How do you forgive?!

[whichwayisup]

5 months into your marriage she's been living a lie, knowingly deceiving you, living a double life behind your back. She is broken inside, has issues obviously and is not wife material. You deserve so much more. Your whole marriage was built on lies and mistrust, cheating and betraying.

[whichwayisup]

She wants to be forgiven, but what is she actually doing to make it slightly easier for you TO forgive her? Is she all talk? It's so easy to say I'm sorry, I'll make it up to you, I'll change, I promise to be faithful to you. Words mean NOTHING, she needs to back it up with actions. Is she seeking counselling to fix herself? Doing marriage counselling with you? Is she in TOTAL no contact with the exOM? Cut all ties, including any mutual friends? Has she given you access to her phone, email etc?

[whichwayisup]

She needs to change her number so he cannot contact her. WHy is he texting her? The A is over, right? She SHOULD have IMMEDIATELY shown you the text. Not tomorrow..That's such crap and she is controlling the situation. how do you know if it was just one text?

 

She maintains that the affair mainly consisted of them texting and there were only three sexual encounters...the OM lived about 1k miles away.

3 years, and only 3 encounters?

 

Can he confirm this? Without her knowing you're contacting him, he could shed some light on his version of the affair.

[ShakeyMouse]

We talked some more last night. She showed me the txt msg and I told her the response should be something along the lines of my husband knows about you and never contact me again. She was clearly conflicted with this. So I dug deeper and she admitted that she missed him because they did have an emotional connection and she said her dealings with him were habitual so to have no contact was hard.

 

I admitt that was hard to hear, but I knew it...she then told me that the more we talked the more her emotions caught up with her head. This too was hard to hear. She says she wants to work on our marraige because she can depend on me and I treat her well and when we were dating no one ever treated her the way I did. And she doesn't want to leave me "like his.". She wants to help me get through it, by she admit she isn't sure if us staying in the same house is a good idea all of the time.

 

This has been the worst 3 months of my life...I don't even know how I've been able to function...I kind of sort of hate her for all I this.

[road]

What are you doing to verify NC?

 

What are you and WW doing to recover?

 

Has WW answered all your questions about the affair?

 

Odds are against you having a happy marriage because statistics show that when a WW is sleeping around this early in a marriage she will do it again. This time you are lucky that the OM did not get WW pregnant.

 

The both of you need to go to your family Dr and get STD testing.

 

 

To this I will add has this affair been exposed and to who?

 

 

We talked some more last night. She showed me the txt msg and I told her the response should be something along the lines of my husband knows about you and never contact me again. She was clearly conflicted with this. So I dug deeper and she admitted that she missed him because they did have an emotional connection and she said her dealings with him were habitual so to have no contact was hard.

 

I admitt that was hard to hear, but I knew it...she then told me that the more we talked the more her emotions caught up with her head. This too was hard to hear. She says she wants to work on our marraige because she can depend on me and I treat her well and when we were dating no one ever treated her the way I did. And she doesn't want to leave me "like his.". She wants to help me get through it, by she admit she isn't sure if us staying in the same house is a good idea all of the time.

 

This has been the worst 3 months of my life...I don't even know how I've been able to function...I kind of sort of hate her for all I this.

 

 

Time to stop comming here and crying and time to man up answer questions and take action.

 

Are you crazy allowing WW to respond to OM?

 

Why no NC letter?

 

Why has OM not been blocked from getting to WW, emails, texts, calls?

 

Why has WW's phone numbers and email address' not changed?

 

Plus all the other questions that have been previously asked?

 

Then after you answer them go buy the book Surviving an Affair by Dr Harley.

[nofool4u]

We talked some more last night. She showed me the txt msg and I told her the response should be something along the lines of my husband knows about you and never contact me again. She was clearly conflicted with this.

 

Yup, I knew she would be.

 

 

So I dug deeper and she admitted that she missed him because they did have an emotional connection and she said her dealings with him were habitual so to have no contact was hard.

 

Tell she is free to leave the house anytime she likes while you go talk to an attorney.

 

 

I admitt that was hard to hear, but I knew it...she then told me that the more we talked the more her emotions caught up with her head. This too was hard to hear. She says she wants to work on our marraige because she can depend on me and I treat her well and when we were dating no one ever treated her the way I did.

 

Ah, well thats sweet of her to say:rolleyes:

 

So now the problem is there is a big imbalance in your marriage. She thinks she can have her fun, then come back to you for stability.

 

Sure, that works for her, but what about you?

 

 

And she doesn't want to leave me "like his.". She wants to help me get through it, by she admit she isn't sure if us staying in the same house is a good idea all of the time.

 

Of course not. That would give her more freedom to screw around on you.

 

I think if she moves out, it needs to be for good. Then you can start looking for a decent woman. Let the OM have her. They deserve each other and the betrayal that will end up in their relationship too.

 

You deserve better, and there is definitely better to be had.

 

This has been the worst 3 months of my life...I don't even know how I've been able to function...I kind of sort of hate her for all I this.

 

Understandable, and thats all that needs to be said. She has now become sh** to you, am I right?

 

So flush her and find a woman that isn't sh**.

[nofool4u]

Are you crazy allowing WW to respond to OM?

 

Why no NC letter?

 

Thats what he had her do is respond with the intention of telling him no more contact. The idea was really to gauge her response to having to tell the OM that they are through.

 

And as suspected, and confirmed by Shakey, she didn't like it. She didn't like the idea of cutting OM out of her life comletely.

 

Thats all that needs to be known now. He needs to tell her to pack her bags.

[Ninja'sHusband]

Just a warning that there are some divorced folks here who will not be happy until you are too, no matter what happens. Do what you feel is right.

[nofool4u]

Just a warning that there are some divorced folks here who will not be happy until you are too' date=' no matter what happens. Do what you feel is right.[/quote']

 

Yes, he needs to do what he feels is right.

 

But spare us your "we are not happy unless you aren't" bull.

 

We are simply showing him the obvious. It may be one thing if his wife wants to never hear from the OM again.

But that isn't the case. She not only doesn't want to tell him its over, she doesn't WANT IT TO BE OVER with the OM.

 

What part of that don't you understand?

 

If we are so way off base with your "some divorced folks" comment here, then the alternative would be to tell him to work it out with a woman that wants another man.

 

Ok, then

[ShakeyMouse]

I do appreciate all of the feedback. It is understandable that opinions vary greatly.

 

I will say that while she was conflicted about telling the OM that they can have no further contact, she said she would do it because it was the right thing to do and she doesn't want to have an affair anymore.

 

I don't know what to think about that, seems sincere but who knows. I'm still leaning toward ending things. It is hard for me to ever see myself get past this. I do think I would be able to forgive her, which i know would be necessary for reconciliation. I am having a hard time understanding people who have reconciled, and say things like "the affair made our marraige stronger"...that sounds crazy to me. The person who you chose to spend the rest of your life with betrayed you in the worst way imaginable and you take them back think things are better...this idea is foreign to me...how!?! Isn't taking them back in some way justifying what they did? I mean most likely the marraige had problems and I guess all WW say that is what lead them to stray, so it seems like taking them back says "we had problems they handled it wrong but I understand"...I just don't get it right now.

[neveragain2012]

Then you obviously haven't done any reading from some of the biggest authors on the subject about it. What I stated came directly from "Not Just Friends" at end of the book in the chapter about Forgiveness. I am here to help by giving another outlook. That's fine if you don't agree, but to say it's not based in reality is completely false.

 

I think there's book reality and real life reality. Kind of like parenting books. Its all good in Theory, but when it comes to putting it into practice human emotions come into play, on both sides, and that seriously affects the outcome.

[2sure]

Attempting to reconcile with an unremorseful cheater is Impossible.

The heavy lifting of the reconciliation at some point...is theirs. If you dont see it, or worse - if you see a lack of it, get out.

 

They will do it again, and you will be F'd up but good.

[mercy]

Forgiveness came easy, the hard part was living with what I knew.

[jnj express]

Hey SM---you arn't really serious about wanting to stay with this woman are you??

 

At the point in time that the 2 spouses in a mge., are starry-eyed lovers, and no one else in the world exists but the 2 of you, for you are so in love you don't even see other people around---YOUR WIFE STARTS AN A.

 

For 36 of the 42 months that you have been married, you have been in 2nd place in her heart, mind, soul, and whathaveyou

 

Now when you are willing to give her the greatest gift you could ever give her---THE SECOND CHANCE---she fights you

 

What else do you need---to look at her, should make you wanna puke---she should be out of your house and gone

 

Do you not understand, she is still "into him"----I know it is hard to go cold turkey---but she ain't even trying

 

What you are faced with is this----she knows she can never fully have him, so that's why she is still around----if she leaves, she is now facing starting her life all over, trying to find a decent guy, to take care of her---so you know da*n well, she wants to stay in this mge, she needs your bankroll, and she likes her life as it is---BUT she doesn't wanna give up her lover-----

 

Why are we even having a discussion on forgiving----you still have a wife that is involved with another man-----when in your vows did you agree to be involved in a mge, that was a 3some------but for the last 3 yrs that is what your mge was----

 

If she lives only a mile from her lover, I promise you, and I am willing to bet any amount of money you can come up with, they had sex a lot more than 3 times,,, very well you could put a couple of zeroes behind the 3----you gotta wonder if you got sex, how many times was it sloppy seconds

 

I wouldn't be worried about family and friends---You need to be worried about how fast to get away from her------she isn't a wife---SHE IS A BIGAMIST.

[drifter777]

I do appreciate all of the feedback. It is understandable that opinions vary greatly.

 

I will say that while she was conflicted about telling the OM that they can have no further contact, she said she would do it because it was the right thing to do and she doesn't want to have an affair anymore.

 

I don't know what to think about that, seems sincere but who knows. I'm still leaning toward ending things. It is hard for me to ever see myself get past this. I do think I would be able to forgive her, which i know would be necessary for reconciliation. I am having a hard time understanding people who have reconciled, and say things like "the affair made our marraige stronger"...that sounds crazy to me. The person who you chose to spend the rest of your life with betrayed you in the worst way imaginable and you take them back think things are better...this idea is foreign to me...how!?! Isn't taking them back in some way justifying what they did? I mean most likely the marraige had problems and I guess all WW say that is what lead them to stray, so it seems like taking them back says "we had problems they handled it wrong but I understand"...I just don't get it right now.

 

Clearly, you and I are kindred spirits. I'm finally ok with people who say things like "the affair ended up being good for us" because there are all kinds of people and some of them are able to reconcile to this degree. It does not mean that ALL of us can get to this point.

 

No one on this forum, or anywhere else for that matter, would tell you that reconciliation is possible without your WW being truly remorseful and willing do to whatever it takes to make up for what she has done to you. It's really that simple and is what most of the posters here are telling you.

 

I know you are hurt and confused right now and are having a hard time figuring out what to do next. Since your WW suggested it may not be good for the two of you to live in the same house, you should leave and take some time to sort out your feelings. Or get her to leave. The important thing is for you to have some time away from her right now. You should also see a counselor and start working on your own recovery. Whether you reconcile or not, you need to take care of yourself right now.

[Ninja'sHusband]

I do appreciate all of the feedback. It is understandable that opinions vary greatly.

 

I will say that while she was conflicted about telling the OM that they can have no further contact, she said she would do it because it was the right thing to do and she doesn't want to have an affair anymore.

 

I don't know what to think about that, seems sincere but who knows. I'm still leaning toward ending things. It is hard for me to ever see myself get past this. I do think I would be able to forgive her, which i know would be necessary for reconciliation. I am having a hard time understanding people who have reconciled, and say things like "the affair made our marraige stronger"...that sounds crazy to me. The person who you chose to spend the rest of your life with betrayed you in the worst way imaginable and you take them back think things are better...this idea is foreign to me...how!?! Isn't taking them back in some way justifying what they did? I mean most likely the marraige had problems and I guess all WW say that is what lead them to stray, so it seems like taking them back says "we had problems they handled it wrong but I understand"...I just don't get it right now.

I'll just repeat what I was saying before. You need to figure out what is right for YOU. And that might change. I'm not advocating divorce or reconciliation. And for the record, I'm 1 month into a separation that is headed for divorce because of my WW's actions. I tried like hell to reconcile but she just wasn't remorseful enough to make NC happen and give me peace of mind. I couldn't live like that. It was important for me to know I did everything I could first though, especially since we have a 9 year old daughter.

[ShakeyMouse]

All you guys are making some very good points and giving me a lot to think about.

 

We talked again yesterday or rather she talked. The gist of what she said is she has decided that she does not want a relationship with the OM. She says she's been doing a lot of reading and thinking about the things she has been saying and admitted if She heard someone else say the things she has been saying she would think they were stupid. He says she is ready to put my feelings first now that all of the clutter is out of her mind. She says the relationship with the OM wasn't based on reality.

 

I didn't say much because I always like to take time to think about what she has said because I have to consider the fact that she is lying and or manipulating me. But I did say something like "you are ready now!..but have not cared about me or put my feelings first in the past?". To which she said "I didn't feel this way about you before and I feel closer to you." she says she had a lot of resentment towards me when we first married b/c we moved about 1000 miles from out families...which we did because I took a job that would allow us to buy the kind of house she wanted...but I digress.

 

What do you guys make of this? I have to admit to being skeptical of some of the advice and predictions ya'll have made about the WW and her motives but I must admit as a group you've been more right than wrong.

[Jonah]

she says she had a lot of resentment towards me when we first married b/c we moved about 1000 miles from out families...which we did because I took a job that would allow us to buy the kind of house she wanted...but I digress.

 

Some things she says has no meaning. I think she is shooting in the dark hoping to find any words that will "make it better". I think you could take it as a positive, that she is "trying".

 

I am so sorry to read that you are suffering so. I think listening to her try for reconciliation will at least help your ego some and you can use that. Your suffering may never end even if you do split, or don't. You will hurt for a long time.

 

Sure she can mentally make this decision to end it, but in a year life could get humdrum, not much excitement going on, she gets a phone call and the forbidden passion could flare up hotter than ever -especially that first time back together. She would be better at hiding it so then it could go on and on.

 

Take Care ShakeyMouse. Take solace in knowing that many a man has been in your shakey shoes!

[nofool4u]

Look, you do what you feel is right, divorce, or reconciliation.

 

But one thing is for certain, your wife now needs to stay home and act like a wife. The freedoms she once enjoyed that allowed her to screw around with this guy should now be over. She f****d that up.

[Furious]

 

What do you guys make of this? I have to admit to being skeptical of some of the advice and predictions ya'll have made about the WW and her motives but I must admit as a group you've been more right than wrong.

 

 

You are being given advice.... take what works for you.

 

Listen to your gut...if what your wife is telling you doesn't make sense and what you see and hear doesn't add up, then keep digging for the truth until you find it.

 

With time and deep soul searching you will be able to decide what is best for you.

[GLDheart]

After really digesting this thread, I'd say your question is another way of writing what you really deep down want to know. That is best worded as:

 

"How can I move on, have a future with this woman, and be OK with all of this?!?"

 

If my hunch is right, that answer will come down to mostly her actions.

 

- Does she truly regret what she did? Does she feel remorse for the pain you feel?

- Has she ceased contact? Is she now willing to answer any and all questions?

- Is her behavior that of someone now with nothing to hide?

 

If all of those things are met, you have a shot. If she is acting that way now, but in the future reverts to her old pattern of deceit, you will snap right back to "NOT OK" in a heartbeat.

[jmargel]

I do appreciate all of the feedback. It is understandable that opinions vary greatly.

 

I will say that while she was conflicted about telling the OM that they can have no further contact, she said she would do it because it was the right thing to do and she doesn't want to have an affair anymore.

 

I don't know what to think about that, seems sincere but who knows. I'm still leaning toward ending things. It is hard for me to ever see myself get past this. I do think I would be able to forgive her, which i know would be necessary for reconciliation. I am having a hard time understanding people who have reconciled, and say things like "the affair made our marraige stronger"...that sounds crazy to me. The person who you chose to spend the rest of your life with betrayed you in the worst way imaginable and you take them back think things are better...this idea is foreign to me...how!?! Isn't taking them back in some way justifying what they did? I mean most likely the marraige had problems and I guess all WW say that is what lead them to stray, so it seems like taking them back says "we had problems they handled it wrong but I understand"...I just don't get it right now.

 

Hi Shakey,

 

It's been a long time since I posted here but maybe I can help. I too was a 'victim' of a cheating spouse. One thing you have to remember is that there is no just 'one talk'. Second, it's a process, some days will be good others not so good. You will be on an emotional roller coaster. The foundation of your house has been destroyed so it's going to take a long time to build it up again (trust).

 

You can forgive but you will never forget. That said, if she is sincere on making it work she need to stop all contact. You both also need to see a therapist otherwise you two will get divorced. It will help you both deal with all of this and to look at thing at another angle. It might provide you with answers that you cannot get right now.

 

In my case she started seeing her ex the first year of our marriage. I still hold resentment towards it. Do I use it against her? Perhaps in certain ways that I don't realize at the time. I might be just in a bad mood because a past thought came into my head. You have to get answers, find resolution and then refocus yourself.

 

She has to be 110% open to you, nothing hidden. Any contact attempts by him should be brought to your attention. She has to accept that she will be under your eye for quite some time.

 

You must also realize she did not do this to hurt you. She did this for her own emotional, selfish reaons. This is why you both need therapy. Think of it like a weed. You need to get to the root of the problem and remove it, otherwise the weed (the cheating) will come back.

 

I noticed that alot of insecure women will often cheat, due to one reason or another. You must also concentrate on yourself, do things for yourself, don't put this on your own self-worth. Create goals and accomplish them, with and without her.

[jnj express]

Now all of a sudden she "gets it"---for 3 yrs, you weren't even there, he was there (in her heart, and mind)---now you are there

 

Do you really believe that------so why now all of a sudden, she wants back in

 

Could it be cuz she knews he can't really take care of her, and you can---could it be that she needs you to maintain her nice lifestyle

 

The BS, about moving for job, and better life, is just that, BS---she had a say back then and agreed to the move

 

There are many reasons why cheaters, cheat----you need to find out the WHY, and FIX it---before you consider anything, with her

 

Until you can get down to the WHY, you need to keep your decision as to R, or D, in reserve

 

She does not get to dictate any terms, about ANYTHING, she does not get to decide ANYTHING----your future, and what you decide in re: the mge., is up to/depends upon you

 

You need to place boundaries, on her, with actionable, not verbal consequences----You need to make her sign a POST --NUP, with a 80/20 property split in your favor

 

To even get to R., after she is fixed, she agrees to everything, and she DOES ALL THE HEAVY LIFTING----that's the way this has to come down----do not be abusive, but be firm, and make your demands known

 

If she doesn't like anything, she is free to leave at anytime---and get herself, one to two jobs, and try to make ends meet----that, tho is what she wants to avoid----

 

So again I ask this question, why does she all of a sudden "get it"------It certainly can't be for love, cuz she hasn't loved you for 3 yrs, or if there was some love there, you got what was left, after she gave her love to her lover

 

Do not make this easy---she does not just get to move back into her lifestyle, as it has been all along, nice/cushy/easy/comfortable/good---those days need to be over for her, for a period of time, accountability/repentanence/contriteness/remorse---are now to be in full sway for her!!!!!!!

[ShakeyMouse]

Thanks guys. This has been very therapeutic for me. I still don't know what I want to do, well that is not entirely true...I want to end things, but our therapist insists that I should not make any decisions right now because I am not capable at the moment of making a good well reasoned decision about the marraige right now.

 

I've started asking mor specific questions about the affair and the times they spent together. I'm treadin lightly because I'm very afraid of some of the things she may say...although I doubt any of it would be a shock.

 

What I don't like the most right is the fact that I still care about her. It makes me sick actually; especially when Im asking about details of the affair.

 

I find it hard to be mean to her, although I have been a couple of times, but being an ahole is not really apart of personality. I'm just kind of rambling but I am appreciative of the advice you guys have given.

 

I do have one other question. I've had this urge to tell my parents about all of this, I've resisted because i think that would seriously hamper reconciliation; but I feel like I need them...thoughts?

[GLDheart]

...I want to end things, but our therapist insists that I should not make any decisions right now because I am not capable at the moment of making a good well reasoned decision about the marraige right now...

 

Your therapist IS right that you will be acting on emotion. HOWEVER, I say "acting a little emotional" sometimes is just fine. It will help to show your Wayward the VERY REAL pain you are in. Don't let your therapist talk you into being a numb robot.

 

I do have one other question. I've had this urge to tell my parents about all of this, I've resisted... ...but I feel like I need them...

 

This is a tough one. I think you are having a hard time because you know they will turn on her... SO, if you reconcile, you now have a SECOND PROBLEM of a family that does not want you with her.

 

Also, Deep down a man feels some shame that his woman needed "more" than just him.

 

The only thing that I can say to that stuff is that THOSE ARE HER PROBLEMS. If you need support (and yes, you do) then get it. Your Family is YOURS first. They will in time accept her if that is what you decide. And if it makes it tough on her in the end, those are just her consequences to deal with.