Some questions for the Walk Away Spouses out there

[KBarletta]

Guys,

 

I have to say I think you are giving many waw's too much credit. I know every situation is different, but my WAW never communicated things were bothering her. Our marriage was far from perfect. All marriages have issues particularly after being together in excess of 30 years. .

 

My way to deal with things that bothered me was to bring them up. Her way was to write them in her journal(which I did not know about). I am not now nor will I ever be a mind reader.

 

About 6 months before my son went to college my wife shut me out. I suggested counseling as we had gone about 25 years earlier when we had some issues. She said no. I gave her some space as she asked. She still would not discuss what was bothering her.

 

Right after my son left, DDAY for me. Leaving me for another man she supposedly met 2 months ago. Yeah right.

 

As an additional datapoint approx. 3 years prior to DDAY we were on a vacation with mutual friends and she confided to my bestfriend how happy she was with her life and that I was the best thing that could have happened to her. I still have no idea what changed, other then her meeting the other man.

 

While I accept some culpability for my marriage ending, in my case my WAW kept the issues to herself til she met a new man. Then made her move. Her lack of communication skills and integrity were the biggest contributor to the death of our marriage. Also my inability to mindread.

 

I do agree with the majority of posters here though. Once they are WAW, they keep walking. In my case I am beginning to realize it is probably the best thing that could have happened to me. I hope it turns out that way for you also.

 

Major,

 

I really wish my ex had made her feelings known. Even if we could not have stayed together it would have made things a lot easier on both of us. I commend you for communicating your unhappiness and at least giving him a chance to make some changes.

 

Have to agree with chew on this one. There are plenty of WAS who have attempted to communicate their dissatisfaction, but just as many who have not, but expect their spouse to understand anyway. Mine was the latter.

 

Much like chew, I had little idea my marriage was in trouble until it was too late to do anything to save it. If we had communicated about the issues and still hadn't been able to resolve them, I would have felt much more at peace about the end of my marriage. As it is, it is ending and I feel like it was stolen from under my nose without my knowledge. Much harder to accept.

 

Of course, as others have said, no 2 situations are the same, but there are elements of so many of these WAS stories that seem eerily similar.

[hl1962]

"this is NOT a walk away situation..."

 

Depends on our definitions. I've seen a definition for walk away wife/husband as a situation where one spouse leaves a "low-conflict" marriage (a marriage where there is no cheating, no drug abuse, no criminal activity, no physical violence, no insolvent gambling or other tumultuous addictions). The spouse leaves (walks away) because the marriage is no longer intimate/fulfilling (not because s/he's being beaten or otherwise endangered).

 

 

You say "low-conflict", I see neglect. "neglect" is a ground for divorce in many states.

[ProdigalMe]

You say "low-conflict", I see neglect. "neglect" is a ground for divorce in many states.

 

Whether it's low-conflict (no communication/no intimacy) or high-conflict (physical beatings; infidelity), it's just different shades of neglect. There's low-conflict neglect, and high-conflict neglect. Either way, there's a failure (a neglect) to nurture the relationship.

 

California is a no-fault state. You can get divorced for any reason, or no reason at all, as long as you cite "irreconcilable differences."

[2.50 a gallon]

Non-conflict WAW are a dime a dozen.

My best friend in college married a gal a couple of years younger than him after he graduated. In fact I was best man at their wedding. Me being a happy bachelor and the two of them starting a family, we drifted apart. He moved to the east coast and I to the left coast.

Thirty years later we once again crossed paths. He was devastated as she was in the process of walking away. He was a very successful engineer and a little bit into computers and made loads of money. The money got to him, he always wanted to make more. He also got into investment banking as a hobby and eventually ended up a millionaire many times over. Yes he bought her fancy houses, and took her to the Bahamas, Hawaii, Alaska. And was dumb founded when she announced she was no longer in love with him and wanted a divorce and walked away.

Her story, he got obsessed with making money. She warned him for years she needed more us time. Yes they traveled the world, but when they went to Hawaii, he spent most of his time deep sea fishing, and golfing, The same when they went to the Bahamas. Alaska for trout and salmon fishing. She wanted them to go to Europe. Once he realized she was serious it was too late.

Another divorced gal that I knew, married at age 19, had a couple of kids, he was a construction worker, who started small contracting on the side, that grew into a very large company, with her running the office. She had always wanted to be a nurse, and over the years took some college classes. Once the kids were on the way to college, she walked away. She had always wanted to live on the Pacific coast and wanted to be a nurse. She could have taken him for big bucks, but all she wanted was the funds to get her degree in nursing. Which she did. She still loved her Ex, had no plans to remarry. As she said she what do you know about life when you are only 19? She was very happy being a nurse and living on the coast.

[2.50 a gallon]

In my late college years, my two best friends and I rented a large house. We all had summer GF's and we all were bah humbugers. Shortly after New Years are gals began breaking up with us, until by Super Bowl time they were all gone.

Next year, the same result

By the third year we had moved out of the house and were now living in a large apartment complex. I had a 1 bedroom while they shared a 2 bedroom. Our attitudes about Christmas remained unchanged. But in my case the gal paid me no never mind and I came home one day to find she had put up a medium tree with just a few lights and ornaments and some cutout thingys in the window. The tree was sort of bare so I jumped in added another couple strings of lights and another in the window, and got infected by her Christmas high. Come Super Bowl time my friends have once more been dumped, while my sex life had improved.

Lesson learned. Ever since I have been one to celebrate Christmas.

[ProdigalMe]

2.50 a gallon

 

I guess I'd better put on my Christmas cheer.

 

This raises an interesting question for both dumpers and dumpees in a walk-away-from-marriage situation.

 

For you dumpees that changed something about yourselves, what did you change, and what motivated you to make the change? Was it something you did for yourself, or something you did to prove something to your Ex?

 

For you dumpers who saw the dumpee make positive changes, what did you think? Did you say, "that's great, but I've moved on." Or did you say, "that's great, I'm actually attracted to dumpee now."

[ProdigalMe]

KBarletta

 

Sorry to hear about your blindside situation. I don't know how or if I could deal with that, I'm already struggling with my own situation, and I had plenty of warning. Why I was so apathetic is a mystery I have to crack open for myself.

[2.50 a gallon]

Prodigal

 

 

You can't nice her back, perhaps you can find a way to re-attract her

I am a short, skinny guy, no where close to dream boat material, yet I have had great success with the ladies. I owe my success in part because I was different, in a way unique.

Where I lived there were lots of guys where cowboy hats. I got lucky when a gal friend braided a small leather piece that looped around the base of the hat then dangled down like a tail about 6 to 8 inches off of the back. This P.O.ed a bunch of the guys, but I found women seemed to like it, it made me different

I am a model builder, not kits, but I scratch build. Again the women seem to be fascinated by my skills.

From my earliest bachelor days I had a large fish tank, that I placed low to the carpet, and then used pillows to relax and watch the fish swim. It was a great prop with a glass of wine or two to break thru the just friends state.

After the break up of my marriage, along with me teaching myself to cook gourmet meals, a woman introduced me to raising, rare and hard to breed tropical fish. Again it was a win / win as this took time away from obsessing about the Ex's doings and women really got off on being able to see baby fish. Sometimes even being able to watch them hatch.

I had a friend who raised poison dart frogs, so named because the natives use the secretions from their skin on their darts. They look like a regular frog, except they are very brightly colored in order to stand out and warn predators they are dangerous to eat. Again some women found his hobby unique and different.

[LifeNomad]

the best thing you can do is to make her doubt her decision down the line, maybe not at first, but a few weeks months or even years into the sepearation / divorce

 

 

the best way is to basically not beg cry plead or try to force her to change her mind, because if she already told you what she wants, anything you tell her is basically trying to force her to change her mind

 

 

so smile, look good, smell good, lose weight! get a new wardrobe, stay looking clean and sharp, start exercising, daily, eat better, if she starts dropping breadcrumbs don't go running back to her, you gotta play it cool, this is your time to embrace your new life, you are reborn! its hard, very hard, im almost 1 1/2 yrs that we separated and once in a while I still feel down and sad, but for most part im a better person, a better dad

[GreatDadAlways]

I have real issues with this thread. So many say there were no real issues in the marriage but the spouse simply decided they were done. What happened to the commitment we all made in our vows? This happened to me and after 23 years she walked away. Well kind of ... Walked away from our marriage and family but took 60% of my income with her for 7 years! If you choose to walk away when there is no abuse, addiction, etc. then walk away with nothing. Only then will walk away spouses be faced with a real choice. The current system rewards this "I'm bored with you" attitude and it's at the detriment of the children!

[Dr Paws]

Dr Paws, why were you relieved that he didn't try to change your mind? Would it have caused too much turmoil? Were you already exhausted at that point?

 

Yes, I was. And there was absolutely no point...all it would have done would have been to irritate me even more so than I already was. Believe me, I've been there: when you finally decide to leave someone who has treated you like crap and they suddenly try and 'up their game'...frankly, I found it pretty ****ing insulting.

 

They weren't thinking of me, they were thinking of themselves. Suddenly the realization that the years of what they'd considered 'idle threats' were actually real. That their partner should have been respected, actually listened too, and taken seriously from day one. Not Day one bloody thousand, at least 999 days too ****ing late.

 

So yeah in the modern parlance of TL/DR: too little, too late.

[moonwalker86]

She says she's done. She's exhausted. We've had the same discussion over and over again about her issues with me. At this point she doesn't care to save anything because she feels she gave it her all. She says she would just like to exit now and find the husband she deserves.

 

My attitude is just like yours. Love is something you choose, not a feeling that you hope comes over you and sustains you. But others have a different viewpoint. It's kind of like the chicken and the egg question. Which came first? The chicken or the egg? Which came first? The feeling of being in love, or the decision to love?

 

My viewpoint (and baffin, maybe you share it) is that a decision to love (the commitment) sustains the feeling of being in love (the spark, the romantic connection). The feeling of being in love ebbs and flows. You don't feel love towards your spouse 24/7, 365. There's probably some days where you feel an intense dislike towards your spouse. But if the commitment is unwavering (if the decision to love is there), the feelings of love always return. Always. The spark always comes back.

 

But if your viewpoint is that commitment is based on feelings, then I think that is problematic. If you're extremely committed one year because your feelings of love are blossoming, that can be beautiful. But if, in the next year, your commitment crumbles because your feelings of being in love aren't there, then it can feel like you're trapped and wonder why you got married.

 

There's probably very few long term marriages (those marriages of 5+ years) in which a spouse looks up at the work clock every single day of the year and thinks, "I can't wait to get home to see my spouse because I'm so in love with him/her." There are rare exceptions, of course, but for the vast majority of us, this kind of constant romantic feeling isn't there. Does that mean the spark is gone, and the marriage should now end? I don't know.

 

So I pose the chicken and the egg question to all the walk-away spouses out there. What is love in a marriage? Is it a spark/feeling? Is it a decision? Which comes first? Does one depend on the other? Does it even matter?

 

 

I'm currently going through this kind of thing right now and it's the worst thing I've ever experienced. It's been a few days since my wife told me she doesn't want to be with me anymore. I've tried everything I could to try to win her back and convince her that I can make her happy. I feel terrible regret for not taking her threats seriously and making the change stick. I wish she would change her mind but she is set on her decision. We have a child together which makes it even worse. Add on top of that, that she was my first love and I believed to be my soulmate. I thought we would always be together, maybe that's why I got so comfortable with her. There is no worse pain in the world than this one. Sometimes I'm not as sad and I have this feeling of acceptance, but then a few hours later something just makes me think about what we were, or what I won't be having with her anymore and it tears me apart. I have nobody to talk to. I have no real friends. It's horrible. I wish this was a nightmare and I could just wake up.

[moonwalker86]

the best thing you can do is to make her doubt her decision down the line, maybe not at first, but a few weeks months or even years into the sepearation / divorce

 

 

the best way is to basically not beg cry plead or try to force her to change her mind, because if she already told you what she wants, anything you tell her is basically trying to force her to change her mind

 

 

so smile, look good, smell good, lose weight! get a new wardrobe, stay looking clean and sharp, start exercising, daily, eat better, if she starts dropping breadcrumbs don't go running back to her, you gotta play it cool, this is your time to embrace your new life, you are reborn! its hard, very hard, im almost 1 1/2 yrs that we separated and once in a while I still feel down and sad, but for most part im a better person, a better dad

 

That's great advice but it seems so impossible to apply, I still love my wife so badly even though she isn't in love the same way. She says she still loves me and always will but I have pleaded to her that I can't bear to think of someone else filling my void. Someone else having that happily ever after story, it breaks me down.

[beatcuff]

Yes, I was. And there was absolutely no point...all it would have done would have been to irritate me even more so than I already was. Believe me, I've been there: when you finally decide to leave someone who has treated you like crap and they suddenly try and 'up their game'...frankly, I found it pretty ****ing insulting.

 

They weren't thinking of me, they were thinking of themselves. Suddenly the realization that the years of what they'd considered 'idle threats' were actually real. That their partner should have been respected, actually listened too, and taken seriously from day one. Not Day one bloody thousand, at least 999 days too ****ing late.

 

So yeah in the modern parlance of TL/DR: too little, too late.

 

bingo... well said... too many think the announcement date is the start date --- when it started long ago, even years. you can lament about committing to their vows. they did. they expressed their displeasure, suggested changes, talked, screamed, yelled, stomped, went to 'moms' for a couple of days... which were all ignored (or were met with half-hearted or short term changes).

 

you may have noticed things lately have 'gotten better', actually that is the day it was over. the other partner, exhausted, gave up. no sense fighting over nothing.

 

what to do. start with the 180 (look it up). while there is a slim chance it will win back your spouse, it is designed to get ready for the new world.

[ProdigalMe]

LifeNomad

 

Thank you for the advice. At first, I did the whole "let's talk about it, let's change your mind, just take me back" routine. Didn't get me far. So, when she told me recently that it's definitely over, and there's nothing more I can do, I basically said, "ok, I accept that, there's nothing more I can do, one person can't save a marriage, it takes two." I sense she was a bit taken aback by that response. It was TOUGH to say, because 99% of me wanted to shout, "NO, let's work things out!!" But I bit my tongue. She then got a bit angry. Who knows where it goes from here?

[ProdigalMe]

moonwalker

 

I feel your pain, I really do. It's just one big ball of confusion, pain, loneliness, loss, anger, bewilderment, desperation, etc. Here's how I cope. I examine all the extreme thoughts I get (I'm unlovable, she is unique and irreplaceable, I'll forever be alone, I'll never be happy again), and consciously debunk all of it. Because none of it is true. It's just that we are prone to extreme thoughts when we're in the middle of the sucking sadness. I do deep breathing exercises. I meditate. I take long brisk walks. I count backwards from 1000 (sometimes by threes, sometimes by sevens...1000, 993, 986; it's a form of mental distraction). I practice gratitude ("thanks for this morning sun, it makes me happy"; "thanks for this great warm cup of coffee, it makes me happy"; there's ALWAYS something to be grateful for). I tell myself that she's hurting too (as much I am, if not more), so be compassionate. I come on here to vent. I recommend all these things for you, moonwalker. The sadness will be unshakeable for a while. Hang in there, take it day by day, and start to take control of your own mental processes (it's tough, but start doing it now, and in a month, you'll see some progress in how your mind react to things).

[ProdigalMe]

2.50 a gallon

 

When you comment on my thread, it brightens my day a little, because of your positivity and perspective. Thank you.

[ProdigalMe]

That's great advice but it seems so impossible to apply, I still love my wife so badly even though she isn't in love the same way. She says she still loves me and always will but I have pleaded to her that I can't bear to think of someone else filling my void. Someone else having that happily ever after story, it breaks me down.

 

Here's a good example of extreme thinking that I want to warn you about. Your days are difficult, as are mine, but don't make them more difficult by extreme thinking. Practice conscious debunking of extreme thoughts.

 

"Filling void." By this I think you mean that you fear being replaced and forgotten, and it may also mean you're a bit jealous that your wife will find someone to be physically intimate with. Consider this perspective: she still loves you, and there will always be a piece of her heart carved out just for you that she will never be able to get rid of, no matter how hard she tries, that she will never, ever forget. As for the physical intimacy part, I think it's natural to be jealous of that, just tell yourself that you and her used to have that too, and just because it's gone now, doesn't mean it wasn't real or special back then.

 

"Happily ever after." Long term relationships/marriage are/is hard work. So, if she enters one later, there's no happily ever after. It's more like happiness, mixed in with a lot of work and frustration, just like your own marriage.

 

So, avoid extreme thoughts. They distort reality and make the pain seem far worse.

[ProdigalMe]

Yes, I was. And there was absolutely no point...all it would have done would have been to irritate me even more so than I already was. Believe me, I've been there: when you finally decide to leave someone who has treated you like crap and they suddenly try and 'up their game'...frankly, I found it pretty ****ing insulting.

 

They weren't thinking of me, they were thinking of themselves. Suddenly the realization that the years of what they'd considered 'idle threats' were actually real. That their partner should have been respected, actually listened too, and taken seriously from day one. Not Day one bloody thousand, at least 999 days too ****ing late.

 

So yeah in the modern parlance of TL/DR: too little, too late.

 

Thanks for your perspective. She told me the same. She basically asked why are you changing now. She's mad that I'm only doing it now, when things are over. She asked why did it take a f*cking separation filing to get your attention. So, I get it. She's had enought. We've reached terminal stage, mostly because I didn't heed all the warning signs. She's angry (understandably) and I'm out of second chances (and thirds, and fourths, and fifths). I hope one day her anger subsides and she can forgive me.

[ProdigalMe]

beatcuff

 

Thank you for your post. I am starting to mentally prepare myself for the worst case scenario. I'm mentally preparing myself to deal with all of the emotions and logistics of "the end." I tell myself, "prepare for the worst, even as you hope for the best."

[pteromom]

My attitude is just like yours. Love is something you choose, not a feeling that you hope comes over you and sustains you. But others have a different viewpoint.

 

Love IS a choice.

 

But you said:

 

She's complained about these things repeatedly and has mentioned separation/divorce many times in the last 9 years. I would make changes, but they were never permanent.

 

So your wife's complaints were not about her feelings being gone - it was about her NEEDS not being met.

 

She loved you, but felt neglected and unfulfilled.

 

She explained to you what she needed.

 

You didn't or couldn't make permanent changes to make sure she was satisfied and content with the marriage.

 

Eventually she was so resentful, it killed the love.

 

Completely different scenario than a spouse who walks away simply because they aren't feeling the butterflies, which I agree are fleeting.

[ProdigalMe]

pteromom

 

Thanks for your perspective. She is angry and resentful. I don't blame her. She gave me chance after chance, but now I've reached the limit of her patience.

Where there was love, now there's anger, resentment and numbness. I hold out hope that she makes one one more choice to love again. If not, I understand.

Edited November 19, 2015 by ProdigalMe

[moonwalker86]

moonwalker

 

I feel your pain, I really do. It's just one big ball of confusion, pain, loneliness, loss, anger, bewilderment, desperation, etc. Here's how I cope. I examine all the extreme thoughts I get (I'm unlovable, she is unique and irreplaceable, I'll forever be alone, I'll never be happy again), and consciously debunk all of it. Because none of it is true. It's just that we are prone to extreme thoughts when we're in the middle of the sucking sadness. I do deep breathing exercises. I meditate. I take long brisk walks. I count backwards from 1000 (sometimes by threes, sometimes by sevens...1000, 993, 986; it's a form of mental distraction). I practice gratitude ("thanks for this morning sun, it makes me happy"; "thanks for this great warm cup of coffee, it makes me happy"; there's ALWAYS something to be grateful for). I tell myself that she's hurting too (as much I am, if not more), so be compassionate. I come on here to vent. I recommend all these things for you, moonwalker. The sadness will be unshakeable for a while. Hang in there, take it day by day, and start to take control of your own mental processes (it's tough, but start doing it now, and in a month, you'll see some progress in how your mind react to things).

 

I can relate to everything you said, everything. I'm glad I'm not alone in the way I have been thinking. It's gotten much better today. I am looking at the positives and the hurt is lessening. Sometimes here and there something will happen and I will get this little sort of emotional stab where it hurts for a little bit, but it's more dull now, the pain isn't as strong as it was. I wish it were a different story but I've come to accept that she does not want me in her life as a lover and I will be ok. I have been telling myself things every time a thought comes to mind that tries to make me sad, I try to just talk up to myself.

I say things like, you will be ok, the pain will become a lot less as time goes on, and things like she needs to be without me to figure out her life and realize that she walked away from a good man. She hasn't been with anyone else, I think she wants to test the waters and see what's out there, she may end up regretting this decision down the road. But whatever the case is, I will be ok, she will be ok and the acceptance phase of my grief is coming into play.

There will be hard days sometimes, I'm still human, but I'm looking up more now. Thank you!

[moonwalker86]

Here's a good example of extreme thinking that I want to warn you about. Your days are difficult, as are mine, but don't make them more difficult by extreme thinking. Practice conscious debunking of extreme thoughts.

 

"Filling void." By this I think you mean that you fear being replaced and forgotten, and it may also mean you're a bit jealous that your wife will find someone to be physically intimate with. Consider this perspective: she still loves you, and there will always be a piece of her heart carved out just for you that she will never be able to get rid of, no matter how hard she tries, that she will never, ever forget. As for the physical intimacy part, I think it's natural to be jealous of that, just tell yourself that you and her used to have that too, and just because it's gone now, doesn't mean it wasn't real or special back then.

 

"Happily ever after." Long term relationships/marriage are/is hard work. So, if she enters one later, there's no happily ever after. It's more like happiness, mixed in with a lot of work and frustration, just like your own marriage.

 

So, avoid extreme thoughts. They distort reality and make the pain seem far worse.

 

You're absolutely right, 100%. I think you have a great understanding of this and I thank you for your sound advice, I will apply it to my life and things will get better.

[basil67]

I have real issues with this thread. So many say there were no real issues in the marriage but the spouse simply decided they were done. What happened to the commitment we all made in our vows? This happened to me and after 23 years she walked away. Well kind of ... Walked away from our marriage and family but took 60% of my income with her for 7 years! If you choose to walk away when there is no abuse, addiction, etc. then walk away with nothing. Only then will walk away spouses be faced with a real choice. The current system rewards this "I'm bored with you" attitude and it's at the detriment of the children!

 

I'm coming in late to this thread.

 

I left my ex-h under similar circumstances to the OP's situation. If a person's needs are not being met and the partner repeatedly refuses to address the situation, how is this having "no real issues"? If a person is unhappy in a relationship, these ARE issues which need to be addressed.

 

When I entered the marriage, I contributed about 20% of the assets. When I left, I took about 20% of the assets. Why should a person give up their share of assets because a partner refused to address the relationship problems?