Trouble getting past details of my wife's affair

[garyfromla]

And how do YOU feel about your wife's progress?

 

How has her changes affected how YOU feel about her?

 

I feel that my wife's progress is great but it's benefiting her right now even though her initiative for change and improvement is to win me back and earn my trust and love again. I feel like I will eventually start appreciate her efforts FOR ME later on but for right now, I'm still feeling this sense of imbalance in our relationship.

 

Her changes have led me to believe that we have hope for our marriage and that she truly wants to have me in her life. But sometimes, when I remember the things they did, I feel like all this effort from my W to change is indicative of how badly she screwed up.

[2sunny]

You mean you didn't realize how badly she screwed up the M?

 

And I'm not so sure an old friend is impartial for her counselor - her friend should have passed her case to a colleague = very unprofessional!

[garyfromla]

So she cheats when it's a good M - what might she do when it's not good? Or have you been deceived or not informed about how it was great or not great...?

 

Maybe you didn't recognize that it wasn't great?

 

 

Maybe she was unwilling to be honest with you IF she felt it wasn't great?

 

You have some things to determine - really... How did SHE view your M when she decided to cheat? Because IF she thought it was good/great and she STILL cheated - your M has bigger issues than you think.

 

That's the thing, the months leading up to her A, our marriage was not nearly as great as it was before. We argued a lot, which seemed very out of place but it happened. She told me to ease up on work and spend more time with her and the girls but I refused. Apparently, she took that as a subtle hint of me falling out of love with her which put her in a temporary state of depression of confusion.

 

We lacked the necessary communication that would have probably alleviated a lot of our problems at the time and I blame majority of that on her as she never voiced her opinion, which emotionally weakened her enough to cheat. Yes, I realize she told me to spend more time with her and the girls but she never sat me down and had a serious talk with me about it and expressed how my actions made her feel and think. She only mentioned it in passing.

 

Yes, so in that sense, I agree that I didn't recognize that it wasn't that great at that point but she could have shared her feelings with me more appropriately. And if she was unwilling to be honest about that, then what's the point of communication in a marriage?

[garyfromla]

You mean you didn't realize how badly she screwed up the M?

 

And I'm not so sure an old friend is impartial for her counselor - her friend should have passed her case to a colleague = very unprofessional!

 

No no, I knew how badly she screwed up. I meant that her putting all this effort shows that SHE realizes how badly she screwed up which is bittersweet to me. Sweet because it shows that she regrets her actions and would take them back if she could and bitter because it reminds me at times of all the details of the A. Details that led my W to fully regret everything she did and try so hard to make it up to me.

[garyfromla]

One of my wife's college friends returned to LA about a year ago after nearly 5 years of living in NY. Her friend is a counseling psychologist specializing in couples therapy. A couple of weeks after I had called her and told her I was thinking about reconciliation, she got in touch with her friend and explained what was going on and her friend immediately offered her help. Do you really think that is a good idea? Friends are notorious bad adviser´s.There is a reason you go to a natural.IC/MC.. I would strongly recommend to switch IC.

 

Just remember she is your wife´s friend.Not your´s

 

That's the thing, she is not her friend at those times. She is a psychologist who just happens to be friends with her outside of her sessions. Regardless, these sessions are for my W and her alone. So I could care less if she's a little biased.

 

Her therapy is to help her grow and improve on her part to make our M work better so if she wants to cheat on that too, then I'd be done with her. But she has truly done her best to utilize her time with the therapy.

 

My time for therapy will come later where we have discussed to have couples therapy with an IMC at that time. So her friend won't be taking part in that.

[Mr. Lucky]

That's the thing, the months leading up to her A, our marriage was not nearly as great as it was before. We argued a lot, which seemed very out of place but it happened. She told me to ease up on work and spend more time with her and the girls but I refused. Apparently, she took that as a subtle hint of me falling out of love with her which put her in a temporary state of depression of confusion.

A typical reaction for someone who's mad at you for too much travel might be to refuse to pack your suitcase. What they don't do under normal circumstances is have enthusiastic sex with their AP.

 

Your efforts to look at and treat this as a relationship problem is like trying to cure someone's cancer by changing their home furnishings. While it might put them in a better frame of mind, it doesn't address the central issue. You know the what, where, when and how of what she did. You don't really know the why. And until you do, how can you know it won't happen again? Like I said, I'd be scared sh*tless...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Artie Lang]

apart from your immediate family, who else knows about this?

 

 

early in this thread i asked whether she did "things" with him that she might not have done with you. i ask because if you didn't get those "things," do you feel resentment over this?

 

in a sense, do you feel deprived of it?

Edited October 12, 2012 by Artie Lang

[2sunny]

apart from your immediate family, who else knows about this?

 

 

early in this thread i asked whether she did "things" with him that she might not have done with you. i ask because if you didn't get those "things," do you feel resentment over this?

 

in a sense, do you feel deprived of it?

 

He said he got all those things.

[2sunny]

My therapist - by law - can not be my FRIEND outside of therapy!

 

It's SUPPOSED to be a neutral person with no emotional investment in me - just someone who can give me guidance - professionally - my "friends" are clearly separate than my therapist.

 

Your wife isn't making strides like you think she is IF she's still so focused on HERSELF... The M could be limping along for 40 more years while she makes more excuses and blames you for what SHE did!

 

How about YOU jump up and down and show her that YOU need attention?

 

Her NEED for that attention is what got her to the cheating - time to let go of HER selfish and self centered self and start paying attention to you! SHE should be making this up to you - not YOU making things up to her!

 

She's feeding a load of crapola - and you're gobbling it up just because she says its ice cream!

 

Stop buying her crap!

 

YOU SHOULD BE FURIOUS that she's not doing more to set things right FOR YOU!

[Artie Lang]

sorry, i must've missed it.

[turnera]

Are you in therapy yourself? It might help you to get to the point where you can let go of what happened. The biggest thing I see in BSs is that need to...accomplish something, you know? Get closure, find answers, figure out why, get an apology...it's the helplessness that is eating you alive, the fact that your control (what little you have) was wrested from your hands and you're left unable to regain it.

 

Unfortunately, that is one of those times in life where you have to accept the fact that you don't get everything. Bitter pill, but it must be swallowed. Kind of like when a teenager decides to join the army instead of going to college - nothing YOU can do about it; now you just have to shift your future plans to include the new information. Was it what you wanted? No. Can you live with it, with a new, revised version of your future? Of course; you have no choice.

 

It's getting to that point where you say ... wasn't what I wanted, but it's what I got ... that defines you.

[garyfromla]

apart from your immediate family, who else knows about this?

 

W's best friend, my mother-in-law, and a good friend of mine. My W has an older and younger sister but both my MIL and I thought it would be best that they didn't know.

 

My MIL has been great in all of this. She really loves and admires me and sees me as the son she never had according to her. The poor woman was emotionally abused by her husband a long time ago and it led her to have an affair back in the day unfortunately because she felt like she was trapped in their marriage and her husband was just dragging her along.

 

My W witnessed her affair with her own eyes so my MIL blames herself after her daughter for what Cheryl did. She's been crying just as much if not more than my wife, at certain times, throughout this whole healing process.

[garyfromla]

My therapist - by law - can not be my FRIEND outside of therapy!

 

It's SUPPOSED to be a neutral person with no emotional investment in me - just someone who can give me guidance - professionally - my "friends" are clearly separate than my therapist.

 

You're taking this therapy thing out of context. My wife's friend just happens to be a psychologist that is helping her as a FRIEND, not her counseling therapist. She does not get paid for helping my wife even though my wife has insisted. Instead, she just happens to counsel her about what is going on when they have other casual conversations together when they are hanging out. There is no portfolio or record of what is being said or heard. Hence why my W's friend was able to talk to me about certain things.

 

Your wife isn't making strides like you think she is IF she's still so focused on HERSELF... The M could be limping along for 40 more years while she makes more excuses and blames you for what SHE did!

 

I apologize if I made you think that way but I thought I made it pretty clear that she's doing everything in her power and capacity to appease me, not herself. I just said at this moment, I feel like all the things she's doing for me isn't hitting me yet but I think they will in the near future when I get over this nostalgic funk.

 

And she certainly doesn't blame me for what she did. Had she done that, I would have settled with the divorce a long time ago.

 

YOU SHOULD BE FURIOUS that she's not doing more to set things right FOR YOU!

 

What more can she do? And that's not a rhetorical question. I'm serious, what other things are there for her to do? I think she is doing everything she can at this time to make it up to me which does piss me off a little bit especially when I'm thinking about the details a little more and have this feeling of imbalance in our relationship. It's horrible to say but sometimes, I wish she wasn't doing enough so that I could unload the frustration I have at the moment on her and feel that it would be justified.

[Darth Vader]

You brought up a lot of great points in your previous posts Doug but I have to tell you that she is not as manipulative as you think she is. That was absolutely her first and only time she cheated and she truly was upset when she confessed. She had no ulterior motive to confess to me about the affair other than her guilt and realization that she made a huge mistake.

 

The whole miserable with me than happy with him thing was read out of context too and I apologize for that. She didn't mean that that was the situation at hand with us. She was figuratively saying that she would be willing to have her once in a while bad times with the man she loves (me) other than not run into any drama with a man she doesn't love (him). I worded it poorly and I apologize for that.

 

 

She didn't make a "mistake" She "intentionally" and willingly rode this OM! Stop minimizing what she did! She needs to stop calling this a mistake as well, if she has been calling it that.

 

BTW, she said the OM's 14 year old son walked in on them, seeing what they were doing, does she take responsibility for that as well? You realize chances are, his son saw your wife naked....... That's something to point out as well, not to mention the awkwardness of them seeing each other out and about! I'm sure she's seen him already...... More injury to this insult!

[Darth Vader]

One of my wife's college friends returned to LA about a year ago after nearly 5 years of living in NY. Her friend is a counseling psychologist specializing in couples therapy. A couple of weeks after I had called her and told her I was thinking about reconciliation, she got in touch with her friend and explained what was going on and her friend immediately offered her help.

 

From the only time I had talked to her friend about my wife's therapy progress, it seemed she was making huge strides to better our situation. This was about 1 month ago. Her friend told me that even though she's my wife and had her permission to share, she wasn't going to divulge too many details about their discussions and exercises but that she had made improvements in a lot of areas. The one thing she did bring up though is that my wife was seeking help on how to handle our oldest daughter's curiosity in her mother's affair. Both of our daughters have forgiven her even though there is a certain degree of coldness between the three of them but they are re-building their tight bond.

 

But according to her friend via my wife, our oldest daughter seems to be prying into my wife about her affair to probably highlight her mother's stupid actions and to 'redefine her identity' due to some leftover resentment according to my wife's friend. I have no clue how to approach that honestly. My wife has been seeing her friend once a week since the week she asked for her help.

 

Another point to bring up, your daughter probably has heard from this OM's 14 year old son as to what he saw, I want you to bring this up with your wife as well as the points I posted above! You realize your daughter may feel like she's the laughing stock of the whole school and to think, your wife has done this to your own Daughter/s! The children truly suffer the most!

 

Normally I'd say drop Bitch and trade her in for two 20 year olds (your daughters may agree), but, that's me. I'm not the one who has to live with her, you do, unfortunately, however, that's just my take.

[Darth Vader]

No no, I knew how badly she screwed up. I meant that her putting all this effort shows that SHE realizes how badly she screwed up which is bittersweet to me. Sweet because it shows that she regrets her actions and would take them back if she could and bitter because it reminds me at times of all the details of the A. Details that led my W to fully regret everything she did and try so hard to make it up to me.

 

 

Problem is, she can't make up for having an affair.

[Artie Lang]

you should read KID's thread. it sounds so very similar to what you're going through.

 

hope the outcome isn't the same, as he had the very same sentiments.

 

tread lightly my friend, lest you end up in the same predicament.

[Darth Vader]

you should read KID's thread. it sounds so very similar to what you're going through.

 

hope the outcome isn't the same, as he had the very same sentiments.

 

tread lightly my friend, lest you end up in the same predicament.

 

 

I don't think I've read the Thread myself. Gary, some of us say drop her, others say go for R, but, we all want the best for you! Even if you do decide to stay with your wife, Remember, you have no obligation to stay with her whatsoever! Even after 20 - 40 years later, you can still drop her!

[Artie Lang]

^i meant gary, bro.

[Darth Vader]

^i meant gary, bro.

 

 

Yeah, I know. It's cool.

[Artie Lang]

you alright, Darth.

[laotzu]

Hi Gary,

 

I've been reading this off and on for a few days, and I'd like to suggest -- as some others have mentioned -- that you might be minimizing her affair behavior. Your wife lied to you and concealed a sexual affair from you for months, and there's a part of me that wonders whether or not this really was the first time.

 

Have you ever cheated on your wife, before?

 

I want to suggest that what you know now is just a small fraction of what there is to know, and the remainder will be found out in the future. I find it highly, highly doubtful that your wife was so torn up about her behavior... but it took her months to tell you about it, after having a very sexual, romantic relationship with another man. If she were so guilty that she broke down to tell you about it, don't you sorta think that this would have happened once or twice, before the guilt was too much?

 

It's possible she's cheated before. It's very possible, given all the affair information I've seen in the past, that your wife knew you were about to find out about the affair from someone else (e.g. the other man, a family friend who saw them together, or ________) and so "broke down" and confessed. Very often, someone will threaten the affair partner with exposure to get them to end the affair.

 

I doubt this is the first time your wife has cheated. I think she needed to confess this time for other reasons.

 

Sorry man, it's just my two cents. I was cheated on, and obsessively read forums and the psychological literature that's available. If you do find out more, please share, because these things have a terribly repetitive narrative.

 

Good luck with your wife. I might suggest staying with her and accepting her for who she really is, but remember that we never really know another human being entirely. You're getting to know her a little better, now, and what you find out might be interesting.

 

Best,

LT

[garyfromla]

Stop minimizing what she did! She needs to stop calling this a mistake as well, if she has been calling it that.

 

Trust me bud, I'm not minimizing the heaviness of her actions. Hence, why I'm so pissed these days despite everything she's been doing to get us through this.

 

She doesn't refer to what she did as a mistake, or at least a 'mistake' based on true and general definition. She knows that what she did was 1.) not my fault 2.) the lowest point of her life and character.

 

She, herself, said that she was a 'stupid whore' who was undeserving of my love and care. I can't really say it hurts me to hear her say that and I don't care if that's a ****ty attitude to have if you're reconciling with your cheating spouse.

 

BTW, she said the OM's 14 year old son walked in on them, seeing what they were doing, does she take responsibility for that as well? You realize chances are, his son saw your wife naked....... That's something to point out as well, not to mention the awkwardness of them seeing each other out and about! I'm sure she's seen him already...... More injury to this insult!

 

I'm not sure what you mean by taking responsibility so please elaborate. She does regret it though. She wishes he hadn't walked in on them. His son did see my wife naked.

 

She described that entire encounter the day I asked her for all the details of the A. I doubt that she and his 14 year old son will have much interaction in the future so I doubt any impending awkwardness.

 

How would it be more injury to insult if she has already seen him?

[garyfromla]

Another point to bring up, your daughter probably has heard from this OM's 14 year old son as to what he saw, I want you to bring this up with your wife as well as the points I posted above! You realize your daughter may feel like she's the laughing stock of the whole school and to think, your wife has done this to your own Daughter/s! The children truly suffer the most!

 

My daughter (s) and the OM's son do not know each other nor do they go to the same school. But if they did, I agree, my wife would have stomach the pain she has caused her own daughter on top of the pain she has caused me.

[garyfromla]

Gary, some of us say drop her, others say go for R, but, we all want the best for you! Even if you do decide to stay with your wife, Remember, you have no obligation to stay with her whatsoever! Even after 20 - 40 years later, you can still drop her!

 

Thank you so much. I agree. If I feel it's not worth it to work for our marriage again at any point, I know I have the freedom to seek happiness else where.