Question for those who have had/are having affairs

[spiderowl]

You've definitely given me some things to think about here. I do wonder if a WS is looking for something they are missing or just seeking 'more' of something they happen to enjoy. It is hard to tell. I guess the only way to tell is if they are willing to leave their partner. Only then can you know they were really looking to meet an important need.

[Overtaxed]

Something a lot of men ignore is that women will use sex to manipulate them. As awful as it may be, women are given the message, very early on, that they can use their sexuality ( for lack of a better term) to get men to do what they want.

You can see this right from the story of Helen of Troy ( who's face (euphemism?) launched a thousand ships) to today's female celebrities.

 

This being said, it is still is not an excuse for cheating.

 

It's awful that message is given, however, it's also entirely accurate so best not to bury our heads in the sand either.

 

Sex is THE primary "bargaining chip" that women use with men. It's the thing men most want from them, and women are typically ambivalent about it. Put another way, women have an excess of sex and men a shortage, in economic terms, women sell, we buy. And, because that "good" is so valuable to us, yes, women can and do leverage that to get the "best possible deal" for their sexuality. Could be marriage, could be a boyfriend or some other kind of commitment. Could be money (prostitute). Could be other goods (professional gold digger or trophy wife). That's just the way it works.

 

It's also why, for a man, a NSA relationship, a ONS or an A is so attractive to men. You're basically getting it for free. And it shows that the woman is so into you she'll give away what others have paid dearly for. It's a huge ego boost.

[somanymistakes]

There are so many women who want and enjoy sex, and the more they are told over and over again that they are wrong, dirty, disgusting, unwomanly for doing so, the more hung up they get. There are women who start intentionally hurting themselves during sex just to be SURE they don't enjoy it. And everyone loses.

 

It does no one any favors to pretend that women are all 'meh' about sex. This hurts women who want sex and it hurts men who want sex. No one wins here.

 

On average, is the male sex drive higher than the female one? Yeah. On average. People aren't averages.

 

Repeating the message to women that "sex is disgusting and you shouldn't want it, but you should use it to get men to do things for you, but you definitely shouldn't enjoy it" is not helping.

 

Also, there are plenty of women who can't bat their eyelashes, promise sex, and get everything handed to them on a platter. Even stereotypical Hot Chicks sometimes fail when they try this gambit (some guys are just amused by 'bimbos' trying to get free stuff from them by showing their boobs, laugh at them, and don't give away anything) and there are plenty of women in the world who are not Hot.

 

Do you know how much it sucks for the women posters who've come in here to complain that they can't get dates even in bars, when all anyone says is 'you're a woman it's easy for you'?

[darkbloom]

I think I fulfilled something he didn't know he could have. He said his relationship was good but he didn't know that relationships could be great.

[BluesPower]

I think I fulfilled something he didn't know he could have. He said his relationship was good but he didn't know that relationships could be great.

 

This is a good point..

 

I can vouch for this. I have had some really good relationships with some of my GF's and some were just about sex. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

 

But right now, R with new GF's really feels like a keeper and over all it is just so great.

[aileD]

 

But right now, R with new GF's really feels like a keeper and over all it is just so great.

 

Says everyone at the beginning of relationships. It's the chemicals talking. I'm happy for you. It why are you going to do to keep the relationship when the chemicals wear off? Do t have to answer but it's just something to think about

[Mrs. John Adams]

I certainly was not looking to cheat...i never ever thought about it...I was one of those people that swore it would never happen to me. I was very naive....I have never really been in a setting where cheating was even a possibility. I was a SAHM...very involved in church...and my husband and my children were my life.

 

I found myself in a situation that i had no previous experience with...and i was not equipped to handle it emotionally. I let my boundaries down...and I let myself become flattered and selfish. I found that once you move a boundary...it is easier to move the next one. Once you tell a lie...the next one comes easier....once you tell yourself its ok....it is ok.

 

The bottom line...why did i cheat...because i wanted to....because if i had not wanted to...I would not have. It is really that simple. It is ugly....but it is the truth.

 

No one made me cheat....I cheated because i wanted to....and now i live with that knowledge that i am capable of becoming this ugly...the rest of my life. I am capable of hurting the people i love and placing my own selfish wants above everyone else.

 

I cannot answer for everyone...becasue we are all different. I lacked for nothing in my marriage....sad isn't it.....

[TurningTables]

You've definitely given me some things to think about here. I do wonder if a WS is looking for something they are missing or just seeking 'more' of something they happen to enjoy. It is hard to tell. I guess the only way to tell is if they are willing to leave their partner. Only then can you know they were really looking to meet an important need.

 

Everyone is different. In my case, xMM didn't leave because of his special needs child. It was also about his identity as well. He once told me that if he divorced, he'd have to move away. On the outside, his wife presents them in a neat package tied up with bow; gushing on Fakebook and eating up the "likes" and comments. He'd look like a pig leaving her to everyone on the outside. Little did they know what was really going on. It's a shame to have to live such a life like that.

No one truly knows what goes on behind closed doors but we as society are so judgmental.

[Birdies]

Why did you seek an affair? Why not leave the marriage and seek what you needed instead?

 

I am not judging, just trying to understand.

 

Thanks

 

I didn't realize that what I had wasn't quite what I needed, until I had what I needed elsewhere. I thought my marriage was good, or good enough.

 

I know it sounds stupid, but remember that most people who have affairs were not purposely / consciously trying to do so. For most people, it sneaks up on you via the slippery slope. You don't wake up one day thinking, "Today I'm going to start an affair and fall in love with someone else."

[spiderowl]

I see what you mean Birdie, but surely a person must realise they are on a slippery slope and ask themselves why they are still sliding along it rather than jumping off?

[Birdies]

I see what you mean Birdie, but surely a person must realise they are on a slippery slope and ask themselves why they are still sliding along it rather than jumping off?

 

Yeah absolutely. I did constantly. I guess the answers were just that I was being selfish and compartmentalizing and justifying the unjustifiable ("my H doesn't even pay attention to me anyway", "I've asked him to make changes and he won't, so I deserve to be selfish too", "what he doesn't know can't hurt him", "this is only temporary", etc). Not saying those excuses are justified at all. I was just caught up in being selfish and trying to justify to myself.

[GeekLover]

I see what you mean Birdie, but surely a person must realise they are on a slippery slope and ask themselves why they are still sliding along it rather than jumping off?

 

Absolutely. I remember when xOM and I first started talking. I remember noticing the signs of what was happening between us, and I remember consciously making the decision to NOT stop it. I had the internal conversation with myself - "I'm on the road to an affair. I either need to stop this now, or say, 'f&$% it!' and see what happens."

 

For me, the temptation was too great to stop myself. At the time, I had been living in a marriage where I was neglected, ignored, and where I did absolutely EVERYTHING. We were roommates. He barely had sex and barely even slept together in the same bed. H and I both didn't know how to talk to each other, so things just spiralled. Meeting OM was a breath of fresh air for me. I was finally listened to, someone paid attention to me, and I could actually TALK to this man.

 

I remember justifying my choice - "I do everything around here. I give my kids 110%, do all the house work and never have anything for myself. THIS is going to be for ME."

 

Stupid? Yep. Selfish? You bet. But it is what it is now. I'm certainly not proud of my choices, but at the time, it was what I did to survive, given the tools I had (and lacked). H and I both acknowledge what went wrong in our relationship which lead to the A. We are on great terms and worked very hard in couple therapy to learn how to communicate.

 

Unfortunately, it still isn't enough to save the marriage, but we both know we have each other's backs going forward, and our kids will be safe, happy, and loved.

 

Whenever I feel ready to enter into another relationship, a big priority the new guy will need to meet will be that he is understanding, accepting and respectful of the relationship H and I have now.

Edited May 14, 2017 by GeekLover

[Overtaxed]

I certainly was not looking to cheat...i never ever thought about it...I was one of those people that swore it would never happen to me. I was very naive....I have never really been in a setting where cheating was even a possibility. I was a SAHM...very involved in church...and my husband and my children were my life.

 

I found myself in a situation that i had no previous experience with...and i was not equipped to handle it emotionally. I let my boundaries down...and I let myself become flattered and selfish. I found that once you move a boundary...it is easier to move the next one. Once you tell a lie...the next one comes easier....once you tell yourself its ok....it is ok.

 

The bottom line...why did i cheat...because i wanted to....because if i had not wanted to...I would not have. It is really that simple. It is ugly....but it is the truth.

 

No one made me cheat....I cheated because i wanted to....and now i live with that knowledge that i am capable of becoming this ugly...the rest of my life. I am capable of hurting the people i love and placing my own selfish wants above everyone else.

 

I cannot answer for everyone...becasue we are all different. I lacked for nothing in my marriage....sad isn't it.....

 

This is a perfect example of why, over and over, the BS has to repeat to themselves, "It's not me". Because it really isn't you. You could be the best W in the world, and your H still cheats. And vice versa. When the cheating comes out, in most cases, the cheater will try to make you jointly responsible for it (they all do), but, it's only to alleviate their guilt. There is nothing you can do to force anther person to cheat, just like there's nothing you can do to force them not to cheat. It's them, something in the them that either is a character flaw, a momentary lapse of judgement, or a overall lack of moral character. Determining the "why", why they felt justified in doing it, is an important part of R IMHO, even if the why is imaginary or not a "good" reason. The why for my W was "I didn't think you loved me". But that was something she forced herself to believe, she took all the "doesn't love me" stuff and weaved it together into a strong case that I didn't love her. But she left out all the "I'm the love of his life" stuff that went on during the same time period because, had she looked at it honestly, even at the worst of our M, it was obvious that I loved her and it would have been much harder for her to cheat. Cheaters make up stories to themselves to build up the cheating, the AP, and tear down their spouses; it's a psychological defense mechanism, dehumanizing the hurt party so that you don't empathize with their pain. Seems to happen in a whole lot of cheating that I read about here (and certainly in my W's A), especially when it's the W who's the WS.

 

Men that I know who cheat are typically more honest (with themselves, certainly not with their wives) with why they are doing it. They feel entitled to it, they want more sex, and this is the way they are going to get it. I never hear a cheating man tear down his wife other than to say "I wish she'd have sex with me". This is likely the reason that male A's are easier to recover from for a couple, the man doesn't seem to justify his actions by making his wife a monster, he typically looks at it as a flaw in himself ("I'm just too horny/demanding with sex") rather than a flaw in the marriage or his W.

 

All gross generalizations, there are plenty of threads with the situations reversed here, but I find that this narrative is true in a lot of the stories I read and in my personal life.

[Birdies]

This is a perfect example of why, over and over, the BS has to repeat to themselves, "It's not me". Because it really isn't you. You could be the best W in the world, and your H still cheats. And vice versa. When the cheating comes out, in most cases, the cheater will try to make you jointly responsible for it (they all do), but, it's only to alleviate their guilt. There is nothing you can do to force anther person to cheat, just like there's nothing you can do to force them not to cheat. It's them, something in the them that either is a character flaw, a momentary lapse of judgement, or a overall lack of moral character. Determining the "why", why they felt justified in doing it, is an important part of R IMHO, even if the why is imaginary or not a "good" reason. The why for my W was "I didn't think you loved me". But that was something she forced herself to believe, she took all the "doesn't love me" stuff and weaved it together into a strong case that I didn't love her. But she left out all the "I'm the love of his life" stuff that went on during the same time period because, had she looked at it honestly, even at the worst of our M, it was obvious that I loved her and it would have been much harder for her to cheat. Cheaters make up stories to themselves to build up the cheating, the AP, and tear down their spouses; it's a psychological defense mechanism, dehumanizing the hurt party so that you don't empathize with their pain. Seems to happen in a whole lot of cheating that I read about here (and certainly in my W's A), especially when it's the W who's the WS.

 

Men that I know who cheat are typically more honest (with themselves, certainly not with their wives) with why they are doing it. They feel entitled to it, they want more sex, and this is the way they are going to get it. I never hear a cheating man tear down his wife other than to say "I wish she'd have sex with me". This is likely the reason that male A's are easier to recover from for a couple, the man doesn't seem to justify his actions by making his wife a monster, he typically looks at it as a flaw in himself ("I'm just too horny/demanding with sex") rather than a flaw in the marriage or his W.

 

All gross generalizations, there are plenty of threads with the situations reversed here, but I find that this narrative is true in a lot of the stories I read and in my personal life.

 

Well, I think you're conflating basic differences between genders with some sort of moral superiority.

 

Generally speaking, men cheat because they are not getting enough sex / physical attention at home and have the opportunity to have it elsewhere. As in the example you give. Apparently this is a "good" reason and when the man admits it, he is being "honest".

 

Generally speaking, women cheat because they are feeling neglected, taken for granted, and unloved by their spouse. As in the example you give. Apparently this is an "imaginary, not good" reason that the woman is "forcing herself to believe".

 

Do you not see the incredible double standard here?

 

Also - cheating men RARELY say "I'm a bad horny man, it's my fault, it has nothing to do with my wife or marriage" ??!?... It's always about how if he was getting some tail at home, he wouldn't have to step out.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Birdies

[Overtaxed]

Well, I think you're conflating basic differences between genders with some sort of moral superiority.

 

Generally speaking, men cheat because they are not getting enough sex / physical attention at home and have the opportunity to have it elsewhere. As in the example you give. Apparently this is a "good" reason and when the man admits it, he is being "honest".

 

Generally speaking, women cheat because they are feeling neglected, taken for granted, and unloved by their spouse. As in the example you give. Apparently this is an "imaginary, not good" reason that the woman is "forcing herself to believe".

 

Do you not see the incredible double standard here?

 

Also - cheating men RARELY say "I'm a bad horny man, it's my fault, it has nothing to do with my wife or marriage" ??!?... It's always about how if he was getting some tail at home, he wouldn't have to step out.

 

No, you're misunderstanding me. First off, there are no good reasons to cheat. There are good reasons to divorce, but not cheat. I firmly believe that, and it does apply to both sexes.

 

What I was saying is that men who enter into an A do actually get what they are after; more sex/different sex/etc. Women typically enter into an A to get emotional closeness or validation from another man; but, thing is, it's very often fake. It's as if a man entering into an A only had sex with his AP by masturbating thinking about her. That's not really sex. And you just blew up your marriage for that? My argument isn't that men have a good reason, it's that men actually get what they came for (sex). Women often get lies; yes, the lies make them feel better, but they are lies, they are fake, and they don't actually mean anything. Look at the countless stories (and my W's also looks like this) of women on here who got into A's with men who "loved them" and then d-day comes, the man vaporizes. Or, no d-day, and the man just ghosts her. Or, the A continues and the woman starts to feel used. Because, in most cases, they ARE being used. They are trading sex (something real) for words without actions behind them. What most women get are conned, conned out of their fidelity, conned out of their marriage, and conned into a life of bitter resentment towards men.

 

If you enter into an A for sex, you're very likely going to get what you want. If you enter into it to find the love of your life, well, most of the time, you're not going to get what you want. I'm not saying that women are fools for doing it, I am saying that anyone entering into an A for "love" is a fool, and most of the time, are going to wind up much worse off for the wear and scarred from the experience of seeing how men really operate.

 

The woman isn't "forcing herself to believe" that her marriage is crappy. She is forcing herself to believe that her AP cares about her. Many times, he doesn't. And sometimes, men do the same thing, believe their female AP cares and she's only there for sex. But it's rare.

[wmacbride]

Warning, over the top generalization about the be given.

A thought and opinion I have, right or wrong.

 

Woman seek a man's love because in general, a man will give the best he has to offer to the one he loves the most. His time, resources, loyalty, his life.

Men are driven by love more than they know or realize.

 

Men seek a woman's respect because in general, a woman will give the best she has to offer to the one she respects the most. Her time, loyalty, faithfulness, commitment, desire, sex, and usually, eventually, her love.

Woman seem to be driven by who or what they respect the most more than they realize.

 

The opposite sexes instinctually respond and seek what seems to govern the behavior of the opposite sex.

From my limited male perspective, trying to avoid saying what I am about to say.

It seems like for some woman, they end up respecting and loving who they have sex with. They usually get around to stop having sex with who they do not love and respect.

 

I can't argue with what you say, but human behavior is based on a lot more than instinct.

 

Some people have been through serious ( and not so serious, but still troubling experiences, right from when they were a child.

 

For example, take the experience of being sexually abused or assaulted as a child or youth. According to the National Center for Victims of Crime , one in five girls and one in twenty boys will have been sexually abused. As an adult, those experiences may color their behavior as an adult, including whether or not they will be prone to having affairs. I've been fortunate enough to have never been in that position, but it's easy to see how much harm that could do to a person.

 

The same is true for other childhood factors, such as physical/emotional abuse, neglect, behavioral disorders in their parents, what they see in their parent's relationship, what they see in mass media when ti comes to marriage and romantic relationships, etc.

 

Add to this the host of external influences in a person's life such as their job, economic status, etc. and internal ones, such as mental illness, addictive personality type and the whole mess that can be a person's psyche , and the end result can be some really hurtful behavior.

 

I'm not dismissing instinct as a driver in human behavior, but I really do believe there is a whole lot of other factors as well.

 

We've all got psychological skeletons in our closets, and those affect our behavior.

[wmacbride]

Everyone is different. In my case, xMM didn't leave because of his special needs child. It was also about his identity as well. He once told me that if he divorced, he'd have to move away. On the outside, his wife presents them in a neat package tied up with bow; gushing on Fakebook and eating up the "likes" and comments. He'd look like a pig leaving her to everyone on the outside. Little did they know what was really going on. It's a shame to have to live such a life like that.

No one truly knows what goes on behind closed doors but we as society are so judgmental.

 

These two statements don't match up at all. You are judging her about what goes on behind closed doors.

[William]

Topic check:

 

Question for those who have had/are having affairs

 

People who are having/have had affairs are encouraged to share their experiences.

 

Why did you seek an affair?

Open ended question - why did you seek an affair?

 

Why not leave the marriage and seek what you needed instead?

 

The thread starter appears to be requesting experiences from married people, present or former, only, who have had or are having affairs.

 

Thanks in advance for your on-topic responses!

[TurningTables]

These two statements don't match up at all. You are judging her about what goes on behind closed doors.

 

 

Yes, they do actually. No, I do not know what was going on behind closed doors in his M. I only have what he told me. What he was telling me was the complete opposite of what she posted about and Ive known him for 20 years. I can contradict alot that has been said on this forum about my A ( I was married at the time too, only separated). Many BS want to say its only about sex. How do you explain then my xMM wanting anything I would give him for me to stay in his life? He wanted that emotional connection over anything else. I tend to think my A was not typical like many here have posted about. But if we as a society posts a bunch of stuff on social media, portraying one thing and then (shock) something happens, everyone judges that person in the wrong. Happens all the time.

What I am saying is, the OP's question doesn't have one set of right or wrong answers. There could be a million reasons why human beings do what they do. This site tends to generalize alot. Not everything fits in a box.

[Birdies]

No, you're misunderstanding me. First off, there are no good reasons to cheat. There are good reasons to divorce, but not cheat. I firmly believe that, and it does apply to both sexes.

 

What I was saying is that men who enter into an A do actually get what they are after; more sex/different sex/etc. Women typically enter into an A to get emotional closeness or validation from another man; but, thing is, it's very often fake. It's as if a man entering into an A only had sex with his AP by masturbating thinking about her. That's not really sex. And you just blew up your marriage for that? My argument isn't that men have a good reason, it's that men actually get what they came for (sex). Women often get lies; yes, the lies make them feel better, but they are lies, they are fake, and they don't actually mean anything. Look at the countless stories (and my W's also looks like this) of women on here who got into A's with men who "loved them" and then d-day comes, the man vaporizes. Or, no d-day, and the man just ghosts her. Or, the A continues and the woman starts to feel used. Because, in most cases, they ARE being used. They are trading sex (something real) for words without actions behind them. What most women get are conned, conned out of their fidelity, conned out of their marriage, and conned into a life of bitter resentment towards men.

 

If you enter into an A for sex, you're very likely going to get what you want. If you enter into it to find the love of your life, well, most of the time, you're not going to get what you want. I'm not saying that women are fools for doing it, I am saying that anyone entering into an A for "love" is a fool, and most of the time, are going to wind up much worse off for the wear and scarred from the experience of seeing how men really operate.

 

The woman isn't "forcing herself to believe" that her marriage is crappy. She is forcing herself to believe that her AP cares about her. Many times, he doesn't. And sometimes, men do the same thing, believe their female AP cares and she's only there for sex. But it's rare.

 

I see what you mean. But I don't think most women get into an affair to find the love of their life. I think they want the attention, the validation, the feeling that this guy really sees you and cares about you. And they often do get that feeling. But yes, more often than not, it was either faked by the guy to get sex, or it seems more special than it is due to the "fog".

[Mysterio]

From what I see around me. The girls are the ones that are pushing for marriage and kids. I think that the average guy could stay in the world of BF/GF. Its easy for them.

[spiderowl]

Thanks for such interesting thoughts on this. There does seem to be an emotional component to some affairs, a need to relate to someone. Does this mean the WS 'needs' that because it is lacking in their marriage or is it just a desire to experience a different person?

 

I suppose because there is often real emotional attachment, this is why people get drawn into an affair where they might not have entertained the idea in the past. Being physically attracted to someone is a bit different from getting to the stage where have become close friends and where each cares about the other. The circumstances might be 'wrong' but feelings are now complicating things.

Edited May 20, 2017 by spiderowl

[Lixxy]

Why did you seek an affair? Why not leave the marriage and seek what you needed instead?

 

I am not judging, just trying to understand.

 

Thanks

 

 

My "justification" (if you can call it that), was that I was an extremely passionate lover and all 3 of my male partners at the time of my cheating were lukewarm lovers, and during the course of my "cheating spree", all 3 men were satisfied with what they were getting from me. If they hadn't have known that I was seeing 2 other guys at the same time, they'd have lived in blissful ignorance.

 

I was in my early twenties, mentally ill (and with personality disorders which were undiagnosed at that time), and had no idea, and little care that what I was doing was immoral, because I wasn't getting my own needs met by one man so I somehow deemed it acceptable for me to "spread" my needs out over three men instead.

 

Messed up but honest.

[Ahurtgirl]

No one plans on having an affair. Just like when you are single and meet someone you really click well with. It just happens. I never thought I would ever have an affair and I literally hated people who I knew that had. Well, now I understand how that stuff happens and I fell in love (to me it really was love not just limerance) while married. You never see it coming and you suddenly realize there is this other person who fits into your life better than your spouse ever did and things get messy.

[QuietDan]

I can't argue with what you say, but human behavior is based on a lot more than instinct.

 

Some people have been through serious ( and not so serious, but still troubling experiences, right from when they were a child.

 

For example, take the experience of being sexually abused or assaulted as a child or youth. According to the National Center for Victims of Crime , one in five girls and one in twenty boys will have been sexually abused. As an adult, those experiences may color their behavior as an adult, including whether or not they will be prone to having affairs. I've been fortunate enough to have never been in that position, but it's easy to see how much harm that could do to a person.

 

The same is true for other childhood factors, such as physical/emotional abuse, neglect, behavioral disorders in their parents, what they see in their parent's relationship, what they see in mass media when ti comes to marriage and romantic relationships, etc.

 

Add to this the host of external influences in a person's life such as their job, economic status, etc. and internal ones, such as mental illness, addictive personality type and the whole mess that can be a person's psyche , and the end result can be some really hurtful behavior.

 

I'm not dismissing instinct as a driver in human behavior, but I really do believe there is a whole lot of other factors as well.

 

We've all got psychological skeletons in our closets, and those affect our behavior.

 

Well, you managed to check off a lot the issues that have complicated the relationship between me and my wife in our marraige. Known, suspected, unknown issues. We've had a number of relationship stressors. Transparent emotional intimacy and effective communication were early casualties. Two really damaged somewhat disfunctional stubborn people. A bit if codepenecy, border line personalities, significant amount of OCD with both,...

Plus a few other letters in the alphabet soup. Throw in two significant differences with sex drive...

Other factors, Childhood traumas... Death of a close parent during the formative years.

Between me and my wife, we can easily put a check by at least 3/4 if the items you listed, plus a few others not mentioned.