Andy_K Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I find it fascinating that in a world where there are constant complains of 'big brother' and meddling governments trying to control people, that when it comes to junk food it is apparently also the government's fault for not interfering enough. Personal responsibility. For 99%, fat is a choice. The only thing I will say is that there is not nearly enough about nutrition taught in schools. Informed people can make informed choices. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Taramere Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I find it fascinating that in a world where there are constant complains of 'big brother' and meddling governments trying to control people, that when it comes to junk food it is apparently also the government's fault for not interfering enough. Who's saying the government should interfere? This is about being alert to the ways in which big business manipulates the consumer into making choices that are bad for them. Knowing that somebody who's trying to sell you things that are bad for you is not your buddy, however smiley a face they put on their manipulations, is the first step in resisting those manipulations. The only thing I will say is that there is not nearly enough about nutrition taught in schools. Informed people can make informed choices. You can't inform people who aren't interested in being informed. When chef Jamie Oliver went to West Virginia and tried to interest people in healthy eating, he was regarded as though he was some sort of communist interloper trying to force people to munch through fields of lettuce like captive cattle. Jamie Oliver in tears as residents of America's fattest city resist his healthy food crusade | Daily Mail Online I'm guessing those residents would see nothing untoward about companies manipulating people (through expensive advertising campaigns) into doing what's bad for them...but when an individual tries, through discussion and education, to encourage them to make healthier choices - well, it would be unpatriotic not to resist such nannying! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Blaming the fast food industry is nuts.... Look....I grew up as a kid iin the 70's.....I'd argue(and easily win), that we had far worse eating habits than anyone born after..We ate tons of junk food, sugar laden cold cereal, soda, me and my brother ate at least a box of donuts or Devil Dogs each day(on top of everything else), pasta, bread, Coke, Pepsi...etc... None of us were fat...In fact, we had bodies like adult male CK models at 12 years old..The main difference is that instead of staring at a screen all day, we were out playing sports, walking, running, riding bikes, etc...In all weather and any time of year.. To a degree it was the same for girls..My daughter is 12...Most of her friends are, what I would consider either heavy, or on the way to being heavy...Their parents are more educated than ours were and therefore provide more healthy food options than we had....they are just... l.....a.....z...y..... TFY 5 Link to post Share on other sites
serial muse Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 It seems to me that you're choosing to perceive the article triggering this thread as a "curvy women are better" agenda, and that by participating in this thread you're choosing to shove that perceived agenda down your own throat. There are plenty of "slim women are better" messages out there. The fashion industry is awash with them, so is the porn industry, and so is the mainstream movie industry. Those messages are everywhere, yet somehow we still have a situation where the majority of people in the Western world are overweight. Yes! This is exactly the point I made way upthread - that I don't understand the pearl-clutching over a few pics of naked not-thin women, as though that is somehow going to change society for the worse by making everyone gain weight. It isn't borne out by the evidence, and yet people are still freaking out about it. This argument, by the way, has NOTHING to do with whether women - or men - should try to maintain a healthy body weight. We're discussing the sociological impact of the pictures here. And the idea that these pics are somehow going to herald a new era of obesity is just silly, considering that the same posters who seem to fear this are lamenting the many overweight people already in the US of A (and elsewhere, increasingly). Well, pics of overweight people sure didn't cause that, because mass media doesn't put pics of overweight people out there. So, what then? 5 Link to post Share on other sites
Taramere Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 This argument, by the way, has NOTHING to do with whether women - or men - should try to maintain a healthy body weight. We're discussing the sociological impact of the pictures here. And the idea that these pics are somehow going to herald a new era of obesity is just silly, considering that the same posters who seem to fear this are lamenting the many overweight people already in the US of A (and elsewhere, increasingly). Well, pics of overweight people sure didn't cause that, because mass media doesn't put pics of overweight people out there. So, what then? Now, SM - come on. Haven't you been educated yet? Fast food doesn't make people fat. We're all tired of that blame-shifting to the fast food industry. People need to start taking some personal responsibility. They need to stop eating pictures of overweight women. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Maleficent Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 ok this is going to be my last post on this thread because I'm pretty much done with it. No one is saying that overweight people are not responsible for their situation. They most likely are. No one is forcing anyone to date, be friends with or even talk to overweight people who are overweight. That's just stupid. But there is no reason to be *********s to someone just because you don't like their weight and then hide behind 'tough love' or 'they need to hear this' or 'it's for their own good'. If you hate seeing overweight people so much, at least have the common decency to at least ignore them. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Mangina Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 the thread is about girls being beautiful while being big. what do you think of the new movement or what ever you want to call it. the guys said no I do not like it, I do not think it beautiful maybe the words were more harsh but the point got across and the girls can not handle it. the prefer the passive rather the honest approach which will not do any thing for them. I am not a handsome man, I know that, I do not need to be featured in cosmos to feel better. girls telling me that I am handsome is not going to do anything for me and or change the way things are. although if they ever did some thing like this for guys like me, it would be a joke. Link to post Share on other sites
serial muse Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 The sociological purpose of these pics is to pat fat girls on the back and say, "look, you can be beautiful too." What they don't mention is that these pics are airbrushed all over the place and the women in the photos likely look nothing like their photographed selves. These pics aren't going to make anyone decide to become obese, but they do enable the lifestyle of the obese people by giving them the wrong kind of support. Instead of showing them (through a photoshopped lie) that they can be beautiful, we should be inspiring them to live healthier. This thread doesn't have much to do with who wants to date who. Nor is it about being crappy to random fat people on the street in the name of tough love. I don't target fat people just to give them crap about their weight, they didn't ask. This is an internet forum. These pics were posted here for people to say what they think...and we have. One of my old high school girlfriends gained a ton of weight after school and became obese. She soon developed diabetes because of her obesity. Now that she is in her 30's, she is literally on her deathbed because of a kidney failure that happened as a result of her diabetic condition. I know this is an extreme example, but that is the sort of life choices people are promoting here. Everyone told her how beautiful she was after she gained weight too. Then there should be far more outrage about the status quo (idealized images of very thin women), which has led to many women having body issues and is the environment in which obesity has been on the rise. Where is the outrage over that? Instead, it's just over a few pictures of overweight women that have arguably had zero effect on society. So, yeah, I find this "for their own good" argument unconvincing, as has been already stated several times now. It has also been stated that it's fine to state a personal preference; there's a big difference between that and calling them disgusting, almost as big as the gulf between that and "enabling" them. Do you not see that? 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Weezy1973 Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Then there should be far more outrage about the status quo (idealized images of very thin women), which has led to many women having body issues and is the environment in which obesity has been on the rise. Obesity has been on the rise for both men and women - in North America even more so for men. Clearly the slim (and by and large of a healthy weight) images of women in the media does not have any impact on the increasing obesity rates. If you'd like more evidence, see countries like France and Italy where being slim and fashionable is a very strong cultural preference, yet their obesity rates are nowhere close to those of North America. At this point it should be totally clear that media images of slim women are not to blame for the increase in obesity. Where is the outrage over that? There is some outrage; it's pretty misguided. Products with attractive people attached to them sell more than products with unattractive people attached to them. People with a healthy body weight are by and large more attractive then people that are overweight or obese. If this makes somebody mad, they need to convince people to stop buying products with attractive people attached to them at a greater rate than products with unattractive people attached to them. Or, put another way, change human nature. Instead, it's just over a few pictures of overweight women that have arguably had zero effect on society. Agreed. These pictures will not have any effect. They will not make overweight people feel better about themselves. They won't start a trend of overweight women becoming the norm in media images, even though it is the norm in the North American population. It has also been stated that it's fine to state a personal preference; there's a big difference between that and calling them disgusting, almost as big as the gulf between that and "enabling" them. Do you not see that? Also agreed. Overweight people are no more or less worthy than those of a healthy weight. They are, for the most part, not as physically attractive, and therefore won't be depicted as much in the media as healthy weighted people, but certainly they are just as worthy as human beings. And should be treated as such. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
sweetjasmine Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 So, yeah, I find this "for their own good" argument unconvincing, as has been already stated several times now. If people were honestly concerned about public health as it relates to obesity, they wouldn't be jumping on the "personal responsibility, it's all your fault that you're a disgusting fatty" bandwagon. Real solutions to the problem involve an investigation of all factors involved, not laying the blame and shame at individuals' feet, wiping your hands, and walking away, satisfied that you've done your duty. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
FitChick Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 How can these photos help fat women? They will still compare themselves and feel bad because they don't have pretty faces, beautiful hair, artfully applied makeup or smooth skin like the models do. At some point women have to grow up and face reality. It's all advertising to sell products. People need to learn to think for themselves. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Emilia Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 If people were honestly concerned about public health as it relates to obesity, they wouldn't be jumping on the "personal responsibility, it's all your fault that you're a disgusting fatty" bandwagon. Real solutions to the problem involve an investigation of all factors involved, not laying the blame and shame at individuals' feet, wiping your hands, and walking away, satisfied that you've done your duty. I don't know... I understand what you are saying but I think people should take responsibility for their own well being. In the UK currently 18% of the NHS budget is spent on tackling diabetes, most of which is type 2. What excuse do Western folk have with their access to education, good food and exercise? They seem to have stopped thinking for themselves. Link to post Share on other sites
Imported Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 If people were honestly concerned about public health as it relates to obesity, they wouldn't be jumping on the "personal responsibility, it's all your fault that you're a disgusting fatty" bandwagon. Real solutions to the problem involve an investigation of all factors involved, not laying the blame and shame at individuals' feet, wiping your hands, and walking away, satisfied that you've done your duty. You make it sound so complex. The real solution is simple. It is your personal responsibility and completely within your control. Obese people have nothing to do with me. It is not my duty to solve their problem. Not laying blame on them, I really don't care. They choose to be overweight, such is life. I'm not mistreating them, I just have no sexual desire towards them. The media did not mold me to desire slender and fit women. The media is just copying reality. The only fault I have with overweight people is when they want to play make believe that life is so much more difficult for them or they have some kinda fat gene that makes it impossible for them to be in shape. Life is pretty difficult for everyone else too, don't make excuses for yourself. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Yes, personal responsibility. But it's not like the playing field is equal for all, and I don't see any point in judging those that struggle with something as personal as weight control. Especially when obesity rates are highest among the least advantaged, it is hard for me to sit on my high horse and feel better about myself because I manage to eat my diet of fresh, healthy foods and go for my runs in my safe neighborhood in my $100 shoes on my adequate free time. People who feel good about themselves make healthier life choices. I want women to feel good about their bodies, regardless of size, so that they will treat their bodies well. I believe that will result in a lower obesity rate. 6 Link to post Share on other sites
SummerDreams Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 As I have said before, metabolism is not the same at everyone. It works differently, most of the time the thyroid does not work as it should, there is a variety of reasons about why someone gains weight easier or can not lose it that easily. But still the issue here is not why some people are obese rather than why overweight people are not given the chance by society to feel good about themselves. Personally I see overweight people coupled or happily married all the time, so please do not try to convince us that men only prefer thin women or that when they are with an overweight woman they are just settling with her just cause they cannot find anyone slimmer. Overweight women can be and are attractive to some men. I do not understand the passion of some men to prove that no man likes an overweight woman. Thank God there are enough thin and fit women in the world for everyone. Let fat women be happy with how they are and stop pretending you care for their health. It is hypocritical and wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
FitChick Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Everyday it seems I see another story about someone massively overweight who lost 100 pounds. It happens all the time. They admit to eating too much and being shamed into losing weight by their kid's schoolmates or having to buy two airline seats or being turned away from an amusement park ride. If I recall correctly, one woman realized her choice was to move, because she couldn't get upstairs, or lose weight. She liked her house so she lost weight. I don't care if you're fat if it doesn't cost me money. Unfortunately, it does. It costs everybody. People overeat to comfort themselves, or out of boredom, anxiety and depression. It's an unproductive way to cope with stress. My cousin and a former coworker admitted they were fat to keep men away. It worked! Link to post Share on other sites
SummerDreams Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I don't care if you're fat if it doesn't cost me money. Unfortunately, it does. It costs everybody. What a heartless thing to say. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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