Is the slut-shaming as bad as the male virgin shaming?

[Tayken]

Sometimes I wish I was a lesbian.

 

It's never too late...just look at our Provincial Premier

 

Kathleen Wynne's not-so-ordinary family | Toronto Star

[samsungxoxo]

Even better: I wish I was asexual. Makes me wonder how these few individuals like that do it. They don't have to worry about dealing with neither those stereotypes. I'll never know what's it like to never have a sex drive and/or no attraction towards anyone.

Edited February 3, 2014 by samsungxoxo

[GoreSP]

Even better: I wish I was asexual. Makes me wonder how these few individuals like that do it. They don't have to worry about dealing with neither those stereotypes. I'll never know what's it like to never have a sex drive and/or no attraction towards anyone.

 

Hmyeah I wouldn't go that far lol

[TheBigQuestion]

It is relevant, because the thread is about 'slut'-shaming. And I recall that you (and TBQ as well, though I could be mistaken about him) have posted on former threads about how a man's sexual past was none of their partner's business, in defense of men who slept with prostitutes. Yet now, somehow, their partner's sexual past is their business? How does that work?

 

You are right in that I should not have posted the details of what you'd mentioned about your previous encounter, though. That was my bad.

 

I've pretty much always maintained that just about everything about a potential mate is fair game. I wouldn't hold it against a woman if she was turned off by a guy who slept with prostitutes. It most certainly IS her business.

[Woggle]

I've pretty much always maintained that just about everything about a potential mate is fair game. I wouldn't hold it against a woman if she was turned off by a guy who slept with prostitutes. It most certainly IS her business.

 

EXactly. Personal preference is not and should not be PC.

[Els]

EXactly. Personal preference is not and should not be PC.

 

I'm of agreement with this, though this typically plays out very differently in threads about women's preferences on LS.

[Taramere]

I'm sorry but why are we dragging prostitutes into this?

 

Let's leave the "pro" sluts alone, shall we? THEY at least serve a purpose.

 

Funny thing...whenever a sex worker (or alleged sex worker, since there's never really any way of knowing for sure whether somebody is what they say they are) contributes to this board, there's always a ton of positivity and respect for her from men on the board..

 

The message would seem to be that while bouncing from dick to dick is frowned upon unless you put on a sexy yet classy outfit, make sure your hair and make up is nicely done and say "yes of course I will suck your dick provided you pay me to do it - and yes, I can take American Express because I'm that smart a business woman."

 

It's only "slutty" if she's looking for love rather than money. Such, it would seem, is the power dynamic between the genders.

[Woggle]

Funny thing...whenever a sex worker (or alleged sex worker, since there's never really any way of knowing for sure whether somebody is what they say they are) contributes to this board, there's always a ton of positivity and respect for her from men on the board..

 

The message would seem to be that while bouncing from dick to dick is frowned upon unless you put on a sexy yet classy outfit, make sure your hair and make up is nicely done and say "yes of course I will suck your dick provided you pay me to do it - and yes, I can take American Express because I'm that smart a business woman."

 

It's only "slutty" if she's looking for love rather than money. Such, it would seem, is the power dynamic between the genders.

 

I think in some cases we respect the honesty. It's sex for money and that is it. I would never use one but it is very upfront and straightforward.

[Taramere]

I think in some cases we respect the honesty. It's sex for money and that is it. I would never use one but it is very upfront and straightforward.

 

Why is a woman who charges money for sex more honest than one who has sex because she enjoys it...or even because she enjoys the attention that it might temporarily give her? What's so much more respectable about people who are forever rubbing second finger and thumb together?

[Woggle]

Why is a woman who charges money for sex more honest than one who has sex because she enjoys it...or even because she enjoys the attention that it might temporarily give her? What's so much more respectable about people who are forever rubbing second finger and thumb together?

 

It's because these men are considering the sex worker as relationship material while in other cases they are evaluating women on that basis and too many men a woman who has slept around a lot is not considered good commitment material. I don't care about numbers myself but that is how many men see it and honestly I wish women evaluated men on that basis. Many women do the opposite and find men who sleep around a lot more attractive which often gets them in trouble.

[GoreSP]

I think in some cases we respect the honesty. It's sex for money and that is it. I would never use one but it is very upfront and straightforward.

 

Sooo how else would you know how many partners a potential date has unless she was totally upfront and straightforward about it?

[somedude81]

Not at all.

 

But if you're going to pass judgement on someone's sexual past, yours better be pretty ****ing clean.

What does past mean to you?

 

Yesterday or 10 years ago?

 

Does how long ago it occurred matter at all for it to be relevant?

[TimmyTuckerR]

There are only two types of women that I don't have any problems with.

 

Relationship only type women

These are the ones that place sex as something that needs to be withheld and only done in a relationship but most eventually want to settle down one day. I respect them.

 

Women that enjoy sex

There is the other type that likes expressing themselves sexually and though she likes casual sex (esp when not looking for a relationship), she's also selective on who to do it with. They can have a high number but they are comfortable with themselves, practice safe sex and don't have hang-ups about it. They are happy with themselves. These women can also get into a relationship when looking for one and are committed to us. Again, I respect them too.

 

Then off course comes the women I wouldn't want find myself being with which are the ones waiting till marriage or very late virgins. If it's for religious purpose, I'm afraid we would not be at the same page as I believe a relationship should include everything, even sex. I wouldn't be able to deal with a sexless relationship for years and when I finally get married to her, find out we're not even sexually compatible. Regarding the late virgin, I've bumped into a 28 year-old virgin woman 2 years ago and I was ticked off. Fortunately she found someone else last year and I found out from someone else that she lost her virginity not so long ago in Nov. Good for her but I would have problems with starting all over with the waiting part and at my age of 27, don't really want to teach a woman how to pleased me. Plus, I would feel bad if she gets too attached to me and confuses that for love.

 

Lastly, the real women with deep issues aka ''damaged goods''. They are women that have a high number but only did it to seek validation, have low-esteem and/or used to be a drug addict or alcoholic as well too. They are those with the Oh, I was abused from an early age and at some point slept around to get rid of my problems, etc. I've seen one of those giving it away to anyone, even an old man. No thanks, I don't want those types either.

[GoreSP]

What does past mean to you?

 

Yesterday or 10 years ago?

 

Does how long ago it occurred matter at all for it to be relevant?

 

No, it doesn't.

Your past starts one second ago and goes on until your birth.

 

Dont get me wrong - I don't care that you paid for sex. You're just being an hypocrite when you judge women who have sex outside of a relationship because you did it too.

 

But then again, I wouldn't dump a man who confessed to having paid for sex.

[Woggle]

Sooo how else would you know how many partners a potential date has unless she was totally upfront and straightforward about it?

 

I told you before it is not about numbers to me. My wife has actually been with a number of men but her mentality towards sex and relationships showed she would make a good wife. Many women and men so it's not really about gender who sleep around a lot become hardened towards real intimacy and it does not bode well for a healthy relationship. I encourage women not to make husbands out of callous players either so no double standards from me. Neither Glenn Quagmire or Samantha from SATC would ever make a good relationship partner in real life.

[GoreSP]

I told you before it is not about numbers to me. My wife has actually been with a number of men but her mentality towards sex and relationships showed she would make a good wife. Many women and men so it's not really about gender who sleep around a lot become hardened towards real intimacy and it does not bode well for a healthy relationship. I encourage women not to make husbands out of callous players either so no double standards from me. Neither Glenn Quagmire or Samantha from SATC would ever make a good relationship partner in real life.

 

See, you don't know that…and this is what bothers me.

 

The thing is some women will settle down with the right man only - it may take them years to find him or and they don't want to live like nuns in the meantime - so this is where the casual sex comes in.

 

There are women who only have sex as part of a relationship but for some reason have a new boyfriend every year because they get into a relationship with just anybody that is interested (not that there is anything wrong with that)

[Woggle]

See, you don't know that…and this is what bothers me.

 

The thing is some women will settle down with the right man only - it may take them years to find him or and they don't want to live like nuns in the meantime - so this is where the casual sex comes in.

 

There are women who only have sex as part of a relationship but for some reason have a new boyfriend every year because they get into a relationship with just anybody that is interested (not that there is anything wrong with that)

 

I judge from what I witness in real life. I usually don't see callous players and hardened man eaters all of a sudden turn into loyal and faithful partners. It happens but not often. I apply this to both genders as well.

[GoreSP]

I judge from what I witness in real life. I usually don't see callous players and hardened man eaters all of a sudden turn into loyal and faithful partners. It happens but not often. I apply this to both genders as well.

 

And that's a fallacy called generalization.

[janedoe67]

If you met a girl who was conservative, sweet, affectionate, but was a virgin and planned to stay that way until marriage, would you assume that she would be more likely to be a faithful partner than her friend who slept with a dozen guys before the age of 22?

[TimmyTuckerR]

But then again, I wouldn't dump a man who confessed to having paid for sex.

That seems just as bad as the women giving it away to any drunkard or old fart. They seem like those individuals with baggage.

 

That male poster doesn't even seem happy about his past. I wouldn't want to deal with a woman like that either. They are what I called damaged types. At least do it because you enjoy it, not because you're trying to either get rid of your virginity or feel sad that you can't land a relationship with a woman (male) that you have to pay a prostitute or had problems and try to make it up to it by sleeping around with anyone that gives you the time of the day (female).

 

Women that like sex and are healthy, choose who to do it with and have no regrets are welcome in my book.

Edited February 4, 2014 by TimmyTuckerR

[Weezy1973]

There's a big difference between dismissing someone who has casual sex as unworthy of love or shaming them, and not wanting to be with someone that has casual sex because their values don't align with your own.

 

For me, sex is only to be had in a monogamous relationship - and that is definitely the right choice for me. Someone who feels that sex can be had casually just has different values than me and therefore would likely not be a good match. Just like someone who believes in polygamy would not be a good match for me. There is nothing wrong with their views at all - just different from mine. I suspect greatly that I would not be a good match for them either!

 

It's no different from someone who places a high value on health and fitness choosing not to date someone that doesn't. Nothing wrong with the person that doesn't prioritize health and fitness, just not a good match.

 

Nobody should feel ashamed either way.

 

I do however think that there are some people, both men and women, that behave in ways that don't reflect their values. For example, there are probably a lot of people that know and feel that health and fitness is important, but eat junk food and don't exercise anyways due to other issues (emotional eating etc.).

 

There are likely people that deep down feel that sex is special and should be "saved" for a monogamous, loving relationship, but have casual sex anyways. Possibly men who feel pressure to get high numbers to be more "manly" or women that are looking for validation from men due to an emotionally unavailable father etc. And then these people defend their behaviour (natural ego defense mechanisms) even though their behaviour does not align with their own values. And that's not healthy.

[somedude81]

No, it doesn't.

Your past starts one second ago and goes on until your birth.

Then that is where our views differ.

 

People change over time, and I think it's wrong to hold somebodies past against them if they have shown that they have made an effort to change.

 

As for the "slut" thing. A woman who is currently engaging in casual sex does not share the values that I do and have had for some time.

[TimmyTuckerR]

As for the "slut" thing. A woman who is currently engaging in casual sex does not share the values that I do and have had for some time.

So if it was 5 years ago (the same time as you) and she hasn't done any of that since then, I suppose that would be also considered a change?

[somedude81]

So if it was 5 years ago (the same time as you) and she hasn't done any of that since then, I suppose that would be also considered a change?

I'd say three years is enough time.

[GoreSP]

There's a big difference between dismissing someone who has casual sex as unworthy of love or shaming them, and not wanting to be with someone that has casual sex because their values don't align with your own.

 

For me, sex is only to be had in a monogamous relationship - and that is definitely the right choice for me. Someone who feels that sex can be had casually just has different values than me and therefore would likely not be a good match. Just like someone who believes in polygamy would not be a good match for me. There is nothing wrong with their views at all - just different from mine. I suspect greatly that I would not be a good match for them either!

 

It's no different from someone who places a high value on health and fitness choosing not to date someone that doesn't. Nothing wrong with the person that doesn't prioritize health and fitness, just not a good match.

 

Nobody should feel ashamed either way.

 

I do however think that there are some people, both men and women, that behave in ways that don't reflect their values. For example, there are probably a lot of people that know and feel that health and fitness is important, but eat junk food and don't exercise anyways due to other issues (emotional eating etc.).

 

There are likely people that deep down feel that sex is special and should be "saved" for a monogamous, loving relationship, but have casual sex anyways. Possibly men who feel pressure to get high numbers to be more "manly" or women that are looking for validation from men due to an emotionally unavailable father etc. And then these people defend their behaviour (natural ego defense mechanisms) even though their behaviour does not align with their own values. And that's not healthy.

 

see, you, I like.