Optionally child-free or regrets having kids

[Nyla]

I don't doubt that parents do many of the things on that list.

 

My issue is the tone of it...very sarcastic and hateful.

 

Not that there isn't some truth to it. Having more time for one's partner as a childfree person resonates with me.

[Silly_Girl]

Some parents probably do a lot of things on the list. However there are a lot of things on that list that parents DON'T do. I'm not struggling to grasp anything. I understand that some people can and do a lot of things on this list.

 

However, just even 10% of that list is enough for me to want to remain child free. I am also pretty sure that everything on that list has applied to at least one person at some point and time.

 

The list is irrelevant to you, then. You're not using it as a tool for decision-making. If you were that would be a big mistake, in my view, for reasons already stated.

[pink_sugar]

 

After all, even the childfree were children once.

 

This is definitely a good point!

[rainfall]

The list is irrelevant to you, then. You're not using it as a tool for decision-making. If you were that would be a big mistake, in my view, for reasons already stated.

 

 

I went back and reread the list and I still can't see what i so wrong with it. I don't think it is designed for someone to use as a decision-making guide. I think it was written by someone who was sick of being asked why they don't want kids. I do think if someone is having deciding on having kids though, they should be aware of every aspect, the good and the bad.

 

This list does point out a lot of the bad parts of having kids, even though yes not every single one of the will apply to every single parent. The list should be irrelevant to you as well, since you have already said most of it doesn't apply to you.

[CarboniteCammy]

I have an eight month old little boy and my girl is getting ready to have puppies Easter Weekend. ;-) It is possible to love both kids and dogs and have time for both.

 

BUT but but but this litter has been in the works for two years and I'm not actually going to be *raising* the litter myself, though I wish I could. All the health testing, the titles on both ends, the search for a stud dog, and now we have a list of 12 *very* excited puppy people...it's just so exciting for me.

 

My husband went from, "I don't want a puppy," to, "OMG SO EXCITED CAN'T WAIT!!!" And, "Now, we are getting one to keep, right?"

 

 

The way I look at it, my kid can become my very own junior handler if I play my cards right! ;-) Just teasing. I'd never foist my dog religion on him.

 

Anyway, My son is the light of my life. I never ever wanted kids. Only wanted to be the crazy dog lady. Now, I have both and frankly it's been a wild, though very cool ride.

 

If people don't want kids, don't have 'em. There are too many people on this planet, anyway, and too many kids suffer because their parents can't/don't want to take responsiblity for them.

 

I've found that I have plenty of room in my heart and more to spare, actually.

[Silly_Girl]

I went back and reread the list and I still can't see what i so wrong with it.

 

Because you don't have kids?

 

This list does point out a lot of the bad parts of having kids

 

I disagree, because I think an awful lot of them are not in line with reality.

 

The list is irrelevant to me, as you say, but it doesn't stop me from wishing it was more accurate.

[rainfall]

Because you don't have kids?

 

I disagree, because I think an awful lot of them are not in line with reality.

 

The list is irrelevant to me, as you say, but it doesn't stop me from wishing it was more accurate.

 

 

Nope don't have kids and don't want them.

Which ones on this list are out of line with reality...I'm just curious?

[Silly_Girl]

Nope don't have kids and don't want them.

Which ones on this list are out of line with reality...I'm just curious?

 

From my point of view:

 

1. You will be happier and less likely to suffer from depression. - untrue

2. (Assuming you get married), you will have a happier marriage. - untrue

3. You will have the capacity and time for meaningful, engaged, quality adult relationships. - not prevented by having kids

4. You will be able to save for a comfortable retirement. - not prevented by having kids

5. You are more likely to be an engaged and involved aunt or uncle because you are not jaded and worn down by your own kids. - untrue, I have capacity and am never jaded or worn down

6. You can fully pursue and develop your career. - not prevented by having kids, I've done it

7. You can fully pursue your educational goals. - not prevented by having kids, I've done it

8. You can decorate your home as you wish with as many beautiful and/or breakable things as you wish and you will not have to child-proof your house. - not prevented by having kids but I don't like my home filled with breakable stuff anyway

9. Your house will be free of junky, plastic kindercrap. - true

10. Your spouse will get all the love and attention he/she deserves. You will come first in your spouse/partner's life. - different dynamic, irrelevant

11. Your pets will get all the love and attention they deserve. - not prevented by having kids

12. You can eat whatever foods you wish at whatever time of the day you wish out in the open, whether it be a gourmet, exotic meal, or chocolate chip cookies. - not prevented by having kids

13. You never have to yell, scold, correct or punish anyone (assuming your spouse and pets are well-behaved - not having kids makes pets more well-behaved???

14. Your home will be a quiet and welcoming oasis, instead of a chaotic zoo. - my house has never been a zoo

15. Your identity will remain firmly intact. - my identity is further reinforced by my being a parent, it does not detract from it

 

 

That's my comments for the first 15. It would be too tedious (for me AND for you) to respond to one hundred, but hopefully this gives you a clue as to where I'm coming from.

[rainfall]

From my point of view:

 

1. You will be happier and less likely to suffer from depression. - untrue

2. (Assuming you get married), you will have a happier marriage. - untrue

3. You will have the capacity and time for meaningful, engaged, quality adult relationships. - not prevented by having kids

4. You will be able to save for a comfortable retirement. - not prevented by having kids

5. You are more likely to be an engaged and involved aunt or uncle because you are not jaded and worn down by your own kids. - untrue, I have capacity and am never jaded or worn down

6. You can fully pursue and develop your career. - not prevented by having kids, I've done it

7. You can fully pursue your educational goals. - not prevented by having kids, I've done it

8. You can decorate your home as you wish with as many beautiful and/or breakable things as you wish and you will not have to child-proof your house. - not prevented by having kids but I don't like my home filled with breakable stuff anyway

9. Your house will be free of junky, plastic kindercrap. - true

10. Your spouse will get all the love and attention he/she deserves. You will come first in your spouse/partner's life. - different dynamic, irrelevant

11. Your pets will get all the love and attention they deserve. - not prevented by having kids

12. You can eat whatever foods you wish at whatever time of the day you wish out in the open, whether it be a gourmet, exotic meal, or chocolate chip cookies. - not prevented by having kids

13. You never have to yell, scold, correct or punish anyone (assuming your spouse and pets are well-behaved - not having kids makes pets more well-behaved???

14. Your home will be a quiet and welcoming oasis, instead of a chaotic zoo. - my house has never been a zoo

15. Your identity will remain firmly intact. - my identity is further reinforced by my being a parent, it does not detract from it

 

 

That's my comments for the first 15. It would be too tedious (for me AND for you) to respond to one hundred, but hopefully this gives you a clue as to where I'm coming from.

 

I guess we are going to have to just disagree then.... In my view I skipped over some, but these are some that I feel are some of my reasons for wanting to be child free.

 

1.True- I will be happier doing what I want with my life

2. True- More time together and more sex= happier marriage/relationship

3.You may have time for them, but they won't ever be the same. You will also have a harder time being friends with child free people (I've seen this with my own friends- we just don't have the same goals in life anymore)

6 AND 7. I would think a kid would make an education and career harder. I am in school right now and I can't even imagine having to study and take care of a kid.-anyone who can do both (especially school and not fail out like I think I would is amazing...)

12.I can see this one not being true, but I also remember my friends kid throwing the BIGGEST tantrum ever because she was having pizza and he couldn't....can't remember why he couldn't though

13.I guess this one applies to me since my new puppy thinks by the door is the same as outside the door....

 

I get where you are coming from, but I feel like you don't get where I am coming from. Having kids changes things about your life and what you can do with it. Yes, you can probably still do most things child free people do, but there is always the extra step of worrying about your kid.

[Nyla]

I think parents who hate having children either didn't want them in the first place or they were unprepared for the harsh realities of parenting.

 

It is all about perspective.

 

I feel sorry for women who have no identity outside of being a wife and a mother. Complete financial dependence is not healthy and children grow up. If a woman has nothing in her life except her children, she will likely be a meddling mom as her kids become adults. A woman having no kind of career or education is very sad.

 

I always use the example of an old classmate who was a teen mom. She is 30 now with five children and no high school diploma. So sad since she was smart enough to become a doctor.

[pink_sugar]

1. You will be happier and less likely to suffer from depression. - depends on the case...

 

2. (Assuming you get married), you will have a happier marriage. - Children do add additional stress and responsibility to the marriage...it can create resentment to someone who does or doesn't want a child while you do or don't. However, they can also make a relationship if it's otherwise healthy and you mutually want kids.

 

3. You will have the capacity and time for meaningful, engaged, quality adult relationships. - you will have less time than someone who doesn't have kids.

 

4. You will be able to save for a comfortable retirement. - it is a fact that you will have more disposable if you don't have kids....but depends on case.

 

5. You are more likely to be an engaged and involved aunt or uncle because you are not jaded and worn down by your own kids. - depends case by case

 

 

6. You can fully pursue and develop your career. - maybe not prevented, but consider time off work...mothers can experience discrimination on the workplace for taking time off during pregnancy or having to leave early.

 

 

7. You can fully pursue your educational goals. - not prevented, but since your kids will have to come first...it may be delayed and more challenging.

 

8. You can decorate your home as you wish with as many beautiful and/or breakable things as you wish and you will not have to child-proof your house.

 

-you have to child proof to some extent

 

 

9. Your house will be free of junky, plastic kindercrap. - true

 

10. Your spouse will get all the love and attention he/she deserves. You will come first in your spouse/partner's life. - it will be harder to make time for each other, because you will need to get a sitter to have some alone time together.

 

 

11. Your pets will get all the love and attention they deserve. - I have known people who have gotten rid of pets because of this...disgusting

 

 

12. You can eat whatever foods you wish at whatever time of the day you wish out in the open, whether it be a gourmet, exotic meal, or chocolate chip cookies. - well, you do have to make some big changes while pregnant and while breastfeeding....

 

 

13. You never have to yell, scold, correct or punish anyone (assuming your spouse and pets are well-behaved - not sure what to say about that one

 

 

14. Your home will be a quiet and welcoming oasis, instead of a chaotic zoo. - it will be more quiet compared to a house with kids, especially multiple kids.

 

 

15. Your identity will remain firmly intact. - my identity is further reinforced by my being a parent, it does not detract from it (I do agree with this one)

[Nyla]

Pink Sugar, I think your response was very realistic. You did not simply deny every point on that list that we are discussing.

 

Having children certainly has some downsides, though the upsides are mostly emotional intangibles. Emotional gains are almost impossible to measure.

[Silly_Girl]

 

I get where you are coming from, but I feel like you don't get where I am coming from. Having kids changes things about your life and what you can do with it. Yes, you can probably still do most things child free people do, but there is always the extra step of worrying about your kid.

 

Having kids does mean extra thought and planning are required, extra effort or care about certain things, absolutely, but where there's a will there's a way. I started nightschool when my son was 9 months old and eventually qualified when he was 10, working full-time for all but 1 year of that time. Of course I scoff if it's suggested that it's not possible.

 

Many of them are indeed points on a sliding scale, which is what you and others have pointed out, but that's not how the author has approached it and I followed suit.

 

I have no issue with people saying 'this [having kids] isn't for me', I'm just wary of a bunch of issues that, to my mind, don't necessarily have to be issues at all. I don't like the list at face value. I do, however, totally understand how much having a child impacts on your life, some people are just totally happy with the freedom and lack of obligations of being child-free.

[sb129]

I have no issue with people saying 'this [having kids] isn't for me', I'm just wary of a bunch of issues that, to my mind, don't necessarily have to be issues at all. I don't like the list at face value. I do, however, totally understand how much having a child impacts on your life, some people are just totally happy with the freedom and lack of obligations of being child-free.

 

Agreed.

 

And there are SO many variables.

I doubt that child free couples are immune to infidelity, unhappiness and divorce.

 

Much of it depends on when you actually decide to have kids.

 

I didn't even think about having children until I was in my thirties.

I pursued all my educational goals long before I became a parent.

I travelled the world, partied, established my identity, life long friendships and a career all before I became a parent. My husband and I had some really great years together where we had a great time alone.

 

Because of that, I don't resent parenthood as much as someone who may have had kids in their early 20s which may have prevented them from doing all those things.

 

Sure, there are times its hard to juggle everything, and there are times that being a parent drives me nuts- but by the same token there are times that my job/husband/friends/ family/ complete strangers really annoy me!

 

My husband and I have made sure that while our daughter is very loved and wanted, she isn't the centre of our existence- we have adult time, adult spaces in our home, adult food, etc etc.

 

Anyway, thats just how we've worked it for us. We're not perfect parents or perfect people.

 

AND if you work out what works for you, WITH or WITHOUT children, then you've made the right choice.

[Wolfcub]

I'm 48, my oldest son is 22 now and daughter is 18. When I had my son, I was too young to really understand what it is all about and even if I did it on my free will he came much of a surprise. Second child - daughter I wanted just because. For a working divorced mother it wasn't easy to rise and provide for 2 children amid total economic collapse, way worse than present crisis - it was the beginning of 90ies, collapse of USSR.

 

And the only thing I ever regretted - why didn't I have MORE children? I always see them as extentions of myself, very beautiful, wise and capable to take their own wonderful decisions extentions, but this way I am never sorry to give them all I have materially and time or emotions wise.

[pink_sugar]

Agreed.

 

And there are SO many variables.

I doubt that child free couples are immune to infidelity, unhappiness and divorce.

 

Much of it depends on when you actually decide to have kids.

 

I didn't even think about having children until I was in my thirties.

I pursued all my educational goals long before I became a parent.

I travelled the world, partied, established my identity, life long friendships and a career all before I became a parent. My husband and I had some really great years together where we had a great time alone.

 

Because of that, I don't resent parenthood as much as someone who may have had kids in their early 20s which may have prevented them from doing all those things.

 

Sure, there are times its hard to juggle everything, and there are times that being a parent drives me nuts- but by the same token there are times that my job/husband/friends/ family/ complete strangers really annoy me!

 

My husband and I have made sure that while our daughter is very loved and wanted, she isn't the centre of our existence- we have adult time, adult spaces in our home, adult food, etc etc.

 

Anyway, thats just how we've worked it for us. We're not perfect parents or perfect people.

 

AND if you work out what works for you, WITH or WITHOUT children, then you've made the right choice.

 

Definitely agree. This is exactly why I don't understand why some women have kids so young like it's nothing. When you're closer to 30, you have much more of an idea what you want out of your life and you have more of a chance to fulfill all your other wants and desires before having kids.

[Nyla]

I wish my mother never had four kids. It might have made her less stressed, which in turn may have minimized the abuse. She always said it was her children who "made her mad".

 

I don't think there is anything wrong with having a bunch of kids. I do, however, think that a woman needs to do more with her life than pop out babies. It is not 1940 and a marriage can always go sour. If mothers who have no education or career get divorced, they are up the creek without a paddle. Never a good position to be in.

 

Don't even get me started on mothers who keep having babies as a way to avoid looking for work. I know a guy whose wife just had a fifth child. Their fourth child is in school now and the agreement was she would go back to work after the last child was in school. Soon after the fourth child was enrolled in kindergarten, the man's wife became pregnant again. She said it was an accident, but the husband thinks otherwise. He is losing respect for her and he wonders how she will ever tell the kids about education and careers.

[Sugarkane]

I'm so glad Pink Sugar posted this question. I've seen so many people who are plain bad parents, it's makes you wonder. When they do something wrong and tell them off, their parents frown at you/ tell you to F off. Eg in the spa of my boyfriends apartment building a kid was jumping into The spa. The adults didn't care but if the kid hurt himself, then they would want to sue the building. I disagree that being a childless uncle or aunt makes you more engaged. I only see my childless uncle and aunt once a year. Sometimes even less than that. I wish my extended family was more closer, but they're not.

[Els]

Mid-late twenties, bf and I are intending to be childfree in the future. Him because his career path won't allow him to contribute to childcare due to time restrictions. He does not see a point in having children that he will never be able to spend time with while maintaining a healthy marriage, and I have no intentions of being the sole carer. My main gripe with having children is that I don't want to spend the prime years of my life caring for them. Unfortunately biology has dictated that if you want to have biological children, having them after forty is not generally a great idea.

 

Will we regret it? I don't know. I do know that when we are older and his career has settled down and I've lived out my 20s and 30s the way I've wanted, I'm thinking we may opt for IVF or adoption. Big if, though.

[Els]

 

Don't even get me started on mothers who keep having babies as a way to avoid looking for work. I know a guy whose wife just had a fifth child. Their fourth child is in school now and the agreement was she would go back to work after the last child was in school. Soon after the fourth child was enrolled in kindergarten, the man's wife became pregnant again. She said it was an accident, but the husband thinks otherwise. He is losing respect for her and he wonders how she will ever tell the kids about education and careers.

 

This is odd, though, why is staying at home with her 4 children not a valid reason for her to be a SAHM? There are plenty of families that do that. The SAHP does housework while the kids are at school and then spends time with them after. I don't think it's so much her using kids as an 'excuse', as the fact that she wants to be a SAHP and just married an incompatible guy. She should've just told him about her SAHM intentions before getting hitched.

[pink_sugar]

I think the OP said she has 3 children under 4. Not 4 children.

[Els]

I think the OP said she has 3 children under 4. Not 4 children.

 

Oh. Well, same thing, no? A SAHP is still a SAHP with any number of children?

[Sugarkane]

As I said in another thread, but have yet to get a reply. How do you know when people change their minds? It seems people have regrets no matter what they choose. I feel lied too as we've folder can have it all.

[pink_sugar]

What do you mean sugarkane?

[Sugarkane]

What do you mean sugarkane?

 

It seems that alot of women who didn't and left it too late regret it. Some women also wished they had more (eg my aunt) but didnt for financial reasons.