31 and never dated

[ZA Dater]

Sometimes you have to think outside the box...Hows your own advice working for you?

 

Actually its working rather well, I don't judge my success according to sexual gratification, it doesn't define who I am and shouldn't define the OP either.

 

I'd like to think a first time there should be some emotional connection and honestly if I put myself into the OP shoes, I couldn't think of anything worse than paying for it.

[Redfisher]

Actually its working rather well, I don't judge my success according to sexual gratification, it doesn't define who I am and shouldn't define the OP either.

 

I'd like to think a first time there should be some emotional connection and honestly if I put myself into the OP shoes, I couldn't think of anything worse than paying for it.

 

I'm happy your doing well, I truly hope you meet the right one and enjoy all that love and great sex has to offer...Cheers.

[ZA Dater]

I'm happy your doing well, I truly hope you meet the right one and enjoy all that love and great sex has to offer...Cheers.

 

There was of course just a tinge of sarcasm in my reply. I think no matter ones level of success there is never really a justifiable reason to at age 31 resort to paying for sex.

 

I suppose its easy for me to say I really don't see the hype about it.

[BronzeAgeJaeger217]

It's more than that:

 

 

• feminism
  
• hypergamy
  
• 80/20
  

 

These are just a few; I could keep going.

 

That's why I like to believe in the phrase, quote "women are born, men are made"

[Redfisher]

There was of course just a tinge of sarcasm in my reply. I think no matter ones level of success there is never really a justifiable reason to at age 31 resort to paying for sex.

 

I suppose its easy for me to say I really don't see the hype about it.

 

I understand, My idea was more a long the lines of an easy chick or one less desirable....I know having a connection and blah blah blah is nice and cheery but I know and have seen with many guys just getting the first one out of the way will boost your man card so to speak and then you can go after what you deserve. But really I'm just a small town lumberjack so take my advice with a grain of salt....haha

[4ever8lone]

Redfisher thankyou for you're honesty. But i dont think i would feel comfortable paying for sex. I have a perfectionist kind of view for most things in my life. I guess im just going to have to lower the bar a little to get the ball rolling.

[Redfisher]

I never said to pay for it, I said exactly what you just said... Lower the bar and get laid dude...Anyways I'm out. Good luck.

[Qboro90]

Redfisher thankyou for you're honesty. But i dont think i would feel comfortable paying for sex. I have a perfectionist kind of view for most things in my life. I guess im just going to have to lower the bar a little to get the ball rolling.

 

Why do you think that you have this perfectionist view towards women and dating tho? Figure that out and come to terms with it and it may help you realize why you're limiting yourself.

 

No one is saying don't have standards and forget about dating attractive women. However there is a big difference between not approaching women who are anything but a 9 or 10.... And not approaching women who are below a 7 (looks scale 1-10 btw).

 

I have a friend who could easily hook up with a number of women and regularly gets looks by girls who are cute (6-8.5s) , however he refuses to approach them using the excuse "they're nothing special" or some thing to that regard when really he's just petrified of being in an uncomfortable situation and being rejected.

 

Everyone understands getting rejected by a 10. Some guys feel embarrassed if they're turned down by a 6-7. There's no reason to be. It's just a mental self value and confidence issue. I've hooked up and dated 10s, 7s, slept with my share of lagoon creatures as well. Turned down by all kinds of women. There's nothing to be embarassed about.

 

Can't enjoy the game if you never step on the field.

[BronzeAgeJaeger217]

i really love this womans attitude, mindset:Why Men Deserve a Break in the Dating Marketplace -

[ZA Dater]

Why do you think that you have this perfectionist view towards women and dating tho? Figure that out and come to terms with it and it may help you realize why you're limiting yourself.

 

No one is saying don't have standards and forget about dating attractive women. However there is a big difference between not approaching women who are anything but a 9 or 10.... And not approaching women who are below a 7 (looks scale 1-10 btw).

 

I have a friend who could easily hook up with a number of women and regularly gets looks by girls who are cute (6-8.5s) , however he refuses to approach them using the excuse "they're nothing special" or some thing to that regard when really he's just petrified of being in an uncomfortable situation and being rejected.

 

Everyone understands getting rejected by a 10. Some guys feel embarrassed if they're turned down by a 6-7. There's no reason to be. It's just a mental self value and confidence issue. I've hooked up and dated 10s, 7s, slept with my share of lagoon creatures as well. Turned down by all kinds of women. There's nothing to be embarassed about.

 

Can't enjoy the game if you never step on the field.

 

There is a great degree of truth to the above but I think one needs to put oneself in the right frame of mind BEFORE contemplating approaching anyone. Assuming one actually wants to approach to begin with.

 

My advice to the OP is to build yourself up, confidence can be found in a number of ways, interacting with people I found did my confidence a lot of good. Also, you must not see dating as something intimidating, it is but if you feel that from the off you aren't ever going to make a concerted effort at it.

 

Qboro will disagree with me but my feeling is dating is more about making oneself the best one can be and then selling that image to people in the hope that they like what they are being sold, simplistic yes but maybe true.

 

Also ask yourself, does being single and a virgin define your life? If you asked me that today I would probably say yes, tomorrow may be a different story.

 

Once again, all the best of luck, approach things with a "I can" attitude and you may be surprised.

[Qboro90]

There is a great degree of truth to the above but I think one needs to put oneself in the right frame of mind BEFORE contemplating approaching anyone. Assuming one actually wants to approach to begin with.

 

My advice to the OP is to build yourself up, confidence can be found in a number of ways, interacting with people I found did my confidence a lot of good. Also, you must not see dating as something intimidating, it is but if you feel that from the off you aren't ever going to make a concerted effort at it.

 

Qboro will disagree with me but my feeling is dating is more about making oneself the best one can be and then selling that image to people in the hope that they like what they are being sold, simplistic yes but maybe true.

 

Also ask yourself, does being single and a virgin define your life? If you asked me that today I would probably say yes, tomorrow may be a different story.

 

Once again, all the best of luck, approach things with a "I can" attitude and you may be surprised.

 

Yes you're right, I would absolutely disagree with that. You're dead set on this "selling oneself" mantra for some reason. Has it worked? No. Perhaps beating that into the ground over and over again might not be the best idea if you're looking to get different results.

 

Instead of propping yourself up and "selling" the best image of yourself. Why don't you actually either 1. Be the best image of yourself all the time instead of trying to turn it on and off when meeting women. Or 2. Realize that the "best image of yourself" is a fabrication of who you are and you're just wearing a mask thinking that will attract someone. You don't understand that eventually the mask comes off and you are who you are.

 

Going out on a date and acting like you're a social butterfly because you think that's what the girl will like is the opposite of what you should do. If you're a reserved person that's totally fine and not a problem when dating. Ever hear of the silent/mysterious type? Girls love it. Learning how to best express and interact around women is the only thing most guys have to figure out.

 

Becoming "the best image of myself" is like me thinking I can be in the NBA because once I hit 10 3pt'ers in a row. That's the best image of my basketball skills. But that's not the kind of player I am. I'm lucky to hit 2 out of 10 on a good day. So going on dates and dressing yourself up, flexing your new muscles, flashing the new watch... Is all fine and dandy... But that's not who you are, and at the end of the day it's more work to act like that manufactured character than it would be to just say "screw it, I'm going up to girls that I'm attracted to and will learn with each rejection, what works and garners positive reaction/feedback, and what doesn't work and I should stop doing".

 

Not saying to dress like a bum either. But you yourself ZA has said you despise the guys who flash their money, or the gym rats, or the typical "bro's".

 

Work out to be in better shape and health for yourself. Not because girls like muscles. Wear sharp clothing and look good because you want to appear to have your **** together instead of wrinkled khakis and a worn out old button down. Look good= feel good.

[Qboro90]

There is a great degree of truth to the above but I think one needs to put oneself in the right frame of mind BEFORE contemplating approaching anyone. Assuming one actually wants to approach to begin with.

 

My advice to the OP is to build yourself up, confidence can be found in a number of ways, interacting with people I found did my confidence a lot of good. Also, you must not see dating as something intimidating, it is but if you feel that from the off you aren't ever going to make a concerted effort at it.

 

Qboro will disagree with me but my feeling is dating is more about making oneself the best one can be and then selling that image to people in the hope that they like what they are being sold, simplistic yes but maybe true.

 

Also ask yourself, does being single and a virgin define your life? If you asked me that today I would probably say yes, tomorrow may be a different story.

 

Once again, all the best of luck, approach things with a "I can" attitude and you may be surprised.

 

 

Why does being single and a virgin define your life? If Steve Jobs was a virgin when he died.... Would that be his legacy and what was talked about at his funeral? Of course not.

 

What about religious folk? The men and women who take vows of celibacy? (Those that honor those vows at least). Their lives are less important because they don't have sex? They can't be happy until they do?

 

If being a virgin defines you then just go get an escort. You're still yourself, you just won't have to self loath about not knowing what sex is like. And you're dating life won't be affected at all. Still looking for intimacy and a relationship. But you're not a virgin. It's not this magical holy thing when you lose your virginity. It's just another experience that won't change anything about your life or who you are as a person.

[ZA Dater]

Yes you're right, I would absolutely disagree with that. You're dead set on this "selling oneself" mantra for some reason. Has it worked? No. Perhaps beating that into the ground over and over again might not be the best idea if you're looking to get different results.

 

Instead of propping yourself up and "selling" the best image of yourself. Why don't you actually either 1. Be the best image of yourself all the time instead of trying to turn it on and off when meeting women. Or 2. Realize that the "best image of yourself" is a fabrication of who you are and you're just wearing a mask thinking that will attract someone. You don't understand that eventually the mask comes off and you are who you are.

 

Going out on a date and acting like you're a social butterfly because you think that's what the girl will like is the opposite of what you should do. If you're a reserved person that's totally fine and not a problem when dating. Ever hear of the silent/mysterious type? Girls love it. Learning how to best express and interact around women is the only thing most guys have to figure out.

 

Becoming "the best image of myself" is like me thinking I can be in the NBA because once I hit 10 3pt'ers in a row. That's the best image of my basketball skills. But that's not the kind of player I am. I'm lucky to hit 2 out of 10 on a good day. So going on dates and dressing yourself up, flexing your new muscles, flashing the new watch... Is all fine and dandy... But that's not who you are, and at the end of the day it's more work to act like that manufactured character than it would be to just say "screw it, I'm going up to girls that I'm attracted to and will learn with each rejection, what works and garners positive reaction/feedback, and what doesn't work and I should stop doing".

 

Not saying to dress like a bum either. But you yourself ZA has said you despise the guys who flash their money, or the gym rats, or the typical "bro's".

 

Work out to be in better shape and health for yourself. Not because girls like muscles. Wear sharp clothing and look good because you want to appear to have your **** together instead of wrinkled khakis and a worn out old button down. Look good= feel good.

 

I see dating as a competition, the best person ultimately wins so you need to be that best person all of the time, hence my comment about building oneself up before even trying to date.

 

Being reserved person is NOT fine, you simply will get nowhere, the type o chick who likes reserved people is not the type of chick I have any interest in at all. I suspect the OP will find the same.

 

I totally disagree with getting rejected over and over again, that's not healthy for anyone, go after what you have a reasonable chance of getting and assess those odds carefully. In theory I can date a model, she has a fantastic personality and if I asked she would probably go out with me, I don't ask because fundamentally she isn't what I want nor I what she wants, thus the odds are off from the beginning. Trial and error is irrelevant in dating because one never gets objective feedback as to what one does wrong, all you do here is smash yourself into oblivion emotionally and end up feeling worthless, I have first have experience of the latter feeling, felt like that for years after rejection after rejection.

 

The BIGGEST mistake I made was to think I could be myself and get girls, frankly I cant, I need to become more outgoing, show more of my personality, be less shy. You need to be the sort of person you yourself would want to date.

 

Honestly those guys with muscle and money do much better than I do so there must be something to be said for doing that.

[Redfisher]

I can understand putting on a front and faking who you are just to get laid..Thats normal, But when looking for a long term deal with a mate why fake who you are? it will only last so long until the person see's the real you and it will disappointing....But at the same time if being who you really are is not working?...ugh life's a struggle for sure.

[WonderKid]

Check the morality at the door, and get a damn prostitute or something. I'm just going to keep it real with you. Get a few of them. Then if you still feel like dating then go for it. Do that, then come back.

[WonderKid]

Redfisher thankyou for you're honesty. But i dont think i would feel comfortable paying for sex. I have a perfectionist kind of view for most things in my life. I guess im just going to have to lower the bar a little to get the ball rolling.

 

Dude whether you know it or not, in your situation, somehow or some way you are going to pay for a woman's company. You can either feel comfortable taking a woman on 5, 6, 7 dates to not get laid or companionship in return. Then go to another and do the same thing. Or you can either hookup with a woman, pay her in some kind of way to what she wants, get laid, and get it out of the way.

[WaitingForBardot]

Dude whether you know it or not, in your situation, somehow or some way you are going to pay for a woman's company. You can either feel comfortable taking a woman on 5, 6, 7 dates to not get laid or companionship in return. Then go to another and do the same thing. Or you can either hookup with a woman, pay her in some kind of way to what she wants, get laid, and get it out of the way.

"The big difference between sex for money and sex for free is that sex for money usually costs a lot less." --Brendan Behan

[BronzeAgeJaeger217]

And yet people will say for the OP that it is never too late, that he still has plenty of time, which angers me

[GunslingerRoland]

And yet people will say for the OP that it is never too late, that he still has plenty of time, which angers me

 

Why does it anger you? (Besides the fact seemingly everything about dating angers you)

[BronzeAgeJaeger217]

Why does it anger you? (Besides the fact seemingly everything about dating angers you)

 

Because isn't he past his prime, missed out on his prime years for dating and relationships, sex? And why I hate it, well I just hate the way the world works, the way reality works

[GunslingerRoland]

Because isn't he past his prime, missed out on his prime years for dating and relationships, sex? And why I hate it, well I just hate the way the world works, the way reality works

 

The reality in YOUR head, tells you that young love is this magical thing that cannot be beat. And while young love can be fun and is special in it's own sort of way. Most people don't find their true love until their 30's. I know people who didn't meet their true love until their 60's or older.

 

 

Sure, past 30 is past your prime years for casual dating, and hookup sex, but so what? Doesn't mean his dating life is over...

 

 

I find it so sad, that you are in your 20's and are so bitter about your wasted youth, not realizing that you are still just a pup. In 40 years you can complain about your wasted youth, for now just enjoy it!

[4ever8lone]

Why do you think that you have this perfectionist view towards women and dating tho? Figure that out and come to terms with it and it may help you realize why you're limiting yourself.

 

Im not entirely sure, but like i said its not just women i have this view towards. Its most things in my life. Im an artist and if i feel a piece isnt to a high enough standard ill start it again.

 

Because isn't he past his prime, missed out on his prime years for dating and relationships, sex? And why I hate it, well I just hate the way the world works, the way reality works

 

I agree, i feel that high school and college is where you learn your skills in the dating game, and i let my fears control my actions.

 

 

I have no idea how to talk to girls either, so what do i say if im interested in a girl?. Im literally a complete beginner when it comes to all of this.

[PaperCrane]

Okie doke, here we go.

 

We have a couple o' people 'ere. One o' dem has a peenor and one o' dem has a pair ah nippy noops an' a woohoo hole.

 

Okie so, yah take away dere fun bits and yah find dere just a people too. That's ah how ya talk to 'em.

 

Now in that you're one to fancy 'er noopies and woohoo, and once yah been talkin' like a pair o' airhorns yellin' at each o'er fer awhile, you slip in all dandy like with a "I really enjoy my time with you, and I think I'd like to take you out some time. When would be good for you?"

 

TRANSLATION MAGIC:

 

Talk to her like a dude, if you find her attractive let her know as much. If she declines, move on. Easy peasy.

 

The best way to describe a way a guy falls in love, is finding a girl he can be friends with but also finds physically attractive. If you find yourself physically attracted to them but fighting to maintain a normal conversation, you probably lack a mental connection. Talk about what you like. You're more confident about subjects you understand. Confidence is attractive, and you'll also know if she's into similar stuff as you.

[WonderKid]

No way!

 

When a guy is 30+ he still has golden years. Especially if he has no kids and not married. You have more power than you realize.

[Qboro90]

I see dating as a competition, the best person ultimately wins so you need to be that best person all of the time, hence my comment about building oneself up before even trying to date.

 

Being reserved person is NOT fine, you simply will get nowhere, the type o chick who likes reserved people is not the type of chick I have any interest in at all. I suspect the OP will find the same.

 

I totally disagree with getting rejected over and over again, that's not healthy for anyone, go after what you have a reasonable chance of getting and assess those odds carefully. In theory I can date a model, she has a fantastic personality and if I asked she would probably go out with me, I don't ask because fundamentally she isn't what I want nor I what she wants, thus the odds are off from the beginning. Trial and error is irrelevant in dating because one never gets objective feedback as to what one does wrong, all you do here is smash yourself into oblivion emotionally and end up feeling worthless, I have first have experience of the latter feeling, felt like that for years after rejection after rejection.

 

The BIGGEST mistake I made was to think I could be myself and get girls, frankly I cant, I need to become more outgoing, show more of my personality, be less shy. You need to be the sort of person you yourself would want to date.

 

Honestly those guys with muscle and money do much better than I do so there must be something to be said for doing that.

 

 

I disagree wholeheartedly. Just an area where we don't see eye to eye.

 

Just can't understand why or how you've developed such strong assumptions/beliefs towards what women want, or what dating is when you've admittedly failed at both continuously.

 

"Being reserved is NOT fine?" Who told you that? " the type of chick that likes reserved guys is not the kind of girl I'm into at all" - that's an absolutely baffling thing to say. How could you possibly know so much about every individual woman in the world and who they are, what they like, what attracts them, etc.

 

You generalize and lump all women into these pre conceived labels and descriptions in such a self debilitating way when there's no reason to whatsoever.

 

Dating isn't a competition. Despite what you may think, every single girl doesn't have 10 options to choose from at all times and secretly judging who the winner will be by what they say or do.

 

I date an absolute smokeshow. Not trying to be cocky or pat myself on the back, but I'm a good looking guy, social, athletic background and she's completely outta my league. I thought she was the kinda girl that had so many options just like you're thinking and I would need to be perfect around her just to have a shot. Guess what tho, turns out that she literally wasn't talking to entertaining dating at all and hadn't for a year because she was focused on school and her career. Her ideal weekend? Sitting at home watching movies. Not going to ViP rooms and parties like I thought she'd want.

 

Stop limiting yourself and forming such firm opinions and beliefs on things just because you heard it somewhere or watched it on tv or think that's what works.

 

You already feel you're at rock bottom in the dating/social world. What the heck could possibly be worse? If I were you I'd be trying every different possible approach I could come up with because what have I got to lose?