Consolidated discussion - "Leagues"

[thecrucible]

Wanted to share this article with you guys

 

'Is he blind?' The cruel bullies taunting an overweight woman whose boyfriend is 'thin, fit and muscular' | Mail Online

[todreaminblue]

Wanted to share this article with you guys

 

'Is he blind?' The cruel bullies taunting an overweight woman whose boyfriend is 'thin, fit and muscular' | Mail Online

 

 

what a beautiful couple..........thanks for sharing that...deb

[todreaminblue]

i don't like it either but i can't change society.

 

 

the socially awkward nerd is the probable genius behind that new piece of software, but he's an employee of a company and he has no rights to it. the ceo of said company makes ten times the salary plus stock options, and will take the credit for the software. furthermore the socially awkward guy doesn't have good people skills or good looks and is in continual danger of getting fired by someone in middle management.

 

 

the same deal with weight. i don't have anything against the obese, but you can't deny that society as a whole does. again its the way it is and one or two opinions aren't going to change things.

 

 

i disagree with the one or two opinions cant change anything......that is why i try not to succumb to popular beliefs ...they are generic.....and need a radical overhaul......

 

 

if you throw a stone in a pond ...it is still one stone.......but that stone creates ripples.......and those ripples are many they go on the force and projection of yep, just a stone.....people can be rocks.....you just have to know when the right time is to jump into the pond.....and create the maximum amount of ripples.....i can create ripples.....the only difference is i know i can....and i recognize the people who want to hold me back from jumping..and considering i am overweight...watch out tsunami ahead and i am hard to hold back.....cheers to ya..deb

[MomsSpaghetti]

If they know they're way better looking than the guy, that means he'll consider himself privileged and so he'll put her on a pedestal and not entertain the thought of cheating. Do some women have this in mind when they date guys below their league?

[ThaWholigan]

If she is a person who wholeheartedly adopts this ideology and likes the idea of being with a man who supplicates to her, then it's not beyond the realm of possibility that she will be thinking it. I can think of one relationship in my head right now that I know of.

 

This is by no means common, nor is it necessarily "strategic". Maybe in the sense that she knows what she wants.....

[New User]

If they know they're way better looking than the guy, that means he'll consider himself privileged and so he'll put her on a pedestal and not entertain the thought of cheating. Do some women have this in mind when they date guys below their league?

 

 

I tend to doubt that this happens with any kind of frequency. Even if a woman were to adopt this as a dating strategy once I think that she'd soon learn it didn't work long term. Cheating has little to do with the attractiveness of the spouse. In fact, there is a tendency of men to "cheat down." Meaning they frequently hook up with less desired females outside of their primary relationship simply because they know (on some level- maybe not consciously) that these women will not be a threat to their relationship. This isn't something I'm pulling out of my hindquarters- I read what appeared to be a well researched article on the phenomenon.

 

Also, you can't keep someone on a pedestal for very long. In most cases of a hot/not hot partnership (physically I mean) that I have seen there was something that the hot partner saw in the person that attracted them that may not be readily apparent from the outside.

[Eggplant]

Meaning they frequently hook up with less desired females outside of their primary relationship simply because they know (on some level- maybe not consciously) that these women will not be a threat to their relationship.

Is that the reason they cheat down? Or is it that the available pool of women willing to be mistresses to married men and settle for scraps generally consists of people with lesser cards who are more desperate? And who often don't have the best of morals (good morals = good mother, so men want that) and who are definitely willing to step on the man's existing children.

[MrCastle]

This is a radical idea, but maybe, just maybe the girl is attracted to him physically and that's why she chose to date him.

 

I'd like to think women aren't evil to the point where they're consciously dating men they don't find physically attractive in order to get treated better.

[Woggle]

Not to get treated better but some women do it for money or the lifestyle a man can provide for her.

[New User]

Is that the reason they cheat down? Or is it that the available pool of women willing to be mistresses to married men and settle for scraps generally consists of people with lesser cards who are more desperate? And who often don't have the best of morals (good morals = good mother, so men want that) and who are definitely willing to step on the man's existing children.

 

 

You make a valid point, but the article that I read was speaking specifically about highly successful men. And this post is pretty much concentrated on physical attractiveness. Not morals. Like it or not, there are plenty of attractive women that are willing to be mistresses to highly successful married men. The article that I read took the position(an at least seemingly well-researched position) that highly successful men tended to cheat with women that were less attractive, and of a lower social status than their wives. Hence no threat to their marriage. You should note that I am in no way condoning this, just stating what I read.

[Eggplant]

If they know they're way better looking than the guy, that means he'll consider himself privileged and so he'll put her on a pedestal and not entertain the thought of cheating. Do some women have this in mind when they date guys below their league?

I value stability in a partner. So I factor in a guy's level of commitment and admiration of me. A "hot-shot" who has no intention of staying faithful to me does me no good at all. On the other hand, I need to have a certain level of admiration and attraction to the man in order to motivate me to continue to put effort into him and to be happy and to be genuine. Ideally, relationship partners meet your specific, unique personal preferences. That way, they are elevated in desirability on your personal scale without attracting more attention from general competition.

[Eggplant]

You make a valid point, but the article that I read was speaking specifically about highly successful men. And this post is pretty much concentrated on physical attractiveness. Not morals.

Like it or not, there are plenty of attractive women that are willing to be mistresses to highly successful married men.

They will get the rich guy's support when they have his children. Their subconscious knows it, even if they don't. And the rich guy's subconscious wants to father children. Everybody involved is a shark.

 

The article that I read took the position(an at least seemingly well-researched position) that highly successful men tended to cheat with women that were less attractive, and of a lower social status than their wives. Hence no threat to their marriage. You should note that I am in no way condoning this, just stating what I read.

Maybe... perhaps maintaining a certain pecking order that prevents all out war between parties and harm to all his offspring. Maybe?

[PJKino]

Thats my only hope an attratcive owmen with low self esteem who dates unattractive men

[truth_seeker]

If they know they're way better looking than the guy, that means he'll consider himself privileged and so he'll put her on a pedestal and not entertain the thought of cheating. Do some women have this in mind when they date guys below their league?

 

As women get older, and still have their looks, they will move on from the hot looking guys, to average looking guys for security.

 

Everybody gets tired at some point in their life and want to rest, ie, not worry about looking their best at all times and being in the game. They want to relax and not worry about losing their partner to someone else.

 

All women in my opinion go from the party stage to security stage. Date hot guys until they feel it's time to date a safe guy and have their security.

[Ruby Slippers]

This is a radical idea, but maybe, just maybe the girl is attracted to him physically and that's why she chose to date him.

 

I'd like to think women aren't evil to the point where they're consciously dating men they don't find physically attractive in order to get treated better.

I'm far from evil, but I'm very aware that relative levels of attractiveness play a role in relationship dynamics. In general, the person who is less attractive treats the person who is more attractive better. Unless an individual is a die-hard Buddhist or has a heart of gold, we're all affected by the power of attraction, to varying degrees. I'm much less easily won over by a handsome face than some of my friends, but I won't deny it can hold at least a little sway over me. I'm never going to be with a hot jerk, but it's human nature to treat a person you're strongly attracted to with a little more favor than one you're not - especially when sex is part of the mix.

 

This topic is timely for me, too, because I just had a big discussion with my boyfriend about this very thing. My boyfriend is a hot alpha guy, a leader, a badass in multiple ways. He dominates the scene and wins people over to his cause easily. People are obviously starstruck by his good looks. Women moon over him and men follow him. But he's also relatively humble, honest, good-hearted, with strong values. He wields his power responsibly. And even though I don't have the model good looks that he does, somehow he seems fixated on me like a bloodhound. Sometimes I'm shocked by how hard he works to figure me out and resolve misunderstandings.

 

I'm considering this guy for marriage, and he's made it clear he wants to marry me. I'm really putting him through the wringer, and he's holding up very well. I keep trying to wriggle away, because that's what I do, but he just won't let me.

 

I was complaining to him this weekend that some other guys in the past gave me much more of the princess treatment than he does. I told him it makes me sad when other random guys rush to open doors for me and give me the princess treatment, when he's not as free with the adoration and grand gestures.

 

He said those men are compensating because they know they have to do that to get and keep the girl. I couldn't argue that my boyfriend doesn't have to do any of that to get girls. Not even close. They're drawn to him period.

 

But he says if I want more of the princess treatment, he'll give it to me and will even make a fool of himself to make me smile - even though he thinks it's silly, akin to something like me gushing to him about how he's my hero. He says he doesn't need all that, because he knows that if I'm with him, it's because I want to be - and I should understand the same.

 

So yes, I know I could get more romantic displays and princess treatment with a simpler guy who's not such a handsome catch. But one thing I never worry about is him cheating on me. Yes, he has ample and easy opportunity all over the place. But he has strong principles and is intensely loyal and devoted to everyone he's close to. So I never worry about that.

[Jane2011]

I pretty much have always dated guys who I thought (and others would probably think) were equal to me in looks or arguably better looking. It's not really a conscious choice on my part; I'm just attracted to good looks (not to be confused with model-esque "hotness"; just basic good-looks).

 

Anyway, no, I wouldn't date below myself in looks just to have power or control. It's more fun to actually be attracted to the person I'm in a relationship with than it is to just have generic power and control.

[MrCastle]

 

He said those men are compensating because they know they have to do that to get and keep the girl. I couldn't argue that my boyfriend doesn't have to do any of that to get girls. Not even close. They're drawn to him period.

 

 

Don't agree with most of what you said but wanted to focus on this part.

 

I have been asked several times to model/if I model. I have been with women who can and (sometimes have) posed in magazines.

 

I open doors, and go the extra mile for women I'm attracted to, not because I feel they're more objectively attractive than I am and I need to do anything and everything I can to keep them, but because it's the right thing to do.

 

Opening doors, being romantic, being chivalrous, to me, is the right thing to do.

 

I could very easily coast on my looks if I wanted. Maybe not do as well, but I could get some girls here and there by looks alone if I wanted. But I don't.

 

I have never in my life felt like I had to do more for prettier women, nor have I felt I had to do less with less attractive women. I am who I am no matter who I'm dating.

 

Looks are not a value based system to me where I decide how much work I'm going to do depending on what her physical value is. I treat everyone the same.

 

Girl with killer ass, skinny girl, best friend, homeless guy. I treat everyone the same.

Edited March 20, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Content]

That's pretty sad for people who do that imo and will do nothing but hurt both people in the end

 

Go after people you're attracted to and stop worryign about yielding power in a relationship.

[New User]

I pretty much have always dated guys who I thought (and others would probably think) were equal to me in looks or arguably better looking. It's not really a conscious choice on my part; I'm just attracted to good looks (not to be confused with model-esque "hotness"; just basic good-looks).

 

Anyway, no, I wouldn't date below myself in looks just to have power or control. It's more fun to actually be attracted to the person I'm in a relationship with than it is to just have generic power and control.

 

 

I think that the vast majority of people gravitate towards someone at roughly their same level of attractiveness. We notice mismatched couples because they are unusual.

 

Going back to the OP- my main point was that using the strategy you put forth would be a foolish move. I'm sure that everyone has heard the old saw:

 

"No matter how good she looks, someone somewhere is tired of her *****."

 

This can be quite true and help to push their partner to look for something outside of their relationship or to accept the advances of someone else. In other words, if you are counting solely on your looks to keep a partner faithful you will fail. I'm not saying that everyone will cheat- just that the beauty that you may have at home will not motivate a man otherwise inclined to stray to be faithful. The type of personality that would consciously adopt this as a strategy is also highly unlikely (IMHO) to be a very good partner- again, if this does happen I have to believe that it is exceedingly rare.

 

Looks matter in attracting someone but I strongly believe that once you're in a relationship all the normal relationship dynamics apply. Physical beauty can't cancel all the other issues out.

[Ruby Slippers]

I am who I am no matter who I'm dating.

He says the same thing - he would treat any woman the same way, no matter what she looked like.

 

My fear is that he would be much more romantic and sappy with a hotter girl. But objectively, I can see that he's not a romantic kind of guy, and that stuff doesn't come naturally to him. So maybe I'm taking his stoicism and reserve too personally.

 

He's strong, stoic, and all business most of the time - which serves him very well in matters of business and the like. I'm a dreamer with my head in the clouds a lot of the time. He's solid and practical with his feet on the ground. He says he's never been interested in some idealized romance, but wants someone he connects with on all levels and can have a happy, productive, prosperous life with. I want all that, too. And I must admit he's romantic in his own ways, and he's adapting. His latest thing is to make up spontaneous poems about me as we're falling asleep. He'll go on for 5 or 10 minutes sometimes, and they're surprisingly good.

 

He doesn't often open doors, help me put on my coat, or any of that princessy stuff. But he's chivalrous in other ways. He always pays, treats me to gifts and little things all the time, drives me everywhere, has strong preferences but will let me have my way on things like what movie to watch, what restaurant to go to, prefers to do most of the work in bed. He's told me he doesn't care if I earn any money and will support me for life.

 

I did a tarot reading about us last night, and it said this is a man who's ready to be of service, the cosmos is supporting our union fully, and I just have to stop being so doubtful and pessimistic. So at least there's that

[Content]

Don't agree with most of what you said but wanted to focus on this part.

 

I have been asked several times to model/if I model. I have been with women who can and (sometimes have) posed in magazines.

 

I open doors, and go the extra mile for women I'm attracted to, not because I feel they're more objectively attractive than I am and I need to do anything and everything I can to keep them, but because it's the right thing to do.

 

Opening doors, being romantic, being chivalrous, to me, is the right thing to do.

 

I could very easily coast on my looks if I wanted. Maybe not do as well, but I could get some girls here and there by looks alone if I wanted. But I don't.

 

I have never in my life felt like I had to do more for prettier women, nor have I felt I had to do less with less attractive women. I am who I am no matter who I'm dating.

 

Looks are not a value based system to me where I decide how much work I'm going to do depending on what her physical value is. I treat everyone the same.

 

Girl with killer ass, skinny girl, best friend, homeless guy. I treat everyone the same.

 

I agree i think its pretty telling about people who are that looks obsessed wheter it be for shallow reasons or insecurity reasons and sabotaging yourself by people you're not attracted to.

 

I always find it pathetic people who let looks sway them THAT much to where they cant think straight or will let a person get away with alot simply because theyre good looking and act like theyve never seen an attractive person before.

 

Im not gonna sit her and say looks dont matter to me at all id be a phony but people who let looks effect them that greatly and put good looking people on pedestals are pathetic to me.

[MrCastle]

I agree i think its pretty telling about people who are that looks obsessed wheter it be for shallow reasons or insecurity reasons and sabotaging yourself by people you're not attracted to.

 

I always find it pathetic people who let looks sway them THAT much to where they cant think straight or will let a person get away with alot simply because theyre good looking and act like theyve never seen an attractive person before.

 

Im not gonna sit her and say looks dont matter to me at all id be a phony but people who let looks effect them that greatly and put good looking people on pedestals are pathetic to me.

 

I just think it's a sick mentality to have if these are some of the thoughts in a person's head:

 

"Oh, he/she is really attractive! I have to really pull out all the stops if I want a chance at this one!"

 

"Oh, he/she is not very attractive. I can coast! Let them do most of the work. They're getting the benefit of dating someone out of their league."

 

I just--I treat the skinny girl with acne the same way I treat the hourglass woman who poses for pictures. Looks to me are a shell. They don't make a person who they are. I don't care what you look like. I'll treat you well if I see you're a good person and avoid you if you're not.

 

But I've said many times I've very flexible on looks. Don't care about height, age, ethnicity, boob size/butt size, hair color. If you have a face I'm attracted to and a good personality I will give us a shot.

[Ruby Slippers]

I just think it's a sick mentality to have if these are some of the thoughts in a person's head:

 

"Oh, he/she is really attractive! I have to really pull out all the stops if I want a chance at this one!"

I didn't think that consciously - but I can't deny that I immediately felt the need to step it up and be my best to hang with this guy. This felt very positive, though. I've always felt like my feelings for him motivate me to go for it even more, on every level. Attraction is just one part of that. I've been out with hot guys who were not that intelligent or interesting, and I felt nothing for them. It's his combination of qualities that attracts me. The good looks are icing on a very tasty and well-made cake.

 

As for having a "sick mentality", maybe I do. He's told me I'm crazy and I think too much. I know I tend to overthink and talk myself down dead end paths. I've come a long way on this, though. And lucky for me, he has the patience to deal with my weirdness - so far.

 

I just--I treat the skinny girl with acne the same way I treat the hourglass woman who poses for pictures. Looks to me are a shell. They don't make a person who they are. I don't care what you look like.

I feel the same way, and it seems he does, too. He also treats everyone the same, whether it's a client or a homeless guy asking for money.

 

I appreciate your post, MrCastle. You make a lot of sense, and you're helping me see how I might be letting my fears and insecurities get in my way.

[tbf]

These threads are annoying since they provide people with avenues to trash good-looking people or place them on a pedestal.

 

How about people just view others as people, where regardless of looks, you're judged by your actions or words and actions, in alignment?

 

As it relates to the thread topic, one person's ten is another's five.

 

---------If people shift from reliance on superficial judgements, their entire world view shifts priorities, providing them with more pertinent insights on the person within, which includes their person within.

 

Without evaluating their person within, there's no way to understand other people since inner lens projects to others. If you understand your inner lens, you can offset inner lens biases (shutting down projections), in order to objectively view others.

Edited March 20, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Ruby Slippers]

I recall a relevant study from a few years back, discussed here: Why Beautiful Women Marry Less Attractive Men | LiveScience

 

Women seeking a lifelong mate might do well to choose the guy a notch below them in the looks category. New research reveals couples in which the wife is better looking than her husband are more positive and supportive than other match-ups.

 

Overall, wives and husbands behaved more positively when the woman was better looking.

 

In couples with more attractive husbands, both partners were less supportive of one another. McNulty suggests wives mirror, in some ways, the level of support they get from husbands.

The study was published in the Journal of Family Psychology, a peer-reviewed academic journal.

 

Thoughts?

Edited August 5, 2013 by Ruby Slippers