15 years together, 2 kids, she loves me but says it's over

[hfp]

She is not offering to wait. She is playing a game. Tell her that she is either in to save your relationship or she is out. None of this half way stuff she is playing. Stop doing what she wants and start doing what you need to do for your own self-preservation.

 

She _is_ offering to wait. It might be a game that I don't understand, but she is offering it. And she will do it at least for three months. I know her. I think it's a bit odd that no one in this thread can fathom the idea of a person being able to postpone her needs for just a little bit to if it really helps someone they care about. Of course it is possible, and not always a lie. The question is whether it helps me or not.

 

I have come to the conclusion that I think it will not help me. I would rather get it over with. Assume that she already is having sex with a dozen men and she can do whatever she wants. I can't depend on what she does. She is not my friend.

 

Of course, I have no need of her rubbing it in my face. And that answers the other question: No, I don't want to know when you start dating. The only thing I care about are the kids. As long as she takes good care of the kids, that's all I need from her.

[hfp]

OP, first I am sorry this has happened to you, but you have given no reason why she is leaving you so when a woman in long term marriage says she needs to leave or needs more space, there is another man in the picture somewhere in most cases I have ever heard of. She is either in an EA or PA. Woman do not just walk out on their kids for the hell of it.

What do you gain by the offer to wait for sex, as if it were true? You will be then sitting by the calendar crossing each day off knowing you are closer to the day.

You need to get your finances in order, seek therapy if you can afford it, and tell her she can best be helpful to you by giving you am honest and complete accounting and timeline as to what brought her to this decision. At least you will not be tormented of wondering why this **** storm hit you.

 

What is EA and PA?

 

There are many reasons for why she is leaving. She thinks some things don't work between us and probably never will and that we have already tried working on them. Things such as sex, attraction, communication, parenting etc. I on the other hand think that her view is pessimistic, she has a tendency to go into a pessimistic on life and then out again later. I think that the above things often work quite well and that we have a good starting point and great potential. And a lot of unused options of development.

 

She is not walking out on her kids, the kids are living with her. She is walking out on me.

 

And there is not a specific man in the wings waiting for her. But as I wrote, she has fantasized about many different men, recently too. So who knows what she might do whenever she feels it is okay to do it. But it is not as if there is a specific man waiting in the wing that she is in love with or have had some sort of pre-affair with that can now blossom. The has a crush on a guy from work. As far as I can see, he lives with his wife or girlfriend and does not know about my ex's crush. Then there was another guy asking her out for coffee, that she has been fantasizing about. But that doesn't mean that she wouldn't postpone acting on it for three months, if she promises me.

 

The questions is whether it helps me or not. And I think I've come to the conclusion that I cannot depend on her at all. And if she waited three months, it would just drag out my own process and healing.

[Raena]

Ok now I see your back story and I understand a little bit better what is happening with you and her.

 

I have a few question(s)... if she is so intent on leaving and wants to have sex with other men, why does she have the kids? Why did YOU leave instead of telling HER to leave? Or why did you let her take the kids with her? Is she able to support herself and the kids alone?

 

It sounds like you have tried to make this work with therapy multiple times over the course of your relationship. It might be time to throw in the towel and let her go. I know that hurts to hear but you've tried everything you can try with her. It doesn't sound like she's willing to do whatever it takes to fix whatever is wrong in your relationship.

 

It's sad and I really feel for you and for your children but sometimes you just can't fix what is broken. I went through something similar when I was in my late 20's. It wasn't just gigs. Our relationship wasn't meant to be and yours with her might not be either.

 

At this point you should focus on what's best for your children and for you. She's already checked out. Let her go.

 

(((hugs))) sorry for what you are going through

[hfp]

She keeps texting me, I haven't answered yet because I don't know what to answer.

 

At 3 AM she wrote: "Please don't commit suicide, you are very important to the kids!" etc.

 

I want to reply "Don't flatter yourself, I'm fine. I'll contact later about the kids". Is that a bad idea, the "don't flatter yourself"? It seems a little to invested. I am trying to un-invest myself. But I want to write it anyway.

[Grumpybutfun]

Stop. Write back. I am just fine, we need to work out details on kids. That is all she gets from you now. Your children are your top priority. You two are clearly over as lovers but you can still be good parents. Make sure you arrange for joint custody of children, and make sure they are with you half the time. She is a lost cause so just tell her you are moving on and do so. Any man who has any self respect is not going to agree to be the dupe who waits for her while she gets to live a hedonistic lifestyle with other men unless he also wants an open relationship. Tell her to do whatever she wants because it will finalize this and stop you from thinking there is any future romantic relationship with this woman. Her offer to wait is just as condescending as her belief you are committing suicide over her unstable self.

Concentrate and prioritize your kids. Don't let her control your life anymore. Find someone who loves and values you instead of someone who can toss you away so easily.

Good luck,

Grumps

[hfp]

Okay, so she came over a moment ago. She still has a key, she let herself in. She was saying: "I didn't hear a word from you! I didn't know where you were and if you were alive!". I said: "I'm fine. I'll contact you later about the kids when I'm ready". I wanted to be strong, happy, indifferent, non-invested. But I was probably a little too invested. A little too rejecting.

 

She said: "I was awake until 3 am. I had my mom at my place. We were all worrying whether you were dead.". She was angry.

 

I said: "Well, I'm fine. Now you know. Whatever you and your mom do is none of my business. I have had many restless nights too. I will contact you about the kids when I am ready". Again, a little to invested and hurt and rejecting on my part. I just want to move on and not depend on her at all. That means I have a hard time balancing not being too invested, too hurt, too angry, too rejecting and not being to friendly, too accommodating, too "I'm totally okay with your decision". I don't know how to respond, so it gets a little too invested at the moment. That's also why I didn't respond to her calls and messages in the first place. I don't want to tell her "I am not okay, I am hurt and angry and sad", but I also don't want to tell her "I am completely okay with your decision, now let's really be happy about your decision and cooperate about the kids."

 

How to balance all this...

[Natsume21]

Okay, so she came over a moment ago. She still has a key, she let herself in. She was saying: "I didn't hear a word from you! I didn't know where you were and if you were alive!". I said: "I'm fine. I'll contact you later about the kids when I'm ready". I wanted to be strong, happy, indifferent, non-invested. But I was probably a little too invested. A little too rejecting.

 

She said: "I was awake until 3 am. I had my mom at my place. We were all worrying whether you were dead.". She was angry.

 

I said: "Well, I'm fine. Now you know. Whatever you and your mom do is none of my business. I have had many restless nights too. I will contact you about the kids when I am ready". Again, a little to invested and hurt and rejecting on my part. I just want to move on and not depend on her at all. That means I have a hard time balancing not being too invested, too hurt, too angry, too rejecting and not being to friendly, too accommodating, too "I'm totally okay with your decision". I don't know how to respond, so it gets a little too invested at the moment. That's also why I didn't respond to her calls and messages in the first place. I don't want to tell her "I am not okay, I am hurt and angry and sad", but I also don't want to tell her "I am completely okay with your decision, now let's really be happy about your decision and cooperate about the kids."

 

How to balance all this...

 

She's cheating on you bro. You see the part where she says she will wait "three months" is a fat lie. There's someone on the horizon and it was strong enough for a woman who hasn't been single for YEARS to leave a marriage. You think a woman with kids is going to leave a marriage without something secure to run to? You're naive about the games women play. But since you're not pining for her, she feels like she needs to know that you love her and miss her. And you aren't doing that.

 

Good for you, ONLY contact her concerning the kids. Don't owe the cheating **** anything.

 

Before you ask if there's proof. You don't need proof. Her actions give it away.

 

She was looking at men during the marriage, there is one. Treat her like an afterthought, or more, like a baby mamma, and ONLY ask and talk about the kids. Do not give this cheater the satisfaction of seeing you in pain.

 

-Natsume21

[BlueIris]

Set up a fixed schedule where you pick up the kids and take care of them. Reach an agreement in writing, specific days and times. Then you and your ex do not have to discuss scheduling as often. Open-ended parenting time just requires more contact, fuels anxiety for both parents, increases the possibility of conflict, and the kids feel less secure and more anxious themselves.

[Itspointless]

Reading your story I really feel sorry for you. I don't know her side of the story, but as you describe her she sounds as she have been really demanding over the years due to her daddy issues. It also sounds like you have been trying to jump through hoops all that time. Despite this and what she says you have been and are her safe haven. I doubt if she actually realizes that at this moment. I think though that you deserve much more than that. I also can imagine your frustration as you probably feel that you were there to support her all those years. In a way you have been her dad and now she wants that you set her free. Clearly that isn't your task and also not her dads, but her own as she is a grown woman.

 

Stay strong for your daughters and try to detach from her a bit, so you can be there for your children and be a fantastic dad. In the long run you deserve a confident woman who does not need all the seducing and drama that she apparently needs; someone who accept you for who you are. You have to work yourself on your anxiety as that will make life a lot easier for you and in the long run for your daughters.

 

Good luck man.

[hfp]

Reading your story I really feel sorry for you. I don't know her side of the story, but as you describe her she sounds as she have been really demanding over the years due to her daddy issues. It also sounds like you have been trying to jump through hoops all that time. Despite this and what she says you have been and are her safe haven. I doubt if she actually realizes that at this moment. I think though that you deserve much more than that. I also can imagine your frustration as you probably feel that you were there to support her all those years. In a way you have been her dad and now she wants that you set her free. Clearly that isn't your task and also not her dads, but her own as she is a grown woman.

 

Stay strong for your daughters and try to detach from her a bit, so you can be there for your children and be a fantastic dad. In the long run you deserve a confident woman who does not need all the seducing and drama that she apparently needs; someone who accept you for who you are. You have to work yourself on your anxiety as that will make life a lot easier for you and in the long run for your daughters.

 

Good luck man.

 

Thanks a lot for this. It really touches the point for me.

[Friskyone4u]

Unfortunately you cannot "nice" her back to you. It appears that she just has decided hat for whatever reasons she has to be free to have sex with other men.

You need to detach as much as possible since she has already moved out . Still not sure why she got to take kids without much discussion, but now they will have other men for sure around and probably pretty soon.

Your wife is being selfish and tormenting you. By telling you she still loves you she is emotionally still keeping you as Plan B in case her flings do t work out since it appears she also knows you would take her back.

If she is done with MC with you , you just need to try to let go and move on with your life. You will survive and the pain will get less over time unless you keep hoping against hope that she comes back to you

That could happen but only after she realizes you are. NOT waiting for her any more

[hfp]

I think I'm having difficulty at the moment balancing certain things:

 

1) Do I want her back or not?

 

If I don't, she shouldn't matter all. It shouldn't matter whether she thinks I'm strong or whether she gets angry or whether I am pushing her away with my actions.

 

If I do, I guess LC is still important, but above all I should appear (and be) strong. I should not be angry or bitter. Above all, if I do want her back, it DOES matter whether she thinks I'm strong, whether she gets angry or whether I am pushing her away.

 

2) Before yesterday and even when we had the final talk to days ago, we were good friends. Being as constructive and forthcoming as we both could. Instead of hating eachother and be overly rejecting etc.

I think she's confused that I was suddenly not responding to her messages and calls. She's thinking: "Didn't we have a good final talk two days ago when we ended it?". She even wrote something sweet to me the same evening, which I was not untouched by.

I have a hard time going LC because we were good friends, if not anything else. And as written above, for my own sake and the kids sake I still want to be strong and constructive. I have a hard time finding the balance between being LC and being strong and constructive. I don't see the value of destroying whatever IS working between us, as we still have to work together on parenting.

Going LC from this point seems to be ramping up conflict, not down. Investing instead of un-investing.

She expects us to be able to be really collaborative and friendly parents that can still do things together with the kids, all of us together. I am trying to understand why this is a bad idea, if possible. Is it because it is a bad idea for me? For my healing?

 

Do my questions make sense?

Edited June 1, 2014 by hfp

[Itspointless]

Thanks a lot for this. It really touches the point for me.

You're welcome. I wish you lots of wisdom.

[hfp]

I think I'm having difficulty at the moment balancing certain things:

 

1) Do I want her back or not?

 

If I don't, she shouldn't matter all. It shouldn't matter whether she thinks I'm strong or whether she gets angry or whether I am pushing her away with my actions.

 

If I do, I guess LC is still important, but above all I should appear (and be) strong. I should not be angry or bitter. Above all, if I do want her back, it DOES matter whether she thinks I'm strong, whether she gets angry or whether I am pushing her away.

 

2) Before yesterday and even when we had the final talk to days ago, we were good friends. Being as constructive and forthcoming as we both could. Instead of hating eachother and be overly rejecting etc.

I think she's confused that I was suddenly not responding to her messages and calls. She's thinking: "Didn't we have a good final talk two days ago when we ended it?". She even wrote something sweet to me the same evening, which I was not untouched by.

I have a hard time going LC because we were good friends, if not anything else. And as written above, for my own sake and the kids sake I still want to be strong and constructive. I have a hard time finding the balance between being LC and being strong and constructive. I don't see the value of destroying whatever IS working between us, as we still have to work together on parenting.

Going LC from this point seems to be ramping up conflict, not down. Investing instead of un-investing.

She expects us to be able to be really collaborative and friendly parents that can still do things together with the kids, all of us together. I am trying to understand why this is a bad idea, if possible. Is it because it is a bad idea for me? For my healing?

 

Do my questions make sense?

 

Anyone, please?

[Itspointless]

Being somewhat anxious myself I get you quite a bit, even as I have never been in your situation. I understand that you want to be strong and constructive for your children, that is good. But I get the feeling that everything revolves around her. I read what she expects 'going out as a family', what you are afraid of 'conflict'. You do not have to destroy anything, but right now you are very 'reactive'. You not responding to her was surprising for her (actually quite strong). I recommended to take some time, not being to reactive just as with the messages you got. She wants you to set her free, but she also has learn to respect your boundaries. First try to find an equal treatment of each-other, with some boundaries you can work with, it is your life too. As for the question if you want her back, give it some weeks.

[beach]

She made the decision - so wondering if YOU want her back or not isn't purposeful now.

 

Set YOUR boundaries!

 

For starters - she should not be bugging you unless the kids have an emergency!

 

And she should NOT be allowed to come to your place - much less enter on her own!

 

She wants out? Act like she doesn't exist! And tell her to stop "mothering you"!

 

She must think she's so important - that leaving you will destroy you. Even IF you feel that way - be strong and prove her wrong.

 

Get busy living! Go out - hike - or walk - anything to be out and about.

[hfp]

I'm busy atm but I'll respond later to this.

 

Looking forward to it.

[bigman1]

I am sorry for your situation. I really wish you well. That being said, let's be real here, shall we? I am not being mean when I say the following:

 

You engaged in some passive aggressive behavior designed to get her to reach out to you by not communicating with her. You were hoping that she would check on you as that would indicate that she still cared about you. It was very easy for you to respond to her comments about suicide, but you were hoping that she cared enough to come check on you. Please stop. Its okay, you are still suffering, but time to stop getting your emotional boost from her. You want her, but YOU DON'T NEED HER. As soon as you realize that, you will start getting better.

 

That she cares for you is not going to turn into some sort of realization for her that she loves you and should come back to you. You have done the counseling route and she has made it clear that IT IS OVER.

 

Now, she is getting an ego boost from you. she wants to be friends so that she does not look like the "bad guy". Who cares? She is the bad guy in so far as keeping the relationship going. Of course, there is not a requirement that anyone stay in a relationship with anyone, so if she wants out, then she is out. Get your key back or change the locks. No need for drama. No need for recriminations.

 

It is time for her to realize what "over" means. Set up a time table for child issues. Communicate only about that and do it via email or text. You don't have to like the fact that she is moving on so that she can sleep with other guys, but at some point you are going to have to recognize that is the hand that has been dealt. She needs to see what living that life is about. At some point, assuming she is not predisposed to the poly lifestyle, she is going to want stability. If you are willing to wait on that unlikely event, well, your life is going got stink more than it does now. She had you and she has rejected you. Something is wrong with her at a fundamental level. While you love her, you are going to have to start loving yourself more.

 

There is no need to ramp up conflict, as you suggest. This is all about reality. No you can't be friends. You can be cordial. No, you can't hang out. You can tell her that. It is real uncomplicated. It goes like this, "As you know, I really loved you and wanted us to work. You made it clear that is not going to happen. I accept that, but I don't like it. Our lives are connected because of our child. As a result, we should ONLY communicate regarding our child, preferably by text or email unless it is an emergency. I will need the key back because as long as you have it, it means that I have not let go. I am letting go, so give me the key back. I can't be your friend because I am not there yet. Maybe one day when our child graduates from school and I have been in a relationship with my new wife, we can be friendly, but until that time, nothing else is going to work for me." You see, until she realizes that decisions have results, YOU are going to be miserable.

 

Stop with the emotional snapping at her. It will be hard. It is going to hurt. You are going to cry. Still, you are going to have to start. You are not going to "nice" her back. You are not going to "guilt" her back. besides, if she came back, how would you feel knowing that she was with you and sleeping with all of the guys that she wanted? Believe me, you would feel worse than you do now. It is not conflict, it is just business now. The only business that you all have together is your child. good luck.

[yorkie]

i have read this thread ad i hope you dont mind me putting in my 2 penneth in!

 

i feel for you an awful lot very simular to myself 2 ids ex walked out new guy etc even though she hasnt and never will admit there was someone else!

 

what happened has happened! nothing you can do now except! accept its over and start to build your life. yes its hard and its gonna be a long lonely road to recovery. but you can do it. im 10 months on now nearly and im only now coming to terms with it all yes 10 months! i still had hope and secretly do sometimes still.

 

But you know what feck the ex's what we all need to do is find our own path in this world. i dont even speak to my ex we text or email unless its an emergency. its hard because yes i feel jealous when the kids return from hers and her new fellas and i have to hear about it all but slowly and i mean slowly im accepting it and im starting to claw back my life , my soul , my self respect! yes my ex moved on and she appears happy, she even makes me feel that im the one who has done wrong but you know what im there for my kids, they live with me, so i know i am better off. i also know that i am a better person. i am slowly getting my life back on track. my ex treated me so poorly and doesnt understand the hurt i went through, yes its hard after 13 years and 15 years for your good self. but you know what its a long bloody rollercoster! all you need to do is grieve, and pick yourself up again and use it to motivate yourself and do it for you not her!

 

really sorry i hope this helps, and feel free to pm if needed.

[hfp]

Thank you all.

[hfp]

I'm beginning to accept the fact that she's moving on. But I can't stop being angry with her for not at least giving me some final words. Up until a few days ago, we were still on good terms and there was still a lot of love and a lot of pain in her about leaving me. So why won't she at least write something to me about what our years together meant for her etc. ? I told her a lot of good things when I finally told her I was setting her free.

 

Maybe it's because I suddenly went LC. Or because I didn't pick up the phone for 1.5 day and she was afraid I had killed myself and then angry when she found out that I didn't, that I was just ignoring her. I don't know. Even if I am moving on, I would still like to hear the best she can offer in terms of last words or closure.

 

It's not like we hate each other. So why is it better for me to be so LC that she won't write these final words to me?

Edited June 4, 2014 by hfp

[hfp]

So I've heard that my ex is going on a date next week with one of the guys that she's had fantasies about for about a year. Of course I knew this was coming.

 

But do you guys have any tips for me? How to deal with the fact that she is dating others and having sex with others?

[yorkie]

HFP how long has it been now? since you split. tbh she has been shagging him for some time now, and you thinking about what they get up to is actually gonna make things worse. but you know what you will do it. we all did it. when she moves in with him or vice versa it will be a sickener. but and yes this is the big but which you haven't got yet! why aren't you thinking about yourself! why aren't you dating! why aren't you getting on with your life as she has left you. until you actually stop and think feck you ex your just gonna suffer. you need to just concentrate on yourself now!

[hfp]

Of course you are right. I should concentrate on me and forget everything about her. It was in January she first said that it was over. Then we agreed to try to work with whatever we could in couples therapy. We gave it until september. Then 3 weeks ago she said that she couldn't even give me that, that is was over. And now, 3 weeks later, after 15 years, she is going on a date with one of the guys she puts on a pedestal...

 

One of the problems is that we have two kids, so I HAVE to deal with her frequently. I don't even want to talk to her or see her at all. It's actually getting hard to just see the kids as much as I want and they (and I) need. Not because she is against it, but because I am in the gutter and I just don't want to deal with her at all. I was considering making my mom pick up the kids at my ex's place and bring them to me some days of the week. That way, I would not have to deal with her at all. But I guess it's not a good way in the long run. I guess I will have to deal with seeing her even if she is with other men, while picking up kids and so on.

 

This sucks.

Edited June 22, 2014 by hfp

[Oberfeldwebel]

She is not your friend, buddy or pal, she is your children's mother. For their sake you need to treat her with a certain amount of respect. You need to set up a regular schedule to take your children and return them. There should never be any men at the house when that takes place. She should not be introducing any men to the children until after the divorce. All contact with you should be about children, financial or legal matters, there is nothing else for you to talk about. The loss of your marriage is going to cause you to go through a roller coaster of emotions. This is natural and just understand it will happen. Exercise with help with the stress and make a healthier you. You need to become involved in other activities that allows you to meet and interact with other individuals, even if this doesn't come natural to you. Volunteering time to help others may be a good place to start.