When you like what you cant have?

[littleblackheart]

OP, I feel like you're wildly overestimating what others think of your habits. I barely drink and I've found that people around me don't care that much.

[ZA Dater]

OP, I feel like you're wildly overestimating what others think of your habits. I barely drink and I've found that people around me don't care that much.

 

When more than one person says its an issue the I do sit up and take notice. My question remains the same, do I continue going to places I don't like and don't fit in at for the sake of dates?

 

 

Surely it would make sense to try and sell oneself as successfully as possible thus doing things that you enjoy?

 

 

The numbers thing is fine but again, how many do you go through before you just feel down on yourself for not fitting in and not getting anywhere? When I did this three/four years ago it was very easy to become totally disenchanted with the whole process.

 

 

How many is too many? How little success is too much?

[littleblackheart]

When more than one person says its an issue the I do sit up and take notice. My question remains the same, do I continue going to places I don't like and don't fit in at for the sake of dates?

 

 

Surely it would make sense to try and sell oneself as successfully as possible thus doing things that you enjoy?

 

 

The numbers thing is fine but again, how many do you go through before you just feel down on yourself for not fitting in and not getting anywhere? When I did this three/four years ago it was very easy to become totally disenchanted with the whole process.

 

 

How many is too many? How little success is too much?

 

Well, I have no authority when it comes to dating by numbers but it seems to me like if your aim is to find yourself a girlfriend, you should do whatever it takes to get to that aim. So that means you carry on dating until you find someone who makes you want to stop dating.

 

And I don't think being teetotal is an issue, unless you make it one.

[Cookiesandough]

 

1: If you don't do what people you like do, then they wont find you attractive.

.

 

ZA dater, you probably must go through a lot of people. I agree with Blackheart that if your goal is a relationship you have to suffer through dating. Dating is not enjoyable for everyone. Some people like the idea of getting to know stranger after stranger pretty intimately rather soon and some of us do not. But you can't make a connection if you do not and that means forcing yourself into somewhat uncomfortable circumstances at times.

 

 

As I said at the beginning of the thread, I have the same issue as you. I am attracted to people who are very different than I am. I also have some characteristics that are considered generally less attractive in my society...for example like you I am a more reserved person and I also do not drink. Some people do equate this to rigid/stuck up/not fun. I'm just being real. Again, like Blackheart said, different people place different in importance on how much each individual thing matters and there are many different ways to attract someone so that you don't drink alone may not budge how they think of you very much. For some people it will. A few may admire you do not drink.

 

I actually drink a little now that I started dating because I just got so tired of being asked why I don't ( I have a metabolic intolerance to alcohol) I just have one.

[MonkeyLogic]

My question remains the same, do I continue going to places I don't like and don't fit in at for the sake of dates?

 

If you're organizing the dates, I wouldn't. I'd go to places where you feel comfortable and you can be yourself. If they make the suggestion though then still go on the date. Being able to compromise is important in dating and relationships...

 

Surely it would make sense to try and sell oneself as successfully as possible thus doing things that you enjoy?

 

Well you shouldn't be selling yourself per se. Just be yourself, and if they're compatible they'll like you. If not, they won't. No selling required..

 

The numbers thing is fine but again, how many do you go through before you just feel down on yourself for not fitting in and not getting anywhere? When I did this three/four years ago it was very easy to become totally disenchanted with the whole process.How many is too many? How little success is too much?

 

I don't see why you'd get down at all. Any outcome of a dating experience is the right one. If they're interested and you are too, great, you go out on another date. If they're not interested or you're not interested, great, you can move onto somebody else who might be interested or you might be interested in. There's no wrong outcome.

 

I would say if you feel like you're getting burnt out to take a break and come back after a few weeks. That being said, if you have the right attitude there's no reason why dating should burn you out.

[ZA Dater]

If you're organizing the dates, I wouldn't. I'd go to places where you feel comfortable and you can be yourself. If they make the suggestion though then still go on the date. Being able to compromise is important in dating and relationships...

 

 

 

Well you shouldn't be selling yourself per se. Just be yourself, and if they're compatible they'll like you. If not, they won't. No selling required..

 

 

 

I don't see why you'd get down at all. Any outcome of a dating experience is the right one. If they're interested and you are too, great, you go out on another date. If they're not interested or you're not interested, great, you can move onto somebody else who might be interested or you might be interested in. There's no wrong outcome.

 

I would say if you feel like you're getting burnt out to take a break and come back after a few weeks. That being said, if you have the right attitude there's no reason why dating should burn you out.

 

Sensible advice thank you.

 

For it's becoming a question of what is a more palatable scenario. Dates which go nowhere with people who don't interest me just make me feel down. Instead I can think of an idea, admittedly a totally unworkable one and feel more content than going on date after date. I this this is called deluding oneself. Haha

 

Maybe I just like the unobtainable more or the idea of it and thus is just enforced after each date which is usually a let down.

 

People invariably don't seem to live up to the idea and those who do aren't interested. People are right though some sort of action would help. What that is I don't know because every place lots of people like I usually don't like and more than that present poorly at.

[NuevoYorko]

OP, I feel like you're wildly overestimating what others think of your habits. I barely drink and I've found that people around me don't care that much.

I don't drink at all, ever, and NO ONE cares unless drinking is a focus of their life, in which case I don't want to date them either.

 

If I were very uncomfortable or judgmental while in the company of a person who was imbibing, I imagine they would not want to remain around me. That might be happening with you. You seem to define yourself very strongly by all the myriad of things you don't do or don't like. Maybe that's a hinderance.

[ZA Dater]

I don't drink at all, ever, and NO ONE cares unless drinking is a focus of their life, in which case I don't want to date them either.

 

If I were very uncomfortable or judgmental while in the company of a person who was imbibing, I imagine they would not want to remain around me. That might be happening with you. You seem to define yourself very strongly by all the myriad of things you don't do or don't like. Maybe that's a hinderance.

 

Correct me if I am wrong but what you are basically saying is I must pretend to enjoy myself? I am not judgemental at all they are welcome to drink but when I say I don't drink I ALWAYS see the tone change, it seems having a drink is considered socially a norm. Solution I suppose is to try and find others who don't drink.

[ZA Dater]

I had a think about this and re read some of this thread. Seems to me what the real problem here is the fact I cant seem to form any sort of connection with people in general. The result being when I go on dates I don't really connect with those people either.

 

 

When I think about who I do find attractive and like they all seems to quite different but the same in one way: easy to talk to and get along with and they challenge me in some way.

 

 

What also doesn't really help is I have built up a certain ranking system of sorts based on personality and certain benchmarks have been established which to be fair would be hard for many people to live up to.

 

 

I was talking to a lady friend about this the other evening and she knows me very well and again she extolled the good things about me but lamented that they are a difficult sell because they aren't things people notice first off (FYI she has been a friend of mine for around 8 years).

 

 

The solution for now is to try and ignore the march of time and devote time and energy to things I enjoy, even if I know I wont meet anyone doing those things, I can at least try balance the scales more towards contentment than loneliness. There is actually someone who I wouldn't mind dating but I'd need to find some superhuman qualities to even go there. (FYI she is actually single).

[BaileyB]

Seems to me what the real problem here is the fact I cant seem to form any sort of connection with people in general. The result being when I go on dates I don't really connect with those people either.

 

What also doesn't really help is I have built up a certain ranking system of sorts based on personality and certain benchmarks have been established which to be fair would be hard for many people to live up to.

 

The solution for now is to try and ignore the march of time and devote time and energy to things I enjoy, even if I know I wont meet anyone doing those things, I can at least try balance the scales more towards contentment than loneliness.

 

The good news is, this is all stuff that you control... All stuff that you can change...

[MonkeyLogic]

OP what you're trying to do is a very common coping strategy. Avoidance. You're trying to just ignore the fact that you want to love and feel loved. Trust me. It won't work. Your best bet is to accept your desire for it and then move forward with some of he advice you've received here...

[ZA Dater]

The good news is, this is all stuff that you control... All stuff that you can change...

 

I partly agree, am quite happy with myself, this last date, if anything did a huge favour because it made it obvious which environments don't work for me at all so I wont ever feel the need to go to those sort of places with the intention of having dates there or meeting people there.

 

 

I'll just keep chasing the improbable.

[ZA Dater]

OP what you're trying to do is a very common coping strategy. Avoidance. You're trying to just ignore the fact that you want to love and feel loved. Trust me. It won't work. Your best bet is to accept your desire for it and then move forward with some of he advice you've received here...

 

This is where I beg to differ with your sage advice. What is point of doing things which make you unhappy? I don't see any upside in that at all, this wont make sense but I am more content to chase something which is very likely impossible than jump back into a pool go on more dates like I had on Sat which really just left me questioning myself and generally feeling bad about myself.

 

 

People don't understand the reasons I do things but there is some reasoning to all of it, I count myself lucky to have met people I have liked very much and to an extent that does offset the near endless dating disasters but I need them strong blinkers to ignore the fact that while I might like those people I'd have a greater chance of winning the lottery than going out with any of them, however they are still around, see them from time to time and despite what some may say there is benefit in that in that I do get to spend some time with people I like.

 

 

Its all good and well comfort zone this but if you genuinely don't enjoy things then why do them, someone who isn't enjoying something is going to make it obvious they aren't, I cannot pretend to like things I don't.

 

 

Which appears to make me seem inflexible, however if I met someone who liked something I didn't I'd be happy to try those things with them, within reason but doing things I don't like to meet someone seems nonsensical to me.

 

 

All of which probably makes me appear stubborn and pig headed but I know me and I know I don't immediately impress anyone but over time I can which doesn't really help when you have 30 min max to try impress someone, yet the irony about this is I cannot recall any date actually going out of their way to impress ME to an degree.

 

 

Without oversharing perhaps all this dates back to formative years largely devoid of friends, sure I had maybe two but they were all very much like me.

 

 

At this point, I'd rather feel good about something dating related than horrible about all of it, which then just spills over into other aspects of life so yes I guess you can call this coping.

 

 

Of course the slight nagging in the back of my mind is something called "time" as the months and years pass it seems this whole dating thing gets harder and harder, the acceptability of being inexperienced has long since passed and it wont get any better and socially I already have a stigma of "never had a gf" attached to me which isn't particularly nice. Part of me just hopes my good qualities shine through enough to sort of negate that but it does weigh in the back of my mind, especially considering the general judgemental nature of society today.

 

 

Watching people get married, have kids etc. can be quite sobering when one simply cannot get two dates never mind anything else. Then I look around me, extremely good looking people, yes they get dates but they never seem to get more than that, I look at what they have to offer and the logic part of me says "well if they cant there is no way in hell I can".

 

 

Oddly I spend a lot of time encouraging others to overcome difficulties but never do I seem to get much encouragement (apart from here), it also doesn't help a lot when people pass disparaging remarks and then belittle me by trying to set me up with people they themselves wouldn't be interested in but suddenly these same people are good enough for me.

[GemmaUK]

Oddly I spend a lot of time encouraging others to overcome difficulties but never do I seem to get much encouragement (apart from here), it also doesn't help a lot when people pass disparaging remarks and then belittle me by trying to set me up with people they themselves wouldn't be interested in but suddenly these same people are good enough for me.

 

This is a pretty obvious one though - it's gonna be because you are (self confessed) stubborn and they're already tried to offer advice to which you will have responded with an excuse not to take said advice.

 

Basically it boils down to this:

'Do what you always did and you'll get what you always got'

along with:

'Change your behaviour and your attitude will change'

 

Trouble is you're not 17,18, 19 anymore so you're not naturally going to fall into new things, new situations where you meet a whole bunch of new people anymore unless they turn up in your world.

[elaine567]

Oddly I spend a lot of time encouraging others to overcome difficulties but never do I seem to get much encouragement (apart from here), it also doesn't help a lot when people pass disparaging remarks and then belittle me by trying to set me up with people they themselves wouldn't be interested in but suddenly these same people are good enough for me.

 

Ok but what do you suggest they do?

Set you up with married and attached women?

There are only so many people at any age looking around for dates, so the fact they find people you may be interested in is a huge bonus.

Sometimes "love" and attraction is not obvious, and people get together with people that we, as outsiders, would never think would find each other attractive.

Your friends are not qualified matchmakers, they are only people trying to help you.

The "belittling" is only in your mind.

[TheTraveler]

3: No I haven't, in fact I have never had a gf at all. Yes, I know a few my type

 

Lots of characters typed, and there's your answer. Have fun...

[elaine567]

Lots of characters typed, and there's your answer. Have fun...

 

Slight problem.

ZA Dater is not THEIR type.

[ZA Dater]

This is a pretty obvious one though - it's gonna be because you are (self confessed) stubborn and they're already tried to offer advice to which you will have responded with an excuse not to take said advice.

 

Basically it boils down to this:

'Do what you always did and you'll get what you always got'

along with:

'Change your behaviour and your attitude will change'

 

Trouble is you're not 17,18, 19 anymore so you're not naturally going to fall into new things, new situations where you meet a whole bunch of new people anymore unless they turn up in your world.

 

Exactly. People don't tend to turn up in my world often and as months years go by it just seems ever harder.

[littleblackheart]

OP, why do you want to be in a relationship? (serious and genuine question)

[ZA Dater]

Ok but what do you suggest they do?

Set you up with married and attached women?

There are only so many people at any age looking around for dates, so the fact they find people you may be interested in is a huge bonus.

Sometimes "love" and attraction is not obvious, and people get together with people that we, as outsiders, would never think would find each other attractive.

Your friends are not qualified matchmakers, they are only people trying to help you.

The "belittling" is only in your mind.

 

The problem is I am not interested in anyone they find (and the people they try set me up with are equally disinterested because the set up usually goes like this "he has never had a gf, why don't you take him out") because its like putting together ice and fire, I have done what they said a few times and ignored the obvious fact I am not compatible and inevitable that exactly what has happened, a total lack of compatibility.

 

 

My point is every set up has a large infusion of pity thrown into it, which frankly I don't want.

 

 

Having said that there have been a few well meaning people but again its so hard to take the advice seriously from someone who has her choice of anyone "oh go out and meet people" was the suggestion, great, where and when and what?

 

 

With all this said I do think people need to aspire to the best, rather than settle for something. Its cold comfort for me I guess.

 

 

I agree with you that often I cannot fathom why people are with the people they are, no apparent logic in it, my only reaction to that is to simply just try be the best person I can and maybe someone someday will notice.

[ZA Dater]

OP, why do you want to be in a relationship? (serious and genuine question)

 

Good question.

 

 

Because being lonely isn't the best of feelings in the world. Because I think there is a lot of good about me that someone else might appreciate. (though perhaps based on my record this is pure fiction at best).

 

 

It may not be apparent here but I do actually have a caring personality. People say its great being single but doing everything on your own really isn't nice. I have sorted out part of that but ultimately I don't have anyone "lets go for dinner", "lets maybe go here", yes I can do those things on my own but its impossible not to look around and not feel even more lonely.

 

 

Id like to experience the physical side of it.

 

 

Emotional connection would be nice, or even just someone to chat to after a long day.

 

 

People cannot relate to literally doing almost everything on your own, I have arranged a weekend away for a club I administer, guess who goes without partner, always me and while I know these people well I always tend to feel like the odd one out.

 

 

Overall I think it would be nice to experience.

[littleblackheart]

Thanks for the reply (and don't worry, people know better than to reduce posters to what they write on here, of course there are other facets to your personality that don't translate online).

 

I ask because my personal experience is that I spent 7 years in a marriage (my only LTR to date) in a country that wasn't mine and I never felt more lonely than during that time so it is possible to be in a relationship that is not a nice experience. Since that experience I have learnt to value being on my own (without a partner I mean, as I have kids) and I am so particular about the type of man I'd want to be in a relationship with that I have stopped trying to find one. But the thing is, I was feeling content single before I got married.

 

I feel like you are idealising what a relationship is; even a successful relationship requires work and being flexible, and it requires building an equal partnership with another person, not just having a companion to go with on trips.

[normal person]

I partly agree, am quite happy with myself, this last date, if anything did a huge favour because it made it obvious which environments don't work for me at all so I wont ever feel the need to go to those sort of places with the intention of having dates there or meeting people there.

 

Is the venue really that big of a deal? If I like someone enough, I enjoy their company anywhere, not write them off because the menus were laminated.

 

What is point of doing things which make you unhappy? I don't see any upside in that at all,

 

Doing things you don't like is often a necessary precursor to getting things you want. Like going through a lot of schooling to get your degree. Or running a lot to lose weight. Again, you're refusal to accept momentary discomfort or inconvenience is proving to be a gigantic hurdle. Just jump the damn thing, already.

 

this wont make sense but I am more content to chase something which is very likely impossible than jump back into a pool go on more dates like I had on Sat which really just left me questioning myself and generally feeling bad about myself.

 

Are you really more content, though? You still seem hopelessly unfulfilled. If I were you, I'd just suck it up, deal with it, and do whatever I had to do without excuse.

 

People don't understand the reasons I do things but there is some reasoning to all of it, I count myself lucky to have met people I have liked very much

 

People understand, they just don't think it's helpful for you to think this way. You don't understand that hanging your hat on table scraps of attention from someone who has no interest in you is a bad, bad, look. You are advertising yourself as the weakest, least sexually viable male around. The "I'm happy just to know you even if you don't like me" angle is very typical "nice guy" behavior that turns people off very, very quickly.

 

 

while I might like those people I'd have a greater chance of winning the lottery than going out with any of them,

 

With that attitude, yes.

 

 

however they are still around, see them from time to time and despite what some may say there is benefit in that in that I do get to spend some time with people I like.

 

If by "benefit" you mean "momentary respite," then it's just a band aid that isn't actually helping you. You need a cure, not a distraction/excuse.

[SammySammy]

Rather than dating, maybe the focus should be to simply do things with other people. With anybody, doing anything. Just find someone you have a mutual interest with and do that thing with them.

 

Get comfortable with companionship first before trying to find that ideal woman who will meet all of your needs.

 

Just having a full social life may be a start.

[MonkeyLogic]

This is where I beg to differ with your sage advice. What is point of doing things which make you unhappy?

 

I'd recommend a book called The Happiness Trap. There is a cycle people go on trying to be happy all the time. It doesn't work. With growth there is always struggle. Failure, rejection, disappointment, frustration, etc. are all part of the process. People that try to live life without experiencing any of those things don't succeed in life. If you want a full, rich life, you're going to need to put yourself in uncomfortable situations. And work hard. And then bounce back and try again if you do fail. Or get rejected.

 

I don't see any upside in that at all, this wont make sense but I am more content to chase something which is very likely impossible than jump back into a pool go on more dates like I had on Sat which really just left me questioning myself and generally feeling bad about myself.

 

Well it makes sense if you're using avoidance as a coping mechanism. The problem is that date on Saturday shouldn't even be playing in your head anymore. Because your dating numbers are so low, each one has an unhealthy amount of significance. So Saturday date, you were incompatible. Next! No emotional energy needed.

 

People don't understand the reasons I do things but there is some reasoning to all of it, I count myself lucky to have met people I have liked very much and to an extent that does offset the near endless dating disasters but I need them strong blinkers to ignore the fact that while I might like those people I'd have a greater chance of winning the lottery than going out with any of them, however they are still around, see them from time to time and despite what some may say there is benefit in that in that I do get to spend some time with people I like.

 

So basically you're choosing to live in your head. That's a very safe option. No chance of getting rejected that way. And that's the big fear right? That you'll fall for someone and once they get to know you, they won't love you back?

 

I'd recommend taking the risk anyways.

 

Its all good and well comfort zone this but if you genuinely don't enjoy things then why do them, someone who isn't enjoying something is going to make it obvious they aren't, I cannot pretend to like things I don't.

 

That's the way you grow. You do the stuff you don't like to accomplish the goal.

 

Which appears to make me seem inflexible, however if I met someone who liked something I didn't I'd be happy to try those things with them, within reason but doing things I don't like to meet someone seems nonsensical to me.

 

Are you referring to going to bars? Well I too would suggest that if you're planning the date, stick to stuff you do enjoy and feel comfortable doing. Especially early on. But your dating partner is a person and has their own thoughts about things, and if you value her, you'll want to do the things that she wants too!

 

 

All of which probably makes me appear stubborn and pig headed but I know me and I know I don't immediately impress anyone but over time I can which doesn't really help when you have 30 min max to try impress someone, yet the irony about this is I cannot recall any date actually going out of their way to impress ME to an degree.

 

Again, you shouldn't be trying to sell yourself. Just BE yourself. That's what they're doing. If they're not interested, so be it. You can't be someone you're not.

 

Without oversharing perhaps all this dates back to formative years largely devoid of friends, sure I had maybe two but they were all very much like me.

 

Maybe just a correlation? Why didn't you have many friends?

 

At this point, I'd rather feel good about something dating related than horrible about all of it, which then just spills over into other aspects of life so yes I guess you can call this coping.

 

Again, feeling horrible about dating is spending way too much emotional energy, and I suspect it's because you have very limited dating experience. If you date more, you'll see that people are just people. And if it's not a match, so be it, move on to the next person.

 

 

Of course the slight nagging in the back of my mind is something called "time" as the months and years pass it seems this whole dating thing gets harder and harder, the acceptability of being inexperienced has long since passed and it wont get any better and socially I already have a stigma of "never had a gf" attached to me which isn't particularly nice. Part of me just hopes my good qualities shine through enough to sort of negate that but it does weigh in the back of my mind, especially considering the general judgemental nature of society today.

 

Yup, this is definitely playing into your fear of rejection. If you actually do fall in love with someone, and she finds out you're inexperienced will she judge you? And then leave you because of it? You're assuming the answer is yes, so you're choosing not to put much effort into dating. I don't think you can read people's minds though can you?

 

 

Watching people get married, have kids etc. can be quite sobering when one simply cannot get two dates never mind anything else. Then I look around me, extremely good looking people, yes they get dates but they never seem to get more than that, I look at what they have to offer and the logic part of me says "well if they cant there is no way in hell I can".

 

Most adults are in relationships. You're using a very small sample size to draw your conclusions from (or to keep seeing what you want to see).

 

Oddly I spend a lot of time encouraging others to overcome difficulties but never do I seem to get much encouragement (apart from here), it also doesn't help a lot when people pass disparaging remarks and then belittle me by trying to set me up with people they themselves wouldn't be interested in but suddenly these same people are good enough for me.

 

How many times have you been set up with someone? Is it fair to draw such an absolute conclusion based on a VERY small sample size? I'd guess the people setting you up had no idea if you'd be a good match for the person. That's why you go out on dates!