How would you describe this behavior?

[spiderowl]

I found when I dated someone who didn't have kids that he didn't understand my obligations either. When my son didn't come back one evening and I rang him and he was stuck at a bus stop and didn't know where, I decided I had to go and find him. Boyfriend was cross and was going to read him the 'riot act' - for getting lost? I felt then that he didn't have a clue about parental responsibilities or caring for a child.

 

I can see that you have little time and that your boyfriend is feeling pushed out. You have so much on that you are 'just getting by'. It's clear he's not going to be the kind of boyfriend who is happy just to fit in and be part of it all. He wants a lot more of your attention. If you can't give him more, then be prepared for him to leave. Your lifestyles are just not compatible.

[stillyoung]

..I hate the sulking. It is 4 year old stuff. You end up doing things to appease and not from a place of genuine wanting to, because you're guilted into it.

 

I've tried to have talks with him, partly because i do think i can try harder to make more time for him. I realize I get too wrapped up in the kids, out of habit.

 

But if he beats me to it and whines, or bean counts ( you didnt answer my call three times), then i resent having to go, oh i'm so sorry because he expects it now, rather than because i wanted to. Exactly like you said. I would be humiliated if someone only called me out of guilt. I can't get that across to him though.

[Arieswoman]

OP,

 

I agree with this from hestheone post #25

 

He wants to be taken care of like one of your children. I had an ex Like this for 12 years. Needy behaviour is a turn off. I hate the sulking. It is 4 year old stuff. You end up doing things to appease and not from a place of genuine wanting to, because you're guilted into it.

As a mom he's tapping into your maternal guilt. Eventually your sex life will suffer as the attraction will be gone. I don't think you guys are compatible. Have an adult discussion saying you will only allow him to be in relationship if open communication is the norm.

 

I also had an ex like this ^^.

 

It sounds to me that this guy is passive/aggressive and controlling, and that doesn't bode well.

 

Sorry x

[Poutrew]

This is one of the reasons I wont date moms. I'm just not into the Brady Bunch thing... For what it's worth, your kids come first. They can't take care of themselves, and by definition, are needy and totally dependent on you. Your BF resents all the attention you heap on the kiddies, and becomes resentful, and over time, that breeds hypersensitivity - eventually that escalates to him standing over your shoulder with a timer, and pushing you into changing those diapers faster. Faster! Faster! The same process is also working in you - you get resentful that he can't see why you spend your time doing what you do, and that breeds hypersensitivity on your part. Hypersensitivity is the fuel for your arguments.

 

If neither of you really are listening to the other or willing to make accommodations for each other then your relationship is already too far gone, and can't be salvaged. In the end you do need to do what is best for you and your kids, and it will probably be without this particular person... sorry.

[stillyoung]

Thanks everyone for their comments. I realize i could be giving more attention and i can try to work on it.

But here is the current update. There has been about 5 days of basically no contact. I called 2 days after the incident (described in initial posts) but he said he was too mad to talk. So nothing until this morning, when i get an email as if nothing happened. He attached an article about how time together is important, etc.

Now i actually agree with pretty much everything the article says, but the fact that i got the pouting and silent treatment yet again makes it very difficult to have a normal conversation about it. I don't know how to respond. I want to say yes i see your point. But i don't want him to think it was because he "made his point" with silence, sulking, etc. Any advice?

[Mr. Lucky]

But i don't want him to think it was because he "made his point" with silence, sulking, etc. Any advice?

 

Yes. Start asking yourself this question:

 

Have you thought about what would happen were he unable to change?

 

Mr. Lucky

[stillyoung]

Well, yes, ive thought that if he is unable (or doesnt want) to change that dynamic, i can't endure it long term. I'm embarassed to tell my friends what is going on if he doesn't show up for some event or whatever. I'm uncomfortable that i feel embarassed of a grown up's behavior.

 

I was hoping that if i can bring this behavior to his attention, he will also realize it is immature. He got attached/married very young so i thought the dynamics were from then and got kind of frozen in time. I kind of acted like that in earlier relationships myself but learned quickly that it did not go over well, through a painful breakup. I was hoping he would come to the same conclusion. My mistake was probably tolerating it so long.

[Mr. Lucky]

I kind of acted like that in earlier relationships myself but learned quickly that it did not go over well, through a painful breakup. I was hoping he would come to the same conclusion. My mistake was probably tolerating it so long.

 

Do you think he has a clear understanding about how you feel? Somewhat ironic that you'd have to wait out 5 days of NC to talk to him about his tendency to shut down...

 

Mr. Lucky

[stillyoung]

Clear understanding, no, not at all. He thinks the best way to get someone to understand how he feels is to do the same thing back. Either to make a point ( I felt bad with 5 days of NC, see, now i should understand how he feels when i don't give him the attention he wants.) or out of spite, or well i deserved it since i ignored him.

 

Or he justifies it some other way. Once we were walking into a luncheon and he made a joke about someone, and i said oh make sure you don't say that in front of so-and-so. He got real offended, how could i think he would do such a thing, then spent the next 45 min in another room by himself. He later said he just wanted to leave me alone to chit chat with my friends (all of whom kept asking, where was he). He saw nothing wrong with that and i apparently couldn't explain.

 

So no, he doesn't seem to see i don't like the pouting. He just thinks I'm too sensitive and should get over it.

[Mr. Lucky]

Perhaps a written explanation would be easier for him to understand and accept. It's certainly not the behavior I'd want modeled for my kids on any kind of regular basis...

 

Mr. Lucky

[pteromom]

How would I describe that behavior?

 

Childish.

and

Selfish.

 

Of course a single mom is going to prioritize her kids. Any guy who gets involved with a single mom should expect that.

 

Rather than sulk and pout like a baby, maybe he should ask you what he can help you with so that you can have more time with him when you are done?

[pteromom]

Clear understanding, no, not at all. He thinks the best way to get someone to understand how he feels is to do the same thing back. Either to make a point ( I felt bad with 5 days of NC, see, now i should understand how he feels when i don't give him the attention he wants.) or out of spite, or well i deserved it since i ignored him.

 

Or he justifies it some other way. Once we were walking into a luncheon and he made a joke about someone, and i said oh make sure you don't say that in front of so-and-so. He got real offended, how could i think he would do such a thing, then spent the next 45 min in another room by himself. He later said he just wanted to leave me alone to chit chat with my friends (all of whom kept asking, where was he). He saw nothing wrong with that and i apparently couldn't explain.

 

So no, he doesn't seem to see i don't like the pouting. He just thinks I'm too sensitive and should get over it.

 

I would not marry this one. He doesn't have the emotional intelligence to build a happy marriage with. Just my opinion...

[hestheone66]

He is playing headgames to keep attention on him, even negative. It is the same as my previously mentioned ex. I used to accommodate his sulky mood swings and accusatory glares, and the silent treatment. He also would reach out as your boy has with some way to start the conversation, but without apologising. He thought all our problems were my fault (not giving him completely focussed attention) because of my children's normal needs to meet. I once out-silence treatment him...we went 9 weeks without an utterance. Yes we lived together. The silence allowed me to evaluate the ****ty situation I was addicted to.. My advice..don't cave. You deserve a healthy relationship, especially as you have impressionable children.

I still think it's telling that you don't speak about loving feelings for him. Maybe you don't want to be alone, trust me, it's way better than the madness you have with your manchild who completely lacks self awareness. Good luck.

[266696687]

His behaviour is totally unacceptable.

 

I don't believe anyone would be able to meet his 'needs'. He wants your constant undivided attention when he doesn't get it he pouts and punishes you with the silent treatment.

 

He is behaving and appears to have the emotional maturity of a child. Something which certainly doesn't bode well for a long term relationship / marriage. It's certainly not a relationship trait you should want him passing on to your children.

 

The silent treatment he is using is to manipulate you into getting his way. If you don't comply or chase after him he'll punish you by 'making a point' to get his disappointment in you across.

 

This is one of the worst type of behavior and chances are this is who he is and won't / can't change.

 

Silent treatment in the way you describe counts as a form of mental abuse. You should check out the below page:

 

Silent abuse ? The mind game by Teresa Cooper | No 2 Abuse

 

Have a read and see if it fits your circumstances and relationship with your boyfriend particularly as this silent treatment is a regular occurrence in your relationship.

Edited May 17, 2016 by 266696687

[WasOtherWoman]

You know, i am starting to think if it wasn't the kids you were focusing on, it would be something else. Giving you the benefit of the doubt that you do not just focus on all of those things and not on him at all, really, his behavior is ridiculous. Do you really need another child? People don't really change, they can modify, but this sounds like a personality trait with him.

 

Honestly, if it were me, I would write him off. You can just expect more of the same.. who needs it?

[stillyoung]

He is playing headgames to keep attention on him, even negative. It is the same as my previously mentioned ex. I used to accommodate his sulky mood swings and accusatory glares, and the silent treatment. He also would reach out as your boy has with some way to start the conversation, but without apologising. He thought all our problems were my fault (not giving him completely focussed attention) because of my children's normal needs to meet. I once out-silence treatment him...we went 9 weeks without an utterance. Yes we lived together. The silence allowed me to evaluate the ****ty situation I was addicted to.. My advice..don't cave. You deserve a healthy relationship, especially as you have impressionable children.

I still think it's telling that you don't speak about loving feelings for him. Maybe you don't want to be alone, trust me, it's way better than the madness you have with your manchild who completely lacks self awareness. Good luck.

 

I think it's funny that you call him "my boy".... He does do the silent treatment but it's only part of the trying to get attention thing. Luckily it's not as bad as the article member 266696687 posted.

 

 

I do love him and care for him a great deal. But some of this type of behavior kills off some of that feeling. It's almost like losing respect for a person. I don't really know what I feel anymore, but if the "original" him would return, without all the manipulative crap, I would really want to be with him. I really liked him and enjoyed his company, conversation, sense of humor, his values (loyal friend, not materialistic, etc.) over the years in the same circle of friends. Somehow dating put the needy expectations on me whereas as friends they weren't there.

 

 

I should have seen that as a sign of neediness, but he just said he was real sure of what he wanted and that was to marry me (we knew each other for years before we dated.)

 

 

So your guy just never got the point and never changed? Another poster said she put her foot down and he stopped the immaturity. I was hoping that could happen.

[266696687]

I think it's funny that you call him "my boy".... He does do the silent treatment but it's only part of the trying to get attention thing. Luckily it's not as bad as the article member 266696687 posted.

 

 

I do love him and care for him a great deal. But some of this type of behavior kills off some of that feeling. It's almost like losing respect for a person. I don't really know what I feel anymore, but if the "original" him would return, without all the manipulative crap, I would really want to be with him. I really liked him and enjoyed his company, conversation, sense of humor, his values (loyal friend, not materialistic, etc.) over the years in the same circle of friends. Somehow dating put the needy expectations on me whereas as friends they weren't there.

 

 

I should have seen that as a sign of neediness, but he just said he was real sure of what he wanted and that was to marry me (we knew each other for years before we dated.)

 

 

So your guy just never got the point and never changed? Another poster said she put her foot down and he stopped the immaturity. I was hoping that could happen.

 

I think you are in denial still young and are focused still on outweighing his silent treatment with the good qualities he possesses. You are making excuses for him. As if all the good in the relationship somehow out weights 5 days of complete silence and refusal to speak to you. You can pretend all you want that perhaps this is an immaturity or a desperate attempt to secure your affections but it is not. He knows exactly what he is doing. Hence telling you he was making a point. You need to figure out why you are so tolerating of this behaviour? Why are you turning a blind eye when someone is disrespecting you and withdrawing from you in order to prove a point?

 

He is punishing you. (Regardless of whether you realize it or not). It is not a cry for attention or a misguided attempt to get your attention back he is using it repeatedly as a punishment. Do you want to be with someone who punishes you for not doing as you are told? Someone who punishes you because you aren't psychic and aren't aware that you need to be extra early for a date because he had planned something prior without letting you know? Punishes you and emotionally withdraws completely because you spent 30 minutes having ice cream with the kids?

 

I think you have a real good pair of fog googles on right now and until you step away from the relationship and really assess what it looks like at a distance you won't be able to see clearly what has been going on.

 

You need to make a point to him. A real boundary enforcing point.

 

If he ever gives you the silent treatment again you will walk away from the relationship without a second thought. If he ever disrespects you in that manner again he will not be welcome back in the relationship.

 

It takes a strong person to lay down a boundary and follow through with it. He is counting on you not being able to do so or not being willing to walk away from the relationship hence why he ignores all your discussions about the subject and continues to give you the silent treatment.

 

If you want him to change this behaviour it has to come from you laying down what is acceptable and what isn't. And if he breaches that boundary or pushes it till it breaks then YOU need to be able to follow through and walk away. You can only enforce a boundary if you don't let someone walk all over it. You have to respect yourself enough to mean it and follow through.

 

At the moment he has no reason to change his behaviour or work with you because giving you the silent treatment works. He gets what he wants.

 

If he doesn't accept the terms then walk away.

[stillyoung]

Thanks for your feedback. You may be right about being in denial, I'm still waffling between neediness and outright manipulation. I saw your article and luckily it's not nearly to that extent. Maybe because I am not so dependent. I still go about my life, whether he is there or not. Funny that the article describes my ex, who eventually I gathered myself up and left. I've done it before, I can do it again if necessary.

 

 

You said, tell him if he ever does this again I'll leave. But the I thought, he might not believe that because I didn't leave this time. The thing is, if I leave I am not coming back. I don't want to do the same thing as he does, which is break up (or silent treatment) to make a point. My history was, if I decide I don't want to be there, there's no reason to come back. (I think ex was surprised about that too, when I left all of a sudden came the promises to work on things.)

 

 

So I'm just trying to figure, can I get this point across? Is there any hope? If in people's experiences this behavior is more or less a permanent thing. Or if anyone changed that behavior successfully.

[266696687]

Yes which is why I said you have some denial. You seem to be fluttering backwards and forwards between being annoyed with his behaviour and then understanding of it and minimizing it like its nothing. It suggests he already has some sort of manipulative emotional control over you.

 

Have you threatened to leave before due to this behaviour?

 

The thing with enforcing a boundary and letting him know this behaviour is a deal breaker is not meant to be a threat. it's a promise to leave if he behaves that way again. Once you've said it you need to be willing to walk away. If you threaten to leave then don't he will see it as a weakness and an unwillingness to lose him but will also reinforce his ability to control you and the silent treatment will continue because he will know you won't actually leave him.

 

You should never threaten to leave a relationship unless you 100% mean it. In this case if the behaviour doesn't stop you should leave immediately. If he won't discuss it or dismisses you when discussing it you should leave immediately.

 

At the moment he doesn't take you seriously or respect you enough to take on board what you have said. He needs to know you are serious and won't tolerate it even if it means no longer being in a relationship with him. That's if you even want to try and continue this relationship. I personally wouldn't.

 

There is a big difference between ending a relationship and going NC and giving someone the silent treatment repeatedly throughout a relationship in order to manipulate their partner.

 

You might want to look at why you are attracting men with this similar trait. You may benefit from counseling to help you build firmer boundaries and standards within yourself. Having firmer boundaries may have helped you firmly address this behaviour on initially seeing it or walking away at the first sign of it.

 

I'm afraid the difficulty with any sort of abuse including the silent treatment is that the person is unlikely or unwilling to change. Violent abusers are the same. They can promise to change and repeat the same behaviour again and again with every partner they encounter. Chances are your man has behaved this way in all or many of his previous relationships.

 

Mental abuse is less obvious but just as damaging to the victim.

 

My advice would be to not even bother trying to repair or fix this relationship. You should just end things with him and walk away. You've already had discussions about it with him which he has chosen to ignore. He clearly doesn't take you seriously and I honestly don't believe he will change his behaviour even if you let him know this is a deal breaker for you.

[Just a Guy]

Hi Still young, just wanted to know how old are the both of you? How long did your first marriages last and in his case, what was the reason for his break up with his first wife? From all that you have written and I'm sorry I haven't read through your whole thread, it seems pretty obvious that the two of you are incompatible in certain key areas of your relationship. There is no use beating about the bush because you are thinking of getting married and marriage, as you know, requires a lot of compromise on the part of both partners. Apart from that your BF comes across as pretty juvenile in his behavior considering he is an adult who has already been married once. If you were to marry him you would find his behavior suffocating and very restrictive. While I understand that with young kids and being a single mom makes it desirable to have a full time partner who can share the responsibilities and expenses of running a household, you cannot barter away your freedom and peace of mind plus your freedom of action, for a parasitic relationship which inhibits you rather than the other way around. It would be better to call it off now than get embroiled in a relationship which will suck out your energy and enthusiasm for life.

Wish you the very best for the future. Warm wishes.

[266696687]

Hi Still young, just wanted to know how old are the both of you? How long did your first marriages last and in his case, what was the reason for his break up with his first wife? From all that you have written and I'm sorry I haven't read through your whole thread, it seems pretty obvious that the two of you are incompatible in certain key areas of your relationship. There is no use beating about the bush because you are thinking of getting married and marriage, as you know, requires a lot of compromise on the part of both partners. Apart from that your BF comes across as pretty juvenile in his behavior considering he is an adult who has already been married once. If you were to marry him you would find his behavior suffocating and very restrictive. While I understand that with young kids and being a single mom makes it desirable to have a full time partner who can share the responsibilities and expenses of running a household, you cannot barter away your freedom and peace of mind plus your freedom of action, for a parasitic relationship which inhibits you rather than the other way around. It would be better to call it off now than get embroiled in a relationship which will suck out your energy and enthusiasm for life.

Wish you the very best for the future. Warm wishes.

 

He was previously married for 25 years so I assume he is at least 45+

[BetheButterfly]

Am I being a thoughtless GF? It seems we are constantly in fights because I ignored him, didn't respect him, whatever. I'm not a vindictive person at all, I'm just trying to get by, but he wants more time out of me, but when he just gets so mad that I don't spend the extra time with him, well I don't know how to handle that.

I don't think you are thoughtless. It takes a lot of work to care for children. It's possible he doesn't understand that, since he is only now having to get used to sacrificing his time and desires for his family. You are already used to sacrificing your time and your desires to take care of your children.

 

Can y'all go to a family counselor who can help him understand the responsibilities of parenthood? Maybe if he understood how much you do as a Mom, he will be more understanding and caring to you.

[Mr. Lucky]

You said, tell him if he ever does this again I'll leave. But the I thought, he might not believe that because I didn't leave this time. The thing is, if I leave I am not coming back.

 

Somewhat ironic to think that discussion/ultimatum would probably trigger the silent treatment from him, the very behavior that brought you to this point.

 

Some people just shut down in the face of adversity, real or imagined. Given his age and history, you aren't going to change him and he doesn't seem self-motivated to examine his behavior on his own.

 

So it's most likely take it or leave it. Either the other "pros" of the relationship outweigh this "con" or they don't. To me, that's the decision you have to make. Hope it works out for you...

 

Mr. Lucky

[266696687]

Somewhat ironic to think that discussion/ultimatum would probably trigger the silent treatment from him, the very behavior that brought you to this point.

 

Some people just shut down in the face of adversity, real or imagined. Given his age and history, you aren't going to change him and he doesn't seem self-motivated to examine his behavior on his own.

 

So it's most likely take it or leave it. Either the other "pros" of the relationship outweigh this "con" or they don't. To me, that's the decision you have to make. Hope it works out for you...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Yeah I agree. I don't believe letting him know this is a deal breaker for her will work in this situation and will probably as you said trigger another silent treatment.

 

She's already had discussions with him about this behaviour he ignores it so again I don't think laying down a boundary will work as he has ignored all her previous attempts to deter this behaviour.

 

A bit of a shock warning I.e the behaviour is so unacceptable that if you choose to continue it the relationship will be over can sometimes go a long way in some circumstance. It makes the person aware of the unacceptable behaviour and also tells them what you will not tolerate in a relationship especially a behaviour that is damaging to the relationship such as the silent treatment. It also gives them a chance to change their behaviour or leave the relationship if they do not want to work on it. However again in this case i don't think it will work as the behaviour is so frequent it's his go to mode of communicating displeasure.

[BetheButterfly]

So it's most likely take it or leave it. Either the other "pros" of the relationship outweigh this "con" or they don't. To me, that's the decision you have to make. Hope it works out for you...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Agreed.

 

People don't change other people. They have to want to change, and work at it for themselves.

 

Personally, I think the OP needs a man who understands how to communicate and work through issues. Being a Mom is a huge responsibility, and it really helps to have a husband who listens and doesn't go off to pout when things don't go his way.

 

While I'm not a Mom, I've seen my Dad be a pillar of support for my Mom. They've been married for 40+ years, and Dad has always been there to help my Mom with her daughters.

 

I can be a handful sometimes lol. My parents told me how when I was a baby, my Dad would come home to find both my Mom and me crying. You now what he did? He would take me driving. I loved (and still do) the feel of the car moving, and it would lull me to sleep. This gave my Mom some much needed alone time. My Dad didn't have to do that, but he did cause he cares.

 

OP, can you find a good mentor for him, a man who has been a great Dad and husband and who can be a good example for him? That might help. One of the reasons my Dad is a pillar of support for my Mom is because his Dad (my Grandpa) was a pillar of support for his Mom.

 

Being a great husband and Dad is not natural; it's learned, often by the example of great leaders.