Really struggling...could do with some and just someone to listen

[40somethingGuy]

let him who is without sin cast the first stone

 

What a cowardly response. You didn't just sin, you didn't just make a mistake. You CHOSE TO BE A LIAR AND CARRY ON A DOUBLE LIFE FOR 4 YEARS. Are you looking for people to tell you that what you did was fine? You wanna go biblical that's fine. Take your ass to confession. You are disgusting and committed mortal sins for 4 long years. There is nothing true about you and I feel for your poor wife being married to a big lie.

[ChickiePops]

My thoughts coming from someone that is still a MOW

 

 

1) How long does it take to get over someone who you've had had an affair with for 4 years? We work in the same place and it can sometimes feel really hard when i see her at work. I don't know how to behave and i don't know how long this will continue for.

 

 

I imagine while you still work together it will be very difficult to not have an emotional attachment to exOW. the key here would be for one of you to remove yourself from the situation. As you cant control her then it would be for you to find a new job. Part of you won't want that because then you will not see her anymore, but it will be the only way to get over her by having complete NC. While you don't want to get over her there is no time that will happen that will mean you are over her. It may never be done unless you want it to be and work towards that.

 

 

 

 

2) Should i confess all to my wife? how do i stop myself from falling into the same trap again

 

 

Before you confess think about why you are doing it and if it is the right thing to do. What do you hope to achieve by telling her? Yes of course it will hurt her, but do you think she will leave you? Maybe that's what you want or don't want. I am a believer in that you chose to keep this secret for 4 years, you may have chosen for the affair to be over but there is no need to share it unless you have good reason to. The guilt is something you now have to take to your grave. Only tell her if you absolutely 100% believe that you wouldn't be able to reconcile unless you have told her. I know there are a lot of people here that will say you can't have full reconciliation unless you tell her but I don't agree with that.

 

 

 

 

3) Not that it should matter to me but it may give me some comfort in my confused lost state...do you think my affair partner would be able to continue with her unsuspecting boyfriend (who she has now known/dated for more than half her life - 17 years). For me this would be comforting because i would somehow feel that she had chosen me over him.

 

 

Yes, I do believe that she will be able to continue. Her past behaviour says she was able to continue because she has never chosen to leave. So chances are she will continue in that state with him unless something changes. Now that you are gone, it will give her time to decide what she really and truly wants and that may be to be with him or to find a new path without him. The one absolute she now knows is that the future won't be with you, whether with him or not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

4) How easy or difficult would it be for her to leave him (because he clearly hasn't given her the things she desires most ..marriage/children so

far) to date someone new?

 

 

 

Ending any long term marriage is difficult. She may not have marriage and children but without knowing how dependant they are on one another, if she is scared of being alone, if her relationship is actually relatively good or not, we can't say what the possibilities of her reconciling this relationship are and even if it is easy or difficult with confidence after an A you can say both paths of staying or going are hard to face when making a decision.

 

 

 

 

My question for you is this - if it went on for 4 years and you truly had feelings for her, why didn't you leave? To me, being in an A tells me something is missing from the primary marriage, and now the affair is over you will have to think about whether you can stay in that marriage or not for the rest of your life. But is there a reason you didn't leave to pursue a life with her other than the kids? To me, the kids is just excuses, not the reason to stay in the marriage.

 

So wait..just to make sure we all understand..you are a woman who's married to a woman but you're cheating with a man. Is that correct? Or are you cheating with another woman? Because you keep going back and forth in your posts between saying MM and OW...

[Chica80]

 

Approximately 4 years ago, i started experiencing feelings of extreme boredom and start looking for excitement. I guess i was experiencing a mid-life crisis. It was at that time i started receiving some attention from a girl at work who was 11 years younger and unmarried. Interestingly however she was in a relationship with a guy who she had dated since the age of 16. Although she had broken up with him for a couple of years during the 13 years she had been back with him for 2 years before she met me. I was flattered and knew of her interest. I was honest and told her that i was married but both of us started seeing more of each other and embarked on a passionate affair. Approximately 3 months into the relationship, my wife discovered an email which i had sent to this girl in which i was declaring my love to her. When she confronted me, i managed to convince her that i had been bored and flattered by this girl and therefore had sent her the email but was not having an affair with her. My wife was extremely hurt but believed my excuse and this was extremely painful for me to see. I also developed a new found respect for her (Wife) because of the way she handled the situation. In someways she changed from then on and our relationship became more loving.

 

Nevertheless i kept my affair going with this other girl. After a couple of years, i started becoming more and more paranoid and we restricted to having sex only 2 or 3 times per year but we would still text and talk almost daily. This made me feel more comfortable because i was not having physical sex anymore (apart from 1-2x year) but i was still very emotionally attached. This girl was even more emotionally attached and often asked me to run away with her. Although she was very attached to her boyfriend she often told me that she would be willing to leave him for me. However by this time i was beginning to realise that i loved my wife and my kids and i could never leave them and so we continued as we were - chatting on the phone, sexting and occasionally meeting up for a cuddle and sex.

 

I became more and more unhappy about the affair continuing but somewhere somehow did not feel strong enough to end it. On a few occasions my affair partner tried to end it, her resolve lasted only a few days before she started texting me again and things would take off from where they left off. I wished that somehow my affair partner would just turn around end it and that would mean that i'd have no choice and the decision would have been made for me.

 

 

 

As i say - i am not proud of what i did and i genuinely will try my best never to fall in this trap again but it would comfort me greatly if someone could help answer some of my questions without being too hard on me

 

OP the bolded phrases are what stick out to me the most.

 

You had a chance to end the A very early on, but chose not to. You continued.

You felt less guilty because it was not physical yet she was very much a part of your everyday life.

 

A happen for many reasons...they are different and we are different. You say you love your wife and children and you didn't want to be in A anymore...yet you stayed. You waited until your AP ended it so you wouldn't have to make a choice. Are you always so conflict avoidant?

 

You seemed to create two very different sets of intimacy. Emotional with one. Love and family, sex with another. Yet not truly committed to either one. So no one truly gets a whole part of you only pieces.

Some parts for OW. Some parts for Wife, some parts for kids.....yet not a whole part of you.

 

I think if you love your wife and want to make it work, you can not do that without being honest. And then it will be up to her if she wants to forgive you or not. Although that seems to work out best for you not having to make any decisions (not meant judgemental).

 

No matter what you need to get into IC.. because the root of your problem it seems was not your marriage, but it's you.

 

Why did you start this?...boredom is not a real answer

Why did you choose to lie and deceive the person you say you love?

Why did you let it go on so long?

And ultimately why didn't you choose to end it?

[Mr. Lucky]

Before you confess think about why you are doing it and if it is the right thing to do. What do you hope to achieve by telling her? Yes of course it will hurt her, but do you think she will leave you? Maybe that's what you want or don't want. I am a believer in that you chose to keep this secret for 4 years, you may have chosen for the affair to be over but there is no need to share it unless you have good reason to. The guilt is something you now have to take to your grave. Only tell her if you absolutely 100% believe that you wouldn't be able to reconcile unless you have told her. I know there are a lot of people here that will say you can't have full reconciliation unless you tell her but I don't agree with that.

 

I'm always confused by this line of reasoning. "Right thing to do", "hope to achieve" and "you have a good reason to" only apply to the WS. You're advising him to protect his BS - out of love? - by continuing to injure.

 

Doesn't add up...

 

Mr. Lucky

[merrmeade]

1. It takes 2x the length of an affair to get over someone (so it has been said and so I have lived). Plus you see her, so that means 8 years or never.

I've never heard this statistic. Where does it come from?

[usernameisvalid]

You will get some brutal advice. Many of those will come from BS or people that feel like they are a moral authority.

 

Don't listen.. do what is best for YOU and your marriage!

 

I had an affair for 3 years.

Similar story where OW wanted more and I could not do that to my family.

 

To answer your questions..

 

1. How long depends on you. NO CONTACT is key.. the feeling and emotions connection will whane over time. I am NC 7 months and although I still think of her every now and then it's not so emotional and traumatic. More like a distant memory. (Of course your mileage may vary)

 

2. Should you tell your wife.. depends, are you unhappy in your marriage and is there nothing that you can do to improve it. I have not told my wife and don't intend to since my marriage was and is good. Why would I want to destroy it now after the fact! And trust me.. by you telling her the marriage is not going to get better.

 

3 and 4. Who cares. See point#1. You have to stop taking to her and get your mind off her. Otherwise you don't heal and move on. If you can't get to that stage then consider telling your wife and deal with consequences.

 

Good luck man.. It's not easy and you will have good days and very bad days but it will get better!

 

Can a marriage in which one of you is having an affair really be called good?

[katielee]

pample - I'm a former WW. If you want to live an authentic life and also WANT THAT FOR YOUR WIFE, allow her to make a choice - tell her.

These folks who are ok keeping their BS in the dark well, how very controlling of them.

[Ahurtgirl]

If you're in a decent marriage, I'd say do not tell your wife, especially since it is on the past and you do not intend to cheat again. My xMM wife would have preferred to have not of known and was irritated by the fact of it being disclosed to her. She would have preferred to live in ignorant bliss. Why hurt your wife by telling her. She may prefer to no know.

[Mr. Lucky]

Why hurt your wife by telling her. She may prefer to no know.

 

How would the OP make this assessment ???

 

Anything other than disclosure just adds insult to injury. You don't get to decide for someone else whether they wanted to unknowingly be in an open marriage for the last 4 years...

 

Mr. Lucky

Edited October 25, 2016 by Mr. Lucky

[MidnightBlue1980]

I've never heard this statistic. Where does it come from?

 

I think I read here on LS in a few places.

 

Obviously I have not taken a poll so who really knows. It fit for me.

[ChickiePops]

If you're in a decent marriage, I'd say do not tell your wife, especially since it is on the past and you do not intend to cheat again. My xMM wife would have preferred to have not of known and was irritated by the fact of it being disclosed to her. She would have preferred to live in ignorant bliss. Why hurt your wife by telling her. She may prefer to no know.

 

How does he find out if she'd prefer not to know unless he tells her though?

 

Telling his wife is not what will hurt her..the fact that he is a sneaky, cheating liar is what will hurt her. If you don't want to hurt anyone, don't get involved in an affair!

[Betrayed&Stayed]

If you're in a decent marriage.....

 

I'm 99% sure that his wife would not describe a marriage that involves a 4 year affair as a "decent marriage".

 

As always the line of 'tell' versus 'don't tell' is delineated by cheaters and non-cheaters.

[howtogoon2016]

So wait..just to make sure we all understand..you are a woman who's married to a woman but you're cheating with a man. Is that correct? Or are you cheating with another woman? Because you keep going back and forth in your posts between saying MM and OW...

 

I am MW with a MM. I am M to a man and with a MM.

 

 

When I am talking about OW and so on in this thread I am responding to the original poster who is a MM with an OW

[merrmeade]

Does this mean - for those who feel the betrayed spouse should not be told - that you do not believe...

-that spouses have an inherent right to know what their partners are doing?

-that being trustworthy is important in a marriage?

-that they each have a right to expect honesty?

-that lying by omission is disrespectful?

[Confused9999]

Can a marriage in which one of you is having an affair really be called good?

 

 

Thats subjective. Many men have affairs and still have a good marriage.

It's been discussed many times on this forum and different articles and studies that men, unlike women, don't necessarily get into affairs because something is necessarily wrong their marriage.

 

The point I making is that if he had the affair for 4 years and his wife did not catch him unless he is ready to destroy his marriage or cannot live with the guilt then there is no good reason to expose himself now.

I cannot possibility see his wife staying to work it out after a 4 year affair!

[Cloudcuckoo]

Thats subjective. Many men have affairs and still have a good marriage.

It's been discussed many times on this forum and different articles and studies that men, unlike women, don't necessarily get into affairs because something is necessarily wrong their marriage.

 

The point I making is that if he had the affair for 4 years and his wife did not catch him unless he is ready to destroy his marriage or cannot live with the guilt then there is no good reason to expose himself now.

I cannot possibility see his wife staying to work it out after a 4 year affair!

 

What utter tosh...

 

I'm a wife who DID stay after my own husband's 4 year affair. Contributing factors in its longevity were distance, (his concubine lived 360 miles from our home), and logistics (he was working away from home for 3months on and 3 off, so the only time he actually saw his girlfriend was on the way to and from the airport he used for travel). Her home was conveniently close to the airport.

 

I say this often..it's not a question of the wayward not GETTING enough, they are not GIVING enough.

 

I had invested over 20 years in what i thought was an essentially good marriage, and I was not prepared to throw all that down the pan without at least seeing if there was anything that could be salvaged out of the ashes.

 

We are still together years after that train wreck because HONESTY is the backbone of a healthy dynamic in any relationship.

 

keeping secrets from someone you say you love is nothing short of a disaster waiting to happen as most of us know.

 

Don't tell his wife?? No Phoenix to rise out of those ashes and hen....

[l8estnews]

let him who is without sin cast the first stone

 

I am not going to throw you stones because I am a sinner as well. I'll just throw bricks at you since it has the same effect anyway.

 

Pample, take the rage of the people here in a different perspective. These people are very mad at what you have done. And we are not even related nor know you personally. Just imagine what your wife will feel when she discovers this.

 

You already know what you need to do. All you need to have now is that courage for you to correct your mistakes and face the consequences of it all. And courage isn't something that we can give you, apparently.

 

This is all on you.

[merrmeade]

Pamplemousse,

The outrage you're reading has a purpose. It may be hard for you to see, as you feel judged and blasted for being bad. It's clear that you have not considered that your affair took anything away from your marriage or from your wife. Like nearly all WSs, you think she's protected by not knowing. But if you'll look on some websites dedicated to infidelity or read about it and then take time to reflect deeply on your marriage during the affair, you might begin to realize that you've been taking away from your wife and marriage for a long time.

 

Following are points that I've collected in my notes about why the betrayed spouse needs to be told:

- the energy and time expended on hiding & having the affair was energy/time taken from the marriage and family;

-not revealing the affair is accepting a marriage based on dishonesty and deceit;

- keeping secrets is still continuing to lie by omission;

- marriages are based on openness (affairs, on secrets), and without it they begin to unravel;

-you have no right to decide what your wife does or does not want to know, should or should not know by controlling her choices or never even giving them to her;

- your wife shouldn’t have to stay with you out of ignorance and presume you've been loyal;

-data indicates the cheating will happen again;

- if she finds out later, everything good you've done between the affair & her discovery will be lost because she can't trust you and will doubt everything.

Edited October 26, 2016 by merrmeade

[wmacbride]

Pamplemousse,

The outrage you're reading has a purpose. It may be hard for you to see, as you feel judged and blasted for being bad. It's clear that you have not considered that your affair took anything away from your marriage or from your wife. Like nearly all WSs, you think she's protected by not knowing. But if you'll look on some websites dedicated to infidelity or read about it and then take time to reflect deeply on your marriage during the affair, you might begin to realize that you've been taking away from your wife and marriage for a long time.

 

Following are points that I've collected in my notes about why the betrayed spouse needs to be told:

- the energy and time expended on hiding & having the affair was energy/time taken from the marriage and family;

-not revealing the affair is accepting a marriage based on dishonesty and deceit;

- keeping secrets is still continuing to lie by omission;

- marriages are based on openness (affairs, on secrets), and without it they begin to unravel;

-you have no right to decide what your wife does or does not want to know, should or should not know by controlling her choices or never even giving them to her;

- your wife shouldn’t have to stay with you out of ignorance and presume you've been loyal;

-data indicates the cheating will happen again;

- if she finds out later, everything good you've done between the affair & her discovery will be lost because she can't trust you and will doubt everything.

 

Add to the list that a lot of ws take out their feelings of guilt over cheating, of grief that the A is over, etc.on their bs. They snap at them, are short tempered, distant, cold, etc.

 

In effect, the bs ends up being punished for the behavior of the ws and doesn't know why. The ws doesn't usually see what they are doing, and the bs ends up feeling like they did something wrong, but doesn't know what it is. The ws pats him or herself on the back for keeping the secret and not hurting their bs, when they have done nothing but.

 

It's a cruel game to play with her mind and heart.

 

I'm not going to lie to you and say that being honest with her will be easy. It won't. It's going to be incredibly difficult, and it may mean the end of your marriage. Conversely, it may mean the start of a long but rewarding journey to a marriage that is so much better because it will have the elements that has been missing for a long time-honesty and two people who are "all in" and completely invested in making it work.

 

My former ws had an A more than seven years ago, and while the read forward after that was bumpy and very difficult at times,it has been well worth it. Our kids are happy, we love each other, and there have been so many good things that I don't think could ever have happened if he hadn't been honest. I think a big part of that was, once I knew the truth and decided that staying M is what I wanted, we could, as a unified team, plan the steps forward. He could have my full support and understanding in the work he needed to do on himself to get to a better place, and we could do the work on our marriage, again as a team.

 

In a nutshell, think of it this way. Five years down the road, where can you picture yourself and your M if you keep the lie going, and where can you picture yourself and your M if you are honest?

 

btw, don't count on your A never being discovered. You can't trust anyone, especially your former ow,to keep things quiet. If your W fins out from anyone else but you, she will likely never, ever be able to trust you again.

Edited October 26, 2016 by wmacbride

[katielee]

I cannot possibility see his wife staying to work it out after a 4 year affair!

 

I can't either. But shouldn't she be given that choice?

[cocorico]

 

Should i confess all to my wife? how do i stop myself from falling into the same trap again

 

 

Grapefruit, you've had a variety of views on this, and probably don't want or need another, but here's mine.

 

I think you should disclose the full extend of your A to your W.

 

I'm a fOW, happily M to my fMM for several years. I haven't "cheated", nor have I ever been betrayed in a R AFAIK. I can't speak as a WS, or as a BS, just as someone who is married, who has been up close to infidelity.

 

I can't say "your BW would want to know" - many fBW on here say they would, others (fewer) say they wish they hadn't, and I don't know your BW to know which she would prefer. None of us do - You are the only one who knows her, and due to a conflict of interest in this, you are not well-placed to make that call either. So I'm not saying "disclose to your BW" for your W.

 

I'm saying it for you. You said you garnered "a newfound respect" for her, for the way she handled your mini-DDay. It clearly matters to you that you respect her. If you want to respect her, treat her with respect - and don't withhold this information from her. Something this big - when you've previously lied, denied and minimised - will fester. You cannot treat her like a child, making decisions on her behalf without her knowledge, and expect that will lead to respect for her. It will undermine the respect you claim to have found for her - though continuing the A has already done that. You ask how you can avoid "falling into the same trap again". This is one way. Allow your W agency, treat her with respect. Engage with her adult to adult rather than parent to child.

 

But also - You state boredom led to your A. If you live authentically, you won't get bored. Boredom creeps in when you become disengaged and emotionally disinvested. To live authentically, you cannot allow a fake "happy" marriage riven with a huge secret to occupy centre stage. You need to reforge your M as a truly authentic, happy or otherwise, marriage, where you are both fully engaged and emotionally invested. Otherwise you're just treading water until you fall into "the same trap" again.

[ChickiePops]

I am MW with a MM. I am M to a man and with a MM.

 

 

When I am talking about OW and so on in this thread I am responding to the original poster who is a MM with an OW

 

You've also said 'my wife'. Thank you for clearing up the confusion.

[MidnightBlue1980]

 

But also - You state boredom led to your A. If you live authentically, you won't get bored. Boredom creeps in when you become disengaged and emotionally disinvested. To live authentically, you cannot allow a fake "happy" marriage riven with a huge secret to occupy centre stage. You need to reforge your M as a truly authentic, happy or otherwise, marriage, where you are both fully engaged and emotionally invested. Otherwise you're just treading water until you fall into "the same trap" again.

 

This is 100% true and the only way to save a marriage. A one night stand is one thing but a 4 year affair is another. You need to recreate the whole marriage, the old one obviously did not work. That is what I did and it is working.

[merrmeade]

One more thing and this is HUGE; I don't know the odds, but I think marriages can and do get worse afrer affairs because of all the things listed - even when the bs doesn't know. THIS HAPPENED TO ME. My WH hid more than one affair from me over the years. Our marriage, as it was before I found out, was spiraling downward and would not have survived. The reason it was bad I did not know then. Now we both do. He confessed everything (?), life was hell for a couple of years and now it's gradually eclipsed anything we'd achieved before.

 

So don't assume it'll go back to what it was or you'll make it better. Assume

[BluesPower]

I think M is right, after everything is out in the open, it can get better.

 

Once my wife got sober, and she knew everything that I had done, and I of course new everything that she had done, I just don't know, it is better somehow.

 

I don't know if it will be forever, but I hope it will, only time will tell.