Snooped phone and found things from past

[honeytomb]

If it is still on your mind, it will not go away once you are married.

 

Although she was in her right in seeing other people while you were married, she shouldn't have lied. Worst case, she felt justified since you were married at the time If she did, she will feel comfortable lying about other things down the road.

 

Or maybe she was afraid and wanted to make sure she kept you after she waited to have you. She probably forgot that those things were even on her phone which shows that it didn't mean anything and the way she dropped the guys does make it clear that she very much wanted to be with you.

 

Talk to her and gauge her reaction. You shouldn't have snooped and she will probably be upset, but she will be more upset about you finding out that she lied if she is remorseful. If she misdirects or shifts blame too much, I would take it as a red flag. Honesty is clearly important to you so you need to make that known to her.

[elaine567]

Honesty is clearly important to you so you need to make that known to her.

 

I am not sure that it actually is, because he has sat on this info for the past 17 months and it is only now he is wondering whether he should bring it up to her.

If honesty was that important to him he would not have spent 17 months of his life living with a woman who he knew lied to him and a woman who even now keeps the charade going by wanting to celebrate their dating "anniversary"...

 

I definitely get the keeping quiet about the fact she was seeing and sleeping with other men, I guess in a multi-dating culture that is not unexpected, but the "anniversary" celebration is all a bit too much IMO.

[BMI03]

I am not sure that it actually is, because he has sat on this info for the past 17 months and it is only now he is wondering whether he should bring it up to her.

If honesty was that important to him he would not have spent 17 months of his life living with a woman who he knew lied to him and a woman who even now keeps the charade going by wanting to celebrate their dating "anniversary"...

 

I definitely get the keeping quiet about the fact she was seeing and sleeping with other men, I guess in a multi-dating culture that is not unexpected, but the "anniversary" celebration is all a bit too much IMO.

 

Honesty is important to me. And it bothered me a couple of years ago when I found this out. The reason I sat on it was related to exactly what some of the earlier posters have stated here: who the hell was I to feel hurt by her dating others...I was married for God's sake! So in my mind I felt I didn't have a base to stand on to voice my objections soundly, so I made a decision to accept and move on with the relationship. At that time, I couldn't have imagined how wonderfully our relationship would blossom, how much we would share and open up to one another about other things, how connected we would become. But now that we are here and she is the woman I want to marry, the honesty to our messy beginnings is something that I feel we owe ourselves. It's not at al about being mad about what happened. That was years ago and we were different people in different situations. It's about breaking down some of the last remaining doors of secrecy that we have from one another in an attempt to ensure we have our base intact and don't give opportunity to even the smallest seeds of discontent as we move into married life. That's what I am after here...openness about it. We have had a similar conversation about my entire marriage from beginning to end, which itself was also full of details that as you share more I am sure don't feel good, but at the end of the conversation leave us both feeling closer like we know each other that much better. That's what I want...to hear her tell me about these things, let me tell her that I love her and understand, and give her the opportunity to know she is loved at her core with even her worst in mind. She has given me that gift with all the messy relationship decisions I have made and shared with her, and so I want us to both feel that closeness together.

[d0nnivain]

Talk to her already. Say a lot of what you said in this last post. Assure her that you love her. Reassure her that you are not being a hypocrite about the fidelity but explain that you have a problem with the lies. She may have a similar response that she just didn't know how to tell you & lying was easier. You then have to judge whether she is otherwise a truthful person this one lapse notwithstanding.

 

But please don't marry without addressing this. It will only fester

[BMI03]

Talk to her already. Say a lot of what you said in this last post. Assure her that you love her. Reassure her that you are not being a hypocrite about the fidelity but explain that you have a problem with the lies. She may have a similar response that she just didn't know how to tell you & lying was easier. You then have to judge whether she is otherwise a truthful person this one lapse notwithstanding.

 

But please don't marry without addressing this. It will only fester

 

Ya, wheels are in motion. Any time we need to talk about something deep or troubling we write an email. Sort of a free flow way to get thoughts in order, put your mind to words, and send it. Then, we talk about it after the emotion of the situation has softened a bit. It's allowed us to jump over that initial stage of being out on the stop and acting defensive or feeling accused. Has led to better conversations and the time to understand each other and see a situation through each other's eyes.

 

So I have emailed her about it and what it has made me feel. And what my goal in talking about it is.

 

The email included some other things too which she said she started reading and got through and would like to talk about to address. At the time she said she didn't get through the whole thing yet (it was long and explored feelings). I don't know if she has gone back to it or not yet as I have been out of town for work. I'll be back and see her Sunday so will see how the conversation goes.

 

Thanks everyone for the help.

[honeytomb]

Good luck. It sounds as though you have a good communication system in place. Sadly I think a lot of relationships start out dishonestly as in the beginning we care more about ourselves, then grow to care more about the other person over time. And we let the other person in and show more of our true selves as the relationship grows. Hopefully that is what happened and you and she can have a constructive conversation and feel more at ease.

[camillalev]

You're upset she was seeing/talking to other people in the first few months of you dating? While you were still married and living with your then wife?

[BMI03]

You're upset she was seeing/talking to other people in the first few months of you dating? While you were still married and living with your then wife?

 

No, I am not

[road]

You're upset she was seeing/talking to other people in the first few months of you dating? While you were still married and living with your then wife?

 

She told the OP that she was not dating anyone else when she started

dating the OP.

[dichotomy]

You actually appear to say you understand and your not really upset nor feel betrayed really. So your cool with it. if so - good man !

 

She did not see other guys once you moved out and were separated right ? These old hidden lovers are not her friends now right? All in the past - gone from her life ?

 

 

Let it go. It was a messy time for both of you. I see nothing good coming from telling her you snooped or you have questions.

Edited June 15, 2017 by dichotomy

[elaine567]

I see nothing good coming from telling her you snooped or you have questions.

 

Too late the email is already sent.

[dichotomy]

Too late the email is already sent.

 

Crap - sorry for them

[BMI03]

You actually appear to say you understand and your not really upset nor feel betrayed really. So your cool with it. if so - good man !

 

She did not see other guys once you moved out and were separated right ? These old hidden lovers are not her friends now right? All in the past - gone from her life ?

 

 

Let it go. It was a messy time for both of you. I see nothing good coming from telling her you snooped or you have questions.

 

 

I'd be lying to say I'm not upset, but I'm upset about the trickery, not the dating while I was finalizing things. The dating I would have understood had she told me up front. It makes sense. I wouldn't like or enjoy it...I wouldn't propose it, but I understand it. It was the safe move when she was just getting to know me.

 

There is one guy from that time that she still texts with, maybe once every 3 months or so. The one where I said Most likely FIBs. She told me about him early on, as a friend of hers she met while Tonderjng. That they met once and just became friends. I saw things that suggest otherwise. She has shared the conversations with him with me. She tells him about me and what we are up to. I do think that he did become just a friend, but I am still uncomfortable with him even in her world. He didn't get an invite to the wedding for instance and that actually is a clear distinction of a true friend vs a friend with some early, even if gone now, romantic overtones. The others are gone.

[road]

I'd be lying to say I'm not upset, but I'm upset about the trickery, not the dating while I was finalizing things. The dating I would have understood had she told me up front. It makes sense. I wouldn't like or enjoy it...I wouldn't propose it, but I understand it. It was the safe move when she was just getting to know me.

 

There is one guy from that time that she still texts with, maybe once every 3 months or so. The one where I said Most likely FIBs. She told me about him early on, as a friend of hers she met while Tonderjng. That they met once and just became friends. I saw things that suggest otherwise. She has shared the conversations with him with me. She tells him about me and what we are up to. I do think that he did become just a friend, but I am still uncomfortable with him even in her world. He didn't get an invite to the wedding for instance and that actually is a clear distinction of a true friend vs a friend with some early, even if gone now, romantic overtones. The others are gone.

 

So what does your wife have to say about this?

[BMI03]

So what does your wife have to say about this?

 

My fiance? Or ex-wife? I assume you mean fiance.

 

He story when we started dating was initially that she met him on Tinder, met but just talked, and he became a cool friend to hang out with. As I pressed months later....well, they had made out, but just the one time. Met for drinks with others a few times after but just hung out and he became a friend. Texts every now and then to see how she's doing and she answers. Less and less with the passage of time. Use to be every 2-3 months...now I think it's likely been 6-8 months since last heard he texted.

 

So that's been her position on it. Since I saw the texts I think they support the idea that they were never anything serious and more just caught up at the bars a few times, but there is also more suggestive things to lead me to believe there was more than kissing.

 

Again, which I don't care about...that was before me, and the meeting at the bars was likely innocent and I would have understood still being married. The problem is having this guy still be a part of her life in some way when she altered the context of their relationship in telling me.

 

Anyway....no issue there other than he will be one of the people I have more questions about when we talk.

[elaine567]

Has she got back to you at all since the day you sent the email?

[Poutrew]

My fiance? Or ex-wife? I assume you mean fiance.

 

He story when we started dating was initially that she met him on Tinder, met but just talked, and he became a cool friend to hang out with. As I pressed months later....well, they had made out, but just the one time. Met for drinks with others a few times after but just hung out and he became a friend. Texts every now and then to see how she's doing and she answers. Less and less with the passage of time. Use to be every 2-3 months...now I think it's likely been 6-8 months since last heard he texted.

 

So that's been her position on it. Since I saw the texts I think they support the idea that they were never anything serious and more just caught up at the bars a few times, but there is also more suggestive things to lead me to believe there was more than kissing.

 

Again, which I don't care about...that was before me, and the meeting at the bars was likely innocent and I would have understood still being married. The problem is having this guy still be a part of her life in some way when she altered the context of their relationship in telling me.

 

Anyway....no issue there other than he will be one of the people I have more questions about when we talk.

 

Even though you say you don't really care about what they did because it was 'before' you, she is still trickle truthing you and that is disturbing. First they only met and talked, then they made out, and yes, if you press, she will eventually admit to more... but it's good you are able to get past that and just focus on the lies. Let me tell you it is a slippery slope. I know a guy who divorced his devastated wife because she lied to him about her virginity. He saved himself for religious reasons, and she told him she had done the same. He found out from a 'friend' who told him about all the sex they had before he had met her. So far as he knows, she had been a good wife, but he felt he couldn't trust her on anything. The last straw was seemingly silly: she went out shopping all day, and came home with just a single bag of groceries. He looked at the receipt which showed the stuff had been purchased 4 hours before she had come home, yet the milk was still ice cold. He had a melt down, accusing her of being at her bosses house, and how he thought they were having an affair. She denied, but he threw her azz out of the house and presented her with divorce papers the next week... this happened about 5 years ago, and to this day he maintains he did the right thing: She did remarry - her boss. And, she never did offer a good reason as to how the milk could stay so cold sitting 4 hours in the trunk of a hot car...Point is, starting a relationship off on a lie is never a good thing.

[BMI03]

Has she got back to you at all since the day you sent the email?

 

Ya, I sent it about a week ago now. Have been on a business trip since then but we have been texting as much as usual and face timing at night. She had texted during the day to say she had been making her way through the email (I can write some looooooong emails), and that she thinks it would be good for us to talk about some of her past romantic relationships, but that she wouldn't exactly call them 'romantic'. At this point she wouldn't have gotten to the part of the email where I told her I snooped. But I certainly expect she has since. I expect she will just let it sit until we are face to face Sunday night and bring it up through the week. I think she will be bothered by the snooping, but more disappointed that I felt the need to. Or, she knows it's a conversation she doesn't want to have to get into, so whether she has gone through the email or not, she may just not say anything unless I do. Anyway, we shall see.

[Bufo]

History is history. Nothing you or she can do anything about. But what I see is that she was a single woman on a mission. A mission to get married. You were. It immediately available due to your marital status. So she made the determination to continue on her mission. Thus the other men. Was it right to lie to you? No. But if you have found nothing indicating ongoing physical or emotional relationships from the time you became available and showed interest in a long term relationship with her, she closed those chapters for you.

 

Where was this evidence stored? Why was it stored? Those answers would be of interest. Wherever it was located , you need assurance that it wasn't the functional equivalent of the confirmed bachelor's little black book.

 

Think about what you need to get over your concerns. If she confesses is all suddenly fine and dandy? Think how you'll react immediately and over time if she confesses. You may be trading one internal problem for another.

Think beyond the lie. Look out for your own interests here. And consider that you may need some form of action from her. If you can't see yourself with her after her confession you may wish to reconsider marriage plans.

 

But remember that any future relationship you enter will have secrets and baggage. Yes, it presents a dilemma.

 

Finally, try for an explanation from her of why she chose to lie to you. My woman on a mission hypothesis may be incorrect. However she explains things, make sure the explanation makes sense.

[elaine567]

But what I see is that she was a single woman on a mission. A mission to get married. You were. It immediately (un)available due to your marital status. So she made the determination to continue on her mission. Thus the other men. Was it right to lie to you? No.

 

If she was a woman on a mission,

Was the OP then the top prize as she binned all others for him, or was he actually the only man left standing at the time?

[LoverofWrestling]

Why were you snooping in the first place? If I was in your fiancee's shoes and you admitted to me that you'd snooped, we'd be over.

 

Two wrong don't make a right, yes she did some pretty awful stuff but so did you.

[Superchicken]

Why were you snooping in the first place? If I was in your fiancee's shoes and you admitted to me that you'd snooped, we'd be over.

 

Two wrong don't make a right, yes she did some pretty awful stuff but so did you.

 

Using your analogy, there would be more deaths in this world if we didn't snoop !.

Get serious, and get sensible.

When one thinks the partner is doing something shifty, then, the need for closure MUST be fulfilled.

 

 

Yeah, two wrongs don't make a right. But, one action, has an opposite reaction.

So, they both cancel out !.

He has a right to do what he thinks he needs to resolve his situation.

He didn't have to screw someone to do it, and certainly didn't have to do anything immoral, yet she did.

Case Closed .

 

 

Ted.

[LoverofWrestling]

Sorry but snooping is never a good thing IMO. I would consider it very disrespectful if either my husband or I snooped and I strongly believe it would end our marriage. It would make it clear to me that he didn't trust me at all if he snooped and I'm sure the same would apply if I was the one who snooped.

[Overtaxed]

Using your analogy, there would be more deaths in this world if we didn't snoop !.

Get serious, and get sensible.

When one thinks the partner is doing something shifty, then, the need for closure MUST be fulfilled.

 

 

Yeah, two wrongs don't make a right. But, one action, has an opposite reaction.

So, they both cancel out !.

He has a right to do what he thinks he needs to resolve his situation.

He didn't have to screw someone to do it, and certainly didn't have to do anything immoral, yet she did.

Case Closed .

 

 

Ted.

 

Also, 2 wrongs of VERY different severity. Snooping might be a -1 "martial points" if the other spouse really isn't doing anything wrong. Sleeping with someone else, -100. So yeah, it's not right, and you shouldn't feel like you should do it. But if your suspicious, snoop. If you're wrong, apologize. If your right, then start figuring out the next right action.

 

I never snooped on my W's e-mails/phone, even when our marriage was hitting the rocks. Let me tell you something, I regret NOT doing it EVERYDAY now. I absolutely could have stopped it before it became a PA, and we would have had a EA to deal with that I'd probably be over by now and on the way to healing. One of my biggest regrets, honestly, is not looking earlier. It was right there, all the answers; here's why your marriage is falling apart. And I never looked. I doubt I'll ever forgive myself for it, we both now carry scars that were totally avoidable if I'D JUST F**KING LOOKED.

[BMI03]

Why were you snooping in the first place? If I was in your fiancee's shoes and you admitted to me that you'd snooped, we'd be over.

 

Two wrong don't make a right, yes she did some pretty awful stuff but so did you.

 

This was explained fully in an earlier post if you look back and read through. Thanks.

 

And no, I don't believe either of us did anything remotely awful at all. But that said, I do think we did things worth clearing up.