who will you worship God or Satan?

[The Blue Knight]

People kill others in the name of religion.

 

People put people down in the name of religion.

 

People oppress people in the name of religion.

 

The preacher man says "God wants you to do this." "God wants you to do that."

 

How does he know what God wants? Nobody really knows.

 

In the bible God told a man to kill his son to test his loyalty. The man was going to do it. But God stopped him.

 

If a man called the cops and said God wanted him to kill to test his loyalty, the cops would send him to a mental hospital.

 

If you told people that God turned your neighbor into a pillar of salt, they would take you to the mental hospital.

 

If you tell people that you crossed the Missouri river on foot because God parted it, they would take you to the mental hospital.

 

So people say they believe in the bible, but I question that.

Rather broad comment about people killing others in the name of religion. Considering that there are many Christians across the U.S. when was the last time we saw a modern-day Christian Church suggest that their members go out and kill anyone in the name of Jesus? Stop lumping everyone in the same boat. It sounds ridiculous. Islam has many problems with radicalists. Christianity does not.

 

The only side lacking any tolerance and putting others down here have been the atheists and evolutionists who have made comment after comment that those of us who accept God are "ignorant" and "lacking education" among a few other similar remarks.

[The Blue Knight]

That is an untestable theory.

That's why it's called faith my friend.

[d'Arthez]

That's why it's called faith my friend.

And that is why God has no place in discussion on science.

[TaraMaiden]

That's why it's called faith my friend.

Yes, more often referred to as 'Blind Faith'.

 

The kind of Faith I have, denotes an inherent confidence in the logical and systematic information and instruction that is testable at every step.

 

In fact, it positively DEMANDS that you appraise and examine it for watertight evidence, before ever accepting it as Truth.

If it doesn't make sense, we're advised to leave it aside as dubious or questionable....

[zengirl]

You're opening remark is one of my primary issues regarding particularly things like global warming and evolutionary science. What is sold to us as scientific fact in the classroom, in the news, on the Discovery Channel, and in our texts (and I have had that term "scientific fact" used countless times by evolutionists and atheists) is a theory, which may be updated or altered as necessary and whenever convenient.

 

Not whenever 'convenient' but whenever the facts bear out differently and become expanded upon! That's a good thing; you seem to think it's a bad thing that science changes, but it's the very thing that makes science true and factual --- that it changes in the face of new information. Science, itself, is a search for the truth, and such a search never really ends; it merely evolves. It's not being 'sold' as any more or less factual than it is. Science = the facts of life as we currently know and understand it, through observations, experiments, and other testable methods --- highly rigorous methods that are clearly outlined in a specific Scientific Method. Scientific facts ARE facts, but no scientist would tell you we know the 'whole truth' about science because there'd be no need for further scientific development if we did! And all scientists understand the need for further study, re-study, and development; it's part of the scientific method!

 

God however remains the same today as He was from time eternal.

 

That is untestable as another poster said and debatable. Your Christian God is hardly the only God that's been professed as truth. What makes your version more factual than any other? What differentiates him from Zeus or Allah or Vishnu or Thor (the God, not the superhero)? Only your faith, as you say, and faith has no place in science or reason or conversations of facts in the practical world.

 

The difference is we know that we can only take educated guesses a much of what God has done and nobody pretends to know what is factual and what isn't.

 

Really? Seems to me you are pretending that God exists, as a fact. And it is very much not a fact --- are you saying you're willing to admit there's a chance God does not exist and that there is no factual evidence to prove it? Because if not, you ARE pretending to know.

 

Scientists aren't pretending to know science --- they're gathering rigorous evidence and ensuring opinions and so forth don't slip in by testing and re-testing hypothesis many, many times before they have anything near a Scientific Theory. They certainly aren't saying, "Someone wrote it down, so it must be true!" especially when it contradicts other things that other people also wrote down.

 

That's why it's called faith my friend.

 

And that is why it has no basis in fact.

[TaraMaiden]

People do all those things without ever believing in God or following a particular religion. There are also people who follow God and don't do any of that.

Yes, but the fact that there are people who use religion as a basis for murdering others, and justifying it as righteous action, in the name of God' is reprehensible.

[wuggle]

People do all those things without ever believing in God or following a particular religion. There are also people who follow God and don't do any of that.

 

I can't be bothered doing the research but I'm pretty sure more people who believe in god murder, rape, torture etc than athiests ? (based purely on the fact that most people have over the last few thousand years professed a belief in god). Many of these attrocities have been actually been committed in the name of god (whichever one they believed in at the time).

 

How many people have committed these attrocities in the name of athiesm ?

 

I think when humanity has ditched god we will still make mistakes, will still kill and torture each other, but I do believe it will be a lot less. We will also waste less times teaching nonesense in schools so might actually have cleverer kids.

[thatone]

Yes, but the fact that there are people who use religion as a basis for murdering others, and justifying it as righteous action, in the name of God' is reprehensible.

 

I think the quote you're looking for, from the '79 winner of the Nobel Physics prize Stephen Weinberg is...

 

Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

[wuggle]

What I believe about atheist who do commit any act that is disgusting has nothing to do with the atheist who do not. Each person is responsible for their own actions, no matter what they claim is their motivation. I would never believe that the atheist who lives down the road from me and is a convicted felon is the same as you or anyone else who does not believe in God. I cannot hold you responsible for his actions. Yet, as a Christian I am lumped into a group that has little or nothing to do with me or my beliefs.

 

I think you may have missed the point that I was trying (not very well, sorry) to highlight. Loads of murders, rapes etc have been comitted directly in the name of religion (or through a belif in a god) which would not have otherwise happened. Loads of time wasted teaching an outdated belief system in schools could also have been more usefully spent teaching about proper, real things.

 

surely it's time for us as a species to grow up ?

[thatone]

You and I do not disagree with that, but why is it all Christians are painted with the same brush. Is that the brush that all atheists should be painted with as if they all are the same?

 

if you pick and choose what you believe from your own bible then you yourself are saying that it lacks credibility.

 

at that point you need to stop demanding that the rest of us give it equal/fair treatment, that it does NOT deserve.

 

otherwise, make the case to us about how murdering your enemies is ok if you say god told you to do it.

[TaraMaiden]

You and I do not disagree with that, but why is it all Christians are painted with the same brush. Is that the brush that all atheists should be painted with as if they all are the same?

Not all Christians are painted with the same brush.

I haven't painted anyone.

I have a lot of really great Christian friends.

I don't adhere to what they follow, they don't adhere to what I follow.

I respect them, they respect me.

And we live and let live.

 

In discussions like these, i disagree with what you believe in, and as we're discussing beliefs, and as it's an open forum, i take issue with them.

 

I can do that, because you keep protesting your side of things, and I can see holes a mile wide in them.

 

Unfortunately for you, you cannot say the same of me, because in all probability, you know little of Buddhism (a lot of Christians are notoriously reluctant to examine the benefits of understanding other creeds, for fear of being persuaded that they have some credibility) and furthermore you would be hard put to find anything to pick holes in.

 

Lastly, you certainly do 'pick and choose'.

there are many scriptures within the Bible which point to positively barbaric practices, and I'm sure you don't subscribe to those...

 

And many would argue that god is not handling his business at all well, because he would take swift action against those who take his name in vain, and murder on his behalf.

Or claim they do.

If human justice can seek to rectify these problems through conflict or legal channels, I don't see why he cannot use his omnipotent powers to the same end and give "the Good Guys" a hand.

[thatone]

1) I don't pick and choose.

 

2) I don't demand anything of strangers...as you are to me.

 

3) I don't have enemies that I would consider murdering...I am not a murderer.

 

4) I have no clue what I or anyone else deserve but I do know that a tone of disrespect is unwarranted when one has not been given to you by me.

 

5) There is no case for me to make, God can handle his business without my help.

 

Be blessed.

 

The man who shows contempt for the judge or for the priest who stands ministering there to the LORD your God must be put to death. You must purge the evil from Israel.

 

i show contempt for priests all the time, should i be put to death?

 

If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

 

gay men are to be put to death too, apparently.

 

Prepare a place to slaughter his children for the sins of their ancestors; they are not to rise to inherit the land and cover the earth with their cities.

 

even kill the children of non believers.

 

A curse on anyone who is lax in doing the Lord’s work! A curse on anyone who keeps their sword from bloodshed!

 

refusing to do the above will get you cursed.

 

you either believe all of this or you don't. if you don't, you're picking and choosing what you want to believe. if you're picking and choosing you're saying that you disregard the bible just like i do. i just disregard more of it than you, in which case you should take a long hard look at what you believe and why.

 

if the answer to that is that you've never actually read the bible, which i suspect is the case for the vast majority of christians, then you should try doing so. i have. when you get done it reeks of bullsh*t, much more so than it does just taking the high points from someone else.

[TaraMaiden]

......Won't stop me from keep on keeping on) to abide by the 10 commandments that is what I am required to do.

 

IMMEDIATELY followed by....

 

I am not required to live under the law before Christ so there is no reason to pick and choose.

 

Aren't the 10 Commandments OT (before Christ) and Christ the NT?

and you're not "picking and choosing"....?

 

For the record I have been fortunate enough to know a great deal about your point of view concerning Buddhism. I have studied your belief system as well as others. It was part of my search for what I needed. You belief system along with several others that I considered for awhile did not sustain what I needed long term.

Wait... so you would prefer to adhere to a system where there is an unseen, unpredictable omnipotent god, who delivers a reward system, and a post-death judgement at whim?

 

Be specific about what about Buddhism does not sustain what you 'needed long term'... Bear in mind it's the only one without a god, and where the consequences and results are up to you, not a deity....

[pureinheart]

Religion is an umbrella term for different forms of devotion and following a specific calling.

Christianity is specific to a Theological devotion with Christ as its pivotal player.

 

Ask any two 'Christians' what they believe, and their definitions will diversify - dramatically, at times.

"Well, to me this means..." is one of the most common phrase used by Christians, as they absorb the different teachings and interpret them in ways they feel sit best with them.

 

 

This is so the truth, and I think one possible explanation would be that not one of us on this earth are exactly the same.

 

I remember when coming to the "heart" knowledge of God, the lady who discipled me (and a couple of others) emphasised greatly not to take mans word for anything, to study and to bring it in compliance and submission with the Spirit of God.

 

The first major study I did was the Book of Revelation and other prophetic passages, as prophecy really caught my eye. Then another exhaustive study on eternal security, could one loose their salvation, and so on...

 

One thing I found essential was going back to the original Greek and Hebrew.

 

Certain things IMO are basicially left up to individual interpretation and how God will apply it to a specific need/personality. Then there are issues and doctrinal facts that if the interpretation by a group or individual are comprimised this is the "flesh" in operation and not the Spirit.

 

I want to say, I admire greatly, and I don't care what faith/nonfaith, those that can adhere to what they believe. For me it so hard because I was raised much different than what the Bible teaches. It has been a great struggle to deny "self" and in the Bible there is a major contrast between self and the Spirit.

[thatone]

but see, that's what's wrong.

 

we are a technology/information driven society, we will only be moreso as time goes on.

 

and there's no room in such a society for people who only 'believe' their own 'beliefs'.

 

religion will be dead in a century in western industrialized countries, for all intents and purposes.

[KathyM]

but see, that's what's wrong.

 

we are a technology/information driven society, we will only be moreso as time goes on.

 

and there's no room in such a society for people who only 'believe' their own 'beliefs'.

 

religion will be dead in a century in western industrialized countries, for all intents and purposes.

Religion is alive and well, and has been in existence for thousands of years. 90% of the world's population believe in God or a higher power (95% in the U.S.). Technology isn't going to change that.

[UpwardForward]

but see, that's what's wrong.

 

we are a technology/information driven society, we will only be moreso as time goes on.

 

and there's no room in such a society for people who only 'believe' their own 'beliefs'.

religion will be dead in a century in western industrialized countries, for all intents and purposes.

 

In a century? Jesus could return by then.

[TaraMaiden]

KathyM, It has already been pointed out to you that your percentages are absolutely so far off-bat as to almost be fictitious fantasy.

Edited June 15, 2012 by TaraMaiden

[KathyM]

KathyM, It has already been pointed out to you that your percentages are absolutely so far off-bat as to almost be fictitious fantasy.

No, it has not. I have looked at several sources, and have even studied it in my college classes. 95% of people in the U.S. believe in God or a higher power. 8% of the world's population are atheists, with another 6% as Buddists. But people can do their own research if they care to. They don't have to take my word for it, or yours.

[TaraMaiden]

Yeah....

 

"There are lies, damned lies and statistics."

 

Don't worry, I can't be bothered.

 

Too much like deja vu....

[UpwardForward]

I've seen those recent 8% figures of atheists/agnostics. The rest considered 'believers'. Kind of an incomplete picture, to me.

[M30USA]

Getting back to the OP...

 

I wish that I could say I will always worship God and serve him. But I can't. Humans, myself included, are too weak and spiritually bankrupt. If Peter, himself, promised Jesus that he would always follow him and then proceeded to deny he ever knew him...how can I promise the same? The Bible explicitly states there is NOBODY who understands, nobody who seeks God, because all have gone astray. Even Joshua, before he died, asked the Israelites if they would forever follow God. They all shouted with an affirmative, saying they always would. Then Joshua told them, "You are not able to serve God, for he is a holy and jealous God." (Joshua 24:19) All we can hope to do is humble ourselves, realize our lowly situation and pray God daily that he sustains us with his mercy and doesn't allow us to fall away from him.

[Eddie Edirol]

I will be helping out Satan. I am learning how to design with fire and brimstone colors now. I'll be ready.

[black_shemer]

but see, that's what's wrong.

 

we are a technology/information driven society, we will only be moreso as time goes on.

 

and there's no room in such a society for people who only 'believe' their own 'beliefs'.

 

religion will be dead in a century in western industrialized countries, for all intents and purposes.

 

yet religion are still here.actually new religions even arises.do a research,and religions started centuries from now and now wer on techie world,it is not a hindrance to stop spreading gods words.what are the blockage to this religion are those people who keep on bluffering around.

[quickjoe]

As long as there are mysteries, there will be frauds pretending to have answers. As long as people have fears, there will be people who exploit them.

 

Religion will always be with us.