Does anyone ever deserve physical abuse?

[thinkhappy]

A couple of thoughts on this:

 

1. You married a rage machine, a verbal abuser and a physical abuser. Physical abuse doesn't have to come in the form of a punch or a kick. An arm around a neck or a shove is just as real as a punch or a kick.

 

2. No one ever deserves to be physically abused by a loved one. Period.

 

3. Abusers rarely change and they certainly don't change on their own. I can only think of one reformed abuser success story - Rod Smith, former wide receiver for the Denver Broncos. I am sure there are more but the common thread would be that they went and got real, meaningful help. This is especially true if the abuser is a rage machine. That is to say, the reason he/she abuses is that he/she doesn't have the tools or the skills to deal with negative emotions and conflict. Those skills don't just magically appear one day - at least not in adults.

 

4. All that being said, you are wise to recognize how your behavior can escalate a conflict. That's not equivocation. People do it all the time in relationships that don't have a single iota of abuse. "How can I handle a conflict better with my spouse/SO" - that's just relationship 101. But don't think for a second that any of your actions explain away his physical abuse. You simply don't hurt the ones you love. Period. I'd rather curl up in the fetal position and cry like a child than ever physically harm someone I love regardless of what they might be doing to me.

 

5. You are not at fault for his physical abuse. You are not at fault for his physical abuse. You are not at fault for his physical abuse. That should be your mantra.

 

Look OP: this marriage is going to go downhill fast unless you and your husband get real help quick. I wouldn't hesitate to give him an ultimatum - we both go to anger management/conflict resolution therapy or we get a divorce. Simple as that. Either we work to save our relationship or we go our separate ways before one of us ends up battered and the other in prison.

 

Best of luck and consider yourself hugged!

 

I totally, totally agree with you - especially the bolded above.

 

If I hadn't cried all of my tears out in the last 2 days, your post would have brought me to tears. I know we are all strangers on here, but your support means so much to me. Thank you!

[understand50]

thinkhappy

 

If you were my sister, or daughter, I would be comming over to have a word, long the lines of "if you abuse her again, real trouble will follow"

 

Look, this is unacceptable, but you must be the one to stand up for yourself. You must not put up with this. Family, freinds can help if they know what is going on. Talk to your husband when he is sober, he may be horrified at himself and change. If not you must leave as these things tend to get out of control.

 

Take care of yourself

[thinkhappy]

......now here is where the water gets a little murky.

 

If things are escalating verbally and he is attempting to defuse the situation and deescalate by walking away (which is wise and appropriate on his part IMHO) and you initiate physical contact with him to block his escape, he may be justified in using an equal or lesser amount of physical force to escape the confrontation.

 

He would not be justified in using a greater amount of force.

 

Do you see where I am going with all of this???

 

It is all about context and proportioned response. If a response is reasonable and proportioned given the circumstances, it likely would not rise to the bar of abuse or assault.

 

But if it is not reasonable and is disproportionate to circumstances, then it does.

 

If you are screaming at him and verbally assaulting him and are escalating in your confrontation towards him and he is trying to getaway from the confrontation and you are shoving him or grabbing on to him to restrain him - he is justified in brushing off your grip or pushing you away from him to enable his escape, provided his pushing is only equal and proportional to the level of your restraint.

 

If she strikes you or intentionally slams you into a wall in a manner that is not proportional or necessary to enable his escape, that is not justified.

 

I am definitely not screaming at him and verbally assaulting him when this happens. And I am definitely not putting my hands on him, either. Usually it's a case of him attacking me verbally and me defending myself, or defending why I brought up a conversation that he sees as negative (i.e. something that he has done that makes me uncomfortable, like getting drunk to the point where he has episodes where he doesn't remember anything.) I feel like we are both always on the defensive with each other. He is always assuming what I have to say is negative and picking a fight, and I am just trying to have a normal, rational, adult conversation with him. I don't start talking faster or louder until he tells me that I am ridiculous, or says that I can't control him, or insults me in some way shape or form. It's an awful cycle and my best "ammunition" has been silence...which my therapist suggested...but it's very difficult for me not to talk about the situation after my H has apologized for his behavior and want to take steps to prevent it from happening again. It goes against my nature of wanting to work things out and come up with a solution that works for the both of us, for the betterment of our marriage. My H just likes to sweep everything under the rug and move on.

[thinkhappy]

I know this feeling, and I hate "something in the air" too. But with an angry and abusive person....you just aren't going to get resolution by pushing for it.

 

NOTE: He is being unjustifiably abusive, absolutely.

 

I will share from the other side of the "resolve it now" equation though. There were times that discussions (read: crazy-making) with my ex would last for hours. Well, unless I just took the blame for everything and took back every bit of real expression of anything negative. And if I went to bed before HE felt better, he would either follow me or bang things around so I couldn't sleep. I remember more than one occasion he had me cornered in the bedroom and wouldn't let me leave. I didn't lash out, but I felt the fight or flight thing big time, and since I knew it was wrong to react physically, I just cowered in the corner and cried.

 

When he wants to leave after gaslighting, verbally abusing, and insulting you...my advice would be to let him, and call someone for help.

 

And have your phone in your pocket. The next time he touches you AT ALL during an argument, I would step back and call 911.

 

This happens with us, too. These discussions sometimes last for hours, and it is so frustrating because nothing gets solved. When do you hold up your hands and decide that a problem does not need to be resolved and when do you persist until it is? I will admit to being the one to keep carrying on the conversation because I just want to fix things.

 

I know you are right, though - I'm not going to get resolution by pushing for it. I just don't know when it's ok to move on and not solve it and when it needs to be solved.

 

It does bother me that he can go to bed with me crying next to him, knowing he has hurt me to the core. Usually, if I start crying, it makes him even more angry, and he snaps that he "can't handle [my] emotions."

 

I did tell him the following day after he grabbed me around the neck that the next time he touched me, I was calling 911 and his a$$ was going to jail.

[oldshirt]

Please understand I am not pointing fingers at you. You came on here asking if his treatment of you is justified and whether or not you are deserving of this treatment.

 

What I am doing is giving you a standard by which to determine if his behavior is justifiable or not.

 

It is quite simple, the questions to ask is are his actions reasonable? Which means would any other sane, sober reasonable adult due the same thing in a similar circumstance?

 

And is his behavior proportional to the circumstances he is being faced with? Is he responding with a lesser or equal degree of confrontation, or is he responding with a greater degree of confrontation?

 

If your answers to both questions is he is responding as any sane, sober, responsible adult would AND he is responding with a proportional and restrained amount of force, then it's not abuse/assault.

 

But if the answer to either of those questions is no, then it is not justifiable.

[elaine567]

I'm sorry to be a broken record but my H has told me so many times during an argument that I am not right, "get a f**ing grip of yourself", that I'm not normal, and has basically made me question every single thing I ever do and say. I used to think I had a lot of the answers in life, but he has made me question myself and how I handle relationships. I have never had a problem in a relationship like this in my life - and he says he has never spoken to anyone in a relationship the degrading way he has spoken to me and has never lifted a finger to anyone. He has told me "Doesn't that worry you? That you bring the very worst out of me?"

 

This is classic emotional abuse.

He leads you to believe he is not at fault YOU ARE, he is not crazy YOU ARE.

Please read about it in this short book.

Living with the Dominator

by Pat Craven - Kindle edition available

AND

You will most likely be a people pleaser, abusers specifically select people like you for relationships, as they know you will put up with their nonsense.

It is not by chance, it is a deliberate choice.

Watch this -

[thinkhappy]

This is classic emotional abuse.

He leads you to believe he is not at fault YOU ARE, he is not crazy YOU ARE.

Please read about it in this short book.

Living with the Dominator

by Pat Craven - Kindle edition available

AND

You will most likely be a people pleaser, abusers specifically select people like you for relationships, as they know you will put up with their nonsense.

It is not by chance, it is a deliberate choice.

Watch this -

 

Thank you for the book suggestion. He borrows my Kindle sometimes - do you know of a covert way to read it online without downloading it to my Kindle?

 

And I am most definitely a people pleaser. One million percent.

 

I love my H. As much of a bastard he can be at times, I really do love him. I just can't see how he would have premeditated and chosen me for this specific reason? Especially since I am the one who "squawks" the most out of anyone he has been in a relationship with. His gf he had before me was extremely passive and naive, and he admits that he took full advantage of that.

[Grumpybutfun]

I am 6'3 and 248 lbs. My wife is 5'0 and 100 lbs. so under no circumstances would I ever do anything that would make her feel intimidated or afraid by my sheer size and rage. She could be hanging off me like a jungle gym going nuts and I wouldn't even think about shoving her or telling her F you....not that she has ever done anything like that.

You blocking the door or trying to control the timeline in which a response or resolve is met is ill advised because he is an abuser. I am not an abuser so my wife gets to rant and I get to ask for a time out if I'm not feeling like I can contribute without being an angry ass. What you described was so foreign to me....pushing into bathtubs, calling you names, insulting your intelligence, drunkenly fighting, etc. that I can't fathom how you think this is even a question of whether this is your fault. If this is indeed what has happened.....

 

 

You are married to an alcoholic. Binging twenty beers and blacking out and then having rage episodes are the actions of a full scale binge alcoholic. He needs help you cant give and he will not stop without it.

 

You are married to a wife abuser who uses his size, power and rage to intimidate you. This is who he is and you can not change him. He needs help in which he seeks to fix himself.

 

You are married to a man who refuses to get therapy for his issues because he thinks you are the one with issues. He is a classic mental abuser. (Look up gas lighting and read Codependency No More by Melody Beattie.)

 

Yes, it is time to leave....like yesterday. Get those children away from that man before he finds excuses to abuse them too. Your daughters do not to be raised in an atmosphere where they think this is normal....this is abusing them because it gives them abuse as normalcy.

 

Not even a question.....this is abuse and is not acceptable.

 

Good luck,

Grumps

[elaine567]

Thank you for the book suggestion. He borrows my Kindle sometimes - do you know of a covert way to read it online without downloading it to my Kindle?

 

And I am most definitely a people pleaser. One million percent.

 

I love my H. As much of a bastard he can be at times, I really do love him. I just can't see how he would have premeditated and chosen me for this specific reason? Especially since I am the one who "squawks" the most out of anyone he has been in a relationship with. His gf he had before me was extremely passive and naive, and he admits that he took full advantage of that.

 

He was scouting around for people pleasers, anyone who showed they will not tolerate being used or anyone with healthy boundaries he will have binned right away. He was looking for a certain type of woman, he will most likely have tested you.

 

He will eventually make you passive and scared and unsure of yourself and your sanity.

He will try to isolate you, by either actively telling you you cannot see friends and relatives or he will make it so awkward and difficult you choose not to go see them or bring them to your home.

You will eventually self isolate due to shame and depression.

Your self esteem will be in your boots and you will live tip toeing on eggshells in case you trigger a reaction.

Your opinions will not be your own, as you will have to mould them to please him, and even if you agree with him, he will still try to prove you are wrong and cause a scene.

 

You can get a pdf version here - Living With The Dominator by Pat Craven.

 

Grumpybutfun is right, get your girls away from him ASAP.

[Mrin]

Oh I didn't see there are children (especially daughters) involved. Yes - you need to put an end to this immediately if only for the sake of your daughters. My GF grew up seeing her mom abused and consequentially she ended up dating a long string of abusive men.

 

You need to put an end to this ASAP. Divorce or immediate anger management therapy for the both of you. Professional help. You can't allow your daughters to get tainted by this. You just can't.

 

Ask yourself this question - would you let a feral tiger live in the same house with your daughters? Even if the tiger was really kind and gentle? And you loved the tiger. No. You wouldn't because there is a small chance that your daughters could get hurt. You just wouldn't take that chance. Well, if your girls are witnessing this abuse, even the verbal and emotional abuse, then I can guarantee with 100% certainty that they are getting hurt. Right now.

 

Ugh. Please, don't be afraid to either call it quits or issue an ultimatum to get professional help.

[thinkhappy]

I promise that my kids don't see this - he does this all behind closed doors. Not that they don't see when there's tension or when I don't prevent him from storming off, and they see he's not here and ask me where he is, sometimes I tell them he's in a grumpy mood and needed alone time, or sometimes I just say "I don't know" because I don't always know where he's gone (it's usually on a walk or for a drive somewhere.)

 

I also want to clarify that he's not an alcoholic - he doesn't drink every day and not even every week - but he went on 2 of these benders a couple of months ago which really put me on edge. I just used that as an example of something that has triggered an argument in the past. It didn't happen at all last month so it's not a regular thing, but he has a particular group of friends who also binge drink and when they get together, they all seem to lose a sense of responsible drinking.

 

My H can be really sweet and kind and thoughtful, and a great stepdad to especially my youngest. Again, he isn't like this all of the time or I wouldn't have married him nor stuck around. He is generally a fantastic partner, except when the chips are down and he has anything to do with it.

 

Oh, and I can't just move out to try and get him to take our problems seriously. The house is in my name from before we were married. Plus, I have my kids to consider. Again, I know they know things aren't rosy with us 24/7 but I think/pray that they are largely unaware of the depth of the situation. If nothing else, I am grateful that my H is respectful of me in front of my kids. It's in private that the unleashing comes about.

 

Oh -- one more thing about the alcohol issue. He never rages when he is drunk. He is either a happy drunk or obnoxious one, lol - but never a mean one. What is MUCH MUCH worse is when he is hung over. A lot of our arguments happen a day or two after he has been drinking.

Edited July 7, 2015 by thinkhappy
Typo again

[TaraMaiden2]

Could you please stop trying to justify everything by using the excuses of how really, he is such a lovely guy and all, and the kids don't know (you pray!) and that you can't do this, or that, and honest he's not an alcoholic really, and ordinarily he's super-kind....

 

The guy is an abuser.

 

Face it, deal with it and do something about it.

 

If the house is in your name - change the locks and kick him out and tell him he gets nothing more from you until he tackles his problems head-on.

 

YOU ARE MARRIED TO AN [HIGHLIGHT]ABUSER.[/HIGHLIGHT]

 

Don't really know how to make it any clearer to you.

[jen1447]

^ OP is in full-on bargaining mode, unfortunately. Probably not reachable at this point.

[coryreply]

OP, would H be open to going to counseling?

[BlueIris]

I agree with jen1447 that you're in bargaining mode. You're certainly defending him. Even though it's already been said: Abusers are nice and even great sometimes.

 

But I want to say this, and I'm saying it because it was told to me and it flipped the switch for me: Your kids are aware and they learn from the adults in their home, as all kids do. You're teaching them. He is too. Saying he's just "grumpy" gives them the green light- from you- to act the way he does if they feel grumpy. You end up endorsing the behavior or pretending about it: "It's no big deal to act like that, it's just he way people act when they're grumpy." Accepting this from him and in your home is normalizing it for your children.

 

Yes, he is abusive and only you can do something about yourself and your kids' lives.

 

Also, consider this:

 

Thank you for the book suggestion. He borrows my Kindle sometimes - do you know of a covert way to read it online without downloading it to my Kindle?

 

You’re so afraid of him, you’re afraid that he'll find out that you're reading a book you want to read.

 

Don’t live like this. And don’t show your kids that it is ok or normal to live like this.

[BetrayedH]

I can say that I don't think he would lay a finger on me if I didn't get in his way of leaving...but saying that, I do think there was one time where he started screaming at me and got nose to nose, pointing in my face how dare I blah blah blah (I can't even remember what it was, but I think I had called him out on his bad attitude and he didn't appreciate it.)

 

That's what I mean, though...inviting a physical response - to me, this means that he had a reason for doing what he did and I am to blame. This is what he tells me, too. This is what confuses me...because I was always taught men shouldn't lay a finger on women.

 

And he definitely has crossed the line, but I am not sure what measures he needs to take, other than to work on himself and stop with the verbal abuse and physical lashings.

 

While I agree that men should never lay a finger on a woman, that doesn't give women free license to start getting physical and blame it on the man when he retaliates. I'm not suggesting that what he did was right but I don't think you should physically try to stop him when he's trying to leave either. I'm simply recommending that you remove any blame you might have in these situations. But in the end, he owns his actions and you own yours.

 

And I'd agree with your last statement...he needs to work on himself, stop the verbal abuse, and thr physical lashings. If he can do that and you can accept his other behaviors, you may have something to work with.

 

All that said, I haven't read the whole thread, or your others. Fundamentally, I believe you have to establish a healthy boundary for yourself. Don't accept unacceptable treatment.

[Babs22]

I agree with jen1447 that you're in bargaining mode. You're certainly defending him. Even though it's already been said: Abusers are nice and even great sometimes.

 

But I want to say this, and I'm saying it because it was told to me and it flipped the switch for me: Your kids are aware and they learn from the adults in their home, as all kids do. You're teaching them. He is too. Saying he's just "grumpy" gives them the green light- from you- to act the way he does if they feel grumpy. You end up endorsing the behavior or pretending about it: "It's no big deal to act like that, it's just he way people act when they're grumpy." Accepting this from him and in your home is normalizing it for your children.

 

Yes, he is abusive and only you can do something about yourself and your kids' lives.

 

Also, consider this:

 

 

 

You’re so afraid of him, you’re afraid that he'll find out that you're reading a book you want to read.

 

Don’t live like this. And don’t show your kids that it is ok or normal to live like this.

 

Thinkhappy, It is obvious to all here who have read this thread that your husband is abusive. He should never even lay a finger on you. He is abusive in every way, emotionally, verbally, and physically. And even though you say your daughters don't see this, they are very aware. You are teaching them that this type of behavior is ok. Your H has many problems, more than I think can be dealt with quickly or easily. He hasn't even been willing to go to IC, so him changing is not going to happen. I am worried about the safety of both you and your daughters. He has already escalated to putting an arm across your throat. Why you didn't pack up and leave right then, I will never know. He also seems to have a drinking problem. Anyone who drinks to the point of blacking out has a problem. When alcohol is effecting a person's relationships, they have a drinking problem.

 

There would never be any reason for it to be ok for him to lay a finger on you. And just like any abuser, they love to blame the victim. And just like any victim, you are questioning everything you used to know. You have let his accusations and blaming you for his actions get into your head.

 

I suggest you open up to some family members and let them know what is going on. You need to get out of this M, he won't get any better while you are there. For your own safety, I would stay out of his way. Do not try to reason with him. You have tried this before and admitted that nothing is ever solved. Talking to him, reasoning with him, rationalizing with him does not work. If he gets angry, I would take my kids and leave. Have a bag with a change of clothes, money, toiletries, medicines, etc. packed and leave it in the trunk of your car. Do not put up with this for one more minute.

 

Please do what you need to do to protect yourself and your daughters. They seriously should not be growing up exposed to this type of treatment.

 

I am sorry that you have found yourself in this situation. It is not fair and it does not matter that you love him. You cannot enable him anymore. I loved my brother to death, he is a recovering alcoholic now. Everyone had to leave him and he had to hit rock bottom before he finally started to go to AA.

[thinkhappy]

OP, would H be open to going to counseling?

 

Sometimes he agrees to it, when the argument or confrontation has blown over, but then when push comes to shove, he always backs out or says he doesn't need counseling.

 

I agree with jen1447 that you're in bargaining mode. You're certainly defending him. Even though it's already been said: Abusers are nice and even great sometimes.

 

But I want to say this, and I'm saying it because it was told to me and it flipped the switch for me: Your kids are aware and they learn from the adults in their home, as all kids do. You're teaching them. He is too. Saying he's just "grumpy" gives them the green light- from you- to act the way he does if they feel grumpy. You end up endorsing the behavior or pretending about it: "It's no big deal to act like that, it's just he way people act when they're grumpy." Accepting this from him and in your home is normalizing it for your children.

 

Yes, he is abusive and only you can do something about yourself and your kids' lives.

 

Also, consider this:

 

 

You’re so afraid of him, you’re afraid that he'll find out that you're reading a book you want to read.

 

Don’t live like this. And don’t show your kids that it is ok or normal to live like this.

 

Yes, I am. I was also afraid both times I went to counseling. I wasn't afraid for my safety, but I was almost certain a fight would ensue afterward. He is mortified if I speak with anyone about our issues...even if it's a total stranger. He doesn't like how he can't tell his side of the story, even though he has been given the opportunity to, multiple times.

 

Thinkhappy, It is obvious to all here who have read this thread that your husband is abusive. He should never even lay a finger on you. He is abusive in every way, emotionally, verbally, and physically. And even though you say your daughters don't see this, they are very aware. You are teaching them that this type of behavior is ok. Your H has many problems, more than I think can be dealt with quickly or easily. He hasn't even been willing to go to IC, so him changing is not going to happen. I am worried about the safety of both you and your daughters. He has already escalated to putting an arm across your throat. Why you didn't pack up and leave right then, I will never know. He also seems to have a drinking problem. Anyone who drinks to the point of blacking out has a problem. When alcohol is effecting a person's relationships, they have a drinking problem.

 

There would never be any reason for it to be ok for him to lay a finger on you. And just like any abuser, they love to blame the victim. And just like any victim, you are questioning everything you used to know. You have let his accusations and blaming you for his actions get into your head.

 

I suggest you open up to some family members and let them know what is going on. You need to get out of this M, he won't get any better while you are there. For your own safety, I would stay out of his way. Do not try to reason with him. You have tried this before and admitted that nothing is ever solved. Talking to him, reasoning with him, rationalizing with him does not work. If he gets angry, I would take my kids and leave. Have a bag with a change of clothes, money, toiletries, medicines, etc. packed and leave it in the trunk of your car. Do not put up with this for one more minute.

 

Please do what you need to do to protect yourself and your daughters. They seriously should not be growing up exposed to this type of treatment.

 

I am sorry that you have found yourself in this situation. It is not fair and it does not matter that you love him. You cannot enable him anymore. I loved my brother to death, he is a recovering alcoholic now. Everyone had to leave him and he had to hit rock bottom before he finally started to go to AA.

 

I wish I could open up to them. They would probably be very angry with him and I am not sure they would forgive him. Plus, my H would for sure leave me if I let any of our family know what is going on.

 

This is exactly what I feel like I am doing. And why am I so weak that I put up with it? I am the one who ended my first M. It's not as if I am a glutton for punishment and love being treated improperly...although I know that is exactly what I am doing in this case.

 

I know I can be a pain in the a$$ sometimes. I know I need reassurance sometimes, I know I could/should let more stuff roll off my back without making a peep, I know I can be hot headed at times and get really upset about something and rant about it for a few minutes before I am back to my normal happy self. I do not proclaim to be the perfect woman. But I know that I am a good wife to him. And the irony of it all is he feels like he is walking on eggshells around me, but I feel exactly the same way about him. He has a tendency to let the smallest, most minor issues get blown out of proportion and gets livid and disgusted with me so easily. I can honestly say that even though I get annoyed with him sometimes, I rarely get angry with him. Those are 2 very different emotions to me, but maybe I am wrong?

 

An example: if he is feeling overheated (which makes him grumpy), or just in a mood for whatever reason, if he were to accidentally trip over something that was inadvertently left on the floor, he has been known to curse and kick that object because he is mad that he tripped. My ex-H did not do this and we were married for a long time, but I don't remember my ex boyfriends ever doing this, either. But maybe I am wrong? Maybe that is a normal response when someone is annoyed or angry? My H has said so many times that my frame of reference of what is normal and how things should be is skewed, because my ex H was very submissive and let me rule the roost. So again, I am not sure what is normal behavior and what isn't. Maybe it's not normal for me to confront my H when I am upset about something he did or said? Again it's not to start an argument EVER - of course I hate arguing. It's because I want him to know how it made me feel so it doesn't happen again. But then that turns into my H saying that I am too sensitive and that I take everything so personally. One time I tried to lean over and kiss him when we had just gone to bed, and he got irritated with me and snapped, "I can't see the TV!" when we hadn't even started watching the program yet. I was a bit hurt that I couldn't even lean over to kiss my H, and I just got quiet and he said to me, "Stop taking everything so personally." How am I not supposed to take things personally when they are personal? Or again...is my perception completely skewed and he is correct, that I shouldn't take things like that personally?

[thinkhappy]

Just in case it got missed above...

 

I know I can be a pain in the a$$ sometimes. I know I need reassurance sometimes, I know I could/should let more stuff roll off my back without making a peep, I know I can be hot headed at times and get really upset about something and rant about it for a few minutes before I am back to my normal happy self. I do not proclaim to be the perfect woman. But I know that I am a good wife to him. And the irony of it all is he feels like he is walking on eggshells around me, but I feel exactly the same way about him. He has a tendency to let the smallest, most minor issues get blown out of proportion and gets livid and disgusted with me so easily. I can honestly say that even though I get annoyed with him sometimes, I rarely get angry with him. Those are 2 very different emotions to me, but maybe I am wrong?

 

An example: if he is feeling overheated (which makes him grumpy), or just in a mood for whatever reason, if he were to accidentally trip over something that was inadvertently left on the floor, he has been known to curse and kick that object because he is mad that he tripped. My ex-H did not do this and we were married for a long time, but I don't remember my ex boyfriends ever doing this, either. But maybe I am wrong? Maybe that is a normal response when someone is annoyed or angry? My H has said so many times that my frame of reference of what is normal and how things should be is skewed, because my ex H was very submissive and let me rule the roost. So again, I am not sure what is normal behavior and what isn't. Maybe it's not normal for me to confront my H when I am upset about something he did or said? Again it's not to start an argument EVER - of course I hate arguing. It's because I want him to know how it made me feel so it doesn't happen again. But then that turns into my H saying that I am too sensitive and that I take everything so personally. One time I tried to lean over and kiss him when we had just gone to bed, and he got irritated with me and snapped, "I can't see the TV!" when we hadn't even started watching the program yet. I was a bit hurt that I couldn't even lean over to kiss my H, and I just got quiet and he said to me, "Stop taking everything so personally." How am I not supposed to take things personally when they are personal? Or again...is my perception completely skewed and he is correct, that I shouldn't take things like that personally?

[TaraMaiden2]

No, we heard you the first time...

I think you haven't had a response because people have realised they're talking to a wall.

 

You don't get it.

 

It doesn't matter what you say, or do, or act....

 

The fact is, he's abusive.

Full-stop, period, end of story.

 

But you're not listening to us.

[Satu]

Nobody deserves to be abused.

 

 

Look at this list and decide for yourself if his behaviour is abusive:

 

 

1. They humiliate you, put you down, or make fun of you in front of other people.

 

2. They regularly demean or disregard your opinions, ideas, suggestions, or needs.

 

3. They use sarcasm or “teasing” to put you down or make you feel bad about yourself.

 

4. They accuse you of being “too sensitive” in order to deflect their abusive remarks.

 

5. They try to control you and treat you like a child.

 

6. They correct or chastise you for your behavior.

 

7. You feel like you need permission to make decisions or go out somewhere.

 

8. They try to control the finances and how you spend money.

 

9. They belittle and trivialize you, your accomplishments, or your hopes and dreams.

 

10. They try to make you feel as though they are always right, and you are wrong.

 

11. They give you disapproving or contemptuous looks or body language.

 

12. They regularly point out your flaws, mistakes, or shortcomings.

 

13. They accuse or blame you of things you know aren’t true.

 

14. They have an inability to laugh at themselves and can’t tolerate others laughing at them.

 

15. They are intolerant of any seeming lack of respect.

 

16. They make excuses for their behavior, try to blame others, and have difficulty apologizing.

 

17. The repeatedly cross your boundaries and ignore your requests.

 

18. They blame you for their problems, life difficulties, or unhappiness.

 

19. They call you names, give you unpleasant labels, or make cutting remarks under their breath.

 

20. They are emotionally distant or emotionally unavailable most of the time.

 

21. They resort to pouting or withdrawal to get attention or attain what they want.

 

22. They don’t show you empathy or compassion.

 

23. They play the victim and try to deflect blame to you rather than taking personal responsibility.

 

24. They disengage or use neglect or abandonment to punish or frighten you.

 

25. They don’t seem to notice or care about your feelings.

 

26. They view you as an extension of themselves rather than as an individual.

 

27. They withhold sex as a way to manipulate and control.

 

28. They share personal information about you with others.

 

29. They invalidate or deny their emotionally abusive behavior when confronted.

 

30. They make subtle threats or negative remarks with the intent to frighten or control you.

 

 

 

(The more of these that apply, the more serious the situation.)

 

 

Source here.

 

 

Re physical abuse:

 

Physical abuse is any intentional and unwanted contact with you or something close to your body. Sometimes abusive behavior does not cause pain or even leave a bruise, but it’s still unhealthy. Examples of physical abuse are:

 

Scratching, punching, biting, strangling or kicking.

Throwing something at you such as a phone, book, shoe or plate.

Pulling your hair.

Pushing or pulling you.

Grabbing your clothing.

Using a gun, knife, box cutter, bat, mace or other weapon.

Smacking your bottom.

Forcing you to have sex or perform a sexual act.

Grabbing your face to make you look at them.

Grabbing you to prevent you from leaving or to force you to go.

 

 

Source here.

Edited July 8, 2015 by Satu

[Lois_Griffin]

Since you claim your binge-drinking alcoholic husband ISNT an alcoholic, then let's just call him a 'social drinker.'

 

Since you want to keep defending his disgusting, barbaric behavior, lets just call him a 'colorful character.'

 

Since you want to deny his serious and dangerous anger issues and wonder if you're the one causing them, let's just say he's 'easily excitable.'

 

And since you want to gloss over his increasingly dangerous physical abuse and pretend your kids are clueless about it because it happens behind closed doors, let's just call him 'playful.'

 

And yes, it's all your fault for making him the way he is. You should just accept the fact that he binge drinks when he wants, slaps you when he wants, calls you vile names when he wants, throws things when he wants, and rages at you when he wants.

 

I suggest you take lessons on how to be a better floor mat for him and how to better take his physical abuse without bruising or bleeding or being upset so you can be a picture perfect wife.

 

There, is that assessment more in line with what you want so badly to believe and hear?

[Grumpybutfun]

An alcoholic is someone who abuses alcohol. He does that if he passes out or is hungover, blacking out and letting it effect his moods. Social drinkers have a few beers. They do not binge. This is a problem. He is an abuser. No excuse that you give him makes me think otherwise after you described your situation. Lady, you are afraid to let him see a book you want to read to improve your life. He snaps at you for kissing him. As the father of three, I can assure you that your children know everything that is going on in your household. You can be in denial about your own quality of life and safety, but stop screwing with your kids lives. You wanted to know what we thought and yet when we tell you, you rug sweep for him. You are codependent. You need help. You need a much better therapist. You need to ask him to leave and file for divorce. If he won't get help, he is a lost cause. Don't make your children a part of your dysfunction.

Best,

Grumps

[Babs22]

Maybe your girls should go live with your husband if you are not going to look out for their best interest. Letting them live in proximity for a man who has shown his propensity for physical abuse, is negligent. I bet money that if you don't leave this SOB, that as soon as they are old enough to start speaking their mind and making choices, they will choose to spend more time with their father.

 

Please do not sweep his behavior under the rug or ignore to see what is obvious.

 

These are your words:

The problem is that my H has recently turned what I feel is abusive. A few months ago, he started losing control when things would get heated and he started pushing me, pinning me up against the wall, etc. The truth is that these are situations where we have been in our bedroom and arguing, usually with him being angry with me because his way of dealing with conflict is avoidance, and he just wants to get out of the house and tells me to f*** off...and that's when my insecurities set in and my compelling need to resolve the conflict sets in and I tell him no, don't leave. So I am blocking his way but not touching him, telling him just sit down, let's discuss this, etc. And he RAGES and he has SCREAMED in my face, pressed his forehead hard against mine, shoved me into the bathtub when we were arguing in the bathroom, pinned me up against things in our room, and just the other day, he put his hand around my neck and was pinning me up against the door.

 

These violent episodes have increased in frequency ever since the first time he did it

What would you tell a friend who told you this was happening to her?

[baco]

I haven't read through the whole thread just the first page, but you really need to get out of this relantionship before it's too late.

 

There is no justification for physical or emotional abuse, none whatsoever, don't even try to rationalize it of find justifications, sorry to be blunt, but your husband belongs in jail.

 

These behaviour just escalates so I urge to get out as soon as you can, I don't know where you are from, but if available call a domestic violence hotline they are able to guide you and give you support.