Do men avoid settling as women get older?

[Mme. Chaucer]

I do see a lot of high fiving and you go girl stuff when it comes to women cheating but I admit it is not all women.

 

 

Can you show me 3 examples of "high fiving" and "you go girl" for cheating, from LoveShack? Since you see it a lot, though admittedly not ALL women do it, you should have no problem.

[Woggle]

Can you show me 3 examples of "high fiving" and "you go girl" for cheating, from LoveShack? Since you see it a lot, though admittedly not ALL women do it, you should have no problem.

 

Just look at that one post I made a thread about a few weeks ago.

[soserious1]

Just look at that one post I made a thread about a few weeks ago.

 

Woggle, I've been thinking about your situation.

 

You were reared by a mentally ill, abusive mother, you married a mentally ill, drug addicted woman who cheated on you and also abused you, you've alluded to a FWB who was also mentally ill and dangerous.

 

You are now married to a woman 15 years your senior, she is actually old enough to be your mother & by all accounts has the patience of a saint, treats you well.

 

You come here and to other forums fueling your mind with evidence of how terrible women are.. you admit to getting into black, negative moods as a result.

 

From here it looks like you are trying really hard to turn your saint like mother substitute wife into a mentally ill abusive woman.. just like your mother.. keep digging for that evidence

keep putting yourself on emotional roller coasters .At some point your wife will finally snap & you'll have created your very own self-fulfilling prophecy

[Pyro]

Just look at that one post I made a thread about a few weeks ago.

 

you mean the link you posted of the message board from the daily mail?

 

We know that you suffer from ADD or something that prevents you from reading the helpful posts on here but she asked you for examples of your 'you go girl' posts/threads from the LOVESHACK forum.

[verhrzn]

I'm in my mid 50's and have worked in a dozen settings

 

I've never worked with any group of guys who would be amused or condone one of their colleagues cheating on their wife. It would be frowned upon big time to the point of that fellow being politely shunned.

 

This includes being in the military, working as a geologist in field camps, in an office ,in a lab, etc.

 

Ya know, my experience with military men is that they seem to fall into two categories: 1) the psychos who joined thinking they got to kill living things and get off on it, who generally hate SOME group of people... other races, women, gays, etc. 2) incredibly upstanding guys who joined because of a sense of duty and honor, and display nothing but the deepest loyalty and respect to people who they feel deserve it.

 

I am very happy to report that most of the military guys (again in my experience) fall into camp 2.

 

I totally believe that military men would not condone cheating. Heck, the ones I run into always seem to be the ones who get cheated ON. My work buddy, who is former Reserve and had his young heart ripped out by his first wife, speculates it's because a lot of military guys, with such deep roots in duty, consciously or subconsciously choose life partners in an attempt to "save" them... They hitch themselves to women they KNOW are unstable or unsuitable, and hope that their love and dedication will somehow change the woman into someone deserving.

 

Not actually all that different than what some women do, taking on "projects." The difference is, I think, women don't take it QUITE as hard when their project fails (maybe because they're always being told to stop going for the bad boys and trying to change men?) The guys I see and hear about, who date someone even though they KNOW she's got more red flags than a parade through Tianamen Square, still take it so hard when it turns out to be true, to the point of turning them bitter and broken themselves.

[Woggle]

you mean the link you posted of the message board from the daily mail?

 

We know that you suffer from ADD or something that prevents you from reading the helpful posts on here but she asked you for examples of your 'you go girl' posts/threads from the LOVESHACK forum.

 

No she was a poster on here and I asked if most women felt this way.

[Negative Nancy]

...and obviously most women said no, they don't feel that way, so there should have been the proof.

 

But I am guilty of the same behavior,just on the other side - there's obviously good men on this board and in the real world, yet when one sees all these negative examples of men they become the overwhelming majority in one's skewed perception and it all seems hopeless. We all struggle with our demons here.

[ThsAmericanLife]

zengirl, where did you find those statisics? They sound interesting!

 

Maybe this link was posted earlier on, but there is a very fascinating post on OKCupid Trends about the issue of age and dating: http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/the-case-for-an-older-woman/

 

It supports both the majority male and majority female view on here. The OKCupid statistics say that women's desirability peaks at 21, and that they're "past their prime" at 31 (in the opinion of male users on OKCupid, based on their actions). According to the statistics, men have more dating options than women from 26 onwards. However, the writer also recommends dating older women, giving various reasons and all backed up by statistics (happier, more self-confident and optimistic, greater interest in sex, etc).

 

Check it out!

 

I've read that study... all it confirms are reasons why smart women should avoid OkC if they are looking for someone who truly values them.

 

... and it is not the 'majority female view' here that their desirability peaks at 21. Some of the guys on LS would like us to think it does in their adolescent rantings.

Edited November 12, 2011 by ThsAmericanLife

[zengirl]

I've read that study... all it confirms are reasons why smart women should avoid OkC if they are looking for someone who truly values them.

 

I met my BF (now fiance!) on OKC. Worked out fine for me, and if 21 was my peak, I long-ago passed it. (Man, I was crazy at 21, so I seriously doubt that was my peak! ) Though I guess I'm not past my prime of 31 just yet.

 

Desirability in those studies is measured by mass flow of messages. Really, the mass flow of messages is not a positive thing. It's overkill and it makes online dating more frustrating for the woman anyway. Who wants 100 messages that say "hi hot stuff" --- I always said I'd rather have a handful of sincere messages any day.

[zengirl]

females are too lazy to failer out teh good ones. while males got months w/o squat. your engaged but still whining. try being one the 29 y/o here who can't get a single date

 

I'm not whining. I'm saying the stats only show volume, not quality, and volume means nothing. I'm sure 21 year old girls get greater volume on OLD websites, but I know I saw greater quality as I got older. I'm doing the opposite of whining---saying it's better than the stats say, because the stats look at the wrong thing.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Sanman

You constantly talk about how I am seen as bitter. Yet it is always you, usually only you, that makes this assertion and engages is such arguments with me.

 

It's because you usually will respond to something I've said to the board in general. Before you started to respond to me, I just observed your comments from afar. But once you directly spoke to me, I responded in my own thoughts and brought out what I think is bitterness on your part. Hope that makes sense.

 

I know you want to believe that everyone should love each other for the person on the inside and external factors such as money, age, and looks should not matter. Yet, this is not how most people go about things.

 

Obviously money, age and looks play their parts in any relationship. Especially when you are younger. But if you are looking for the same things at 30 that you were looking for at 20, that shows an amazing lack of personal growth. Men are just as capable of growing as women are. But insinuating that men are the same people at 20 that they are at 30, or that they even should be, is demeaning to men. The way the media blitzes us with ideals about money and looks and age compared to how most people live their lives are different.

 

And I understand enough about the world that there will always be people who prize age, money and looks above all else. And then there are other people who learn about what life is really about. That's not to say that you shouldn't be with someone you find attractive or that you should be with someone that is stuck in debt. But life is ultimately short and spending it on the generalities you like to promote, seems like a waste of time.

 

Money, age and looks are just ways for people to seperate themselves to make themselves feel better about themselves. Such as thinking if you have as successful job that your better and possibly happier then someone that doesn't. Or that if your more good looking your better and happier then someone that isn't. But we all know that those external things don't buy happiness or true connection and relationships. And we all know that at the end of the day, we all end up in the same place. I am not better then someone that cleans houses for a living just because I work in a professional job.

 

Tell me, you admit to dating guys with money. Have you dated men older than yourself? Have you let them buy you dinner? Then, you have fed into these stereotypes as well. How has having this pie in the sky ideal worked out in you dating life?

 

You know nothing of my dating life Sanman. You hold a special place in your heart for men paying for dates. And you and alot of other guys here seem to think that all women are scripted to follow the same dating path where they use men when they are younger so naturally when they are older they "deserve what they get" mentality that is really just nut crusted in bitterness. Yet there are lots of young women that post here that speak of their own dating troubles. And none of the men here like to take a serious look at what they are saying because it doesn't fall into the script youn and other guys here have previously written out for women. It's easy to justify treating women a certain way if you can define women through a very narrow tunnel of expectations.

 

I have dated men with money. But when I started dating them I didn't know they had money. I didn't ask such questions. I didn't even ask them what they did for a living because I didn't want come off like I was hunting for information. So I let that stuff come out naturally. Or if he opened the door and asked me then I would ask him. But guess what? I also dated/date alot of blue collar guys too. Regular guys. Guys that don't even have college educations but are quite brilliant in their own ways. When I was younger, I was more impressed by men with certain jobs and educations. But I learned that those guys aren't something special just because of their personal (and yes) vauable accomplishments. Now? I am ten times impressed when I hear a grown man talk about how he is going to his Grandma's to do her yard work for her then I am about a man that graduated summa cum-laude. I value things different in my age and experience. And I prize that.

 

A few years ago I dated a man that offered to pay for a lot of things for me. I thought we were just dating, he was clearly more serious about me then I was of him. When I learned the depth of his seriousness, I broke things off. I was not going to fall in love with him. I could have taken his money, let him pay for a lot of things, kept having fun dating him (because we had lots of fun toether!). But I didn't. Because there are things in this world that are more important then that and because I didn't want to lead him on. And it was with that relationship that I learned what I was made of.

 

By they way, I have dated older men. Not all older men are bad guys. Just the ones that view my age as a commodity. Let me tell you why though. I have always been very shy with men. When I was younger, I was so intimidated by men my own age. They were wonderfully exciting but I was never able to get over my shyness with them. And they weren't exactly hitting on me. Then older men started hitting on me. At first it was kind of strange. But they liked me. They made me feel pretty and I wanted some dating experience. So I dated these older men. I don't regret the experience or what they taught me. But I dated them because they made it so easy for me. All I had to do was be pretty. All I had to do with an older man was be present. Men my own age require so much more from me. The connection is different. When I was younger, I didn't know that. I did infact think I was going to end up with an older man. But my view shifted. The connection I felt with men my own age was just so much deeper for me. Is that to say I could never date an older guy again? Baring in mind his own life ideaologies and his idealogies of women, I could. But right now, I find it more exciting to pursue relationships with men my own age.

 

See It's not that I think all older men dating younger women is bad. I think the idea that a man's worth is more then a woman' that is. I think the idea that all women use men when they are younger so they deserve to end up alone when they are older is just born out of hurt and bitterness and not reality. I didn't use men when I was younger. I was shy. Dating was a struggle. I am certianly not the hottest girl in the world. I was like the little sister. Men dated me and broke up with me and I had a lot of first dates where guys never called me back. But the guys here don't seem to want to understand any of that. That women can struggle in dating too. Or maybe it's that the men here only care about the top 5% of women that are so beautiful, men will do anything for them. Well that certiantly isn't me. I have had men disrespect me, treat me badly, be rude to me...just as any man has had. And I refuse to let men like you sit back and say *I* deserve to be treated a certain way because the top 5% of women that used and tossed men aside, the top 5% of really goregous women, made you and other men feel angry.

 

As for my relationship, I don't speak about what I do for my gf.

 

Why not? What would be so bad about that?

 

I choose to keep her around for way she does for me and who she is

.

 

This is the point I was making before. You seem to focus on what *you* get out of the relationship. Why would it be bad for you to focus what you give her?

 

She chooses to keep me around for the same reasons. She is happy with who I am and what I offer her.

 

Well I am sincerely happy for you. Really. I want everyone to have someone that loves them. Even Player80..or whatever his name is because I jsut think he's a deeply wounded soul.

 

 

However, let us most act like women are perfec either. She openly admits that my tight ass and solid career drew her to me as much as my nice personality.

 

Younger women do tend to be more impressed with such things. Younger people tend to be more impressed with such things. That doesn't mean you don't have a loving relationship obviously. But when older people value the same things they did in their 20s, that's when things get a little sad.

 

The OP also was interested in a younger doctor. Do you think she gave the bald, overweight, manual laborer with a heart of gold a chance? If you believe that is all that should matter, then you should date such a man. There are a number of male virgins on this board that seem nice as well. Have you nit attempted to date them?

 

Is the bald, overweight manual laborer her own age?

 

I believe that there are so many combinations of couples out there that it's unfair to say that men and women just follow some script. I know a woman that pulls 6 figures that is in a long term relationship with a burely construction worker. I know a very handsome man married to a very homely woman that he really seems to adore..married something like 30 years now. A school mate's parents. I know a short 5'2 guy with a busty 5'10 blonde. I remember seeing a goregous african american man with a small, pale pasty redhead hugging and looking totally inlove on the subway. I know a farmer married to a scientist.

 

You never answered my question if you tell your girlfriend in the same words you speak about women on the board here, about how you feel about women and their worth.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

amen.......

 

Thanks AmericanLife!

[ThsAmericanLife]

I met my BF (now fiance!) on OKC. Worked out fine for me, and if 21 was my peak, I long-ago passed it. (Man, I was crazy at 21, so I seriously doubt that was my peak! ) Though I guess I'm not past my prime of 31 just yet.

 

Desirability in those studies is measured by mass flow of messages. Really, the mass flow of messages is not a positive thing. It's overkill and it makes online dating more frustrating for the woman anyway. Who wants 100 messages that say "hi hot stuff" --- I always said I'd rather have a handful of sincere messages any day.

 

Good for you...

 

I'm not a fan of online dating in general... but the sites that don't require people pay tend to be the worst. OkC is pretty clever with all of their questions and one of the things I liked most about it... but IMHO, still attracts a certain segment of the population I'd prefer to avoid. But that is just me.

[mysteriousbox]

tl;dr

-

I guess from my own male friends (mid 20s), all the guys that want long term relationships are locked down (married, engaged or been together for years). While the players are and probably will always be players.

 

So I don't think men in general avoid settling, more like the men left in the dating pool just won't settle down.

[thatone]

Good for you...

 

I'm not a fan of online dating in general... but the sites that don't require people pay tend to be the worst. OkC is pretty clever with all of their questions and one of the things I liked most about it... but IMHO, still attracts a certain segment of the population I'd prefer to avoid. But that is just me.

 

OKC has by far the best profile/question format, imo.

 

the pay sites seemed like borderline scams to me.

[Easyguy14]

It is negative but that's how it appears XXOO. Maybe the married guys are attracted to their wives but are they only attracted to them becaue they've been with them since they were young? And are they not most likely looking at porn of much younger women inbetween sessions with their wives?

 

It is much harder being a woman in his world and with all that, men still complain about how difficult it is for them. They just flat out don't much care about women beyond what they shallowly want from women.

 

been following your posts since you seem to talk most and you make least sense to me in making points. you say men only still feel attracted to their wives because they were with them since young? of course they are and as they've aged they're still attracted to each other. they grow together and the attraction remains the same. but you contradict that. maybe you need a break from here to get your head on straight, no offense.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

I can't make much sense of your post Easyguy. But my head is on just fine.

 

Perhaps you should take a break from here to work on your sentence construction? .. but no offense or anything.

[Sanman]

You never answered my question if you tell your girlfriend in the same words you speak about women on the board here, about how you feel about women and their worth.

 

Now we are getting somewhere Disenchantedly. What don't realize is that it isn't about my beliefs about women and their worth. It is about my beliefs about people and their worth to each other. Of course there are more important things than looks or money. What you are talking about is a relationship that develops over time. What I am talking about is dating. Sure, there are those that may overlook money or looks to see the wonderful person inside. However, that is a very small percentage of society. I was attracted to my gf's pretty eyes and beautiful smile. That she is an amazingly kind and generous person is what keeps me in the relationship, but not what drew me there initially. Most people are not going to take the time to get to know every man/woman they meet over time. It is how we tend to categorize people. That you think I am judging women solely on age/looks is silly. I am simply making a reciprocal argument to a person who is putting monetary success (she wants a doctor) as her main criteria. I never told the OP that she will never get a man or even that she would never get a doctor. I told her that as she ages, she needs to offer more than looks if she is to land the type of man that many women are interested in. A successful man interested solely in beauty can get a young beautiful woman. Why choose the older woman who has little to offer when you can choose the you the younger prettier woman with little to offer? A man looking to date his age or older likely values things other than looks. Thus, she needs to develop other things. That said, we are all inherently selfish people that want the best for ourselves. The question is simply what we value as the best. For example, why should dating a person your own age matter anymore than dating someone only younger. Both people are making age a priority over other factors. They are simply picking a different number.

 

As for why I don't talk about what I do for my gf, it simply is not my place. It the same reason that you will hear me tell anyone I meet that I have an amazing gf, but tell no one that I am an amazing bf.

[ThsAmericanLife]

OKC has by far the best profile/question format, imo.

 

the pay sites seemed like borderline scams to me.

 

When I was there, I did like the questions... I also really liked the option of looking at profiles without you knowing they looked... and having a photo album for 'favorites'.... that is the main way I avoided having any pics up while still making it obvious I'm not a one-legged, 200 lb midget (no offense to one-legged, 200 lb midgets out there!)

[xxoo]

For some balance in the conversation, my 40-something husband just finished being riveted to the tv watching a rerun of Everybody Loves Raymond, because Debra (the wife/mom character) was dressed slutty for the story line. He is SO HOT for that Debra character.

 

He also watches that horrible Hot In Cleveland show--for the women!

 

It may be that single guys, or single guys on dating sites, are disproportionately fixated on young women. I'm not saying that married men aren't attracted to young women (hell, I can still appreciate the hotness of a 23 yo man), but most are genuinely attracted to their partner as she ages.

 

I'll say again--ask this question on the marriage board, and read the responses of men partnered with women 40+. They think their wives are HOT!

[Oxy Moronovich]

when women are young and have a lot to "offer" then they have the upper hand in the dating scene. as women age the men get the upper hand. period.

Wow. It's funny how you put it so bluntly.