I take ownership for the death of my marriage

[ProdigalMe]

Today is my first day back at work after surgery. I'm on a part-time basis for now, until I regain my strength. It was actually nice to work. I have something else to concentrate on other than my failed marriage.

 

I've been using two distraction techniques the past few weeks. First, I've been visiting my cousin and little nieces on the weekends. It's great to get out of the house, away from the four walls of my shrinking bedroom, and out into the world, and into my nieces' lives. Nothing cures a bad funk better than two little kids who squeal when they see you.

 

My second distraction technique is cooking a new recipe every week. When I concentrate on whipping up an unfamiliar recipe, measuring, slicing, keeping track of stoves and ovens, I don't have time to think about my relationship pain. And, not to sound immodest, but I'm a pretty good cook.

 

Some day soon I will add exercise to the mix. I hope that cooking, visiting, work and exercise can get me through the year in one piece.

 

Who knows if these distraction techniques are a good or bad thing? Maybe I'm just avoiding the inevitable by distracting myself, and that I still have to pay the piper later when I get nailed in the gut by unprocessed grief.

 

I will say that going full no contact is a tremendous help. When I don't see her face or hear her voice, I don't get reminded of what I've lost. And I don't torture myself about what she's doing, or whom she's with. I recommend it to anyone who is in the middle of a separation. It's daunting at first, but I think you will definitely feel better after a few weeks of no contact.

 

As always, peace to everyone walking through the dark forest.

[2.50 a gallon]

Distraction in my opinion is a good thing.

When I was in similar shoes, the number one thing I had to do to start the healing process was to find a way to stop thinking about her. At first I was obsessed, could hardly think of anything else.

I have been a model builder since I was a kid. I could spend hours building a model. I pretty much gave that up after marriage. So one of the first things I did was dive back into my models. Time spent at the hobby bench was time I was not obsessing over her. Smart guy that I am, I realized that when it came to hobbies this was an opportunity for me to try other things I had always wanted to try. I failed at raising orchids. But a co-worker introduced me to raising rare and hard to breed tropical fish took more time off of the clock. Water conditions had to be just right. Then once they began to spawn I had to collect the eggs and put them into separate containers. Then when the fry hatched they had to be fed special cultures, all of which took more chunks off of the clock,

It was like I started turning the seconds I did not think about her into minutes and later hours, and still later days and months.

As for teaching your self how to cook new recipes is a fantastic idea. I did the same thing. I began to teach myself how to cook some gourmet meals. As you are finding, the preparation takes many valuable minutes away from obsessing. In all it was a triple winner, more time away from thinking, I was rewarded with a great meal. And as I suspected when I got back into the dating scene, it was a fantastic success. Over the years I found many a gal who was eager to come over to my place for a sleep over. I like to think it was my love making that brought on the many repeats. But it also might have been the breakfast I served them in the morning. I even learned to make crepes. And one gal just adored my quiche.

Twenty years ago I began dating a gal totally out of my league in the looks department. We are still together and very much in love. Guess who does almost all of the cooking.

Edited January 20, 2016 by 2.50 a gallon

[pteromom]

I've been visiting my cousin and little nieces on the weekends. My second distraction technique is cooking a new recipe every week. Some day soon I will add exercise to the mix. I hope that cooking, visiting, work and exercise can get me through the year in one piece.

 

Who knows if these distraction techniques are a good or bad thing?

 

Those all sound like very healthy distractions to me. Connection, learning, and strength. Win!

 

You won't necessarily have to deal with unprocessed grief later. Sometimes you grow past your grief, and you are able to just leave it behind.

 

You learned a lot in this marriage that will help you in your next relationship. And you are taking time to fill yourself up before seeking out another woman.

 

You are doing everything right. Just keep moving forward and doing things that make you feel happy and whole.

[ProdigalMe]

I hope I can start turning the minutes into days. I can't even imagine turning days into weeks. But that's because I'm only one month into my separation, approximately.

[ProdigalMe]

I still frequently get moments of wistfulness and sadness. I have this sneaking suspicion that I have a lot of unexplored and unprocessed grief that I am simply ignoring by distraction. It's like a forest fire that I'm ignoring. It will grow if I don't deal with it. There's moments when I want to simply indulge in the sadness and let it wash over me.

 

How do women feel about dating a divorced man, especially if the man is the dumpee? Are they wary that they are going to start dating somebody else's damaged goods? Or do they typically give the man the benefit of the doubt and explore why he was the dumpee before deciding whether he is LTR material?

[pteromom]

I still frequently get moments of wistfulness and sadness. I have this sneaking suspicion that I have a lot of unexplored and unprocessed grief that I am simply ignoring by distraction. It's like a forest fire that I'm ignoring. It will grow if I don't deal with it. There's moments when I want to simply indulge in the sadness and let it wash over me.

 

So let yourself indulge in the sadness for MOMENTS.

 

It won't just grow though. You are in control of what you choose to focus on, and you are in control of how you discern the meaning and lessons from your story.

 

How do women feel about dating a divorced man, especially if the man is the dumpee? Are they wary that they are going to start dating somebody else's damaged goods? Or do they typically give the man the benefit of the doubt and explore why he was the dumpee before deciding whether he is LTR material?

 

You aren't "somebody else's damaged goods". You are a man, who happens to be emerging from a failed marriage. That doesn't make you any more damaged than the rest of us.

 

To answer your question, women are individuals and will have different feelings about it. I would say that not having children will increase your options. You can't think about what may or may not be attractive to the general population though - you have to seek out those who you connect with. BUT - I would not even try to start dating yet. You need to have some time on your own to regroup and redefine your single self.

 

I don't think most mature people consider those from failed relationships "dumpers" and "dumpees". Most of us realize that it takes 2 to make a relationship fail, and that it is never as simple as it seems.

[ProdigalMe]

Regarding dating, I don't want to do it until after the divorce is finalized. That means at least 6 months from the date of filing (and we haven't even filed yet). Furthermore I don't want to date until I'm emotionally ready. I probably won't be ready for at least a year. Whoever sees me in the future deserves to have both my feet firmly planted in the new relationship.

 

She says she will start dating right away (probably because she is emotionally ready since she's been thinking about divotcing me for at least a year).

 

I have to remind myself that I'm not in a foot race with her to see who can get into another relationship first.

 

Thank you for your input and perspective.

Edited January 20, 2016 by ProdigalMe

[2.50 a gallon]

Prodical

 

 

LS problem, back another day

[2.50 a gallon]

Prodigal

 

 

Although we might have walked in similar shoes, our situations were totally different. Just prior to our marriage and shortly after she graduated from college, the Ex wife accepted a job with a Fortune 100 company that moved us a thousand miles away from out home town. She was the first woman to work in her department, and her being extremely good looking, almost from day one I faced an army of co-worker OMs. I had just barely carried her over the thresh hold and we began to fight. There was nothing I could do or say that one of her co-workers could not find a way to twist it around and make me look bad.

On our six month anniversary I caught her kissing a guard where she worked. I exploded, loudly called her many bad names in front of her co-workers and told her it was unsafe to come home. Having no other place to go she went home that night with the guard.

To me the minute she cheated our marriage vows were over. I did not need another man, like a judge to tell me l was now divorced and free. We had not been married all that long, had no assets, no kids, so I just turned my back and walked away forever. I had no plans to ever remarry, so I left getting the divorce up to her.

I found myself at the bottom of a bottomless black hole of nothingness. I actually wondered whether some day in the future I might laugh again.

We had a lease and when the lease was up I moved into a very large apartment complex. And it was not long before I had more than one pretty face looking down at me and asking if I wanted to come out and play. For me that was when the real healing began. Just knowing that I was still attractive to the opposite sex, was a big step in the right direction. Getting back into the dating scene did wonders for my obsessing over her. She was quickly yesterday's news.

As for divorce baggage, I was in my mid 30's so most of the women that I dated had also been through a divorce. So it was not a problem.

I went on to have a fantastic sex life.

One other thought, it has now been over 30 years since the break up of my marriage. A few years back I Googled the ex and found a photo or two. The intervening years have not been kind to her. She is easily pushing the scales past 200. While for the past 20 years I have shared my life with the kindest sweetest most giving gal I have ever met. And even though she is a grandmother of a 20 year old, she still has and hour glass figure.

Divorce was the best thing that ever happened to me

Edited January 22, 2016 by 2.50 a gallon

[ProdigalMe]

For some reason I'm not even interested in dating or even talking to another woman right now. I feel like being alone for a while to process everything that has happened and stare up from my own black hole of nothingness.

 

I have read anecdotes of guys in their mid-40's (like me) starting over after a devastating divorce, and how they are able to rebuild their lives and find happiness again. Is this the majority? I don't know. I get this nagging feeling that the window of opportunity is closing for me, and fast. But, as the Dido song goes, I'm sure I'll "see the sun again." I'm just going to put one foot in front of the other and not pay attention to the horizon right now.

 

Question for you. Your ex kissed another man, but apparently had not proceeded past that. Why was that the final straw for you? Other couples reconcile after more serious transgressions. Sometimes the thought crosses my mind that if we don't divorce, do I have the capacity to forgive? My ego says f*ck no. But the compassionate me recognizes her cheating as the desperate act of someone who felt neglected and lonely. Even the lost deserve to find a way back home.

 

Thanks again for your input, 2.50.

[2.50 a gallon]

I have always pretty much liked living alone. I could do what I wanted, with whom ever I wanted, when ever I wanted. I liked my hobbies. I liked fishing, back packing, and riding my motorcycle very fast. Sometimes when I went fishing, it was in the back country, where few fisherman fished. Bringing a lady with me, or back packing, was a pain and slowed me down. Same thing when riding my motorcycle, you can't go all out with a rider.

Other than my Ex-fiancé, age 27 - 30, I had no desire to couple up.

When I met my Ex, she had just barely turned 19 to my 32. It was she who pursued me. I told her she was too young and a college drop out loser. She immediately signed up for college. And when I still ignored her, her mom who had just separated from her father, had a talk with me, that it was OK for me to screw her daughter, as because of me she was back in school.

When she graduated, she wanted to now marry me.

At that time I was the only one of a dozen grand children capable of passing on the family name. As such for over a decade I had gotten lots of family heat to marry and start a family. I was lucky in that 3 of my grand parents were still alive. So a lot of my saying yes came from my family.

Also the Ex was total fold out material. And sexually she was game for anything, any where, any place, any time. My thoughts were if I have to chose just one, I might as well chose the hottest one.

The any place, any where, any time ended when we got back from our honey moon. She was now my wife and not my slut as she put it.

And then came the co-workers. There was a lot involved, but as I noted we fought almost constantly for five months. I fell in love with her when I saw her walking down the aisle. I wanted to have kids and a family. So I tried and tried, but the co-workers just kept putting their noses in my business.

I was journeyman in my trade and was offered a night job, which is usually the normal thing in my trade. I would have made much more money than her. But being in a new city she was afraid to be by herself at night. So I took a job at about half of what I could have been making. Her co-workers told her I was only in it for her money. We constantly fought over money.

What ever I tried to do they could turn it negative.

One kiss, I was too cold, two kisses I was now clingy. In fact the night before she had again accused me of being clingy.

I know just kissing, making out, but on our six month anniversary? I have never been so mad in my life. Had there not been a chain link fence with razor wire on top I would have been at them and still in jail.

I thought I knew how to manage may anger. For years when ever I need it the most I had leaned to just take a sip. On that day, there was no sipping, I was out of control and it scared me. I no longer trusted her. And I had had it with that relationship. No matter how bad it hurt it was over.

Also I come from a very bad neighborhood. To turn your cheek was dangerous. If you did not fight back they would never leave you alone.

So revenge was part of my character.

In that vain I had met some of the co-workers wives and they looked like they would be fun to get in bed, and they were

Edited January 22, 2016 by 2.50 a gallon

[ProdigalMe]

Earlier this week, she asked if she could do some laundry at my place on Saturday (today). I said ok. Didn't think anything of it; no big deal. Besides, I planned to be absent anyway. She has one of those coin-op laundry things at her apartment, and doesn't like using it.

 

On Friday night it was raining, and I came home from work at 9 pm. There were four dry marks (from tires) on my driveway that signified a car had parked there recently. Who was it? Her? Nobody else would park in that spot. If it was her, why would she come by unannounced at night? Her usual practice is to send me a text before she comes over.

 

On Saturday morning, she didn't send a text. She just showed up at 9 am and came in (she still has a key). Mind you, she's never showed up this early. Luckily, I was already dressed and ready to go. Which is what I did. We chatted, very briefly, then I said I had to go, and walked out. She seemed upset that I didn't want to stay and chat (she wants to friend-zone me, but I will have no part of that). She offered to drive me around (I'm still recovering some from surgery). I declined.

 

I walked out to preserve the no contact/limited contact. I plan to stay away until she's done with her laundry. But, man, she sure was acting weird. Is she trying to spy on me? To see if there's someone else here? If so, why would she even care? She told me in no uncertain terms that we're getting divorced and that she has absolutely no feelings towards me, so why would she even care if someone else was here?

Edited January 23, 2016 by ProdigalMe

[M1ke12]

Earlier this week, she asked if she could do some laundry at my place on Saturday (today). I said ok. Didn't think anything of it; no big deal. Besides, I planned to be absent anyway. She has one of those coin-op laundry things at her apartment, and doesn't like using it.

 

On Friday night it was raining, and I came home from work at 9 pm. There were four dry marks (from tires) on my driveway that signified a car had parked there recently. Who was it? Her? Nobody else would park in that spot. If it was her, why would she come by unannounced at night? Her usual practice is to send me a text before she comes over.

 

On Saturday morning, she didn't send a text. She just showed up at 9 am and came in (she still has a key). Mind you, she's never showed up this early. Luckily, I was already dressed and ready to go. Which is what I did. We chatted, very briefly, then I said I had to go, and walked out. She seemed upset that I didn't want to stay and chat (she wants to friend-zone me, but I will have no part of that). She offered to drive me around (I'm still recovering some from surgery). I declined.

 

I walked out to preserve the no contact/limited contact. I plan to stay away until she's done with her laundry. But, man, she sure was acting weird. Is she trying to spy on me? To see if there's someone else here? If so, why would she even care? She told me in no uncertain terms that we're getting divorced and that she has absolutely no feelings towards me, so why would she even care if someone else was here?

 

I would try not to read to much into this. It may cause you to get your hopes up.

[lolablue17]

Few things on my mind. First, i would like to greet you for taking care of yourself, reasonably and wisely. Secondly, i want to challenge your decision "Not to go dating until ____".

 

I'm not suggesting to go dating by a forced decision, but why invalidate it in advance? It's not the "dating" that is important. It's your confidence that should be built. Not just to find relationship immediately or to get laid, but to hang out, have some social life with new people?

 

You should consider that, with no stress or pressure, but with the motivation to feel some fresh air. What have you got to loose? Your headline is "I take ownership for the death of my marriage". May offer that you also take ownership for you fun, amusements joy and happiness for the rest of your life. Be open, bless life and what can they offer.

 

Third thing - about your wife's feelings. Don't try to understand that. her mind and feelings are influenced by many factors. You will be amazed to hear stories like yours that got into the phase which the wife saw her divorced husband finding a better and happy relationship, and regret it all. She may regret after making some "market research", and understanding how she misses you.

 

She can change her mind and feelings many times, and she might never change her mind. The best thing for you is to gain confidence and improve your social life, I suggest also with women.

[NewLeaf512]

I'm going to go out on a limb here. For the 180. For your safety. For your privacy:

 

Get your bloody key back and don't leave her alone in your place.

[ProdigalMe]

Thank you for recommending a middle path. No hermitry. No hedonism.

 

It's strange. This may be the most painful chapter in my life. But I don't feel an overwhelming urge to drown in liquor. There's something to be said about allowing yourself to really feel it. To stare back at the big panther of misery, fear and chaos without looking for the exit or sprinting for it.

[ProdigalMe]

In the ongoing struggle to understand myself and how I contribute to strained relationships, I researched covert narcissism.

 

Here is a link to a scored test: 23 Signs You?re Secretly a Narcissist Masquerading as a Sensitive Introvert - Scientific American Blog Network

 

I scored a 64. About average according to the above site.

 

And here is more information on covert narcissism: Covert Narcissism - Know Your Emotional Abuser | Info Self Development

 

On one hand, I am relieved that on the continuum of narcissism, I am apparently average in relation to the general population.

 

On the other hand, I gotta be concerned whenever my uglier traits rear their heads in front of the people I love.

 

Ah, self-awareness. It's the first step to improving yourself, and reducing your own @sshole tendencies.

 

I strive to be better, more authentic, more transparent, more empathetic and more conscious of my actions. That's my New Year's resolution.

Edited January 26, 2016 by ProdigalMe

[ProdigalMe]

For those of you knee-deep in a separation (or divorce) that you don't want, this is my "I know how you feel" post.

 

I'm a month into my separation. My wife told me last night that she will move the rest of her things out of my apartment this coming Saturday. Then she will return the key to me. It's things like this that can get me extremely sad and helpless.

 

Even if her love now feels cheap (she cheated on me in December), I can't help but have these grief-filled moments that come swiftly and with surprising knee-crumpling power. This is a woman I once loved and trusted, for 16 years (married 9).

 

Luckily, I manage to pick myself back up 24 hours later, and I replace grief with a bit of optimism and dark humor. Maybe it sounds vindictive, but I have my "f*ck you" moments where I tell her (in my head) "begone cheater; go be someone else's problem now" (this helps me deal with grief and jealousy).

 

Hard-charging music brings on the optimism and dark humor, but I remind myself to not indulge in the anger too much. Anger serves a limited purpose: to pull myself out of a pity-party, but once it serves its purpose, I tell myself to let it go. She's a faulty human being who made mistakes; who am I to be too judgmental and angry? Note: this does not mean I forgive her, or condone her behavior. It just means "let it be." To those of you struggling with grief and jealousy, I hope this post helps. You are not alone.

 

On another note, the separation paperwork should be final in 3 weeks or so. Strangely enough, she is waiving spousal support payments. In other words, she is leaving tens of thousands of dollars on the table. I think it's her guilty conscience talking. I imagine her thought process is like this: "I'm blowing up my marriage, I slept with another man, and now I'm going to have my ex-husband financially support the lifestyle to which I have grown accustomed?" To her credit, she sees how ridiculous this thought process is. Better for me. Here's to silver linings.

[ProdigalMe]

I found out that the other man (a single father who is my wife's age; they work in the same building) has gotten cold feet and doesn't want to hang out with my wife as much. Mind you, a month ago they were texting each other 3 hours a day. And even had sex.

 

And I know my wife wanted a relationship with him but since he's grown cold she has blocked his number.

 

I don't know whether to be happy or sad. On one hand, it serves her right to have this blow up in her face. I wasn't the best husband, but I certainly didn't deserve her cheating. On the other hand, I'm sad that she seems so lost. A person in their right mind would have known that Mr. Soulmate was looking for a quick lay, nothing more (and would predictably go radio silent once he got what he wanted). But she seems adrift and didn't know that when you reek of desperation, men run for the hills (but not before getting sex first).

 

I learned that affter she moved out she went on a girls night at a club, had 10 shots, and was thrown out for being drunk. She's never done that before. Maybe she's realizing the enormity and gravity of what she's done. Or not.

[RySant]

But you started separation in November. And I believe she expressed her moving out by that time.

 

Is it still cheating if you are already separated? Or has this been going on for a while now?

[ProdigalMe]

But you started separation in November. And I believe she expressed her moving out by that time.

 

Is it still cheating if you are already separated? Or has this been going on for a while now?

 

We finally separated on December 30. But before that she lived me with, and was still sleeping in my bed. And, we're still legally married.

 

I found out she was sleeping with another guy during the time she was still living with me.

[ProdigalMe]

I am now officially legally separated. I expect that we will file for divorce in February.

 

I wish my recovery were linear. Instead, it's all over the place.

 

One moment I think I've accepted reality, feel determined to move on, and am hopeful and optimistic about my future.

 

The next moment, I feel a crushing despair, and near-panic that I'm losing her forever. On that note, I know I'm probably losing her as a wife, forever, but maybe not as a friend. She wants to remain friends, but I'm not so sure. Maybe in a year, maybe in two years, but definitely not right now.

 

Has anyone tried to remain friends with an ex- and then regret it later?

Has anyone refused to be friends with an ex- and then regret it later?

[testmeasure]

When there are kids involved, the parents often have to meet in order to exchange the kids, as well as provide any information important to their care. In many cases they have to work together to make major decisions jointly.

 

From what I read, sometimes divorced parents can get along well and work together for the kids sake. Some even say they enjoying working with their ex.

 

In other cases it goes so horribly that they are lucky if they can find ways around ever having to meet or communicate. There can be yelling, screaming, refusal to turn the kids over, calling the police, using the kids against the ex, turning the kids against the ex, you name it.

 

Anything is possible. It just depends how each of you feel.

 

I would go along with whatever she wants till the divorce is final. Get that that thing about no spousal support in the final divorce papers. After that it's up to you whether you ever see her again. Before that's finalized, don't rock the boat on anything. Needlessly burning up any remaining good will there is, could be expensive. Not just on spousal support. The more generous her starting point on anything, the better for you, and the easier it will make the process. It's a funny thing to be saying given that she's one who cheated and hear I am, telling you not to squander any good will you have with her. But it's a practical point.

 

 

.

Edited February 4, 2016 by testmeasure

[ProdigalMe]

 

I would go along with whatever she wants till the divorce is final. Get that that thing about no spousal support in the final divorce papers. After that it's up to you whether you ever see her again. Before that's finalized, don't rock the boat on anything. Needlessly burning up any remaining good will there is, could be expensive. Not just on spousal support. The more generous her starting point on anything, the better for you, and the easier it will make the process. It's a funny thing to be saying given that she's one who cheated and hear I am, telling you not to squander any good will you have with her. But it's a practical point.

 

 

.

 

Point well taken. I look at it like this: For months I've been losing the chess match, losing pieces left and right. I was on my way to a crushing loss, but then she failed to capture my queen (waived spousal support forever). Now I'm playing my way back to a draw (as long as I don't rock the boat).

[testmeasure]

Point well taken. I look at it like this: For months I've been losing the chess match, losing pieces left and right. I was on my way to a crushing loss, but then she failed to capture my queen (waived spousal support forever). Now I'm playing my way back to a draw (as long as I don't rock the boat).

 

Are you sure she can waive it permanently in separation paperwork?

 

Separation is different in different states. Some even require a waiting period before actual divorce can be started. But generally "separation" is viewed as there's still the possibility of getting back together. That flipping to divorce with a permanent no possibility is a pretty big change of circumstance. That the legal structure would not allow her to reconsider spousal support when the separation turns to a divorce seems implausible. (but I really don't know and it probably varies by state)

 

My ex did not request child support at first. In the middle of the temporary orders she was able to change her mind and request it. Child support may actually be different though. I think they can waive it even in the final and come back later to ask for it. This is because the state views child support as being about the child. If both parents are in total agreement to waive it, or do something "odd", the state will follow that. But as soon as one of them has any issue about it, the state will pull out calculators and figure it up.

 

So I'd be very, very clear with an attorney in your state about whether this spousal support thing is totally in the bag or not.

 

In general, I worry too much, but enjoy what I have. The result is I end up covering all the bases, and then focusing on positives. I always did do my homework first and then go have fun. "Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst." But it's more like prepare for the worst first, then go have the best time of your life each and every day.

 

Sounds like you're already in a don't rock the boat mode, you seem pretty level headed. Stop losing chess pieces. Hopefully you already have.

 

 

.

Edited February 4, 2016 by testmeasure