Looking to date other women while married

[Adrian19]

Here's the thing, if you TELL HER EVERYTHING and she Freaks out, that is on her. She will HAVE to make choices. Even if she 'freaks out' then does nothing or makes no move on any of your options, that in and of itself is allowing you to tell her what you then are going to do.

She can stay or leave.

 

Seriously, women do freak out. I freak out. Then it's over and sh$t gets done.

I can see giving her the options/choices you suggested. She'll freak out when I include 'B'. She'll pout for a while, yet won't start going on outings with me. If I then do either B or C, I'll be ridiculed, just as what happened to your husband. As easy as it could seem like I'm making my desires clear to her or make this be her choice (through lack of any response), it wouldn't make it any more OK to her for us to be in an open marriage.

 

I've told her many times that things aren't acceptable and that I'd like for her to go on outings together. Yet her typical response isn't to start going on outings with me, but to attempt to make our home life better.

[Adrian19]

I'd suggest quit trying to read your wife's mind, and give your wife the opportunity to give informed consent or not.

 

By any value measurement, it's selfish to withhold information from your wife that impacts your marriage in such a fundamental way and deprives her of the ability to make her own decisions regarding her life.

 

Why the concern over what she may think of your idea? What are you afraid of? Divorce? Why?

I'm not afraid of divorce. What I'm afraid of is living the rest of my life without the type of female companionship I married my wife for.

[ComingInHot]

To clarify, the husband cheated behind my back WHILE I was meeting his needs both requested and more.

That is why he ended up losing the respect of his Wife, family, friends, and colleagues.

 

Uhmmm not sure if anyone has asked yet (I thought I read it) but, after she freaks out then makes no change, why don't you make a change and separate from her and/or divorce her so you can look honestly and with integrity elsewhere to get your needs met?

[GorillaTheater]

I'm not afraid of divorce. What I'm afraid of is living the rest of my life without the type of female companionship I married my wife for.

 

Then why the reluctance to share your plans with your wife? You've mentioned "pouting" and "ridicule" in a previous post, so are you afraid of discomfort?

 

I'm just trying to get a handle on why you're planning to hold your cards so close to your vest.

[Adrian19]

With all these activities and whatnot you want to do, why does it have to be with FEMALES?

 

You realize that by spending time with other women, there will be bonding, flirting, attraction, and sexual desire.

 

It is a slippery slope of destruction that will lead to an affair and broken hearts.

 

You don't want to disrespect your wife, but how could this situation possibly end well?

Since my wife fulfills only some of my needs with respect to female companionship, it could only end well if another woman fulfilled the rest of my needs with respect to female companionship.

 

When I was single, there were no issues in pursuing this. But now there would be issues if I pursue it. ComingInHot offers what seems like a sensible solution. But I know my wife well enough that she wouldn't do #A, and if I then proceed with #B or #C, she'd make me out to be the bad guy without giving me an opportunity to share my side of the story.

[stillafool]

I haven't yet approached my wife about doing these activities with other women, as she'd probably interpret my mere desire to do that as cheating. (different people have different ideas of what "cheating" actually is).

 

I agree that you should talk to your wife about having a female companion to do activities with but since you won't do that; what are you expecting to gain here at LoveShack?

 

Do you have a female cousin or a sister you could do these activities with?

[Adrian19]

To clarify, the husband cheated behind my back WHILE I was meeting his needs both requested and more.

That is why he ended up losing the respect of his Wife, family, friends, and colleagues.

Big difference between your husband and myself is it sounds like you and your husband were doing lots of things together. Sounds like his needs were purely sexual.

 

Uhmmm not sure if anyone has asked yet (I thought I read it) but, after she freaks out then makes no change, why don't you make a change and separate from her and/or divorce her so you can look honestly and with integrity elsewhere to get your needs met?

Same reason people look for a job while they have a job. If they don't get another job, they still have a job they can go back to. Thus the need to be transparent.

[ComingInHot]

Since my wife fulfills only some of my needs with respect to female companionship, it could only end well if another woman fulfilled the rest of my needs with respect to female companionship.

 

When I was single, there were no issues in pursuing this. But now there would be issues if I pursue it. ComingInHot offers what seems like a sensible solution. But I know my wife well enough that she wouldn't do #A, and if I then proceed with #B or #C, she'd make me out to be the bad guy without giving me an opportunity to share my side of the story.

 

 

ERGO, you're looking for 'cake'. Alrighty then. Can't blame me for trying to help this guy but with the 'logic' he's borrowed from the A handbook justifying his future actions, not a darn thing I can think of beyond what's been written.

 

OP, do you own knee pads, elbow pads & possibly a little Vaseline? I have a feeling you're going to need it.*

[Adrian19]

Then why the reluctance to share your plans with your wife? You've mentioned "pouting" and "ridicule" in a previous post, so are you afraid of discomfort?

 

I'm just trying to get a handle on why you're planning to hold your cards so close to your vest.

There's a certain level of comfort I get from having a comfortable home life. And I value this greatly. I don't want to lose this. I'd rather be transparent and take the risk of getting caught than present her with the option of an open marriage. Of course it doesn't have to be all of one or the other.

[Adrian19]

I agree that you should talk to your wife about having a female companion to do activities with but since you won't do that; what are you expecting to gain here at LoveShack?

 

Do you have a female cousin or a sister you could do these activities with?

Nope. But if I did, then that would help. I don't know how it would make me feel about what my life is lacking when I see other couples when I was out and about with a sister or relative.

[Adrian19]

ERGO, you're looking for 'cake'. Alrighty then. Can't blame me for trying to help this guy but with the 'logic' he's borrowed from the A handbook justifying his future actions, not a darn thing I can think of beyond what's been written.

 

OP, do you own knee pads, elbow pads & possibly a little Vaseline? I have a feeling you're going to need it.*

Pardon my ignorance, but I have no clue what your references to cake, knee pads, elbow pads and Vaseline mean. Please enlighten me.

 

I'm basically reduced to three choices:

1) be open with her (e.g. your A,B & C choices) and risk her pouting and my home life becoming miserable.

2) be transparent about it

3) do nothing and be miserable because my needs aren't being met

 

Right now, I'm doing a little of each.

[GorillaTheater]

There's a certain level of comfort I get from having a comfortable home life. And I value this greatly. I don't want to lose this. I'd rather be transparent and take the risk of getting caught than present her with the option of an open marriage. Of course it doesn't have to be all of one or the other.

 

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/54663173.jpg

[serial muse]

There's a certain level of comfort I get from having a comfortable home life. And I value this greatly. I don't want to lose this. I'd rather be transparent and take the risk of getting caught than present her with the option of an open marriage. Of course it doesn't have to be all of one or the other.

 

I'm guessing that "transparent" isn't the word you mean here. Doesn't make sense in this context.

 

Anyway. OK, so you're afraid of losing your home life. But...going behind your wife's back to "date" other women (and maybe more) is NOT a good gamble. You will very likely make things worse, and then you can say goodbye to the happy home life in a much more long-lasting way than a brief blowup.

 

Doesn't she have the right to have an honest conversation with you and understand the potentially huge impacts that might be coming her way? Yeah, you don't need to drop the "open marriage" bomb, but there are plenty of milder options to make it clear you're very serious about needing this from her. Honestly, I'm unclear on how seriously you've tried to tell her how important this is to you. It doesn't sound like you've tried very hard, perhaps because you're afraid she'll be upset about it. But considering that she makes efforts to make you happy in other aspects of your marriage, it sounds like you're really underestimating her. (And you didn't answer WWIU's question: Are you making her happy too?)

[oldshirt]

I'm not afraid of divorce. What I'm afraid of is living the rest of my life without the type of female companionship I married my wife for.

 

I said that exact phrase in a marital counseling session with my with and the therapist.

 

The therapist came down on her like thunder and told her I was serious and that it was a legitimate request and her options were to take it seriously and step up to the plate or step back out of the way and let me live my life and to sign the papers when she received them.

 

That is the day she turned around and took our issues seriously. I had been telling her that for a couple years and it was just whining and background noise to her. It took the therapist telling her that I would leave her and I would carry on with my life and I would have a girlfriend in a matter of weeks and she would be a single mother if she continued to have no interest in my life and no interest in doing things with me.

[ComingInHot]

I'd be happy to oblige. and OP, please know that I try to add a lil' bit of humor to what would otherwise be an incredibly depressing and non-healing venture for me here on LS*

 

Cake (as in have your cake and eat it too) = cheater gets side relationship with one while holding onto the 'comforts' and securities of Spouse, family & home

 

Elbow pads, knee pads and vaseline = LOL* the crash and burn after cheating and/or behaving dishonorably within marriage

[GorillaTheater]

I said that exact phrase in a marital counseling session with my with and the therapist.

 

The therapist came down on her like thunder and told her I was serious and that it was a legitimate request and her options were to take it seriously and step up to the plate or step back out of the way and let me live my life and to sign the papers when she received them.

 

That is the day she turned around and took our issues seriously. I had been telling her that for a couple years and it was just whining and background noise to her. It took the therapist telling her that I would leave her and I would carry on with my life and I would have a girlfriend in a matter of weeks and she would be a single mother if she continued to have no interest in my life and no interest in doing things with me.

 

And Adrian, note the piece missing from your plan: communication.

[Adrian19]

I'm guessing that "transparent" isn't the word you mean here. Doesn't make sense in this context.

I mean transparent as in pursuing others without proactively bringing it up. Is that what you thought?

 

Anyway. OK, so you're afraid of losing your home life. But...going behind your wife's back to "date" other women (and maybe more) is NOT a good gamble. You will very likely make things worse, and then you can say goodbye to the happy home life in a much more long-lasting way than a brief blowup.

I agree. It's not a black & white thing. There is a certain degree I can take this to without talking with my wife about it without technically doing anything wrong. What I deem as wrong and what my wife deem as wrong are likely two different things. I even have fleeting moments of guilt when I chat with a beautiful sales girl. It's just a business dealing, but I feel guilt. I've heard of men who go on totally platonic lunch outings with a female co-worker and a friend of their wife sees them together and then all hell breaks loose. So the intentions can be benign but the repercussions can be great. Likewise, the intentions can be harmful, but the repercussions can be non-existent.

 

Doesn't she have the right to have an honest conversation with you and understand the potentially huge impacts that might be coming her way? Yeah, you don't need to drop the "open marriage" bomb, but there are plenty of milder options to make it clear you're very serious about needing this from her. Honestly, I'm unclear on how seriously you've tried to tell her how important this is to you. It doesn't sound like you've tried very hard, perhaps because you're afraid she'll be upset about it. But considering that she makes efforts to make you happy in other aspects of your marriage, it sounds like you're really underestimating her. (And you didn't answer WWIU's question: Are you making her happy too?)

I always thought she wouldn't like it if I went off on outings by myself and would simply come along or have enough of a fear that I'm with another woman that she would feel the need to come along. But for her, staying at home seems to be paramount to any of this.

 

Am I making her happy? She seems to be happy. She says she's happy. She acts just as happy now as when we were in our first years of marriage. But "happy" is far to subjective for a question like "are you making her happy" to have any meaning.

[oldshirt]

I said that exact phrase in a marital counseling session with my with and the therapist.

 

I'm serious, it was pretty much word for word.

 

Although I did follow it up with - "......... I am not going to live in my home as platonic roommates. I am going to get out and do things and I want to do them with someone special in the context of a complete relationship. I would prefer that person be you but if you don't want to that's fine. I will be fair and cooperative in the divorce and I will not try to hurt you or fck you over. But I will find someone else but continuing to live as roommates is off the table. "

 

At that point the therapist got all up in her sht and told her she needed to start getting serious about working on the marriage or start preparing for divorce and getting ready to see her kids going off on weekend trips with Dad and his new girlfriend.

 

(Now to be fair and honest, he got all up in my sht on a number things too and I had to pay the piper on a number of issues as well, but he did see the gravity of that situation)

[carhill]

I mean transparent as in pursuing others without proactively bringing it up. Is that what you thought?

 

 

Transparency is communicating thoughts, feelings and actions openly and spontaneously.

 

For example: 'Honey, I feel abandoned when you choose to not share outings with me and I'm seriously considering pursuing alternative companionship for such times with another woman'

 

For myself, I did this, for a couple years, then did pursue another companion and was very direct about the whole deal. I'm now very happily divorced. You simply can't make people behave the way you want. It's voluntary. Everything about relationships is voluntary. Every choice has consequences.

 

OldShirt mentioned MC. Yep, we had a psych like that too. He was good at taking *both* sides to task, since the marriage itself was his client. Try it. Face your fear of upsetting the apple cart. Sometimes it needs an upset to settle things.

[stillafool]

Nope. But if I did, then that would help. I don't know how it would make me feel about what my life is lacking when I see other couples when I was out and about with a sister or relative.

 

So you are not just looking for a female companion for the man/woman activities. You are also looking for a female companion that you can have a romantic relationship with, is this correct?

 

I can tell you if you don't ask for permission first (regardless of your wifes anger) she will more than likely divorce you if she finds out you are having an affair behind her back. She would be absolutely correct in seeking a divorce and I hope you will be man enough to give it to her and go with your new woman. As a matter of fact, I'm thinking divorce would probably be the best solution for you anyway. The things your wife provides at home for you now could be supplied by another more compatible woman. Perhaps that would free up your lovely wife to get a man who enjoys being home with her. You two are horribly incompatible.

[Mopparon]

Firstly, you need to tell your wife exactly how you are feeling.

 

But honestly, it sounds like you may not be compatible any more and if thats the case then it may be better for both of you to go your separate ways, so you both have a chance to find a better match and have a happier future.

[2sunny]

Pardon my ignorance, but I have no clue what your references to cake, knee pads, elbow pads and Vaseline mean. Please enlighten me.

 

I'm basically reduced to three choices:

1) be open with her (e.g. your A,B & C choices) and risk her pouting and my home life becoming miserable.

2) be transparent about it

3) do nothing and be miserable because my needs aren't being met

 

Right now, I'm doing a little of each.

 

So you intend to USE a woman to fill the void in your M? That's mean and cruel and blatantly selfish!

 

Using others is just a crappy way to go about your problem.

 

Go to counseling and be clear "I am here because I need friendship and closeness and considering finding that with someone who isn't my wife!"

 

That might spark some honest conversations that invoke change.

[oldshirt]

A couple questions for Adrian, If your wife was to get involved in your life to a better degree and she did start participating in a activities with you again, would you be good with that and would that take care of things?

N

Or would you still want to do things with other women?

 

Where I am going with this is, are you just simply 'done' with your wife but keep her around to take care of the kids and drain your tank occasionally when no-one else is around and you are using her being a homebody as justification for wanting to move on to a new relationship or possibly the freedom to play the field and have no relationship responsibilities or restrictions?

 

Honest questions.

[carhill]

OP, I'll offer one last tidbit from a fMM:

 

You may think the responses of some here are harsh. Perhaps you're right. I won't be harsh. I'll just share with you that, once you make the choice to go down the road of abrogating your marital vows and contract, and especially without disclosure to your spouse, it's a choice you can never take back, ever, regardless of how your life works out. I don't decide if you've made that choice, nor the consequences of it. LoveShack members don't decide. Your spouse decides. Choose carefully. That's it. Good luck!

[pink_sugar]

It doesn't sound like you've made much effort to communicate to your wife about your unhappiness. This is only going to continue on even if you do leave your wife. If you haven't tried to work on this issue, you have no one else to blame but yourself. Talk to your wife and get marriage counseling asap.