? It sounds to me like you were trying to get a reaction from him by announcing you're going back to the apartment that's making you sick.

 

And I replied to you. You didn't clarify.

 

What do you mean if there's an emergency at my apartment? What kind of emergency? How does that relate to him being away? I've lost the plot. What would I blame my boyfriend for exactly?

[JuneL]

If there is an emergency to the extent that you can't stay there for the night, wouldn't you just have to figure out a solution yourself instead of insisting on staying in the apartment and blaming others for not caring? If I lost someone, I'd politely ask the person to give me clear instructions, instead of snapping at her/him. But even before that, I'd have gotten the verbal instructions clearly from the person first, because I knew it's so easy to lose each other in the traffic. If you boyfriend posted on this forum, he could easily accuse you of being abusive: He was trying to help out of kindness and yet you called him a dick?!

 

JuneL, you're the same poster that wrote:

 

 

 

And I replied to you. You didn't clarify.

 

What do you mean if there's an emergency at my apartment? What kind of emergency? How does that relate to him being away? I've lost the plot. What would I blame my boyfriend for exactly?

[Els]

The driving situation in and of itself sounds like you making a mountain out of a molehill. Yes he should probably have driven a bit slower, but people make mistakes all the time. Obviously after you reamed him out like that for a minor mistake, he wouldn't have asked you to come back to his place or called you.

 

In general, I think you should try to be less reliant on your boyfriend for day-to-day minutae. I mean, he's responsible for giving you a safe place to live AND responsible for you driving to his place??? And we're not talking about extenuating circumstances where you had major surgery and just needed help for a week of your entire life or something like that. This sounds constant and ongoing and you seem to see zero issue with it.

[emzara]

He was trying to help out of kindness and yet you called him a dick?!

 

Context is important here. I'm not trying to excuse my choice of words and I will probably never, ever use the two words "dick move" ever again. At the same time, intention does matter. I work with people who say "dick move" of the actions taken by a colleague that weren't so wise. I'm a computer programmer and if someone at work does something careless, I've heard someone else call it a "dick move". I've kind of desensitized to that expression because I've come to learn it to mean, "not considerate".

 

I do see how it came across as calling him a dick, but that wasn't my intention at all. I can't imagine calling him a name like that. I'm also not a name caller. As a habit, I tend to be quite clear in my communication.

 

At least acknowledge that my intention wasn't to insult him by calling him a name. My intention was to point out that doing a quick U-turn like that is not a considerate way to drive when someone is following you.

 

If there is an emergency to the extent that you can't stay there for the night, wouldn't you just have to figure out a solution yourself instead of insisting on staying in the apartment and blaming others for not caring?

 

Can you acknowledge the difference between blaming someone for not caring and worrying they don't? Is it understandable for a woman to question her boyfriend's motives after living with an emotional manipulator who actually did intend her harm? It's not blame. It's fear.

 

Yes, I would have to figure out a solution. The point for me is that if my boyfriend simply just doesn't care that I end up back in an apartment that makes me sick, I would seriously question what his motives are with me. It's not about blaming him or putting the responsibility on him. We ended up in a situation and he showed zero concern that I was lost and heading back to my apartment. He stubbornly refused to call me back. THAT is what concerns me. He had every ability to return my call after I explained, like a mature adult on his answering machine, that I was lost... and get me unlost. Instead, he ignored me. That doesn't raise red flags to you?!!?!?

[JuneL]

According to another thread, you just broke up with him for a different issue apparently. It might be good for both of you. Just reading this thread was exhausting!

Edited January 7, 2018 by JuneL

[Els]

 

Yes, I would have to figure out a solution. The point for me is that if my boyfriend simply just doesn't care that I end up back in an apartment that makes me sick, I would seriously question what his motives are with me. It's not about blaming him or putting the responsibility on him. We ended up in a situation and he showed zero concern that I was lost and heading back to my apartment. He stubbornly refused to call me back. THAT is what concerns me. He had every ability to return my call after I explained, like a mature adult on his answering machine, that I was lost... and get me unlost. Instead, he ignored me. That doesn't raise red flags to you?!!?!?

 

Seriously? It was all of THIRTY MINUTES. He might not have seen your call immediately. What if he has been in the toilet or something? You can't expect people to always pick up right away. You keep acting like you were in this dire situation where you were lost in the arctic tundra and would've frozen to death or something and calling him was your only hope of survival! You being lost in a city in a car of your own with a GPS capable phone was NOT AN EMERGENCY. Why are you expecting him to act like it is???

 

As for his "motivation" for "letting you go back to your apartment where you would-be been sick", well yes, he respected your autonomy. You said you wanted to go home, he let you. I'm not sure why you keep expecting him to protect you from your own decisions.

[emzara]

It's not another issue. Same issue, different incident.

 

When I post other things he's done, some people who reply insist he's abusive.

 

When I post some things in isolation, I'm the "ME ME ME" bad guy.

 

All a matter of perspective, which is what I'm trying to gain. If it's exhausting for you, maybe don't reply to my questions?

[Shining One]

Would you be able to follow someone if they made a sudden U-Turn and you had a car right behind you?

I would and have, many times. I've never lost someone I was following.

 

With that being said, I tend to take the driving abilities of the person following me into consideration when leading. My girlfriend would not be able to keep up with my normal driving style (both due to her car and her ability), so I take things more slowly and always make sure there was a large enough window for us to both make a turn. If it's one of my brothers or most of my close friends, I just go from point A to point B without any special consideration and they're right there behind me when I arrive.

 

Is your boyfriend familiar with your driving style and ability?

[emzara]

This really isn't the concern, to be honest. Is the guy abusive and hurting me on purpose? That's all I'm trying to figure out. Someone suggested I was a bad follower so I replied and now this topic is way off track again.

[emzara]

Ok, it seems that it really depends on who I ask and which forum I ask in. To some of you, I'm a selfish, demanding, unreasonable hypochondriac.

 

In another forum, I'm naive and making excuses for an emotionally abusive man.

 

I give up. Online forums clearly aren't the way to figure this out. Thank you for all of your time.

[Shining One]

Is the guy abusive and hurting me on purpose?

Based on this one instance, I'd say he's ignorant at best (if he was unaware of your inability to keep up with him) or inconsiderate (if he knew you were unlikely to keep up with him, but drove like that any way). I don't see any outright malice in his actions.

Someone suggested I was a bad follower

I would agree with this assessment. A good follower can stick to a bad leader. A bad follower can stick to a good leader. A bad leader and a bad follower do not make a good combination.

[emzara]

I would agree with this assessment. A good follower can stick to a bad leader. A bad follower can stick to a good leader. A bad leader and a bad follower do not make a good combination.

 

Seriously?! This isn't the point. At all. Ok, so I'm a bad follower. Now what? It doesn't answer the question about ignoring my phone call, which was the crux of what I was asking about. Focussing on the following/leading is irrelevant.

 

Based on this one instance, I'd say he's ignorant at best (if he was unaware of your inability to keep up with him) or inconsiderate (if he knew you were unlikely to keep up with him, but drove like that any way). I don't see any outright malice in his actions.

 

This, however is insightful, thank you.

 

I have been concerned about how often he either ignores me, gives me the silent treatment, or withdraws when he feels hurt. THAT is what I was needing feedback about.

[JuneL]

'He phoned me bluetooth to bluetooth a few minutes later when he realized I wasn't behind him.

 

I said, "That was a pretty dick move". Who whips around like that when someone is following?!

 

He told me the name of a gas station he was at [...] I told him never mind, I'm using my map app.

 

[...]

 

I bluetooth phoned and phoned and phoned, but kept getting his answering machine. Finally, I left a message telling him the app was sending me in circles and I didn't know how to find him, so I was going to go back home.'

 

He was the one who called first when he realized you got lost. Despite your attacking him (how would you have reacted if he was the one who said "That's the driving skill of a pretty stupid b1tch"??), he tried to give you instructions to meet at the gas station, but you told him never mind. So later you left a message saying that you're going home. What was he supposed to do?