Question regarding my fiancee & co-workers

[EnigmaXOXO]

J, maybe knowing this much might help you to understand a little...

 

Because I what your fiancée has been through, she is going to have difficulty in relationships when it comes to "bonding" and "trust." Abandonment issues will also make it difficult for her to let go, such as in the case with her last boyfriend. One minute it will seem as if she’s pushing away, and the very next moment she will cling.

 

She will also need to feel 'in control' and will do whatever she can to maintain the upper hand so that she feels 'safe'...she needs to without even understanding why yet.

 

She will also be prone to bouts of depression, irritability and irrational behavior. Her avoidance to discuss or even deal with what has happened is also a symptom of what she's been through.

 

You can 'help'...by getting her ‘help’ and finding out the things you need know in order to support her through her recovery rather than fall into your own cycle of co-dependency. You will absolutely exhaust yourself if you think love and persuading her to ‘play fair’ is going to undo years worth of damage. This is one situation that you will not be able to "fix" on your own… not without professional help. Trust is going to be a BIG issue for her. Survivors of sexual abuse are often the most difficult to treat because they frequently have trouble even trusting their therapists.

 

You have a lot on plate right now, and I worry you aren't even aware that you may have bitten off more than you can chew!

[jmargel]

Thanks Engima. That's given me something to think on. I believe that's what happened with my ex. Not knowing this made me co-dependent on her. I want to get to the root of her problems not fix each situation as it comes along. Doing that will just exhaust me and will not have the outcome we both need.

 

I now know what I am into. I've had experience before with my ex-fiancee but didn't deal with it in the way I knew how. I just wished she could post on this board. It would do her alot of good. She doesn't have many friends to talk to and I know if she had at least one trusting individual to talk about things that would help as well.

[fredrolin]

You CANNOT change people. You may bury your feelings for awhile to make your partner happy but then those feelings build up and the true always comes out.

 

NO TWO PEOPLE ARE COMPATIBLE. The only way to make a relationship work is to learn to accept your partners faults. It is next to impossible to reason with someone who believes they are correct.

[jmargel]

I don't want to change her. I want to get to the root of her problems and help her through them. This in turn may change her behavior towards me and in general at times.

 

No two people are compatible? If no two people are compatible this world would be a lonely place.

[fredrolin]

no two people are 100% compatible. There always is work to be done.

 

anyway I give you alot of credit for hanging in there.

 

If this were me, I would have bailed out along time ago.

 

I have never been able to deal with women that were alot of work to make happy.

 

I always have settled for the easy to please ones; too bad most of them are ugly and overweight.

[Fedup&givingup]

Originally posted by fredrolin

no two people are 100% compatible. There always is work to be done.

 

anyway I give you alot of credit for hanging in there.

 

If this were me, I would have bailed out along time ago.

 

I have never been able to deal with women that were alot of work to make happy.

 

I always have settled for the easy to please ones; too bad most of them are ugly and overweight.

 

THAT'S not true!!!!

[moimeme]

Everyone in her life has left her at some point in time. I gave a commitment to her when I proposed. We both acknowledge we have issues at hand but to just walk away from a situation like that, I couldn't do it.

 

Oh, yikes! Echoes of my recent past! Jmarguel, if anyone can relate to what you're feeling, I suspect it's me. I was not going to be one of the people who deserted him. Problem is that a lot of them probably tried very hard to stay with him, too. These wounded souls seem to be constructed to do everything possible to push you away when you are determined to do otherwise.

 

Worse, it turns out that all the love in the world may not heal someone. This is the hardest thing I have ever had to accept. Some people are so badly wounded that they resist every possible action on your part to love them.

You may think you're tough enough and strong enough to handle it, but these situations can eat you up and, before you know it, you've got not a thing left. It took me quite a while to regroup this time.

[befuddled11]

Originally posted by jmargel

End a relationship to make things better? Um.. No.

 

Everyone in her life has left her at some point in time. I gave a commitment to her when I proposed. We both acknowledge we have issues at hand but to just walk away from a situation like that, I couldn't do it.

 

I'm not asking whether or not I should end it with her. I'm asking on how to deal with the situations at hand until we get her into counciling. I don't want to continue the 'Princess' syndrom, yet I don't want to have a full drawn out arguement everytime we disagree. If she weren't upto going to counciling and not admitting she has a problem, then yes I would leave. That's not the case however. And yes this thread has opened my eyes to alot of things, especially the way I have been treated. That'll have to end if the marriage is going to take place but I'm willing to give it a chance.

 

 

What I don't get is...you've had ONGOING problems with her, and within your relationship, for a few months now. I've read the posts. She's got oodles of problems and issues and baggage and hangups. You say she's agreeable to counselling. So what the h*ll has she been doing about it? She's too busy focusing on the trivial STUPID stuff, like making CDs of songs for a one day event (the wedding day)....and not doing ANYTHING to help prepare herself, and together with you, for the MARRIAGE.

 

Hello?

 

Why would you make a "commitment" to someone who has openly expressed NOT WANTING CHILDREN, when in fact YOU DO? How silly is that? Are you even thinking this through? Before you propose marriage to someone, you have to be damn sure you know them, and they know you...and you discuss your goals and dreams and aspirations...and you ensure that you've worked through real and potential issues..and you ensure that you're both on the same wavelength when it comes to the important matters: children, finances, how to deal with problems constructively, the importance of compromise, working together as a TEAM, etc etc etc.

 

You seem so focused on marrying her, that you're missing the forest for the trees.

 

You haven't even been together with her, in a relationship capacity, for that long. What the h*ll is the huge rush to get married when you have SO MANY unresolved problems....problems that will surely end in a miserable marriage, and inevitably, divorce.

 

Cripes....you say you're here looking for help on how to work through these issues. Nobody here can help you. That's between you two. She seems very spoiled, self-centered, immature, has her priorities sorely screwed up, unable to communicate, unable to compromise, bratty, b*tchy, treats you like dirt, is catty, always wants her own way, uses her engagement ring (and the removal thereof) as a way to punish you when she doesn't get her own way (you not wanting to "jump" when she decided she didn't want to be at the bar). So she's got a history of abuse. Lots of people do. But that doesn't give her the right to act the way she does.

 

If she really give a sh*t about you and your upcoming life together, she'd be searching out a counsellor instead of worrying about happy hour and getting drunk and what songs she'll have at the wedding.

 

Just because you love someone doesn't mean they're the right person to spend your life together. If you're remaining with her because she's been left by other men in her life (crap, who hasn't?) and you want to be her savior, well knock yourself out....but mark my words, you're both nowhere near ready to be making such a serious commitment as marriage. I predict you'll be here shortly after the wedding, posting long posts about how she does this or how she does that and how you can't leave because you've made the commitment of marriage, bla bla bla. Yes, you DO have your head in the sand. And she's likely loving every minute of it. You're her chump. Better get yourself some industrial strength kneepads!

[moimeme]

Befuddled

 

The reason I post posts contradictory to yours is that I find you are very hard on people. Yes, you think I make too many allowances, but so? If you were the person in jmargel's fianceé's place, might you not hope a little slack would be cut you? The basic difference between our approaches is that I don't attribute unpleasant behaviour to serious personality flaws or to malice. IMHO, people are just screwed up, and because they're screwed up, they don't behave ideally. It doesn't make them bad or nasty or anything other than perhaps people one ought not tie one's life up with.

 

This girl has had a lot of rotten luck in her life. People become difficult, spoiled, self-centered, angry, etc. sometimes as defences against further hurt and for other reasons they don't realize. Sometimes, they can get therapy and overcome all their issues, which is why I figure one should never give up on people.

 

I don't think it helps to judge people so harshly. Yes, there are some nasty people out there, but most people are just mired in their own stuff. And getting back to jmarquel, this really is the issue. It's not that she's necessarily selfish, etc etc etc as befuddled claims, but that's how she behaves and it is the behaviour that can really get to you after a while. If these behaviours are coping mechanisms, it could take years for change to occur and you'll have nothing left by then. It's not that they're bad people or that what they do is done deliberately. It's just that they haven't room to love you because they have so much to take care of in themselves. You're not her 'chump'. She's too wrapped up in her own problems to waste time working out how to manipulate you.

 

I definitely agree with befuddled that you seem determined to go headlong into this marriage despite all the flashing red lights and screaming sirens and I totally agree that that seems exceedingly unwise.

[befuddled11]

Moi,

I think JMargel is a really nice guy, based on his many posts here. If his posts are an accurate representation of who he really is, he's a true gem.

 

What you claim as me being harsh, is me feeling bad for him, and frustrated that a good guy like that is not standing up for his life and happiness. He should be putting his foot down and laying it on the line, something to the effect of, "The wedding is on hold until we've worked through the issues with communication, compromise, the way we deal with problems and differences, etc etc etc."

 

They haven't even lived together for 2 weeks (well, just barely) and she's already given back the ring once and told him it was over. This is NOT how things should be between a couple who's planning their wedding. It's absurd.

 

The details of this wedding should be the last thing on their minds at this point. The wedding is just one day.....it's the marriage that really matters.

 

These 2 have issues with trust, control, power-struggles, their differing opinions about having children, you name it.

 

I just don't get it. Most people don't have the luxury of seeing so many "red flags" prior to walking down the aisle.

 

Oh well, I've shared my thoughts. It's his life, it's their lives. It's 5 months, I believe, from their wedding and they've got a sh*tload of significant issues and obstacles, but if they're in a rush to get married and end up living in misery, that's their prerogative. I've nothing more to say on the matter.

[meanon]

Every one of us has the capacity to change if we see the need and there is no greater motivation than love, jmargel. Many, many times I've seen people overcome difficult life experiences and become stronger people as a result of their journey. It does take courage and a willingness to change and maybe your girlfriend simply doesn't see the need, yet. She hasn't had great role models of normality.

 

I was so glad to see your post referring to your commitment to her - that's what love is all about, in my view. We all have problems and difficulties in life and it's the love and support of family, partners and friends that can make all the difference. I know that sometimes it's just not enough but in my view you are a long, long way from knowing that.

 

You were sure of her when you proposed - help her jmargel, she needs you.

[Thinkalot]

Hi there jmargel.

 

I'm sorry you are having a rough time of it. I agree, there are all kinds of red flags here. Counselling is needed, and perhaps delaying the marriage.

 

Be committed, and help her out, but don't forget to look after yourself too, you don't want to lose yourself here and end up down.

 

I hope posting here helps keep things in perspective for you and give you objective points of view.

 

You can work through things if you BOTH try hard..not just you though.

[jmargel]

I found a counselor that I am calling today. With regards to Friday when I got home, she was already there. She said she went out with them, the meeting ended early. And that everyone left but her, this other girl and this one guy (guess he has a gf). She said he bought them a drink and she told him she was leaving because she wanted to be there when I got home. Guess he wanted her to stay. So, hearing this I was still upset she let him buy her one. That just set the whole mood for friday night as really bad.

 

We went to a restaurant and I ran into an ex co-worker. He went upto her and said 'You know you are a lucky girl to be with him' and thought that was nice of him to say that. When we got at the table she looked like she was upset and asked whats wrong. She's like 'Im the lucky one?' then she said 'No' to when I asked 'Dont you think you are with me?' I was about to leave her right then at the restuarant. We then talked for about an hour and her mentioning that when I come home Im not happy anymore, dont look forward to seeing her, etc.. I then told her why. She said she was doing alot of 'thinking' the past few days which I know wasn't good. Alot of it has to do with her being very touchy since going cold-turkey with her LexaPro. She needs to see a doctor about this. While she was on it she was alot less moody.

 

Surprisingly though Sat. & Sun. actually were good, until last night when a movie I rented she didn't like. She doesnt like movies with killings in it so she just went to bed. Though Sunday we did do what the other wanted. I don't want this to be a day-to-day journal about my life but I just want to let some people who read this to know what some go through.

 

I know I have issues as well dealing with insecurity. It was because of a bad relationship with my ex-fiancee.

 

I'm going to talk to her tonight about 'after' the wedding when after all the events take place on her realizing that its just me & her now. As far as kids, she says she doesnt want any but everytime she sees my 1 year old nephew she just can't get enough of him. Last night she mentioned this to me saying 'When I see Antionio I just think at times..' and then cut it short. She wouldn't say much more about it, but in the past she's mentioned she might think of having one later in life. I know she's not sure right now and that's something we aren't ready for. We need to deal with these issues first.

 

I want a relationship where both of us can do what we like without hurting the other. Where we can agree on the majority of things and when we can't, know when to give into the other but then also be able to take a stand on something without fear of losing any love or respect.

 

I realized through this post and her telling me the things on Friday night that the way I was showing my emotions to her was my way of pulling away and preparing for the worst. She's been picking up on this and I guess was hurt herself. Though it all had to start somewhere and I know it was because of her selfishness she has at times. She's asked me a number of times, and actually last night about whether I was happy she moved in. She then said she knows she's difficult at times. I think she also feels like I'm not happy with her, since she's mentioned that a few times. I'm happy with her, except for when she gets this way or I feel like I have to be defensive.

 

I don't want people to think that our relationship is all bad. There is so much good to it as well. If it was all bad there would be no way I would stay in it. I know I let little things bother me, but I also know the stuff happening, that not all of it is minor. We have connected in alot of ways and she & my family totally adore each other.

[Fedup&givingup]

I think the counselling could be beneficial. I will also reiterate that a lot of this strife and discord is due to the fact of just moving in together. That's very stressful. I had noticed that you hadn't posted here in a while, and I was wondering about that, and then you came back with all of this, and immediately, I could sense the tension in your relationship, and when you mentioned that the two of you just started living together, well that explained a lot.

 

As for her going out Friday night...inappropriate. She went against your wishes and feelings. I too would feel threatened and upset by this male co worker buying her a drink and encouraging her to stick around. That's not really a good situation. This needs to be dealt with in counselling.

 

For the marriage plans, just take this counselling for all it's work. Work on THAT, and don't put the cart in front of the horse. Things aren't ever going to be perfect, but you two have some major, major issues to sort out first. Just my opinion.

[lostforwords]

k.... ive noticed a few things jmargel.... IMO... you met this girl... you were still hurt and bitter about your ex...actually you still are now according to your posts.... you then are for certain "absolutely" in love with this girl after not even a year of meeting her?!! profess your love for her and and ask her to marry you... you and "her" wanting to get involved in a 3 some?!! and now this? dude... your problem is your too quick to hold onto something so you ask them to marry you right away and when **** doenst go your way... IMO... you get pissed off and scratch your head wondering why they arent listening to "your" needs.... i dunno thats just my persepctive... you can sugar coat it all you want.... but you said it yourself... you have your own insecurities to work on... you should have before you plunged deeply into another relationship as well as you should.... you think by proposing to someone... makes marriage seem all glamorous and a sure fire way of securing your future with someone... when maybe your just in denial of needing to work on yourself before dragging someone else into your life/probelms/insecurities.... i dunno you can shoot me down if you want... but thats MHO....

[jmargel]

Yep, that whole friday thing will be coming out when we meet w/ the therapist. She told me he only bought them a drink because they were new. Of course I don't know how they act at work, she told me they (I assume the girls and guys) were talking about sexual things. I have no clue whether or not she precipated in this, I would truly hope she wouldn't but didn't ask her. She said she felt uncomfortable being there with just him and that other girl and left. I've already had the discussion with her when we first became a couple that I don't give second chances. I trust fully with my heart and once the trust gets broken it's over. She's told me before that she hasn't and wouldn't flirt with anyone.

 

If she wanted to I know there are alot of men out there that would go out with her. While we were just friends, she was asked out quite a bit but never went.

 

As for my background my relationship with my ex ended in '99. I dated a few but never felt any connection. Brandy & me were best friends for a year before becoming a couple as well, so she knows what I am all about. As for the 3 some thing that is her being curious which is fine with me. We hardly talk about it and I believe she knows we need to get through these issues before even thinking about that.

 

Like I said before it's not all bad. We are very affectionate with each other & tell each other we love you lots of times during the day. She can also be very considerate as well, except for when she gets into one of her 'princess' moods. I believe the other poster was right that she acts this way to make herself feel more secure. If she can get through that & me get through my issue I believe everything else will work itself out.

[Fedup&givingup]

Originally posted by jmargel

Yep, that whole friday thing will be coming out when we meet w/ the therapist. She told me he only bought them a drink because they were new. Of course I don't know how they act at work, she told me they (I assume the girls and guys) were talking about sexual things. I have no clue whether or not she precipated in this, I would truly hope she wouldn't but didn't ask her. She said she felt uncomfortable being there with just him and that other girl and left. I've already had the discussion with her when we first became a couple that I don't give second chances. I trust fully with my heart and once the trust gets broken it's over. She's told me before that she hasn't and wouldn't flirt with anyone.

 

If she wanted to I know there are alot of men out there that would go out with her. While we were just friends, she was asked out quite a bit but never went.

 

As for my background my relationship with my ex ended in '99. I dated a few but never felt any connection. Brandy & me were best friends for a year before becoming a couple as well, so she knows what I am all about. As for the 3 some thing that is her being curious which is fine with me. We hardly talk about it and I believe she knows we need to get through these issues before even thinking about that.

 

Like I said before it's not all bad. We are very affectionate with each other & tell each other we love you lots of times during the day. She can also be very considerate as well, except for when she gets into one of her 'princess' moods. I believe the other poster was right that she acts this way to make herself feel more secure. If she can get through that & me get through my issue I believe everything else will work itself out.

 

With the latter of this, I see these problems you two are having as speed bumps. People are NOT perfect, and it's all about how committed to this you are. I see alot of it on your end, J. The fact that your girl is going to go to counselling shows her level of committment as well.

[Fedup&givingup]

Oh, and as for the 3 some that your fiance was curious about, I don't in any way see that as a threat to your relationship...the curiosity of it, that is.

 

I've been curious about that a time or two. But, only banannas for this monkey

[fredrolin]

I didn't read every word of this thread but from what I did read I have got to say that you are too intense.

 

So what if this guy bought a drink? If you read into every little aspect and move your fiancee says and does it will drive you nuts and drive her away.

 

 

Friday night after work my wife met her friend at a bar for ONE drink. Her friend is recently divorced and very "loose".

My wife came home pretty buzzed and admitted doing several shots at the bar that were bought by random guys at the bar. My wife told me her friend wanted my wife to come back out and see this band that was playing at a local bar (5 minute walk from my house).

My wife said she wasn't going; her and I drank some beers and shots and we ordered a pizza.

Around 9:00 her friend calls and says that she is at the local bar waiting for my wife, after my wife told me she turned her friend down.

My wife then decides she is going to go meet her friend, for ONE hour (I had to stay home, we have an 8 year old).

Around midnight I wake up and hear voices in the kitchen; it is my wife and her 23 year old son doing shots. My wife is bombed and and all day Saturday she is a worthless hungover crab.

And then today I look at our bank account and find out she spent $50 at that bar (she put it on our debit card).

 

Sure I tell everyone on LS that my marriage sucks and that I am not "in love", but she is still my wife and this is the life I have created.

Yes I gave her some crap about going overboard Friday night, I have to.

But I have done the same thing and I will forgive her and forget and live with it.

 

No counseling, no complaining, no constant analysis, life isn't perfect and will never even come close.

[lostforwords]

fred...... your a man after my own heart...... lmao!!!!

[jmargel]

Fred.. that may be fine for you but that is exactly what I'm trying to avoid or prevent with my fiancee. If you were to do the same thing would you have hell to pay from her?

 

Like I said before, I have only got one life. I went through the samething you did with my ex-fiancee and I was miserable. She's showing you a lack of respect that you deserve. To me if my fiancee won't give me that, then there are other women out there that will. I need to stand up for myself now or face the future of what you are living.

 

What were to happen if you were to make a stand now?