I'm prob kind of a food snob. He's not.

[GemmaUK]

To me that menu is pretentious,

It has a glossary for goodness sake!

I understand most of it and I don't speak a word of Italian but even so..

It's only by experience and knowing translations of words on Italian menus that I understand it.

 

I can understand why a guy who likes steakhouses would not want to go somewhere like that.

Being that you only eat fish you can't even recommend dishes he would like as you won't have tried them.

If you are wanting to take him out to somewhere like this I'd say that's not the best introduction.

[guest569]

She did call him "unadventurous", didn't she? When I read that my first thought was: "That's a bit rich coming from you!!", lol.

 

It is admittedly eye opening to see so many people on this thread say that they completely don't understand or dislike that Italian menu. I'm Asian, don't really eat Italian cuisine very often, and I understand the majority of it... But half the fun is in finding out the things you DIDN'T know, no?

 

Me too Els , it seems that our corner of the globe is more open and diverse when it comes to food?? which surprises me??

[joseb]

 

It is admittedly eye opening to see so many people on this thread say that they completely don't understand or dislike that Italian menu. I'm Asian, don't really eat Italian cuisine very often, and I understand the majority of it... But half the fun is in finding out the things you DIDN'T know, no?

 

While I can concede the menu is maybe a tad pretentious, I too enjoy figuring out menus like this.

And even fairly cheap Italian places often have menus in Italian.

This is part of the reason I like travelling...figuring things out, learning new foods, getting out of my comfort zone.

 

Everyone is different though. It sounds like op and this guy may just not be that compatible.

[Eternal Sunshine]

She did call him "unadventurous", didn't she? When I read that my first thought was: "That's a bit rich coming from you!!", lol.

 

It is admittedly eye opening to see so many people on this thread say that they completely don't understand or dislike that Italian menu. I'm Asian, don't really eat Italian cuisine very often, and I understand the majority of it... But half the fun is in finding out the things you DIDN'T know, no?

 

I guess I'm just really glad that I and most of the people I know are open to most things. We can enjoy market stall food and fine dining alike. Variety is the spice of life after all!

 

I would also say I understand about 80% of that menu and I don't speak Italian...probably from watching cooking shows, dunno. I would totally go there.

 

It seems to be a weird thing to cause such a hassle. I can probably find something to eat at any food place in existence. I don't really care what restaurant a guy suggests, as long as it's not Subway or something.

 

Can't you agree to make alternate suggestions? That's usually how I date, one date it's my suggestion, next date it's his.

[elaine567]

While I can concede the menu is maybe a tad pretentious, I too enjoy figuring out menus like this.

And even fairly cheap Italian places often have menus in Italian.

This is part of the reason I like travelling...figuring things out, learning new foods, getting out of my comfort zone.

.

 

Figuring out the menu is all part of the fun and the whole experience of dining out.

Restaurants like this, rely on selling an atmosphere, an experience, and that is underlined by the "foreign" menu.

It can justifies the high prices too, and the selling of cheaper cuts and offal as being "special", as they have been given a fancy name...

[No_Go]

I bet you don't like him!

You don't like him and this is just the way out because he seems like a nice guy but you just can't be with him and the food makes it a great way to escape!

 

The whole issue makes zero sense to me.

 

The first dates are not about the venue, but about getting to know the person. Even if she doesn’t like the food - so what? If I liked the person I’d be happy to chat with him over glass of water while he eats, I can grab something else for myself later (or before).

 

It’s like she plans to buy a restaurant not to get a bf.

[elaine567]

The whole issue makes zero sense to me.

 

The first dates are not about the venue, but about getting to know the person. Even if she doesn’t like the food - so what? If I liked the person I’d be happy to chat with him over glass of water while he eats, I can grab something else for myself later (or before).

 

It’s like she plans to buy a restaurant not to get a bf.

 

BUT for some the whole foodie thing is a big part of who they are. They want a partner who they can go "exploring" with, someone they can discuss food with, someone who shares their passion.

Yes a person can go dine alone or find a foodie friend to visit restaurants with but as restaurants are often also mixed up with romance then it is not the same really.

This is not just about visiting a restaurant for the first few dates, then both are as happy as Larry curled up on the sofa with a pizza or steak and chips.

This is a lifestyle choice and I guess this will start to grate long term if neither is willing to give in.

[smackie9]

Again this is a compatibility issue. Eating is bonding, whether it's with family/friends or lovers. Food and alcohol can be considered as a "lifestyle", and it is important to many to have that in common. I'm one of those. I would never date someone who was vegan. I love steak....buck the horns off and put it on a plate.

 

OP needs to find a fellow foodie as her match.

[WaitingForBardot]

Ok but there's a GLOSSARY by the end of the menu:

 

Glossary link here: Menu - Lupa New York

/...snip/

The glossary reminds me of a line in a show I watched recently...

 

"Scrambled eggs - a dish so pedestrian that the name is the recipe." ..lol..

[Els]

 

OP needs to find a fellow foodie as her match.

 

The problem with this is that very few foodies will be interested in a person who calls herself a "foodie" but excludes 90% of the eateries where she lives. Most foodies I know (and again, I'm fairly active in the community) are all about diversity. Sure they enjoy fine dining, but they wouldn't turn up their nose at a good burger joint or steakhouse or hole-in-the-wall eatery either. The variety of experiences is what makes food so exciting.

 

Unfortunately the OP doesn't just need a foodie. She needs a foodie whose food preferences overlap with hers - and considering hers are tiny, that's probably 99% of the population excluded based on this factor alone (say 10% of the population are foodies, and 10% of foodies share her particular preferences).

 

I have also never heard of a couple having THIS much problem finding a place to eat together. That in and of itself suggests that the problem is bigger than just "foodieness".

[CryForNoOne]

Well he's from NY born and raised. If you guys tell me you don't see anything you like in this menu below, I will agree that I might be the problem then. I find it almost impossible not to find ONE thing to like here: Menu - Lupa New York

 

I think he's just like my father... not adventurous with food, and always sticks to the meat/potatoes/shrimp/whatever. I find it so boring For me it shows lack of intellectual curiosity, which bothers me, although he seems quite intelligent. Elaine is right. He said he's not going to get "educated" with palate at this age.

 

Anyway, thanks for the insights... gonna go get ready to meet him

 

Btw he insists he's not right wing in Politics, but after seeing this menu he said I'm a "typical liberal". And said this is the kind of food he and his friends laugh about. WTH?

 

This is all you need to know. You're not going to be compatible. He's just trying to say whatever to get in your pants but is too dumb to even pull that off without slip ups like this...

[CryForNoOne]

SMH at this entire thread...

 

OP is not picky nor is the menu at Lupa pretentious. The menu is in Italian because it's an ITALIAN restaurant. If you want ACTUAL Italian food, the menu is most likely in Italian. I find it hilarious that they provide a glossary. I don't think I've ever seen that before. English description under name of dish in foreign language - yes. But an actual glossary??? LOL! I guess they had too many Pisans from "the neighborhood" complaining they couldn't understand a word when their new hoity-toity girlfriend brought them to such a pretentious restaurant... There is nothing wrong with American-Italian, but at least understand it doesn't remotely resemble Italian food that they eat in Italy. It's like thinking Mexicans only eat tacos and burritos all day long...

 

Food can be a big deal to some and not at all to others. But it sounds like OP is not going to be compatible at all with this guy. I enjoy a burger and fries as much as the next guy (just had one last night actually), but I'm also a serious foodie. I could not date someone that has Olive Garden, Burger King, and Applebee's as part of their regular diet...

[WaitingForBardot]

While I realize there may be real problems if one member of a couple is a vegan and the other is a red-meat and potatoes only type, and as much as I like Drew Barrymore, her Santa Clarita Diet would give me pause ..lol.., to me at least anything in between is an easily surmountable issue. It's the sort of thing you work out with someone over time as a relationship progresses, not just a couple of meals before something has even kindled.

[Els]

SMH at this entire thread...

 

OP is not picky nor is the menu at Lupa pretentious. The menu is in Italian because it's an ITALIAN restaurant. If you want ACTUAL Italian food, the menu is most likely in Italian. I find it hilarious that they provide a glossary. I don't think I've ever seen that before. English description under name of dish in foreign language - yes. But an actual glossary??? LOL! I guess they had too many Pisans from "the neighborhood" complaining they couldn't understand a word when their new hoity-toity girlfriend brought them to such a pretentious restaurant... There is nothing wrong with American-Italian, but at least understand it doesn't remotely resemble Italian food that they eat in Italy. It's like thinking Mexicans only eat tacos and burritos all day long...

 

Food can be a big deal to some and not at all to others. But it sounds like OP is not going to be compatible at all with this guy. I enjoy a burger and fries as much as the next guy (just had one last night actually), but I'm also a serious foodie. I could not date someone that has Olive Garden, Burger King, and Applebee's as part of their regular diet...

 

You must have missed a substantial number of the OP's posts. She does not "do" burgers and fries AT ALL, not from any restaurant, and doesn't "do" quite a few other types of restaurants besides. There is a HUGE spectrum between that and "having your regular diet consist of Burger King".

 

FTR, I don't find the menu she linked to be "pretentious". To be honest it doesn't strike me as "authentic Italian" (I have actually found that hole in the wall restaurants generally serve the most authentic food), but fine dining in and of itself is its own cuisine IMO, even if they draw from other cuisines. I would happily dine there, but if my partner could NEVER enjoy simple restaurants or food, that would be a problem. Even if they are willing to pay for all of it, which would be pretty bank-breaking if we were having haute cuisine on a regular basis!

 

Which does bring me to another point - I wonder how the OP and her date split the bills. If he is paying, it would make a lot of sense not to fork out that kind of money for a woman he's only met twice. In cases where the couple doesn't know each other beforehand, it's generally sensible to keep to reasonably priced dates at the start IMO.

 

Edit: I just looked Lupa NY up. It was founded by a bunch of Americans. One of them is a pretty renowned chef, but he was born and bred in America and never trained in Italy. His specialty is "American Italian" food.

Edited November 20, 2017 by Elswyth

[smackie9]

The problem with this is that very few foodies will be interested in a person who calls herself a "foodie" but excludes 90% of the eateries where she lives. Most foodies I know (and again, I'm fairly active in the community) are all about diversity. Sure they enjoy fine dining, but they wouldn't turn up their nose at a good burger joint or steakhouse or hole-in-the-wall eatery either. The variety of experiences is what makes food so exciting.

 

Unfortunately the OP doesn't just need a foodie. She needs a foodie whose food preferences overlap with hers - and considering hers are tiny, that's probably 99% of the population excluded based on this factor alone (say 10% of the population are foodies, and 10% of foodies share her particular preferences).

 

I have also never heard of a couple having THIS much problem finding a place to eat together. That in and of itself suggests that the problem is bigger than just "foodieness".

OK she's not what you would call a "Foodie", but whatever you call it, she has an expectation as to what she likes to enjoy and share with someone. We all have certain expectations, some rare or quirky that means something to us, but whatever... there is someone for everyone. She should keep looking that's for sure.

[Shining One]

I have also never heard of a couple having THIS much problem finding a place to eat together. That in and of itself suggests that the problem is bigger than just "foodieness".

Agreed. This seems like such a simple problem to solve (to me), especially with so many options where they live. He likes meat. She likes fish. Wasn't "surf n' turf" created specifically for couples like this?

Which does bring me to another point - I wonder how the OP and her date split the bills. If he is paying, it would make a lot of sense not to fork out that kind of money for a woman he's only met twice. In cases where the couple doesn't know each other beforehand, it's generally sensible to keep to reasonably priced dates at the start IMO.

If I recall correctly, the OP is very traditional in this area and doesn't believe in spending money herself until marriage. Personally, the concept of Person A decides while Person B pays rubs me the wrong way (outside of special occasions, of course).

[RecentChange]

Perhaps I kinda get it. I DO judge people regarding what they eat to an extent....

 

I am not a “foodie” but like the OP being from NYC, I am from a “foodie” family that hails from San Francisco (grandpa was a chef) – we know food.

 

Here’s the thing, like you – I wouldn’t require that a guy be a “foodie” But…. BUT, I would have a big problem if someone was picky. Or extremely limited in what they eat – and the biggest, if they weren’t ADVENTUROUS.

 

I’ll try just about anything once. And I like people of the same attitude. My husband didn’t grow up in food culture like I did, but he is adventurous. Like me he likes to try new things, expand is comfort zones, learn about stuff. Sometimes he will ask me to explain things on a menu for him (or make recs knowing his tastes), or maybe we both are unfamiliar with something, and we will ask the host, or look it up – and we take pleasure in learning and exploring together.

 

If a guy was really picky, and limited himself to the most pedestrian of fare – that’s going to be a major turn off for me. If we aren’t at all compatible there, I can’t imagine we would be in other areas.

 

If he has no experience with different cuisines and is willing to try - great! Something for us to explore together.

 

That said, I am not picky and I do not have any food restrictions, I would eat at any old place a date suggested.

[CryForNoOne]

The problem with this is that very few foodies will be interested in a person who calls herself a "foodie" but excludes 90% of the eateries where she lives. Most foodies I know (and again, I'm fairly active in the community) are all about diversity. Sure they enjoy fine dining, but they wouldn't turn up their nose at a good burger joint or steakhouse or hole-in-the-wall eatery either. The variety of experiences is what makes food so exciting.

 

Unfortunately the OP doesn't just need a foodie. She needs a foodie whose food preferences overlap with hers - and considering hers are tiny, that's probably 99% of the population excluded based on this factor alone (say 10% of the population are foodies, and 10% of foodies share her particular preferences).

 

I have also never heard of a couple having THIS much problem finding a place to eat together. That in and of itself suggests that the problem is bigger than just "foodieness".

 

I don't see how you're drawing all those conclusions. There is a difference between being discriminating and picky. You're conflating OP's dietary restrictions with being picky. I know and have dated plenty of pescatarians, vegetarians, and vegans. Many actually miss the taste of meat but opted to stop for health or ethical reasons. Once you haven't eaten red meat for a long time, even the smell of meat can make one feel sick. It's an acquired taste and they've lost that. You keep mentioning burgers and steaks as if it is a prerequisite for being a foodie, which is absolutely not the case. I know plenty of foodies who are pescatarians or vegan. She mentioned she likes sushi, Italian, and can order something just about anywhere as long as the food is good. That doesn't sound picky at all - just someone who's traveled a bit and enjoyed good food and has a hard time eating crap.

[Shining One]

You keep mentioning burgers and steaks as if it is a prerequisite for being a foodie, which is absolutely not the case.

She said burger joint and steakhouse, not burgers and steaks. There is a difference. I eat neither burgers nor steaks, but some burger joints and steakhouses are among my list of frequented restaurants. Bern's Steakhouse in Tampa is one of my top five personal favorites.

[CryForNoOne]

Agreed. This seems like such a simple problem to solve (to me), especially with so many options where they live. He likes meat. She likes fish. Wasn't "surf n' turf" created specifically for couples like this?If I recall correctly, the OP is very traditional in this area and doesn't believe in spending money herself until marriage. Personally, the concept of Person A decides while Person B pays rubs me the wrong way (outside of special occasions, of course).

 

She said burger joint and steakhouse, not burgers and steaks. There is a difference. I eat neither burgers nor steaks, but some burger joints and steakhouses are among my list of frequented restaurants. Bern's Steakhouse in Tampa is one of my top five personal favorites.

She actually referred to steaks and steakhouses, burgers and burger joints. But it's kinda irrelevant because I don't think you're getting what the OP is saying either...

 

You don't take a pescatarian to a steakhouse and tell her to order surf and turf. Or a burger joint and tell her to get the veggie burger. It would have been obvious to me that American Italian doesn't cut it either. Frankly a steakhouse is where a non-foodie takes someone when they want to impress them. The vast majority of steakhouses I've been to have been with family (it's seems obligatory to pick some crappy overpriced steakhouse for special occasions) or corporate expense account when I worked in the hedge fund industry. All the foodies I know prefer to spend their hard earned money on mom-and-pop Indian, Thai, Ethiopian, Chinese, Italian, Mexican, Lebanese, Moroccan, etc... We're constantly debating where you can find real baguette, the best banh mi, killer ramen, or genuine paella with socarrat at the bottom of the pan...

[No_Go]

If that's their primary hobby - maybe it makes sense to find another foodie.

 

I'd admit I'd be annoyed if I had a partner willing to spend too much of our common budget on food... So food preferences can be somewhat a friction point, yes.

 

But here seems like it is just that she is pescatarian and he likes meat. And they have been on like 2 dates! What makes sense to me - if she was interested in getting to know him, is to focus on that, not on the food menu. If I really can't eat anything in a restaurant - I can still enjoy the company of my date sipping on a glass of water or something. And it will be ok to discuss hobbies and preferences involving food during the date or after, so to set the tone for the next one.

 

Btw I retrospected a bit - my first BF was vegetarian, I'm not - we were getting along just fine when going out - we'll just order different things from the menu (nearly any place will make the dish with no meat per request of the client). He was totally ok with me eating meat, although I'd usually not do it in front of him anyway out of courtesy.

 

BUT for some the whole foodie thing is a big part of who they are. They want a partner who they can go "exploring" with, someone they can discuss food with, someone who shares their passion.

Yes a person can go dine alone or find a foodie friend to visit restaurants with but as restaurants are often also mixed up with romance then it is not the same really.

This is not just about visiting a restaurant for the first few dates, then both are as happy as Larry curled up on the sofa with a pizza or steak and chips.

This is a lifestyle choice and I guess this will start to grate long term if neither is willing to give in.

[No_Go]

OP is not picky nor is the menu at Lupa pretentious. The menu is in Italian because it's an ITALIAN restaurant.

 

You wish the menu was in Italian It is some kind of English-Italian mix that doesn't make any sense: like 'Salumi' is in the glossary but 'Formaggi' is not, or 'Olive oil' is in English, but then they add 'Aceto balsamico' in Italian. Why?!?!? I'd advise them to pick one language OR the other and stick to it, otherwise it is just silly.

 

If OP is not paying for her meal AND complaining about food it is just hilarious to say she's not pretentious. Even pre-schoolers are aware gifts are... gifts, you take them or not, but at least be grateful...

[MuddyFootprints]

Our lives revolve around food. I wouldn't consider a relationship with someone who didn't share the same food values as I do.

[Els]

You don't take a pescatarian to a steakhouse and tell her to order surf and turf. Or a burger joint and tell her to get the veggie burger.

 

Why not? Most of the vegetarians/pescatarians I am friends with are happy to eat wherever, they just order the option that corresponds to their diet - they aren't self-centered enough to believe that everything should be catered to them. Admittedly, I don't hang out much with the vegetarians/pescatarians who AREN'T laid back in that aspect, I think it would be exhausting.

 

The vast majority of steakhouses I've been to have been with family (it's seems obligatory to pick some crappy overpriced steakhouse for special occasions) or corporate expense account when I worked in the hedge fund industry. All the foodies I know prefer to spend their hard earned money on mom-and-pop Indian, Thai, Ethiopian, Chinese, Italian, Mexican, Lebanese, Moroccan, etc... We're constantly debating where you can find real baguette, the best banh mi, killer ramen, or genuine paella with socarrat at the bottom of the pan...

Why would "all foodies" go to all of the above but specifically eschew steakhouses and burger joints? It makes zero sense. FTR, lots of steakhouses and burger joints aren't overpriced, certainly not more so than Lupa NY. I was invited to an event in my foodie community last year (I didn't go, as I wasn't available on that date, but anyway). It was at a new gourmet burger joint. Not sure why it's so inconceivable to you that someone might want to have ramen one day, paella the next, and *gasp* BURGERS the next!

 

It would also be interesting to see if the OP even eats at banh mi or ramen stalls (and everyone knows that the best banh mi and ramen come from stalls, not restaurants). Sounds to me like they might be too "low brow" for her.

[Els]

Might as well eat at Olive Garden.

 

Ok, I will admit, I like some of the food at Olive Garden. Then again, I already admitted that authentic Italian food usually doesn't appeal to me. I'd rather have a good steak or burger any day.

 

I personally wouldn't mind trying Mario Batali's food sometime, actually, just to see if all the hype about him is true. But I definitely wouldn't expect it to be "authentic Italian"!

 

OK she's not what you would call a "Foodie", but whatever you call it, she has an expectation as to what she likes to enjoy and share with someone. We all have certain expectations, some rare or quirky that means something to us, but whatever... there is someone for everyone. She should keep looking that's for sure.

 

Of course, no one is saying she should carry on dating him. It's just really amusing how she's drawing all these conclusions about her being "better" than him in this regard.

 

FWIW, I do agree that compatibility in this aspect is important. Sharing meals is often a big part of how a romantic relationship develops, so it makes sense that people would need compatibility in this aspect. I am the same - I wouldn't date the guy the OP is seeing. My point is just that I wouldn't date the OP, either. I also tend to be wary of people who claim that "their preferences are better than other people's preferences".

 

If I recall correctly, the OP is very traditional in this area and doesn't believe in spending money herself until marriage. Personally, the concept of Person A decides while Person B pays rubs me the wrong way (outside of special occasions, of course).

 

Wow. So she expects him to pay, but suggests a place that would likely cost $150 minimum for 2 people as a SECOND date???

 

This just blows my mind, lol. Just can't understand it. FTR, my SO usually pays, and he usually prefers me to choose, but I ALWAYS pick a budget/mid-range option unless he specifically says he feels like splurging, or it's a special occasion.

Edited November 21, 2017 by Elswyth